Former American Prisoner Reacts to Two Norwegian Prisons
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 7 сен 2024
- Today we take a look at Norway's Bastøy and Halden prisons. Bastøy is supposedly the lap of luxury, and Halden is it's Maximum security alternative. How different are these two Norwegian prisons, what do the prisoners say? And how much can American learn, from the best and worst Norway has to offer in order to better treat our inmates?
Thank you to everyone's response to my new Patreon account! You all rock!
/ maxhaddad
I'm on Twitter! @maxhaddad
Link to the original video: • Norway's Humane Prison...
Enjoy and take care of yourselves! Remember, if you have more ideas you'd like to look at and consider covering, please email my business account at W.max.haddad1223@gmail.com
Feel like this is never said:
Bastøy isn’t a normal prison, not even by Norwegian standards. It’s supposed to simulate normal life outside to ease the transition from prison. It’s why everyone has 9-to-5 jobs. They’re not taking care of animals because someone though it would make for good therapy, they do it because it’s their job. The fact that Americans (& the British for that matter) keep calling it a “luxury resort”, despite it really being just another island faming community, makes me question the living standards over there. USA must be the most miserable rich nation in the world.
It is said! I needed it told to me when I first posted this, but luckily you and a few others have made it clear. I'm not rich so I'm not miserably rich yet, but it does seem to be the case that most of our rich are pretty unhappy. Plenty of good ones though too. :)
Some of the prisoner even have jobs on the main land. The go to work and comes back at the end of the work day.
@@MaxHaddad You also mentioned the scenery in the video, but Norway just has beautiful scenery. That farming community you saw is pretty normal, even mediocre I should say. I've seen alot more beautiful sights in Norway. They have extreme nature, so its hard to get to it everywhere like here (in sweden) but yeah. Scandinavia just has beautiful nature.
Michael Moore is a liar and a demagogue.
He cleverly edits his movies leaving stuff out that would refute his points, telling half truths etc...
When he was popular with american working class in the 90s, then now almost no working class person buys his movies.
The ratings are down and Moore himself has become totally insane after he became RICH.
He keeps talking and promoting communism while he is not willing to share his wealth with others.
Just another crazy leftist totally not in touch with reality.
Shows Norway, while completely not mentioning that the population of norway is overwhelmingly white. You Can't take a prison example from a homogeneous country and then claim the same shit would work in america with a MIXED race population.
@@tanelviil9149 Of course you can. Everyone is still a human being, and responds to humane treatment like anyone else.
Michael Moore isn't a demagogue. Of course he is editing his movies. They are his movies, aren't they? It would be stupid to not edit them to give the message he wants to give with them. Just as stupid it is to believe his "documentaries" aren't edited and directed. Or any documentaries. They all are.
I don't see him having changed since he was young. Still as "insane" as ever.
I don't think he's been promoting Communism. Maybe you don't quite understand what Communism is. But Michael Moore has been sharing his wealth with others. People in his movies, who got into trouble, have received economical help, for example the car industry workers who lost their jobs. His foundation gives grants to support among others documentary makers.
Nevertheless, why are you saying this here? It has nothing to do with any comment in this thread.
I think it's worth mentioning that the 22. July terrorist is kept isolated from other prisoners, and despite the 10-21 years sentence, he can't be released unless a parole board approves it. Which is to say that once 21 years has passed, a parole board will determine if he is eligable to be returned to society, and if he's not he'll be kept for more years until he's up for another parole. Regular prisoners are released once their time is up, but dangerous ones won't be released if they're still considered dangerous.
Technically, the dangerous ones doesn't recieve prison sentences, they're sentenced to confinement (I don't know if it's the correct term). The difference is that prison sentences are finite, confinement is not.
Pretty sure he's kept isolated for his own safety.
@@palharaldrindal4871 exactly, like... if he is put in general.. or in public, he wont be alive for long... people are angry. that father is correct, I would rather that my friends swam rather than fight back... but also, if I came over that man being beaten and killed, I would not step in to defend him... id keep walking, i see nothing. I dont want him dead, but I dont want him in the community.
That is the same way with Canada where life is 25 years. After 25 years the parole board will make that determination if the inmate is ready for release back into society. Just like Norway we have prisoners who will never see society ever again
Is it me or are Finland, Sweden and Norway are this deadly triple combo of understanding something the rest of the world doesn't or can't for some reason??
I would love to see a social experiment where American inmateds are sent to a Norwegian prison to see how well they can be rehabilitated.
Denmark too
@@lmao4982 There must be extra oxygen in northeast Europe :/
Yes. Once i saw breaking the cycle and since then i wan't to see such a experiment.
@Marie B. N. Will do, thanks!!
theyd end up stabbing someone. its just how muricans are
5:02 yeah Bastøy is the sort of prison you can apply to when you're on the end of your sentence particularly if you've been well-behaved
Sadly this is not communicated in the video. The inmates on Bastøy have a lot to lose if they don't behave well.
Honestly the FIRST step America would have to take on this front is to stop imprisoning everything that walks on two legs. And for god's sake abolish for-profit private prisons and prison labor, it's shameful, a civilized country would not operate like that.
Are you for REAL ABOLISH prison labour don't you think they should do something for their keep!? What are they meant to do ALL DAY! They are there for because they broke the law.
@@grazutissmith9647 Nice trolling attempt. I'm only saying that of course because I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt that you could actually be that disgusting a person for real.
@@Arbaaltheundefeated I saw at some point that they made stuff for someone on the outside (Graphic Design), but doing that would be prison labor - I dont know if the price has to be of market value though.
you means should because as would it is doing it right now in USA and it works. If your goal is to make some rich people ever richer and imprison a minority population because slavery was illegal and have to find a way around it.
Im Norwegian, we have prison labor as well, not as bad as the US but still.
Yeah, in Norway, your right to vote can only be taken away by the courts in two situations:
1. You're a convicted traitor to the state
2. You're a convicted deserter in war time
And still, I have never heard of anyone having their right to vote taken away. If that'd happen, even to a traitor, there would probably be mass protests. We value democracy higher than anything else. How can you say you live in a democracy if it is conditional?
It's easier to lose your citizenship than to lose your right to vote over here...
Yep, you can even vote as a non-citizen here in Norway at local and regional levels.
@@Luredreier But not at the national level. Even if you have the right to permanent residency and regardless of how long you've lived in Norway.
@@-_James_- of course not. in no country in the world, can you vote on who will run the country, whitout being a citizen of the country, so it require citizenship, not only permanent residency..
Yeah. That's so fucked up. Considering the amount of blacks having been imprisoned at some point, and now they can't vote. No wonder no one cares for the prison system, because they don't count!!
I wonder if i could become a citizen in Norway even with a criminal record here in the US. It's been almost a decade since i committed a crime.
I respect you and your comments on this, as an ex inmate myself. I felt a little tear in my eye and am glad to live in Norway because of how other countries treet their inmates.
At this point i feel like you should come and visit Norway and see how our country works😂😂
+go to prison for the experience
I'm down.
Ok time to move to Norway (when I get enough money/if I get enough)
I don’t need to move to Norway i have lived here since i was alma baby
@@iambored3932 'Alma baby'? Sorry if it's a stupid question, what does that mean?
Bastøy is in the middle of the fjord. It would be extremely hard, if not impossible to swim across, even in the summer.
and oh, yes! they teach vocals and instruments in the public schools. Norway is really good at it.
ja stemmer d, jeg er helvetes god på blokkfløyte
@@kongvinter33 lol! Da er du litt eldre enn 20 antar jeg. ;)
My grandfather did. As a bet. During lunch. He swam to the Island though. 😂
always great to see the US react to other ways of life, seems alot of americans forget that there are other ways of life
You're right, the non-violence thinking is cultural for most people in Scandinavia. Bering Breivik is an outlier compared to general society here and that's why there is no need to change the entire system just because of him. I can't see him being allowed out in society any time soon.
The system already has controls in place for people like him. He's in forvaring, which means he's kept throughout his sentence, but when the sentence is up, he's not automatically released, he gets put before a parole board, that can extend his stay for up to five years before he gets another shot at parole, and there's nothing preventing this from being denied until he dies of old age. It just means they have to give him a parole hearing at least every five years.
The problem with someone like him is that he's shown no signs of remorse, and he has a history of manipulative behavior. He outlined his strategy for concealing his intentions in his manifesto, and he showed no guilt for what he did, although he clearly knew he was doing something most people would find immoral and illegal.
So when he goes before the parole board in like.. 2033 or whatever, even if he's been on good behavior and tries to show regret (which I doubt he will), they can just say sorry bro, we can't trust you because you have a history of concealing your true intentions, and we have no reason to think this is for real.
I want to share this, I was 12 when Breivik bombed a federal building and killed all those teenagers. I remember watching the news about it, I remember being really scared. I remember the days, even the years after. We came together, the entire country, we stood together and mourned together. Many of us didn’t even know those who were affected or those that was killed, but we stood together.
so much respect for the father that lost his child.
"She is naked"
Why do so many Americans say that someone is naked, like a man wearing boxershorts or a woman who is topless?
I never understand why it has to be stated that prisoners in Norway can vote, it's a right, and a right can not be taken away, so it's given that they can vote.
Well your children can’t vote, so don’t pretend like your democracy is a perfect, full democracy. (And no, no country has a perfect, full democracy). It wouldn’t surprise me if prisoners similarly couldn’t vote.
@@krystiankowalski7335 You dont uderstand what he means. A right is given to vote when a person reaches a certain age and qualifies as "can vote". That right can, after that point, never be taken away.
The US takes away the rights of voters if they go to prison. The norwegians dont. Has nothing to do with democracy, its how much the right to vote is valued in each country. In Norway it is untouchable while in the US it is not.
So if children can vote or not is compleatly irrelevant.
@@krystiankowalski7335 Whether democracy is perfect or not is a different question, but the fact that you're using lack of a right for a growing human to vote is mind boggling, would you put a 10 year old behind a steering wheel? Would you force a child into labor at a young age? There's exactly same reasons why children are not allowed to vote, they're growing, they're literal sponges for knowledge, they take in everything yet they lack experience or ability to pick the right knowledge apart to make nation affecting decisions, not even talking about the fact that a child practically has no individual stance on politics or anything like that, they're 100% influenced by their family and surroundings, only as an adult you start to realize that your parents were not always right, that the friends you had were wrong and so on.
The reason why democracy is failing is people like you.
@@Kioselis Actually, yes I would put a 10-year-old behind the steering wheel. Not forced labour though, that’s just slavery. Wouldn’t do that with an adult either.
The thing with not having an individual stance on politics is bullshit. Way too many people at my school are lib-left, which is the opposite of the stance most older people have. Your surroundings do influence you, I’ll give you that, but the surroundings nowadays tend to be the Internet, where you are exposed to a wide range of views.
I’ve had mostly the same general stance since I was 7 (this was not given to me by my parents by the way) and I doubt it will change upon reaching the age of majority. You’re saying that if I were to vote for the Workers’ Party right now, it would be a catastrophe, but if I were to do it in 3 years, it would not? And frankly I’m offended you see me as that stupid.
The reason why democracy is failing is people like *you*. Equal rights when?
@@noobster4779 Well we’re both talking about how much countries value the right to vote here. What’s your point?
The link is that neither can vote. That’s the link. The US doesn’t really care about voting rights.
Philosophy and science theory for Exphil. Exphil being a subject thats usually taken the first semester of university. Basically its a mix of Ethics, Science- and Philosophyhistory
I mean filosfi is obviously philosophy...
I was just about to answer this.. but scrolled down to see if it had been answeres.. you wrote it better than I would have anyway :)
I was sentenced to 60 days of maximum prison, like Halden. I have never felt more secure in my life. I lived with rapists, murderers and sociopaths - make no mistake, some, you stayed away from. But approaching them as a normal human being, they responded as a normal human being. Now, I had a high star, since I was not a criminal, and among criminals, that was something to care for. Two times in those 60 days I was threatened, but it ended with a hug, as I saw that only frightened men will threat another man.
Anyway, these days, Halden does not work that well any longer, because the government are cutting funds. Fewer guards = less schooling = more hours spent on the cell = angrier innmates.
And they did not show you ILA, state prison...wonder why..that is a much tougher climate, but still a world from US prisons.
"RUNE. WHAT AN UNUSUAL NAME."
every single scandinavian person ever: "uhm.... skyrim... hunty. no its not."
Change my name to Skyrim, or Oblivion or Morrowind, just not Redguard NO GOD NOT REDGUARD.
Rune is a very common in name i Norway. Ditto for Ragnar which many english speakers think is a cool name (but is very much an "old uncle" name around here).
Myself..my name is in my handle.
Also..i live in Halden =)
I don´t know about Norway, but in Sweden there is 26 713 men named Rune. That makes it the 86th most common male name in Sweden in 2020. It´s pronounced like Ruh Neh, with the same amount of stress on both syllables. The e- in the end of names are usually not silent.
The average age for people named Rune in Sweden is 74, and it is/was really common among those born in the 1920s and 1930s. It might be one of those names that is coming back, a lot of babies have "old man names" now.
Names are often "recycled" once every 100 years.
@@Asa...S According to Norwegian census bureau (SSB) there are 18761 men with the name Rune - making it the 22nd most common male name in Norway.
Most common mens names are #1 Jan, #2 Per, #3 Bjørn - with 48k, 39k and 38k individuals respectively.
For women top three is: #1 Anne, #2 Inger, #3 Kari.
Most popular baby names in 2020 are: Girls: Nora, Boys: Jakob (and if you look at the rest of the list - very much trending towards "anglo saxon" type names "William, Lucas" and such non traditional names.
My name, "Jarl" - only 1541 got that name.
@@jarls5890 The most common male names in Sweden are Karl, Erik and Lars (Per is 5th, Jan is 10th and Björn is 39th), and the most common female names are Maria, Elisabeth and Anna (Inger is 22nd, and Anne and Kari isn´t on the list, but Ann is 24th and Karin is 8th).
Most common names for baby boys in 2020 was Noah, William and Hugo, while the most common names for baby boys were Alice, Maja and Elsa. It's seems like boys tend to get more anglosaxon names, like Liam, Lucas and Noah, while more girls get traditional names like Astrid, Freja and Alma.
In Sweden there are 1 294 men named Jarl.
The standard of making good neighbors is such a wholesome goal. Like, it makes sense. Sure, punish people for breaking the law, but further damaging people is not going to help anyone. The punishment is taking away freedom, not completely ruining a person because they made a mistake. People learn, people change, people grow. It’s refreshing to see places move beyond the dehumanization of the past, even if it’s a long way to go.
I felt absolutely sick watching those American inmates being abused... 😳😳🤮🤮🤬🤬
And I could see how upset it made you too... 💔
How can anyone do that to another human being without completely loosing themselves?? 😭😭
The abuse is the whole point of American prisons. If you break a person they will become repeat offenders. That way the American prison system makes money off the person until the day they die.
@@DivineFalcon
That's incredibly sad... 😭
Very good question
@L M
It's RUclips that deletes comments with those types of words. I'm pretty sure Max didn't...
Yeah, it's infuriating. Really is.
It should be mentioned that this is usually part of the last years they spend in prison. People with longer sentences spend their first years in prisons you have reacted to earlier and the end of their sentences in this kind of facility to reintegrate to society.
As a Norwegian I find these these videos you make very insightful and interesting to watch so thank you
Just to elaborate a bit on that for anyone else reading the comments. Its known as open prisons and are for the prisoners that have already done most of a long prison sentence. There are different ones around the country, from farms to islands. They have limited capasity and you have to apply to get accepted to one, along with showing good behaviour and a genuine wish to change your life. Even with them being very open the "line in the sand" that they cant pass, say swim or walk a certain distance is very strict. If you try to escape you will not be allowed to re-apply and you will spend more time in a "closed prison". And if you are at a place you can sunbathe by the water, you do NOT want to go back to a cell :)
@@Alex-ir9nx This would never work in the US.. Also, some crimes SHOULD be punished. I have never committed a crime yet, these people are rewarded with better housing an accommodations than most Americans have living normally.. Which would never set a good precedent for criminals as crime would pay off too much. With our culture being much less homogenous and way more diverse, this tends to lead to more crime and violence. So again, this would never work in America.
@@JonHop1 Lmao why do do you think diverse communities equals more crime that statement alone is wrong and problematic and Yt guys are mad mostly about Blk men with Yt girls same as other non Yt men with Yt girls like korean guys thx too kpop and kdramas and Hispanic guys Latin lovers and middle eastern guys nowadays too haha as a Blk migrant Yt guy insecurity is laughable TRIGGRD it could work in america
@@CJ-fs1zr What? I have no clue what the heck you are talking about... But yes, diversity doees cause more tension and conflict, this is factual.. When different cultures, religions, and races come together, it does indeed cause problems due to their different lifestyle's and beliefs. There is a reason the fighting in the Middle East has been going on for Thousands of years...
bastøy is the place you can go in youre last leg of the sentence like 0.6 - 1 year left
Gotcha. Thank you Skimyni :)
I once read a study where young criminals were put into therapy to see if it affected their recidivism rates. It didn't. But when their parents or guardians were put into therapy, the rates lowered. I truly believe these inmates have lower recidivism rates primarily because of the nurturing and safe enviromnent of this prison reconditioning them. Its just hard to fathom in the states because while the nurturing is beneficial, U.S. guards dont want to provide that type of kindness to dangerous crimimals.
I think what Americans don't undersrand and fail to understand is there own shortcommings. Not that of the prisoners. It goes both way. But if you treat people like animals or see them as dangerous than your not open to see what someone realy are and what they can become. If you keep people in a survival mode they are going to do things just to survive
Very late to the comments here, but still. I think a good start to actuate change in the US prison system would be to teach guards to regard prisoners as fellow human beings. And then teach them how to treat prisoners as fellow human beings. From the little I have heard about the systems stateside those two changes would in themselves be a more than tough enough challenge to implement.
Not too late Haukevind. I still read these. :) I like that your idea to implement change considers that some guards may never have even been given the opportunity to consider criminals as anything other than lower class citizens. Of course then, if that's the case, when they are put around inmates they will treat them poorly. I do think baby steps instead of systemic ones can definitely be the correct way to go. And like you said, just because the change is simple, doesn't mean it's easy. Appreciate you voicing this.
I was a volunteer in a American prison to try to teach the inmates when they we set free how to get employment, when the prisoners completed there class as a instructor you weren't permit to complement the prisoners on their accomplishment, but I did anyway and I was replaced after a time, for my actions.
comments and questions that came up as I watched
#1. Can't speak for Norway, but in Finland, yeah singing and instruments are taught in public school. I would assume it's the same for Norway.
#2. What was the intro video you guys got?
#3. That question about whether he wished his son had a gun rubbed me the wrong way. I realise it's supposed to be for shock value, and I guess it worked.
"#3. That question about whether he wished his son had a gun rubbed me the wrong way. I realise it's supposed to be for shock value, and I guess it worked. " - it's a common speaking point in US politics that "the only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun" so I don't believe that he made it as a shock value thing as much as actually asking a question that many of his US viewers would ask.
#1. We do or did at least when I was in schools
#3. Its a very American question. More of a shock to the US I would say. A gun is a terrible way for self defence anyway, takes a lot of training
#1. In Sweden we have the basics of most art in school, but then also a subsidized music school (like a couple of hundred kronor a year to learn an instrument, and cheaper and cheaper for a second and third). So I would leave class several times a week to go have a session alone with a music teacher at the music school, educated to teach that specific instrument. I also took dance classes and drama classes there after school, but in groups. I would assume Norway has a similar system too but I am not sure at all.
the point 1 is ine of the reasons I would be happy to be incarcerated in your prisons,my dreams was yo learn piano,but ai can't afford ot and schools in Italy don't offer this kind of hobbies and opportunities 😂💔
21:12 man this guy, has a heart and mind of steel this made me cry fr.
In the Netherlands, we accept Norwegian prisoners as Norway has not enough capacity (Norway pays for it) because we have a similar philosphy. Not that extreme, but the thinking is the same. However, our police officers are armed and we don't have a vacation facility on an island somewhere. Our prisons are like the Norwegian maximum security prison. We can rent it out, because for 20 years now, crime is falling gradually in the Netherlands. I do acknowledge that the criminals that are still active, are getting more and more aggressive and dangerous (drugs cartels etc).
Netherlands should think about offering (for a price of course) prison and rehabilitation services to other EU countries. For example: setting up a facility to process italian prisoners, hiring italian speaking personnel but using dutch procedures. It could become lucrative for Netherlands.
Cool ending...that was very enlightening. Wow, what a difference. It would be interesting how the inmates from the Norwegian prisons (either or both places) do once released..Like a follow-up of how they are doing.
I would really love to see that as well. Frustrating when all you can find to look at for people post-prison is statistics. Let me see what I can find.
I knew someone who spent the last part of their time on Bastøy. He's doing fine now (5 years later), construction job, no re-offending as far as I know, but we don't hang out anymore.
One of the counselors at my high school is a former prisoner. He has taught and told us about drugs and the prison system. One of the things I remember best is when he told us about the apartments prisoners get to move into for a while right after they're released. They're there to help them integrate back into society again. Especially since housing is difficult to find, if you don't have a family that'll take you in.
here in australia in brisbane they made a new prison which is alot like norwegian prisons, there was alot of uproar from people saying prisoners dont deserve to live like that. i think its a disgusting way to think as over here our prisons are pretty bad too at the end of the day we are all people and deserve a second chance to right our wrongs. i wish more people would be onboard for rehabilitation over punishment and revenge.
Agree with you, i am Norwegian, also i have family in Australia who would agree with you, i hope the rest of Australia will see that to
@@masterofoblivion7963 sadly i dont think they will see it this way, most people who get locked up just stay as criminals the rest of their life. Easier to cheat in life than be legit.
I remember being shocked at the statistics for undiagnosed and untreated ADHD in the prison system in the US - you know, poor impulse control, often trouble managing their emotions (anger), and a strong tendency to self-medicate by way of drugs. :/
And also a documentary on exactly what it (sometimes) looks like when people are released from prison after serving LONG sentences.
When you take a bloke who has been locked up for 20 years, with no variation, no modern tech, no choices - and send them out into the world with close to no support network, it's not pretty.
One guy was put on a long-distance bus to a different city with $50 in his pocket and a slip of paper with the adress of a halfway house he was supposed to stay in.
By the time the bus got to the destination, he'd bought a pack of sigarettes, lost the adress, lost most of his money, and had no idea what to do.
I'm not sure, but I believe he was back inside within a couple of months at most.
You see this in victims of abuse as well - they forget how to make decisions and choices for themselves, because they've been denied the agency to decide anything bigger than "what brand of cigarettes to buy" or "what colour the dish towels should be" for years and you just lose the skills needed to handle all the options that modern life throws at you every second - not to mention the need to be tech savvy just to pay your bills or check your bank balance.
Yeah, it's painful to think about all the people suffering in places like that...
I get your point, and I agree. I don't agree that ADHD patients have trouble managing their anger. That is simply not true to the extent that it poses societal or criminal problems.
@@ronaldderooij1774 Statistics show that about 50% of the people assigned court-mandated anger management classes have undiagnosed ADHD. If you don't get a good foundation with the tools to self-regulate your emotions, and no medication to add that half second of "stop-and-think" which it gives some people, and you have f.ex. RSD - Rejection Sensitivity Dysphoria - then yes, a lot of ADHD people may end up in a situation where their anger (at least in a society like America) will land them in prison.
@@GreyMinerva Well, I suppose so. I know a few ADHD patients. I have only in one case seen sudden anger, but not in the sense of hurting someone. He was just too angry too suddenly for the situation. The others, I have never seen emotional. Chaotic thinking, yes. Although in one case I did not even noticed that. I did not even believe that she had ADHD, but according to my son, who knows her well, she is "almost off the scale". So, yeah. My point is, that it does not pose societal problems as the video suggested.
@@ronaldderooij1774 Oh, don't get me wrong - I got my ADHD diagnosis at 43, three years ago... I am ABSOLUTELY not an angry person. The only one who can push all my buttons is my son, unfortunately - but only to the point of raised voices.
So no, it's not a universal constant - but a lot of undiagnosed ADHD brains have also been mildly or deeply traumatized by growing up "out of step" with society - often failing at "everything", ending up in debt, going from job to job, relationship to relationship and never quite figuring themselves out; all the things that can contribute to mounting anger.
But even I, mostly-chill and laidback person that I am, experienced a new level of emotional control and increased patience when I started on the appropriate medication.
Also, sudden anger doesn't really have to hurt someone directly for it to be a crime - try throwing a TV through a shop window, or driving your car into that rude bastard's car, or making verbal threats that you don't really MEAN, but the just pop out of your mouth because your brain has no brakes...
Or even arguing back against the cops who are treating you in a way that triggers all your old trauma or RSD. :/
That video of the prisoners getting bitten, beaten up.. made me cry..
I'm sorry dillon. I hate it too, but I felt the gravity of the violence has to be shown so people don't think it never happens, and it's just a little shoving going on. Appreciate you sticking through it. Take care.
Why don't you shed some years for the victims and their families instead of the criminals!?!?
As a community the Norway aproach make so much sense. A prisoner costs about 3000 Dollars a month. A resocialized prisoner pays taxes. It makes totaly sense to invest time in these people.
12:17
Yes, yes they do. You even get grades in it in middle school. And in High school you can "major/minor" in music while getting the normal, standard education as well that you need for Universities and higher education. Like, you can do the music line and still educate yourself as a doctor or something else.
I like how the inmates have access to classes that seem similar to college courses, it could allow them to develop new interests that can help them stay busy when they are out of prison. If this was in America, maybe inmates would be more interested in additional education as well, once they see they have an interest in politics or philosophy or music, and that they are able to do these classes.
It is college courses. Ex Phil which is a introductory philosophy class is a class that everyone entering college in Norway has to take. He is probably getting a philosophy bachelor in prison and it's going to be just as legal and official as any bachelor taken at an actual university.
@@martineeinarsen Even better!
Treat people like animals, they will act like animals. Punishment is not the way to go. Most criminals have had a hard life and that's all they've known. When inside give them a chance to educate themselves, teach them a vocational job and make them feel worthy and human. That's how you reduce crimes.
A few details (and correcting some misunderstandings):
- The guards are called "contact officers", which means part of their job is to be personally responsible for the well-being of a small number of inmates and acting as their contact with the outside
- Most of the security is so-called "dynamic security"
- A lot of the services (health, education, ...) that in the US I understand are provided by prison-system-specific providers, are provided by the same providers as if you were outside. If you're getting a high-school education (which could be say to be a mechanic) in Halden, the paper will say the name of the county just like if you were outside
- Being a prison guard requires a two-year college-degree
- Being in prison doesn't change your eligibility to vote, so if it's election-year you'll vote in prison
- Those windows are showing the yard, but in a way that avoids showing the walls and it's setup so that you'll see the progress of time
- The maximum sentence, even ignoring extensions is 30 years, not 21, however 30 years has never been used.
- The assumption is - Most inmates will leave the prison, so the goal is to make good neighbors
When i was conscripted into military service in norway we had those large showers where several people could shower together. Water was usually cold since our barracks was last in line from the heating facility. We also had to share rooms with 3 - 4 other people. So happy we dont have those kind of barracks that you see in Full metal jacket. Not complaining tho, it was a good experience.
in scandinavia if you are homeless... that is a choice. there is so much safety net for our populations, that no one is forced on the streets with no place to stay.
Not a choice excactly, as no one decides to become a drug addict, but you won't become homeless because of poverty alone
I realize this is an old video, but thank you for your views and insight. It's really appreciated.
Hey! Thanks for watching regardless of how old this video is :)
@@MaxHaddadthe world may not be perfect, and not everyone trust each other or help each other enough, but if they did then there might not be any crimes, however no one desserves to be beaten up or killed, sure we do wish the killer dead in the moment not all but some at least, but they do not want to become a killer themself, and want the killer rehabilitated as an alternativ selution, so when they are released they are better people and who know maybe even teach other criminal buddies to be better to, this is just one of the way i see it, it is a good system and i do hope it lasts and spreads to help the human taking a step forward, you know
As a Swede I feel like Americans have a hard time seeing others as humans. I always try to think that even though someone did a crime their still a member in OUR society. If my brother did an awful thing I wouldnt mind that hes going to prison. But I think that he should treat others with respect and others him.
You dont demand respect and loyalty you earn it.
At 14:20 ca, you asked if this is a maximum security prison. I am from Norway, and had a temporary job in a maximum security prison as a a fengselsbetjent (prison server is my closest poor attempt at the direct translation of the job title, US would call it a prison guard). Maximum security prisons in Norway have unscalable wall, heavy compartmentalisation of indoor areas(but still as low as possible internal compartmentalisation within living units as possible) and as much freedom of movement as possible (with safety of employees and inmates in regard) as possible. My unit didn't have private showers, but one-person showers that were lockable from inside to prevent other inmates from entering while in use (but the "prisonseverants" had a masterkey to open it if necessary). I am very proud of the norwegian prison system
So am I , and I've been an inmate.20 years ago this summer.☺️
You're right that there are only a selection of prisoners that get sent to prisons like Bastøy. I don't know if there's any specific conditions, but it's mostly talk about prisoners that are at the last phase of their sentence and are close to being integrated back into society. They are given normal responsibilities and as close to an ordinary life as possible to make the transition from prison to society as smooth as possible.
Some years ago while working in law enforcement I had a supervisor who had been in the police in Canada. I asked him why the US had such a violent and vengeful attitude in law enforcement and he replied that in the US the population moved west and the law came later. In Canada the law arrived before the population (Mounties etc). So while the US experience was one of trying to push the cork back in the bottle the Canadian experience was one of keeping the pressure down, so avoiding an explosion. An interesting perspective.
Love the fact that you trying to make a positive impact on society this way. Great project my friend. Change is going to come!
Of course, you get a like and me as a subscriber - It's my pleasure! 👍
I think the difference between America and Norway prison systems is that the American prison system is focused on punishment and have a tendency to dismiss the person after doing their time, there's no real rehabilitation involved, which in turn creates a never ending cycle of offences for these people. Where as the Norway prison system is focused primarily on rehabilitation, and making sure that the prisoners have the tools to establish themselves again as part of society when they are released, so that they are less likely to reoffend.
@Max Haddad 12:25 Yes, they teach music and it's theory, instruments and singing in most scandinavian/nordic countries
I think you would enjoy clips from the show "Poliisit", there are some with English subtitles on RUclips. It's a show that follows real Finnish police during their day-to-day jobs and tasks.
15:17
"Philosophy and sciencetheory for ExPhil" ("ExPhil" is the name of the study, it's short for "Examen Philosophicum", latin for "philosophic exam")
I'm unable to read the smaller black letters, only see the big white ones.
So I'm afraid I'm unable to tell you who the author of that book is...
It's for the entrance exam to the university - all university students start off with the "Ex.Phil", which teaches philosophy, a bit of scientific history and critical thinking etc. Basically "Getting you aquainted with the great thinkers and different ways of looking at knowledge, truth, theories and such". :)
No worries! Thank you for this Luredreier.
This is my opinion with no proof behind it or anything: In the US if you suggest things like "We should defund the police because...." You get "No! Police needs the money, Why do you want crime!". When the who sentense was "We should defund the police because they cant handle all the different situations they are asked to handle. We should get more money towards social work, housing, mental health help and make sure the police can focus on the situation where police is needed" It it bit too much all or nothing sometimes with Americans :)
I'm from Denmark and Norway and work in Sweden but I also have studied, worked in the US for 4 years and still own property in two states over there. There are many things I like about the US especially its people regardless of 50% of them believing in ineffective public systems with even more ineffective private suppliers.
The US have spent more money and human sacrifice, then any other country by bombing in Iraq with the explanation that "Now America will bring Iraq democracy and humanity". Americas current criminal law and its correctional system and the American peoples strong believe in hate and retaliation is similar to Code of Hammurabi a Babylonian legal text composed c. 1755-1750 BC.. later re-discovered by the Romans as lex talionis. Babylon was in Iraq and today the city is called Bagdad.
If one is not familiar with the religious scriptures It is really difficult to identify any reason for the US and its people to base sanctions and punishment on the basis of 4000 years old principles and cast aside the vast scientific knowledge and experience obtained during those 4000 years.
In Europe we first had Roman law and later the dreadful Canon law which sometimes was followed or mixed by the laws of various kings. What helped us to progress to a humane and predictable regime in western Europe was the founding fathers and philosophers of the USA and 2 centuries later it was the UK who gave us the European Convention on Human Rights.
It was Ronald Regan, an actor, president, Alzheimer patient and not to forget heavily dependent on drugs such as Amphetamine who set out to destruct the US welfare system and its foundation it is entirety... Regan and his voters believed in primitive behavior which should be motivated by "greed" which again was rebranded as "American Freedom".
If America wanted to have more humane conditions and reestablish the welfare state it would have to reverse many of Regan's doings and increase taxes and introduce new taxes e.g. the sales of controlled substances (Now buy your Coke at Walmart next to the Guns for Teens section "LOL") which again would contribute heavily to the Welfare System. Sadly I do not ever see the US getting back to a welfare system without some kind of internal war which is unlikely.
The worst thing that could happen to the current US system is that other other countries would create a competing financial system for banks and stock trading. The competing Internet already exists and the competing financial system is rapidly being developed by the rest of the world. When that happens the US will seize to be a superpower and suddenly it will be more important than ever that the states reestablish some kind of welfare state ... this scenario is properly more realistic than civil war.
The US once decided that it would land on the moon and so it did.
The both political sides of the US says that it cant have a reasonable and effective welfare system thus there will never be a welfare system again unless both political sides are dismantled or forced to reconsider.
I'm not sure that anything should change in the US but I guess that it would be fair to give the less fortunate of its people a chance to migrate away from what to them must feel like a failed state.. The problem is that no country really want to accept the average American.. maybe you could make a welfare state in Alaska and let sick, uninsured and uneducated people migrate to a life with humanity and dignity in Alaska. Look that the bright side.. you would not have any homeless people any more.
Yeah. It's a bit silly really. If the police do something wrong it has to be corrected, but reducing funding is tge wrong way to go. Perhaps instead more money for an education program or something.
@@MrThorsteinb the US should try adapting Israel's law on crime and punishment this is from the new world translation of the Holy scriptures Bible Major crimes under the Law. Capital crimes. Under the Law the death penalty was prescribed for (1) blasphemy (Le 24:14, 16, 23); (2) worship of any god other than Jehovah, idolatry in any form (Le 20:2; De 13:6, 10, 13-15; 17:2-7; Nu 25:1-9); (3) witchcraft, spiritism (Ex 22:18; Le 20:27); (4) false prophecy (De 13:5; 18:20); (5) Sabbath breaking (Nu 15:32-36; Ex 31:14; 35:2); (6) murder (Nu 35:30, 31); (7) adultery (Le 20:10; De 22:22); (8) woman marrying with false claim of being a virgin (De 22:21); (9) intercourse with engaged girl (De 22:23-27); (10) incest (Le 18:6-17, 29; 20:11, 12, 14); (11) sodomy (Le 18:22; 20:13); (12) bestiality (Le 18:23; 20:15, 16); (13) kidnapping (Ex 21:16; De 24:7); (14) striking or reviling a parent (Ex 21:15, 17); (15) bearing false witness, in a case where the penalty for the one testified against would be death (De 19:16-21); (16) coming near to the tabernacle if not authorized (Nu 17:13; 18:7).
In many instances the penalty named is ‘cutting off,’ usually executed by stoning. Besides this being prescribed for willful sin and abusive, disrespectful speech against Jehovah (Nu 15:30, 31), many other things are named that bear this penalty. Some of them are: failure to be circumcised (Ge 17:14; Ex 4:24); willful neglect of the Passover (Nu 9:13); neglect of Atonement Day (Le 23:29, 30); making or using the holy anointing oil for ordinary purposes (Ex 30:31-33, 38); eating blood (Le 17:10, 14); eating a sacrifice in an unclean condition (Le 7:20, 21; 22:3, 4, 9); eating leavened bread during the Festival of Unfermented Cakes (Ex 12:15, 19); offering a sacrifice in any place other than at the tabernacle (Le 17:8, 9); eating of communion offering on the third day from the day of sacrifice (Le 19:7, 8); neglect of purification (Nu 19:13-20); touching holy things illegally (Nu 4:15, 18, 20); intercourse with menstruating woman (Le 20:18); eating fat of sacrifices.-Le 7:25; see CUTTING OFF.
Punishments imposed by the Law. Punishments under the Law given by Jehovah through Moses served to keep the land clean from defilement in God’s sight; those who practiced detestable things were cleaned out from among the people. Also, the punishments deterred crime and maintained respect for the sanctity of life, for the law of the land, for the Lawgiver, God, and for one’s fellowman. And, when obeyed, the Law preserved the nation from economic failure and from moral decay with its subsequent loathsome diseases and physical deterioration.
There were no barbarous punishments prescribed by the Law. No man could be punished for another’s wrongs. The principles were clearly set forth. The judges were granted latitude, considering each case on its own merits, examining the circumstances, as well as the motives and the attitudes of those accused. Justice had to be strictly rendered. (Heb 2:2) A willful murderer could not escape the death penalty by any payment of money. (Nu 35:31) If a man was an accidental manslayer, he could flee to one of the cities of refuge provided. Confined within the boundary of the city, he was forced to realize that life is sacred and that even accidental killing could not be taken lightly, but required some compensation. Yet, working productively in the city of refuge, he was not a financial burden on the community.-Nu 35:26-28.
The sanctions for offenses were designed to give relief and compensation to the victim of a thief or of one who damaged his property. If the thief could not pay the stipulated amount, he could be sold as a slave, either to the victim or to someone else, thus reimbursing the victim and making the criminal work for his upkeep, so that the state would not have him on its hands, as is the case where imprisonment is practiced. These laws were just and served toward the rehabilitation of the criminal.-Ex 22:1-6.
Under the Law, the death sentence was carried out by stoning. (Le 20:2, 27) The sword was occasionally used, especially where a large number were to be executed. (Ex 32:27; 1Ki 2:25, 31, 32, 34) If a city turned apostate, all in the city were to be devoted to destruction by the sword. (De 13:15) At Exodus 19:13, death by the spear, lance, or possibly the arrow, is alluded to. (See Nu 25:7, 8.) Beheading is mentioned, although it may be that execution was carried out by another means and the corpse beheaded. (2Sa 20:21, 22; 2Ki 10:6-8) For the more detestable crimes the Law prescribed burning and hanging. (Le 20:14; 21:9; Jos 7:25; Nu 25:4, 5; De 21:22, 23) These sentences were carried out only after a person had been first put to death, as the cited scriptures plainly state.
Captives of war were usually executed by the sword if they were persons devoted to destruction by God’s command. (1Sa 15:2, 3, 33) Others who surrendered were put to forced labor. (De 20:10, 11) Older translations of the passage at 2 Samuel 12:31 make it appear that David tortured the inhabitants of Rabbah of Ammon, but modern translations indicate that he merely put them to forced labor.-See NW; AT; Mo.
Precipitation, that is, throwing one off a cliff or high place, was not enjoined by law, but King Amaziah of Judah inflicted this punishment on 10,000 men of Seir. (2Ch 25:12) The people of Nazareth attempted to do this to Jesus.-Lu 4:29.
Strict justice was enforced by the law of talion or retaliation, like for like, where injuries were deliberately inflicted. (De 19:21) There is at least one recorded instance of the execution of this penalty. (Jg 1:6, 7) But the judges had to determine on the basis of the evidence whether the crime was deliberate or was due to negligence or accident, and so forth. An exception to the law of retaliation was the law dealing with a situation in which a woman tried to help her husband in a fight by grabbing hold of the privates of the other man. In this case, instead of her reproductive organs being destroyed, her hand was to be amputated. (De 25:11, 12) This law demonstrates God’s regard for the reproductive organs. Also, since the woman was owned by a husband, this law mercifully took into consideration the right of the husband to have children by his wife.
The Mishnah mentions four methods of inflicting the death penalty: stoning, burning, beheading, and strangling. But these latter three methods were never authorized nor commanded under the Law. The methods prescribed in the Mishnah are part of the traditions that were added, overstepping the commandment of God. (Mt 15:3, 9) An example of the barbarous practices to which it led the Jews is their method of executing the penalty of burning. “The ordinance of them that are to be burnt [is this]: they set him in dung up to his knees and put a towel of coarse stuff within one of soft stuff and wrapt it around his neck; one [witness] pulled one end towards him and the other pulled one end towards him until he opened his mouth; a wick [according to the Gemara (52a) it was a strip of lead] was kindled and thrown into his mouth, and it went down to his stomach and burnt his entrails.”-Sanhedrin 7:2; translated by H. Danby.
Since man has been governed by law from the beginning, either by divine law or by the law of conscience divinely implanted, it has been true that the closer men held to true worship, the more reasonable and humane were the punishments administered by their laws, and the farther away they strayed, the more corrupt their sense of justice became. This becomes evident when the laws of ancient nations are compared with those of Israel.
I don’t think you can implement the Norwegian prison system in USA just like that in a week or two. You got to do something with the society and the general mindset first. I so much agree with you when you say that there is a middle ground between the Norwegian system and how it is in the US, and any step towards a more human way to treat prisoners I think would do more good than harm all over (sorry if I write in Norwenglish…too tired to think in English)
No! Your writing was good! :) I agree with you that it's not as simple as a group of powerful politicians implementing systemic changes and expecting the rest of the population to follow suit. I think working towards that middle ground is a smart approach, and I'm hopeful that just simply being aware of certain positive and negative facets of both the American and Norwegian(and other) systems will gently help people move toward a more effective perspective. Sorry if that was overly wordy, I have been accused of that before. :) Thank you for the comment Else! Take care.
Middle ground be good. Treat people like humans and decent food be a good start. Next pay more than a dime a day for working. Unfortunately it's no money in it for the authorities, so I don't think it would happen. One can hope though.
A prerequisite for working as a prison guard in Norway is a bachelors degree. You have to be a fully trained social worker; _then_ you can train to become a prison guard.
One things "the island" is for prisoners who have "behave" during a long time, and is at there end of there captivity. Its also "training" to live a civilian life. You have your "own" home and "responsibility" to behave. Some have real civilan work but they must be back on "the island" in the evening.
So ""the island" is the ultimate reward for prisoners who "behave" attack a gard or somthing stupid like that and you louse all your privileges.
They use Bastøy prison for the transition from prison to society. the people that are in prison in Bastøy are really just there for a couple of months to a year mby before they go out to society unless they relapse during their time on Bastøy.
I guess it's just the difference between having a justice system and a legal/revenge system.
You're not wrong.
I think your confusing revenge and justice!!!
This isn't justice. Imagine if someone killed someone you loved and went here? What a joke.
@@user-sm4fp2jo1o The killer made the biggest wrongdoing a human can do to another, take his/her life. But who are we to seal the fate of others? Is that not the same as the killer did to his victim? Who are you to decide? What makes you so special? Treating hate with hate has never solved anything in this world, hate can grow so strong it comes easily out of control. And supporting death sentence like you do in the US is some of the most inhumane I know of. Sure, the victims family with the wrong mentality and mindset may think they feel better knowing the killer of their family member is dead by lethal injection. But it will not bring their loved one back. It is not like we are turning the other cheek asking for another punch in the face, instead we stand facing each other, look each other in the eye, listen and learn. Grow bigger, be better and learn the path to forgiveness. It will set you free. But the guilt that killer have will never leave him/her.
Yes - music is a class every kid has in elementary schools. Unfortunately not as much as earlier - but they are supposed to learn the fundamentals of music history and basic concepts of music.
In Norway, at least during the post-war era (WW2) there was a focus on giving the working class access to "arts" and a general understanding of how art is shaping our collective identeties. Before this, art was something that only the upper classes had access to. While they have drifted away from those kinds of classes in the past 20 years, it's still there as a foundation.
Norwegian prisons do not allow prisoners to leave at any time like in Finland. You sadists! :D
hahaha
The losing one´s freedom is the punishment. Greetings from Finland, also a Nordic country as Norway. NOT included into Skandinavia , Finnish has its own language group.
You are right. Loosing one’s freedom is the punishment, and there should be a difference between punishment and revenge. Much love to my Nordic brother Finland🇫🇮
i think it depends how Whelthy is the society,the problem for a lot countries this life the inmates get is a luxurious one that offers lot of opportunities (free education, healthcare, hobbies like playing instruments for free, cool apartment,good food, and lot of entertainment) that someone of the free people Will never get and are actually less fre than them (don't tell me working 10 hours per say and not getting enough to habe to not kive with tkur parents is freedom)
This is a minimum-security prison where people are sent either at the end of their sentence or if the sentence was short. And obviously, if they are deemed to be on good behavior.
@TheRenaissanceman65 Let's just say i have some experience of how they work in Sweden
did you even watch the whole video?
@@Sadon06 yeah why?
The island is low security. The big Halden prison with high walls, are a max prison.
That makes sense, transition them to normal life near end of sentence.
Dear Max, best of everything to you. Your commentary is moving, especially the part about those returning to prison after a few weeks.
There s not a prison in Norway that is created for revenge - all of them is made for rehabilitation. You get a small amount of money, tv, refrigherator and bathroom in your cell. Library, gym, healthcare, education possibillities and more. This is a good thing - it is important that the inmates becomes "good neighbours" when they "done their time". We does mostly succeed in this matter.
you know - before the year 1800, the British philosofer Sir Francis Bacon wrote: A man who studieth revenge keeps his own wounds green
It's good to know that choosing compassion and what is effective over revenge isn't a brand new idea.
I really enjoyed your commentary on this video! You seem like a nice person. I never write comments here on youtube. But i just felt like writing this :)
Well Oskar I really appreciate you taking the time to write one then. That means a lot. Hope you are doing great. :) Appreciate you watching.
Prison is not a business in Norway.
12:39
That red book is the laws of Norway.
and in Sweden it is blue.
@@magnusemilsson7205 Thats a cool trivia to know! Thank you for that
How fitting - Red for N, Blue for S - Just like the flags
From a different perspective, even the maximum-security prisons here in Norway are so much nicer than the old age homes that old people joke about becoming criminals...
But that's also because the moneyjar for healthcare has been emptied into the pockets of the governement. And you need a few workers for 50 prisoners and about one person per elderly person. Prisoners can wash, feed and walk by themselves.
15:18 the title of the book is " Philosophy and Scientific theory to ExPhil" with ExPhil being one of two academic exams in most undergraduate programmes at Norwegian universities.
I love you for commenting but this has been answered I think over 100s of times now hahaha. I never should have asked that question! :) Ty for watching, for real.
Good vid cheers from norway🇧🇻
Cheers from the U.S. ! Thanks for watching :) Cool name btw, Horror anything is the best anything. (except for real life I guess)
"filosofi og vitenskapsteori til ExPhil"
is the blue text book held up
It translates as "Philosophy and Scientific Theory to ExPhil"
ExPhil, as I understand it, is a compulsory course
in all Norwegian universities by Royal Decree
(Norwegian equivalent of Executive Order)
It is designed to give students a guide to philosophical thinking
and critical thinking.
As a quick disclaimer: I'm not a Christian, but I was raised in a Christian family in Germany. And though I'm an atheist, I still believe in many values and virtues the bible talks about.
With all the videos of Americans reacting to videos of nordic prisons I've seen, there is always one thought that crosses my mind every time. And the thought is: The self-proclaimed Christian society of the US is not really Christian. Their god is the revengeful god of the Old Testament, the Jewish god.
The New Testament, written to teach believers the sermons of Jesus Christ. He wants people to forgive. "You have heard that it was said, "An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth." But I say to you. Do not resist the one who is evil. But if anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn him the other also. And if anyone would sue you and take your tunic, let him have your cloak as well."
This is an enourmous difference in attitude and philosophy or mentality/values in general between the US and (parts of) Europe. And I think the American society will not change its view of law enforcement and corrections until there is a fundamental change in its values, which I can't see happening even in the distant future. A depressing thought.
Wow, that was DEFINITELY the best comment I have ever read ANYWHERE. I would say more, but I am seriously at a loss for words.... #Standing ovation 👏 Our beliefs are different, but thank you for the extremely educated explanation of yours.
You know, I remember this quote: "An eye for an eye and makes the whole world blind".
The God of the Old Testament and Jesus are the same
@@Silvia_Arienti So do many believe. But there is a big difference between the two of them. The god of the Old Testament is vengeful, the god of the New Testament is forgiving. And there are people who believe in one or the other.
I don't believe in god at all, but if I had to choose, I'd chose the god of the New Testament.
@@twinmama42 No, they literally are the same. Believing they are two different gods is an heresy called Marcionism.
6:15 Our prisons are a lot more like rehab, for sure. I've visited someone in my family at rehab and I know a few that has been to prison and they've said the same.
That being said, some prisons do look and feel a lot more like a prison, but the focus and treatment is more like a rehab overall in those as well.
What a huge difference between the two countries. It's just like night and day. Like you said, I believe there needs to be a happy medium between the two.
But on the other hand, it's really working for them. There's no violence, and the recidivism rate is low.
So what does that show you? That it's working. I'm conflicted.
The violence you saw, must have been horrible. I'm so sorry you had to go through that.
You have my great grandfather to an extent, to thank for the current penal system in Norway.
He was a prominent figure in the discussions that arose after the war regarding punishment vs. rehabilitation in post war Norway.
He started out as a warden without any form of education and ultimately became head administrator of the biggest prison in one of Norways four largest cities :)
i wont discuss what i believe is the best. You will have to decide that for yourself.
i dont know what you have been locked up for, but i wish you good luck whatever it is.
I am a Norwegian, and this don't paint the right pigture of the prisen system!
This is bastøy prison. It is the best prison in the word but it is not a normal Norwegian prison. It is a prison you can get sent to at the end of your sentence with good behavior. Then it is more likely you don’t try to escape. But some still have.
The problem is to get them on the right foot in life. Prison is a rehabilitation place where you get time to think about yourself. Norway is a great definition of what a prison should look like.
American prisons are a joke.
Now also once these people get out, 99.999% of them will not have a job, because no one would like to hire someone with a criminal background. So their job opportunities is very limited and their life as well. Sure they might enjoy prison but outside it, it's a different story.
I was in Norwegian High security prison. Locked in a small cell 23 hours and 45 minutes a day.
Best day of the week was library day, got to go to the next building, even outside. And I made sure I've saved all my valium all week for that day 😅
The fun part was the prison nurse who was drugged behind his mind at the end of each day 😂
15:42
Politicans going to prison isn't really a thing here in Norway.
It *can* happen, but it's kind of rare...
That sounds like how it should be lol. If you should go, you do go. None of this buying your way out nonsense we do here.
We've had a couple of Stortingsmenn (Stortinget = Norwegian Parlament, menn = men) being a bit too creative with traveling-bills they tried to get refunded and/or didn't disclose it on their tax-returns, but not much else.
@@baardkopperud Well, there was one FRP ("Progress Party, aka anti-immigration populists) politican who left politics because of a rape charge, not sure if he ended up in jail or not...
Another kind of spicy story involved a family member of another FRP member who ruined his car and sent him death threats (probably trying to implicate the political left) but who got caught doing so and who's therefore serving time in jail I believe...
Rune is an old Norwegian name that has been used since the Viking Age. The name is a product after runes. When few could read, runic script was considered magical signs used in religious rituals. Norwegians are good at using old names, names are part of our roots. My son's name is Sune which means son in Old Norse.
Hatred has never beaten hatred, it has only ever bred more hatred.
Love and kindness are the only things that can beat hate. Most of the time it doesn't, but when it does it is super beautiful.
In the case of Anders Breivik: He will be psychologically evaluated before being released. It is doubtful that he will ever be mentally stable enough to rejoin society, but wouldn't that be a beautiful thing to see? A man so full of hate that he killed 77 people could be cured of his hatred and become a productive member of society again? Wouldn't that send such a strong message of peace?
I could Not possibly disagree with you more!
Agreed
The religion of peace has been beaten with hatred at the door of Europe plenty of times.
but are victim helped too? because if they are abandoned with their trauma it seems to me they are the one who get punished at the end
@@rhythmicmusicswap4173 Well... The ones that were killed are beyond our help. The people who survived got medical and psychological attention, which really is the only way to help afaik.
Punishing Breivik does not actually help the victims. It might satisfy their thirst for vengeance, but the justice system was never built around vengeance.
A famous thing to say in Norwegian prisons, when tanning in the sun:
"Jeg ligger her å soner meg!"
"Soner" translates to "sentencing", instead of saying "Soler", which translates to "tanning"
Essentially, you're saying "I'm laying here doing my sentence", instead of "I'm laying here getting my tan on."
There's no english way of making it rhyme unfortunately.
EDIT: On a sidenote, we dont have homeless people in our country.
By the way the mass murderer in Norway will never get out as long as he is seen as a danger to society or at high risk for repeating he will not be let out
It seems like people think that in Norway, even a dangerous murderer will be free after a couple decades at most, and that's not the case. I appreciate you sharing that, people need to know that just because Norway is compassionate, it doesn't mean they are stupid!
He could s still living comfortably though
@@MaxHaddad his sentence will be prolonged until he has one foot in the grave.
Similar to Denmark! I feel like we have a great system, especially after seeing what happens in American prisons. So sad :(
Quick note on Halden fengsel. It's currently very understaffed so a lot of prisoners are kept in isolation 23 hours a day and violence is building up. The former Norwegian government cut down a *lot* to save money to give the richest tax cuts and that's where the money goes. I just hope the current government can mend that, but it'll take time, years.
This isn’t a social study experiment . This has been going on for quite many years. And it’s more than this one.
It's correct this is not the average prison and there are the ones that resemble more what one would expect. Even so, the worst prison in Northern Europe is better than the best in USA.
A huge problem in USA is the mentality and the opportunity to profit on running prison like a business.
The dad is a bigger man than me and most people, and killing the sons killer won't bring back his son!
Nope your right it eon bring his son back but at least he would feel that some form of justice has been executed! And not just having his son's killer living a comfortable existence in prison!
Please, do a simular video about prison in sweden. We have 3 stages of "hardness" in sweden prisons. Class 1, class 2, and class 3. Class 1 is the most toughest prisons in sweden. Kumla, Hall, Norrtälje, Saltvik, Salberga, hällby, and tidaholm, are class 1. What we called "closed" prisons. Class 2 are closed also, but not as class 1. And class 3 are more free.
I am not 100% sure but i thought ila fengsel (ila prison) was the most secure... i know that they have a lot of psychiatric inmates, and that it has a lot more guards per person. But that might just be one wing of the whole prison. As i said not 100% sure about this!
Its a bit hard to defy as we dont do the maximum security prison the say way the US does. Ila and Halden are both maximum security prison but in different ways. Its more about what the guards are able to do in case of things getting out of hand. But its a good question for sure.
@@Alex-ir9nx thats very true! Its hard to defy bc of how its set up in Norway vs the USA! I tried to look it up on their website, but it didnt say much on ila as a prison.
Halden is a more recent institution. Ila is much older.
@@TullaRask oh okay! That makes sense😅
I have had SO many coming back...i have worked as a teacher in prisons here in Norway for...6-7 years.
They are not a part of a "PROGRAM". This is prison in Norway
I am Danish and while we are not at the point Norway is at regarding prison systems and implementing ideas like this, we are closer to Norway than to USA by far.
When I see reports out of the prison system of the USA I can only think "If any of this happened here it would result in huge scandals, arrested correction officers and even closed prisons".
I can't blame USA or Americans though, because looking around the world it seems the US correctional system is more an example of the rule and is definitely not the exception. Unless we as humans take care to sit down and reason, to think about what is right and what is wrong and what is constructive and what isn't, then we act like animals. The animal inside all of us wants to respond with violence and insensibility but as rational, thinking and intelligent beings we can set aside our irrationality if we so choose.
This is also a really important thing to remember about the prison system in Norway and similar systems elsewhere in the Nordics. This was not handed down from ancient times, it doesn't come out of a magical box, the reason systems like this exist is because people here looked at the existing systems and said "this doesn't work, we need to try something else" and then sat down and studied and experimented with alternatives. It's easy to let emotions rule the day and to seek vengeance and act in spite, but emotions doesn't change reality only our perception of it.
A prison system based on vengeance doesn't work but instead of trying to make their prison system work people have instead just convinced themselves that imprisonment is done for vengeance and the victim's "sense of justice" rather than for the protection and betterment of society, and so for most people the dysfunction and abuse of the system become the point of the system, the abuse is the criminal's punishment for being "bad". You can see this clearly whenever prison life comes up in daily talk in any group with large or majority US people in it, the Americans will be at least semi-seriously be glorifying prison rapings, inmates beating and murdering each other and various groups of inmates being abused by each other or correctional officers. Americans don't want to talk change to the prison system because the prevailing idea is that the horrors and evils of the system is somehow "good" or "right", and sadly I have talked to many Danes who also have this view (probably not incidentally people with this viewpoint also tend to be the same people who support inhumane policies towards the homeless, psychiatric patients and other vulnerable groups in society).
1:28
"Rune", not "Run".
The "e" at the end of a word being silent is a English thing, not something other germanic languages do as far as I know.
Certainly not nordic languages nor German.
This prison is for exemplary behavior as far as I know. In addition, you are not sentenced to Bastøy, but towards your release you might get transfered there. I was in prison for a short time as a kid (18) and it was far more prison like back then, so things have drasically changed in 30 years, I feel like. But its working.
Treat a man like a beast and he will become a beast. Don't, and you will still have a man.
Bastøy is a transition prison that you can apply to at the end of a long sentence in order to acclimate to free life after 10 or 20 years of solitary confinement.
I actuarly wants to see an american prisoner come to a norwegian prison.... just to see what would change
Me too. I have a video on an American prison in Pennsylvania that is trying to do what is done in other more humane prisons, but it's only in the beginning stages and unfortunately covid slowed it down quite a bit. From what I've heard they are back up and running though. I know that's not exactly what you said but it's close. :) I would love, love, love to see an inmate be transferred to a Norwegian prison to see what would change.
@@MaxHaddad that sounds like it would be amaising to watch 😁
Recidivism sure doesn't. Different populace.
subscribed! and i watched. i cried at the ending with the song.
Our police need to start being "peace officers " 1st off ..
hahaha
@@MaxHaddad it's a pipe dream...I know 😕 lol
Firs and foremost, norwegian prisoners are treated and respected as human beings. If you are given respect, even if you have done something wrong then you wont have to be mean. I know we have norwegian prison officers that are working with US prisons.
😳 he's a murderer...in a nicer house 🏠than mine....
HE TOOK A LIFE..WTH
I m moving and creating a crime
He spent many years in a horrible home earning that house he can't leave. If this looks good to you, look closer.
Their system is a joke!
@@grazutissmith9647 😂
When it comes to ABB and Utøya, that guy is never coming out again. He is sitting on what is called "forvaring" in Norway. The max is 21 years, but it can be prolonged eternaly. I still remember ehere I was thatr saturday morning, after the mass shooting. I was looking after a dog for a friend of mine....this was in 2011, and I cried!! But I still work in the prison education system, there are people out there that need to be saved.
your information is not correct, this is not an exception, this is how the entire prison system in Norway works.
Very sad to hear that
Yeah Bastøy is minimum-security
The funny thing is that if you escape the island they want you to call and say that you are allright, so they know you are allright and dont need to look for you in the ocean😂