Golf Iron Shaft Test - Heavyweight Shaft VS Lightweight Shaft With Launch Monitor Results
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- Опубликовано: 5 сен 2024
- Golf iron shaft testing with a heavyweight steel shaft going against a lightweight steel shaft using GC2/HMT to look at results as well as my personal feedback on feel.
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I think we often overlook swing tempo when choosing shafts. I have a short back swing with an aggressive transition. I was using senior flex lightweight shafts because that's what I was "supposed" to be using based upon my swing speed and distance. At a demo day they put a Mizuno swing analyzer on and it said I should be using KBS Tour Pro shafts. Immediately my dispersion tightened up, and my distance increased.
You hit the nippon first giving a slight advantage to the TT. If you smash factor were improved a hair I think the two would be quite similar! Thanks 🙏🙏🙏
Thank you , this is great topic ... I am considering changing iron shafts from dynamic gold xp (113 grams) to dynamic gold series 85 (92 grams). After watching this video.... I concur the solid feel is more important than lightweight feel . Feel = Accuracy.
Look at his smash efficiency, club speed 95.5 smash is 1.28. Now for most of us amateurs, try swinging 130 gram shafts vs 80 gram shafts and play 36 holes back to back, or 3 days 18 hole straight golf.
I play with a low handicap friend that swears he hits it farther with a lighter shaft. Great video. Thanks
Most do
Great test Michael. I switched shafts in my AP-2 7 iron last year after bending it, from Project- X rifle 5.5 to True Temper DG S300. I have DG S300 in my old blades and just prefer the feel of them over the Project X, which actually feels heavier. (although having just weight them both, the Project X is about 30g lighter) I´d never really thought about swing weight / flight characteristics before, just assumed it was all down to my strike, so it´s interesting to hear your thoughts on this and the difference in feel between the two (I have similar swing speed, around 92-95mph with 7 iron)
Interesting test Micheal, Thai you.
so is it just a given that light shaft = high ball flight, heavy shaft = low? Or is there more involved in shaft selection like tip stiffness, swing tempo, etc.
The Nippon had "very high" launch compared to the s300 but the avg difference was 1yrd... Nippon was 33-35yrds, S300 32-35yrds. Not sure if I could spot a 3ft difference... I assume Nippon achieved max height faster and stayed aloft longer due to the 700rpm increase in backspin. Great Vid!
Bingo. Decent angle had a degree in it too. Bit of weight, seemed to tame the shot he didn't want to see.
Mike,
Basic physics explain why your ball speeds were lower with the lighter shaft. If we assume the swing force (F) was the same for both clubs, the inertia you exerted over the ball was not. The lighter club simply had less mass (m).
This also explains the longer carry distances and the spin numbers. The ball was able to stay inert longer on the face creating a longer interaction with the grooves and creating more spin. This backspin creates more lift in the air and increases decent angle. All of these reduce carry distance.
Is that right? I agree basic physics is f=m x a. But the force being applied to the ball is surely by the club head so it is the mass of the club head which is relevant not the mass of club head AND shaft. No idea whether this is right though - just asking the question
It was the smash factor. He didnt hit it as pure with the nippon. He actually got slightly higher ballspeed with the nippon at 1.35 smashfactor vs 1.36 with DG. I agree i dont think shaft weight has any impact, though maybe the stiffness, since it doesnt give in as much? Need to look at this as a dynamic movement not as static.
Justin Stephenson you must consider all moving items involved when calculating mass. This includes the head, shaft, and the person swinging the club. Because the head and person stayed constant throughout the tests the only thing we need to consider is the shafts
I think this is one where quality of strike over rules everything. As far as I can tell there is no correlation between shaft weight and carry distance when humans test - maybe there would be when robots test - if anything heavier shafts tend to produce shorter carries for more golfers which is not necessarily in contradiction with you if the heavier shaft results in a much slower swing. I am not convinced that anything other than the club head is relevant for mass - but then again I am not a scientist
You can’t really draw any conclusions about the spec of a golf club vs shot results when doing a test like this. There are just so many variables in a golf shot when you introduce the human element. If you hit them both on a robot with the exact same swing speed attack angle etc etc etc you wouldn’t see any difference, but in the hands of a golfer the weight or feel of a club can absolute have an impact on how a player swings the club. I’m a high swing speed player but play light weight (80 gram) graphite shafts in my irons because I like the lighter feel and less harsh vibrations graphite offers.
Great video Mike, not many pro's have done that type of test. Great to see the difference in launch and spin. Looking forward to future videos, cheers Andy
Andy Wood thanks Andy
Very interesting video. The ball speed increase is remarkable. Maybe the weight of the heavier shaft gives more impetus to the ball...like tiny hammer versus sledgehammer.
Seems that the weight is more important than the flex. Nice one.
That's down to strike. He has more clubhead speed with the lighter shaft. The only way that can translate into lower ball speed is by not hitting the centre of the face. You can see this in the spin numbers and launch angles. 3 shot sample with 1700 rpm spin difference and nearly 2 degrees variation in launch angle points to a couple of wildly different strikes. Mike is Mr. Consistency most of the time so this really stands out. If you are choosing shafts I would do a lot more personal testing than just 3 strikes unless you get 3 relatively equal strikes.
Momentum is a bit higher in heavier shafts. Swing speed and shaft weight and flex are correlated.
can you do a video on driver shaft weight , the driver length video was excellent would like to see advantage/disadvantage of a heavier shaft , cheers
I second this. Would love to see comparisons starting from 60g to 80g or 90g.
+jason thomas sounds good, I’ll add to my list 👍
Would also add a third factor. Club head weight. So adding 20 g to the weight ports. Not front to back since that would change spin. But simply adding more\less weight. What would be the effects on ball flight etc?
Michael I'm very skeptical of the influence of shafts on ball flight. I've seen too many tests and listened to the best fitters in the world say it doesn't make a big difference in ball flight. Feel, sure. Weight has a huge impact on the feel of a club. I would have liked to see the trackman data on this one.
Launch angle, peak height and land angle all very similar yet you said you saw the shot ballooning. Was it the spin? I see the distance was 8 yards longer with the heavier shaft. I would have expected much higher peak height and land angle with the lighter shaft.
The monitor results were normalized. He mentioned it was quite windy in person. The extra spin was probably causing the ball to be a bit floaty in the wind.
Heavier shaft and stronger flex gives better dispersion and control. In one line ! But not for everyone!
100% if someone wants better dispersion it's always better to be stiffer shaft than to weak a shaft. If too weak club can stay open longer on faster swing or can already start passing hands on slower swings and cause left hits.
Mike, great video, thanks.
This is quite a revelation! The loss of distance is 4% for lower weight of 10%!! Right now I am using NS pro 850gh shafts, light weight due to advanced age.
Thanks for setting premise with your impeccable analysis, Good basis to shift to light weight shafts. Thanks
Fantastic shaft.
Great video Michael. Can you do a video or explain how club length effects clubs "swingweight" etc. I play half inch longer with midsize grips (as fitted at a fitting) but read so much conflicting info after my fitting on how the club dynamics/flex can change by adding just 0.50 of an inch.😣 As your a taller player yourself.. can you explain what's going on. Do heavier grips counter act the added length etc?? Thanks.
I also am really interested in knowing more about this.
Great test good information . This is what a golf channel should be about . How about on course testing .
+Michael Roberts it’s having the time Michael between my day to day coaching & fitting
Thanks for the video Mike, it was very interesting and enlightening . I swing a 95 gm UST Recoil shaft in irons and I have around 105-107mph driver club speed. Tempo is such an important part of my swing and if it's not right on it can be a long day. I'm just afraid of losing distance if I chose a heavier shaft, but maybe I won't. Next time I get fitted I definitely have to use a launch monitor.
+Joe Pesce yes Joe
Same shaft manufacturer would of made the test more reliable. In my opinion...for what it is worth.
Have you dont any videos on the 950gh or the 990 nspro range Mike.
The 950 is miles more stable and they actually compare it to a 125 shaft in any other brand for consistency. Any thoughts?
Thanks.
Had a hit with this recently. Fantastic, an absolute sublime feel and execution, compared to the DG S300 I currently play. Have never played anything else, but the DG S300. Time for a change, perhaps?
Excellent vid again. I have found that light shafts are less accurate, so i just purchased a set of mizunos with dg s300 ATM tour white shafts in. No loss of distance but accuracy has really improved compared to my original Project x 5.5 rifle shafts.. Hoping to get back down to 4 Handicap again. Currently sitting on 7..I wonder if this would work with my driver? ie, fitting a 70g shaft instead of a 60g. I will give it a go..Thanks again for this one Mike. 👍
really good video
Interesting how you actually drew the ball with a heavier and more stiff tipped profile. Just shows you how "feel" of a club can over rule any type of golf wisdom or anecdotal evidence you might hear.
Very good video, really instructive for every level golfer. I knew I could not play light shaft but more for feeling and control reasons, but I never get how big was the gap between ball speed and carry distance. It would be interesting to include more shaft testing in your golf club reviews. The shaft industry is a jungle with so many options (brands - models), and it is hard to get a grasp even during a fitting session!! :)
+MsBibid that is very true
Enjoyed the comparison and confirmed my experiments last year. Would have been more valuable comparing light and heavy shfts of the same stiffness/kick rating and make?
Good video 👍
Your swing is extremely smooth, looks like a slow swing but its not!
Very interesting and surprising. However, is it beyond question that, say, a 70 year old golfer with a 7 iron clubbed speed of 72mph would benefit from a high (even graphite) shaft? Thanks.
Really enjoyed the video. Subscribing now. I ordered the P790’s today with kbs tour flt which I believe is in the middle of these two and was curious to how they will play. I have the same swing speed as you do I expect good results.
great set of irons! thanks for subbing
Poor bastard. I bought the same clubs, Hated them
o.o wow, unexpected heavier weight get more distance ...
till now still not be use to steel , from graphite ...
1 inch longer makes a difference
Hi ya Michael, brilliant vlog as always , I don't know now I missed this one from way back lol , I want to change my irons I'm playing mizuno mp 54s dg s300 , I'm 57 play off 1 but only swing a 7 iron 80 mph , when I go for fittings they say I should be a regular flex and put me in kbs 90 or nippon pro 850 , but my dispersion is all over the place , then I hit my mp 54 s with the s300 and its fine again , they can't give me an answer , please could you give me some advice , because I don't feel confident in there process , any help would be really great ty ... jules 🏌️♂️⛳️👍
Would you expect a higher handicap player to have the same results? I think not. The only thing this test proves is that the DG is a much better shaft for you, but that doesn't mean it's the same for the rest of us.
That’s what he basically said
Why wouldn’t you use a Dynamic Gold SL? That would be more of an apples to apples comparison.
+Kevin Gallemroe true, just wanted to go from one extreme to the other in regards to weight
what was head weight? all heads different weight?
your pull spin numbers on the heavy shaft were more erratic than the lighter shaft
can a lighter shaft say c taper light cause toe hits? After a custom fit I can no longer hit my 4,5 without a big fade.
The iron weight is a Aztec pyramid with an oval spot at the bottom left of it.
Regards
wion news Pakistan and Russia
Please can you tell me if the shaft for irons should be the same for your driver? As in if I use stiff for irons would it be same for driver ?
I changed my drive to a 59g regular flex and my hybrids to 59g. These are considered light weight. I make solid contact and control the dad or draw easily just by changing hand position. My irons have 72 gram HCP from Callaway and with the longer irons I tend to fade. Any suggestions in weight for iron shafts?
Hi Michael, great video! Is the true temper amt black compatible with the 718 ap2? Thanks
Yes, it’s a stock option the the 718 range.
Not exactly a blind test was it Michael?
People need to understand you have a vested interest in not recommending off the shelf equipment.
Please explain to me what differences we’d see in distance/flight if we used different shafts on Iron Byron.
The average golfer would be amazed at how little difference the shaft actually makes.
Good info Michael, but what comes first? I ask as I went to test an iron today and found that I gained 10 yds carry but added an extra 5 yds when testing a lighter shaft. The club felt, sounded and looked great but the low flight and low spin were worrying. So as I’m going to change my irons soon, do I select the head I want and then get fitted for the shaft or do I get an idea of the ‘right’ shaft then test that in a number of heads?
elect the head you like and design that suits your strike ability, then work shaft around to dial in launch and spin and feel you prefer.
I use I use precision rifle FCM 6.5. I’ve had the same shafts for 10/12 years. When I got the clubs I was younger lad, now. turning 60 I find I’m hitting the ball to the right all the time. I’m thinking I’m not as strong now so I’m not getting thro the ball as I did when I was 50 ?. Without being tested (living in oz ).whats a good shaft ?
Try a modus
It was about smash factor - ball speed is just club head speed x smash factor - three shots with each is not a bigger enough sample size make any decisions
Not sure why these youtubers don’t hit a lot more with each option ( can be offline so as not to become boring) three shots with each is use offering no conclusion whatsoever
Hi Michael another great video, do you think the Nippon would be a good choice for 70mph club speed (7 iron), would like to say asking for a friend but afraid it's for me!? Regards.
John Bishop yes worth a try. Nippon offer a number of different weights in the lighter category
Surely kickpoint also has to be considered here?
Alberto Fernandez-Sanguino does that not reflect in the numbers
Therefore there is a second factor which has to be borne in mind. Would make more sense to compare shafts with same or very similar kickpoint or bend profiles. That way only weight is the variable. Also you need a greater Datta set say 10 shots each to get to some meaningful conclusions.
Hi mike, i have the ns pro Reg shafts in my srixon 765 irons . With swing speed of about 74 mph club head speed about 100 mph. I hit spin Numbers of about 5700 with 7 iron dynamic loft around 20degs carrying about 140 yrds . Would you recommend somthi g that would lower my spin or does this sound about right?
Hi. Your dynamic loft is pretty low for a 7 iron which is why your spin is slightly on the low side. If you were to increase your spin you'll probably loose some yardages depending on other aspects of your club delivery & speed etc. You don't want to lower the spin anymore.
Michael Newton Golf many thanks 🖒
shows perfectly that your getting more bang for the buck with the heavier shaft. Slower swing, better energy transfer, less shaft deflection, more distance, and more accuracy.
Only if that shaft suits your swing. I don't think it would suit mine. I have a driver SS of 95 and a very smooth delivery and transition. Heavy shafts don't work for me. I'm more accurate and get a better ball flight and feel for the club with the lighter shaft.
Use a lav mic and a decent camera. Great info just hard to listen to and watch.
This is an old video, upgraded a couple of years back 👍
Club head speed goes up . . . but ball speed falls behind? The laws of physics suggest that this outcome is not likely. ? ? ?
Smash factor.
You mentioned weight under handle 12 times. OK, we get it! lol
Good info though!
😆
Why people dislike information. Anyways go to Instagram therealLionWoods
Imagine if Arnold heard all this bullshit.....he would say shut up and hand me an iron..damn geek
It has nothing to do with your swing "comfort"! It is simple physics - the momentum of the heavier shaft is bigger and it allows for BIGGER energy transfer therefore the distance is different!It was proven times and times again that for an average golfer a small difference - up to 20grams, doesn't make any significant difference and heavier shafts are usually better!!!!!!