Are the New DAREDEVIL & KINGPIN Actually Variants? | Netflix Multiverse & New Marvel Canon EXPLAINED
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- Опубликовано: 15 май 2024
- Spider-Man: No Way Home and Hawkeye re-introduced two of our favorite characters from the Marvel Netflix Defenders-verse: Wilson Fisk and Matt Murdock. Even though Charlie Cox and Vincent D'onforio returned in these roles--are they the same characters from the Marvel Netflix series. Or, following the rules of Loki, are they variants?
We think the answer is a little bit of both--which is exciting news for the Marvel Cinematic Universe.
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Written by Colton Ogburn ( / @coltonhere )
Hosted by Ryan Arey ( / ryanarey )
Edited by Randolf Nombrado and Sean Martin
#Daredevil #Kingpin #NoWayHome 
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Do you think they're varaints?
It doesn’t matter. With a now infinite number of universes, there are an infinite number of Daredevils and Kingpins all of which have had the same life and experiences as the Netflix ones. So with infinite worlds, everything is canon.
Doesn’t matter to me really , I mean with a lot of infinite numbers of universes, also remains a number of Daredevils and Kingpin
I don't believe they are variants. I just believe Marvel decided to up the strength of Kingpin.
I just feel the idea of "it's not exactly right, therefor variant!" is a silly thing. It's not different *enough* to be a variant.
I think this is a kingpin variant where he bought the supersoldier serum from sharon and thats why he is as strong as he is in Hawkeye
The answer is maybe there’s a possibility that they are but not really yes 😂
With the deleted scenes, their attention to put Fisk in a black suit in everything set before 2015 and a white suit in everything set after 2018 is a good indication they're connected.
Deleted scenes?
but that's the thing though it's a deleted scene. it wasn't part of the show.
@@FaZaFurhod but it was supposed to be
@@bbwibb02 There was a deleted scene released for Hawkeye where Kingpin met with Eleanor right after her husband's death
@@garlicsalt317 it was supposed to be, but it wasn't. It was cut.
I don't care if they are variant or not , I just want a Daredevil's Season 4
please Marvel , do it ...
Its going be trash disney cant be as gritty. those shows were grounded & brutal. kid shit
If not a Daredevil movie, it'll be Daredevil season 1
@@rasheedfraser5680 they wouldn’t continue it on Disney plus they’d continue it on Netflix
Disney. They won't let Marvel be dark.
Would it be a season 4 or would it be a season 1? As for the other responses on this comment, we need to understand that these companies are growing and changing guys. Disney let a sex scene be in Eternals, they're going to let Deadpool be Rated-R, these shows can get as dark and gritty as the Netflix shows. It might just take stepping stones to get there.
I think Moon Knight will be a good indicator of if the MCU can execute dark storylines. If so than I will have a great amount of confidence that they could execute Daredevil and Kingpin
Sounds like Disney and Sony finally realised their adult audiance makes up 70 percent of the MCU fandom then 25 percent of 13-18. Their demographic wants those dark storys and we are finally bring listened too.
It seems we are definitely going to see brutality in moon knight so I am hopeful for a somewhat similar tone if we are able to get more seasons of daredevil.
@@Bandanab310 If we do get more seasons of Daredevil, it’ll probably be on Hulu and not on Netflix
@@IcyDiamond Disney plus adult just saying wouldnt br hard to password code it for parental use.
@@laithamekir5778 I feel Disney will just put most of their most adult stuff on Hulu imo
Charlie cox played daredevil so well i have a hard time believing he isn't blind in real life.
Lol 😂
he wore contacts that made him basically blind during a lot of his scenes
Apparently he does too... He did an interview once where he talked about Losing a Role (or two) because he'd gotten into certain habits playing Blind , and he fell into those habits while auditioning and didn't properly 'connect' with his scene partner
@@TJ52359 I didn't know that thank you for sharing!
@@TJ52359 He’s so good at playing blind he’s starting to become blind
Vincent D'onofrio said that it's the same Kingpin. So, it is until it's not.
He said he's going to play him just like he did play him in netflix, l mean no matter the timeline, kingpin will always act the same
@@bashengatheblackmanta7003 wrong, he said it was the same Kingpin
@@bashengatheblackmanta7003 No Kingpin has evolved a lot through the Netflix shows, so in Hawkeye he was playing According to that
did you not watch the part of the video where he himself literally says that they connected some dots but that others were impossible to connect? But hey if you want to believe whatever you want, go ahead bud.
@@kingleepz those dots that are not impossible to connect, was mainly about Kingpin's strength, it never seemed like a big deal to me, when I watched the show, he was a pretty strong dude in Daredevil, strong enough to smash someone's head and choke someone's neck. He got nerfed a lot. Even if, Marvel never explain this i dont really mind that scene exists.
I sincerely hope the netflix shows are canon. A lot of people put in a lot of hard work on those shows, and they were, mostly, very good. Even Iron Fist improved in the second season.
they are canon, Wilson Donofrio confirmed it already. ScreenCrush is just pick and choosing interviews and playing with semantics to make it look like he hasnt
@@abnerjvd do you have a source?
@@joaoportiz The show literally references the first Avengers movie.
@@TheOneToKeepYouWaiting but no avengers tower, no avengers appear as if they all went away and never came back
Yes, but they work better as their own thing, so hopefully these shows aren't canon to the MCU. And there are plenty of reasons why these shows shouldn't be canon to the MCU. These shows don't need to be apart of the MCU to be good, they are good, regardless of whether or not, they are apart of the MCU and hopefully, Kevin Feige will make the right choice and not make these shows apart of the MCU.
Vincent D’onofrio already addressed in an interview he’s not playing a variant. The Netflix shows exist within the MCU.
They’re the exact same characters. Maybe a couple tweaks now that MCU has more control than Marvel TV and can build more around them, but they’re 100% same IMO.
The director of each said they're stories are slightly different but they end up in the same place that the Netflix series ended on. So you can believe what you want, buuuut its probably not correct, technically.
@@twodumbgamers9285 I hope they change iron iron fist
@@chidaluokoro9104 I'd agree haha I but more comic
@@twodumbgamers9285 no director ever said that
@@abnerjvd they did. It was months ago when the echo show was first talked about.
Any differences seem way too minor for these characters to be considered variants. Sometimes characters just have subtle changes from one film/series to the next. Plus I don't see any reason why the Netflix shows would need to be removed from the canon. Nothing that happened in those shows was supposed to impact the greater MCU.
Yep, characters change over several seasons of a show, too. That shows growth.
Marheshala ali, thats the problem. He cant be a differet character in luke cage thats dead, and blade at the same time. Unless he is a variant blade.
@@spike-kc8be but there's a whole lot of people that have played two different characters in the mcu
@@marielalara1202 like who? Genuine question. I know Chris Evans was Captain America and the Human Torch, but none of the fantastic four movies are even remotely cannon.
@@platypusab The woman who played Shang-Chi’s aunt was also a ravager in Guardians of the Galaxy
All I want is Charlie Cox as Daredevil. Idc how I get it. It’s my favorite Marvel production out of all the shows and movies. The fight choreography, writing, and tone are *chefs kiss*
vincent d’onfrio said his kingpin is the exact same, even going so far as to state that kingpin lost a lot of power when he was blipped
Which would explain how Tombstone could become The Big Man in that power vacuum.
I think the fact that the two actors have conflicting opinions about it is evidence enough that they weren't explicitly told if they were playing variants or continuing the characters. Cox seems to be under the impression that he's playing a variant, while D'onfrio seems to at least want to believe they are the same character. And to be fair, the writers from No Way Home and Hawkeye are different people, so they may have written them with opposing mindsets on the canon. Ultimately, the best rule is to assume that nothing is canon unless explicitly stated by Feige or in an unquestionably canon scene in the shows or movies. So for now, I won't assume any of the Netflix shows are canon, but will allow the stories to inform my knowledge and opinion of the current incarnations of the characters until something directly conflicts.
Kingpin wasn't blipped because he manipulated hawkeye into killing maya's dad during the blip
@Paraone Ngatai it was never stated in the show that jack killed maya's dad. Jack was an oblivious nice guy who was framed by kate's mom
@Paraone Ngatai in episode 5, hawkeye straight up admits to maya that he killed her dad because kingpin manipulated him into doing it
I’d like to think they’re 97% exactly the same, with the 3% being probably Matt Murdock’s powers are crazier than in the Netflix show and he’s an actually highly competent lawyer and Kingpin having near superhuman strength and a more unhinged personality, even more so than what’s established.
That’s most likely done so someone like Kingpin can fight Spider-Man without getting completely whooped by him
How do you even explain such strength without super soldier serum. ? xD
Plz don't say "Bro, it's a movie, just let them write whatever they want to"
@@jees9179 Maybe Kingpin got a bit of the super soldier serum during the events of The Falcon and the Winter Soldier? I am not at all convinced that they are variants. Casting Charlie Cox and Vincent D'Onofrio is acknowledging the Netflix shows. Sure, J.K. Simmons reprised his role as J. Jonah Jameson in a new continuity but that's because Marvel loves him and kept casting him as the voice of Jameson in animated shows. The fact that Matt Murdock just showed up in No Way Home without any proper introduction and caught a brick as if he's been doing it for years shows that they are not rebooting Daredevil, and so the Netflix show is completely canon.
I just see it as "they netflix shows are canon until specifically made not canon" in much the way that a lot of the Star Wars legends stuff is treated. Any discrepancies in how the characters act, behave, move, or perform can be attributed to events that happened offscreen in the intervening period of time.
Fisk wears brighter colors? He's just found a new appreciation of life after being blipped or having someone he cares about blipped.
Maybe he reevaluated his choices after DD kicked the shit out of him.
Maybe he's stronger because he hit the gym. Maybe he got his hands on some of that blue juice through Val.
Until something comes up that can't be explained through even the most contrived head canon, the Netflix shows will still be canon to me.
They’re always going to be main canon to the MCU
"He hit the gym" that doesn't necessarily explain.
> Ripping off car doors
> Get smashed through walls by cars
> Surviving grenades to the bollocks just like some kid in nyc bit by a radioactive spider.
@@jees9179 it does explain it.
It’s Kingpin you know.
He literally throws a person across a building in the Netflix show, so of course he’s like that strong.
@@jees9179 guy literally punched a concrete wall in the Netflix series.
@@ultrabrian8151 Dude take up wrestling, even you would be able to throw people around,(like rag dolls if you have a big stature)
But for tearing freaking car doors as if they were made of paper?
You gotta sell you soul to the devil or something
[ pun intended]
I mean Vincent Donofrio did say that his Kingpin is the same one in Netflix , but like of course he lost his power once he got snapped off screen in infinity war
He didn't get snapped. He was the reason why hawkeye killed maya's dad during the blip
I think if they decide to bring back Mike Colter as Luke Cage, it’d be interesting if they introduce him as the mob boss of Harlem (like they implied in the season 2 finale) and Daredevil has to go up against him before Luke finally realizes what he’s become. I hope they bring back Krysten Ritter as Jessica, as well!
We got Kingpin and Daredevil back, so I hope Jessica can come back too. I could take or leave everyone else
@@jtf5223 Luke Cage was great
@Paraone Ngatai I dont see daredevil beating Luke Cage
Yah, but these shows were unfortunately cancelled and I don't believe Marvel Studios will revive them. Plus, fortunately, Mike Colter has been recast as Luke Cage in the MCU. Hopefully Krysten Ritter gets recast as Jessica Jones too. I don't have anything against these actors, but it's a good thing that a few of these characters have been recast in the MCU and hopefully a majority of these characters are going to be recast in the MCU.
I think they could/should be canon, the shows already reference the MCU itself and everything could be explained, Kingpin could’ve gotten stronger via the leaked super solider serum and Matt could’ve been blipped. I think Agent Carter should be canon as well and the AoS crossover stuff could be ignored, Marvel could pick and choose what’s canon and what’s not, Jarvis’ actor is the same in Endgame and it’s never said if they retconned him or not (to my knowledge)
I’m thinking every non Disney+ MCU show is canon except Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. and Inhumans
As far as Jarvis goes, it's best to assume that Agent Carter is also vaguely MCU canon, that most of the events occurred without being sure that all of them occurred. The main reason I say this is just that we got the same Jarvis but we did not get the accompanying actor for Howard Stark, and the two actors played the role very differently.
They are canon. Hawkeye show runner confirmed it on Twitter and no one else from Marvel has disagreed.
@@underscore_5450 I tried searching every way I can think of, and I could not confirm this. The Hawkeye Twitter doesn't touch the subject, no websites have written about this supposed confirmation, several sites are still writing about it being questionable, and to the best of my ability I couldn't find a Twitter for Jonathan Igla, the showrunner.
@@IcyDiamond actually AOS and inhuman are canon well except for season 6-7 but that could easily be explained due to What If. Inhumans are canon because that was one of the projects Kevin Fiege passed over like Agent Carter.
They have always been part of the MCU though. In the first season of Daredevil they bring up the attack on New York, and they bring up MCU super hero’s throughout the show.
Makes a lot of sense to explain any future appearances in any future MCU shows/movies from any of the Marvel non MCU shows or movies. Loki and spiderman opened up to infinite variants of basically any character. I hope to see more Kingpin in Echo and hopefully see more Daredevil
A little off-topic: Do you think that Matt remembers helping Spider-Man, since he only encountered him as Peter?
No any connection, to peter via Spider-Man has been forgotten.
Happy remembers Spider-Man not peter.
Matt remembers he once helped Spider-Man clear his name but doesn't remember who spiderman is
He may not remember, but daredevil would know he’s not lying if he told him
@@jayskiv4125 Good point.
The Netflix shows were so good, I cant wait to see Punisher and Luke Cage in the wider mcu!
I'm glad they brought these two into the MCU, but I think they should go further with the other Netflix Marvel shows... Definitely bring back Jon Bernthal as Punisher. While we're at it, bring back Mike Colter and Krysten Ritter in their respective roles as Luke Cage and Jessica Jones, since their future daughter (Danelle Cage) plays key roles in several comics, they can do the same in the later half or phase 4 or into phase 5. Since they have set grounded heroes within NYC not directly affiliated with Shield or the Avengers (yet), an expansion of local heroes within a city that big would be cool to see via individually and in the occasional teams. The Tom Holland Spiderman is pretty much on his own, so seeing him bump into a fellow New Yorker hero would be pretty sweet.
Iron Fist?
@@chechibatta5673 we pretend that didn't happen
Thanks for bringing up the Hallway fight, that was one of my favorite scenes in Daredevil show 🔥🔥
I do not think that they are variants, I think that it is the same character from Daredevil, a deleted scene showed Fisk in his suit that he was wearing in Daredevil and he was also wearing his father's cufflinks, the Marvel Netflix shows referenced the other MCU which shows that they exist together
They arnt that doesn’t mean it’s in the main MCU universe they arnt referencing the MCU exactly it’s just that the avengers existed in the Netflix shows also. Like the video says it’s likely a branched universe that is only 15-20% different or less. Some universes are exactly the same and practically copies but are still separate, others are more different.
@@slimmdusty8809 Dude, VinyD himself said it's the same.
Just stop. XD
@@jees9179 Yeah cause an actor vaguely saying that means it’s totally true and that’s what marvel plans to do entirely, you don’t know if he meant daredevil takes place on earth 616. He also said there are differences in the character in another interview, the man who literally plays daredevil even said he could only come back if the character was re imagined and that it would be different and Vincent said that some dots just can’t be connected to the Netflix shows. Idk why it’s so hard for daredevil fans to realize marvel isn’t gonna continue the Netflix stuff if they did it’s gonna be different. There is 0 real confirmation that it’s on earth 616 accept it.
@@slimmdusty8809 The Netflix shows and the other shows by Marvel Television were created to connect to the MCU. And of course it's not on Earth-616, that's the original comics. The MCU is Earth-199999. Mysterio only said the MCU is 616 because he was lying about the whole multiverse.
@@slimmdusty8809 "0 confirmations"
> Same cuffs
> Same suits
> Same way of playing the character
> The very fact that the actor himself said he is playing the same character.
"Charlies said he can't come back if the character is not reimagined"
Andrew said he would never come back to play Spiderman. Guess what Happened?
" Why can't you accept they are different"
Why can't you accept they are the same?
The shows were always in MCU, there is no 'connecting' what's already a part.
They couldn't show up before due to rights conflicts as one was Marvel entertainment one was marvel studios and now they are owned by marvel studios so it's open season now.
Moreover if they were to play a different character, then they could have literally got any actor to play the roles, new ones would have obliged for probably half the money, they are getting.
"Everything has to connect"
Nobody is saying everything has to connect and they have to refer back to every single instant of those shows. Just chill.
VinyD said, these are the post blip versions of the same characters i.e them after a time jump.
And about having changes, isn't it obvious? Fisk is a super human now.
This will surely be explained in future fisk appearances with the super soldier serum we saw in FnWS.
I like to think it's going to be cannon due to having a large fan base. So the simplest thing I been thinking about it how this can play out is the mat and the prosecutors and judges that were handing the case got blipped making easy for the king pin to get the charges dropped by buying them or put his people in places to get him out and started to rebuild his empire. For him having super strength is that he started to work out and got stronger (remember pure muscle). I don't think he hasn't fought someone that beat him in a long time and motivated him to be strong
the time gap of blip can explain many things like how kingpin got more strong easy power broker and foe daredevil they dont have change anything just beilive that he was bliped away simple as that no problem for marvel there
I don’t care that there are some differences. I’m stoked that the actors are back!
🤞🏼 they bring back Jon Bernthal and Wilson Bethel. Their performances were outstanding.
I'm just hoping they're able to soft reboot Iron Fist so that Finn Jones can get his Andrew Garfield moment. Finn was screwed by the production, script and lack of time when filming Iron Fist and he was actually a fairly good Danny Rand regardless
Maybe Iron Fist will be in Shang-Chi 2
I'm happy to see I'm not alone in that opinion. Jones was a fine actor for the role, as were most of the cast, the writers were just tone deaf and lacking in awareness of what they were doing. I'd love to see the MCU tie-up the loose ends left by Iron Fist (and Luke Cage) season 2. I'd be happier to see the same crew, but won't hold Marvel to any expectations.
The Battle of Harlem is also seen in Ben Urich's office. That's a Hulk reference.
The show runner for Hawkeye confirmed that ALL the Marvel Netflix shows are canon to the MCU. And no one else from Marvel has disagreed.
They havent disagree yet
So Blade is Cottonmouth? Black Mariah is both a villain in Luke Cage but also a grieving mother Civil War? Interesting stuff.
@@andrewshandle that’s why they are ACTORS, have you forgotten that Gemma Chan played 2 different roles in the same universe?
@@mannyrodriguez3933 Gemma Chan played a very small background role wearing makeup in one film before moving to her big role. This is _very_ different from Mahershala Ali playing Cottonmouth on Netflix and Blade in the MCU or even Alfre Woodard playing a major character in Netflix them appearing in the MCU in a different role.
Come on man, try harder.
@@andrewshandle Its just actors
Like how Samuel L Jackson is Fury, despite the StarWars movies existing in the MCU
I hadn't thought of that. I was thinking canon or not. It makes sense that it would be "mostly" canon. Bring over the shows and their histories but give yourself some wiggle room.
Dude it has already been well established they are the same!!
Variety had this very interview eith VinyD himself after ep6 of Hawkeye. He said, YES IT'S THE SAME CHARACTER BUT A POST BLIP VERSION, WHO CAME A LONG WAY FROM WHERE WE LEFT HIM OFF THE PREVIOUS TIME, HE MIGHT HAVE LOST MOST OF HIS POWER BUT HE CLEARLY GAINED SOMETHING ELSE. The directors confirmed too, that's it's the same character coming back, just like Tobey and Andrew.
The super soldier serum theory is what they are gonna go with, I can put my money on that. And I believe this very thing will be a plot for the upcoming Echo Series.
I think the fact that Maya's shot is heard right when Fisk says "Eye to eye" is a hint that it's going to be a blinding shot like in the comics, not a kill shot.
I just want a Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles / Daredevil cross over. Considering the stuff that blinded Matt Murdock is the same stuff that spilled into the sewer on a couple of turtles and a rat.
If Viacom plays ball then I guess they could be in the MCU
That is really well descriptive and understandable
I want someone to bring back Agent Phil Coulson! If they pluck anyone else out of the MCU series it should be him, and Captain Marvel doesn’t count cause he did like a cameo. And or Agent Melissa “The Calvary” May, I enjoyed both of them.
Coulson died in Season 5. It's an LMD taking his place.
I just want a season 4 or possibly a daredevil movie! I’d also love to see him and spiderman team up at some point
I really want the next Spider-Man movie to go in the completely opposite direction and be a street level Daredevil, Punisher, Kingpin, Maggia extravaganza.
I need this Daredevil variant to still have done the hallway fight. You can’t erase that!!
Easiest assumption, anything that doesn't conflict with the canon is canon. At this time, that means it can all be treated as canon until stated otherwise. I doubt they'll be so specific, even if they decanonize all of it, as to specifically say anything that would make the hallway fight non-canon. They'd either have to completely retcon that this version of Murdock never actually became Daredevil, or at least retcon the black suit as non-canon.
he can be a variant that still did that hallway fight
At first I was happy to see Daredevil and KingPin in the MCU. Then it hit me that the MCU's snarky, flippant tone may make these character far less entertaining than when they were on Netflix.
I would love to be wrong about this, but look at how disrespected Kingpin was at the end of Hawkeye
ya i was really mad at the hawkeye show. in daredevil kingping was menacing and scary . in this he was a joke . he got beaten by some teenage girl and was shot so easily by echo
@@mahadbahad9895 hawkeye had a hard time fighting wilson and he wasn't trying to kill her and we didn't see the wilson after the shot
They need to have a few earths, 616, and 2 others we care about. We need earth 616 which is the movie earth and family-friendly and say 919 which is the darker edgier marvel earth (Netflix-like). It would also allow them to have stories now impossible on 616 due to continuity. The fact Disney owns marvel has been a good thing, but they need to get out of the family-friendly universe a bit and do some really dark stuff on 919. Have Daredevil but one street level and one super hero like.
My fears exactly. Netflix Kingpin wearing these clothes? Jeez.
@@Friskyjournal Next he'll be wearing a Mickey Mouse T-shirt.
Perfect take!
I would love to see some interactions between spiderman and daredevil
I think they are same as in Netflix. It's easy to canon Netflix shows. They are separate from likes of AOS, Runaways and other Marvel TV series. Also Netflix shows don't have plot holes if they were to canon to the MCU. (Not like AOS time travel vs Avengers time travel).
plus agents of shield has inhumans going past season 4 which arent in the mcu so thats another reason
idk how they are doing khamala tho
@@Rumym8 Exactly my own thoughts on the matter. Gawd, I wished they’d dumped Perlmutter and Loeb earlier.
Technically cloak and dagger and runaways are canon to the netflix shows, which would make them canon to the mcu
@@captainspike1913 Ya. As I remember Cloak & Dagger mention about Luke Cage. I think Cloak & Dagger is ok. But Runaways mess with time travel and allien stuff that are different to the Avengers. 🤔
@@SriCricketer well it was similar to Endgames time travel but that can easily introduce different forms of time travel into the MCU. Sorta of like how the timestone reverse time and still being within the same timeline .
I'm just watching Daredevil (Netflix) for the very first time, and this definitely gives me food for thought. Great channel. Thank you.
HAHAHAHHAHAHAH using the best clip of Lahey falling down the stairs... Gold...
They’re confirmed the same character from the Netflix TV show. So no they’re not variants, people need to stop making that assumption.
Cloak and Dagger is one I want to come over into the spidey films
There's a scene in Luke Cage where a character refers to Icharus, the man who flew too close to the sun, but we know this hadn't happened yet in the MCU.
lol Icarus is a Greek myhtology character too
Ryan, well done! I think that the consensus is that this will be the status quo from here forward.
All I know, things are in danger of getting really fucking messy if the MCU don't keep their shit in check. But I would love to see the Netlix characters having relevance in the MCU. I was as excited to see Matt Murdock pop up in No Way Home as the Sony Spidermen. I was kind of hoping the Netflix Marvel characters would have a small role in the Battle of New York in Infinity War. Kind of like how we sore the Sorcerer Supreme battling Loki's army in End Game. It was not to be. But maybe now? Yep.
Agents of SHIELD is still part of the Marvel Universe since the events of the movies take place within the show as well.
That was the original intention. Now that Feige is in charge of everything, AoS will be ignored. Call them variants or whatever.
@@davechan8613 well don't count them out too soon, you might see a familiar face show up in the future.
whoa i didn't see that clip of d'onofrio talking. nice.
*I really hope they bring all the characters playing in those shows, they were so great cast, maybe resurrect some characters that are connected to other characters so they can interact with the MCU heroes*
I think the Netflix shows are basically canon and in the same timeline until anything indicates that they aren’t. I don’t think there have been any hard inconsistencies yet. Yes Kingpin is stronger but he could’ve become a lot stronger between Daredevil and Hawkeye. His strength can change over time.
I would like to see DareDevil on Hulu so we can get the grittiness we got before. I want Jessica Jones, Luke Cage, and the Punisher back also. They need to reboot The Iron Fist though
If they can make Deadpool 3(which infact they are), why can't they make a Daredevil show like it's meant to be
Without handing it off to others
Kingpin getting ahold of super serum would work well with the Cap/Falcon series.
Should the Netflix shows become Canon?
So torn on this. Because I don't want The Hand to be canon in the MCU at all.
Yes, definetly at least daredevil and the punisher
Everything on Daredevil BUT THE HAND should be canon
They were never not canon.
already are
I really want there to be an actual Season 4 of Daredevil made with the same actors, back stories, and tone as the Netflix Daredevil. But even if Murdock and Fisk are variants, and as a result the Netflix show isn’t MCU canon, it won’t affect how much I love that three seasons that exist. One of my favorite shows and top 3 Marvel movie/show.
The Netflix Daredevil TV Show isn't a movie and I don't believe Marvel will revive the show.
i see, that’s more make sense and interesting going forward tbh
We also need info about how the Snap and the Blip affected Kingpin, Murdoch and the rest. Those events and the follow ups throw in enough of opportunities to change a lot from we saw in the Netflix-series.
Hold your horses.
Kingpin is in the upcoming Echo series (which will probably explain how he is so OP and what happened post Daredevil S3)
Murdoch is in she hulk
@@jees9179 Horses held. Cool. I knew about Murdoch being in She-Hulk but unsure about where on the timeline there he shows up. The Echo series had gone under my radar, thx for that. 🙂
More Daredevil please, I would be super hyped for that
I'd love to see Matt Murdock and Wilson Fisk as prisoners in the TVA... need to work together to escape...
You may be on to something 😮😮
I love this channel
If I were to guess, I'd say that the variation comes in just before season 3 of Daredevil. Instead of using the legal route to rebuild his power-base and escape from prison, Kingpin gets hold of some serum from the Powerbroker and takes a more hands-on, street level approach. Possibly the Blip itself is the reason he escapes- he blips out somewhere that's deserted or unguarded when he blips back in five years later- perhaps he was in a prisoner transport at the time, for example. Because he stays out of the public eye, Daredevil isn't aware he's back yet in NWH. (Disclaimer, I haven't seen NWH yet)
I like the explanation of how could he scape, the problem is that we from the Hawkeye show that he didn't got snap because he sent Ronin to kill Maya's dad, and Clint only was Ronin during the blip.
Also it doesn't explain why Clint can't call the Police at the beginning of ep 6 to arrest him, it's like this Kingpin doesn't have a real Criminal record like the DD one that was sent to jail 2 times
Hi ScreenCrush
Totally agree
I actually just read that comic yesterday/Mya shooting Kingpin
I love Vincent D'Onofrio as an actor. Hes taken on so many looks and personalities before.
they're variants just so everyone has a good excuse to forget Iron Fist ever happened
nah the actor who plays kingpin said he’s the same one from the netflix series
Autistic?
@@Jordan123151 huh
@@GT_Mr.C Just my personal opinion. A lot of people like him, but I'm not sure why. He acts autistic rather than a cunning ruler of the crime underworld.
@@Jordan123151 i’m still confused by your opinion lmao
@@GT_Mr.C You said the actor would be the same one from netflix. He, to me, is written and acted like he is on the spectrum in that series.
Honestly the big win would be to have the whole Daredevil show canon and not the Defenders mini-series. Just have Matt being presumed dead from some other incident at the start of season 3.
Didn't even watch the via yet and of course they are. No way can they be the exact same from Netflix, it doesn't work storywise nor do the dynamics fit the MCU because it was more realistic. See how Kingpin was able to tank a hit from a car and walk away, which is pretty comic accurate.
i would love to see all the netflix show charecters come in the MCU as in iron fist season 2 danny got double iron fists and colleen also gets the fist so it would be soo good to see all the netflix show charecters in the MCU
The last Daredevil season took place in 2018 which is the same year that the snap happened. I think that maybe Matt was blipped and Fisk survived. That would explain how Fisk managed to get out of prison and rebuilt his empire without having Daredevil to get on his way.
I think your explanation is the best one, so I don’t think I’ll be watching it in my MCU watchthroughs but just remember that some parts are canon when I get to the parts they do show up.
If Kingpin took the super-soldier serum, would it be from one of the 20 vials that the Flagsmashers stole in Falcon and the Winter Soldier? I tried to count the number of serums that Zemo smashed recently (minus the eight used by the Flagsmashers and the one John Walker took), but it was hard to follow the audio... Could Kingpin and/or the Power Broker have taken serums from that batch?
The way I see it there's no reason to believe they're variants. The shows were intended to be canon and haven't been decanonized. It's honestly just that simple.
And secondly Vincent D'Onofrio literally said that the writers told him that it's the same version of Kingpin. How did you mention Vincent being the one to have Kingpin wear the Hawaiian shirt and yet completely skip the interview where he confirms its the same version? Tired of this debate.
The Netflix shows were confirmed canon by the Hawkeye show runner.
@@underscore_5450 that means since Daredevils canon the defenders is canon connecting them to Cloak and Dagger( since they mention them ) connecting them to the Runaways.
Yeah and James Gunn said they aren't why does he have less say than an actor? James has spoken with Kevin feige many times
Also theyre not in the MCU on disney plus there on countless cointradictions and much more
@@littledude6669 there are so many tie ins that the marvel TV shows established connecting them to the MCU. Also James Gunn literally got fired from Marvel for a few months you really gonna trust him.
Yes more Daredevil and Punisher please
I would love it they were both canon to the MCU. I also believe that feige will adapt them so it makes sense. I hope we as fans get to get our cake and eat it
Variants or not they need to keep it consistent if they want to keep the following fans on board and not interrupt that cash flow.
love the jim layhey clip lmao
I want more of that giddy NetFlix version of Marvel. That was some good TV back then. Especially Rated R or P13 (forgot which one it was) with Daredavil and Punisher.
I don't think they are, but if they are, I don't care! I'm just glad Vincent and Charlie are back! I hope they bring back at least one more - Jon's Punisher.
Doesn't the concept of a multiverse being adopted make EVERYTHING canon?
Yes
Until they're not. **sigh**
Theres something satisfying about ryan saying the punisher before iron fist
You and I shared the same mindset, that's exactly what l think they are variants. One element of netflix l think will remain canon to the mcu will only be daredevil season 1.
I watched hawkeye on a pretty solid home theatre. If you listen carefully, the bass of Vincent’s voice is alot deeper with a sort of robotic deep bass rumble when he threatens people. Couldnt tell when I rewatched those scenes on a laptop. Just FYI!
I just hope they don't water the characters down
Daredevil and Kingpin deserve to be set in a darker/grittier setting
0:25 Actually, it is a simple yes, and has always been a simple yes. There’s really no need to make it more complicated.
6:11 Regardless, it is MCU canon. 6:15 Actually, it was also made by Marvel Television, but is still MCU proper.
I think they’re both definitely variants.
My main leaning point is May Murdock’s hair’s crown split has changed sides. In the TV series his split is on the right side of his head, in No Way Home it’s moved to his left. Kinda like bizzaro superman’s S being back to front kinda vibe.
When in doubt, everyone is a variant. That or a Skrull. Or a Life Model Decoy. Or a Doombot. (Continues for another 30 min) Or a clone. Or from the future/past. Or... You know, I think that pretty much covers it.
I wonder if Kevin Feige can convince Disney to bring back Daredevil and The Punisher in all their violent glory. Maybe create a "mature" category on Disney Plus.
Kingpin (Hawkeye series) is a Skrull
I like to think this is a reboot of the characters into the actual MCU canon making them the PROPER earth-199999 versions of those characters.
They reference the movies.
Geez, finally someone that gets the gist of it.
I hope they are the same characters but kingpin got super soldier serum. I'd have trouble believing he is just super strong now without some sort of serum. I hope mat gets it too so he can't be a little more exaggerated to fight with the midnight sun's and better fit the MCU.
Theory: The nexus event that spawned Agents of Shield was Coulson surviving. In sacred timeline MCU he died.
He did die but was resurrected. His death and resurrection was a major plot point of season 1.
I would love so so so so so much for them to continue with daredevil it was soooo good probably my favorite TV show to date I hope so badly there's more of it
I would love new seasons for Daredevil and Jessica Jones 🤩
Theory: "Bullseye" from the Netflix version of "Daredevil" might somehow get into the MCU reality seen in "Hawkeye" meaning that "Bullseye" may become the MCU version of "The Joker" in which he often talks about the Netflix Universe (NU) as well as the MCU.
Possibly, a Dark Version of "Doctor Strange" brings "Bullseye" into the MCU to do a heist of a magical item ?
In, short get the actor that played "Bullseye" as he's outstanding.
They’re literally the same character in the MCU
I'm of the mentality that the history of the MCU's Daredevil and Kingpin are as identical to their Netflix counterparts, so long as it doesn't include anything involving Iron Fist. And possibly Jessica Jones, Luke Cage, and Punisher (unless Disney brings them back). Either that or everyone on Iron Fist will be the only people to have been blipped and never return.
well it's wrong lol everything is canon
Banner returned everyone from the Blip. The people he didn't resurrect were the ones who died in other ways.