Grand Seiko vs. Omega (A Debate).
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- Опубликовано: 23 авг 2022
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Grand Seiko has been full steam ahead for a while now. They go above in beyond in any way they can and the watch industry has CERTAINLY noticed. However, are their tactics effective enough to start to take some market share from Omega? It may seem totally unlikely and maybe even a dumb topic but HEY! We are a couple of dumb guys having some dumb fun! So what happens when you put up a Speedmaster vs. a Snowflake?
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GS and Omega are my favorite two brands, and own both. I'd take a slightly different tack and say it's apples and oranges, both having their place and complementing each other extraordinarily in a collection. GS makes astounding dress watches and dressy GADAs that are just head and shoulders above anything this side of holy trinity particularly in their level of hand craftsmanship (dials, dial furniture, zaratsu finishing). That's not Omegas thing at all. Omega makes some of the GOAT sport watches, mass produced, go to the moon or the Mariana Trench, or for that matter the Olympics. GS will never catch Omega's legacy in sports in a hundred years, and Omega could never devote the time and energy to even touch GS quality without seriously repositioning themselves, which they have no reason to do. So on my wrist, it's SMP300 for a daily sports watch, GS SGBA201 for just a ridiculously classy dress GADA. Great video and thoroughly enjoyed this discussion!
I've tried hard to love GS and am completely open-minded to them, but like many others here the aesthetics of their watches just don't appeal to me. And I completely respect the quality of their watches - I'm just waiting for them to take that craftsmanship and produce a model that I can't resist! Omega, on the other hand, has many references I'd love to own.
Totally reasonable. No love for the aesthetic of the SLGA007, SLGA009 or SBGP017?
Facts. Omegas has top tier movements, finishing, AND design. GS falls short on design, which is critical when spending thousands of dollars.
Same
I feel the exact same way. I never connected to any of GS's watches.
I completely agree with this. I’ve looked at loads of grand seikos and tried them on. I went to the GS boutique in Knightsbridge, London and spent 2 hours trying on everything. Nothing really made me think ‘yes this is the one’. Omega have many iconic timepieces and their newest sector dial is fabulous, blows the omiwatari out of the water. GS vs Omega? No chance
Seiko va omega? Different proposal
Absolutely love your videos, especially these involving debate of two notable brands - an active discussion about popular icons in Omega and Grand Seiko is great, and I appreciate points on both sides of the table 👍
Someone once said, buy a Rolex to impress others, buy a Grand Seiko to impress yourself...enough said.
Who?
Very well put Daniel, when I loop my grand Seiko wow, never gets old, Jeff.
I rather a Submariner or a Speedmaster. Grand Seiko dosen't do a dam thing for me and they change their styles way to often so nothing will be iconic
I agree with the Rolex impressing others...but Omega? While it's my favorite luxury watch brand and is leaps and bounds ahead of Rolex as a watchmaker (IMO) most people won't spot an omega or give a shit. Everyone knows Rolex and pitches pants tents. I'll stick to my Omega.
@@lonewolfemcquade8133 Snowflake
Grand Seiko’s quality to price ratio is really top notch. And they retain their value extremely well.
Everything else aside: I've been to almost every major watch boutique in London and the level of attention, luxury, and service in the GS boutique in comparison to everything else was remarkable. I own an Omega, but the experience of just BROWSING at the GS boutique makes me want to buy that as my next watch.
I always appreciate the thoughtful insights from the both of you, it’s always a treat to watch.
Only just came across you guys recently, great content delivered in an accurate amusing way. Keep it going. Also your open letter to Breitling was incredible.
I visited my local design district with all the watch shops and I was so ready to go with GS. But when I got to the store and put them on the watches felt kinda flat, also I guess the rep wasn't as enthusiastic and, side note, no financing option. When I got to Omega the reps really walked me through everything made me fall in love with the speedmaster and aqua terra.
Sorry to hear you had that experience. Personally, I've never been to a GS boutique or AD where the sales associates weren't enthusiastic and ready to go into all the nitty gritty on a dime.
Please don't finance watches
Never finance consumption!
@kieran finney then you haven't seen enough models. They haven't had a primarily polished case in the heritage line since the Snowflake. And the Evo9 line is primarily brushed. Bracelets also vastly improved and super comfortable in the Evo9 line.
@kieran finney their marketing is really muddy, true, and their bracelets aren't at Rolex quality (then again, no one's really are), but I definitely wouldn't say the cases have no life to them. Hell, in my collection of 5 or so luxury pieces, they're the only ones where the case finishing and execution REALLY pops every time for me, and that's despite owning two Cartiers with beautiful shapes of their own.
Love your content. Eager to see actual watch reviews every once in awhile!
I love these kind of videos. Keep up the great work!
I would argue both sides of this point… GS was my first watch and I LOVED it, but I eventually sold it for an omega which I still wear. All points are valid 🤷🏻♂️
You guys always make my day with these videos!
Love your videos. Always look forward to them every time I get the notification. I have a GS and am thinking about getting a speedy as I’m not willing to overpay for those damned Daytonas
Always a good day when a new T&H video drops
Hard to choose one over the other.
Omega is like a great steak, perfectly cooked and brought to the table still sizzling, in a dimly lit steak house that was established before your parents, parents were born.
GS is that is also like a great steak, only sliced into perfect pieces and presented on a slab of granite with a single sprig of rosemary, in an open concept restaurant thats mostly windows.
Both steaks taste delicious, but one is more about the art, and the other is more about the tradition. At least in my opinion.
I have been the biggest fan of your channel . Keep killing it with the oxfords and chubbies . You really got me addicted to watches and I recently just purchased a 1998 birthday speedy . Completely in love with it . Thank you for all the videos and love . NH
I love my Grand Seiko. For me looking down at it nearly takes my breath away how beautiful and intricate it is. BUT, I've seen myself in pictures with it, and from any other perspective besides up close it looks like a very generic, plain watch. I cant put my finger on exactly what it is. It could be some subtle elements of Japanese design vs Swiss that just haven't caught on yet. Either way I love it. Especially with Seiko in the name. It is a watch that doesn't shout "look at how much money I have." It under promises and over delivers. Nobody is going to mug you for your Grand Seiko or think you are flexing, but anybody who is paying attention can't help but be impressed.
I agree. I see it like Japanese street wear. If you love it you love it and if you don’t, then you don’t really get it.
I feel like Japanese luxury cars are the same. They need to over deliver to compete with the established European luxury. The Japanese brands are bang for their buck in a way and very well built and they have their fan base and are well respected with enthusiasts. I like GS and I like Omega.
This.
Love this type of content. I am not in the position to purchase either brand, but I still enjoy learning from experts. Please keep it up.
Very interesting debate. I always had my eye on an Omega but when push came to shove I opted for a GS primarily because of the technology and the finishing. It threaded the needle between dress and casual for me. I do like that Globemaster and it may make a perfect addition to my two watch collection and I would have a complete three watch collection.
Love this channel, always so insightful, you guys have inspired me to wear more dress watches everyday
I’ve always wanted a Grand Seiko. On another note, I recently subscribed on Instagram and some of the reels are hilarious. 🤣 I love this channel and all the great content.
I love both brands. GS has better finishing and technologically more advanced, but Omegas heritage and iconic designs push them ahead of GS in my opinion. The Aqua Terra is just so damn gorgeous
Technologically they aren’t more advanced, their only card is a quartz movement. Besides that, Omega is technologically better.
@@diavalus I agree… mostly. The new 9SA5 movement is epic, but if you’re comparing an SBGR317 to a black Aqua Terra, the Aqua Terra is more technically advanced. That said, GS has spring drive, which is even more advanced than the caliber 8900… but at that point, is it apples to apples or are we comparing different things?
@@Sk3tchPad I see your point, and I think you’re correct. Comparing quartz to mechanical is comparing apples to pears. Omega has tungsten bezel, ceramic dials, extreme water ratings, Metas and black polishing, GS has zaratsu polishing, well polished movements and many others.
This said, I think one should own both brands, they are fantastic. I don’t see them as competitors, I wake up in the morning and depending what kind of day I will have, I will choose either Omega or GS.
If Grand Seiko exists for watch lovers, they need to work on releasing more reasonable watch sizes. More 36-38mm releases! Most of their stuff is dressier and 40+ looks silly. I adore the brand otherwise.
Agreed i have some pre big wrists and am overall big dude(186cm 107kg) they look pretty normal on me. But for smaller guys 40+ def looks off. Their chronographs and divers are even too big for big fat guys. They need way more stuff around 40 and under.
They do have smaller sizes. 37mm and 38mm. Plenty of them.
One of the things that I have always admired about Grand Seiko is the no compromise type of attitude that they have. It is the type of mindset that delivers amazing product at the relatively acceptable price. The mindset that the Japanese have towards creating product is one of the many things I admire from them and I am always astounded by the level of details that they do towards their products at Grand Seiko.
Love the channel!
A lot of great points presented guys. What’s your take on the Evolution 9 GMTs? I personally feel those were their 1-2 punch to the sports watch that really blues the line between sports and dress much like Rolex gmt does.
I am an “entry level” enthusiast. I own Bulovas and a Ball Engineer III. I have a grail collection in mind, and if i were to bounce one for an omega/GS, I would never take an Omega. I just find their designs mostly boring, and the only watch of substance is the Speedmaster. Highly Meh brand. GS is at least taking daring approaches with dials
Grail Collection:
Red dial grand seiko whose name i forgot
Cartier Santos bracelet blue dial
JLC Reverson Duoface + moonphase
Rolex Datjust41 blue/green flutes/jubilee
Breitling superocean green dial
This is literally the only channel I have notifications turned on for
amazing content. ive been watching you and your companies growth since anna. keep liquor run going please. yours truly
Great video, I'm a new subscriber and i love your videos
Thanks for the great content. Just subscribed to your podcast!
Grand Seiko can beat Omega on two very important areas, accuracy and innovation. Spring drive is one of the greatest innovations in horology and it's accuracy is second to none.
need more podcasts than once a week!!
Great video. Commented for the competition. Big fan of the channel. Keep it up. And brown Jordaan loafers would be the choice.
Great video as always!
Props on the Breitling video, I hope you will give us an update should something interesting happen with that situation.
I think GS can make itself more desirable to the mass market by going around them and positioning themselves as a high horology brand with watches like their constant force tourbillon. I do think they could use some changes in their design language but if you can appeal to a certain segment at the top others will follow and try to emulate their style. Personally I love GS but prefer Omega as brand because of their variety, history, and “classic” quality-but at the end of the day most GS models simply don’t resonate with me and give me that tingly feeling inside that makes me want to buy a watch.
You both had great points. I really enjoy your content.
Love the debate. Interesting topic. Love how “beat” was defined do the debate stayed practical and meaningful.
I’d get vintage GS or King Seiko, such a cool story about the factories competing even if it’s embellished; also my family has a seiko streak running from my dad buying himself and his dad a seiko, and then myself doing the same for my dad.
Love the videos!
Very insightful conversation.
Just got my first GS, a 9F quartz. My Longines VHP now seems so inferior to it I can't believe I ever wore it. If GS figures out some marketing and releases some attainable sports watches they'll get massive.
It’s such a good movement that
I agree. Seiko can make good sport watches. Seiko got the SKX, Alpinist, Arnie, King Turtle, the Tuna, the Monster. Just make a GS version of the Alpinist and it will do extremely well.
F9 is a good movement it can be serviced you can get it serviced and it will last a life time. It is a long interval too like 20 years. Super accurate as well and quartz made Seiko what it is so it also a bit of history with it too.
@@alexlilano1931 so good right! I got myself a spring drive and hi beat36000 too recently and they’re all pretty impressive
Very interesting debate. A lot to consider here.
Dude love the John call out!
GS makes too many great watches.. smaller tighter catalog (the rolex model) would promote more interest and recognizable models. People who are new to the brand can get lost in a decision and in the meantime purchase a speedy (guilty). I agree they need work on the sports line. Would love to see another SE watch like the Godzilla maybe samurai or Japanese sword related. Thanks for the great video.
😂 jokes aside, which watch is the taiwan special edition? I can’t seem to find any information on that
At this point Theo and Harris are probably the most quality producer of watch content on RUclips
When I first got into watches, I didn't pay GS any attention. I just thought they were very sporty high end Seikos. Now I've learnt more and explored their elegance line, I think they are producing the best looking dress watches, definitely at their price point, and maybe beating some brands at a much higher price point.
Great video idea! The GS v Omega debate is a very interesting one.
Another great vid! I must say, GS is an incredible brand, but I believe that omega will absolutely dominate the mass market for the foreseeable future. I do also think that GS will continue to gain popularity and will reach higher levels, but omega is ingrained so deep in the hobby that it would be very difficult for GS to overtake them.
Was thinking of adding a Grand seiko sbgm 221 GMT or paying way over the odds for a Rolex Pepsi ,thoughts?
Very well thought out pros and cons on two very good watch brands. I'm now liking Grand Seiko more now than ever before, but I'll still pick Omega for the time being. Thank you for keeping the watch community informed.
😂 those debate tactics
Great takes, both brands are great in their own way.
Great debate and perspectives I respect both brands but the quality and time put into GS puts them above in my eyes
Maybe it’s the name. But I could never see myself choosing a GS over an Omega. I’ve also just always been wanted a speedy and a sea master so that might Also have something to do with it.
I'm the same. I think some of their dials look amazing but they change their models every 6 months and resale value is horrific if you want to trade in / swap out. You will always be able to sell a speedmaster or seamaster without getting completely hosed in your investment.
@@Weakeyedominant Yes I agree I don't like when they change styles so quickly. Pick one style and stick with it so it becomes iconic ✨ Breitling is another brand that's constantly changing the Super ocean way to often
I guess I am your biggest fan! I could watch you guys 24/7…😊❤️
The cinematography and production value in your manufacturer pieces is second to none.
Excited for the future of watches. Hope Grand Seiko improves their bracelets/clasps soon.
Theo and Harris is much more than just watches. Great channel!
Omega was my first luxury watch and that emotional attachment is far too strong for me. That being said, experiencing Grand Seiko's in person is incredible. Not just the intricacy of the dials, but the entire boutique experience.
Interesting debate. In the end, I think it all comes downs to what the “winning” criteria are.
I have the sbga407 and love it. I thought I would use it formal settings only, but have found that I’m wearing it as much as my diver. Love it. Perfect in a 2 watch collection
I have had my eye on grand seiko for a long time. The textured dials are incredible. Definitely have to pick one up in the near future.
Fun thought exercise, highlighted what is really great about both brands.
To me, anything is possible, but not anything is probable. Omega would have to make a lot of poor decisions, consistently; and Grand Seiko would have to make a lot of very strategically good (and lucky) decisions, very consistently. Even then…
What brands are next for debate?
Maybe it's because I've lived in Japan for a long time, but Grand Seiko's styling doesn't really excite me. My doctor wears a Grand Seiko, and it's not because he's a watch guy. It's just the watch to wear for a doctor here. GS knows this market segment well, and they're mostly older and don't do sports watches. I hope that GS's popularity overseas pulls their marketing department to be a littler more daring.
Good debate, thanks.
Love that shirt Christian
Great video and topic. I love grand seiko and excited to see them making smaller sizes!
Great debate. On point. GS for the win though
These videos are great, but the full length podcasts are better!
Been watching since the wind reviews with your father. Bring back that series.
Agreed! For a dress watch, I’m actually debating between grand Seiko and Cartier… and that’s the extent of my desire for grand Seiko 🤷🏻♂️
Doubt Grand Seiko will beat Omega as long as Seiko is in the name. Lots of watch snobs will never accept anything with the name Seiko on it.
Defining the "beat" is key. Own the frame, own the deal.
Love the video, I can see myself getting a GS eventually however I've always seen Omega as superior
Yo! Love the videos!
Love the videos. You both mentioned these companies are very much clearly at different points in their development and are a far way away from being actual competitors. I think Christian said once that watch companies think in decades.
"The best way to predict the future is to study the past"-Kiyosaki
As you both know a lot about watch history and vintage watches, I think the future videos in this format could benefit from a historical view. How did seiko/omega beat competitors in the past? How has design ethos of the sports watch changed over the past 30 years? Could that margin of change benefit be big enough to make a GS design language of nature be very impactful in a future filled with environmental turmoil?
Again love the content and attention to detail. Watching these videos always makes me smile at my little accutron.
Easier said than done, but I’d love to see Grand Seiko featured as the next Bond watch. New actor, new direction for the series, big opening for a watch company that has been killing it through a pandemic.
Great bud guys!
Wow this one is tough. There are things I really like about both. Hopefully I can own one of each in the future.
Loved this dialogue. I already kind of see Grand Seiko in a similar light to JLC. Extremely fine watches; super premium movement with nearly unbeatable finishing. They have a few things holding them back but I agree that their greatest road block is lack of a good sports watch line. They simply dont, not cant, compete with other brands that do have them. Beautiful dress watches, stunning and an incredible value proposition. Dress watches just aren't really popular right now.
love both brands!
Love the chemistry you guys have. Even when your your not getting on the point you still sound interesting...staying on point, for me grande seiko Will always be to big, or too shinny or too dressy. I think Omega designs would always look more apealing, specially the reissue ones.
I agree with Michael, lacking the excitement factor is one of the largest “downsides” of Grand Seiko.
Just got off work...cant wait to get my coffee and relax and watch!!!😎⌚️✌️Thanks guys....
Imagine if GS did an OP like simple watch with beautiful colorful dials and improved steel bracelet + clasp with screws... not too complicated... average ppl don't care about the internal overcomplications
Thanks!
Correct me if I'm wrong. I think the latest GS limited edition releases are in Thailand, not Taiwan. (Koke-iro/SBGH303, Nami/SBGY021, Hikari/SBGY025)
Also, I’ve tried so hard to love Grand Seiko but I fell in love with mechanical watches (via Theo and Harris) and really enjoyed Omega’s quality and mainly the history of the company. My first watch was a Nomos Orion followed by an Omega Seamaster Aquaterra. Maybe one day, Grand Seiko, just not now.
Now that is an interesting idea! GS gaining market share by going straight at each Swiss brand’s undisputed heavyweight. A Speedmaster alternative that is a better value, a submariner alternative that is actually available for purchase, etc etc.
I recently got my first big boy watch. I wanted to go with GS as I was always fascinated with Japan. But the reps didn’t look enthusiastic and were just pushing to buy the watch rather than just present the watch. I went to omega boutique in Las Vegas and I had a blast with everyone at boutique and ended up getting the seamaster 300. But the itch is still there and I guess next bonus will be going towards a GS.
I bought my wife a Tudor Royal recently, and she was with me the whole time when we were looking for her first mechanical entry level luxury watch. I asked her if she might be interested in a Grand Seiko for ladies, she literally said "Why would I go for a Seiko if I want a luxury piece?"... I am giving this as an example to show that people who know about Omega and Grand Seiko know their shit, but Grand Seiko is still an unknown brand for people who don't know about high end luxury watches. With this being said, I think that Seiko is Grand Seiko's monkey on the back, however, with good advertising strategies (because obviously they already have the good build quality and heritage) Grand Seiko might beat Omega and even some more similar luxury watch brands.
They basically have to stop making regular seikos. Swap to one of their other sub brands. Orient. Brightz astron prospeX what ever. Just stop sticking seiko on all their lines. Can you imagine if there's a little swatch badge on all omegas 5k watches? It would kill their sales dead
Just out of curiosity, which Tudor royal variant did you get her ?
@@rage8kage totally correct, thanks for sharing your thoughts :)
@@leroyjenkins9000 I don't know the exact reference but it was the S&G version with a white dial and diamond numerals
Love you guys and your conversations. I am a big fan of Grand Seiko and I also love Omega too. I think Grand Seiko is way more affordable and punches way above its price in terms of value. Omega is nice too but they are more expensive, less accurate, and frankly, heritage just doesn't appeal to me. I'd rather have precision and engineering advancements than heritage look and feel.
The shirt game on this channel is strong. Mid century vibes.
Nice video! Love to see "other brands" getting attention.
Omega has the name the horology, coaxial escapement, and the cloud, Grand Seiko has the better finished watch. And spring drive. For me it would be hard to turn down having Omega on the dial however it always comes down to design for me. Give me that pie pan
I love the “Connie”. The Constellation is one of the most underrated timepieces out there. I have Globemaster Annual Calendar - Green pie pan dial. The fluted - coin edge bezel is beautiful on this dial.
Man, you are so right on this. I bought the Globemaster two months ago and it became my daily ever since. That’s such a good watch!
Long time fan since day one when Christian talked in his parents back yard about the credibility of archieluxury😂
I really appreciate your professional evolution, from pure watch making over to marketing and everything that goes with it. And not afraid do throw punches at the big boys, keep it up👀