One morning I had a terrible hangover and my hyperactive flatmate was annoying the crap out of me (he had carried on drinking from the night before). Then he decided to play me this. Not the best day of my life.
Justin got it exactly right. The strange circumstances that led to the recording of this album resulted in a record that sounds like no other. It became somewhat of a cult record, as an example of so-called naive art. I'll say this for it: if you listen to this and follow it immediately by a conventional song, you become more aware of what the conventions of song writing are (at least, I did), so it has that going for it. However, we mustn't forgot that it must have been a pretty unpleasant experience for the children who were dragged out of school and forced to do it.
I own this CD! It has a certain charm. Richie Untberger wrote a book titled "The Secret History of Rock: The Most Influential Bands You've Never Heard" and put this band in the chapter called Naive Rock along with people like Daniel Johnston and Jonathan Richman. It's a thing. Thanks for your reaction Justin
I wanna track this book down cause i love learning about this stuff. I think i object to the use of the word naive though. I dunno, seems infantilizing? Or something? Somethings off about it. Did the girls mean to have this timing in a sort of ‘perfectly rehearsed trout mask replica level’ kind of way? No.
Their father kind of insisted the girls make a record. They were young and didn't feel ready. They were right, but we've been gifted this strange and wonderful record. I have to be in the mood for it. @@willburbur3793
The Shaggs made some of the most unintentionally uplifting and inspirational music I've ever heard. It's impossible for me to be in a bad mood while listening to them.
I think this is the first time I have heard you utter the words..'I don't like this song". However, on a positive note, you will never have to listen it again. And look at that -- you don't have to worry about copyright! Love the look on your face, and the long dramatic pause before speaking. Stunned. Best of the world to you, friend.
The strange thing is that it's possible to be very popular for being very bad (William Hung, for example). You just have to be the very best at being very bad.
Yup! We have a guy from our village who "won" a TV show called Sweden's worst singer. He sure grabbed attention and is still, many years later, at least a local celebrity.
I do so LOVE stuf like this. Which goes a long way to explain the Leary looks I got at parties when people saw me in charge of the sounds being played.
JP . . you have been tested. Your music "appreciation" is set at an all time . . "Hmmmm." I almost fell on the floor. Your expressions are TIMELESS. It's Halloween, is a real WINNER! It's soooooo bad, it's good. It's that kind of thing. You're very generous and bless your heart, JP. LOL!
As I waited for this to begin I felt like I was at a surprise birthday party, just waiting for the guest of honor to arrive and open the door. It's all about the look you're gonna have on your face. Priceless.
Turns out the JustJP x Canadian Studmuffin crossover being the crossover I never knew I needed also gave birth to the reaction video I never knew I needed
And now do "Banana Bike" by Dot! Although it is much improved, It is still a very naïve piece of music, that is a tribute to her sister Helen, who was the drummer in The Shaggs, because Helen had an imported Raleigh Chopper bicycle in bright yellow that she used to keep fit with.
All the best critics give this track a review - so well done. Gonna give you a health warning here - do not listen to it too often, otherwise you may become obscessed and begin to like it (like me). Frank Zappa was also a big fan ( allegedly). Just for the record - Foot Foot was a two-legged cat.
To give you an idea of why it could be a work of accidental genius: It challenges our perception of “good” music. It’s subversive, yet not intended to be. It’s time changes are a combination of poor playing and following oddly metered phrasing from the lyrics. It challenged the idea (especially for the time) that pop music had to sound good. It’s actually fairly catchy too. Brian Eno commented once, if I recall, that any random sequence of notes can sound important when repeated. This song is the same way, listen to it repeatedly and what initially sounded “bad” or “off” starts to sound right. It’s unintentionally avant-garde. But is it really “bad” compared to other complex or avant-grade music? How many people think Coltrane, King Crimson, or pre-Dark Side Pink Floyd is just noise? On the surface it’s just a naive song played poorly by some young girls. Yet are the lyrics really simpler or worse than, say, “She loves you, yeah, yeah, yeah?” It’s one of those things that can make you explore what art, music, and “good” really is if you take the time to listen a number of times and then consider those sorts or questions. Or not. I guess that’s up to the listener. It reminds me of a quote by Gene Simmons when asked if he thought Kiss music is art. He said that’s not up to him to decide, it’s up to the listener. Another thing to consider is that in many other cultures, music if of the people. It’s not about being good, but expressing yourself. In the western world, by commoditizing music, we require judgement - is this good? Will it sell? They are amateurs. Should Music (capitalization intentional) be only in the domain of a Musician?
It's bad. Simply bad, No other adjective more readily applies. Trying to apply terms like "avant garde" or " artistic" disrespects the concept of art itself. At some point you have to be willing to call shit shit,
@@daneng3641 There's a lot of music that sucks. Most of it isn't remembered. Even stuff that's horrific rather than boring usually goes away. There was an absolutely horrendous drum-n-bass "remix" of "Sweet Caroline" that went mildly viral last year. I listened to it and laughed at how bad it was, but nobody is still talking or thinking about it today, even less than one year later. The Shaggs are still remembered and talked about over 50 years later. It's worth asking why that is, because there IS something compelling about them that isn't compelling about more run-of-the-mill bad music. I think to say otherwise and leave this unexamined is far more disrespectful to the concept of art.
@@daneng3641 Isn’t bad art still art? For me, it’s simple. There’s some music that speaks to me, some that doesn’t. I find it hard to fathom that others aren’t moved by King Crimson or Yes, for example. Intellectually I can understand it, but not experientially. I hear it, and it moves me. Of course, there’s loads of music that does that for other people, but leaves me cold. Some I actively cannot stand to listen to. I can grasp the appeal, but I can’t stand it. I suppose that is probably “better” art than the middle-of-the-road stuff that’s just there. Because it *does* move me, just in a negative way. It appears that this song moves some people. It connects with them, on whatever level and for whatever reason, who am I to say they are wrong just because it doesn’t speak to me? Frank Zappa, Kurt Cobain, Robert Fripp and others speak of it highly. Even if it doesn’t move me, it certainly may have impacted them, and influenced them in some way that perhaps led them to produce music that does. Is that not art, then?
@@NewBritainStation I think you're taking subjective to its logical extreme. It's people like Zappa, who are technically great. but take music to a challenging extreme who muddy the waters. I can't even hope to understand music to Zappa's level, but I genuinely think he's fucking with us.
Your reaction was priceless! I actually enjoyed this, but not sure how long I can listen to it (not sure I can handle a full album). Thanks again for always playing a great variety of music!
Gonna comment before I listen. Saw the chat last night when this was recommended/suggested to you. Didn't expect you to react so quickly. I love this album. I listen to music randomly, all my sounds are on shuffle. When the Shaggs come on they always, always make me laugh. Some time in the future you could react to a cover of this by Deerhoof. I hope you enjoy this because I definitely am going to. 😉
There's something to be said about music being created from what seems to have been a vacuum. No inspirations, just making sounds with no regards to theory or structure. It's a very interesting experiment and is definitely worth some amount of introspection and discussion. Mainly, though, this song (and accompanying album) seem more like a mad science experiment and thus I don't really see how it could be called anything but novel, haha.
Hey Jason, Ned from Spain to say, how about a channel for oddball music like this ? Maybe as a challenge to see just how much of this uhm...stuff you can get through.
@@JustJP Wish I could think of what would be the right song for you to try. The thing is, you liked Tom Waits. Beefheart can be a lot like a more insane Tom Waits. Ummmm... 'Fallin' Ditch'? It's still absolutely Trout Mask Replica, but you can hear why people care
When I heard about this album a couple of years ago I downloaded it and I've listened to it 2 or 3 times (my brain has dumped the exact figure in the waste bin ). When you listen to it all the way through, it makes you realise exactly how long 31 minutes and 39 seconds last. In a way, it's so bad that there is something magnetic about it. The band still exists and tours and plays every song note by note. They are probably the greatest perfectionists in the history of modern music. PS: If I remember correctly, I think FootFoot was their pet rabbit.
If you think this is bad, you should see how much this record goes for! Not gonna lie, I'd take this any day over ELP or most bands who play complex for complexity sake.
there was once a band called "the chocolate-watch band" who recorded and released three albums at the height of the psychedelic era 1967-68. although they appeared in a movie "riot on the sunset strip" in 1967 they were destined to be but a forgotten footnote in r&r history. their last album was so chaotic the producer finished the album with a different singer and an entirely different band on some tracks because he couldn't find the band to finish the album. but he still credited every song to "the chocolate-watch band." in the 70s collectors rediscovered the band's three albums which originally sold very little and their albums became sought after and VERY EXPENSIVE collectors items. the value of these original albums were nearly equal to original elvis and beatles albums. the difference between "the chocolate-watch band" and "the shaggs" is that the former were actually VERY, VERY GOOD! they're one of my favorite bands today. the point i'm making is... there's no telling what the future will bring. recognition, good or bad, can come at any time.
there's actually two versions of shaggs songs out there recorded a decade or two apart. the second one isn't nearly as bad as the first. but at this point in time i can't tell them apart. i can't tell if this is the "good" or "bad" version.
The attribution of "genius" to this would be down to the fact that They Invented _Music_ . I'll try (but I'm not good at this) to briefly outline their history as I've heard it. They had a very religious, very eclectically opinionated, extremely controlling father, so they grew up not so much in a family as in a cult. It was weirder than the weirdest family you've ever encountered. As far as music goes, their father believed that music as Of the World, and Sinful, and his family (wife, too, I think) had to be protected from it. He took extreme steps to ensure that they would never be exposed to the polluting effects of music. (I don't remember the details, but I think they might have spent at least part of their lives largely confined to a cellar, and were kept away from places where there's music, like school. (I think they were home schooled, "for their protection".) And then he had a change of heart. I don't know if he encountered a fortune teller, like the story you have there says, but he had some "contact with a Vision" (as far as he was concerned), in which his daughters had been born to become the greatest band that ever was - more in terms of being the Ones who would, by their music, Save humanity (along with getting rich and famous while doing so.) So he bought them instruments, and forced them to make music. No lessons. Just grab these instruments, follow the divine inspiration, do what the Juju (or whoever) has decided you should do. They had to work at it for hours on end every day, coming up with songs, and when they had enough of them, he paid to have the songs recorded. Yes, music already existed (as all the people here who are clever enough to do pattern recognition are attesting), but it wasn't part of their lives, growing up. They had to invent it from scratch. There's something "down to bare metal" about that, and I think it's this that people like Kurt Cobain (and maybe Frank Zappa, too - not too sure about him, though) loved about the album. It's not fake. They resisted doing it. They stopped as soon as they were able to. (When he died, I'd guess.) It's a rare thing, then. All the "great music" is largely great just because of its familiarity. People love things that fit what's familiar to them. It's comfortable. There's something pretty about a neat fit to a pre-determined pattern, too. I saw an interview with them somewhere at some stage. I don't know if it's great or trash or not appropriate to evaluate in such relative terms; I just know it's interesting. A helleva lot more interesting than a lot of "good music" made by using some "good music cookie cutter" - including the more intricate cookie cutters out there. It's not the ugliest music in the world, BTW. Here's the world's ugliest music: ruclips.net/video/RENk9PK06AQ/видео.html (If the background story sounds interesting, just delete everything from &t= on, and hit the return key.)
I remember suggesting this when you did a video asking for songs you wouldn't like. The Shaggs only had one studio album, but did have a compilation album "The Shagg's Own Thing" that is played more competently. Yes, I have it. There is a slightly tighter version of My Pal Foot Foot on it. There is even a decent version of the instrumental "Wheels" on it. Oddly enough, if you look up "Philosophy of the World" on All Music Guide, they rate it four and a half stars. I did enjoy this video. Keep those tunes coming.
I remember commenting on the video of the album that, as it went on, the guitar got more and more out of tune and, had they continued a bit longer, the strings would have dropped off. There is actually a point on the album where guitar, bass and drums match up and it sounds like proper music but it only lasts for a second or two.
Just think, Captain Beefheart had to lock trained musicians in a shack and torture them psychologically for months to make music that sounded like this.
I'm surprised you didn't burst out laughing sooner. Another reaction channel played this on April Fool's Day so I listened only for your reactions. I have a headache 😫
@@timfeeley714-25 Personally I have never taken any Frank Zappa statement at face value. Anyway Gerry and the Holograms is still relatively much better than The Shaggs!
It's a good idea to read more about the story of The Shaggs and the bizarre story behind this record. For me it's not a case of "worst band ever" - it's what a group sound like when they have years of practice (not training), but no idea what music should sound like. I wouldn't say the results sound good, or course, but there are aspects - the way all the notes (vocals/instruments) are the same rather than harmonised, the half-repetition from the second vocalist, the drum solo at the end - I would say there are more ideas just in this song than in many other albums.
"Daddy what are all those instruments for"? Quiet, girls, if those damn hippies can make money off of terrible music. So can we"! So bad it's good. Peace & Love.
Frank Zappa called The Shaggs geniuses and said he thought they were better than the Beatles. He said it in earnest. Check out a few songs from their second (and last thankfully) album...particularly their cover of Yesterday once more. It is simplistically beautiful. (and sung mostly in tune).
Good gravy! Outsider Music by sisters who literally had no idea how to play music. I feel like I'm going insane, listening to this song. What did Kurt Cobain possibly see in them?
Frank Zappa said it's one of his favorite bands and Kurt Cobain listed as his 5th favorite album! Both are into atonal music so I can see why they might enjoy it!
Did you notice their thick as a hunk of fudge Boston or Massachusetts accents ? It's Halloween is another humdinger. This LP has more hits than the Gambino family. How about some classic Rodd Keith or Gene Evans, MSR song poems or Lucia Pamelas In Outer Space ? BJ Snowden ?? I know we're all thinkin Daniel Johnston's Hi How Are You , right ? RIGHT !
Can someone point me to a corner of the internet where the shaggs are appreciated. I’m sick of all these reviews that just treat it like a joke. They always think these girls were stupid and that they, the reviewer, are so much better at music and blah blah blah. It’s a masterpiece. Where can it be treated like one?!?!?!?!
Wow ! Justin, wouldn't you be a little masochistic these days in your musical listening?🤔 The Shaggs managed to do worse than the Velvet Underground, and this is not an easy task!🤣
@@a.k.1740 you alredy did with other comments so it's not possible to do worse 🙃. Jokes aside, the velvet underground were an extremely ""poor"" band (they weren't the flamboyant conservatory freaks like emerson or others and they didn't need to be like that) making ""poor"" music, besides that their influence, lyrics AND compositions inspired 50/60% of the bands that came after while also having monstrous intuitions that spawned some genres DECADES in advance (noise, punk, industrial, post-punk, dream pop, gothic rock ecc ecc) , that's a sign of musical genius as far a my opinion is concerned. So regarding the VU as a shitty band is completely wrong in basically every level (taste asides of course). Ps I am not even the only one that says this, the (almost) entirety of musical critique agrees on this topic (also in my little, a lot of people that made the conservatory and I know loves the velvet underground, so are you sure they just sucks?).
@@tuskact4overheaven873 I've never trusted music critics or so-called music luminaries. I trust my ears alone and they tell me that the velvet is a monumental fraud.
Ah you actually went there!!!! 😆😆😆😆😆 There are some prominent musicians who cite the Shaggs, but I think their best trait is totally deconstructed music. It's like they had no idea what music was. This is what a baby would think music is, without cultural referents.
If you want to hear another "so bad it may actually be good" song, check out the Turtles "Umbassa and the dragon." The difference between the Shaggs and the Turtles is, of course, that the Turtles were real singers, musicians, and songwriters and "Umbassa" was not typical of their songs.
I guess you'll be reacting to the rest of this album then. You have to admit though, that the prediction did come true since here you are, reacting to it and we're commenting!. I suppose you could see this as a form of abstract creativity? 🙃 I'd heard this before, so was looking forward to your reaction...twas as expected.😊
Well I enjoyed this anyway. No JP, don't take up the suggestion: Captain Beefheart's 'Trout Mask Replica' will not go down well with you. I think you would enjoy Shiny Beast though.
This is the wrong track to start with. You should try "Who Are Parents?" instead. It was used as the outro to the film "Ken Park" and I honestly thought it was an obscure 90s indie band responsible. All the off centre and random vocal lines against a steady drum beat do actually coalesce into a fascinating style which sounds very contemporary. I think that is where the "accidental genius" comes in. They do say however that if you superimpose and phase the instrumentals on this album and have some ranting male voice shouting over them you end up with an album called "Trout Mask Replica". Which ironic as that seems to have been put together in a more extreme form of what happened with these girls. I do suggest a reaction to that track as it is something special.
Nope nope nope. The Magic Band, and Beefheart, could really play. They were choosing to play like that, and Samuel Andreyev has an amazing analysis of 'Frownland', the opening track and the most out-there track musically. There's a similarity though: The Shaggs got forced into playing by their Dad, and the Magic Band got bullied by Beefheart, who took all their credit. But their musical abilities were very, very different, as was the effort involved. Now you've got me wondering what off Trout Mask would likely get to JP in a positive way: I don't think Frownland would work, just too intense and can't be remotely grasped on a first listen.
I have listened to this album twice, and will listen to it many more times. I do admit my drumming at 15 back in 1990, with no lessons was better. My mom's piano playing would have fit right in. She had 7 years of lessons and was still not good.
It's a dream come true for you to listen to The Shaggs. 😄 Hope everyone checks out my interview with JP. It was an honor to interview him.
Canadian Studdmuffin interviewed JP? I got to see this!
Didn't expect to see you here!
@@inkoinfinity2 I interviewed JP a few months back. ruclips.net/video/UMMf4wXBHA4/видео.html
Jesus H. Christ! How can you NOT love this?
One morning I had a terrible hangover and my hyperactive flatmate was annoying the crap out of me (he had carried on drinking from the night before). Then he decided to play me this. Not the best day of my life.
🤣
One of my favorite reactions to this was, "The drummer sounds like she's building a shed."
This is one of those noises that is best listened to with the sound turned all the way down.
Lol!
Justin got it exactly right. The strange circumstances that led to the recording of this album resulted in a record that sounds like no other. It became somewhat of a cult record, as an example of so-called naive art.
I'll say this for it: if you listen to this and follow it immediately by a conventional song, you become more aware of what the conventions of song writing are (at least, I did), so it has that going for it.
However, we mustn't forgot that it must have been a pretty unpleasant experience for the children who were dragged out of school and forced to do it.
dude your reaction is killing me LMAO
Cheers to Austin for getting all three of his predictions. The band will live on in the so bad it's brilliant catagory.
Best song ever
Maybe the cat heard them playing, that's why it went missing.
Foot foot was apparently their two legged cat. But it still mustered up the energy and coordination to run away. 🤣
Not many videos you do that I wouldn’t give a thumbs up or down but thumbs in my ears. Woah 😳
I own this CD! It has a certain charm. Richie Untberger wrote a book titled "The Secret History of Rock: The Most Influential Bands You've Never Heard" and put this band in the chapter called Naive Rock along with people like Daniel Johnston and Jonathan Richman. It's a thing. Thanks for your reaction Justin
"Naive rock" is a great name for it.
I wanna track this book down cause i love learning about this stuff. I think i object to the use of the word naive though. I dunno, seems infantilizing? Or something? Somethings off about it. Did the girls mean to have this timing in a sort of ‘perfectly rehearsed trout mask replica level’ kind of way? No.
Their father kind of insisted the girls make a record. They were young and didn't feel ready. They were right, but we've been gifted this strange and wonderful record. I have to be in the mood for it.
@@willburbur3793
There's an innocence to this that I find somewhat appealing....and it makes me laugh...a lot.
The Shaggs made some of the most unintentionally uplifting and inspirational music I've ever heard. It's impossible for me to be in a bad mood while listening to them.
I'm thinkin' that "Sister Ray" is lookin' pretty good right about now . . .
Exactly what I thought. They're like a bad version of The Velvet Underground.
I think this is the first time I have heard you utter the words..'I don't like this song". However, on a positive note, you will never have to listen it again. And look at that -- you don't have to worry about copyright! Love the look on your face, and the long dramatic pause before speaking. Stunned.
Best of the world to you, friend.
The strange thing is that it's possible to be very popular for being very bad (William Hung, for example). You just have to be the very best at being very bad.
Yup! We have a guy from our village who "won" a TV show called Sweden's worst singer. He sure grabbed attention and is still, many years later, at least a local celebrity.
Oh yeah the Shaggs I’ve got this album
I think everyone probably vividly remembers the first time they heard The Shaggs, hahaha! My introduction was "Who Are Parents?"
I do so LOVE stuf like this. Which goes a long way to explain the Leary looks I got at parties when people saw me in charge of the sounds being played.
JP . . you have been tested. Your music "appreciation" is set at an all time . . "Hmmmm." I almost fell on the floor. Your expressions are TIMELESS. It's Halloween, is a real WINNER! It's soooooo bad, it's good. It's that kind of thing. You're very generous and bless your heart, JP. LOL!
And this had a big big big following in the mid to late 1980s
A bit early for April fools....
I unironically thoroughly enjoy this album
Same, where is the shaggs love? Does the cult meets anywhere?
Next Up: Captain Beefheart & his Magic Band - Trout Mask Replica
It's gotta happen ! Lick My Decals Off Baby as well !
Yes!
Ha.... that'll teach ya. Sister Ray anybody!!
Ha Ha Justin. Been a fan of Larry's channel for years and yours as well. Was great to see you guys chating.
I think for a moment I saw your face say “what am I doing with my life?”
Maybe it's time for Barnes & Barnes infamous cult classic, "Fish Heads”
I have 2 Barnes and Barnes albums and they're both actually very good!
What a splendid suggestion... Top marks that man 👍
As I waited for this to begin I felt like I was at a surprise birthday party, just waiting for the guest of honor to arrive and open the door. It's all about the look you're gonna have on your face. Priceless.
Played backwards, what is "Toof Toof" really trying to tell us
This is my favorite band
It left you speechless! I actually saw them in concert in 2017.
Mark! How was the performance?
@@reddiver7293 he did not
@@LordXbow
How do you know that, brother?
@@LordXbow They really did reunite and tour believe it or not. They are in the Daniel Johnston indie league of cult artists.
Justin, your face coming to this for the first time, is a picture. It wouldn't have been as funny if you'd read the Shagg's story first.
Haha ty ty
Turns out the JustJP x Canadian Studmuffin crossover being the crossover I never knew I needed also gave birth to the reaction video I never knew I needed
Frank Zappa did say The Shaggs were better than the Beatles at one point… but Zappa was known to be a troll at times lol.
And now do "Banana Bike" by Dot! Although it is much improved, It is still a very naïve piece of music, that is a tribute to her sister Helen, who was the drummer in The Shaggs, because Helen had an imported Raleigh Chopper bicycle in bright yellow that she used to keep fit with.
I’m glad your back to normal now.
All the best critics give this track a review - so well done. Gonna give you a health warning here - do not listen to it too often, otherwise you may become obscessed and begin to like it (like me). Frank Zappa was also a big fan ( allegedly). Just for the record - Foot Foot was a two-legged cat.
Robert Fripp too, apparently.
HisboiLRoi
19 minutes ago
Bonnie Raitt, Carla Bley, and Kurt Cobain as well.
To give you an idea of why it could be a work of accidental genius:
It challenges our perception of “good” music. It’s subversive, yet not intended to be.
It’s time changes are a combination of poor playing and following oddly metered phrasing from the lyrics. It challenged the idea (especially for the time) that pop music had to sound good. It’s actually fairly catchy too.
Brian Eno commented once, if I recall, that any random sequence of notes can sound important when repeated. This song is the same way, listen to it repeatedly and what initially sounded “bad” or “off” starts to sound right.
It’s unintentionally avant-garde. But is it really “bad” compared to other complex or avant-grade music? How many people think Coltrane, King Crimson, or pre-Dark Side Pink Floyd is just noise?
On the surface it’s just a naive song played poorly by some young girls. Yet are the lyrics really simpler or worse than, say, “She loves you, yeah, yeah, yeah?”
It’s one of those things that can make you explore what art, music, and “good” really is if you take the time to listen a number of times and then consider those sorts or questions.
Or not. I guess that’s up to the listener.
It reminds me of a quote by Gene Simmons when asked if he thought Kiss music is art. He said that’s not up to him to decide, it’s up to the listener.
Another thing to consider is that in many other cultures, music if of the people. It’s not about being good, but expressing yourself. In the western world, by commoditizing music, we require judgement - is this good? Will it sell? They are amateurs.
Should Music (capitalization intentional) be only in the domain of a Musician?
Good points Randy
It's bad. Simply bad, No other adjective more readily applies. Trying to apply terms like "avant garde" or " artistic" disrespects the concept of art itself. At some point you have to be willing to call shit shit,
@@daneng3641 There's a lot of music that sucks. Most of it isn't remembered. Even stuff that's horrific rather than boring usually goes away. There was an absolutely horrendous drum-n-bass "remix" of "Sweet Caroline" that went mildly viral last year. I listened to it and laughed at how bad it was, but nobody is still talking or thinking about it today, even less than one year later. The Shaggs are still remembered and talked about over 50 years later. It's worth asking why that is, because there IS something compelling about them that isn't compelling about more run-of-the-mill bad music. I think to say otherwise and leave this unexamined is far more disrespectful to the concept of art.
@@daneng3641 Isn’t bad art still art?
For me, it’s simple. There’s some music that speaks to me, some that doesn’t.
I find it hard to fathom that others aren’t moved by King Crimson or Yes, for example. Intellectually I can understand it, but not experientially. I hear it, and it moves me.
Of course, there’s loads of music that does that for other people, but leaves me cold. Some I actively cannot stand to listen to. I can grasp the appeal, but I can’t stand it.
I suppose that is probably “better” art than the middle-of-the-road stuff that’s just there. Because it *does* move me, just in a negative way.
It appears that this song moves some people. It connects with them, on whatever level and for whatever reason, who am I to say they are wrong just because it doesn’t speak to me?
Frank Zappa, Kurt Cobain, Robert Fripp and others speak of it highly. Even if it doesn’t move me, it certainly may have impacted them, and influenced them in some way that perhaps led them to produce music that does.
Is that not art, then?
@@NewBritainStation I think you're taking subjective to its logical extreme. It's people like Zappa, who are technically great. but take music to a challenging extreme who muddy the waters. I can't even hope to understand music to Zappa's level, but I genuinely think he's fucking with us.
Your reaction was priceless! I actually enjoyed this, but not sure how long I can listen to it (not sure I can handle a full album). Thanks again for always playing a great variety of music!
his facial expressions were so funny
This is what will be playing when the 4 Horsemen of the Apocalypse come riding in to straff the planet!!!
Reviewing the full album should be your 28k subscriber goal.
Gonna comment before I listen. Saw the chat last night when this was recommended/suggested to you. Didn't expect you to react so quickly. I love this album. I listen to music randomly, all my sounds are on shuffle. When the Shaggs come on they always, always make me laugh. Some time in the future you could react to a cover of this by Deerhoof. I hope you enjoy this because I definitely am going to. 😉
The lead singer, Dot Wiggin, formed a new band DOT WIGGIN BAND 44 years later and recorded a new album! In 2013 on Jello Biafra's label!
You're playing 'Green Eggs & Ham' with 'Hi Ren'. And in the end you're gonna love it.
Imagine them doin' "Sister Ray"!
There's something to be said about music being created from what seems to have been a vacuum. No inspirations, just making sounds with no regards to theory or structure. It's a very interesting experiment and is definitely worth some amount of introspection and discussion. Mainly, though, this song (and accompanying album) seem more like a mad science experiment and thus I don't really see how it could be called anything but novel, haha.
Oh no
So basically you’re gonna find out it was the girls father that decided to produce them
Are you losing it, my old son? Take a break, recuperate 😆
👍I feel like Justin's brain has tripped from being exposed to the VU for too long.😉
@@a.k.1740 like O-O
Hey Jason, Ned from Spain to say, how about a channel for oddball music like this ? Maybe as a challenge to see just how much of this uhm...stuff you can get through.
You could probably draw a parallel between this and outsider (self-taught) art.
Great! Next “Paralyzed” by the Legendary Stardust Cowboy or “Mom I Gave The Cat Some Acid” by the Happy Flowers 😂😂
You are not ready for Trout Mask Replica.😆
Thats why it excites me :D
@@JustJP Wish I could think of what would be the right song for you to try. The thing is, you liked Tom Waits. Beefheart can be a lot like a more insane Tom Waits. Ummmm... 'Fallin' Ditch'? It's still absolutely Trout Mask Replica, but you can hear why people care
When I heard about this album a couple of years ago I downloaded it and I've listened to it 2 or 3 times (my brain has dumped the exact figure in the waste bin ). When you listen to it all the way through, it makes you realise exactly how long 31 minutes and 39 seconds last. In a way, it's so bad that there is something magnetic about it. The band still exists and tours and plays every song note by note. They are probably the greatest perfectionists in the history of modern music.
PS: If I remember correctly, I think FootFoot was their pet rabbit.
If you think this is bad, you should see how much this record goes for!
Not gonna lie, I'd take this any day over ELP or most bands who play complex for complexity sake.
I'd take.... uh, never mind. 😎 But I would. Hey Foot Foot!🐰
there was once a band called "the chocolate-watch band" who recorded and released three albums at the height of the psychedelic era 1967-68. although they appeared in a movie "riot on the sunset strip" in 1967 they were destined to be but a forgotten footnote in r&r history. their last album was so chaotic the producer finished the album with a different singer and an entirely different band on some tracks because he couldn't find the band to finish the album. but he still credited every song to "the chocolate-watch band."
in the 70s collectors rediscovered the band's three albums which originally sold very little and their albums became sought after and VERY EXPENSIVE collectors items. the value of these original albums were nearly equal to original elvis and beatles albums.
the difference between "the chocolate-watch band" and "the shaggs" is that the former were actually VERY, VERY GOOD! they're one of my favorite bands today. the point i'm making is... there's no telling what the future will bring. recognition, good or bad, can come at any time.
there's actually two versions of shaggs songs out there recorded a decade or two apart. the second one isn't nearly as bad as the first. but at this point in time i can't tell them apart. i can't tell if this is the "good" or "bad" version.
It was outsider art
before There was outsider art ‼️
The attribution of "genius" to this would be down to the fact that They Invented _Music_ .
I'll try (but I'm not good at this) to briefly outline their history as I've heard it.
They had a very religious, very eclectically opinionated, extremely controlling father, so they grew up not so much in a family as in a cult. It was weirder than the weirdest family you've ever encountered.
As far as music goes, their father believed that music as Of the World, and Sinful, and his family (wife, too, I think) had to be protected from it. He took extreme steps to ensure that they would never be exposed to the polluting effects of music. (I don't remember the details, but I think they might have spent at least part of their lives largely confined to a cellar, and were kept away from places where there's music, like school. (I think they were home schooled, "for their protection".)
And then he had a change of heart. I don't know if he encountered a fortune teller, like the story you have there says, but he had some "contact with a Vision" (as far as he was concerned), in which his daughters had been born to become the greatest band that ever was - more in terms of being the Ones who would, by their music, Save humanity (along with getting rich and famous while doing so.)
So he bought them instruments, and forced them to make music.
No lessons. Just grab these instruments, follow the divine inspiration, do what the Juju (or whoever) has decided you should do.
They had to work at it for hours on end every day, coming up with songs, and when they had enough of them, he paid to have the songs recorded.
Yes, music already existed (as all the people here who are clever enough to do pattern recognition are attesting), but it wasn't part of their lives, growing up. They had to invent it from scratch. There's something "down to bare metal" about that, and I think it's this that people like Kurt Cobain (and maybe Frank Zappa, too - not too sure about him, though) loved about the album.
It's not fake. They resisted doing it. They stopped as soon as they were able to. (When he died, I'd guess.) It's a rare thing, then. All the "great music" is largely great just because of its familiarity. People love things that fit what's familiar to them. It's comfortable. There's something pretty about a neat fit to a pre-determined pattern, too.
I saw an interview with them somewhere at some stage.
I don't know if it's great or trash or not appropriate to evaluate in such relative terms; I just know it's interesting. A helleva lot more interesting than a lot of "good music" made by using some "good music cookie cutter" - including the more intricate cookie cutters out there.
It's not the ugliest music in the world, BTW. Here's the world's ugliest music: ruclips.net/video/RENk9PK06AQ/видео.html
(If the background story sounds interesting, just delete everything from &t= on, and hit the return key.)
If you want to hear *Something New* you're in luck. *Rain* has just released a song with exactly that name. ruclips.net/video/o9kBUF18eBs/видео.html
I remember suggesting this when you did a video asking for songs you wouldn't like. The Shaggs only had one studio album, but did have a compilation album "The Shagg's Own Thing" that is played more competently. Yes, I have it. There is a slightly tighter version of My Pal Foot Foot on it. There is even a decent version of the instrumental "Wheels" on it. Oddly enough, if you look up "Philosophy of the World" on All Music Guide, they rate it four and a half stars. I did enjoy this video. Keep those tunes coming.
THIS is why I watch Reaction Videos.
Bwaaaaaaaaaaaaaahahahahahahahahahahahaha!
I remember commenting on the video of the album that, as it went on, the guitar got more and more out of tune and, had they continued a bit longer, the strings would have dropped off. There is actually a point on the album where guitar, bass and drums match up and it sounds like proper music but it only lasts for a second or two.
Yes it’s dreadful, but as an artefact it’s interesting
Teenage girls doing a Beefheartian mask replica.
It's sounding like this might be The Shaggs only outing. Interesting, but can't say i'd be broken hearted about it if that's the case 🙂
I wouldn't take any more recommendations from the Studmuffin, looks like he's trying to sabotage your channel 😁
I agree!
Just think, Captain Beefheart had to lock trained musicians in a shack and torture them psychologically for months to make music that sounded like this.
I'm surprised you didn't burst out laughing sooner. Another reaction channel played this on April Fool's Day so I listened only for your reactions. I have a headache 😫
The whole album's fire, so bad it's good! "Better than the Beatles, even today" ~ Frank Zappa. Frank said it was his third favorite album of all-time.
Frank Zappa must have been joking, but his fans took it literally.😂
@@a.k.1740 I don't know, he liked Gerry And The Holograms, at least he said he did.
@@a.k.1740 have you heard WE'RE ONLY IN IT FOR THE MONEY?
@@timfeeley714-25 Personally I have never taken any Frank Zappa statement at face value. Anyway Gerry and the Holograms is still relatively much better than The Shaggs!
@@joemaurone7923 Yes I did but it's definitely not my stuff !
In-A-Gadda-Da-Shaggs
Well Justin - you could always listen to Electro Swing. April Fool's to you! ✌
Who needs Zeppelin , Bon Jovi or Mahavishnu ?? We got Shaggs !!!!
This song made me cry
It's a good idea to read more about the story of The Shaggs and the bizarre story behind this record. For me it's not a case of "worst band ever" - it's what a group sound like when they have years of practice (not training), but no idea what music should sound like. I wouldn't say the results sound good, or course, but there are aspects - the way all the notes (vocals/instruments) are the same rather than harmonised, the half-repetition from the second vocalist, the drum solo at the end - I would say there are more ideas just in this song than in many other albums.
"Daddy what are all those instruments for"? Quiet, girls, if those damn hippies can make money off of terrible music. So can we"! So bad it's good. Peace & Love.
Frank Zappa called The Shaggs geniuses and said he thought they were better than the Beatles. He said it in earnest. Check out a few songs from their second (and last thankfully) album...particularly their cover of Yesterday once more. It is simplistically beautiful. (and sung mostly in tune).
You need to listen to the entire album
There are many covers of this song, but unless they get the drumming right and the guitars and vocals, this is the one I keep coming back to.
Oooh! The Raincoats next?
I'd be interested to see you react, in two side-long vids, to "Pictures Of Starving Children Sell Records", by Chumbawamba. you might be surprised
So incredibly incoherent it's special! Theres something to be said for so bad it's good.
Good gravy! Outsider Music by sisters who literally had no idea how to play music.
I feel like I'm going insane, listening to this song. What did Kurt Cobain possibly see in them?
Frank Zappa said it's one of his favorite bands and Kurt Cobain listed as his 5th favorite album! Both are into atonal music so I can see why they might enjoy it!
Involuntary rock
I'd say Regressive rock for my part, although "rock" is such a big word in that case !😉
@@a.k.1740 anti rock perhaps
@@Hartlor_Tayley Yes that's it.👍 I would go even further, it's close to anti-music😉
@@a.k.1740 “still better than the crap on the radio today” to quote a tired old cliché.
@@Hartlor_Tayley I couldn't confirm it because I haven't listened to the radio for more than thirty years!😉😀
It’s impressive how the drums are keeping the same beat all through the song. A beat that has nothing to do with the guitar and the singing.
Did you notice their thick as a hunk of fudge Boston or Massachusetts accents ? It's Halloween is another humdinger. This LP has more hits than the Gambino family. How about some classic Rodd Keith or Gene Evans, MSR song poems or Lucia Pamelas In Outer Space ? BJ Snowden ?? I know we're all thinkin Daniel Johnston's Hi How Are You , right ? RIGHT !
That was the best worst band I have ever heard!
Can someone point me to a corner of the internet where the shaggs are appreciated. I’m sick of all these reviews that just treat it like a joke. They always think these girls were stupid and that they, the reviewer, are so much better at music and blah blah blah. It’s a masterpiece. Where can it be treated like one?!?!?!?!
Wow ! Justin, wouldn't you be a little masochistic these days in your musical listening?🤔 The Shaggs managed to do worse than the Velvet Underground, and this is not an easy task!🤣
I absolutely concur!
Except that the velvet underground are one of the greatest band ever 😊
@@tuskact4overheaven873 Well, if you say so! I'm not going to upset you.😏
@@a.k.1740 you alredy did with other comments so it's not possible to do worse 🙃. Jokes aside, the velvet underground were an extremely ""poor"" band (they weren't the flamboyant conservatory freaks like emerson or others and they didn't need to be like that) making ""poor"" music, besides that their influence, lyrics AND compositions inspired 50/60% of the bands that came after while also having monstrous intuitions that spawned some genres DECADES in advance (noise, punk, industrial, post-punk, dream pop, gothic rock ecc ecc) , that's a sign of musical genius as far a my opinion is concerned. So regarding the VU as a shitty band is completely wrong in basically every level (taste asides of course).
Ps
I am not even the only one that says this, the (almost) entirety of musical critique agrees on this topic (also in my little, a lot of people that made the conservatory and I know loves the velvet underground, so are you sure they just sucks?).
@@tuskact4overheaven873 I've never trusted music critics or so-called music luminaries. I trust my ears alone and they tell me that the velvet is a monumental fraud.
Ah you actually went there!!!! 😆😆😆😆😆
There are some prominent musicians who cite the Shaggs, but I think their best trait is totally deconstructed music. It's like they had no idea what music was. This is what a baby would think music is, without cultural referents.
Foot Foot is their cat.
If you want to hear another "so bad it may actually be good" song, check out the Turtles "Umbassa and the dragon." The difference between the Shaggs and the Turtles is, of course, that the Turtles were real singers, musicians, and songwriters and "Umbassa" was not typical of their songs.
Even Emerson, Lake & Palmer had to start somewhere, and we all know how that turned out!
This album reminds me of Malta
They just want Foot Foot to come home.
I guess you'll be reacting to the rest of this album then. You have to admit though, that the prediction did come true since here you are, reacting to it and we're commenting!. I suppose you could see this as a form of abstract creativity? 🙃 I'd heard this before, so was looking forward to your reaction...twas as expected.😊
Well I enjoyed this anyway. No JP, don't take up the suggestion: Captain Beefheart's 'Trout Mask Replica' will not go down well with you. I think you would enjoy Shiny Beast though.
This is the wrong track to start with. You should try "Who Are Parents?" instead. It was used as the outro to the film "Ken Park" and I honestly thought it was an obscure 90s indie band responsible. All the off centre and random vocal lines against a steady drum beat do actually coalesce into a fascinating style which sounds very contemporary. I think that is where the "accidental genius" comes in.
They do say however that if you superimpose and phase the instrumentals on this album and have some ranting male voice shouting over them you end up with an album called "Trout Mask Replica". Which ironic as that seems to have been put together in a more extreme form of what happened with these girls.
I do suggest a reaction to that track as it is something special.
Nope nope nope. The Magic Band, and Beefheart, could really play. They were choosing to play like that, and Samuel Andreyev has an amazing analysis of 'Frownland', the opening track and the most out-there track musically. There's a similarity though: The Shaggs got forced into playing by their Dad, and the Magic Band got bullied by Beefheart, who took all their credit. But their musical abilities were very, very different, as was the effort involved. Now you've got me wondering what off Trout Mask would likely get to JP in a positive way: I don't think Frownland would work, just too intense and can't be remotely grasped on a first listen.
@@airwindows I was joking. Yes I have heard all the isolated tracks and everything but first impressions remain first impressions.
@@airwindows I think he should go straight into "Pena" and have done with it.
I have listened to this album twice, and will listen to it many more times. I do admit my drumming at 15 back in 1990, with no lessons was better. My mom's piano playing would have fit right in. She had 7 years of lessons and was still not good.