Just as Devil May Cry 5 released.. he disappeared... Many games released since then in much need of sinning... Now he's returned and I believe he can sin them all.
That's mainly because the original god of war Areas was always a prick as much as the other gods (except hades he had legitimate reason to be mad) and they just screwed with Kratos first and he was just fighting back and later just wanted a normal simple life Abby killed the main character in the first game because her father died to Joel and then helps a bunch of tribal kids and starts shooting her own people for said tribal kids she just met while we saw and witness all the Bullcrap jeol goes through just to be a father again and Abby ruin it
So Abby just gets to be fatherless because joel was becoming a father again? What a shit reason to dislike a character. Abby shouldn't lose her father because joel is gaining a "daughter" or any analogous Joel shouldnt get to be a dad again if it requires that some else's is taken away. So he had to suffer consequences for his action.
@@symbioticspiderman4 Joel didn't save Ellie to become a father again you empty twat, he save her because its the right thing to do, also what the consequence of Abby killing Joel since you are such a sweetheart who look for accountability?
@@symbioticspiderman4 Abby’s father was going to dissect a unconscious young girl without bothering to give her consent or say in the matter, regardless of his excuses and if he feels bad doing that doesn’t change the fact he and the rest of the fireflies didn’t even consult Ellie on the issue or even care about it which makes them absolute shitty people. And there wasn’t even a guarantee it would’ve worked so Ellie could’ve died for nothing and should’ve been told this, and it's already a dumb idea to immediately kill her, you’d think they keep her alive as much as possible and spend a year or so to study and research her unique ability and possible find a way to replicate it without killing her and if not, having a better idea of the thing would be better then just immediately kill your one specimen. So yeah he and the other fire files can go to hell.
The whole “joel was softened” thing doesnt even make sense Daryl Dixon didnt start trusting everyone randomly just because he took care of Judith, he stayed cautious, and would do whatever he could to stay alive Joel is like Daryl but dial that to 11, so he would stay as cautious as possible, but more so because of what he did
Hell Joel was like this before Sarah died, when they pass a family he tells Tommy to keep driving and when Tommy claims they have a kid Joel responds “So do we.”. Yes he says “Someone else will come along” but it shows what Joel prioritizes above all else.
Apparently joel got softened in jackson... but not in the flashbacks... and apparently jackson had the exact opposite effect on ellie who turns into ted fucking bundy
Daryl did end up giving a gun to that one stranger that was with two women and the guy ended up stealing Daryl’s crossbow and bike And later on killed Denise
I remember playing as Abby in the Ellie boss fight and letting Ellie kill Abby like ten times hoping it was some sort of secret happy ending. Man was I wrong.
I think the biggest problems with the writing come down to a few things: (1) Joel was killed off too early in the game. Nothing wrong with killing him off, but the timing doesn't work. With Joel dead right at the beginning, we can't explore the relationship between Joel and Ellie except through a bunch of flashbacks, which drag the story down and make it feel too slow and aimless. Hunting Joel down (or playing as Joel while being hunted) could have been used as a source of tension / rising action for a large chunk of the story. (2) Speaking of "slow and aimless", those words also describe like the first 2/3 of Abby's plotline. Giving Abby a more tightly written narrative, with more direct relevance to the rest of the plot, might have made more players empathize with her instead of actively trying to sabotage her during the Abby/Ellie fight. (3) As you point out in the video, Ellie's immunity should have mattered more. It essentially became a peripheral element of the story, when it's supposed to be the entire reason why Ellie is such an important character to begin with. This strikes me as a huge "Chekhov's Gun" problem. The few characters who are aware of Ellie's immunity just *talk* about it, but it never really has a tangible payoff, or any impact on the rising action at all.
Points 2 and 3 are fine but your first point _is trash._ Killing Joel at the beginning is totally fine because it justifies Ellie leaving the safety and paradise of Jackson to go kill a bunch of folks _so that we can have a game._ Furthermore, if they killed _anyone_ else it wouldn’t have an impact. Anyone who says “killing Joel at the beginning is bad writing” is a cope. Just be honest and say his death was so upsetting that it ruined the game for you. I would respect that. You want Joel to die exactly like high honor Arthur Morgan- at the end of the game, looking at the sunset- but instead the writers took an actual risk🤷♂️
@@durodesduvo8424 That take makes no sense. Joel’s death felt like complete bullshit at the beginning of the game. We aren’t saying he has to commit due at the end like Lee Everett, just maybe give Joel and Ellie’s father/daughter relationship more active screen time to present more well-written pacing and THEN maybe kill him so that Ellie can begin actually having a justification to start the game and not make every flashback feel like filler content that doesn’t do much for anyone. By the way, a lot of people say argue the argument and not the person, but why the hell is it cope to call out gameplay that cuts to “Star Wars Sequels” level flashbacks that a bunch of people didn’t like to see for more than a quick 3 second showing of a father/daughter type relationship? Trick answer: it’s not. Cope with it.
@@IamtheSpy2005 are you nuts? for me the Ellie flashbacks were great because we got more Joel screentime through memories. Especially since we thought he was gone forever, it was nice to see him again. It was good for tonal variety because was a nice break from the revenge campaign which has a consistent depressing tone throughout. The Ellie flashbacks did something that I thought was clever, which was reveal information that makes you question the characters thought process when you thought you understood them already. When Joel is killed we think that Ellie has no idea what he did at the firefly hospital, and we expect Ellie to learn about it during her quest. So when we learn that she knew _why_ Joel was killed and other context from the flashbacks, it changes the reason for revenge. Before we thought this was revenge for killing Joel- but the truth is that Ellie is doing this out of the guilt she feels for ending their relationship over differences and not treasuring the time they had left. Anyway you don’t have to like it, but Joel dying is the only catalyst that makes sense for this game. Who else could they kill? Dina? Tommy? Nobody would give a fuck. The other option would be Jackson getting attacked I guess… better than your idea to have an even more drawn out start to the game with Joel and Ellie hanging out, no rising action, or tension at all. The funniest part about you fools complaining about Joel dying is that *this is exactly how the first game started,* the only difference is that we’re more invested in the character. Joel’s daughter dies in an unfair, bullshit way and now we get to experience what felt in the second game.
@@durodesduvo8424 sure Joels daughter died, but the motives and level of cruelty are completely different. You cannot call them "exactly the same". Even Joel killing Jeffrey and Marline was less cruel than how Abby killed Joel. This isnt even to mention how well the players already know Joel so its a completely seperate situation other than "early character death" its an incomparable story start. Also the order of events with how Joel was killed off should have been layed out differently. Market the game completely from Abby's perspective. Dont even show Ellie and Joel anywhere and sell it as a "seperate story". If you HAVE to play as Abby. Begin the game from Abby's perspective then slowly reveal details to have the player realize who these people are. Then kill off Joel. Boom sympathy built on Abby with no negative stigma to begin with, and less players starting the game off pissed, and complicated emotions over the events of TLOU1.
The problem with Druckmann is his growing inability to compartmentalize his writing and his personal politics. Really great writers can subtly sprinkle in some of their beliefs to compliment the story intelligently, leaving the audience to reach their own conclusions with context clues. Druckmann doesn’t really have subtlety. He just throws something in your face and then gets angry when you don’t understand the point of it. He does this when it doesn’t even fit the scene sometimes. Alot of the scenes in this game just felt really jumbled and like they had no flow to them. Just a bunch of patchy fragments thrown into no particular order and running with it.
@@carloszestyboy2901 I agree. The whole Lev as a trans person storyline feels so disconnected from Ellie and Abby's conflict. Ellie ironically as a lesbian never learns that Lev is Trans or that Lev also suffered bigotry for it. Because to Ellie Lev is someone that almost killed her girlfriend and is helping the murderer of her surrogate father. Ellie understanding Abby has nothing to do with the understanding Lev and Abby share and that understanding Abby has with Lev has nothing to do with Lev being Trans. It just such a forced story. If Lev is skilled in combat than Lev's gender or dead name means nothing. Because Abby doesn't care about any of that and neither does Joel care that Ellie is gay. Druckman obviously doesn't care about what makes sense story wise for a game about fighting flesh eating monsters.
You got to remember that, introspection is for those with a guilty conscious and Abby was written to not have one. Abby doesn't have an introspection moment when Ellie kills her friends because Abby doesn't see Ellie's quest for revenge and her quest for revenge as the same. Abby convinsed herself that Joel was just a murderous psycho path that killed her father and sees Ellie the same way for killing her friends, not as a daughter trying to avenge a father figure but a psychopath just out to kill. When Abby killed Joel, he was just another psychopaths like the ones she was known for killing, and absolved herself of guilt of killing him. If they truely wanted a "revenge is bad" message, then Abby shouldn't act like her revenge was justified and Ellie's is not.
Translation: Abby is like "Why did you have to go on revenge?! Only I am allowed to have it! ME! Why would you want to kill me when I horrifically traumatized you" She doesn't realize that Ellie coming for her all ties back.. to her. Because only ABBY's revenge is justified in this game according to the writers.
And notices how in the game Abby never learns that the real reason Ellie came after her was bc she killed Ellie’s father figure, same as Ellie never learns that the real reason Abby killed Joel was bc he killed her father? It’s bc if either of them learns the truth, it would shatter the weak foundation this whole game is built on and the story will make even less sense than they already do if they keep trying to kill each other. But ND NEEDS them to keep trying to kill each other so Ellie and Abby just conveniently never learns the truth even though there’s like 100 times where they could’ve lmfao
@@GloomyNooby This is only partially true. Both could get a basic idea of why the other is out for revenge. Ellie learns that Abby ties back to the Fireflys, and Abby knew Ellie tied back to Joel because she was there for his death. Really, even if Abby was to learn the whole truth, it wouldn't change much about her point of view. Abby would still see Joel as just the psycho path that killed her dad. Ellie is the only one to take the information as earth shaking.
@@travisb.honest2438 I disagree, imo both learning the truth will at least change their motivation somewhat because then Abby will realize that Joel was doing something that Jerry probably would’ve done if Abby was the one immune, and Ellie would’ve realize that Abby did something that Ellie herself is doing right now seeking revenge as a heartbroken daughter
Another thing about the game I hated was that killing Joel didn’t even affect Abby at all for the rest of the game. We don’t know if she felt bad or good about it for the rest of the game. It didn’t even matter except for plot for her and Ellie to fight.
Abby is a narcissistic sociopath who is incapable of even understanding the idea of someone else caring for the victim of her actions and wanting revenge like she did. That is how far removed she is of basic human rational.
no you could definitely tell that abby believed killing joel would’ve given her the closure she thought she needed but she didn’t feel better after joels death she almost felt worse
You obviously didn’t pay attention to the fact that nightmares about her dad still plagued her and she wasn’t getting sleep even after Joel’s death. Stop streaming the game on twitch and play it yourself and pay f***ing attention
The biggest example I have to disprove the Joel got soft theory is the literal start of the first game. Joel was basically living in paradise and decides not to help out a family with kids on his way out. Why would he help abby?
hes been living in Jackson for a while now and they have a policy of bringing people in to see if theyre on the level, but i agree joel wouldve kept his wits about him, either not surrounding himself with strangers or not giving names (but tbf tommy did that). they shouldve had him or tommy get injured during the escape, something small enough to not gun it back to jackson but big enough to make it so they couldnt fight back as well and needed medical supplies to get back to jackson (something like a sprained ankle or a bad cut, not something he'd die over or need immediate medical help, but big enough to need to rest)
Welp, there you have it, folks. A game y'all have waited a long time to get a true and proper "Sin" Video on. One of the best reaction videos I have personally seen. Now rewind it, watch it all over again and take notes on how to write games, books, movies, etc. for yourselves. Get this man some views!
One, every Gaming Sins Video has been, more or less, tongue in cheek. Two, everybody (including GCN) forgets that UNTIL Jackson, Joel lived in military controlled quarantine zones where nobody could relax in any way; and now, he has been living in an actual city again for several years where people inside the walls CAN relax and be somewhat comfortable again.
@@Joe_Okey four, with zombies and shamblers that they had to kill in the flashbacks; five, joel went soft is like veteran be able to sleep well when someone blows the whistle after just five years; six, you,more or less, tongue in cheek.
@@PedroSCP No the issue is NEIL CUCKMAN is a far LEFTIST WOKE liberal that's the problem . Those people can't help themselves , they think that normal people are interested in their NEO MARXIST, lets hate the west, lets hate white people, lets hate men nonsense.
42:10 Critics who defend this game assume the cure was going to work make ZERO sense. The foundation of this war between Abby and Ellie is beyond stupid.
The fact that Naughty Dog decided to take a giant shit on Ellie and Joel's relationship while also shoving Abby down our throats was the main reason I hated the game so much.
@@helstein I also liked the world, and it's also the first peice of the whole zombie media thing to actually attribute the zombie virus to an actual real world virus. I liked how dark and gritty the world, and the characters. But one of the things I liked the most, was that they actually SHOWED the zombie outbreak happening in real time. I think this is the most important aspect to show the viewer in a zombie piece of media, and most zombie genres don't even show this, which is infuriating. It's a breath of fresh air to see it in tlou1. And they showed it so realistically. It was downright scary with how realistic it was. The time jump of twenty years is great. It skips straight to the most interesting part, which is the actual post apocalypse. It doesn't focus on a few months after, or any of that shit, like most in media. Because tbh, after the initial outbreak, nothing really happens after that. Its just the protag staying in groups and shit. The military or at least a provincial government is just non existent for some reason, which is just downright unrealistic. The world in other zombie genres also doesn't give enough time for other civilizations or factions to arise from the dust, because they mostly taking place after the initial outbreak. Walking dead was really bad at this, and the majority of others. The thing thats good about tlou, is that when it skips it just shows a montages of newsreels as the years go by, which mentions the severity of the outbreak after, mentioning riots, death count, rising factions, cure attempts etc, which is already more realistic than most zombie apocalypse material in the media. Most zombie shows and shit need to learn that that just because a significant outbreak happened, it doesn't automatically equal a post apocalypse world. It usually takes time for humanity to be brought to the brink obviously, especially when it comes to pandemic. Tlou understood this, and that's why I like it. The masterful storyline and characters just make it fucking better.
The fact that everyone is constantly coming up with objectivity better versions of the Last Of Us 2 story is a testament to how much Naughty Dog took an L
3:15 Dartigan said it best: I don't feel bad when I kill people in video games, can the developers not try to make me feel like a monster when I do the one thing their game forces me to do in order to complete it?
THIS! This game couldn't go one minute without trying to beat me in the head about how terrible a person I am for killing people who, may I remind you, were trying to kill me first and expect me to feel bad about it. At least some games like Deus Ex or Dishonored had the decency to give me options where I didn't have to bathe in blood so that when the game called me a monster they had a point because I had a CHOICE which this game clearly didn't care to give me.
Said it before I will say it again. Metal Gear Solid has done this concept perfectly. From the 2nd game, all the way to the 5th, you DONT have to kill a single person or creature if you choose so. Not even the bosses, who are deserving of death. The only difference is, Kojima and Konami didnt shove your bloodlust in your face. The closest that happens is Venom Snake gets bloody as fuck and you cant wash off. Thats it.
bruv… I know I’m late but did you not play tlou pt 1? it’s made very clear that Joel is not innocent and has killed/hurt many people to survive, and not necessarily through defense. It’s why he knew the hunters were going to ambush him and Ellie after Bill’s town.
Let's all take our time to appreciate the amount of time this man takes to make these videos. He could just be a weekly sins videos but he takes time to really look at these games and analyze them to sin them properly. Bravo GCN, Bravo
@@captaintony1227 i used to like them equally but I just found Dartigan’s sins more lame over time. At least with GCN’s sins if they’re lame, they become pretty funny with his delivery so GCN >>>> Dartigan. Also I like how for the older Walking Dead games he took every path to sin everything equally
Thank you! Finally! Someone else who says what I've been saying for years. Everyone is always hung up on "They killed Joel." The fact that anyone would believe he'd survive this game is just confusing to me. I'm more concerned with how they killed Joel. It wasn't emotional, it wasn't built up properly, none of it! It's character assassination at its worst. Joel a one man army, a man who murdered hundreds of people in the first game some of which posed no threat to him, just walked in a room full of strangers without a care in the world. It's just ridiculous. I can't even say it was shocking because there's only reason for them to have in Jackson looking for a man. They thought they were being clever and smart but in reality it was just such basic story telling it had me rolling my eyes.
Whenever the first trailer dropped for this game and we saw Joel talking to Ellie, literally everyone was predicting that Joel was already dead and that Ellie was seeing him in hallucinations. Also everyone thought Abby was Ellie's mother lol.
You don’t know what character assassination is and weren’t paying attention. Joel saving Abby at the start isn’t really out of character, they’re on patrol and looking for travelers and taking out infected, it’s just called common fucking courtesy which jackson has been able to allow. Second, Joel never gave out his name, that was all tommy who is naturally the more trusting of the brothers, and thirdly Joel was Surrounded with no cover, he was dead the second he walked into that room.
To this day, I am convinced that the awards were paid off by Sony. There is no other reason why The Last Of Us Part II should ever have gotten "best music" over *DOOM ETERNAL* despite the soundtrack being droning drums and slow pluckings of the guitar strings.
Yeah. That showing of a video game awards show plummeted my respect for those kinds of shows. That was 100% a agenda or pay off from Sony to get TLoU2 all those awards. Absolute BS and now I wont support that kind of shit ever again. Made me lose a fat amount of respect from Naughty Dog too.
The Game Awards are the same type of shitty political shills you can find in all of media. It is an event sponsered by the same shitty companies that release the games! Player vote is only about 10% of the final scores, and it is about 50% "Political Agenda" and 40% "Who paid the most to get an award".
@@thatguy1080 I don't think they were paid off by sony, it came out during a time of mass protests, riots etc and all of this anti hate stuff so I feel like they felt if they didn't give it the win, twitter would have a field day and they just didn't wanna deal with it lol
I feel like the writers for this game were teenage girls that spend too much time on Twitter. I swear there was no respect for the first game at all. At least let me play Ellie the whole game. Why would you throw away that perfect formula you nailed in the first game? Just baffles me how bad it is.
The fact that this game got Game of The Year despite having no real reason to have received it makes me wonder if this industry is nothing more than a brand recognition competition. Ghost of Tsushima or Doom Eternal deserved the award.
@@doncheadlegaming7521 I disagree. Ghost of Tsushima story wasn't nearly as good as people were making it out to be. Khan was an absolute idiot the entire game. The gameplay I do agree with
This. Your take on joel's death and how you would describe his character and personality is absolutely perfect. Couldn't have worded it better. I 100% agree
Look at where he has been living for several years compared with where he lived BEFORE that. Everybody (including GCN) forgets that UNTIL Jackson, Joel lived in military controlled quarantine zones where nobody could relax in any way (thanks to said military being in charge of EVERY aspect of your life, including whether you got full rations or not and when and where you were assigned to work; and now, he has been living in an actual city again for several years where people inside the walls CAN relax and who grow and raise their own food. Also, the story EXPLICITLY mentions that people come through that city on a fairly regular basis. So, YES, everybody INCLUDING Joel could start feeling a little more relaxed again and have a basis for helping strangers also.
@@Joe_Okey "you can't teach an old dog new tricks". Even if he lived with people for a couple of years and became relaxed does that erase all of the experience he acquired before? Hell no. That was a dangerous situation and Abby was a random person. To go out of their way and waste time to save her in that situation without a safe way to escape is BEYOND STUPIDITY. Someone as experienced and coldblooded as him doing that without any pressure from the side like Ellie begging him or something like that? No. It would've been more believable if he spent DECADES in that town. But several years? No, not that much, that's for sure.
@@Joe_Okey This is a joke. I had a roommate who was a Marine in Afghanistan and Iraq. He NEVER let his guard down. My current roommate was in the Navy and he always looks behind him when walking his dog or walking to his truck. Both of these men left the military YEARS ago and still act this way. Your excuse for Joel's actions in Last of Us 2 makes absolutely no sense. Joel was writing terribly plain and simple.
01:12:00 What's worse is Abby doesn't even acknowledge how she manipulates and lies to her friends for her own benefit. In fact doesn't show any form of remorse over that.
Because she was born many years after the world fell apart and every post apocalyptic story shows that humanity’s worst is brought out of them. Respectfully, I feel like you’re reaching with this comment
@@urbiznesnunuv6938 But this game is literally in the fuckin' apocalypse... @ComicWriter2020 Doesn't really seem like reaching when it happens to be true. She was born about 6 years or so after the apocalypse. You wouldn't be able to fully grasp what life was like before (entirely) so you'd be confused on a lot of things.
OH MY GOD IM SO HAPPY! IVE BEEN WAITING FOREVER FOR THIS! Lowkey someone should also record their entire gameplay and then chop it all up and edit it to how the game should’ve been laid out
The writing and dialogue in this game is so ridiculously cringe. It’s like an LA hipster’s zombie apocalypse fantasy where people talk and act like it’s 2020 America but theres zombies
Thats why we are getting a tlou3. Where the player will be able to switch between abby and ellie on the fly! Open world story driven game with side quests and world building with deeper rpg elements!!!!!
Straight up the best game sins channel you have tons of personality and feel like you've come into your own thing rather than just copying cinema sins and making videos you want to instead of pandering to views
The fireflies rushing Ellie into surgery to murder her without consent 100% justifies Joel's decision. This makes Abbys revenge plot really dumb. Any sane person would feel conflicted if their parent was complicit in the attempted murder of a child. The fact Abby lacks this sort of empathy makes her an awful character. Last of us 1 was amazing due to Joel and Ellie, removing either be of them ruins it.
No. See.... I disagree. Joel in fact did know that Ellie would have wanted to give herself up for the cure if he meant taking her life. You know this primarily because when Marlene confronts him about him about it, you see Joel unable to hide his expression that Ellie would in fact have wanted to die at that hospital. But yet Joel killed Marlene anyway. Because for him it wasn't about saving the world. He couldn't give too shits. He wanted Ellie. He never tried to justify himself by saying you're taking away her ability to choose because he didn't give a shit about that. Also if we're going to say Abby is an awful character because she lacks empathy. Then what exactly does that make Ellie? Ellie decided to kill Abby's friend because Joel decided to murder her dad and other fireflies members. So how the hell can you hold Abby to a standard you don't hold Ellie to? If thats the case is Ellie an awful character as well?
@@SuperMurray2009 First of all you are completely wrong. Joel does not know what Ellie wants, no more than the fireflies know what Ellie wants. He might suspect she would give her life but that's not enough to sit back and just let her be killed without her consent. Especially after she promised to go anywhere with Joel after seeing the fireflies, indicating she had not planned on dying. So that's your first point refuted. Secondly the game makes it clear that there is zero guarantee that they can even make a cure, all attempts had failed so far, so to say Joel is damming the work is also wrong. Third, once Abbys dad decided to rush a child into surgery to kill her on the small chance of a vaccine, then you reap what you sow, the fireflies are not the good guys here, they are as grey as Joel. They kept a kid sedated, didn't wake her to explain the situation, they didn't ask her to if she wanted to give her life, they didn't let her say goodbye, they rushed her into surgery. That's barbaric. Finally, as to your point about Ellie and her empathy, I've just watched a compilation of her killing Abbys friends, she kills most of them after they try to attack her instead of giving her info, leaving her no choice. That's far more than what those awful people gave Joel! Did you even play the game or did you just fap to Abby all the time? Abby is an awful character that Naughty Dog tried to manipulate people into liking. It only worked on simpletons... Like you. Abby stans are the weirdest.
@@user-Marrk 1. You can't just say I'm completely wrong without providing and proof or context? How exactly am I wrong? You don't provide any. You just say no I'm right you're wrong. Joel does in fact know what Ellie wants because litrerally Joel tells Ellie that she doesn't have to go though with the fireflies and they can ditch it all together. But Ellie declines and says wants to see the journey through. On top of that... if you watch the scene with Marlene and she accusing Joel of knowing what Ellie wants, you can actually see Joel's facial expression turn into guilt. That facial expression in itself was more than evidence to conclude that their was somewhat conflict in Joel's decision making. 2. But nothing is guaranteed. How far down the rabbit hole do you even wanna go with this? It's not guaranteed that they even make it to the fireflies, it's not guaranteed that fireflies even know what the do with cure. It was always a risk. The game heavily implies that Joel doesn't give a shit anyway about what would have happened to said cure If it meant that Ellie would be killed in the process. If you wanna use the excuse that their is no guarantees than why even bother taking her to the fireflies after Jackson anyway then? You would be trying to refute the whole plot of the third act of the game. 3. You're right. It is Barbaric to rush a child into surgery. And the fireflies are grey just like Joel. However the point of the matter is ...The game heavily implies that Joel is again somewhat aware the Ellie would have probably gave herself as a sacrificial pawn for the cure. So this is that area where Joel is still also in the wrong because he killed Marlene when she literally offered to forgive him and let it all go in the end but he shot her anyway. 4. Wait what? How in the hell is all your friends getting killed somehow alot more tamer than one organization killing one man? Do you even hear the foolishness coming from your mouth? They'll killed one guy and spared rest of the people in your crew. When they literally didn't have to. First off your ignoring the fact that Ellie kill Nora in cold blood. And it's somehow it's supposed to be less empathetic even though Ellie holds her friends at gun point with murderous intent? Like you are doing some heavily level mental gymnastics to support your case. So yeah you're points are extremely flawed and you too busy reiterating Skill up Talking points to support your case in the time of need to bash the game when you lack even proper context. Like you literally just admitted to watching a compilation of Ellie killing Abby's friends. So if anything that points to you not actually playing the game.
@@user-Marrk He did know. That's why he lied about what happened. HOW could you not get this after beating the game? Marlene told Joel this is what she wants and Joel never denied it.
@@SuperMurray2009 I told you in the first few lines how you were wrong, because no one knows what Ellie wants cos no one woke her up! You're a raving Abby Stan, probably on the spectrum so I ain't wasting my time responding to your delusions 😂😂
Nothing wrong with personal preference, the real problem with this game is purposefully getting a reaction out of all of everyone. That is not how writing should be, writing is basically like playing god, how you write it literally tells the world who you really are, even if your plan for your story was to get a reaction from the viewers & consumers.
I feel like you could have sinned one time more when Tommy ambushes Abby, 1) for not just shooting her straight away, and 2) the fact that Yara just teleported to save Abby remember it was only Abby and Manny who chased Tommy, then Yara suddenly shows up out of nowhere.
@@urbiznesnunuv6938 ok dipshit except you seem to have forgotten the fact that it was tommy who surprised Abby, and instead of shooting her he just tries to slap her with the gun and the game is filled with similar scenarios, something you should know when you try to defend something you fucking asshat.
@@ElementVoidX yeah lemme just shoot someone with a rifle when I’m blinded by hatred and want them to suffer the same way they hurt my brother. Ever notice Ellie shoots Abby to stun her in death scenes before killing her while she’s begging? We’ve literally seen tommy torture people in the city already. Shut the fuck up and learn to connect the dots, I can’t do it for you.
@@urbiznesnunuv6938 no you can't cause you can't even connect them, have you forgotten he shot at them when you were chasing him? or are you just a retarded troll who have not even played the game? also wtf does Ellie have to do with what Tommy is doing? you are just spewing shit out of your ass, try to look up the Dunning-Kruger effect, that is what you are suffering from, Tommy never said he wanted her to suffer he tortured the 2 people to get through the gate which again don't even make sense, not that it matters in this shit game, the only fans of this piece of trash are people like you who are fooling yourself into believing this is a good game, fuck out of here.
same, i hate this trope like, you killed for so much less, so many times before. just on the way there she killed a dozen plus people, and especially that in this world, you cant take a trip to the toilet without having to kill a handful of people or infected there wasnt even a good reason to forgive them
The fact that a lot of your major points are things I brought up reveals the fact that this game deserves much more valid criticism than others. People keep talking about what Joel did. Unlike Abby, Joel doesn't attempt to prolong the suffering of others, especially without a purpose. Unlike Abby Joel can feel some remorse. Abby is just stubborn.
Wow! It's just eyes opening. When I played the game, I felt like going through the motions, especially the parts with Abby and wanting her to die on purpose. But after seeing this, I understand how many details I just ignored, that bugged me inside. Thank you, man. Now I get why I hated the story so much.
@@gangg1762 nah he admitted to seeing facts which he already knew were true and he felt tlou2 supporters are like rats and facts are like light to them anytime facts are spitten they scurry away and hide back into their rat hole
18:30 It's so lazy that the game fails to explore Ellie's friendship with Dina. All we see is them do is go from friends to lovers after smoking weed. And that's only because from my interpretation at least Dina wants to pull Ellie out of her emo shell and she finds Ellie attractive. That's a weak setup for the two to become life partners and parents to Jesse's child after going on a dangerous mission that is only personal to Ellie and Tommy. It would have made more sense if we saw Ellie become more and more depressed as time passed because Joel refused to apologize for lying. This would worry Dina but also move her emotionally to connect with Ellie on a deeper level leading to romance. Instead all we get is the flashback later in the game of them making out. That starts a fight between the bigot that Tommy's wife Maria forces to apologize to Ellie and Joel protecting Ellie from Mr. Bigot's abuse. Also why Mr. Bigot is upset the surrogate daughter of one of the most powerful residents of Jackson is kissing another girl in public when both protect Jackson from danger is so mind numbingly stupid it makes Joel stupidly giving personal information to Abby's group seem highly intelligent like Iron Man building a nano tech suit. This fight leads to Ellie partially forgiving Joel after Joel gives a partial apology due to both of them getting kicked outside the dance hall. Which has zero connection to Dina other than Joel encouraging Ellie to start a romantic relationship with her. This makes Neil Druckman's anger towards Joel (as represented through Manny) more confusing. In Joel's short time in Last of Us 2, Joel saves Abby, supports Ellie, is pro LGBT by fighting Mr..Bigot, monitors the patrols to protect Ellie, an expert tracker and navigator which gives Ellie the best birthday gift ever and is an accomplished musician. Yet Druckman...I mean Manny says pendejo after he spits on Joel. And what great things does Manny do in this game...treat women as sex objects...and worry about his sick father...and make stupid jokes. Wow that resume totally compares to Joel's resume. (Sarcasm). It makes me so invested in Manny's friendship with Abby. (Sarcasm). Basically Last of Us 2 is lazy at building relationships between characters whereas that was the best part of Last of Us 1. It made fighting to survive in a group more meaningful because you worried for the other characters.
Another point with the doctor, not even the same skin color. and there was never any mention or implication of any kids besides Ellie being anywhere in the area let alone IN the hospital. Her whole existence was just fabricated and shoehorned in to explain it away and they failed horribly. I would have believed it more if it was just the daughter of a random survivor or Firefly we kill throughout any of the other areas or something.
The guy in the second game also looks more put together and just in general looks like he walked off the set of a shampoo commercial, the guy in the first game looks honestly like crap (fitting look for being in a world like this) and could pass out at any moment.
i always felt odd about this story. Abby really is doing her own thing most of the storyline, with lev, and in fact, if it wasnt for Ellie's revenge plot, would have died due to the rattlers. So all Ellie actually achieved (bar killing all Abby's friends) was releasing Abby from being captured and letting her be free. So NOT going after Abby in Santa Barbara would have been a better choice. (never mind i didn't actually want to be ellie fighting abby by the end, i really didn't want to have to "kill" her, but had no chouce if i wanted to finish the game. End it after the theatre fight. much better.
What's even worse is that Ellie sacrificed her own family just to free Abby and not kill her. Now she's a piece of garbage because even though Joel lied to Ellie he never abandoned her. Yet Ellie abandoned Dina and JJ. Ellie is a horrible mom.
31:42 THANK YOU. So many Naughty Dog apologists were trying to justify this shit by saying it was to cover up spoilers. "But Infinity War did it! They showed the Hulk and instead it was Banner in Hulkbuster armor!" Yeah, except nobody went to see the Avengers solely because they saw Hulk in that scene. Meanwhile plenty of people, myself included, bought the Last of Us 2 because they were falsely made to believe by this trailer that we would get to see another chapter in Joel and Ellie's story. They knew that was what the fans were after and that it would sell. And then they wondered why the game split the fanbase in two.
Infinity War was about all the Avengers not just Hulk. Last of Us 2 trailer made it seem the game was about Joel and Ellie fighting the Fireflies. I actually thought Joel was a hallucination in the trailer though but even that was a lie too.
@@kaoridovani8284 Nope, he repeated verbatim what uncultured/basic reviewers and people who didn’t even play the game said. 🤦🏼♀️ Most people are just mad that they didn’t get a storybook ending and I think that scenario jars a lot of people’s psyche. It’s almost like if Bambi died at the end - that would leave a lot people feeling unsettled. Anyways, rant over - bye.
Sorry you have to dredge through the comments with us simpletons who simply are too uncultured to understand the deep philosophical undertones of this video game. Hopefully our foul stench doesn't rub off on you.
The RUclipsr “Macarb storytelling” has also done an amazing review over 3 hours talking about the plot and characters of this game in amazing detail, I recommend it!!
I was excited you finally made a video, but I’m only 10 minutes in and I’m getting triggered with flashbacks on how betrayed I felt when this game came out. Smh
That's brilliant that explains everything. The first game felt like a gritty action thriller. The second felt like a shitty teenage drama written by someone that failed English language at secondary school.
13:22 there is an alternative universe out there somewhere, where this is how the last of us 2 is written, and that is enough to put a smile on my face.
People kill me with what Joel did. Ellie was not ask if she wanted to give her life. They just throw her on the table . Then treated Joel like garbage after he got her there . There should have been a discussion between Ellie and Joel and the fireflies . Then they could have made a choose. Joel killed because they were after him. So did Ellie. The bound that Joel and Ellie developed was priceless. No one would allow someone to just kill off this child no matter what was at stake.
Exactly but idk ppl didn’t play the game 🙄 now ik how GCN felt bout tlou1 ravers (even tho in my mind its a top 10 game) ppl find any excuse to hype tlou2 everyone knows tht game was assssssss
Agree mostly but one thing - Isaac did have a meteorologist in the mountains doing 'a job for isaac' (Manny's scientist lover) so it is actually perfectly reasonable that they predicted the storm
13:06 And you know what's hilarious! Niel Druckman posted on Twitter expressing how much he loved Star Wars the Last Jedi, saying it was his favorite movie. Coincidence, I think NOT
The Last Jedi is a better written story than Last of Us Part II. It's not a great story but at least there's a little bit of logic in Last Jedi. Last of Us Part II is divorced from logic.
39:00 Abby is a hypocrite. Abby is a hypocrite. Joel saved your life and you still killed him to complete your vengeance. 😂 You're the real monster Abby.
@@Jillworrell22 Sorry I misunderstood your post. But I'm just stating down below why Abby frustrates me. Abby did screwed up things for less justifiable reasons than Ellie doing screwed up things. Ellie did not kill Jerry Anderson yet Abby's actions ruined Ellie's life. What's even worse is that Abby killed Joel in front of Ellie and ignored her crying and begging her to stop. Ellie warned most of Abby's friends to surrender and was forced to attack when they refused to surrender. Abby kills Jesse for no reason when Jesse didn't kill any of Abby's close friends nor was he interested in revenge. She doesn't even interrogate Jesse or order him to surrender. Ellie wanted to seek revenge alone. Abby manipulated her friends to go on a dangerous mission to get revenge. Abby never mentions nor says Joel saved my life. She never even contemplates Joel's final act. While Ellie is saddened that Jerry was dead and that his dream of curing the world from the cordyceps fungus is gone forever. Every time Ellie tries to wrestle with her own actions. Abby ignores her own actions but then has the audacity to lecture other people about their lack of morality. It's ridiculous.
The first Last Of Us was suppose to be a revenge story where Joel and Ellie are fleeing across the country from a vengeful Tess. But the people Druckman was working with convinced him that it doesn't make sense to have a revenge plot in a post apocalypse. Travel across a country that filled with hordes upon hordes of deadly zombies for pointless revenge. And yet, despite those hard facts, Druckman still went with a revenge plot in the sequel in a setting where a revenge plot wouldn't make sense. So this story already fails by just the concept alone. If Druckman wanted to write a revenge plot, he shouldn't have written a zombie post apocalypse in the first place. How the hell did someone who wrote a great story like the first LOU failed so miserably at writing a sequel? And even if that wasn't the case, the story itself is sloppy and just leaves a bad taste in your mouth.
because he did not write the story of TLOU, or he did at least not alone, Bruce Straley was a director in the first game but left after, so now there was no one to stop and say no to Cuckmann and his retarded ideas, and then we ended up with this piece of shit.
Simple, he was kept on a short leash and had others to veto his bullshit. For some reason the people in charge did not see fit to tighten his damn leash and add a muzzle.
I can't wait for the Last of Us 3. Where Abby travels across the zombie infected universe to get revenge on it and destroy that boogieman Ellie. What do you mean that's even more nonsensical? What do you mean spaceships wouldn't work in the apocalypse? What do you mean revenge in a zombie wasteland is dumb? Neil Druckman probably.
This. This comment right here is one. I've felt the same way since it's launch. As for that last comment/writing the sequel. It's because Neil was working with people that care, Neil seems to write story based off of what HE wants, so those folks who redirect Neil's writing changes, to now make a interesting story for US to enjoy. That's just my perspective though.
It will always astound me that both Abby and Ellie were in the same place at the same time. Abby was in the basement fighting the Rat King and Ellie was upstairs killing Nora.
9:00 what's an even better testament to this is that even prior to Sarah dying, Joel was even softer but if you watch/playthrough the scene where he, Tommy and Sarah are driving to town away from their home he literally refuses to give someone who was broken down a lift. He was extremely cautious even before the apocalypse
Literally my favorite RUclipsr makes a video after so long and it's over an hour long. I could never thank you enough. For entertaining me for so many years. Thank you for always delivering even though you don't make as many videos as you used to. At least I know whenever they come out they will always be in good quality. So please take as long as you want with the next couple. I cannot wait to see them. You have a great day good sir.
I like your head-canon story, but I feel like that'd take even longer than what we got. Personally, I feel like they should have written the story as a rescue mission. Instead of murdering Joel like a dog Abby could have dragged him to Seattle in an attempt gain a sort of "proper" justice at the hands of a court. It would create a consequence for Ellie and the groups effective invasion of a sovereign states territory (As the Seraphites wouldn't be present in this version) and would lead to a climactic final battle between two groups that believe the other unjustifiably attacked the other. It could even include the dual points of view between Ellie and Abby, which I thought was an interesting concept, but would been done as a 1-2 1-2 instead of the 1-1 2-2 we got. However, I do think that the game isn't that bad, especially with how it sets up a potential finale to the series; and I'm curious as to how you'd do that seeing how much thought you put into your head-canon rewrite.
Or how about make it even better get rid of Joel and Ellie from the story entirely focus on Abby being loyal to the WlF have her be saved by Lev and both start to grow attached to each other similar to what goes down in part 2, Abby then wants to broker peace between both WLF and SCARS, it goes bad because both factions can’t forgive each other and basically shows the cycles of violence of revenge while both Lev and Abby are stuck in the middle. Abby and Lev grow very attached and survive the destruction between both factions and Its then revealed Abby’s trauma with her dad dying at the hands of Joel as well as showing a cinematic of her seeing Joel unconscious just so in terms of plot makes it easier for her to identify Joel, the player doesn’t know if she’s gonna kill Joel or not but to then be revealed that she forgives Joel basically because the whole game she basically understands Joel’s position from her own relationship with Lev and because of what she’s witnessed throughout the game, the cycles of violence and revenge and that it caused the unnecessary destruction of 2 factions. Basically the whole journey throughout the game teaches Abby about forgiveness and what revenge can do to people.
This game was truly a blur. Literally took nothing from this other than the fact that they killed Joel off in the most corniest way. But this video pinpointed everything i felt.
@@leonpaelinck But she wasn't 100% sure and regardless she still enjoyed hanging out with Joel during the museum flashback. Also it's ironic Ellie gets to be mad at Joel but shouldn't Dina and JJ be mad at Ellie for leaving them?
Love your version of the plot. And how you made sure us players do understand that something will happen to Joel eventually but ND’s execution was horrible and that’s why people are mad. Still love the game but it could have been so much better.
the sky bridge was an extremely anxiety inducing section of the game for me. i don't know what was worse. not seeing the distant ground or seeing the distant ground.
DAMN! That whole rant from 0:01 to 2:49 is EXACTLY how I felt about this shitty-ass story from the start. Defenders of this game don't understand just how important Joel's relationship with Ellie is and they ruined that. He did NOT NEED to die for Abby to have her own story be developed.
@@Blackemperess Abby is one of the most bland and generic character I've ever seen. It's like the writers want Abby to be liked so much they made her one dimensional. That way people can see themselves in her or project their own opinions about her decisions to make concepts about the game such as trauma or forgiveness fit the story. Abby's such a bad character beyond killing Joel. 1. Abby doesn't even express obvious signs that Joel saved her life or even mentions that to Ellie. 2. Abby shows very little emotional connection to her friends. It's as if Abby is supposed to be similar to Joel at the beginning of the 1st game (loner with only Tess as a companion). This is stupid because all her friends are happy that Joel is dead and Abby only seems to care about Owen. 3. We see the backstory for Owen and Abby but its pointless. Because Abby and Owen aren't together and Abby brings nothing to the relationship. So it's unclear why Owen is even attracted to her. We understand why Abby is attracted to Owen tho. But because the relationship is one sided it just makes Abby look even more boring. 4. Abby's only defining trait is anger. That's it. Joel, Ellie and heck even Tommy based on his feelings about Joel's past actions in the 1st game have more diverse character traits than Abby. It makes Abby's immediate connection and chemistry with the two Scars/Seraphites seem so phony and just a tool to force the player to like Abby. Joel took a considerable amount of time to warm up to Ellie but Abby bonds with these two kids super quick even though their friends and family killed Abby's friends. Also Lev only mentions Abby's role as a scar killer once and Abby just says you're my people. Like what? That could have been a conflict explored throughout the game which would help the player learn more about Abby's personality. But no its just you're my people. 5. Abby falls into the dumb blonde white woman stereotype and due to her physique she falls into the dumb blond jock stereotype. She shows so little self awareness its confusing. A. She fails to understand that Ellie doesn't see her as a person but a Firefly obsessed with finding the cure and killing Joel in revenge for sabotaging the cure. B. Abby fails to understand that leaving someone alive can lead to you being victim to retaliation (this is why Joel killed all the Fireflies at the hospital) but Abby for some odd reason does this 3 times. The 1st time I will give Abby a break on. But the other TWO TIMES you left Ellie for no reason. C. Abby fails to understand how dangerous the Fireflies were and how dangerous the WLF are. She seems them as the heroes and everyone else as the feelings. D. She never considered her friends feelings at all throughout the entire game. Which makes Owen being in love with her even more stupid and makes his character look even worse. E. Abby is proven wrong about Owen being a dedicated WLF soldier but doesn't seem to care nor is she worried about abandoning her WLF friends and their families at all. Like Joel had to struggle with abandoning his old loner lifestyle because he didn't want to grow attached to Ellie. Yet Abby just abandons her WLF lifestyle with ease and never considers the consequences of doing such a radical change.
24:27 More sins: -Dina standing on the glass, shooting down at targets. -Falling through the glass, and not being catastrophically injured. Did she break bones? No. Fracture her skull? No. Spinal injury (which I have seen from much lesser falls)? HELL-to-the-NO. Those are higher-than-normal, vaulted ceilings. And she was standing above, adding to the height of her fall. I'd estimate that's a good 12+ feet, plus the thickness of the skylight emplacement (or whatever that is) which is another foot-and-a-half (at least), plus her height (5+ feet). That's around an 18 foot drop onto tiled, potentially concrete, floor.
Been a while since I watched your videos, I definitely see a change in how you sin games. I agree with many points you made, and that saddens me that the bond between Joel and Ellie was ruined so that Neil can push his CW-style story. Bruce Straley was right: The concept of revenge in a apocalyptic setting with infected around is illogical, yet Druckmann pushed the idea in the sequel versus sharing more of how Ellie's relationship with Joel, how she feels being immune and finding a cure. You'd think he would have continued the idea of the military or the Fireflies search for Ellie and Joel, not Abby.
And this is why no one can create proper response videos to GCN because unlike Dartigan and most other youtubers who mostly do story mode only sins and most of those sins are straight up cringe jokes or false information, these videos of GCN spit out straight facts. Kudos.
Yeah, the other Gaming Sins are TERRIBLE. I haven't watched one in years, so they may have gotten better, but goddamn they were so bad. Unfunny, dumb, cringey, just horrible videos
Has it really been four years since this game came out? Time flies. Long time coming. It’s funny how the alternate scenario GCN came up with for this game’s plot is similar to what I came up with. We’re all writers here. Tommy as our companion was a missed opportunity. Issac is the Hector Alcazar of this game.
And yet those that love the game like to hit us with the “you’re just salty that Joel died”. No. We saw it coming from miles away. It’s the HOW not the WHAT.
13:24 Holy shit. This. In one video, you've managed to come up with a more compelling story for Last of Us 2 than what Naughty Dog gave us that took 4 YEARS in the making. What the hell?!
Yeah, writers tend to do that when they do a second (and onwards) draft. TLOU2 is a rough draft presented as a final product, hence why it reads like rejected fanfiction. (Though it's foundation *is* based on Neil Druckmann's factually rejected fanfiction.)
Man, I think one of the WORST things in this game is the fact that Ellie sees an actual WORKING video game….. and DOESNT PICK IT UP! I wanted to shoot myself when I found out you couldn’t pick this up! (Also @GCN did you know you can teebag in this game? One of the VERY few good qualities in this retched piece🤦🏾♀️)
38:10 The fact that Ellie's fight with Abby doesn't take place at the Aquariam where Ellie has the advantage is the game arbitrarily deciding to protect Abby in order to make the player sympathize with Abby.
there is literally infinite number of ways to make your character "not die" when writing a story, if you really think that was the reason ellie doenst fight abby in the aquarium (weirdest complaint ive ever heard in my life btw) was to somehow protect abby then ya, you got autism my man.
@@OMGlvl86turtlepilot I said the game is forcing Ellie not to fight Abby at the aquarium. I never said Ellie chooses to avoid Abby at the Aquarium on purpose. How can you not understand what I wrote? 🤦♂️.
I was extremely disappointed with ending of the last of us part 2 but more so the whole story. The sad part is that everything in this game literally happened for no reason because of the ending. All this game needs is some good dlc, that ties up some loose ends, played by non of the main characters and giving a different perspective, great video man.
9:37 Speaking of character assassination does anyone else specifically remember the whole reason Joel killed Marlene? Joel said it best, "you would just come after her" so it makes sense that he would tie up loose ends and kill the leader of the faction that tried to kick him out on his ass without any supplies. In order to truly save Ellie she needed to die yet in the detached writing of the sequel Abby just finds Joel randomly because that was the only way to make the plot THEY wanted to happen.
Speaking of character assassination even more, Marleen is acting way differently in these flashbacks than she did at the end of the first game. In part 1, she barely gave a shit about Joel's opinion on the matter and acted as if he should just be thankful they're not taking more from him, as well as clearly assuming that Joel only saw this as just a job before he shoots up the place. But now suddenly she's retroactivly "Damn it, Joel deserves to know, he went through so much for us and clearly cares about Ellie!" Like, yeah, you could say she was putting up a front when talking to Joel, but there's no reason for her to pretend to have an attitude that would most certainly increase the chance of Joel not taking the news well.
@@nobody2996 That wouldn't be character assassination at all. Marlene was like a second mother to Ellie. She was friends with her mom and had been taking care of her for a long time.
your last of us part 2 head cannon ending is 1000x better than the dogass that was sold for $60 lol, i swear i felt better about your ending than i did the actual product.
![Noob To Max With DRAGON REWORK In Blox Fruits [FULL MOVIE]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/LnBMOinoOvA/mqdefault.jpg)
Just when the world needed him the most, he finally stopped playing Devil May Cry 5 and graced us with a brand new sins video.
Lmfao
It's hard to stop playing such a good game for....this game
Just as Devil May Cry 5 released.. he disappeared... Many games released since then in much need of sinning... Now he's returned and I believe he can sin them all.
He is full of motivation
@@Christian-gr3gu games arse
When a guy like Kratos has a better redemption story than Abby does despite having more blood on his hands, you know you screwed up!
That's mainly because the original god of war Areas was always a prick as much as the other gods (except hades he had legitimate reason to be mad) and they just screwed with Kratos first and he was just fighting back and later just wanted a normal simple life
Abby killed the main character in the first game because her father died to Joel and then helps a bunch of tribal kids and starts shooting her own people for said tribal kids she just met
while we saw and witness all the Bullcrap jeol goes through just to be a father again and Abby ruin it
So Abby just gets to be fatherless because joel was becoming a father again? What a shit reason to dislike a character. Abby shouldn't lose her father because joel is gaining a "daughter" or any analogous Joel shouldnt get to be a dad again if it requires that some else's is taken away. So he had to suffer consequences for his action.
@@symbioticspiderman4 Joel had to save Ellie because the Fireflies had no idea wtf they were doing
@@symbioticspiderman4 Joel didn't save Ellie to become a father again you empty twat, he save her because its the right thing to do, also what the consequence of Abby killing Joel since you are such a sweetheart who look for accountability?
@@symbioticspiderman4 Abby’s father was going to dissect a unconscious young girl without bothering to give her consent or say in the matter, regardless of his excuses and if he feels bad doing that doesn’t change the fact he and the rest of the fireflies didn’t even consult Ellie on the issue or even care about it which makes them absolute shitty people. And there wasn’t even a guarantee it would’ve worked so Ellie could’ve died for nothing and should’ve been told this, and it's already a dumb idea to immediately kill her, you’d think they keep her alive as much as possible and spend a year or so to study and research her unique ability and possible find a way to replicate it without killing her and if not, having a better idea of the thing would be better then just immediately kill your one specimen. So yeah he and the other fire files can go to hell.
The whole “joel was softened” thing doesnt even make sense
Daryl Dixon didnt start trusting everyone randomly just because he took care of Judith, he stayed cautious, and would do whatever he could to stay alive
Joel is like Daryl but dial that to 11, so he would stay as cautious as possible, but more so because of what he did
That on top of the fireflies and the military still potentially hunting for him and Ellie, which would make him even more cautious.
Hell Joel was like this before Sarah died, when they pass a family he tells Tommy to keep driving and when Tommy claims they have a kid Joel responds “So do we.”. Yes he says “Someone else will come along” but it shows what Joel prioritizes above all else.
There is also not a single moment before is death that shows Joel going soft.
Apparently joel got softened in jackson... but not in the flashbacks... and apparently jackson had the exact opposite effect on ellie who turns into ted fucking bundy
Daryl did end up giving a gun to that one stranger that was with two women and the guy ended up stealing Daryl’s crossbow and bike
And later on killed Denise
I remember playing as Abby in the Ellie boss fight and letting Ellie kill Abby like ten times hoping it was some sort of secret happy ending. Man was I wrong.
⤴️Congratulations 👏 you won a giveaway, send me a message via telegram to the above username 👆👆 to claim your package 📦📦🏆🎁🏆....
Remember how they constantly kept shoving gayshit in our face?
it got slammed by ellie 10 times either way, hardest tlou boss fight i been in
xD! A *LOT* of people did that believe it or not!
@Honey_Eva 🤓
I think the biggest problems with the writing come down to a few things:
(1) Joel was killed off too early in the game. Nothing wrong with killing him off, but the timing doesn't work. With Joel dead right at the beginning, we can't explore the relationship between Joel and Ellie except through a bunch of flashbacks, which drag the story down and make it feel too slow and aimless. Hunting Joel down (or playing as Joel while being hunted) could have been used as a source of tension / rising action for a large chunk of the story.
(2) Speaking of "slow and aimless", those words also describe like the first 2/3 of Abby's plotline. Giving Abby a more tightly written narrative, with more direct relevance to the rest of the plot, might have made more players empathize with her instead of actively trying to sabotage her during the Abby/Ellie fight.
(3) As you point out in the video, Ellie's immunity should have mattered more. It essentially became a peripheral element of the story, when it's supposed to be the entire reason why Ellie is such an important character to begin with. This strikes me as a huge "Chekhov's Gun" problem. The few characters who are aware of Ellie's immunity just *talk* about it, but it never really has a tangible payoff, or any impact on the rising action at all.
Romance girl
Points 2 and 3 are fine but your first point _is trash._ Killing Joel at the beginning is totally fine because it justifies Ellie leaving the safety and paradise of Jackson to go kill a bunch of folks _so that we can have a game._ Furthermore, if they killed _anyone_ else it wouldn’t have an impact.
Anyone who says “killing Joel at the beginning is bad writing” is a cope. Just be honest and say his death was so upsetting that it ruined the game for you. I would respect that.
You want Joel to die exactly like high honor Arthur Morgan- at the end of the game, looking at the sunset- but instead the writers took an actual risk🤷♂️
@@durodesduvo8424
That take makes no sense. Joel’s death felt like complete bullshit at the beginning of the game. We aren’t saying he has to commit due at the end like Lee Everett, just maybe give Joel and Ellie’s father/daughter relationship more active screen time to present more well-written pacing and THEN maybe kill him so that Ellie can begin actually having a justification to start the game and not make every flashback feel like filler content that doesn’t do much for anyone.
By the way, a lot of people say argue the argument and not the person, but why the hell is it cope to call out gameplay that cuts to “Star Wars Sequels” level flashbacks that a bunch of people didn’t like to see for more than a quick 3 second showing of a father/daughter type relationship? Trick answer: it’s not. Cope with it.
@@IamtheSpy2005 are you nuts? for me the Ellie flashbacks were great because we got more Joel screentime through memories. Especially since we thought he was gone forever, it was nice to see him again.
It was good for tonal variety because was a nice break from the revenge campaign which has a consistent depressing tone throughout.
The Ellie flashbacks did something that I thought was clever, which was reveal information that makes you question the characters thought process when you thought you understood them already.
When Joel is killed we think that Ellie has no idea what he did at the firefly hospital, and we expect Ellie to learn about it during her quest. So when we learn that she knew _why_ Joel was killed and other context from the flashbacks, it changes the reason for revenge.
Before we thought this was revenge for killing Joel- but the truth is that Ellie is doing this out of the guilt she feels for ending their relationship over differences and not treasuring the time they had left.
Anyway you don’t have to like it, but Joel dying is the only catalyst that makes sense for this game. Who else could they kill? Dina? Tommy? Nobody would give a fuck. The other option would be Jackson getting attacked I guess… better than your idea to have an even more drawn out start to the game with Joel and Ellie hanging out, no rising action, or tension at all.
The funniest part about you fools complaining about Joel dying is that *this is exactly how the first game started,* the only difference is that we’re more invested in the character. Joel’s daughter dies in an unfair, bullshit way and now we get to experience what felt in the second game.
@@durodesduvo8424 sure Joels daughter died, but the motives and level of cruelty are completely different. You cannot call them "exactly the same". Even Joel killing Jeffrey and Marline was less cruel than how Abby killed Joel.
This isnt even to mention how well the players already know Joel so its a completely seperate situation other than "early character death" its an incomparable story start.
Also the order of events with how Joel was killed off should have been layed out differently.
Market the game completely from Abby's perspective. Dont even show Ellie and Joel anywhere and sell it as a "seperate story".
If you HAVE to play as Abby.
Begin the game from Abby's perspective then slowly reveal details to have the player realize who these people are.
Then kill off Joel.
Boom sympathy built on Abby with no negative stigma to begin with, and less players starting the game off pissed, and complicated emotions over the events of TLOU1.
What's sad is at the hands of a decent writer, Abby could've been made into a great character.
There is potential for sure.
Absolutely agreed
The problem with Druckmann is his growing inability to compartmentalize his writing and his personal politics. Really great writers can subtly sprinkle in some of their beliefs to compliment the story intelligently, leaving the audience to reach their own conclusions with context clues. Druckmann doesn’t really have subtlety. He just throws something in your face and then gets angry when you don’t understand the point of it. He does this when it doesn’t even fit the scene sometimes. Alot of the scenes in this game just felt really jumbled and like they had no flow to them. Just a bunch of patchy fragments thrown into no particular order and running with it.
@@carloszestyboy2901 I agree. The whole Lev as a trans person storyline feels so disconnected from Ellie and Abby's conflict. Ellie ironically as a lesbian never learns that Lev is Trans or that Lev also suffered bigotry for it. Because to Ellie Lev is someone that almost killed her girlfriend and is helping the murderer of her surrogate father.
Ellie understanding Abby has nothing to do with the understanding Lev and Abby share and that understanding Abby has with Lev has nothing to do with Lev being Trans. It just such a forced story.
If Lev is skilled in combat than Lev's gender or dead name means nothing. Because Abby doesn't care about any of that and neither does Joel care that Ellie is gay.
Druckman obviously doesn't care about what makes sense story wise for a game about fighting flesh eating monsters.
@@carloszestyboy2901 In short: He's a moron.
You got to remember that, introspection is for those with a guilty conscious and Abby was written to not have one.
Abby doesn't have an introspection moment when Ellie kills her friends because Abby doesn't see Ellie's quest for revenge and her quest for revenge as the same. Abby convinsed herself that Joel was just a murderous psycho path that killed her father and sees Ellie the same way for killing her friends, not as a daughter trying to avenge a father figure but a psychopath just out to kill. When Abby killed Joel, he was just another psychopaths like the ones she was known for killing, and absolved herself of guilt of killing him.
If they truely wanted a "revenge is bad" message, then Abby shouldn't act like her revenge was justified and Ellie's is not.
Translation: Abby is like "Why did you have to go on revenge?! Only I am allowed to have it! ME! Why would you want to kill me when I horrifically traumatized you"
She doesn't realize that Ellie coming for her all ties back.. to her. Because only ABBY's revenge is justified in this game according to the writers.
And notices how in the game Abby never learns that the real reason Ellie came after her was bc she killed Ellie’s father figure, same as Ellie never learns that the real reason Abby killed Joel was bc he killed her father? It’s bc if either of them learns the truth, it would shatter the weak foundation this whole game is built on and the story will make even less sense than they already do if they keep trying to kill each other. But ND NEEDS them to keep trying to kill each other so Ellie and Abby just conveniently never learns the truth even though there’s like 100 times where they could’ve lmfao
@@GloomyNooby This is only partially true. Both could get a basic idea of why the other is out for revenge. Ellie learns that Abby ties back to the Fireflys, and Abby knew Ellie tied back to Joel because she was there for his death.
Really, even if Abby was to learn the whole truth, it wouldn't change much about her point of view. Abby would still see Joel as just the psycho path that killed her dad. Ellie is the only one to take the information as earth shaking.
@@travisb.honest2438 I disagree, imo both learning the truth will at least change their motivation somewhat because then Abby will realize that Joel was doing something that Jerry probably would’ve done if Abby was the one immune, and Ellie would’ve realize that Abby did something that Ellie herself is doing right now seeking revenge as a heartbroken daughter
Metal gear solid, red dawn (87), v for vendetta. They all have the same thing in common, empathy for the villen. Thats what makes story telling grate.
Another thing about the game I hated was that killing Joel didn’t even affect Abby at all for the rest of the game. We don’t know if she felt bad or good about it for the rest of the game. It didn’t even matter except for plot for her and Ellie to fight.
Abby is a narcissistic sociopath who is incapable of even understanding the idea of someone else caring for the victim of her actions and wanting revenge like she did.
That is how far removed she is of basic human rational.
no you could definitely tell that abby believed killing joel would’ve given her the closure she thought she needed but she didn’t feel better after joels death she almost felt worse
@@autumnbrown4350 true she didn't feel better. But we don't ever once see her show any sign of regret
You obviously didn’t pay attention to the fact that nightmares about her dad still plagued her and she wasn’t getting sleep even after Joel’s death. Stop streaming the game on twitch and play it yourself and pay f***ing attention
@@leonpaelinck why would you? He damned humanity
The biggest example I have to disprove the Joel got soft theory is the literal start of the first game. Joel was basically living in paradise and decides not to help out a family with kids on his way out. Why would he help abby?
Romance girl
He was thinking of his daughter's safety at that time. Furthermore, he didn't know exactly what was happening since the pandemic was just starting.
hes been living in Jackson for a while now and they have a policy of bringing people in to see if theyre on the level, but i agree joel wouldve kept his wits about him, either not surrounding himself with strangers or not giving names (but tbf tommy did that). they shouldve had him or tommy get injured during the escape, something small enough to not gun it back to jackson but big enough to make it so they couldnt fight back as well and needed medical supplies to get back to jackson (something like a sprained ankle or a bad cut, not something he'd die over or need immediate medical help, but big enough to need to rest)
Welp, there you have it, folks.
A game y'all have waited a long time to get a true and proper "Sin" Video on. One of the best reaction videos I have personally seen.
Now rewind it, watch it all over again and take notes on how to write games, books, movies, etc. for yourselves.
Get this man some views!
this is going through great length to not tell a good story, a copypasta has better rising action
@@BarioIDL Facts
One, every Gaming Sins Video has been, more or less, tongue in cheek. Two, everybody (including GCN) forgets that UNTIL Jackson, Joel lived in military controlled quarantine zones where nobody could relax in any way; and now, he has been living in an actual city again for several years where people inside the walls CAN relax and be somewhat comfortable again.
@@Joe_Okey four, with zombies and shamblers that they had to kill in the flashbacks; five, joel went soft is like veteran be able to sleep well when someone blows the whistle after just five years; six, you,more or less, tongue in cheek.
After a 6 month hiatus, you return with this gem. Strap in, this will be a good episode.
Its amazing how everyone but the actual creators can write the story for this game.
Naughty dog got comfortable and sloppy over the years I mean not just them a lot of big developers have been getting sloppy
Its almost like they got a whole bunch of gay people, sat them down, and said " how can we make this gay"
@@crimsonhawk4912 LOL.. How on earth... how in the solar system did you come up with this conclusion??
This game has that in common with Game of Thrones season 8
@@PedroSCP No the issue is NEIL CUCKMAN is a far LEFTIST WOKE liberal that's the problem .
Those people can't help themselves , they think that normal people are interested in their NEO MARXIST, lets hate the west, lets hate white people, lets hate men nonsense.
42:10 Critics who defend this game assume the cure was going to work make ZERO sense. The foundation of this war between Abby and Ellie is beyond stupid.
Why was his story in 2 minutes so much better than tlou2’s story 💀 especially the “and I’d do it again”, line
Because unlike TLOU2, it wasn't a bad story using an existing license to get pushed. It was a story designed to *continue* the original.
It was terrible fym 💀
@@colejohnson2332why?
hush
@@memestho1018 no you
The fact that Naughty Dog decided to take a giant shit on Ellie and Joel's relationship while also shoving Abby down our throats was the main reason I hated the game so much.
Yeah the entire reason I liked the first one was Ellie and Joel's relationship, like that's what made it so enjoyable.
@@helstein I also liked the world, and it's also the first peice of the whole zombie media thing to actually attribute the zombie virus to an actual real world virus. I liked how dark and gritty the world, and the characters. But one of the things I liked the most, was that they actually SHOWED the zombie outbreak happening in real time. I think this is the most important aspect to show the viewer in a zombie piece of media, and most zombie genres don't even show this, which is infuriating. It's a breath of fresh air to see it in tlou1. And they showed it so realistically. It was downright scary with how realistic it was. The time jump of twenty years is great. It skips straight to the most interesting part, which is the actual post apocalypse. It doesn't focus on a few months after, or any of that shit, like most in media. Because tbh, after the initial outbreak, nothing really happens after that. Its just the protag staying in groups and shit. The military or at least a provincial government is just non existent for some reason, which is just downright unrealistic. The world in other zombie genres also doesn't give enough time for other civilizations or factions to arise from the dust, because they mostly taking place after the initial outbreak. Walking dead was really bad at this, and the majority of others. The thing thats good about tlou, is that when it skips it just shows a montages of newsreels as the years go by, which mentions the severity of the outbreak after, mentioning riots, death count, rising factions, cure attempts etc, which is already more realistic than most zombie apocalypse material in the media. Most zombie shows and shit need to learn that that just because a significant outbreak happened, it doesn't automatically equal a post apocalypse world. It usually takes time for humanity to be brought to the brink obviously, especially when it comes to pandemic. Tlou understood this, and that's why I like it. The masterful storyline and characters just make it fucking better.
bcoz ND is now full of lesbians and pronouns
The fact that everyone is constantly coming up with objectivity better versions of the Last Of Us 2 story is a testament to how much Naughty Dog took an L
FACTS💯
3:15 Dartigan said it best: I don't feel bad when I kill people in video games, can the developers not try to make me feel like a monster when I do the one thing their game forces me to do in order to complete it?
or at least, not this cheap way
Goofy voice: I'll fuckin do it again
THIS! This game couldn't go one minute without trying to beat me in the head about how terrible a person I am for killing people who, may I remind you, were trying to kill me first and expect me to feel bad about it. At least some games like Deus Ex or Dishonored had the decency to give me options where I didn't have to bathe in blood so that when the game called me a monster they had a point because I had a CHOICE which this game clearly didn't care to give me.
Spec Ops: The Line.
Said it before I will say it again. Metal Gear Solid has done this concept perfectly. From the 2nd game, all the way to the 5th, you DONT have to kill a single person or creature if you choose so. Not even the bosses, who are deserving of death.
The only difference is, Kojima and Konami didnt shove your bloodlust in your face. The closest that happens is Venom Snake gets bloody as fuck and you cant wash off. Thats it.
I never understood the, ”Joel/Nathan Drake kills tons of people” critique. Everyone they kill tried to kill them first.
It's just rhetoric
bruv… I know I’m late but did you not play tlou pt 1? it’s made very clear that Joel is not innocent and has killed/hurt many people to survive, and not necessarily through defense. It’s why he knew the hunters were going to ambush him and Ellie after Bill’s town.
Let's all take our time to appreciate the amount of time this man takes to make these videos. He could just be a weekly sins videos but he takes time to really look at these games and analyze them to sin them properly.
Bravo GCN, Bravo
GCN > Dartigan
@@kensredemption i like them both equally. I found dartigan first but this guy is on point so i respect him for making his content his own.
@@captaintony1227 i used to like them equally but I just found Dartigan’s sins more lame over time. At least with GCN’s sins if they’re lame, they become pretty funny with his delivery so GCN >>>> Dartigan. Also I like how for the older Walking Dead games he took every path to sin everything equally
@@kensredemption I like those guys equally
Very easy to nit pick games for your hate nerd fan base. Don’t get why you think it’s hard to play a game and complain about it.
i wish we had Tommy as a companion , he is basically Ellie's uncle at this point
Thank you! Finally! Someone else who says what I've been saying for years. Everyone is always hung up on "They killed Joel." The fact that anyone would believe he'd survive this game is just confusing to me. I'm more concerned with how they killed Joel. It wasn't emotional, it wasn't built up properly, none of it! It's character assassination at its worst. Joel a one man army, a man who murdered hundreds of people in the first game some of which posed no threat to him, just walked in a room full of strangers without a care in the world. It's just ridiculous. I can't even say it was shocking because there's only reason for them to have in Jackson looking for a man. They thought they were being clever and smart but in reality it was just such basic story telling it had me rolling my eyes.
Whenever the first trailer dropped for this game and we saw Joel talking to Ellie, literally everyone was predicting that Joel was already dead and that Ellie was seeing him in hallucinations. Also everyone thought Abby was Ellie's mother lol.
@@LeeEverett1 tf? Ellie’s mom died giving birth to her lol
You don’t know what character assassination is and weren’t paying attention. Joel saving Abby at the start isn’t really out of character, they’re on patrol and looking for travelers and taking out infected, it’s just called common fucking courtesy which jackson has been able to allow. Second, Joel never gave out his name, that was all tommy who is naturally the more trusting of the brothers, and thirdly Joel was Surrounded with no cover, he was dead the second he walked into that room.
Joel should have died like Lee in The Walking Dead of Telltale
@@mateoreyes6921 please fucking stop
The biggest sin of all was how this game won Game of the Year over GHOST OF TSUSHIMA.
To be fair, it did get more of an emotional reaction
To this day, I am convinced that the awards were paid off by Sony. There is no other reason why The Last Of Us Part II should ever have gotten "best music" over *DOOM ETERNAL* despite the soundtrack being droning drums and slow pluckings of the guitar strings.
Yeah. That showing of a video game awards show plummeted my respect for those kinds of shows. That was 100% a agenda or pay off from Sony to get TLoU2 all those awards. Absolute BS and now I wont support that kind of shit ever again.
Made me lose a fat amount of respect from Naughty Dog too.
The Game Awards are the same type of shitty political shills you can find in all of media. It is an event sponsered by the same shitty companies that release the games!
Player vote is only about 10% of the final scores, and it is about 50% "Political Agenda" and 40% "Who paid the most to get an award".
@@thatguy1080 I don't think they were paid off by sony, it came out during a time of mass protests, riots etc and all of this anti hate stuff so I feel like they felt if they didn't give it the win, twitter would have a field day and they just didn't wanna deal with it lol
I can’t forgive a random guy who called me a mean word but i can forgive the person that killed my father figure wtf
Imagine forgiving your father’s murderer for no reason
@@ghostwhencodghosts9114 yeah doesn’t make sense I suppose the whole plot is basically revenge bad
And the guy even got her some beef sandwiches! I imagine that would be quite something in the post apocalypse!
Yeah when i first played the game and heard Ellie call that guy a “bigot” I already knew how this game was gonna go.
The Radom guy was actively trying to kill her, and Abby was surrendering and didn’t want to fight???? Wtf
I feel like the writers for this game were teenage girls that spend too much time on Twitter. I swear there was no respect for the first game at all. At least let me play Ellie the whole game. Why would you throw away that perfect formula you nailed in the first game? Just baffles me how bad it is.
Yeah it was written like a teenage melodrama in parts, and Joel and Ellie destroyed.
it was written by pronoun people
The fact that this game got Game of The Year despite having no real reason to have received it makes me wonder if this industry is nothing more than a brand recognition competition.
Ghost of Tsushima or Doom Eternal deserved the award.
@Freesmart Ghost of Tsushima also has it. Not as great as Doom Eternal, but it’s story is leagues better then 2 lesbians learn revenge is bad.
@Freesmart I have. It’s good
@@doncheadlegaming7521 I disagree. Ghost of Tsushima story wasn't nearly as good as people were making it out to be. Khan was an absolute idiot the entire game. The gameplay I do agree with
@@SuperMurray2009 You defend TLOU2 so your take on what a good story is means nothing to civilized society.
@@xacmashe3852 yes
This. Your take on joel's death and how you would describe his character and personality is absolutely perfect. Couldn't have worded it better. I 100% agree
Look at where he has been living for several years compared with where he lived BEFORE that. Everybody (including GCN) forgets that UNTIL Jackson, Joel lived in military controlled quarantine zones where nobody could relax in any way (thanks to said military being in charge of EVERY aspect of your life, including whether you got full rations or not and when and where you were assigned to work; and now, he has been living in an actual city again for several years where people inside the walls CAN relax and who grow and raise their own food. Also, the story EXPLICITLY mentions that people come through that city on a fairly regular basis. So, YES, everybody INCLUDING Joel could start feeling a little more relaxed again and have a basis for helping strangers also.
@@Joe_Okey "you can't teach an old dog new tricks". Even if he lived with people for a couple of years and became relaxed does that erase all of the experience he acquired before? Hell no. That was a dangerous situation and Abby was a random person. To go out of their way and waste time to save her in that situation without a safe way to escape is BEYOND STUPIDITY. Someone as experienced and coldblooded as him doing that without any pressure from the side like Ellie begging him or something like that? No.
It would've been more believable if he spent DECADES in that town. But several years? No, not that much, that's for sure.
@@ankaros7194 actually it was Tommy who revealed their identity 🤝
@@PixHQ But Joel revealed information to Abby about Jackson for no reason.
@@Joe_Okey This is a joke. I had a roommate who was a Marine in Afghanistan and Iraq. He NEVER let his guard down. My current roommate was in the Navy and he always looks behind him when walking his dog or walking to his truck.
Both of these men left the military YEARS ago and still act this way. Your excuse for Joel's actions in Last of Us 2 makes absolutely no sense. Joel was writing terribly plain and simple.
Hoo boy, I've been waiting for this one...
Let the roasting begin
I screamed in my car when I saw the notification I was so happy I’ve been waiting years to hear what he’s got for the last of us 2
01:12:00 What's worse is Abby doesn't even acknowledge how she manipulates and lies to her friends for her own benefit. In fact doesn't show any form of remorse over that.
Exactly, she is a psycho
How does Ellie not know what an ice cream truck is but knows what bigotry is 🤣🤣
They still get the CW in Jackson
Because she was born many years after the world fell apart and every post apocalyptic story shows that humanity’s worst is brought out of them.
Respectfully, I feel like you’re reaching with this comment
it come with lesbian
You’re more likely to learn about the word bigot in school history class than you are to learn about ice cream trucks mate
@@urbiznesnunuv6938 But this game is literally in the fuckin' apocalypse...
@ComicWriter2020 Doesn't really seem like reaching when it happens to be true. She was born about 6 years or so after the apocalypse. You wouldn't be able to fully grasp what life was like before (entirely) so you'd be confused on a lot of things.
This dude just wrote a game that would have actually maintained the legacy of the Last of Us. God damn Naughty Dog screwed the pooch on this one.
OH MY GOD IM SO HAPPY! IVE BEEN WAITING FOREVER FOR THIS!
Lowkey someone should also record their entire gameplay and then chop it all up and edit it to how the game should’ve been laid out
The writing and dialogue in this game is so ridiculously cringe. It’s like an LA hipster’s zombie apocalypse fantasy where people talk and act like it’s 2020 America but theres zombies
LA hipster zomapoc, perfectly put.
No it's not?
*GCN spent almost 2 minutes explaining the first sin.*
Yeah this gonna be good
I can't believe in any universe where Ellie would let Abby live for what she did. Absolutely no way.
Especially with the missing context as to why.
@@jacktaylor8195 I really tried my best to comprehend the reason why she let her live but it was indigestible from all perspectives to be fair😂
@@vidhroh1538 Well I guess the REAL reason is so that Nuaghty Dog can make an absolute cash grab of a third game with Abbey as the protagonist.
Thats why we are getting a tlou3. Where the player will be able to switch between abby and ellie on the fly! Open world story driven game with side quests and world building with deeper rpg elements!!!!!
Well, it happened.
Straight up the best game sins channel you have tons of personality and feel like you've come into your own thing rather than just copying cinema sins and making videos you want to instead of pandering to views
This and Dartigan are my favorites
@@LeeEverett1 Dartigan’s tone make him sound like a robot which makes it unbearable for me to hear what he says unfortunately.
@@nadirmarshall4059 That's sad
And yet after watching this GCN still manages to make a better story in his own head, and he doesn’t even get paid to do it. God I love GCN
The fireflies rushing Ellie into surgery to murder her without consent 100% justifies Joel's decision. This makes Abbys revenge plot really dumb. Any sane person would feel conflicted if their parent was complicit in the attempted murder of a child. The fact Abby lacks this sort of empathy makes her an awful character. Last of us 1 was amazing due to Joel and Ellie, removing either be of them ruins it.
No. See.... I disagree. Joel in fact did know that Ellie would have wanted to give herself up for the cure if he meant taking her life.
You know this primarily because when Marlene confronts him about him about it, you see Joel unable to hide his expression that Ellie would in fact have wanted to die at that hospital.
But yet Joel killed Marlene anyway. Because for him it wasn't about saving the world. He couldn't give too shits. He wanted Ellie. He never tried to justify himself by saying you're taking away her ability to choose because he didn't give a shit about that.
Also if we're going to say Abby is an awful character because she lacks empathy. Then what exactly does that make Ellie? Ellie decided to kill Abby's friend because Joel decided to murder her dad and other fireflies members. So how the hell can you hold Abby to a standard you don't hold Ellie to? If thats the case is Ellie an awful character as well?
@@SuperMurray2009 First of all you are completely wrong. Joel does not know what Ellie wants, no more than the fireflies know what Ellie wants. He might suspect she would give her life but that's not enough to sit back and just let her be killed without her consent. Especially after she promised to go anywhere with Joel after seeing the fireflies, indicating she had not planned on dying. So that's your first point refuted.
Secondly the game makes it clear that there is zero guarantee that they can even make a cure, all attempts had failed so far, so to say Joel is damming the work is also wrong.
Third, once Abbys dad decided to rush a child into surgery to kill her on the small chance of a vaccine, then you reap what you sow, the fireflies are not the good guys here, they are as grey as Joel. They kept a kid sedated, didn't wake her to explain the situation, they didn't ask her to if she wanted to give her life, they didn't let her say goodbye, they rushed her into surgery. That's barbaric.
Finally, as to your point about Ellie and her empathy, I've just watched a compilation of her killing Abbys friends, she kills most of them after they try to attack her instead of giving her info, leaving her no choice. That's far more than what those awful people gave Joel! Did you even play the game or did you just fap to Abby all the time?
Abby is an awful character that Naughty Dog tried to manipulate people into liking. It only worked on simpletons... Like you. Abby stans are the weirdest.
@@user-Marrk 1. You can't just say I'm completely wrong without providing and proof or context? How exactly am I wrong? You don't provide any. You just say no I'm right you're wrong.
Joel does in fact know what Ellie wants because litrerally Joel tells Ellie that she doesn't have to go though with the fireflies and they can ditch it all together. But Ellie declines and says wants to see the journey through. On top of that... if you watch the scene with Marlene and she accusing Joel of knowing what Ellie wants, you can actually see Joel's facial expression turn into guilt. That facial expression in itself was more than evidence to conclude that their was somewhat conflict in Joel's decision making.
2. But nothing is guaranteed. How far down the rabbit hole do you even wanna go with this? It's not guaranteed that they even make it to the fireflies, it's not guaranteed that fireflies even know what the do with cure. It was always a risk. The game heavily implies that Joel doesn't give a shit anyway about what would have happened to said cure If it meant that Ellie would be killed in the process. If you wanna use the excuse that their is no guarantees than why even bother taking her to the fireflies after Jackson anyway then? You would be trying to refute the whole plot of the third act of the game.
3. You're right. It is Barbaric to rush a child into surgery. And the fireflies are grey just like Joel. However the point of the matter is ...The game heavily implies that Joel is again somewhat aware the Ellie would have probably gave herself as a sacrificial pawn for the cure. So this is that area where Joel is still also in the wrong because he killed Marlene when she literally offered to forgive him and let it all go in the end but he shot her anyway.
4. Wait what? How in the hell is all your friends getting killed somehow alot more tamer than one organization killing one man? Do you even hear the foolishness coming from your mouth? They'll killed one guy and spared rest of the people in your crew. When they literally didn't have to.
First off your ignoring the fact that Ellie kill Nora in cold blood. And it's somehow it's supposed to be less empathetic even though Ellie holds her friends at gun point with murderous intent? Like you are doing some heavily level mental gymnastics to support your case.
So yeah you're points are extremely flawed and you too busy reiterating Skill up Talking points to support your case in the time of need to bash the game when you lack even proper context. Like you literally just admitted to watching a compilation of Ellie killing Abby's friends. So if anything that points to you not actually playing the game.
@@user-Marrk He did know. That's why he lied about what happened. HOW could you not get this after beating the game? Marlene told Joel this is what she wants and Joel never denied it.
@@SuperMurray2009 I told you in the first few lines how you were wrong, because no one knows what Ellie wants cos no one woke her up! You're a raving Abby Stan, probably on the spectrum so I ain't wasting my time responding to your delusions 😂😂
In my opinion the best GCN video EVER please never stop (im still waiting for sins of RDRII and Detroid become human)
His ending was so much better than this and now it lives rent free in my head
He hasn't uploaded it but i already know this is gonna be Masterpiece of a video
This channel cracks me up. Enjoy the content
It always brightens my day
Nothing wrong with personal preference, the real problem with this game is purposefully getting a reaction out of all of everyone. That is not how writing should be, writing is basically like playing god, how you write it literally tells the world who you really are, even if your plan for your story was to get a reaction from the viewers & consumers.
My man came back and starting torturing this game.
Oh boy was it worth waiting for this video to come out.
I feel like you could have sinned one time more when Tommy ambushes Abby, 1) for not just shooting her straight away, and 2) the fact that Yara just teleported to save Abby remember it was only Abby and Manny who chased Tommy, then Yara suddenly shows up out of nowhere.
By the time tommy would have spun around if he did have his gun she would have shot him, dipshit.
@@urbiznesnunuv6938 ok dipshit except you seem to have forgotten the fact that it was tommy who surprised Abby, and instead of shooting her he just tries to slap her with the gun and the game is filled with similar scenarios, something you should know when you try to defend something you fucking asshat.
@@ElementVoidX yeah lemme just shoot someone with a rifle when I’m blinded by hatred and want them to suffer the same way they hurt my brother. Ever notice Ellie shoots Abby to stun her in death scenes before killing her while she’s begging? We’ve literally seen tommy torture people in the city already. Shut the fuck up and learn to connect the dots, I can’t do it for you.
@@urbiznesnunuv6938 no you can't cause you can't even connect them, have you forgotten he shot at them when you were chasing him? or are you just a retarded troll who have not even played the game? also wtf does Ellie have to do with what Tommy is doing? you are just spewing shit out of your ass, try to look up the Dunning-Kruger effect, that is what you are suffering from, Tommy never said he wanted her to suffer he tortured the 2 people to get through the gate which again don't even make sense, not that it matters in this shit game, the only fans of this piece of trash are people like you who are fooling yourself into believing this is a good game, fuck out of here.
Imagine if Kratos murdered all those gods to not end up killing Zeus at the end? Ridiculous right?
same, i hate this trope
like, you killed for so much less, so many times before. just on the way there she killed a dozen plus people, and especially that in this world, you cant take a trip to the toilet without having to kill a handful of people or infected
there wasnt even a good reason to forgive them
The fact that a lot of your major points are things I brought up reveals the fact that this game deserves much more valid criticism than others. People keep talking about what Joel did. Unlike Abby, Joel doesn't attempt to prolong the suffering of others, especially without a purpose. Unlike Abby Joel can feel some remorse. Abby is just stubborn.
Wow! It's just eyes opening. When I played the game, I felt like going through the motions, especially the parts with Abby and wanting her to die on purpose. But after seeing this, I understand how many details I just ignored, that bugged me inside. Thank you, man. Now I get why I hated the story so much.
Lol you basically admitted to hopping on a bandwagon of hate
@@gangg1762 nah he admitted to seeing facts which he already knew were true and he felt tlou2 supporters are like rats and facts are like light to them anytime facts are spitten they scurry away and hide back into their rat hole
18:30 It's so lazy that the game fails to explore Ellie's friendship with Dina. All we see is them do is go from friends to lovers after smoking weed. And that's only because from my interpretation at least Dina wants to pull Ellie out of her emo shell and she finds Ellie attractive.
That's a weak setup for the two to become life partners and parents to Jesse's child after going on a dangerous mission that is only personal to Ellie and Tommy.
It would have made more sense if we saw Ellie become more and more depressed as time passed because Joel refused to apologize for lying. This would worry Dina but also move her emotionally to connect with Ellie on a deeper level leading to romance.
Instead all we get is the flashback later in the game of them making out. That starts a fight between the bigot that Tommy's wife Maria forces to apologize to Ellie and Joel protecting Ellie from Mr. Bigot's abuse.
Also why Mr. Bigot is upset the surrogate daughter of one of the most powerful residents of Jackson is kissing another girl in public when both protect Jackson from danger is so mind numbingly stupid it makes Joel stupidly giving personal information to Abby's group seem highly intelligent like Iron Man building a nano tech suit.
This fight leads to Ellie partially forgiving Joel after Joel gives a partial apology due to both of them getting kicked outside the dance hall. Which has zero connection to Dina other than Joel encouraging Ellie to start a romantic relationship with her.
This makes Neil Druckman's anger towards Joel (as represented through Manny) more confusing. In Joel's short time in Last of Us 2, Joel saves Abby, supports Ellie, is pro LGBT by fighting Mr..Bigot, monitors the patrols to protect Ellie, an expert tracker and navigator which gives Ellie the best birthday gift ever and is an accomplished musician.
Yet Druckman...I mean Manny says pendejo after he spits on Joel.
And what great things does Manny do in this game...treat women as sex objects...and worry about his sick father...and make stupid jokes. Wow that resume totally compares to Joel's resume. (Sarcasm). It makes me so invested in Manny's friendship with Abby. (Sarcasm).
Basically Last of Us 2 is lazy at building relationships between characters whereas that was the best part of Last of Us 1. It made fighting to survive in a group more meaningful because you worried for the other characters.
Romance girl
Another point with the doctor, not even the same skin color. and there was never any mention or implication of any kids besides Ellie being anywhere in the area let alone IN the hospital. Her whole existence was just fabricated and shoehorned in to explain it away and they failed horribly. I would have believed it more if it was just the daughter of a random survivor or Firefly we kill throughout any of the other areas or something.
The guy in the second game also looks more put together and just in general looks like he walked off the set of a shampoo commercial, the guy in the first game looks honestly like crap (fitting look for being in a world like this) and could pass out at any moment.
It’s lighting you fumb duck
Yeah.. cuz slightly different lighting is going to make them completely different colors, huh retard?
@@OG-ColorfulAbyss. does that red haired mother fucker look black to you? Get your eyes examined
Did I say "black" mother fucker? Get ya whole brain examined cuz you're clearly delusional and seeing things.
i always felt odd about this story. Abby really is doing her own thing most of the storyline, with lev, and in fact, if it wasnt for Ellie's revenge plot, would have died due to the rattlers. So all Ellie actually achieved (bar killing all Abby's friends) was releasing Abby from being captured and letting her be free.
So NOT going after Abby in Santa Barbara would have been a better choice.
(never mind i didn't actually want to be ellie fighting abby by the end, i really didn't want to have to "kill" her, but had no chouce if i wanted to finish the game.
End it after the theatre fight. much better.
What's even worse is that Ellie sacrificed her own family just to free Abby and not kill her.
Now she's a piece of garbage because even though Joel lied to Ellie he never abandoned her. Yet Ellie abandoned Dina and JJ. Ellie is a horrible mom.
Romance girl .
She made her peace
31:42 THANK YOU. So many Naughty Dog apologists were trying to justify this shit by saying it was to cover up spoilers. "But Infinity War did it! They showed the Hulk and instead it was Banner in Hulkbuster armor!" Yeah, except nobody went to see the Avengers solely because they saw Hulk in that scene. Meanwhile plenty of people, myself included, bought the Last of Us 2 because they were falsely made to believe by this trailer that we would get to see another chapter in Joel and Ellie's story. They knew that was what the fans were after and that it would sell. And then they wondered why the game split the fanbase in two.
Infinity War was about all the Avengers not just Hulk.
Last of Us 2 trailer made it seem the game was about Joel and Ellie fighting the Fireflies. I actually thought Joel was a hallucination in the trailer though but even that was a lie too.
No Naughty Dog wanted to make it unexpected. If they showed Joel's death or smth, it would ruin the game
The best thing I've seen today. This is gonna be good. I know Abby is gonna catch holy hell in this one.
Maybe! There is a good possibility that he'll side with Abby and cheer how she handled Joel, he even said he disagreed with how Joel lied to Ellie
@@kaoridovani8284 🤦🏽♂️😂💀
@@kaoridovani8284 Nope, he repeated verbatim what uncultured/basic reviewers and people who didn’t even play the game said. 🤦🏼♀️ Most people are just mad that they didn’t get a storybook ending and I think that scenario jars a lot of people’s psyche. It’s almost like if Bambi died at the end - that would leave a lot people feeling unsettled. Anyways, rant over - bye.
Sorry you have to dredge through the comments with us simpletons who simply are too uncultured to understand the deep philosophical undertones of this video game.
Hopefully our foul stench doesn't rub off on you.
@@BoleDaPole no simpletons detected. We're all here for the same objective: enjoying a sins video.
The RUclipsr “Macarb storytelling” has also done an amazing review over 3 hours talking about the plot and characters of this game in amazing detail, I recommend it!!
I watched it. Macarb Storytelling did a great reviews. My only issue is that he misunderstood some aspects about Ellie's character.
I was excited you finally made a video, but I’m only 10 minutes in and I’m getting triggered with flashbacks on how betrayed I felt when this game came out. Smh
That's brilliant that explains everything. The first game felt like a gritty action thriller. The second felt like a shitty teenage drama written by someone that failed English language at secondary school.
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Yeah
The Last Of Us 2 really feels like a Netflix show
@@mateoreyes6921 Like...13 Reasons Why? Is that a good comparison?
@@RenaldyCalixte Yeah
It adds the drama for tension. Cause then Jesse never got to know from dine herself that he was a father. It makes crap sad.
13:22 there is an alternative universe out there somewhere, where this is how the last of us 2 is written, and that is enough to put a smile on my face.
Your version of the sequel was so much more satisfying
L
This is officially my favorite take down of this disaster of a game next to The Critical Drinker's video on it!
Angry Joe's review was great as well.
Nakey jakey also had a good video too
Great to see you working on RUclips again
People kill me with what Joel did. Ellie was not ask if she wanted to give her life. They just throw her on the table . Then treated Joel like garbage after he got her there . There should have been a discussion between Ellie and Joel and the fireflies . Then they could have made a choose. Joel killed because they were after him. So did Ellie. The bound that Joel and Ellie developed was priceless. No one would allow someone to just kill off this child no matter what was at stake.
Exactly but idk ppl didn’t play the game 🙄 now ik how GCN felt bout tlou1 ravers (even tho in my mind its a top 10 game) ppl find any excuse to hype tlou2 everyone knows tht game was assssssss
@@calebrichards9538 Star Wars the Last of Jedi is amazing compared the trash game known as Last of Us 2.
Agree mostly but one thing - Isaac did have a meteorologist in the mountains doing 'a job for isaac' (Manny's scientist lover) so it is actually perfectly reasonable that they predicted the storm
i'm so glad you're back, keep up the good work and thank you for all the work you've done
13:06 And you know what's hilarious! Niel Druckman posted on Twitter expressing how much he loved Star Wars the Last Jedi, saying it was his favorite movie.
Coincidence, I think NOT
What?!
The Last Jedi is a better written story than Last of Us Part II. It's not a great story but at least there's a little bit of logic in Last Jedi. Last of Us Part II is divorced from logic.
Never trust a person who likes the Last Jedi
Neil either has questionable tastes, or is afraid of upsetting woke Star Wars fans
He looked up to a loser movie, he made a loser game.
It would've made more sense if it was a relative of marlene who went after joel instead of the daughter of some random npc from the first game.
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Exactly...the foundation of this game is stupid.
39:00 Abby is a hypocrite. Abby is a hypocrite. Joel saved your life and you still killed him to complete your vengeance. 😂 You're the real monster Abby.
Abby ass kissers be like "No, you are wrong! Joel is the monster for saving his daughter"
Abby and Ellie both did screwed up things but yes, Abby is a monster
@@Jillworrell22 Sorry I misunderstood your post. But I'm just stating down below why Abby frustrates me.
Abby did screwed up things for less justifiable reasons than Ellie doing screwed up things. Ellie did not kill Jerry Anderson yet Abby's actions ruined Ellie's life. What's even worse is that Abby killed Joel in front of Ellie and ignored her crying and begging her to stop. Ellie warned most of Abby's friends to surrender and was forced to attack when they refused to surrender.
Abby kills Jesse for no reason when
Jesse didn't kill any of Abby's close friends nor was he interested in revenge.
She doesn't even interrogate Jesse or order him to surrender.
Ellie wanted to seek revenge alone. Abby manipulated her friends to go on a dangerous mission to get revenge. Abby never mentions nor says Joel saved my life. She never even contemplates Joel's final act. While Ellie is saddened that Jerry was dead and that his dream of curing the world from the cordyceps fungus is gone forever.
Every time Ellie tries to wrestle with her own actions. Abby ignores her own actions but then has the audacity to lecture other people about their lack of morality. It's ridiculous.
3:00 GCN you spoke the EXACT words I was thinking when this game was released in 2020. Thank you.
Dear lord this over an hour long. Thank you so much
The first Last Of Us was suppose to be a revenge story where Joel and Ellie are fleeing across the country from a vengeful Tess. But the people Druckman was working with convinced him that it doesn't make sense to have a revenge plot in a post apocalypse. Travel across a country that filled with hordes upon hordes of deadly zombies for pointless revenge. And yet, despite those hard facts, Druckman still went with a revenge plot in the sequel in a setting where a revenge plot wouldn't make sense. So this story already fails by just the concept alone. If Druckman wanted to write a revenge plot, he shouldn't have written a zombie post apocalypse in the first place. How the hell did someone who wrote a great story like the first LOU failed so miserably at writing a sequel?
And even if that wasn't the case, the story itself is sloppy and just leaves a bad taste in your mouth.
because he did not write the story of TLOU, or he did at least not alone, Bruce Straley was a director in the first game but left after, so now there was no one to stop and say no to Cuckmann and his retarded ideas, and then we ended up with this piece of shit.
Simple, he was kept on a short leash and had others to veto his bullshit. For some reason the people in charge did not see fit to tighten his damn leash and add a muzzle.
I can't wait for the Last of Us 3. Where Abby travels across the zombie infected universe to get revenge on it and destroy that boogieman Ellie. What do you mean that's even more nonsensical? What do you mean spaceships wouldn't work in the apocalypse? What do you mean revenge in a zombie wasteland is dumb?
Neil Druckman probably.
This. This comment right here is one. I've felt the same way since it's launch.
As for that last comment/writing the sequel. It's because Neil was working with people that care, Neil seems to write story based off of what HE wants, so those folks who redirect Neil's writing changes, to now make a interesting story for US to enjoy. That's just my perspective though.
I actually thought it would be them running from a vengeful Bill due to Ellie stealing his magazine.
It will always astound me that both Abby and Ellie were in the same place at the same time. Abby was in the basement fighting the Rat King and Ellie was upstairs killing Nora.
Romance girl
9:00 what's an even better testament to this is that even prior to Sarah dying, Joel was even softer but if you watch/playthrough the scene where he, Tommy and Sarah are driving to town away from their home he literally refuses to give someone who was broken down a lift. He was extremely cautious even before the apocalypse
Romance girl
I think if Ellie and Tommy teamed up, it would be a true avenging team because one’s a surrogate daughter and the other is his biological brother
Literally my favorite RUclipsr makes a video after so long and it's over an hour long. I could never thank you enough. For entertaining me for so many years. Thank you for always delivering even though you don't make as many videos as you used to. At least I know whenever they come out they will always be in good quality. So please take as long as you want with the next couple. I cannot wait to see them. You have a great day good sir.
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I like your head-canon story, but I feel like that'd take even longer than what we got. Personally, I feel like they should have written the story as a rescue mission. Instead of murdering Joel like a dog Abby could have dragged him to Seattle in an attempt gain a sort of "proper" justice at the hands of a court. It would create a consequence for Ellie and the groups effective invasion of a sovereign states territory (As the Seraphites wouldn't be present in this version) and would lead to a climactic final battle between two groups that believe the other unjustifiably attacked the other. It could even include the dual points of view between Ellie and Abby, which I thought was an interesting concept, but would been done as a 1-2 1-2 instead of the 1-1 2-2 we got. However, I do think that the game isn't that bad, especially with how it sets up a potential finale to the series; and I'm curious as to how you'd do that seeing how much thought you put into your head-canon rewrite.
Or how about make it even better get rid of Joel and Ellie from the story entirely focus on Abby being loyal to the WlF have her be saved by Lev and both start to grow attached to each other similar to what goes down in part 2, Abby then wants to broker peace between both WLF and SCARS, it goes bad because both factions can’t forgive each other and basically shows the cycles of violence of revenge while both Lev and Abby are stuck in the middle. Abby and Lev grow very attached and survive the destruction between both factions and Its then revealed Abby’s trauma with her dad dying at the hands of Joel as well as showing a cinematic of her seeing Joel unconscious just so in terms of plot makes it easier for her to identify Joel, the player doesn’t know if she’s gonna kill Joel or not but to then be revealed that she forgives Joel basically because the whole game she basically understands Joel’s position from her own relationship with Lev and because of what she’s witnessed throughout the game, the cycles of violence and revenge and that it caused the unnecessary destruction of 2 factions. Basically the whole journey throughout the game teaches Abby about forgiveness and what revenge can do to people.
This game was truly a blur. Literally took nothing from this other than the fact that they killed Joel off in the most corniest way. But this video pinpointed everything i felt.
My biggest complaint about this game, there’s no wooden pallet to save them.
A moment of silence for our Arbor kin ally please...
Poor Ellie lol they should have had Lev use the pallets
Wait a minute, wasn't it implied at the end of TLOU that Ellie knew Joel was lying?
Then the last frame of tlou1 would be “🤨” not “🥺”
Yes. That's why she went to the hospital in the flashback.
@@leonpaelinck But she wasn't 100% sure and regardless she still enjoyed hanging out with Joel during the museum flashback.
Also it's ironic Ellie gets to be mad at Joel but shouldn't Dina and JJ be mad at Ellie for leaving them?
This RUclipsr didn't even play the game I bet
Mistake in sin 118, Joel didn’t sacrifice any future of humanity when he saved Ellie
What
I mean kinda easy to say that in hindsight right?
@@SuperMurray2009 Yeah, but even without hindsight, there are obvious things that indicate that saving Ellie wasnt a humanity dooming exercise.
That 2 minute story you narrated was so damn good!! Why did Naughty Dog have to butcher this game? This had so much potential.
The long short is one petty failure of a writer covered for the company's Weinstein and was granted total power over the company in exchange.
He's back ladies and gentlemen he's back ❤️😭😭😭😭
We've missed you GCN 😭
38:28 Love that left you actually getting a chuckle out of your own script because of how absolutely brutal you were being.
The Last of us part 2 what went wrong?
EVERYTHING
the title is all that's needed lol
Love your version of the plot. And how you made sure us players do understand that something will happen to Joel eventually but ND’s execution was horrible and that’s why people are mad. Still love the game but it could have been so much better.
the sky bridge was an extremely anxiety inducing section of the game for me. i don't know what was worse. not seeing the distant ground or seeing the distant ground.
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That was the only part of this game that was great everything else was ok or horrible.
DAMN! That whole rant from 0:01 to 2:49 is EXACTLY how I felt about this shitty-ass story from the start. Defenders of this game don't understand just how important Joel's relationship with Ellie is and they ruined that. He did NOT NEED to die for Abby to have her own story be developed.
The problem is, Abbey never developed as a character. Because Abbey was written to be about as deep as a thimble full of water.
@@Blackemperess Abby is one of the most bland and generic character I've ever seen. It's like the writers want Abby to be liked so much they made her one dimensional. That way people can see themselves in her or project their own opinions about her decisions to make concepts about the game such as trauma or forgiveness fit the story.
Abby's such a bad character beyond killing Joel.
1. Abby doesn't even express obvious signs that Joel saved her life or even mentions that to Ellie.
2. Abby shows very little emotional connection to her friends. It's as if Abby is supposed to be similar to Joel at the beginning of the 1st game (loner with only Tess as a companion). This is stupid because all her friends are happy that Joel is dead and Abby only seems to care about Owen.
3. We see the backstory for Owen and Abby but its pointless. Because Abby and Owen aren't together and Abby brings nothing to the relationship. So it's unclear why Owen is even attracted to her. We understand why Abby is attracted to Owen tho. But because the relationship is one sided it just makes Abby look even more boring.
4. Abby's only defining trait is anger. That's it. Joel, Ellie and heck even Tommy based on his feelings about Joel's past actions in the 1st game have more diverse character traits than Abby.
It makes Abby's immediate connection and chemistry with the two Scars/Seraphites seem so phony and just a tool to force the player to like Abby.
Joel took a considerable amount of time to warm up to Ellie but Abby bonds with these two kids super quick even though their friends and family killed Abby's friends. Also Lev only mentions Abby's role as a scar killer once and Abby just says you're my people.
Like what? That could have been a conflict explored throughout the game which would help the player learn more about Abby's personality. But no its just you're my people.
5. Abby falls into the dumb blonde white woman stereotype and due to her physique she falls into the dumb blond jock stereotype. She shows so little self awareness its confusing.
A. She fails to understand that Ellie doesn't see her as a person but a Firefly obsessed with finding the cure and killing Joel in revenge for sabotaging the cure.
B. Abby fails to understand that leaving someone alive can lead to you being victim to retaliation (this is why Joel killed all the Fireflies at the hospital) but Abby for some odd reason does this 3 times. The 1st time I will give Abby a break on. But the other TWO TIMES you left Ellie for no reason.
C. Abby fails to understand how dangerous the Fireflies were and how dangerous the WLF are. She seems them as the heroes and everyone else as the feelings.
D. She never considered her friends feelings at all throughout the entire game. Which makes Owen being in love with her even more stupid and makes his character look even worse.
E. Abby is proven wrong about Owen being a dedicated WLF soldier but doesn't seem to care nor is she worried about abandoning her WLF friends and their families at all. Like Joel had to struggle with abandoning his old loner lifestyle because he didn't want to grow attached to Ellie. Yet Abby just abandons her WLF lifestyle with ease and never considers the consequences of doing such a radical change.
Agreed but with less hate. It not complete crap
Oh god the pain you went through Atari, I pray for you everyday
24:27
More sins:
-Dina standing on the glass, shooting down at targets.
-Falling through the glass, and not being catastrophically injured. Did she break bones? No. Fracture her skull? No. Spinal injury (which I have seen from much lesser falls)? HELL-to-the-NO.
Those are higher-than-normal, vaulted ceilings. And she was standing above, adding to the height of her fall. I'd estimate that's a good 12+ feet, plus the thickness of the skylight emplacement (or whatever that is) which is another foot-and-a-half (at least), plus her height (5+ feet).
That's around an 18 foot drop onto tiled, potentially concrete, floor.
Been a while since I watched your videos, I definitely see a change in how you sin games. I agree with many points you made, and that saddens me that the bond between Joel and Ellie was ruined so that Neil can push his CW-style story. Bruce Straley was right: The concept of revenge in a apocalyptic setting with infected around is illogical, yet Druckmann pushed the idea in the sequel versus sharing more of how Ellie's relationship with Joel, how she feels being immune and finding a cure. You'd think he would have continued the idea of the military or the Fireflies search for Ellie and Joel, not Abby.
And this is why no one can create proper response videos to GCN because unlike Dartigan and most other youtubers who mostly do story mode only sins and most of those sins are straight up cringe jokes or false information, these videos of GCN spit out straight facts. Kudos.
Yeah, the other Gaming Sins are TERRIBLE. I haven't watched one in years, so they may have gotten better, but goddamn they were so bad. Unfunny, dumb, cringey, just horrible videos
@@amadeusk525 I always thought Charii was almost at the same level as GCN. **almost**
Has it really been four years since this game came out? Time flies. Long time coming.
It’s funny how the alternate scenario GCN came up with for this game’s plot is similar to what I came up with. We’re all writers here.
Tommy as our companion was a missed opportunity.
Issac is the Hector Alcazar of this game.
It felt like the writers were just guessing on what to write for the script.
Everyone with any sense knew they were gonna kill off Joel even before the leaks. It's the most obvious direction to go with the story.
And yet those that love the game like to hit us with the “you’re just salty that Joel died”. No. We saw it coming from miles away. It’s the HOW not the WHAT.
@@cocob0l0 I liked the game and even I think the events that lead to Joel’s death were contrived asf.
@@lopeshick9607 How so?
Heard the whole alternate story by GCN. And I would have appreciated it’s 2020 game of the year a bit more, if that story played out.
13:24 Holy shit. This. In one video, you've managed to come up with a more compelling story for Last of Us 2 than what Naughty Dog gave us that took 4 YEARS in the making. What the hell?!
Yeah, writers tend to do that when they do a second (and onwards) draft.
TLOU2 is a rough draft presented as a final product, hence why it reads like rejected fanfiction. (Though it's foundation *is* based on Neil Druckmann's factually rejected fanfiction.)
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@@crazyinsane500 Exactly. Though I've written and read fan fiction 10 times better than this garbage story for Last of Us 2.
Y'all are just haters. The game was made, get over it.
Man, I think one of the WORST things in this game is the fact that Ellie sees an actual WORKING video game….. and DOESNT PICK IT UP! I wanted to shoot myself when I found out you couldn’t pick this up! (Also @GCN did you know you can teebag in this game? One of the VERY few good qualities in this retched piece🤦🏾♀️)
Well Ellie is an adult now. She's more mature and has changed. (Sarcasm).
38:10 The fact that Ellie's fight with Abby doesn't take place at the Aquariam where Ellie has the advantage is the game arbitrarily deciding to protect Abby in order to make the player sympathize with Abby.
there is literally infinite number of ways to make your character "not die" when writing a story, if you really think that was the reason ellie doenst fight abby in the aquarium (weirdest complaint ive ever heard in my life btw) was to somehow protect abby then ya, you got autism my man.
@@OMGlvl86turtlepilot I said the game is forcing Ellie not to fight Abby at the aquarium. I never said Ellie chooses to avoid Abby at the Aquarium on purpose. How can you not understand what I wrote? 🤦♂️.
I was extremely disappointed with ending of the last of us part 2 but more so the whole story. The sad part is that everything in this game literally happened for no reason because of the ending. All this game needs is some good dlc, that ties up some loose ends, played by non of the main characters and giving a different perspective, great video man.
9:37 Speaking of character assassination does anyone else specifically remember the whole reason Joel killed Marlene? Joel said it best, "you would just come after her" so it makes sense that he would tie up loose ends and kill the leader of the faction that tried to kick him out on his ass without any supplies. In order to truly save Ellie she needed to die yet in the detached writing of the sequel Abby just finds Joel randomly because that was the only way to make the plot THEY wanted to happen.
Speaking of character assassination even more, Marleen is acting way differently in these flashbacks than she did at the end of the first game. In part 1, she barely gave a shit about Joel's opinion on the matter and acted as if he should just be thankful they're not taking more from him, as well as clearly assuming that Joel only saw this as just a job before he shoots up the place. But now suddenly she's retroactivly "Damn it, Joel deserves to know, he went through so much for us and clearly cares about Ellie!"
Like, yeah, you could say she was putting up a front when talking to Joel, but there's no reason for her to pretend to have an attitude that would most certainly increase the chance of Joel not taking the news well.
Randomly? Did you forget they were looking for Joel?
@@SuperMurray2009 ah yes, to kill him! brilliant
@@nobody2996 That wouldn't be character assassination at all. Marlene was like a second mother to Ellie. She was friends with her mom and had been taking care of her for a long time.
@@SuperMurray2009 And that has nothing to do with what I'm talking about? Joel and Ellie aren't the same character.
It’s amazing how Naughty Dog destroyed all of their credibility at creating interesting stories and great characters with this one game
Not really. It was a very interesting game. It just went over a lot of people’s heads, including yours it seems. These games are for adults after all.
you sound like an asshole
your last of us part 2 head cannon ending is 1000x better than the dogass that was sold for $60 lol, i swear i felt better about your ending than i did the actual product.
The RUclipsrs story doesn't add up. You might want to re hear the story he said.
After all this time, it feels glad to see you finally come back with the milk.
I've been looking forward to your return.