DIY - E-BIKE HACK | Pedal no more No new parts needed! [The Green Bandit]
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- Опубликовано: 16 янв 2016
- This is a video about how to turn your pedal assistance e-bike into a reliable e-moped/scooter. Btw this system is on a bike that has an all or nothing control board. It's not advanced. it doesn't recognize pedal speed.
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Most newer units allow you to engage or disengage the pedal assist with the press of a button on the display.
One down side you will need to make sure the power is turned off when you walk with the bike
Otherwise the turning wheel will cause the electric motor to operate could be quite dangerous
shutdown the system !
@@ashrafhghoneim thats why you always hold the break levers. when maneuvering your ebike in close quarters
@@grandmaster-grouch actually removing sensor from brakes and add like hand accelerator like on e-scooter
What if you simply remove some of the magnets on the drive disc sensor so it thinks your cranks are spinning slower than they are?
So I put the magnets on the wheel that doesn't have the motor in it, I have the motor on my back wheel, so your saying that its goes on the front wheel ?
At least with PAS you can coaster along without adding anymore speed. With this, as long as the wheel is moving there is extra power supplied to the wheel. It seems to me the only way to slow is to brake so as to cut the motor and kill the speed. And what happens if your going down hill? do you have to hold the brake on to keep the speed under control? it seems a waste of brake pads and battery power, It's like some mental mechanical paradox
I am really excited at this idea. I want to keep the magnet disc in place exactly where it is and I have new magnets that I want to put on the spokes. Does anyone have any idea on how to do that? They are small single magnets and I want it to look clean. My thought process right now is to either get a wooden dowel and paint it black, cut it in half, glue the magnet to that and then put a screw through the two halfs of dowel and put the spoke in between to keep it in place but I hope theres an easier way. Like i say, i don't want to cut the magnet ring into pieces and I want to keep it in place for the future or just in case for whatever reason that this doesn't work with my bike
Exactly what I needed, thanks.
Don't listen to this hack it makes no sense if you go into the programming of your screen it has an option that you can bypass the Pas and use throttle
@@garyfox8668 a lot of e-bikes don't have a screen. This hack makes a lot of sense.
Can you hide the sensor somewhere else with a magnet attached to it, so as to trigger it
Or this won’t work?
Does it have to sense a magnet moving across strictly periodically?
Can you tell me the distance I need to have between the magnets and the round indicator or round ring that it picks up off of I'm trying to assemble one on a trike and it's a lot different than on a regular bike
Hi, can I disconnect the pedal assist all together? I don't even want it on my bike anymore: it doesn't work half the time! Thanks for your help😊
Would you have to add a capacitor because these DC Motors work in a delta configuration which do not rotate correctly unless motion is present?.
No you just need a 120 ohn resistor to terminate the CAN bus connection alongside a diode (1N4000) forward biased between the positive and negative of the battery supply.
I can just disconnect the sensor wire plug from the controller wire plug and it just goes off of throttle like pedal assist isn’t even there. I have a rear hub 2kw motor. Seems to have more power and speed because pedal assist doesn’t work at 35 mph anyways.
Can I do this with a Bosch system ebike?
does that work on pedal assist bosch ebikes?
Hey! i am confused as if to what variables does the battery respond? What is the pedelec sensor doing there? sending rpm of the shaft to the controller and not the torque?
It's a very simple ECB. It responds to current variations. It sends 100% power or 0% power depending if there are current variations or not. There are ne torque sensors or frequency sensors.
Is this the same device that limits the motor to 15mph? Because im planning on moving that closer to the pedals and attaching the magnet to the peddle so I can have peddle assist at higher speeds. But now I want to do this too!
If you have 26" wheels set the speedometer to think you have 10" wheels then the controller will think you are going slower than you are
Hello, i have built 3 electric bikes over 5 yrs,all rear wheel Chinese brushless motors,500/1000 and 1500w, all 48v(just had mine stolen though!)not once did i fit this sensor,and everything worked off the throttle. Obviously mine was outside the uk law,but laws are meant to be broken? Thanks for sharing your vid.
Hi Terry and can you help me please I have put o. I have the small magnetic sensor. But very strange🤔. Y coyote connect e bike only moves if I pedal backwards. May e I need too tour it over to the opposite facing side. Yes..?
I have an old bike with throttle & the horrible pedal assist( you have to peddle to make it start). Well not any more as i used a 555 timer chip to feed pulses into the controller instead. Connected to the 5v line instead of the hall sensor). It thinks i am peddling fast all the time :D
First off, nice one!
Now for some questions :)
So is the 555 timer signal just connected to the hall sensors signal wire?
Are you powering the 555 using the 5v power lines to the hall sensor?
What signal rate / frequency did you find best?
Got a link to a schematic or pics or videos?
Hello from Athens, Greece. May I ask a solution if it works better and more easy as I think I see it ? If in this disk with a lot of magnets you remove the half of them will it increase the final assisting speed? Thanks in advance.
Hi, Athens. Did you try this? If so what results?
When you stop on a hill you won't be able to move, but it does invoke some ideas, thanks 😊
So if you disconnect that wire it will go faster correct the sensor wire from the controller
I've done the same thing, but on my bike it has a throttle for how much power I want the engine to use when I pedal. So I put the magnet system on my back wheel (which is powered), so all I have to do is "push off" and my electric motor always kicks in granting me power to the throttle. So in my case, mounting the magnets and sensor to my powered wheel was the solution.
Leave the sensor put magnets all around the spokes and take off the speed limit for cruise control
Interesting!
can i achieve higher speed by removing some of the magnets from the pedal disk instead...!!
+Munther G-mail That would depend on the setup of your sensor
wow tnx this is smart :D
that's when a spoke was a spoke
I have psa and twist throttle so I can use my bike without peddling if I want to. There is no need for your idea of putting the magnet and sensor on a wheel to obtain motion without peddling, a twist throttle automatically disconnects the feed back from your peddles and sends power to your wheel regardless of what your peddles are doing.
Where would I hook up the twist throttle? Million dollar question
Can you show how to increase the speed limit... Because I can use my cycle without pedel but it's limited to 25kmph
Did you ever find out how to increase max speed?
Would it be possible to bypass the sensor? My sensor is broken and I'm thinking about tricking the sensor system so that I dont need a new sensor.
I'd like to know that too.
How can I stop the sensor and use the throttle only . I try to plug out the wires but the bike doesn’t work
If you have an ebike conversion kit with both PAS and throttle, you should be able to use throttle only and avoid connecting the PAS system by just taping the magnet to the brakes sensor and then tape that to the handlebar.
You should be able to use throttle only. Just be sure to ride safety when braking.
Do ebikes still use magnets in 2018 because surely they would loose they magnetism after rain water splashes them over time?
I think it will be much more easy to fix or glue more magnets on the p.a. disc. So the controller see more movement from your disc and supply more power.
George Ale The point is not to have to pedal at all.
@@CHSWEUSA Isn't that the whole point of the throttle though?
I love all these nutty arguments about going too fast and making it unsafe. That is the part the rider takes care of isn't it? There are still brakes.
Thanks for this, I'm using an electric wheel for a project with no pedals and one wheel, so due to the legal requirement - this stupid restriction on the controller was a hurdle.
I thought of doing the same thing, so this video has been helpful to watch someone do this before I must attempt it :D Thanks!
How do u stop if your tire keeps tricking the senser when u press the brakes the motor will still deliver power to the moter
still using lets say maximum assist how do you stop or slow down , do I assume simply using the brake to cut the power off as the motor will be at full blast ?
Yes you simply use the brakes to cut off power. This is probably unsafe if you own a bike with 500 wattrs and up.
I was thinking about making a bike to do something similar. On my Sondors bike you pedal and turn the freewheel some in the process and the PAS activates. But what if I put a freewheel on backwards. If I activate throttle it will turn the freewheel which will then turn the pedals which will then activate the PAS and keep the bike moving, all I would have to do is hit the throttle to start and take off the pedals. Would this work?
How many magnets do i need on my back wheel
Just about to try this hack out
How many magnets did you use? Did you have success with this? Cheers
@@RuffBuster tommy how many magnets you use?
Jesus ..I fell asleep twice !
How abaot to disconnect pedal asist and put throtle to wires?
too logical lol
Doesn't work I try it.
Conceptually problematic. Instead of the controller measuring pedalling speed (increasing power as you pedal faster), instead we're having it measure wheel speed (increasing power as the bike moves faster). This is opposite of what we really want, which is more power as speed slows down on an uphill, and less power as we speed up going downhill.
The system shown might be decent on flat terrain, but I doubt it will be useful for those who deal with hills.
We might, instead find a small battery-powered motor, like inside a small battery-powered clock, and mount the magnets on a disc. wire a small variable resistor dial on the handlebars, to modify the disc speed (and thus power output), by this throttle control.
I'll see what I can rig on my own pedal-assist e-bike and report back.
Yeah I love the idea. Try it! I just kept this as simple as possible.
Sherryn Meyer ,, de verte última etapa del tur de Francia.....
This wouldn’t be a problem for my bike because it doesn’t use crank speed to determine the output power of the motor. Not sure if other bikes are different but my bike has 3 set speeds to choose from. Low, med, & high so the crank sensor only detects movement not crank speed. I can pedal super slow and still reach top speed.
I bet this guy works for NASA now,
This is a pre pandemic.
Trust me A lot has changed in the e-bike word now.
I do not mind to pedal to get power. My problem is the speedometer is wrong and way off. When I know for real I am doing a 14 Km/h speed (8 miles/h) (I commute to work daily in the past months) the speedometer thinks I am going at 30Km/hour (18mile/h) and cuts the power when marks 25. Today was a record according to my bike I was at 40 km/h (25 miles/h) in a bit of the road I know I couldn't reach beyond 21Km/h
This bike It's a pain with so many hills as soon I hit the pedal twice the speedometer jumps high and the bike power is cut off. But looking for a solution I find this hack everywhere. And I'm starting to see it as the solution for my bonkers speedometer which I'm starting to think I should try and cover the speedometer screen.
Go into settings and change the top speed limit and make sure the wheel setting is correct. Also if you choose a smaller wheel the bike will read slower and not cut out. You may have problem with the controller or lcd controller. Is battery and bmf good?
If the speed sensor is on the cranks and you are not in top gear as you spin the cranks faster the bike thinks you are going faster. Gear up to slow down the drive rotations and the electric assist will continue to provide power. Once you are in top gear and max out the rpm, then you are truly out of options without a hack.
One problem with this setup is your going to constantly be running the motor any time the bike is moving which is going to shorten your range. You can’t coast downhill without using power. I had thought of using a push button connected to a small flash circuit board powering a small electromagnet to trick the sensor by flashing the electromagnet on & off but I came across a perplexing obstacle. If the sensor simply reads the magnets passing in front of it why doesn’t the motor turn on when I pedal backwards? Different strength magnets stepping up in power to provide a sense of direction to the circuitry? I think that’s a possibility but not sure yet. Haven’t tried testing that theory. Any thoughts?
The "Double Hall" Sensor detects the direction of the magnetic fields, similar arrangement in the Throttle except there is only one sensor between two magnets.
what happens if u don t connect ur pas sensor ,,, will the e bike still work,,,m,,,xxx
well then, if the wheel still running, how to shut of the power at very requied moments, specially on sharp corners?
what you say is cool, but not safety at all, isn't ?
The power cuts off with a light press on the brake lever. SO that's how the power feed is controlled.
How do you intend to shut off the motor for when you need to brake? ;)
+innergy111 Hi! I let go of the trigger. It's like a remote control car :)
many new bikes do'nt have a triggers anymore but work with torque control on the pedal to control your power...
Jörgen Börg Hi I am sorry there was a mix up with the comments. Initially inergy111 apeared on my longboard video. The motor shuts off using the brakes like a normal e-bike. There is no trigger. The trigger is for my e-board.
The Green Bandit
oh, i understand ;-). frinedly greetings Jörgen
+innergy111 by pressing the brake. Nothing changes on the security shut-off circuit.
Just disconnect the PAS system
Ciao è possibile in italiano
Our saucers work like this
haha noice!
You did actually show hot yo do it and if it works
Hall effect sensor
cut to the chase .great idea - just show doing it.
+Glen Blackbourn You are right! I even annoyed myself ^^ love watching this old montage though. Gives you a real sense of what not to do on videos haha. Hope the idea worked for you though :)
So ....it would be easier to show it than explain it,wouldnt it. I mean if you built one and it works.
is it me if you don't peddle unplug pa done lol
It belongs on the pedal, that's why its called pedal assist.
If you want constant power install a throttle
give praises when praise is due
I`ll reply after I`ve had some sleep 🙃
If you have a “pedal assist” only bike, buy a cheap “5V pulse generator” (NE555 timer) and a momentary push button. Set the pulse generator output to around 25HZ (max for mine was 45). Remove the crank sensor (cut the wires, there are 3) install the push button on the 5V line (red) and wire the output of the pulse generator to the ‘signal return’ (blue) wire. Push the button to turn on the pulse generator, and it will send the pulse to the controller and the back wheel will turn. Let go of button and it stops. Pedal assist only to throttle controlled ebike. Get fancy and instead of push button, wire use potentiometer control that twists like a throttle, with a 3D printed mount.
Why don't u just throw a throttle on it
Hi! Because I am not permitted to by law :( In this country we need to have pedal assist. This is a pedal assisted motor.
It no longer is legal if it is reading wheel speed as you will not have to pedal which will make it illegal. Easier to by-pass the hall effect switch and use a hand control illegal again of course in your country it would seem. All you would need to do is connect positive to positive and chop out the negative.
best part 7;37
pure mor magnet on the fak sensor daaaaaa gos faster
+Nelson Santos Hi Nelson, sadly that is not true for most models. But that is a good idea though ;)
Nope sorry that doesn't work.
you only have problem when you have accident
This doesn’t seem logical? Your pedal assist is activated when the magnets spin, so even after hitting the break and deactivating the motor your motor will just kick on again because the wheels are still spinning. Why not just buy a thumb throttle and connect it to your controller? Seems like less work
Where do you connect that? I think that’s the big question. The circuit board doesn’t have a designated input for it.
Pedal assist is good to have.
Nice hands huh
forget the dislikes
you brought forth the IDEA
now ive seen it...DUH
+Tom Robertson I'm happy that this gave you the idea :) I'm here to share mine!
Yes exactly. ;) Glad to contribute to life hacks
Good evening . And how many BETTER magnets should this sensor have!? I have an older model bike; / There is NO on-board computer, only a small board with LEDs. and its natural PAS sensor consists of only 5 magnets!!! / Today there are 8 of them and there are also 12 magnets. So is it possible to replace 5 magnets with 8? What will change!? Will there be problems later on the road!? Thank you .
Looks good, but has some problems. Your brakes will wear like hell. How do you start cycling? By pushing your bike? Even if you brake, you control unit will still receive the signal that you are pedalling and therefor increase your power to your engine.
I'm not sure this bike will be much controllable... Especially when your motor will oscillate with the pedalling causing it to run at its max power and speed, with only 1 control, your brakes...
Brakes automatcally turn off engine. Where is a detector for this
Hmmm If you don't like pedaling buy a motorbike if you want more speed shift the sensor to the frame and stick the other magnet on the pedal shaft so the two magnets pass each other when pedaling this will trick the controller to think it is going slower than it actually is no resoldering just a bit of glue and a couple of zip ties
hehehe i can see some poor guy trying this and the bike running away him,and he cant stop it. its really not had to add a twist throttle to any ebike ,can just get a pwm driver chip a few components a hobby pcb a throttle with a 5 or 10 k pot be easier ,than hall throttle ,tjhere is plenty of circuit diagrams online
WHATEVER!
JOHNNIE MIRANDA yep whatever he's smoking I want some
Elon musk?
God it's like watching paint dry
His intention is to be helpful & share his discovery, that's all thats counts.
It’s just like a Andy Murray speech,after a game of tennis 🎾
This is clearly going to get you charged with riding a moped without tax/insurance as well as giving you erratic speed control unless you are constantly changing your assistance level. There are settings on your controller display to shut this function down or make it cut in or out at a certain speed. The settings are deep in the menu of an LCD controller display as are many other useful tweaks. Not in the instruction leaflet though so download the full manual of your LCD display to,find out how. If you have the LED display treat yourself to an upgrade. It will be like having a new bike
Yes it could but don't do this on an advanced model you will break it. And yes if you want to hack it you could, but in this case the system is to simple and the idea is to find a cheap and easy way to get away with not pedaling to work.
Seems to me it would be easier to just install a pwm controller that does not req the PAS sensor, or is switchable with hidden switch? These are all over ebay etc, 'currie' is one brand, their older bikes are PM motor and newer are 3 phase (hub motor). Another thought is, if the hall sensor (pedal sense) does not vary assist or speed, just requires 'some' motion, wire a 555 timer chip to a small electromagnet to pulse near the pickup to fake the pm magnets going past. ($2 worth of electronics and could be wired to a horn button on the bars)
In the UK you have to be pedalling to use PAS, otherwise your Bike has to be registered as an EAV.
These people don't care about that, in the same way that people drive cars at 40 mph in a 30 limit don't care. They are happy to ride an illegal ebike. I've done it myself in the past. Just ask any e scooter rider aren't you worried that your breaking the law and I'll bet the answer is no or something more colourful.
@@pauljames4991 It doesn`t help either when the Market is flooded with cheap eBike conversion kits that only work with a Throttle.
The whole point of a pedal assist sensor is to power the motor WHEN you pedal. If you don't want to pedal, then use the thumb throttle instead. If your e-bike doesn't have a thumb throttle (or a cruise function like my ebikeling kit) then you purchased the wrong e-bike.
You sound just like Elon musk….
A lot of pricks in the comments here 😂😂😂
) was
All you have to do is go into your programming on your screen and bypass the pas I think it is po3 and it'll be three options 0 1 or 2 and 0 is both one is one of them to as the other just get on here and ask about the programming and someone will explain it to you don't go screwing up your e-bike when you can just change a little bit of programming
That's one way to invalid your warranty on your expensive ebike
the idea is to improve your fitness level and get to where you wanna go cheaper , not to be
a couch potato on a bike
Most ebike kits have thumb throttle or twist throttle so this is not necessary.
Nah, most ebike have pas mate
the down side is if your brake motor cut of stop working for some reason this set up will always put power to your motor wile spinning .if the motor cut out dont work like it should do you will burn out your brakes and motor faster .sorry pal good thinking but not safe
Yes you are right if the cutoff won't work the motor won't stop. But I doubt this will ever happen and if it does my brakes are much too strong for the engine to burn them out.
it will burn your motor out by putting more strain onto the motor than necessary. i have add a bike where both brake cutouts stopt working are the controller was faulty. by stopping pedaling solved this problem use the brake like normal . its up-to you with what you do but if a ebike kneaded a mot it would not pass with that kind of set up
Not a problem if you have a twist-grip throttle and / or an 'ignition' switch. Both can turn the motor off
Right, they all have brake switches, better be sure to turn it all off when walking the bike across the street though!
Imagine , when you want to make very slow U turn . If you don't hold the brakes to kill the power you can be very surprised. Dangerous. It's call pedal assist. Best position is to be there. Not Rim assistant or wheel assistant. Magnets on the spokes are used for speed calculations. Not for this.
just don't add the pas system if you don't want it, why go through all this nonsense?. p.s. you would have to register the vehicle as a road going bike only, insurance, road fund license, have a bike license for the road, too much hassle.
Learn what the parts are on a bicycle before you teach about a bicycle. There Called SPOKES. ITS CALLED SPROCKET.
He wants me to trust him on a modification. On whatever these things are. They are called spokes. If you wish to teach people to make shady mods. At least have the proper vernacular when speaking. You will be more believable at least.
just put $2 throttle on it.
i like the concept however next time dont smoke so much weed before making a video lol. bet you were baked as lol
My Me Haha no weed, just no prep
Andy Murray Speech !!!
Please don't knowone try this!!! Trip to E R for sure
what's the Point? If I wanted an electric scooter I'd have bought an electric scooter.
+Doran Amatto haha! Well said. But there are countries mostly in Europe where pedaling is required so that the vehicle is not registered as a scooter and therefore taxed and insured.
Depends on legislation. In Switzerland it is very costly to own an electric scooter.
Already have an ebike so i won't want to be another one ... what i ready want to do is remover this pedal-assist and just ride the bike . do i just cut the wires and connect them together . cause ever time i try to pedal the bike takes off.
Doran Amatto thank you he's having trouble with the word spoke disconnect it and ride wtf
Beim nächsten Mal (Wenn du ja vorher überlegt hast, was du sagst), zeichne deinen Kram, und lass es rückwärts laufen! Dann haste Zeit, deinen Text vom Blatt zu lesen! Zum Zweiten solltest du dich selbst mal in eine Polizeikontrolle rein denken! Meinste nicht, das die das schnallen? Fahren ohne Fahrerlaubnis bzw. Erlöschen der BE, is klar, oder?
More than 7 minutes to describe a silly idea to make electric bicycles very dangerous! In Europe it will never work....
In Europe, it works. If you don't understand how things work here just comment further. Nothing is dangerous about this. Maybe your e-bike is too powerful for this.
Nonsense "very dangerous" . EU justifying their existence introducing laws that are not needed.
Sorry I thought this was a joke
I would gi e this video 10 thumbs down if I could supper unsafe should your brake sensor fail you become an angel real fast just instal a trottle in your bike or change the controller to add a trottle
:/
Tried worse way to do almost killed myself while turning slow motor kicked on
Ok dont trash out the bike like he did! Now it looks sloppy... All you should do for the original intended purpose of Not having to peddle add magnets in between the current magnets on the disc. That's the best way safesy way and less hassle.
Adding more magnets overlaps the field. Causes the bike to jerk on and off. You can add more magnets but you need to increase the disc size
I cannot understand why, if people want an electric moped they just don't go out and buy one! Could it be because ebikes are perfectly legal in their OEM form and require no licence, road tax, insurance or registration and electric mopeds do? So what is being advocated is to disguise what is now a moped as a legal ebikes and ride without the legal requirements. Isn't that just as bad as all these illegal motorbike riders we are currently plagued with? It's just hypocrisy and very sneakily attempting to look legal. Just go and buy an electric moped. They aren't much dearer.
Don't compare a acid throwing moped t*rr*r*st, to an innocent millenial commuter on low income trying to get by, if you want to ban transport innovation and go back to horse and carriage, no ones stopping you or your 19th century law for it... find me an electric moped with the total cost(insurance/tax etc) of less than €400, thats the reason why these are worldwide popular, Theres more and more brits commuting on these "illegal" m365 scooters now, pop down to london and have a look. or a quick youtube search m365 london.