Street Epistemology: Rome & Sergio | An Awkward Silence
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- Опубликовано: 19 фев 2015
- Location: San Antonio, Texas
Recorded: 19 February 2015
Released: 19 February 2015
Summary: Rome and Sergio both believe in the Christian God, and put themselves around the 100 percent mark on the confidence value of their belief. I found Rome's position more honest and interesting, so I quickly chose to focus on her. Having watched this a few times, it was interesting to see the dynamic between Sergio's answers and how Rome responded.
And yes, I realize that Hinduism precedes Christianity. That was a distraction that I chose to ignore to keep the conversation moving along and stay focused on the reliability of their methods.
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Audio Only: / ep-113-rome-sergio-an-...
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Mistakes: I started off with Krishna, but then used Vishnu.
Recorded w/Go-Pro. Edited w/PowerDirector.
The views addressed here are mine and mine alone, and are not necessarily shared by members of my family and friends.
#StreetEpistemology #Christianity #Magnabosco #Hinduism #OutsiderTestForFaith #Krishna #Vishnu #Bible #PlanetRotation #AronRa #AnthonyMagnabosco
So Sergio thinks Hinduism is a 'newer' religion than Christianity? Hinduism is the oldest religion in continuous practice. It's at least 1500 years older than Christianity. The most recent revision of it is the Bhagavad Gita which has been contextually dated to 2600 years ago.
+Vlad IV-XianKnightofRomania77 How do you not understand this? Sergio said you have to go back to the root at the beginning. I would agree with that strategy for comparison. But then he says that Hinduism is a newer religion, as if Christianity were the 'root'. No no no. Hinduism is the oldest religion in continuous practice while Christianity is relatively new. Only Islam and Sikhism are newer than Christianity. Everything else is older, and if Sergio (or you) knew about these other older religions and what they said, then you would see how Christianity isn't even original. Sergio sabotaged his own argument on a false assumption.
+AronRa I had the same thing happen during a discussion on marriage equality when the Supreme Court was hearing the case. A Christian friend of mine was literally dumbstruck when I pointed out that marriage predates Christianity - the idea had never occurred to him. The point is crucial because when you realize your belief system is not the authoritative "source document", and you begin to understand the evolution of human faith systems you realize how shaky faith based truth claims really are.
+TheFloatingSheep Ugh, it struck a cord with me too but I think that's his point. In his technique of "Street Epistemology" he wants us to temper our desire to correct people on misconceptions and just sow the seeds of doubt with inquiry and unbiased analysis so that we may help them help themselves. As you said, it activates a shield when you tell them they are wrong because that's what you're taught to do, defend your faith. This is hard, but I think he's on the right track. You could see the gears turning in Rome's head at least.
+AronRa Hinduism is not the oldest religion. Zoroastrianism is older.
We don't know which is the oldest. We can only use science to investigate for evidence. It doesn't really matter as your point is still valid about it being older than Christianity, but, following the guys logic in this video he should be Jewish as he believed we should start at the beginning. His god started with Judaism.
Truth Matters Oh, that would be delightful! Please, let's have a discussion. Doubt can be a good thing to have. I do hope I can encourage you to question everything as I have found it to be very helpful in my life to distinguish between things I should place my trust in and things that I should not.
Would you like to continue to discussion elsewhere since you seem engaged in another one here? Maybe private messaging? If not, I await you inquiry with much anticipation!
When the guy said, "Hinduism is a new religion"... I almost fell off my chair.
Lmao same
Ditto :)
"She wouldn't even listen, because she's so convinced on her religion, that she's just going to close her mind to not even think about other things because she's so into her religion that she doesn't have time to, like, think or talk about others [religions]."
Does Rome realize that the way she described people who don't share her faith is the exact same way those people feel about her?
Rome BECAME the Hindu woman in this encounter.
Yes that was an amazing point in the conversation. I wonder whether Rome realised at the time that she was describing her own reflection? I was waiting for the penny to drop. Perhaps it did happen during the interview or perhaps sometime after? Either way this was a very good interview.
Anthony Magnabosco How did you ever refrain from asking Rome if she herself might be a little like the Hindu woman?
Do you feel, in hindsight, you should have?
It’s gold, someone say something can be used to criticise herself.
these are like the same people who went to US public schools, didn't pay attention or skipped class, grew up and believe nonsense, and then complain about US public schools and how kids don't pay attention or skip class, and also advocate for less funding to public schools and don't think about how other people will also believe nonsense. a circle of ignorance
You are insanely good at ignoring their sidetracked thoughts and bringing the conversation back to your line of thought. This is so hard to do. It's so hard not to go off and reply to every tangent but the conversation goes nowhere when you do that. Every time they raised a point, often incorrect, my mind was screaming to answer, but each time you calmly just kept on with your thought.
The timer thing is brilliant because it puts people at ease. Actually having a physical timer. I wonder how many people you go through to get to these good conversations.
Thanks. It took some time to learn to not get sidetracked on those curveballs, and stay focused on the real reasons why someone holds a belief. Most all conversations that I have are fairly productive like you see here, although more than one person at a time is tougher as there are more distractions and I suspect each person's answer influences the other.
deanmat I just want to say I agree on this. I've seen many videos and its very common that religious people go on tangents.. mostly it seems to really avoid answering the question or see the point.
+Truth Matters okay, let's run the experiment. Why do you believe Allah exists? Is it because the Koran says he exists? And, is that a sound reason for believing Allah exists?
+Truth Matters I also believe that truth matters. So given the conflicting beliefs, and all the cognitive distortions associated with mental (thinking) illness, and the cognitive illusions and bias and just plain bad thinking associated with self deception, how do we people accurately determine what is true? How can they be sure they aren't deceiving themselves given the strong desire to not really die and to see dead loved ones? How can we be sure what is true or real?
+Truth Matters if you don't care about the names why not be a Muslim? Or a Mormon? These all have beliefs. These sets of beliefs just happen to share a similar belief with you. How can we gage which beliefs are true?
He basically said: "Some moons spin in different directions, therefore God !!!" (and he seems very proud and confident in that conclusion, amazing)
Seems like god messed up and spun some stuff the wrong way
He also said Christianity is older than Hinduism, a religion whose origins date back to 1750 BCE. In other words almost thousands of years BEFORE FUCKING CHRIST.
There is no way I let him walk away without telling him Hinduism is centuries older.
Beaste Meauxde I understand your concern, but I think both of these folks walked away with a lot more to think about than history.
Anthony Magnabosco thanks for responding Anthony. I really like how accesible you are. I know you're right, but I have a little more AronRa in me. lol
I remember when you talked about that with AronRa. So I should ask "If I could show you that one of those other religions was older, would you stop believing this one?" He would say no, it's his faith, so talk about faith.
Beaste Meauxde Hey there. Glad to help...this stuff is important to me. Yes, that would be an excellent question to ask Sergio. By the way. this is the encounter Aron and I briefly discussed when we spent time together talking about SE--in fact, you might be able to sort by 'Top Comments' here and find Aron's comment about Sergio's misunderstanding of Christianity being the oldest religion. Thanks for watching.
Edit: And yes, if Sergio (or anyone else) says their reason is faith, go there. But don"t assume faith is their next layer. Go where they take you.
Just say it nicely. Maybe suggest that he double check the historical documentation.
another approach would be to ask him if a religion would be older than christianity will it make it true and invalid christ faith? poor guy probably think his religion is 4000 years old and come with the making of the world...
Hinduism the 'new religion'. Aww, poor Sergio.
A couple of nice kids though, you have to admire their honesty.
Hugh Jarce What religion could possibly have existed before year zero?
bj0rn ah, but there was no year zero.
(Grumble.... who came up with this numbering scheme? It's 69 AP, we should have something better by now... oh wait... betterlikebutter.blogspot.com/2017/08/after-present.html )
LOL @ Sergio's complete understanding of religious history. Hinduism is a "new religion"... LOL.. just LOL. Wow.
Yes I would agree. Sergio, is very cognitive dissidents on the subject of religion. He seem to be a little upset on the questions to which I can see he could not even explain or understand.
let's not ignore that he literally said "all the planets spin one way, but there are like 4 or 5 moons that spin the other way. and science can't explain that". wow
6:15 Sergio claims that Christianity is an "old" religion and then goes on to call Hinduism a "new religion". Hinduism is considered the oldest religion on earth. Sergio strikes me as a guy who is probably very smart but has not further developed his religious beliefs because nobody has ever challenged or questioned his views.
rox290 I like how he doesn't get lost on that detail, religion does beg ppl to mind fuck themselves very deep
Hinduism is the oldest _extant_ religion, not the oldest religion. We don't know what kinds of religions might have existed prehistorically.
2:57 When you asked about how confident she'd be if she was Hindu, there was a moment there where it just seemed like she was having a new perspective. She probably never considered what'd be like from another religions point of view. Great job! Keep up the great work!
Head tilted up, eyes widened, slight smile, yeah she 100% had a new idea going on. Hope she held onto it after the interview.
@@EustaBAracer She probably did, until it was suppressed by her church and priests. The threats churches make against their followers are enough to silence the great unknown benefits of thinking for yourself.
Boyfriend giving her the sideways police eye - "don't fuck things up now"
yeah.
It hurt a little bit to see it. I hope she gets time to think about this conversation by herself.
Judas C
one can hope.
"New religions like Hinduism"...distilled arrogance!
Frups I face-palmed and shouted at my computer after hearing that
So beautiful to watch Rome describe herself, when describing the Hindu believer, and not realizing it..... Yet. Also sad that Sergio has been lied to about the age of Hinduism.
Hitchens would have killed these people in 10 seconds.
But I love that you don't. It would be so pointless, you're approach is great. Please keep going.
Lars Nilsson Anthony is great at epistemology whereas Hitch was great at anti-apologetics.
SE is a process.
Best comment on the internet!!
Hitchens would've let them be tortured until he experienced it himself for almost 6 seconds.
Anthony, I have been following you from the beginning and I have to say your focus was good here. In my experience and what I have learned from people like you and Dr. Boghossian, the moment you start correcting the interlocutor, they become defensive and the conversation is derailed. If one stays patient there may be opportunity to direct them to find their own error through careful questioning.
Thank you for your hard work I appreciate this valuable resource.
When I went to rehab they tried claiming that coincidence doesn't exist. "That was your higher power working" they said. Reductio ad absurdum
WOOOOOOOOOOOW!! Anthony, after watching almost all of your encounters, that silence at the end, and decision to end the conversation was SO powerfull. Boom! you nailed that man! huge respect.
Leighton from Auckland,NZ
You probably didn't want to correct him on hiduism right? Since Christianity is a new religion compared to hiduism.
Yes. I mentioned that in the video description field. Maybe I'll start putting something on-screen to signify when I've noticed something like that during the talk but chose to ignore it to keep the conversation moving.
Anthony Magnabosco
Would you at a later point if you had a second conversation with him explain to him that he was wrong?
I mean, I'm not sure if you want him to "convert" to atheism, or any idea that is more true (or less wrong) than another. But I think it sometimes is effective pointing out mistakes like that.
If that is his argument for why he thinks he is right ( and he probably will make up another one if you correct him) then he will see that his believes are not based on things that are actually true.
Now as I just said, when you correct him, he probably will use a different argument for why he thinks Christianity is more true than Hinduism, but still. His ignorance should be corrected.
I agree that eventually Sergio needs to be corrected on Hinduism, not to mention why other objects in space rotate the other direction. That just wasn't my objective here. My goal is to understand how people have come to their belief in the first place, not actually what they believe.
Anthony Magnabosco I know, I watched a lot of your videos.
To me things like that just annoy me.
Also the "objects in space rotate differently, therefor god" argument was pretty weird and so flawed hah.
Anthony Magnabosco Right, I'm learning NOT to jump on every little mistake that I can spot. It also helps to focus on the point of the discussion to not react to every little side track. I'm LEARNING Tony, don't stop.
I am not religious I would just like to mention. You have a positive approach, you ask questions yet never try to make your interviewees' feel for a lack of better words dumb or misinformed. They are left with questions to think about.
Thanks. You just described Street Epistemology :)
It is truly amazing to watch their body language, that moment when they realize that their beliefs are no more valid than that of any other religious person..... yet they still hold on tight and proclaim that their belief is 100%!? Ive seen this with a few of your videos, hopefully some religious people will see the same thing and realize that they are simply wasting their time.
+Vlad IV-XianKnightofRomania77
And you wasted your time answering a comment that is 8 monts old.
Btw, he is right, most believers never really thought about the validity of their beliefs.
Truth Matters
Hehe, you only showed that Theisms foundation for morality is just as subjective as the humanists foundation for morality.
Simply asserting that your moral standards are objective while ignoring that you subjectively interpreted the moral nature of your god is selfdefeating.
You lost, like every Theist before you and after you. ;)
Truth Matters
"You do not admit raping children is objectively wrong, just a subjective preference?"
Like I already showed you.
When you get your morals from the God of the old testament then you are in no position to claim that raping little virgin girls is wrong.
Except you accept the consensus of historians that Moses was just a fictional character like Noah and Abraham.
Then of course you could argue that the stories about Moses were also just fiction.
You also fail to see the command "you shall not kill" in context. Israelites were not allowed to kill other Israelites, nothing more. ;)
"LOL. I almost missed this insane nugget of atheist stupidity. Since I subjectively interpret that you exist, do you not objectively exist? Is your existence subjective upon my interpretation?"
Actually you are unable to prove that I exist, you only know that you exist and the world that you believe to perceive could be just in your imagination, including me.
Basic philosophy, in this case solipsism.
"You will never be honest. The truth in nowhere in you."
You claim to know things that you can not possibly know.
So you are the one who is not honest.
At least try to be honest with youself. ;)
Truth Matters
"I asked you if raping children is wrong, or just a subjective preference. You refuse to answer my question. Your evasion is proof that YOU KNOW you are wrong. YOU KNOW raping children is morally wrong - not a mere subjective preference. The objective moral duty is proven in your evasion."
-By my subjective moral standards raping children is wrong.
-By the subjective moral standards of the society I live in raping children is wrong.
-By the objective moral standards of the God of the Old Testament raping children is not wrong.
It seems like you also get your moral standards from your society, or maybe you simply refuse to accept the fact that the moral standards of your God are demonstrably not like you claim they are.
"You are all mouth with no teeth Rami. You chatter distractions, but refuse to answer when proven wrong. The truth is nowhere in you. You are profoundly dishonest with me - and yourself. I cannot make you be honest, but I certainly don't respect you. You lie without conscience and recognize no moral duties or shame. In that respect, you at least live consistently with atheism. However, I wouldn't trust you to feed my dog. "
You are just a deluded indoctrinated fool, who knows nothing about science, history and philosophy, or even his own religion.
Its obvious that your only option left is to project your shortcomings onto others to protect your fragile belief in your dying death cult.
But I forgive you, its probably not your fault and you are just the victim of years of indoctrination when you were young and weak. ;)
Truth Matters
"DO YOU (Rami) BELIEVE RAPING CHILDREN IS WRONG - or just a subjective personal preference whereby a child rapist is justified to rape children according to his subjective preference?
Is raping children not wrong if a person happens to prefer raping children - or is child rape wrong no matter what a child rapist prefers?"
Yes the rapist is wrong according to the moral standards of our society.
"You have lost this debate."
I answered your silly questions countless times, and just because you dont want to accept my answers doesnt make them wrong.
Btw, this wasnt a debate!
You made silly claims that are not based in reality and I corrected them. ;)
I wonder how well this could work on conspiracy theorists, flat earthers, etc.
+Voidsworn My guess is not well. They are so extremist, I don't think they would even be open to a conversation of this nature. And if by chance they did agree, they would probably stop it short. I also think they would get angry. I just think extremists would not be as open and receptive to these sorts of conversations like the moderate college kids are.
***** Hmm. I stand corrected. Sorry for stereotyping you. Stereotypes suck.
I would imagine it'd work the same way. You ask questions and try not to laugh. This is a serious answer and not one intended to ridicule someone's beliefs.
I can tell by the look on their faces they weren't really 100 percent certain they just didn't really want to think of the possibility that what they believe could be wrong.
Luckily they were 100% confident. I can't imagine what the conversation would have been if they were 99%.
Immediate sodomy
Anthony is just such a skillful interviewer. He asks very insightful questions to make people think critically
Rome fidgeted with her bottle cap, perhaps uneasy with the discussion. I think she hasn't thought much at all about her belief and perhaps knows it and was just trying to come up with good sounding justifications. I think her faith is mainly "I just go along with it", but maybe she's starting to think about it. She seemed a little less dismissive than Sergio of the idea that one could have doubts. When she says "Yep." she follows with "Hmm." at the end.
Most people, especially 'newly minted' adults, cant really articulate their beliefs because they havent actually LIVED them consciously .As an adult.
I don't think she's actually religious. I think she just didn't want Sergio to know that and the interviewer stuck with her.
I love these! Keep it up, Anthony. It's great how you get these college kids thinking.
man, look at her gears turning.
Lol. It won't take much.
@ 6:09 "I think it starts with the roots... Christianity started a long time ago, and the new religions, like Hinduism, started a little bit later after that"
Ugghhhhhhh.... Hinduism is 4000 years old!
Dude these are awesome, keep up the excellent work.
"Tides go in, tides go out....."
Keep up the impressive work Anthony.
One Love Anthony! You're the man!
It's pretty clear (and amazing) that most people have never asked themselves even the most simple and obvious questions about their religion and what they call faith.
Step one: Place the belief within the context of provisionality (1-100% scale).
Step two: Identify cultural indoctrination a contributing (the only?) factor.
Three: Personalize the possibility of a different cultural background. ("If you had been raised Muslim...")
Four: Inquire if cultural conditioning has or should have anything to do with actual truth.
Five: Demonstrate that another also uses cultural conditioning as justification for believing something contradictory. ("A Hindu is just as convinced as you...")
Six: Ask how we might determine which culturally conditioned belief is correct. (4:30 - Anthony is a master at eliciting this inquisitive while simultaneously perplexed state in his interlocutors.)
Seven: Ask if the third-party culturally conditioned person should be willing to change her beliefs.
Eight: Ask if the aforementioned third party might ask the same of the interlocutor.
Nine: Ask if the belief is largely or perhaps completely determined by cultural conditioning, is it fair to hold said belief with a high level of conviction.
Ten: End.
I will say that Anthony did not do Steps 7 and 8. I added those because I thought the conversation could have gone in that direction. Anthony is obviously more of an expert than I at this. And I think Step Six is the coup de grace of this whole exercise and if that is achieved in under five minutes, SE has tremendous value.
I'm still amazed at your work my friend. Since I've watched your videos more than a few times, the above was simply an attempt to tease out the process you tend to follow. For anyone reading this, Anthony is the only one I know of that actually engages in Street Epistemology, and although this is certainly not the only way to do it, I have to say that it seems rather effective at getting people to apply a more cogent epistemology to beliefs they at least initially thought were rational.
One of my favorite moments in this exchange is where Sergio at 6:00 shakes his head no. The way he handles any potential cognitive dissonance is to shut down the whole dialogue. In my opinion, for him, even considering his beliefs might be wrong is a complete non-starter, most likely due to the social penalties he'd experience if he ever revealed to his peer group/family he didn't believe anymore. Thus the freethought movement - anyone should be free to believe or disbelieve anything at any time without fear of reproach from family or friend, government, business or entity.
Nice work. Some of these sessions are quite revealing. I admire the way you stick to your S.E. technique and sail right past his Christianity is older than Hinduism statement. I don't know that I would have the discipline to do that ;-)
Wow. Sergio knew and understood what Anthony's point was, and yet he still completely shut down the possibility of considering anything else at all. He did it completely knowing what he was doing.
Hey! I really like your videos but I had a thought after watching a few of them. In every single one that I've seen, every person that you are talking to always says that they 100% believe in their god (at least when you first ask them). Do you think this could be a result of how you ask the question? I feel like when you phrase it as "0% is not at all, and 100% is total confidence", it makes people think that 100% is the "correct" answer for someone who is a part of their faith. Maybe you should try giving examples of what the other percentages would represent, like 75% is you are fairly sure but have had some crises of faith or something like that. I just thought I'd suggest this because it is so frustrating to see people say they are 100% confident when they really clearly aren't.
Hey Anthony, I stumbled onto your videos and found them quite interesting. After watching a few I realized how your effective your approach is in most cases to get people to "think". One of the more frustrating things can be a non thinking conversation.
I also noticed how you never spent any time to correct the multitude of false claims and just stuck with the faith and pie chart approach. You never directly challenged the belief you just asked them to think about the make up of the faith. Really effective way of jump starting an indoctrinated brain.
i love how uncomfortable you make people feel, even with the simplest and least harmful/antagonizing questions. you can literally see them dealing with the contradictions in real time. well in this case, you could at least see it in Rome. Sergio, ehhh he's got some learning to do before I think anything will open up his mind.
Well said. I agree with you.
I like how that ended, how you just left that thought with them. Brilliant.
"Well, miracles..." Breathtaking testimony
A lot of work needs to be done in America.
Scary
Um, to be fair I don't think they grew up in America but yes, America needs help.
Wow this is great, its like stepping out of the box of the usual theist/ atheist conversation.
Anthony this video is another great example for showing those of us who are used to debating using facts rather than addressing epistemology, how to ignore the bait. So many of us I'm sure would want to pounce on Sergio's timeline error regarding Hinduism and Christianity. By ignoring that, I think you really left Rome with something to think about and I think Sergio is just one "History of World Religions" course from having his worldview rocked! haha!
Just curious, how often do you see the same person and they try to avoid a follow up chat with you? Obviously this would be due to the internal conflict they might not want to deal with... Thanks really enjoyed the video!
It is rare, but I intend to go to this location for several days in the hopes of running into the same people again for follow-up interviews.
Anthony Magnabosco you should start giving people your business card with contact info so that they have a chance to get back to you later if they don't see you again.
Kesha Kesha Yes, you are right. Working on it now.
Rome made a telling admission at 5:47 which Anthony failed to acknowledge properly, as I think he was more focused on asking his next question. She basically said that the Hindu woman spends a lot more time thinking about her own religion and doesn't even bother considering others, which is why she would be so unwavering in her beliefs. This of course explains why ALL religious people assume their religion is correct and more valid than others. He could've highlighted that crucial detail after she said it. But Anthony again does a nice job at picking the ideal moment to close on. His last question was beautifully rhetorical, and their illogical answer and subsequent silence was a fitting way of hammering that point home. They couldn't possibly walk away from that encounter feeling like they gave him sufficient answers in justifying their beliefs.
Loved the video! The one question I was hoping you would askwas what would happen to their belief if they found out that Hinduism was older? Great convo! Thanks so much for your work!
Crypto Facts Hey! You’re good at this! Thanks for watching.
"Because she's so closed minded and doesn't want to think about other things.'
[wait for the penny to drop]
[waiting...]
[waiting...]
It never comes. What a complete lack of introspection and empathy.
How did it feel bumping up against that wall? Don't tell me you weren't frustrated, Anthony!
I kept waiting for him to call her on it, as least a little bit. Something like: "Do you think that what you've just described would apply to you at all?"
Man you could tell Rome was really thinking about it there. I would have struggled to stop from smiling simply because of how happy I was that she was really questioning it.
Sergio failed to know that Krishna and Vishnu Precede the jesus story.. Krishna was also born of a virgin fwiw.. Great videos thanks.
Horus too.
You blew their minds dude.
Nice!.
I love your approach to these Theists. It's very interesting to see their wheels spinning when you ask your tough questions re culture and exposure from upbringing. I bet if you see them again, they will not want to talk to you. I would think they were made uncomfortable since you were making sense.
That was a joy to watch.
This method is genius. It allows genuine thought and discussion while ending peacefully. Walls are not thrown up by confrontation.
They seem like they have never considered this before. Now they probably wont be able to stop thinking about it.
From the get go, when you engage people, they think you are a preacher and claim immediately 100% belief in a god. The trap is set and you slowly show them the error of their ways... Pretty cool. These are interesting discussions. I love to see peoples brains tick in real time.
I can't wait for you to come across someone who will be honest with you:
You: "So how did you come to have such a strong god belief?"
Interviewee: "Through an argument from ignorance fallacy."
I wonder what Sergio would have said if you had told him that Hinduism is older than Christianity.
It's a strange thing to me. That if you ask someone if they believe in a God. They say 'off course we do.' This would almost never be the case in my country. In fact I wouldn't have a whole lot of people to talk to about that here. I still enjoy watching these video's so much. To me this is still the best way to make someone think about what they believe.
I’m just wondering, do you yourself have any beliefs on religion, and how did you come to them?
Oh yeah. For sure. I’m quite vocal about my nonbelief.
I was raised a hindu in India, so I just use myself as the example, just as you did. Good job.
Science can't explain why some celestial bodies spin in a direction different to other bodies? Seriously? Go play a game of billiards. I'm sure you can get various balls to spin in various directions. Simple Newtonian physics.
I've heard this weird claim about things spinning in our local solar system back in my old church days when I was really young. I don't understand what the origin of this urban myth is.
their last yep just blew me up. did they even understand what he asked? :c
Sadly I suspect they stopped thinking about it before they even walked out of the frame....
I finally found the Ray Comfort of Atheism!!! Go up to unsuspecting individuals, who are not expecting your probing questions, and ask them about their faith! This is how poweful and immature conversations are done! Props guys you have sunken to a new low, enter into a debate or at least encourage them to know why they believe what they do. Please be different than so many others who have gone done this immature route.
So powerful...... ( which god do you believe)? Anthony this is a great subjective view. Great job.
I had the privilege of meeting Peter Boghossian this evening. Excellent philosopher and I'm definitely going to put into practice his techniques from now on when speaking to theists.
Truth Matters Charade? Boghossian is an expert on personal belief. He specialises on criminals where he unravels their beliefs and helps them learn how to alter their ways and become better people.
Truth Matters lol don't you think quite highly of yourself. You're obviously very deluded to brush him off as a con artist and dishonest. Knee jerk reaction I guess from a strongly indoctrinated Christian who is trained to dismiss anything at a whim that goes against your particular doctrine.
Truth Matters Leading questions? You think asking rational questions is 'leading questions?' That's why you're deluded. You don't like real questions.
Truth Matters lol avoiding questions doesn't make you clever, it just makes you an idiot.
Truth Matters You are incapable of holding honest debate. I can prove that by having a debate with you. Pick your topic.
The part starting at 5:35 - could you have pointed out that the hindu woman might say the same about her? I know it's a tricky line - push too far, and they will put up a wall (I think Sergio had his up almost from the start, thanks for focusing on Rome, who seemed to be more thoughtful).
Is there a reason you choose Rome over Sergio to continue conversing with?
Edit: You seemed to focus more on her. Just something I noticed. Short conversation must have been hard to give these two equal time I understand.
Good catch. It was a split-second decision.I did try to kerp Sergio in the loop throughout, but yes, for some reason I decided to focus on Rome. Maybe I sensed tthat she sermed more open. Dual-interventions are always more difficult (for me) than one-on-ones.
That was so hard to watch. How ol girl gonna sit there and describe herself 😑😑😑. Sergio need to do some more research
“New religions, which is Hinduism”
Keep up the good work!
Roots of Belief: Indoctrination & Ignorance
I feel that even though you pried them wide open on this one, ready for dozens of corrections we're hoping that they make themselves, I get the feeling both are walking away coming up with reasons in their head to reinforce their prior belief because they felt vulnerable. Very interesting one though and great self control on refraining from corrections on this one, would've been pretty tough for me.
Is this supposed to prove something?
almost atheist no, not necessarily, why do you ask?
Just wondering, it seems kinda pointless and obvious that people are a product of their environment- if someone believes they have the trust and are comfortable with it what's wrong with that?
This isn't on a Uni' Campus is it?
Watching this 5 years later. Follow up on Rome?
Jason Clarke Sorry, not at this time.
Well done ! you got them to think.
I don't see much difference between this, a common question that Anthony asks:
Christian: I believe in God because of miraculous personal experiences.
Anthony: If you had not had those experiences, would you still believe?
Christian: Yes, of course!
And this:
Sergio: I am Christian because Christianity is the oldest religion. We have to start at the roots.
Anthony: If there were a religion older than Christianity, would you still believe it?
Then Sergio could have said that yes, he would still believe. And Anthony could have continued with the faith-related line of questioning with him and his viewers resting easy because we would realize that there is no point in correcting him. I know these conversations aren't about proving anyone wrong or being confrontational, but it would have made more sense to mention that Hinduism is the older religion so he could have gotten down to the real reason he believes in Christianity instead of making that up. Or even ask him in the way I mentioned so that you could get the answer without insulting or correcting him.
You should ask people, "what is your best reason for believing in a creator or a god?" the response most give isn't sufficient to support the claim/belief and follow up with, "How did that reason lead you to the conclusion that your god may be a reality?"
good video though, they seemed really reserved lol
Seems like this might be the first time either of them were asked these very basic questions. Maybe it made them think about their answers?
they don't appear to be on that 100% confidence scale they said they were on
7:04 Really great that she said "hmmmm" after that very last "yep".
Awesome place to stop.
There is so much ego involved here, you can see it in people's faces, getting annoyed that someone is punching holes in their belief, is like they are thinking: "I don't care what you say I'm not gonna' let you win"
“All the new religions like Hinduism.” 😳
There is value in what Anthony is doing here. His method gets the theist (or other dogmatist) to "show their work;" or tip their hand.
In traditional encounters, the theist is guarded, they are in defense mode. So they try to hide any weaknesses in thinking, avoid exposing contradictions and non-sequiturs. Very rarely in that format does someone come out to expose their thinking - their logic, show their work.
With the approach Anthony is taking, he gets the theist to openly explain the nature of their belief, the nature of their thinking and logic. Pretty much everything that the theist tells you in this format would be "hidden" in combative encounters.
"An Awkward Silence." What awkward silence?? They were both considering a lot of what you asked. They were also thinking they might not like being challenged like that...so they were ready to leave. Personally, I don't call any Silence Awkward..and I'll chat deeper than most people. I do pretty well with body language and such. :) Some very good questions, as usual. Be-LIE-fs are very much related to how you were raised. Challenging "Sacred Cows" can be very, very challenging for a lot of people. Very good session.
5 minutes is over so quickly. It's hard. I hope you get to speak to them again than you can ask Sergio about the epistomologic logic behind "older = more true".
Rome only answered "yep" after Sergio already answered, even though the question was directed at her (right?). I think she might have answered differently if she where alone.
I noticed that as well, her body language wasn't as rigid as his after answering, you can even see a sudden eye shift of realization. She seems like the kind of person that would accept a different view, but the group think keeps her in a blissful comfort zone.
How are these two at university? "The scientists can't explain why some moons spin the wrong way." - what the hell is this?
Ahh, I was really hoping to see Sergio's face when being informed of how old Hinduism is.
"Is there a God?" and "Why do you believe in the one you do?" are two different questions. I think people may have a different "0 to 100% scale" position for each of those two questions. A person may feel intuitively, or for whatever reason think, "surely there must be a God", but may recognize that they believe in the God they do because of what they have been taught.
i think not the scale is here to have a general overview on the belief. The other question is about what make this value in the scale and so tend to think again about the value put in the scale. Indeed there're differen question but lead to different answers and thoughts. The why meeting the level of certainity and exploring the why lead to potentialy change the level value.
good one
Switch the timer to ten minutes, I have never seen a video that is resolved in five minutes.
Quote from the religious epic known as The Cleveland Show:
Cleveland Jr: Why are you a Christian?
Donna Brown: I'm a black woman in the south.
Cultural conditioning is one of the biggest things that determines what we think and do.
You show amazing restraint in not going off track with some of these people. Like when the guy states that Christianity was the oldest religion & everything else came from it. I'm sure you know that Hinduism is much, much older...but you showed restraint & ignored it and stayed on track with your original question. (I think I would have had to point out his error though, just to show how little they know about their own religion.)
So the Sanskrit & the Vedas originated around 11,000 years ago, isn't that before Christianity?
not 11,000 years ago..but definitely older than the bible.
Sergio was oozing charisma.
our sergio is a bit pushy eh? stepping in to save rome from having to think. "i have an explanation, it's a guess, but it'll do".
Haha true. In the last moment when Rome does (hmmm) he looks at her with slight insecurity.
Is it wrong that my first thought watching this video was "when in Rome"? I tried to get it out of my head but it just wouldn't happen, this isn't the type of thought that you can just "un-think".
Pretty much exactly what I thought, as I'm sure any red blooded man would. Total babe.
I really enjoyed watching this, however;
You say that your intent is to understand how they got to their belief system, but when Sergio says "half heritage, half observation" you allow only an anecdotal mention of these. Why, for example, didn't you pry him further on the limitations of science and how this correlates to the (non)existence of god?
I think the entire thing came across as loaded, which is fine except you explicitly state its your intention to understand. (this is the first video I've watched of yours, maybe you are trying to coerce by reason).
At the time, I just had the sense that Rome was more open and honest, so I decided to focus on her more than Miguel, but still tried to include him here or there in the conversation. I ask you watch my channel intro video (and one or two of my tutorials, if time) for a better insight into my objectives and positions.
A christian with a tattoo - Leviticus 19:28, which says,”You shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor tattoo any marks on you: I am the Lord. He should read his book surely ?.