and who decides what is "bad"? It's a very slippery slope into silence and fear when mob justice rules. We've gotta be really careful about the tremendous power that holds, and wield it wisely.
Same with Dave Chappelle. Like while I've seen some pretty horrific stuff said about him on twitter, I've also seen some really nuanced, critical takes from trans and lgbt+ influencers but he and his fans like to lump it all together to discredit everything, including the solid, thoughtful critiques.
I wish they had someone on the podcast that was “cancelled” over something that doesn’t matter like doing something “cringey” like making bad music or not dancing well enough on tik tok or something. Gabbie wasn’t cancelled she was held accountable for her awful actions
@@savannahhhh777 that's even saying too much. She was just a teen who wanted to do something fun with her friends, there were no "managers". We bullied someone for being a child ☹
@@chloedsmith I didn’t know that Rebecca black was so hated until recently. I was 10 when that song came out and I actually loved it 😂 I sang that song all the time
People give tea channels crap for lack of research when Red Table Talk, a whole-ass show with producers and an entire team, somehow failed to make note of the long list of Gabbie’s scandals 🥴
I was thinking the same thing Mark! So unfortunately the show got their facts wrong and fumbled the whole interview! Could have been a really good conversation if they had the correct information about their guests!
@@hwoods-kg1jf Another theory I read was that Gabbie and her team might have paid the show hush money for them to not bring any of those scandals up and paint her as the victim, but I’m not sure if I believe that 😂
@@FateWorseThanDeath he barely does lol he has a thousand or more people that follow him faithfully and that’s it He can barely reach 1k likes on Instagram anymore 😬😬😬
@@societycrumbles He has made videos about how he was in the past. How he would out people and basically make celebs life a literal hell. He even apologized to the celebs/people before this cancel culture thing had started. He has said that he chose to change how he does things ( tho im not a regular watcher so idk if things have changed or not ) but he has owned up to what he has done. I think becoming a father changed his outlook some things
It baffles me he still thinks what he was doing wasn’t that bad. He was literally harassing women and girls for just living their freaking lives. He’s such a slimy person and I hate that he’s still somewhat famous
I think Madison has been unfairly cancelled, but I think charli was fairly justified in why she got cancelled. She partied during a pandemic and put everyone at risk, went on holiday and used “I need a break” as an excuse which is why it rubbed people the wrong way. I don’t agree with people sending her death threats, that’s fucked up but it isn’t justified to say she was labelled cringe and not being held accountable.
@@mj448 dont know anything about the n word incident but apparently the blm photoshoot thing was a photographer who was shooting pics during a protest, noticed madison was there, and asked if he could snap a pic of her for awareness
To me this "cancel culture is so evil, I should be allowed to be an awful person with no consequences" and "we should approach this with love" is a direct result of how schools deal with bullying and fights in school. People who are bullied are always told to "be the bigger person" but all that does is allow that kind of behavior to continue and it teaches people who are bullies that there are no consequences to their actions. It also teaches them to aspect that no bad behavior will yield any consequences and in fact the person who spoke up at all was in the wrong. That they shouldn't have tried to get them in trouble for being a shitty person. And they also just expect the person being bullied to just forgive. Like why? Why should anyone have to forgive someone for being shitty to them? Why aren't they allowed to feel angry and never talk to that person again? My point might be getting a little lost now that I'm pissed but the gist is cancel culture cannot and should not be treated like two 5 year olds getting into a minor insult match on the playground when you get to serious issues. You cannot expect both parties to apologize and be best friends again because they forgot about it. People don't forget when other people seriously hurt them: physically, emotionally, mentally etc.
Yes! I was bullied in school and my primary (elementary) school told me that. They told me 'ignore the bullies, don't react.' Because I was told to do nothing and the school didn't do anything, the bullies kept bullying me and when they were forced by the teachers to apologise I was supposed to forgive them. Even though I knew they were going to bully me again. It hurt me when I was forced to accept their apology because they didn't mean it. I couldn't say 'no, I don't accept your apology because you seriously hurt me.' because I'd be the one in trouble with the teachers.
No youre right on the nose with this. I remember thinking "this is what an adult bully looks like" when GH started on the whole "but i also deserve an apology" nonsense with jessie smiles
So true. My older brother was the biggest bully for majority of my life. I was constantly told that me reacting is what made the situation worse. I was meant to just ignore it, keep my head down and say nothing. Why, so he could verbally and physically assault me without repression? To this day, I’m told to just “move on” and “stop living in the past”. Complete garbage. Said “past” is as recent as 3 years ago. I was 24 and he was 26. Garbage.
@@anonymousperson2839 My biggest bully in life was someone like you though. She must have been serioulsy hurt by having to accept their apologies, that she became one as an adult.
I feel like Janet Jackson was wrongly "cancelled". Her career was never the same after the super bowl incident. That being said, just because of who she is, she'll never be hurting for money
Except I don't know anyone who was mad at her. Do you? People who liked her before continued to like her. The issue was nobody would hire her or promote her. That's not cancellations - that blacklisting. Which I didn't see Hollywood boo-hooing about that the past 60 years as they did *that* left and right.
Gabbie Hanna deleted her videos on her channel like what she did never happened. She actively tried to change history to spin her narrative but people like us definitely won’t let it slide.
Also, you can still find the videos where Gabbie Hanna is called out for her wrongdoings on the channels of JessiSmiles, Joey Graceffa, Daniel Preda, AlxJames, etc.
And the thing is Gabbi isnt even cancelled… she still is making music, still has a large following, still has a platform, still gets a lot of love… Idk why Gabbie keeps complaining when shit could be a lot worse. She just dislikes seeing any negativity about her on the internet.
I was wondering if you would be covering this interview with Gabbie. The fact that they did ZERO research into understanding who Gabbie actually was and what she's done is grossly negligent.
@dali I think we can acknowledge that multiple people can be bad at the same time. The reason a lot of this energy is directed to gabbie is because she keeps bringing it up and trying to expose all these people for being 'mean' to her, that, in reality, she herself has wronged. She also refuses to take accountability for anything she has done, as evidenced by the red table talk.
@dali Gabbie for 2 years defended and stood by a rapist (even after convicted - not of rape but of SA) proven by multiple tweets the day the story broke and the following months + years of contact with the rapist. Some former friends have come forward quoting GH as saying "you're lying you don't know the situation." And allegedly was blackmailed by the rapist with a video saying Gabbie believed him and would never speak badly of him. (Which she hasn't) and as recently as this year she hinted that Jessi was not "actually raped" because of a kink/fantasy Jessi at one point mentioned. Moving on from that - Bullying several people (Angelika, Rachel Oates, Oscar Wilde, Alyx James) this ranges from name calling, shaming them for followers/views, to their own personal content. Gabbie once claimed Alyx James physically hurt her but then later deleted the claim when Alyx came forward and threatened a lawsuit on Gabbie. There is a video of Gabbie on her youtube channel talking about the death of a classmate, she describes this classmate as "a druggie on the wrong path" and alludes to the girl commiting suicide - this was not the truth and an incredibly misleading representation of that young woman and the accidental overdose that occurred. These are the big, morally questionable choices and actions of Gabbie Hanna that she has repeatedly refused to acknowledge any wrongdoing for. Gabbie thoroughly believes she is the victim in all cases, citing she was never friends with the rapist and never defended him (proven untrue several times over), that those she bullied deserved it for speaking about her, and several other excuses she has made to defend her position as the eternal victim. Then there is the smaller "scandals" such as Kenza cosmetics, a scam Gabbie pushed to her fans then famously said "lower your expectations" the issues surrounding her false claims of the set of Escape the Night, etc.
@dali As far as actual crimes, there were several instances of Gabbie threatening minors in discord, accessing their personal information (emails, addresses, etc) and blackmailing another influencer. Aside from this she broke the Terms of Service on Twitter, Patreon, Discord, and Instagram. (By using her followers to mass report other creators, encouraging her followers to bully and harass not only creators but fans as well) Gabbie also spread rumors about a creator saying she had "R**** a little girl" and was "incredibly dangerous" *this claim was proven false beyond any doubt.
@@lilman20477 with all due respect, ALL of these people cannot ALL be suffering with specific disorders that make them unable to accept change. They’re shitty. Period.
I feel like “cancel culture” is just a buzz word without true meaning now. Like some people who want to defend problematic individuals just throw it out so they don’t have to come up with a real argument. It’s like a wall to just stop any accountability.
Only "woke" is more annoying to me than cancel culture. You aren't cancelled if you still have a platform. Not supporting someone you don't approve of isn't cancelling, its just a choice
26:28 Thank you! As someone who is a poc it always rubs me the wrong way when people are like just be nice to the racist person because your better than them. Personally, I would never put up with it. Why do I have to be nice to someone who doesn't see me as an equal. I'm over that narrative at this point. Ps: This is my opinion and you have the right to disagree.
Yes! "So much for the tolerant left" when someone is calling someone else out, drives me crazy. Being tolerant of a difference of an opinion, or because someone annoys you is one thing. Being tolerant of a racist assh*le, sexist, bigoted, etc is enabling and quite frankly shows me how that person *really* feels.
Exactly, no one should have to be tolerant of something that is harmful towards themselves or others. Tolerance is not how we enact change, speaking out and holding people accountable is.
This reminded me of what I believe to be a generational difference I noticed at work. We have a coworker who does not hide that he stares at women and make them uncomfortable. The older women I talked to said," it's gonna happen. We (women) don't have any way to stop it." I was like, fuck no, I don't like that and it's not right. I want to hold him accountable, not be nice. The older women kinda stared and just shrugged.
HELL YES!!! As a queer black woman, I'm so sick of the "you aren't going to change someone's mind with anger" bullshit. It's great that Daryl Davis exists and he can do what he does. But that is not my path and it doesn't have to be your path. Anger is justified. Anger is normal. I'm not going to hug someone who doesn't think I deserve human rights.
Exactly! People act like being angry makes you 'irrational' or 'less able to see the truth'. But personally, if your reaction to blatant racism and prejudice is 'objective' calmness, then I think that's the less rational response.
it IS insulting to compare what perez did to real celebs to the self-victimization gabbie , a youtube NOBODY, did to herself. either the person who conceptualized the ep idea is either very out of touch or gabbie/her manager worked double time to sell her unhinged a55 to be on the show.
I work for a talk show and you’re right. Unless you’re a local celebrity (Gabbie isn’t) or you’re a huge name celebrity (definitely not Gabbie), they don’t call you, your manager has to sell you to them and in Gabbie’s case, probably keep bugging them until they literally had such an open day that the producers went through the laundry list of B to D list celebrities whose managers are all begging to get them on the show. People like Scarlett Johansson get the producers asking them to be on the show. Gabbie doesn’t. So in my professional opinion, I can say with certainty there’s no way in hell her manager hadn’t just annoyed one of the Red Table producers enough that they decided to put her on when they couldn’t find anyone better.
YES. I can disagree with you and still be friends when it’s about sports teams or music tastes, but calling out racism or sexism or homophobia isn’t a difference of opinion. I think people’s fear of cancel culture comes from the idea that they only get one mess up and then they’ll lose everything, but if someone is “calling you out” it’s usually from a good place, where they want you to be better.
Also name me one person who got canceled who made one mistake and then wholeheartedly apologized and made up for it. Rather it usually involves a pattern of shitty behavior and complete unwillingness to take accountability for anything.
Exactly. An honest mistake is one thing (especially when it is followed by remorse). But if you are repeatedly acting or speaking out in such a way that impacts peoples livelihoods, you are not making a mistakes and you deserve to be held accountable for these action and you do not deserve a platform.
I know it doesn’t always happen but very often the people with repeated bad behavior have been warned/helped/reality checked by people around them multiple times. they just only listened when it affected their money/fame. then they say they “only got one chance” but it’s like… people have been telling them things for years? come on now.
i cant get over how well you speak, at the end when you entered *full rant* mode you kept your composure while still making your point crystal clear, like i’m genuinely impressed even though your public speaking skills weren’t the point of the video lmao
so in general, i hate most things about how academia works, but one thing I love is that everyone always has to define the terms they are using. That is something that i wish was more common in mainstream causal debates. Like what counts as cancel culture vs regular online harrasment and bullying. what counts as cancel culture vs deplatforming criminals that have massive public influence. I wish just one person saying "cancel culture has gone too far" would define what cancel culture is before they say it.
I think some people depend on the ambiguity of “cancel culture” as a concept so that they can make whatever half-baked claim they want and call it “cancel culture” without having to back up what they’re saying with well-reasoned arguments. They don’t want more accurate terms, because then they’d have to actually engage in honest discussion, which is not what they really want.
It looks like they did so much research on perez but none on gabby like it's embarrassing to let such a venomous cruel person victimise herself in your show and not challenge her. "Cancel culture" does not work or exist if it did gabby wouldn't have a platform to act a fool
Canceling has also become synonymous with criticism, I've noticed, which is SUPER frustrating Latest example that comes to mind is Chris Pratt being cast as the voice Mario in a movie coming out. Media spun it as people who didn't like that casting decision were trying to "cancel" Chris Pratt...that's not how this works. That's not how any of this works 😑
As a sociology professor, I'm constantly blown away that my college students don't automatically see a connection between plain old social sanctions (praising or punishing by parts or all of society) and "cancel culture." They're the same - it's just faster and more widely seen on the internet so more strangers can get in on it.
Ohhh I’m so excited for this! PS: Truly appreciate all your hard work and effort for Glowmas! Thank you for wonderful content! Being graced with Smokey glow everyday has been so special ♥️
You know who’s fully been cancelled? The Chicks. (When they were Charlie Damelios older sisters name) chicks. The right fully cancelled them. Removed their music from radio and completely stopped their career at the absolute height of it. This is cancel culture. It’s when people are cancelled who shouldn’t be. Anyone else is being held accountable, and are typically failing at becoming better people
I think about them so often when it comes to cancel culture. They were done so wrong and never fully recovered from it even after coming back. And they didn't deserve the cancelling in the first place. All they did was share an opinion that many people had, it wasn't even a problematic thing they said.
they didn’t get cancelled. they’ve been blacklisted from the industry since like 2003 because they publicly criticized the president. but the last few years have been some of their most successful. you might be talking about lady antebellum who changed their name to lady A because antebellum is associated with racism & slavery but then an existing black artist with the name lady A was like wtf that’s literally already my name
so true! my favourite podcast did a three part series on "cancel culture" and spent a whole episode talking about how the chicks are one of the only examples of someone being cancelled and they were cancelled by the political right, whereas when people talk about cancel culture now it is always the political right accussing the political left of trying to cancel people
I feel uncomfortable with grown adults spreading "Cancel Culture is Bad >:(" instead of "people feel so out of power and that celebrities get held to so little accountability, they have gone a bit rogue with it."
this was a really good video because people always have so much to say about cancel culture that it's become one of those buzzwords that's just thrown around, and hearing from the perspective of GH and PH of all people... just one note about the concept of young people not being involved in having social opinions, i think the idea of kids not "having to worry about that" comes from a place of privilege. i feel like many young people who are from marginalized communities simply do not have the option of not thinking about social issues and how their own identities intersect with those causes. granted, this doesn't excuse that teenagers are often the ones to take things too far. but at the same time, the only people who do not have to worry about things like racism, sexism, xenophobia, etc were never the ones being harmed.
So much this!! I grew up in privileged white household. I didn’t have to start forming political opinions until it started to peak my interest. But of course, if a social issue was directly affecting you, you would take a stance on it no matter how young. Therefore, I think teenagers are 100% valid in expressing their social opinions as long as they understand the intricacies of expressing this on social media.
I really appreciated your final thoughts on the “love and compassion” narrative Hannah! I’m dealing with that right now due to the whole antivax movement. My best friend is an ER nurse and she is being put at risk by this movement EVERY SINGLE DAY, and she is experiencing major anxiety and career burnout at 23 years old. Sorry but I can’t coexist and approach antivaxxers with any understanding, not when it’s directly impacting my loved one (and putting my elderly relatives at risk but that’s almost besides the point now). That fundamental disagreement and lack of compassion on their side makes me completely unable to be nice to them and I will hold them accountable for the burden they are placing on the healthcare system and the harm they are causing to the scientific community due to the peddling of false information. (And this pretty much applies to the entire political divide that surrounds any sort of direct harm to actual human lives). I won’t apologize for that.
@@HornedAngel333 This is why its important everyone who can gets vaccinated, so those who genuinely cannot do it are safe thanks to herd immunity. your reasons are justified, its not like you go out of your way to spread misinformation, its not comparable. I hope you get a straight answer from your doctors!
I am feeling the same way! My dad works on the distribution of the vaccine and I've seen people online call him a money hungry murderer when in reality, he's getting paid much less than he usually does. But he accepted the offer because he felt a duty to help. I cut off those people in my life cause I just couldn't stand seeing my dad work 12 hour shifts and come home exhausted then go on Facebook and see him and others like him being insulted .
I’m 28 and I absolutely agree with you in regards to 14 year olds having political opinions and how it’s actually a good thing, I’m so proud of how the younger generation are able to stand against the racist sexist homophobic opinions of our parents and grandparents in ways that I never could have done. It gives me such a hope for the future and makes me feel like the world would be a safer place for my daughter no matter what she wants to be when she grows up.
I’m leaving this video in tears, and I could not be happier about it. As a gay man, the messaging of the video, especially toward the end, is a shining example of how we need to be approaching the conversation around human rights and decency going forward. It does not work to offer love and compassion to people who will continue to deny love and compassion to others. All that does is enable further regression into a world where hate thrives. I think another reason that contributes to a lot of people looking the other way from other’s poor behavior is because there’s this overwhelming sense of exhaustion with “wokeness” that comes from the damaging messaging that somehow civil liberties and human rights are radical topics. When in reality, they aren’t radical at all - equality for all should be the most critical of foundations upon which society relies, and we can’t let ourselves become tired and complacent in that fight. Regarding “cancel culture” in general, I love the idea that we need to be more open to the fact that it’s NOT a one-size-fits-all, nor should it be weaponized by offenders against people who are fighting to hold them accountable. People like Gabbie Hanna can kick and scream all they want, but the fact is we’re transitioning into a world where there’s no more room for bullshit. Own up to your mistakes or get out of the way for the ones who will. In the video, you ask how we can achieve a world where we will no longer have to deal with this type of behavior - I honestly don’t think we ever will. A world like that would be Utopia. But my hope is that we WILL get to a place where the consequences will finally reflect the severity of those behaviors in such a way that we can ALL finally live harmoniously despite our fundamental flaws that come with being human. Thanks again for all you do. ❤️
Seems like the theme of the episode wasn’t so much cancel culture as it was “giving a platform to bad people.” Sitting down unprepared and letting an absolute snake on the grass like Perez Hilton or Gabbie justify themselves is unproductive and harmful. Them being invited to a platform like this proves that cancel culture doesn’t exist. Online harassment is a real problem, and nonsense like this just throws a smoke bomb on the ground and avoids the real subject. Gabbie and Perez Hilton should not have a platform. They ARE the people doing the online harassment in many cases. Maybe they should’ve spent the episode talking to that professor and learned something.
Look, I have a "Gabbie Hanna friend", she's an SA apologist, her BOYFRIEND SAed me, and she basically got me shunned out of a feminist group that I cared about a LOT. I don't even care about him, I fully LOST EVERYTHING, because of him, he doesn't deserve me remembering him tbh. SHE was the one that destroyed me. A WOMAN, believed him, cancelled me to our friends and her family, and set precedents about the whole thing, he's basically never been ANYTHING to me but harsh reality, but SHE betrayed me. She now blackmails me about physical stuff that stayed with her in her country, so I WON'T open my mouth about her boyfriend's SA, and I can't stand that my ex best friend is doing this. So I understand Jessi wanting to FULLY cancel Gabbie. JUST LIKE, Jessi & Gabbie, my "friend" did me real wrong. Some stuff is unforgivable sometimes, and there's A LOT of "eureka" moments to do with tr**mas. I can't ever forgive Gabbie, for some evident reasons. Never watched Perez, don't care about him, just f***** let Gabbie think about her stuff, cus she got it WRONG. She can talk to me if she wants, if anyone reads this. It'd be dangerous to let people like Gabbie go without realising how their acts have affected someone's life as a whole. Cus she hasn't realised. You can tell. Anyway....
Oh I completely agree about the whole cancel culture not really being a permanent thing, of course it does play a role in actually pressuring the justice system do its job in some cases. Where I don’t completely agree is the notion that normal everyday people don’t have to worry about being canceled. Though it’s more rare that their shitty day/decision would go viral opposed to an ‘influencer’/celebrity I think the backlash would be much worse because they don’t have any media presence besides the incident in question and they don’t get the chance to have a public redemption arc. But yeah idk why they had Perez and Gabbi… different eras, different issues lol. Go off, girl. Love your videos💛💛
this was also the one and only point I disagreed with in the video. and I think it's kind of worse on the Left because we often don't give those people empathy in their viral bad choices so as not to appear tainted as they are in their BadnessTM whereas people who go viral for bad things and should be cancelled on the Right often find a sympathetic ear for the anti-"oversensitive Left" and end up rebounding as important people on the Right. That couple from the gated community that pointed weapons at unarmed marching protesters, Kyle actual murderer Rittenhouse..... it's so f***ed.
Not only that but smaller and/or niche communities are affected a lot by people misusing callouts and such. Yeah, we are used to seeing people essentially do mass criticism of a celebrity with varying levels of tact to straight mockery but to do the same thing to a random person? With a callout that didn't sufficiently prove they were dangerous? Random people don't have the same resources to deal with that. Random people need their jobs. This is not accounting for the fact that we're talking about mob mentality on top of everything and that biases is definitely a play in this type of situation. Meaning a person of color might get intensely campaigned against vs someone who's not that did the same thing.
I think where we need to start is with an actual definition of what "cancel culture" is. To one person it can mean "there are consequences for your actions", to another it could mean trolls and bullies running an innocent person off line, affecting their life in negative ways. I tend to lean toward your meaning, Hannah. "A day of reckoning". Edit here- whoever the producer is needs to do their job. Research their guests, etc.
Hard agree. Too many times, I’ve seen people argue and it’s like they’re talking about two completely different things. Somehow, “cancel culture” has been so warped that too many people have completely different perspectives on what this “culture” actually is.
When it comes to celebrities and boundaries, one thing i just hate. The fact that fans are so invested in the celeb's personal life. The speculation, and everything. I don't think anyone should stick their nose into someone's relationship. What's even worse is that some go and hate on the celeb's partner/lover.
You said so many things that I agree with. I’m always impressed how your rants always manage to still be so coherent and focused. I loved how you said we need to find a way to make sure we don’t have to hold people accountable in the first place.
Piggybacking off the final thoughts portion: I've been saying this for a while and I think it's a useful perspective to have on things like cancel culture. Basically, the way people are being called out for their shitty behavior, the protests going on everywhere, people cutting off homophobic/racist/etc family members, it all feels like what happens when you set boundaries with an abuser or narcissistic, but on a macro scale. People focus on how the victim reacts vs the abusive behavior that violated their boundaries in the first place. This analogy was super helpful to people like my parents, who genuinely want to understand and learn and grow but still have a lot of harmful things they need to unlearn.
Just something I just noticed is a lot of adults who say things "I didn't have to worry about that when I was a kid" probably didn't who didn't grow up where people weren't openly against you. Like if you were a teen and had like gender or sexuality crisis, leaving a religion, or just being political divided against your patents will very quickly become socially conscious and learn about cutting off certain people. I dont think its a new thing, I think adults who didn't grow up in that situation are just learning about it.
To me "cancel culture" seems like a catch all term for anything from bullying, social accountability to legal accountability. I would love if we could go back and start differentiating between different kinds of "cancelled". We have the terms and concepts, why not use them?
Any SG video with “A Rant” in the title I am HERE FOR. I absolutely agree with all of your points. The idea that “cancel culture” is not the problem but the solution is so right, if we’re talking about it in the sense of holding people accountable for their shitty behavior.
i just absolutely love your comments on kids getting involved. I work at a high school and ppl who arent around kids have no idea how much more socially aware they are nowadays than we were when we were teens. It is sad but like you said its a good thing because they can control their surroundings much better and that will save you from toxic relationships in the long run
Soo ready for this! Been absolutely loving Glowmas!!! Sad its almost over. BUT you & Charles have KILLED it this month! Sooo appreciative of all the content
The problem with the Estefan Red Table Talk is they do not have the range to host discourse on cultural issues and shifts. Oh, they can talk about it, but it’s all surface conversations with little to no depth: always hollow and lacking true understanding to carry the weight of the message that needs to come through. I remember Canceling being used to warn others as “hey, this person is trash for doing x,y,z: they’re canceled (until further notice).” It was a warning to not consume anything from them, but keep it pushing. The problem is we were supposed to move on from it. Then White Fragility entered the space and muddled the movements. Gah!
I was watching a recap video of the talk last night and I honestly couldn’t finish the video bc Gabbie Hanna was so full of bs and so genuinely convinced that she’s been a blameless victim throughout her entire career that it pisses me off but also really deeply concerns me. how does one just put themselves so above everyone else that they refuse to take any accountability at all and also try to twist the narrative to fit their version of the story (like her taking down the majority of her videos so ppl who aren’t already familiar w her can’t go back and double check her “I’ve never talked about anyone on my channel” bs)???? MS MAAM LICH RALLY STARTED HER CHANNEL WITH STORY TIMES ABOUT OTHER PEOPLE 😭😭😭😭
I think this is my favorite video of yours I've ever watched. The question "who has actually been cancelled" has been on my mind a lot. All these people who complain about being cancelled sure are doing it VERY LOUDLY on platforms that reach millions of people. That sure doesn't look like cancelation to me.
i think part of the problem is that the people who HAVE "actually been cancelled" are people who we never would have known about in the first place. as you note, a lot of people with lots of money and a huge platform like to complain about being "cancelled" when what they mean is their reputation took a hit - but the people actually being run off of social platforms, isolated from their support networks online, etc. are not rich & famous. they're random people who maybe had 500 followers on twitter, or got a little bit of attention on a niche side of tiktok, and then somebody pulled out a screenshot of them saying something problematic and they became the villain of the week in their internet circle. those are the people who actually get successfully bullied into deleting their accounts and leaving whatever fandom/hobby/social cause they were initially participating in. so then we end up with these discussions where the only people speaking up as "victims of cancel culture" are the ones who were never really cancelled in the first place, while the ones who were have already been pushed into silence.
As for young people (as an old person), the moments that surprise me using social media is when someone younger says something to a celebrity via tweet via comment and then the celebrity responds. And then the person usually says something along the lines of, "I didn't think you'd see it!" Like, I know not every celebrity is in charge of their social media page, but some are especially today where everything is so accessible and sometimes that makes people more accessible in a way they weren't when I was a kid. It always surprises me that they think this person doesn't see it and is affected by it and doesn't have a reaction to it. Let's treat social media knowing that there's a person on the other end of that tweet or that post. It's not all anonymity.
Could not find a SINGLE thing I disagreed with in this video. Spot on and on the mark with every single word you said. I have not been watching Glowmas because I have had SO MUCH going on but my sister tells me daily how incredible your glowmas videos have been. I have so many videos stocked up and will be spending the next few days binging your amazing content. I look up to you as a creator and I am so proud of you for all your accomplishments and your strength. Thank you for your hard work and dedication to your craft.
Loved the video, I've grown frustrated with the way most people talk about "cancel culture" so I really appreciate this (and the rest of Glowmas!). I actually wanted to discuss the two things you said (how cancel culture is being co-opted as a political talking point, and how many younger people are a lot more socially aware of certain things) are actually inter-related. While it's most blatantly seen in the acts/laws trying to be put into place that ban the teaching of systemic racism(so as to protect the feelings of white people), it also comes in the form of the backlash to cancel culture. Attacking people trying to hold others accountable as being 'overly sensitive' or 'just trying to cause problems' is actually pretty insidious (and also ironic). This applies to other things as well, and while there are aspects of the way we talk about this stuff online that could definitely be done better, I do think there's something very telling about how the people making such a fuss about it are the people with the most power.
Couldn’t agree more!! Especially the last few minutes. It’s impossible to be kind to everyone bc being kind to some people is cruel to others! Thanks so much for being such a thoughtful creator 💖
I don’t think cancel culture started w bad intentions and genuinely worked in holding people accountable for their actions, but social media blew it so out of proportion that it’s lost it’s meaning and has become more of a peer-pressure thing to try and police other people’s likes, dislikes, opinions, etc and an excuse to bully people who go against your own views “cancel culture” doesn’t even work anymore. we see this v clearly w Shane Dawson, James Charles, David Dobrik, the Paul brothers and even Gabbie Hanna. they all disappear for a bit while their scandals are still hot topic but after the talk dies down a few months later, they come back like nothing happened and whatever hit their platform took rarely impacts their earnings or viewership or reputation bc everything is forgotten in another few months as they keep uploading as if nothing happened another reason I think “cancel culture” is no longer effective is bc people genuinely “get over it” (the topic) after the hype has died down, which allows problematic creators to emerge back from whatever cave they decided to hide away in. cancel culture no longer holds people accountable - it’s just for drama and people who actually care about the problems created are told to shut up and get over it bc it’s been months already. but like you said, there’s no real solution either so like 😭😭😭😭 SORRY THIS COMMENT IS SO LONG AND PROBABLY FILLED W ERRORS AND HALF COMPLETE THOUGHTS SHFKSNFKEKF
I agree with everything you said. But certain people still need to held accountable for their actions. So what’s the solution? When someone says something racist or homophobic etc, are people just to ignore it like nothing ever happened? What about Mika Stauffer who adopted a disabled child for clicks and views made boat loads of money because of him then re-homed him like a pet when his disability became too much for her 3 years later, should society just let her get away with that? Not trying to be argumentative here, I honestly think it’s an interesting conversation. So, please take my words with all due respect.
@@FreyaWarr dw about sounding argumentative, I totally agree with this! unless we find another way to hold people accountable, they will always find a way to shed tears and notes-app-apology their way back into a fair amount of people’s good graces. they will still gain money, still gain fame, still have fans blindly fighting on their behalf, still get promos, etc etc. cancel culture only works to a certain extent, was kind of what I was trying to say - people on the internet who already have such a big following will rarely truly get canceled, especially if they have other influencers backing them. Jenna Marbles is a good example of someone who’s taking accountability seriously in the way she as an Internet personality can imo: apologizing and saying she’s leaving RUclips and actually sticking with it long-term (can’t speak for the future, of course, but I admire her for this in the moment). as long as these people have a platform to return to, they will 100% find a way to do it and manage to slip back into their old ways unless they are genuinely learning from their mistakes and trying to improve as a human. I think taking away their platform for good would only be a starting point, though, because there’s still potential for plenty of people to be like “oh, I just need to hide this part of myself” which is so easy to do on the internet.
I’m so glad someone finally said this. When a majority of people are voicing their anger at a public figure’s actions, that’s not cancelling! It’s called consequences, and everyone has to face them. I’m really tired of people blaming cancel culture for their favourite celebrities being called out, when 1: they’re almost never ACTUALLY cancelled and blacklisted from the internet and 2: they made mistakes/inappropriate actions that NEED to be corrected and called out. And you said it so much better than I ever could
I agree with most of what you are saying, but I do think that the issue with approaching things with "love and compassion" is not as cut and dry as you are saying it is. I think that most situations in which two parties disagree can lead to genuine and productive conversation. Though some of them are loud, the population of people that disagree in basic human rights for all (and are not willing to change their minds) is small. I completely agree that there is no room for niceties when it comes to people like that, and I share your anger towards them. That being said, I don't think that we should give up on having conversations with people that we don't agree with just because terrible people like that exist!
THANK YOU for talking about "cancel culture". in 2020 and throughout 2021, yes, we threw around "cancelled" a lot, but we often used it as a term to hold problematic people accountable. a lot of news organizations took it and ran with it, thinking that the entire internet just ruin random people's careers for no reason at all.
such a good video with so many excellent points! when I think of CC I think of people bullying strangers online bc they feel justified since their target "deserves it" (no, they don't deserve it. _no one_ deserves 💀 threats, kay-why-ess, harassment that pushes them to the point of no return, etc.) people are really obsessed with justice in this sick and demented way but it is absolutely necessary to have societal penalties to harmful/hateful behaviour so I also agree that CC is a solution and also that it needs to be directed in a way that isn't bullying and harassment (all this is agreeing with the video)
Also the whole “love and compassion” propaganda needs to end, not only is it just flat out performative but the only ppl that perpetuate that rhetoric are ppl that aren’t going to be directly affected by the negative things that happen to regular ppl, like during the beginning of the pandemic when ppl were losing their jobs and being forced to stay homes and and the celebrities were like “peace and love 🥰” from their million dollar houses, Uhh peace and love for you ig bc I’m losing my house if I don’t pay my bills YOU however are making money in your sleep sooo 😀🖕🏾
While i agree that "kindness" can often be a buzzword for toxic positivity AKA "just don't talk about this because it's bothering me," Love and Kindness are really the only ways to make positive changes. Correcting someone is loving. Holding someone accountable is loving. Having respectful but firm conversations with people you have relationships with is loving. Love is wanting the best for someone, and putting thier needs (to be educated/informed/enlightened) above your own comfort (to avoid conflict). It's radical, and often doesn't feel good. It can be a hard road to walk, but when we embitter ourselves in moral outrage to the point where we can't associate with anyone who sees the world differently, and can no longer feel compassion for other people, we need to take a step back from "calling out," IMO. Of course I'm not saying it's our responsibility to let racists or homophobes into our innner circle, but everyone (right and left) runs a real risk of creating thier own echo chamber, and then demonizing anyone who doesn't toe the party line. For example, screaming that someone who is anti-vax is an irresponsible murderer isn't going to make that person want to be vaccinated, and while the most extreme people might never come to the conclusion that they should be, more moderate people will be converted by honest and compassionate discourse than anger and hatefulness.
To this day I didnt know that Lauren Jauregui was outed by Paris Hilton and I was online when she came out. Its not that related to the video, but its so crazy how invested in their projection of her her fans were at the time, they were cheering that day in a way that I thought she came out willingly, a lot of "everyone already knew!" and "so when they will confirme camren is real?" and most crazy reactions were people that were glad she was lgbt but sad she was with another girl out of their ship. It was a very strange time, how her being outed was dealt with this way because it was something the fans "wanted". Like even if they exposed their ship, in a world where Canolla is not a insufferable plain af hetero, they would get happy they were right instead of mad they were outed without consent. A lot of these were young gay girls, who had no contact with queer people in real life and projected really hard on them as their connection with gayness but I think this issues go deeper. Like at the time of Hunger Games, when Jlaw was still very broadly well-liked for her "cool girl persona" and that was the major leak of celebrity nudes, mostly hers, a lot of her fans were like "lol everyone going crazy, like Jen is gonna care about this, she doesnt give a fuck and everyone loved the pictures", spreading the pics further and then she came on statement saying how she felt violated and like her life and career were over. I know its not popular to feel bad about celebrities these days BUT this issues with projection, desumanization and scrutiny they receive when they are victims of crimes is not normal and still goes on today. Its so crazy how the environment cultivated online is that liking an anime villain makes you a irredeemable freak and talking about being glad a character died makes you a sociopath but people barely bat eyes at edgy/troll accounts joking about Megan being shot, Ariana's PTSD from a terrorist attack, BTS's V deceased grandmother etc like... those are real people being talked about and there are real people behind those account saying all this nasty stuff about them. Yeah, went off topic
"Camren" shippers are fucking toxic. Same as eith Larry shippers. They tore real friendships apart for the sake of their own fanfic. People still go on with this and act as if these couples are real and Louis and Harry are secretly together. It is WRONG. Even if it was true. No one should be put in that position.
you are literally the only creator that perfectly articulates exactly how im feeling with empathy and intelligence but without watering down your message.
You have been such a savior with glowmas lol thank you for covering this! recovering from surgery the to turn around and get ready for another major one has been so stressful, its nice to be able to escape it for a little bit ❤
omg I have been binging all your GH videos from this year so this is literal perfect timing edit: also I hope you're feeling better, and please do not hesitate to take breaks and delay uploads when you need to!! your physical and mental health matters more than a daily video ❤
I’ve really been enjoying all your Glowmas videos and have watched almost all of them and I just get really positive vibes from you and your videos always make me feel better,so thanks for that
It’s so crazy and gross how people can’t just admit when they make mistakes. It’s so easy, and it makes everything better. Everyone makes mistakes, but not being able to own up to it is unacceptable in every aspect of life.
Hannah if you ever write a book it needs to be on cancel culture you have already refined your position on this so well- I feel like if you collated the key events in which you've covered it thus far you'd have a really comprehensive text
Wow! I absolutely love hearing you talk about makeup, but when you get passionate about important topics, that’s when I want to applause! You word things in such an eloquent and simple way that it could actually change some peoples minds. So so well said!
Gabbie Hanna calling Perez Hilton a hypocrite for not taking accountability, as she proceeds to take no accountability whatsoever, lives rent free in my head.
You are 100% right. We cannot approach people who are hateful with love and compassion if they are not coming from a place of love and compassion. They do not deserve an energy that they are not giving.
I just find the whole conversation around CC amusing because people will argue that ‘cancel culture’ is good in theory, but whenever it’s been shown in practice it is never effective or fair or based on nuance. The internet makes it impossible. That’s my perspective. Lindsay Ellis did a great video essay on the subject that I found damn eye opening.
Hannah!!! This was so amazing, especially those final thoughts -- whew!!! Feel like I went to church and had a sermon that was actually worth listening to! Speak on it, sis
Well done, Hannah. Perez, in his blog heyday was heinously toxic expecially to young women and celebrities who had not publicly come out. He has no excuse and should have just taken accountability. Gabby is never going to take accountability, obviously, because she still acts like she is a perpetual victimized by viewers who don't get her. What a waste of a round table.
There’s a great series of eps of the podcast You’re Wrong About that covers cancel culture and they use The Chicks (fka The Dixie Chicks) as a case study of Bush-era ‘cancel culture’. Worth a listen for anyone who enjoyed how Hannah articulated her thoughts on this Gabbie/Perez RTT since the podcast explores similar things from a similar lens… Another banger Glowmas video Hannah!!!!
I agree with most of what you said, however I think that occasionally cancel culture goes too far. Contrapoints, Lindsay Ellis and Sarah Z have very long videos talking about their experience with their canceling and it made me realize that the left can have impossible standards for their creators. Shane Dawson getting cancelled for his continuous racist videos is fine, Lindsay getting cancelled because she tweeted that Raya and the Last Dragon was similar to Avatar is excessive. They were both labeled as racist but their infractions are very different. And to me what Lindsay did wasn't wrong (although it's not on me to accept an apology) but each person is going to have a different sensitivity level. And because being a RUclipsr means being at the whim of the court of public opinion, a very small but loud minority can make their life a living hell. And yes it's bullying but it's all under the umbrella of holding someone accountable. And part of why this is so insidious is that it tends to happen to smaller women creators who have less power and the ones who are doing it feel like they are doing a good thing. And the content creators criticisms of 'hey maybe my life shouldn't be upheaved because of a bad take on Twitter' get lumped into this idea that powerful people hate cancel culture because it means that they can't be racist, sexist, homophobic or ableist anymore. There is definitely more nuance than that.
Thank! You! This really is an issue, but it only affects people who 1) are already progressive-left and have communities or supporters who are also prog-left 2) lack the influence and money that major celebrities have 3) are guilty of small or nonexistent infractions People really are out for blood. Honestly, I had to leave many LGBTQ groups because everyone was just treating each other as an emotional punching bag under the guise of "calling out" or "accountability." We need to do better.
@@jacquelinealbin7712 Thank you for making my point in a more succinct way. I was worried that in my rambling my point would be lost. I'm an incredibly small creator (I only have 700 followers on IG) and there are things that I have thoughts about in the community that I'm a part of but I'm honestly so terrified to say anything because I've seen how quickly the pileon can happen. And I'm worried about talking about being scared because then people would say you shouldn't have anything to worry about as long as you're one of the good ones. Like even posting that last comment felt risky. And I think it's a part of cancel culture that never gets talked about until a creator gets cancelled. Not because I don't think other creators don't worry about it but because until they cancelled they have everything to lose.
Great comment, very insightful. Everything you said was true. The way Natalie, Sarah and Lindsey were viciously attacked disturbed the hell out of me. Their so-called liberal, progressive fan base just used them as a vessel to project their rage onto. None of them even got a chance to take accountability because people were too busy sending death threats.
Cis people love to bring up contrapoints and lindsay Ellis. There are much better examples than those 2, start with people like Isabel fall or someone who didn’t actually do something worthy of some sort of accountability or at least a mild push back.
@@redo5oh I understand that point. I used Lindsay, Natalie and Sarah because 1) They are a pretty good example of what I'm talking about 2) They all released very long thoughtful videos about their experience 3) They are fairly well known in the RUclips space (I don't know who Isabel fall is) But each example is going to have it's limitations.
I hate when people use “cancelled” to mean their reputation took a hit because they did something bad
This!!
Yes!!! Like baby that’s just life
Agree!!! No such thing as cancelled.
And the people who defend them simply cause "cancel culture = bad". Its so frustrating
and who decides what is "bad"? It's a very slippery slope into silence and fear when mob justice rules. We've gotta be really careful about the tremendous power that holds, and wield it wisely.
you are everything.. couldn't agree more legend!!!
Yaaaaas! Love to see my fave loving on my fave!
AMEN🙌
favs on favs 🤌🏻
Right.
Smokey Glow x Chris Klemens 🛳⛴🚢
I feel like a lot of influencers conflate “receiving criticism” with “being cancelled” and that needs to change
This!
Same with Dave Chappelle. Like while I've seen some pretty horrific stuff said about him on twitter, I've also seen some really nuanced, critical takes from trans and lgbt+ influencers but he and his fans like to lump it all together to discredit everything, including the solid, thoughtful critiques.
Cancel culture protects certain groups from rightful criticism with the latest -ism and -phobic label. Talk about the irony.
I wish they had someone on the podcast that was “cancelled” over something that doesn’t matter like doing something “cringey” like making bad music or not dancing well enough on tik tok or something. Gabbie wasn’t cancelled she was held accountable for her awful actions
rebecca black would have been such an interesting guest!!! she was so hated on for choices most likely made by her managers
Omg I was gonna say! Rebecca black would've been a v interesting guest to have!
@@savannahhhh777 that's even saying too much. She was just a teen who wanted to do something fun with her friends, there were no "managers". We bullied someone for being a child ☹
@@chloedsmith I didn’t know that Rebecca black was so hated until recently. I was 10 when that song came out and I actually loved it 😂 I sang that song all the time
They should've had the Friday chick
People give tea channels crap for lack of research when Red Table Talk, a whole-ass show with producers and an entire team, somehow failed to make note of the long list of Gabbie’s scandals 🥴
@Domi B honestly hear you for sure. It really feels like it with the sheer volume of enabling nonsense going on
I was thinking the same thing Mark! So unfortunately the show got their facts wrong and fumbled the whole interview! Could have been a really good conversation if they had the correct information about their guests!
@@hwoods-kg1jf Another theory I read was that Gabbie and her team might have paid the show hush money for them to not bring any of those scandals up and paint her as the victim, but I’m not sure if I believe that 😂
ESP when there are literallly 100s of videos on RUclips outlining them point by point
@@markramos1216 yeah that could be a possibility as well! Wouldn’t surprise me!
The fact that Perez Hilton still has a platform is honestly baffling to me
@maria daza When did he ever take accountability? He's been the same shitty edgelord he was 10 years ago. What he does was never cool or funny.
I didn't even know he did still until this video honestly
@@FateWorseThanDeath he barely does lol he has a thousand or more people that follow him faithfully and that’s it
He can barely reach 1k likes on Instagram anymore 😬😬😬
Not as baffling as James Charles tho
@@societycrumbles He has made videos about how he was in the past. How he would out people and basically make celebs life a literal hell. He even apologized to the celebs/people before this cancel culture thing had started. He has said that he chose to change how he does things ( tho im not a regular watcher so idk if things have changed or not ) but he has owned up to what he has done. I think becoming a father changed his outlook some things
Please don’t forget Perez Hilton also took an up-skirt photo of Miley Cyrus and posted it online, when she was a minor…
It baffles me he still thinks what he was doing wasn’t that bad. He was literally harassing women and girls for just living their freaking lives. He’s such a slimy person and I hate that he’s still somewhat famous
I've HATED him so much since I was a child, he's disgusting and annoying
🤢🤢
WTF?!
Jesus...
They should have had Charlie Damelio, or even Madison Beer on Red Table Talk. People labeled cringe instead of actually harmful.
Right?! Especially because they could also talk about online bullying.
I think Madison has been unfairly cancelled, but I think charli was fairly justified in why she got cancelled. She partied during a pandemic and put everyone at risk, went on holiday and used “I need a break” as an excuse which is why it rubbed people the wrong way. I don’t agree with people sending her death threats, that’s fucked up but it isn’t justified to say she was labelled cringe and not being held accountable.
@@kenzieperez02 im pretty sure madison said the n-word and used blm as a prop for a photo shoot so idk if thats unfairly cancelled
That's a really good idea, I'd watch that.
@@mj448 dont know anything about the n word incident but apparently the blm photoshoot thing was a photographer who was shooting pics during a protest, noticed madison was there, and asked if he could snap a pic of her for awareness
To me this "cancel culture is so evil, I should be allowed to be an awful person with no consequences" and "we should approach this with love" is a direct result of how schools deal with bullying and fights in school. People who are bullied are always told to "be the bigger person" but all that does is allow that kind of behavior to continue and it teaches people who are bullies that there are no consequences to their actions. It also teaches them to aspect that no bad behavior will yield any consequences and in fact the person who spoke up at all was in the wrong. That they shouldn't have tried to get them in trouble for being a shitty person. And they also just expect the person being bullied to just forgive. Like why? Why should anyone have to forgive someone for being shitty to them? Why aren't they allowed to feel angry and never talk to that person again? My point might be getting a little lost now that I'm pissed but the gist is cancel culture cannot and should not be treated like two 5 year olds getting into a minor insult match on the playground when you get to serious issues. You cannot expect both parties to apologize and be best friends again because they forgot about it. People don't forget when other people seriously hurt them: physically, emotionally, mentally etc.
Absolutely all of this
Yes! I was bullied in school and my primary (elementary) school told me that. They told me 'ignore the bullies, don't react.' Because I was told to do nothing and the school didn't do anything, the bullies kept bullying me and when they were forced by the teachers to apologise I was supposed to forgive them. Even though I knew they were going to bully me again. It hurt me when I was forced to accept their apology because they didn't mean it. I couldn't say 'no, I don't accept your apology because you seriously hurt me.' because I'd be the one in trouble with the teachers.
No youre right on the nose with this. I remember thinking "this is what an adult bully looks like" when GH started on the whole "but i also deserve an apology" nonsense with jessie smiles
So true. My older brother was the biggest bully for majority of my life. I was constantly told that me reacting is what made the situation worse. I was meant to just ignore it, keep my head down and say nothing. Why, so he could verbally and physically assault me without repression? To this day, I’m told to just “move on” and “stop living in the past”. Complete garbage. Said “past” is as recent as 3 years ago. I was 24 and he was 26. Garbage.
@@anonymousperson2839 My biggest bully in life was someone like you though. She must have been serioulsy hurt by having to accept their apologies, that she became one as an adult.
I feel like Janet Jackson was wrongly "cancelled". Her career was never the same after the super bowl incident. That being said, just because of who she is, she'll never be hurting for money
I remember that. Even at 14 I felt so sad for her-everyone blamed her for the malfunction even though it wasn’t her fault.
Except I don't know anyone who was mad at her. Do you? People who liked her before continued to like her. The issue was nobody would hire her or promote her. That's not cancellations - that blacklisting. Which I didn't see Hollywood boo-hooing about that the past 60 years as they did *that* left and right.
Gabbie Hanna deleted her videos on her channel like what she did never happened. She actively tried to change history to spin her narrative but people like us definitely won’t let it slide.
Also, you can still find the videos where Gabbie Hanna is called out for her wrongdoings on the channels of JessiSmiles, Joey Graceffa, Daniel Preda, AlxJames, etc.
And the thing is Gabbi isnt even cancelled… she still is making music, still has a large following, still has a platform, still gets a lot of love… Idk why Gabbie keeps complaining when shit could be a lot worse. She just dislikes seeing any negativity about her on the internet.
I was wondering if you would be covering this interview with Gabbie. The fact that they did ZERO research into understanding who Gabbie actually was and what she's done is grossly negligent.
@dali I think we can acknowledge that multiple people can be bad at the same time.
The reason a lot of this energy is directed to gabbie is because she keeps bringing it up and trying to expose all these people for being 'mean' to her, that, in reality, she herself has wronged. She also refuses to take accountability for anything she has done, as evidenced by the red table talk.
@dali idk that much about Gabbie Hannah but I remember what she did to Rachael Oates, that was pretty fucked up
@dali Gabbie for 2 years defended and stood by a rapist (even after convicted - not of rape but of SA) proven by multiple tweets the day the story broke and the following months + years of contact with the rapist. Some former friends have come forward quoting GH as saying "you're lying you don't know the situation." And allegedly was blackmailed by the rapist with a video saying Gabbie believed him and would never speak badly of him. (Which she hasn't) and as recently as this year she hinted that Jessi was not "actually raped" because of a kink/fantasy Jessi at one point mentioned.
Moving on from that - Bullying several people (Angelika, Rachel Oates, Oscar Wilde, Alyx James) this ranges from name calling, shaming them for followers/views, to their own personal content. Gabbie once claimed Alyx James physically hurt her but then later deleted the claim when Alyx came forward and threatened a lawsuit on Gabbie.
There is a video of Gabbie on her youtube channel talking about the death of a classmate, she describes this classmate as "a druggie on the wrong path" and alludes to the girl commiting suicide - this was not the truth and an incredibly misleading representation of that young woman and the accidental overdose that occurred.
These are the big, morally questionable choices and actions of Gabbie Hanna that she has repeatedly refused to acknowledge any wrongdoing for. Gabbie thoroughly believes she is the victim in all cases, citing she was never friends with the rapist and never defended him (proven untrue several times over), that those she bullied deserved it for speaking about her, and several other excuses she has made to defend her position as the eternal victim.
Then there is the smaller "scandals" such as Kenza cosmetics, a scam Gabbie pushed to her fans then famously said "lower your expectations" the issues surrounding her false claims of the set of Escape the Night, etc.
@dali As far as actual crimes, there were several instances of Gabbie threatening minors in discord, accessing their personal information (emails, addresses, etc) and blackmailing another influencer.
Aside from this she broke the Terms of Service on Twitter, Patreon, Discord, and Instagram. (By using her followers to mass report other creators, encouraging her followers to bully and harass not only creators but fans as well) Gabbie also spread rumors about a creator saying she had "R**** a little girl" and was "incredibly dangerous" *this claim was proven false beyond any doubt.
@dali sweetie
She did commit crimes
And she supported criminals
It’s actually kind and compassionate to hold someone accountable, you hope they become better people. The problem is some people don’t want to change.
Agreed! I feel it's also having compassion for the person they harmed.
A lot of mind related disorders revolve around not being able to accept change
Right
You hope they become better people and sadly a lot of times that doesn't happen.
@@lilman20477 with all due respect, ALL of these people cannot ALL be suffering with specific disorders that make them unable to accept change. They’re shitty. Period.
I feel like “cancel culture” is just a buzz word without true meaning now. Like some people who want to defend problematic individuals just throw it out so they don’t have to come up with a real argument. It’s like a wall to just stop any accountability.
Only "woke" is more annoying to me than cancel culture. You aren't cancelled if you still have a platform. Not supporting someone you don't approve of isn't cancelling, its just a choice
half the time people just use it when they really mean "somebody disagreed with me and i feel attacked uwu", ESPECIALLY politicians recently🙄
It's honestly just making holding people accountable a political talking point and shrugging it off. It's fucked
This and people who are right learning also do that with Woke
@@kkuudandere Politicians are SO close to calling each other "haters", I swear. 😂 Assuming they aren't already..
The look on Gabbie's face... she really thought she was doing something with that "hypocrite" statement 😂
26:28 Thank you! As someone who is a poc it always rubs me the wrong way when people are like just be nice to the racist person because your better than them. Personally, I would never put up with it. Why do I have to be nice to someone who doesn't see me as an equal. I'm over that narrative at this point.
Ps: This is my opinion and you have the right to disagree.
Yes! "So much for the tolerant left" when someone is calling someone else out, drives me crazy. Being tolerant of a difference of an opinion, or because someone annoys you is one thing. Being tolerant of a racist assh*le, sexist, bigoted, etc is enabling and quite frankly shows me how that person *really* feels.
Exactly why do we have to coddle them. Why is it our responsibility as poc to protect the feelings of racist?
Exactly, no one should have to be tolerant of something that is harmful towards themselves or others. Tolerance is not how we enact change, speaking out and holding people accountable is.
Respect goes both ways. Why should you put up with someone who clearly doesn't respect you?
This reminded me of what I believe to be a generational difference I noticed at work. We have a coworker who does not hide that he stares at women and make them uncomfortable. The older women I talked to said," it's gonna happen. We (women) don't have any way to stop it." I was like, fuck no, I don't like that and it's not right. I want to hold him accountable, not be nice. The older women kinda stared and just shrugged.
hannah you’ve said “fuck” almost every single day of glowmas and i’m here for this energy🤣🤣 we merry af this year
You’re crushing it with Glowmas, it’s insanely impressive how much content you’re able to supply, especially around the holidays. We appreciate you💗
HELL YES!!! As a queer black woman, I'm so sick of the "you aren't going to change someone's mind with anger" bullshit. It's great that Daryl Davis exists and he can do what he does. But that is not my path and it doesn't have to be your path. Anger is justified. Anger is normal. I'm not going to hug someone who doesn't think I deserve human rights.
Exactly! People act like being angry makes you 'irrational' or 'less able to see the truth'. But personally, if your reaction to blatant racism and prejudice is 'objective' calmness, then I think that's the less rational response.
"You think that my friend should be killed because he's gay and I'm supposed to approach you with love? FUCK NO!" Amen, Hannah. Amen.
it IS insulting to compare what perez did to real celebs to the self-victimization gabbie , a youtube NOBODY, did to herself. either the person who conceptualized the ep idea is either very out of touch or gabbie/her manager worked double time to sell her unhinged a55 to be on the show.
👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
I work for a talk show and you’re right. Unless you’re a local celebrity (Gabbie isn’t) or you’re a huge name celebrity (definitely not Gabbie), they don’t call you, your manager has to sell you to them and in Gabbie’s case, probably keep bugging them until they literally had such an open day that the producers went through the laundry list of B to D list celebrities whose managers are all begging to get them on the show. People like Scarlett Johansson get the producers asking them to be on the show. Gabbie doesn’t. So in my professional opinion, I can say with certainty there’s no way in hell her manager hadn’t just annoyed one of the Red Table producers enough that they decided to put her on when they couldn’t find anyone better.
YES. I can disagree with you and still be friends when it’s about sports teams or music tastes, but calling out racism or sexism or homophobia isn’t a difference of opinion.
I think people’s fear of cancel culture comes from the idea that they only get one mess up and then they’ll lose everything, but if someone is “calling you out” it’s usually from a good place, where they want you to be better.
YES!!!
Also name me one person who got canceled who made one mistake and then wholeheartedly apologized and made up for it. Rather it usually involves a pattern of shitty behavior and complete unwillingness to take accountability for anything.
All of this
Exactly. An honest mistake is one thing (especially when it is followed by remorse). But if you are repeatedly acting or speaking out in such a way that impacts peoples livelihoods, you are not making a mistakes and you deserve to be held accountable for these action and you do not deserve a platform.
I know it doesn’t always happen but very often the people with repeated bad behavior have been warned/helped/reality checked by people around them multiple times. they just only listened when it affected their money/fame. then they say they “only got one chance” but it’s like… people have been telling them things for years? come on now.
i cant get over how well you speak, at the end when you entered *full rant* mode you kept your composure while still making your point crystal clear, like i’m genuinely impressed even though your public speaking skills weren’t the point of the video lmao
so in general, i hate most things about how academia works, but one thing I love is that everyone always has to define the terms they are using. That is something that i wish was more common in mainstream causal debates. Like what counts as cancel culture vs regular online harrasment and bullying. what counts as cancel culture vs deplatforming criminals that have massive public influence. I wish just one person saying "cancel culture has gone too far" would define what cancel culture is before they say it.
I think some people depend on the ambiguity of “cancel culture” as a concept so that they can make whatever half-baked claim they want and call it “cancel culture” without having to back up what they’re saying with well-reasoned arguments. They don’t want more accurate terms, because then they’d have to actually engage in honest discussion, which is not what they really want.
@@specialj67 THIS
Exactly. I just tune out talk of cancel culture now because so many people use it to mean “disliking a famous person.”
It looks like they did so much research on perez but none on gabby like it's embarrassing to let such a venomous cruel person victimise herself in your show and not challenge her.
"Cancel culture" does not work or exist if it did gabby wouldn't have a platform to act a fool
That’s the true question a social worker is asking: how do we create an environment where cancelling people isn’t necessary? Thank you.
I stan a morally strong teen girl with strong opinions. Honestly I do. Good for her
Do you mean Hannah? She's definitely not a teen haha
I think she’s talking about the sister in law :)
@@emaezing oh makes sense haha
@@leakenny1125 yeah at first I thought the same thing though lolll
Me too :) I bet she will be a great leader one day
Canceling has also become synonymous with criticism, I've noticed, which is SUPER frustrating Latest example that comes to mind is Chris Pratt being cast as the voice Mario in a movie coming out. Media spun it as people who didn't like that casting decision were trying to "cancel" Chris Pratt...that's not how this works. That's not how any of this works 😑
I love it when Spicy Glow delivers a hard-hitting societal critique. So spot on!!
As a sociology professor, I'm constantly blown away that my college students don't automatically see a connection between plain old social sanctions (praising or punishing by parts or all of society) and "cancel culture." They're the same - it's just faster and more widely seen on the internet so more strangers can get in on it.
The more things change, the more they stay the same.
Ohhh I’m so excited for this! PS: Truly appreciate all your hard work and effort for Glowmas! Thank you for wonderful content! Being graced with Smokey glow everyday has been so special ♥️
You know who’s fully been cancelled? The Chicks. (When they were Charlie Damelios older sisters name) chicks. The right fully cancelled them. Removed their music from radio and completely stopped their career at the absolute height of it. This is cancel culture. It’s when people are cancelled who shouldn’t be. Anyone else is being held accountable, and are typically failing at becoming better people
I think about them so often when it comes to cancel culture. They were done so wrong and never fully recovered from it even after coming back. And they didn't deserve the cancelling in the first place. All they did was share an opinion that many people had, it wasn't even a problematic thing they said.
they didn’t get cancelled. they’ve been blacklisted from the industry since like 2003 because they publicly criticized the president. but the last few years have been some of their most successful. you might be talking about lady antebellum who changed their name to lady A because antebellum is associated with racism & slavery but then an existing black artist with the name lady A was like wtf that’s literally already my name
@@misseselise3864 Being blacklisted from the industry is part of getting cancelled.
so true! my favourite podcast did a three part series on "cancel culture" and spent a whole episode talking about how the chicks are one of the only examples of someone being cancelled and they were cancelled by the political right, whereas when people talk about cancel culture now it is always the political right accussing the political left of trying to cancel people
What did they do?
I feel uncomfortable with grown adults spreading "Cancel Culture is Bad >:(" instead of "people feel so out of power and that celebrities get held to so little accountability, they have gone a bit rogue with it."
this was a really good video because people always have so much to say about cancel culture that it's become one of those buzzwords that's just thrown around, and hearing from the perspective of GH and PH of all people...
just one note about the concept of young people not being involved in having social opinions, i think the idea of kids not "having to worry about that" comes from a place of privilege. i feel like many young people who are from marginalized communities simply do not have the option of not thinking about social issues and how their own identities intersect with those causes. granted, this doesn't excuse that teenagers are often the ones to take things too far. but at the same time, the only people who do not have to worry about things like racism, sexism, xenophobia, etc were never the ones being harmed.
So much this!! I grew up in privileged white household. I didn’t have to start forming political opinions until it started to peak my interest. But of course, if a social issue was directly affecting you, you would take a stance on it no matter how young. Therefore, I think teenagers are 100% valid in expressing their social opinions as long as they understand the intricacies of expressing this on social media.
I really appreciated your final thoughts on the “love and compassion” narrative Hannah! I’m dealing with that right now due to the whole antivax movement. My best friend is an ER nurse and she is being put at risk by this movement EVERY SINGLE DAY, and she is experiencing major anxiety and career burnout at 23 years old. Sorry but I can’t coexist and approach antivaxxers with any understanding, not when it’s directly impacting my loved one (and putting my elderly relatives at risk but that’s almost besides the point now). That fundamental disagreement and lack of compassion on their side makes me completely unable to be nice to them and I will hold them accountable for the burden they are placing on the healthcare system and the harm they are causing to the scientific community due to the peddling of false information. (And this pretty much applies to the entire political divide that surrounds any sort of direct harm to actual human lives). I won’t apologize for that.
@@HornedAngel333 This is why its important everyone who can gets vaccinated, so those who genuinely cannot do it are safe thanks to herd immunity. your reasons are justified, its not like you go out of your way to spread misinformation, its not comparable.
I hope you get a straight answer from your doctors!
@@HornedAngel333 aw thank you! stay safe! ♡
I am feeling the same way! My dad works on the distribution of the vaccine and I've seen people online call him a money hungry murderer when in reality, he's getting paid much less than he usually does. But he accepted the offer because he felt a duty to help. I cut off those people in my life cause I just couldn't stand seeing my dad work 12 hour shifts and come home exhausted then go on Facebook and see him and others like him being insulted .
I’m 28 and I absolutely agree with you in regards to 14 year olds having political opinions and how it’s actually a good thing, I’m so proud of how the younger generation are able to stand against the racist sexist homophobic opinions of our parents and grandparents in ways that I never could have done. It gives me such a hope for the future and makes me feel like the world would be a safer place for my daughter no matter what she wants to be when she grows up.
It's so strange to me when I hear people mention Perez Hilton. In my mind, he lives in 2007 and never leaves
I’m leaving this video in tears, and I could not be happier about it. As a gay man, the messaging of the video, especially toward the end, is a shining example of how we need to be approaching the conversation around human rights and decency going forward. It does not work to offer love and compassion to people who will continue to deny love and compassion to others. All that does is enable further regression into a world where hate thrives. I think another reason that contributes to a lot of people looking the other way from other’s poor behavior is because there’s this overwhelming sense of exhaustion with “wokeness” that comes from the damaging messaging that somehow civil liberties and human rights are radical topics. When in reality, they aren’t radical at all - equality for all should be the most critical of foundations upon which society relies, and we can’t let ourselves become tired and complacent in that fight.
Regarding “cancel culture” in general, I love the idea that we need to be more open to the fact that it’s NOT a one-size-fits-all, nor should it be weaponized by offenders against people who are fighting to hold them accountable. People like Gabbie Hanna can kick and scream all they want, but the fact is we’re transitioning into a world where there’s no more room for bullshit. Own up to your mistakes or get out of the way for the ones who will. In the video, you ask how we can achieve a world where we will no longer have to deal with this type of behavior - I honestly don’t think we ever will. A world like that would be Utopia. But my hope is that we WILL get to a place where the consequences will finally reflect the severity of those behaviors in such a way that we can ALL finally live harmoniously despite our fundamental flaws that come with being human.
Thanks again for all you do. ❤️
Seems like the theme of the episode wasn’t so much cancel culture as it was “giving a platform to bad people.” Sitting down unprepared and letting an absolute snake on the grass like Perez Hilton or Gabbie justify themselves is unproductive and harmful. Them being invited to a platform like this proves that cancel culture doesn’t exist.
Online harassment is a real problem, and nonsense like this just throws a smoke bomb on the ground and avoids the real subject. Gabbie and Perez Hilton should not have a platform. They ARE the people doing the online harassment in many cases. Maybe they should’ve spent the episode talking to that professor and learned something.
Look, I have a "Gabbie Hanna friend", she's an SA apologist, her BOYFRIEND SAed me, and she basically got me shunned out of a feminist group that I cared about a LOT. I don't even care about him, I fully LOST EVERYTHING, because of him, he doesn't deserve me remembering him tbh.
SHE was the one that destroyed me. A WOMAN, believed him, cancelled me to our friends and her family, and set precedents about the whole thing, he's basically never been ANYTHING to me but harsh reality, but SHE betrayed me. She now blackmails me about physical stuff that stayed with her in her country, so I WON'T open my mouth about her boyfriend's SA, and I can't stand that my ex best friend is doing this. So I understand Jessi wanting to FULLY cancel Gabbie. JUST LIKE, Jessi & Gabbie, my "friend" did me real wrong. Some stuff is unforgivable sometimes, and there's A LOT of "eureka" moments to do with tr**mas. I can't ever forgive Gabbie, for some evident reasons. Never watched Perez, don't care about him, just f***** let Gabbie think about her stuff, cus she got it WRONG. She can talk to me if she wants, if anyone reads this. It'd be dangerous to let people like Gabbie go without realising how their acts have affected someone's life as a whole. Cus she hasn't realised. You can tell. Anyway....
Oh I completely agree about the whole cancel culture not really being a permanent thing, of course it does play a role in actually pressuring the justice system do its job in some cases. Where I don’t completely agree is the notion that normal everyday people don’t have to worry about being canceled. Though it’s more rare that their shitty day/decision would go viral opposed to an ‘influencer’/celebrity I think the backlash would be much worse because they don’t have any media presence besides the incident in question and they don’t get the chance to have a public redemption arc. But yeah idk why they had Perez and Gabbi… different eras, different issues lol. Go off, girl. Love your videos💛💛
this was also the one and only point I disagreed with in the video. and I think it's kind of worse on the Left because we often don't give those people empathy in their viral bad choices so as not to appear tainted as they are in their BadnessTM whereas people who go viral for bad things and should be cancelled on the Right often find a sympathetic ear for the anti-"oversensitive Left" and end up rebounding as important people on the Right. That couple from the gated community that pointed weapons at unarmed marching protesters, Kyle actual murderer Rittenhouse..... it's so f***ed.
Queens. 👑 Love your content Bea, didn't know you were a fellow glowstick! ✨
Not only that but smaller and/or niche communities are affected a lot by people misusing callouts and such. Yeah, we are used to seeing people essentially do mass criticism of a celebrity with varying levels of tact to straight mockery but to do the same thing to a random person? With a callout that didn't sufficiently prove they were dangerous? Random people don't have the same resources to deal with that. Random people need their jobs.
This is not accounting for the fact that we're talking about mob mentality on top of everything and that biases is definitely a play in this type of situation. Meaning a person of color might get intensely campaigned against vs someone who's not that did the same thing.
I think where we need to start is with an actual definition of what "cancel culture" is. To one person it can mean "there are consequences for your actions", to another it could mean trolls and bullies running an innocent person off line, affecting their life in negative ways. I tend to lean toward your meaning, Hannah. "A day of reckoning".
Edit here- whoever the producer is needs to do their job. Research their guests, etc.
I totally agree. I think that people who debate over whether or not cancel culture exists are talking past each other to a certain extent.
Hard agree. Too many times, I’ve seen people argue and it’s like they’re talking about two completely different things.
Somehow, “cancel culture” has been so warped that too many people have completely different perspectives on what this “culture” actually is.
I couldn’t agree more!!! I’m frustrated that now our senators are using cancel culture as an excuse/distraction to get out of being an awful person
Literally it's so disgusting the lengths people will go to be vicious
"reactions to her own actions" sums it up PERFECTLY
When it comes to celebrities and boundaries, one thing i just hate. The fact that fans are so invested in the celeb's personal life. The speculation, and everything. I don't think anyone should stick their nose into someone's relationship. What's even worse is that some go and hate on the celeb's partner/lover.
I fully agree on your standpoint on cancel culture. We aren’t just going to accept injustice anymore, that would be like moving backwards
You said so many things that I agree with. I’m always impressed how your rants always manage to still be so coherent and focused. I loved how you said we need to find a way to make sure we don’t have to hold people accountable in the first place.
Piggybacking off the final thoughts portion: I've been saying this for a while and I think it's a useful perspective to have on things like cancel culture. Basically, the way people are being called out for their shitty behavior, the protests going on everywhere, people cutting off homophobic/racist/etc family members, it all feels like what happens when you set boundaries with an abuser or narcissistic, but on a macro scale. People focus on how the victim reacts vs the abusive behavior that violated their boundaries in the first place. This analogy was super helpful to people like my parents, who genuinely want to understand and learn and grow but still have a lot of harmful things they need to unlearn.
Just something I just noticed is a lot of adults who say things "I didn't have to worry about that when I was a kid" probably didn't who didn't grow up where people weren't openly against you. Like if you were a teen and had like gender or sexuality crisis, leaving a religion, or just being political divided against your patents will very quickly become socially conscious and learn about cutting off certain people. I dont think its a new thing, I think adults who didn't grow up in that situation are just learning about it.
Very much this
Yeah they were ignorant and more conservative
I've been raised to be politicaly/socially conscious but being lgbt+ in eastern europe contributed a lot too. It just depends ig.
To me "cancel culture" seems like a catch all term for anything from bullying, social accountability to legal accountability. I would love if we could go back and start differentiating between different kinds of "cancelled". We have the terms and concepts, why not use them?
Any SG video with “A Rant” in the title I am HERE FOR. I absolutely agree with all of your points. The idea that “cancel culture” is not the problem but the solution is so right, if we’re talking about it in the sense of holding people accountable for their shitty behavior.
i just absolutely love your comments on kids getting involved. I work at a high school and ppl who arent around kids have no idea how much more socially aware they are nowadays than we were when we were teens. It is sad but like you said its a good thing because they can control their surroundings much better and that will save you from toxic relationships in the long run
Soo ready for this! Been absolutely loving Glowmas!!! Sad its almost over. BUT you & Charles have KILLED it this month! Sooo appreciative of all the content
The problem with the Estefan Red Table Talk is they do not have the range to host discourse on cultural issues and shifts. Oh, they can talk about it, but it’s all surface conversations with little to no depth: always hollow and lacking true understanding to carry the weight of the message that needs to come through.
I remember Canceling being used to warn others as “hey, this person is trash for doing x,y,z: they’re canceled (until further notice).” It was a warning to not consume anything from them, but keep it pushing. The problem is we were supposed to move on from it. Then White Fragility entered the space and muddled the movements. Gah!
the final thoughts section was EVERYTHING. i was losing my mind. you’re amazing and this video is a must watch for everyone
I was watching a recap video of the talk last night and I honestly couldn’t finish the video bc Gabbie Hanna was so full of bs and so genuinely convinced that she’s been a blameless victim throughout her entire career that it pisses me off but also really deeply concerns me. how does one just put themselves so above everyone else that they refuse to take any accountability at all and also try to twist the narrative to fit their version of the story (like her taking down the majority of her videos so ppl who aren’t already familiar w her can’t go back and double check her “I’ve never talked about anyone on my channel” bs)????
MS MAAM LICH RALLY STARTED HER CHANNEL WITH STORY TIMES ABOUT OTHER PEOPLE 😭😭😭😭
I think this is my favorite video of yours I've ever watched. The question "who has actually been cancelled" has been on my mind a lot. All these people who complain about being cancelled sure are doing it VERY LOUDLY on platforms that reach millions of people. That sure doesn't look like cancelation to me.
i think part of the problem is that the people who HAVE "actually been cancelled" are people who we never would have known about in the first place. as you note, a lot of people with lots of money and a huge platform like to complain about being "cancelled" when what they mean is their reputation took a hit - but the people actually being run off of social platforms, isolated from their support networks online, etc. are not rich & famous. they're random people who maybe had 500 followers on twitter, or got a little bit of attention on a niche side of tiktok, and then somebody pulled out a screenshot of them saying something problematic and they became the villain of the week in their internet circle. those are the people who actually get successfully bullied into deleting their accounts and leaving whatever fandom/hobby/social cause they were initially participating in. so then we end up with these discussions where the only people speaking up as "victims of cancel culture" are the ones who were never really cancelled in the first place, while the ones who were have already been pushed into silence.
@@friday13thirteen that's honestly a fantastic point and I hadn't really thought about it that way before.
I don’t pay attention to very much internet/RUclips drama, but I’m always here to watch people rant about Gabbie Hanna
literally never apologize for your ranty videos, they're my favorite lol
As for young people (as an old person), the moments that surprise me using social media is when someone younger says something to a celebrity via tweet via comment and then the celebrity responds. And then the person usually says something along the lines of, "I didn't think you'd see it!" Like, I know not every celebrity is in charge of their social media page, but some are especially today where everything is so accessible and sometimes that makes people more accessible in a way they weren't when I was a kid. It always surprises me that they think this person doesn't see it and is affected by it and doesn't have a reaction to it. Let's treat social media knowing that there's a person on the other end of that tweet or that post. It's not all anonymity.
Could not find a SINGLE thing I disagreed with in this video. Spot on and on the mark with every single word you said.
I have not been watching Glowmas because I have had SO MUCH going on but my sister tells me daily how incredible your glowmas videos have been. I have so many videos stocked up and will be spending the next few days binging your amazing content. I look up to you as a creator and I am so proud of you for all your accomplishments and your strength. Thank you for your hard work and dedication to your craft.
Loved the video, I've grown frustrated with the way most people talk about "cancel culture" so I really appreciate this (and the rest of Glowmas!). I actually wanted to discuss the two things you said (how cancel culture is being co-opted as a political talking point, and how many younger people are a lot more socially aware of certain things) are actually inter-related.
While it's most blatantly seen in the acts/laws trying to be put into place that ban the teaching of systemic racism(so as to protect the feelings of white people), it also comes in the form of the backlash to cancel culture. Attacking people trying to hold others accountable as being 'overly sensitive' or 'just trying to cause problems' is actually pretty insidious (and also ironic). This applies to other things as well, and while there are aspects of the way we talk about this stuff online that could definitely be done better, I do think there's something very telling about how the people making such a fuss about it are the people with the most power.
Couldn’t agree more!! Especially the last few minutes. It’s impossible to be kind to everyone bc being kind to some people is cruel to others! Thanks so much for being such a thoughtful creator 💖
Idk why but I love rants lol, their the best videos sometimes especially when creators like Smokey are so eloquent and well spoken
You perfectly articulated exactly how i felt about the episode + topic of cancel culture. Thank you for your incredible ongoing work
I don’t think cancel culture started w bad intentions and genuinely worked in holding people accountable for their actions, but social media blew it so out of proportion that it’s lost it’s meaning and has become more of a peer-pressure thing to try and police other people’s likes, dislikes, opinions, etc and an excuse to bully people who go against your own views
“cancel culture” doesn’t even work anymore. we see this v clearly w Shane Dawson, James Charles, David Dobrik, the Paul brothers and even Gabbie Hanna. they all disappear for a bit while their scandals are still hot topic but after the talk dies down a few months later, they come back like nothing happened and whatever hit their platform took rarely impacts their earnings or viewership or reputation bc everything is forgotten in another few months as they keep uploading as if nothing happened
another reason I think “cancel culture” is no longer effective is bc people genuinely “get over it” (the topic) after the hype has died down, which allows problematic creators to emerge back from whatever cave they decided to hide away in. cancel culture no longer holds people accountable - it’s just for drama and people who actually care about the problems created are told to shut up and get over it bc it’s been months already.
but like you said, there’s no real solution either so like 😭😭😭😭
SORRY THIS COMMENT IS SO LONG AND PROBABLY FILLED W ERRORS AND HALF COMPLETE THOUGHTS SHFKSNFKEKF
I agree with everything you said. But certain people still need to held accountable for their actions. So what’s the solution? When someone says something racist or homophobic etc, are people just to ignore it like nothing ever happened? What about Mika Stauffer who adopted a disabled child for clicks and views made boat loads of money because of him then re-homed him like a pet when his disability became too much for her 3 years later, should society just let her get away with that? Not trying to be argumentative here, I honestly think it’s an interesting conversation. So, please take my words with all due respect.
This was a very intelligent and concise comment! You don’t have to put yourself down towards the end of it. ❤️
@@FreyaWarr dw about sounding argumentative, I totally agree with this! unless we find another way to hold people accountable, they will always find a way to shed tears and notes-app-apology their way back into a fair amount of people’s good graces. they will still gain money, still gain fame, still have fans blindly fighting on their behalf, still get promos, etc etc. cancel culture only works to a certain extent, was kind of what I was trying to say - people on the internet who already have such a big following will rarely truly get canceled, especially if they have other influencers backing them. Jenna Marbles is a good example of someone who’s taking accountability seriously in the way she as an Internet personality can imo: apologizing and saying she’s leaving RUclips and actually sticking with it long-term (can’t speak for the future, of course, but I admire her for this in the moment). as long as these people have a platform to return to, they will 100% find a way to do it and manage to slip back into their old ways unless they are genuinely learning from their mistakes and trying to improve as a human. I think taking away their platform for good would only be a starting point, though, because there’s still potential for plenty of people to be like “oh, I just need to hide this part of myself” which is so easy to do on the internet.
@@suoutubez19 thank you ;-;-;-;-;-;-;;-;-;-;-;;;
I’m so glad someone finally said this. When a majority of people are voicing their anger at a public figure’s actions, that’s not cancelling! It’s called consequences, and everyone has to face them. I’m really tired of people blaming cancel culture for their favourite celebrities being called out, when 1: they’re almost never ACTUALLY cancelled and blacklisted from the internet and 2: they made mistakes/inappropriate actions that NEED to be corrected and called out. And you said it so much better than I ever could
I agree with most of what you are saying, but I do think that the issue with approaching things with "love and compassion" is not as cut and dry as you are saying it is. I think that most situations in which two parties disagree can lead to genuine and productive conversation. Though some of them are loud, the population of people that disagree in basic human rights for all (and are not willing to change their minds) is small. I completely agree that there is no room for niceties when it comes to people like that, and I share your anger towards them. That being said, I don't think that we should give up on having conversations with people that we don't agree with just because terrible people like that exist!
THANK YOU for talking about "cancel culture". in 2020 and throughout 2021, yes, we threw around "cancelled" a lot, but we often used it as a term to hold problematic people accountable. a lot of news organizations took it and ran with it, thinking that the entire internet just ruin random people's careers for no reason at all.
such a good video with so many excellent points!
when I think of CC I think of people bullying strangers online bc they feel justified since their target "deserves it" (no, they don't deserve it. _no one_ deserves 💀 threats, kay-why-ess, harassment that pushes them to the point of no return, etc.)
people are really obsessed with justice in this sick and demented way
but it is absolutely necessary to have societal penalties to harmful/hateful behaviour so I also agree that CC is a solution
and also that it needs to be directed in a way that isn't bullying and harassment
(all this is agreeing with the video)
LOVE your statements on the whole “approaching people with love and compassion”!!!
Also the whole “love and compassion” propaganda needs to end, not only is it just flat out performative but the only ppl that perpetuate that rhetoric are ppl that aren’t going to be directly affected by the negative things that happen to regular ppl, like during the beginning of the pandemic when ppl were losing their jobs and being forced to stay homes and and the celebrities were like “peace and love 🥰” from their million dollar houses, Uhh peace and love for you ig bc I’m losing my house if I don’t pay my bills YOU however are making money in your sleep sooo 😀🖕🏾
This could have been 2 hours and I would have listened to every bit of it! I love your perspective!
When I tell you I was WAITING in anticipation for you to cover this topic I was praying you would. You look stunning as always ♥️
You spoil us for Glowmas! Thank you!!
So glad you made this video!!!! She tried rewriting history
Just like she always does lol
While i agree that "kindness" can often be a buzzword for toxic positivity AKA "just don't talk about this because it's bothering me," Love and Kindness are really the only ways to make positive changes. Correcting someone is loving. Holding someone accountable is loving. Having respectful but firm conversations with people you have relationships with is loving. Love is wanting the best for someone, and putting thier needs (to be educated/informed/enlightened) above your own comfort (to avoid conflict). It's radical, and often doesn't feel good. It can be a hard road to walk, but when we embitter ourselves in moral outrage to the point where we can't associate with anyone who sees the world differently, and can no longer feel compassion for other people, we need to take a step back from "calling out," IMO. Of course I'm not saying it's our responsibility to let racists or homophobes into our innner circle, but everyone (right and left) runs a real risk of creating thier own echo chamber, and then demonizing anyone who doesn't toe the party line. For example, screaming that someone who is anti-vax is an irresponsible murderer isn't going to make that person want to be vaccinated, and while the most extreme people might never come to the conclusion that they should be, more moderate people will be converted by honest and compassionate discourse than anger and hatefulness.
To this day I didnt know that Lauren Jauregui was outed by Paris Hilton and I was online when she came out. Its not that related to the video, but its so crazy how invested in their projection of her her fans were at the time, they were cheering that day in a way that I thought she came out willingly, a lot of "everyone already knew!" and "so when they will confirme camren is real?" and most crazy reactions were people that were glad she was lgbt but sad she was with another girl out of their ship. It was a very strange time, how her being outed was dealt with this way because it was something the fans "wanted". Like even if they exposed their ship, in a world where Canolla is not a insufferable plain af hetero, they would get happy they were right instead of mad they were outed without consent. A lot of these were young gay girls, who had no contact with queer people in real life and projected really hard on them as their connection with gayness but I think this issues go deeper. Like at the time of Hunger Games, when Jlaw was still very broadly well-liked for her "cool girl persona" and that was the major leak of celebrity nudes, mostly hers, a lot of her fans were like "lol everyone going crazy, like Jen is gonna care about this, she doesnt give a fuck and everyone loved the pictures", spreading the pics further and then she came on statement saying how she felt violated and like her life and career were over. I know its not popular to feel bad about celebrities these days BUT this issues with projection, desumanization and scrutiny they receive when they are victims of crimes is not normal and still goes on today. Its so crazy how the environment cultivated online is that liking an anime villain makes you a irredeemable freak and talking about being glad a character died makes you a sociopath but people barely bat eyes at edgy/troll accounts joking about Megan being shot, Ariana's PTSD from a terrorist attack, BTS's V deceased grandmother etc like... those are real people being talked about and there are real people behind those account saying all this nasty stuff about them. Yeah, went off topic
"Camren" shippers are fucking toxic. Same as eith Larry shippers. They tore real friendships apart for the sake of their own fanfic. People still go on with this and act as if these couples are real and Louis and Harry are secretly together. It is WRONG. Even if it was true. No one should be put in that position.
you are literally the only creator that perfectly articulates exactly how im feeling with empathy and intelligence but without watering down your message.
You have been such a savior with glowmas lol thank you for covering this! recovering from surgery the to turn around and get ready for another major one has been so stressful, its nice to be able to escape it for a little bit ❤
Hannah, you put such effort and work in all of your videos. You are a joy to watch.
omg I have been binging all your GH videos from this year so this is literal perfect timing
edit: also I hope you're feeling better, and please do not hesitate to take breaks and delay uploads when you need to!! your physical and mental health matters more than a daily video ❤
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THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR THIS! Sometimes you cant and shouldnt be the "bigger person".
I’ve really been enjoying all your Glowmas videos and have watched almost all of them and I just get really positive vibes from you and your videos always make me feel better,so thanks for that
Your final thoughts section was *chefs kiss*
It’s so crazy and gross how people can’t just admit when they make mistakes. It’s so easy, and it makes everything better. Everyone makes mistakes, but not being able to own up to it is unacceptable in every aspect of life.
Hannah if you ever write a book it needs to be on cancel culture you have already refined your position on this so well- I feel like if you collated the key events in which you've covered it thus far you'd have a really comprehensive text
this glowmas has been so amazing
Wow! I absolutely love hearing you talk about makeup, but when you get passionate about important topics, that’s when I want to applause! You word things in such an eloquent and simple way that it could actually change some peoples minds. So so well said!
Haven’t even watched yet but I am HERE for a rant. 👏🌟
Gabbie Hanna calling Perez Hilton a hypocrite for not taking accountability, as she proceeds to take no accountability whatsoever, lives rent free in my head.
Do I know what Red Table Talk is? No. Am I still gonna watch this? Heck yeah! lol
You are 100% right. We cannot approach people who are hateful with love and compassion if they are not coming from a place of love and compassion. They do not deserve an energy that they are not giving.
Preach girl!!🙌🏻 Everything you’re saying is speaking to my ears lol love you girl!❤️
I appreciate so much that you carry such a similar opinion as myself, really makes me feel not crazy that I want celebrities be held accountable!
I just find the whole conversation around CC amusing because people will argue that ‘cancel culture’ is good in theory, but whenever it’s been shown in practice it is never effective or fair or based on nuance. The internet makes it impossible. That’s my perspective. Lindsay Ellis did a great video essay on the subject that I found damn eye opening.
Yes! Lindsay Ellis being chased off Twitter is a great example of everything wrong with cancel culture.
Hannah!!! This was so amazing, especially those final thoughts -- whew!!! Feel like I went to church and had a sermon that was actually worth listening to! Speak on it, sis
Well done, Hannah. Perez, in his blog heyday was heinously toxic expecially to young women and celebrities who had not publicly come out. He has no excuse and should have just taken accountability. Gabby is never going to take accountability, obviously, because she still acts like she is a perpetual victimized by viewers who don't get her. What a waste of a round table.
There’s a great series of eps of the podcast You’re Wrong About that covers cancel culture and they use The Chicks (fka The Dixie Chicks) as a case study of Bush-era ‘cancel culture’. Worth a listen for anyone who enjoyed how Hannah articulated her thoughts on this Gabbie/Perez RTT since the podcast explores similar things from a similar lens… Another banger Glowmas video Hannah!!!!
I agree with most of what you said, however I think that occasionally cancel culture goes too far. Contrapoints, Lindsay Ellis and Sarah Z have very long videos talking about their experience with their canceling and it made me realize that the left can have impossible standards for their creators. Shane Dawson getting cancelled for his continuous racist videos is fine, Lindsay getting cancelled because she tweeted that Raya and the Last Dragon was similar to Avatar is excessive. They were both labeled as racist but their infractions are very different. And to me what Lindsay did wasn't wrong (although it's not on me to accept an apology) but each person is going to have a different sensitivity level. And because being a RUclipsr means being at the whim of the court of public opinion, a very small but loud minority can make their life a living hell. And yes it's bullying but it's all under the umbrella of holding someone accountable. And part of why this is so insidious is that it tends to happen to smaller women creators who have less power and the ones who are doing it feel like they are doing a good thing. And the content creators criticisms of 'hey maybe my life shouldn't be upheaved because of a bad take on Twitter' get lumped into this idea that powerful people hate cancel culture because it means that they can't be racist, sexist, homophobic or ableist anymore. There is definitely more nuance than that.
Thank! You!
This really is an issue, but it only affects people who
1) are already progressive-left and have communities or supporters who are also prog-left
2) lack the influence and money that major celebrities have
3) are guilty of small or nonexistent infractions
People really are out for blood. Honestly, I had to leave many LGBTQ groups because everyone was just treating each other as an emotional punching bag under the guise of "calling out" or "accountability."
We need to do better.
@@jacquelinealbin7712 Thank you for making my point in a more succinct way. I was worried that in my rambling my point would be lost. I'm an incredibly small creator (I only have 700 followers on IG) and there are things that I have thoughts about in the community that I'm a part of but I'm honestly so terrified to say anything because I've seen how quickly the pileon can happen. And I'm worried about talking about being scared because then people would say you shouldn't have anything to worry about as long as you're one of the good ones. Like even posting that last comment felt risky. And I think it's a part of cancel culture that never gets talked about until a creator gets cancelled. Not because I don't think other creators don't worry about it but because until they cancelled they have everything to lose.
Great comment, very insightful. Everything you said was true. The way Natalie, Sarah and Lindsey were viciously attacked disturbed the hell out of me. Their so-called liberal, progressive fan base just used them as a vessel to project their rage onto. None of them even got a chance to take accountability because people were too busy sending death threats.
Cis people love to bring up contrapoints and lindsay Ellis. There are much better examples than those 2, start with people like Isabel fall or someone who didn’t actually do something worthy of some sort of accountability or at least a mild push back.
@@redo5oh I understand that point. I used Lindsay, Natalie and Sarah because
1) They are a pretty good example of what I'm talking about
2) They all released very long thoughtful videos about their experience
3) They are fairly well known in the RUclips space (I don't know who Isabel fall is)
But each example is going to have it's limitations.