I'm primarily a stills photographer but I literally didn't pause this video because it was so engaging and well-made. Love the no bs approach and easy to understand explanations about bitrate and resolution. Loved it all, Justin. Looking forward to watching and learning more!
@@jamescohen I really was considering the Leica SL-2s for a hybrid system but the Fp looks to be a contender. Especially regarding value. I love that viewfinder attachment a lot.
@@leedeleon2745 I haven't even tried the viewfinder. In bright sunlight you wish for one though, and yeah, the screen not tilting etc. means some minor acrobatics sometimes, but for the moment I can't justify the cost of the viewfinder, when there are so many lenses and SSDs to buy for the Ninja. If you get it, post some samples! Love to see what you do with it. I have a few early things when I first bought it here online and I think one recent clip with the Ninja. I have a long way to go to learn to use it to its potential though, as I discovered from this video.
@@jamescohen Yeah! i use it for stills all the time! in fact, that's why i originally got it, all the video stuff i found out AFTER i bought the camera! LOL
Great overview of the camera though I have multiple issues with how the data was presented. Now before I get into things, let me clarify that I still think that this is a perfectly good camera and I'd be happy to add it to my equipment. That said, some things were presented in a biased way. First of all. Color accuracy: While you did show the chromaticty plots at 9:29 you didn't explain them in full detail. You were happy to mention how the Sigma beats the Venice in regards to the greens, but completely ignored the fact that the Venice wins in regards to blues. If you look at the diagram you can tell that the Sigma FP doesn't even seem to fully cover the blue range of the sRGB colourspace. And depending on the display that you are creating content for, this might actually be more important. If you are creating content for Rec.2020 (the large triangle in the diagram/ used by typical HDR displays), then yes... the gain in the greens is probably the more important factor. But if the content you create is for sRGB monitors (the smaller triangle / what most people on the internet have.) Then all the benefits in the greens are clipped away anyway... and you will only be left with the poor performance in regards to blue. This is made worse by the fact that the 1931 version of the CIE diagram (the one used in the video) is biased and allocates a larger area to the green tones, exaggerating the importance of the difference in green, while undermining the importance of blue... The 1976 version of the diagram is much less biased and should be the one used in such a case. I understand however that both the type of diagram used and omitting the blues were dictated by the source material, so I can't really blame you for that ^^ While this isn't perfect, it's not a huge deal either, since highly saturated blues are kind of rare in nature anyway. So unless you set out to capture maybe kingfishers or one of those crazy blue butterflies, the lack of extremely saturated blues won't come into play. Bitrates / DNG RAW: Now don't get me wrong, I think DNG raw is great, but the importance is definitely exaggerated in the video. Comparing RUclips compression to RAW compression is basically pointless.... You can't compare top end to bottom end.... It's like comparing the difference between 720p and 1080p to the difference between 6K and 8K. Like sure the former is worse than the latter (assuming all other quality determining factors remain the same) but there is a point of diminishing returns.... 8K might be more useful than 6K in extreme cases and the same is true for DNG raw, but in most cases, the extra storage needed outways the benefits. If many of Hollywood's professionals don't even bother to use the least aggressive version of the lossy compression methods but instead opt for one of medium strength (e.g. 5:1 on the Hobbit) then surely that's good enough for most of us too? Another thing that bothers me with the bitrate comparison is that it's not clear whether the data was gathered in an unbiased way. If you just compare filesizes in relation to clip length, then you are taking a biased approach. Lossy RAW compression typically combines multiple algorithms, some lossy and some lossless. So the filesize does not represent the information contained in the file. (Example for lossless algorithm.: Grouping repeated pixels can save storage without losing any information... What needs more storage: 8x "green" or "green" "green" "green" "green" "green" "green" "green" "green"?) Less abstract / real life example: The Nikon D810 can stores images as NEF-Raw or as uncompressed TIF files. (And of course JPG, but that's the bottom end, so let's ignore that.) The NEF files need ~20mb per image while the TIF files need ~200mb.... And yet the quality of the NEF files is higher... The only reason to ever use TIFF would be edge case scenarios where you need the files to be immediately readable by any software, without having any time to manually convert the RAW files. (Maybe for the usage in the press, where time is more important than maximising quality?) So don't estimate the bitrate of the video based on the filesize. A better method to make such comparisons, would be to first convert both source files (BRAW and DNG RAW) to uncompressed OpenEXR image sequences and compare the size of those in relation to the number of frames. At the same time another advantage of using an uncompressed DNG Raw is overlooked in the video. AFAIK image/video compression is actually quite a computationally heavy task, which in turn leads to a noticable hit in battery performance. I can only assume that this is at least partially the reason why the batteries of the Sony FP seem to last so much longer than those of the Blackmagic Pocket Cinema Camera, despite having a smaller capacity. Thanks for coming to my TED talk. Hope you enjoyed the read... 😄
Yeah, the whole thing with the bitrate had me scratching my head. The higher bitrate throughput of the FP is a material requirement of shooting a less efficient format, not an indicator that the FP contains full multiples more usable visual information. "Its bus is faster" is frankly meaningless if both cameras are capable of outputting their highest settings to internal media.
Thank-you. I got only as far as the confused explanation of bitrates in this video before realising this guy has no clue. It's not about which camera has the biggest numbers. It's about practicality. A BMPCC4K gives *you* the choice of how much compression to use in the BRAW files, and this means that you can make the *best decision* for your needs. The Sigma gives you *no choice* so you must always use the maximum amount of expensive fast storage... or forget RAW altogether. Just because it's compressed, the image must be worse? That's wrong. Even at the lowest BRAW Q5 the BM4K produces excellent footage. There are many comparisons online of the different quality settings. The differences are negligible, seen only by pixel-peeping and not in real life work. Comparing RUclips compression to these file formats is simple ignorance. The discussion of the depth of field possible with a larger sensor is also off base. Not because it's technically incorrect, but because not everyone wants super-trendy miniscule DOF. Classic Hollywood directors prided themselves on *deep* DOF which is *much harder* to obtain and control on set. The BMPCC4K has a Super 16mm sensor which is a conventional size that's been used since the 1960s. if it was good enough for the BBC, it's good enough for me! People should choose the right tool for the job. Until Sigma provides options for RAW compression, the fp is not for me.
Yeah altho there's some lossy raw formats (often perceptually lossless, even with intense colour grading), what he said could amount to "those documents take way more space so quality is obviously superior than those same documents but zipped"
i bought a sigma FP because of this video... a week later i got the smallrig cage.. completely rigged it out and just got a ronin SC... i'm bout to make a narrative mini series about bank fraud & the dark web. xD
I bought this camera the day it was released and never understood the hammering it received. It is a tremendous camera and makes shooting a pure joy. Thank you for recognising that.
This was very helpful to me as an fp owner - I bought it exclusively for stills, because it can adapt even very vintage ultra wide angles and offers in-body flat frame correction for them (!!). I LOVE it for photography. Never been into video but now I have a cinema camera, I’ve been thinking I should learn, if only to capture short clips of the gentle movements of the nature I’m out photographing. Your video is tremendously helpful, and informative, even for a total newbie - thank you!
1:25 fun fact: the original name for the piano (instrument) was the fortepiano because it had much better dynamic range capability than the harpsichord, the primary keyboard instrument at the time.
Watching this sent me down a big rabbithole! I love watching your videos because you have so much passion and general excitement for what you do, and learning from your experiences saves me a lot of money in my decision making. Thanks for doing what you do!
I have never heard of this camera and now you have sent me down a rabbit hole also LOL I have a Blackmagic 4K so this has me very interested in maybe selling mine LOL
ok im just 5 minutes through the video and im blownnn away not only did i not expect sigma to be crowned for the title of the video but to see the comparison, spec wise to the bmpcc4k , the r5 , the s1 on so fort.. and to see that it clearly outsmart them , again at least spec wise is unbelieveable. not enough videos for this little camera for sure...
I definitely understand your enthusiasm and love for this camera, I get very enthusiastic about gear and topics that I love and enjoy as well, but your reasoning for why the lp "obliterates" the BMPCC4K is not completely based in reality. BRAW is not "highly compressed" RAW. It is very lightly partially debeyared in-camera/recorder, but it's not *lossy* compression; it's lossless compression, meaning it's just a more effective way of storing the same raw bits. The only actual real-world difference coming from that partial debayering is a difference in the noise detail that is retained. The difference in detail retained is so minuscule that it simply does not matter in the real world, because it is not going to affect your colour grading even a little bit, it's not going to affect your dynamic range even a little bit, and you will not be limited in compositing the footage for heavy VFX use, either. The only scenario where this would make a difference is if all you're shooting RAW for is keeping the noise (digital noise, keep in mind) as true to the sensor data as possible. Otherwise, moot point; you're going to denoise (and regrain at the end for VFX) for final delivery and noise detail affects none of the signal integrity in the chain apart for the noise itself (again - digital, colourful noise - not film grain), and the difference will never be discernible in the slightest before punching in to 600% or above. ProResRAW is closer to uncompressed RAW, as there is no partial debayering happening in-camera/recorder. You still get smaller file sizes, but even the noise detail is perfectly retained. There is not a single reason to shoot in CDNG over something like ProResRAW unless filling up storage drives as quickly as possible is your kink. Oh, perhaps software compatibility, but that's a different story. So, no, BRAW is not "highly compressed", and for the rest of the video you talked about video codecs like H.265, which does not apply to the Blackmagic Pocket Cinema cameras when you have BRAW available. And I don't think you're thinking about bitrates in a logical way, either. Your comparison image between 0.19Mbps-9.00Mbps is completely detached from your actual argument, to the point where it's arguing in bad faith, in my eyes. Like with every other technical number in the world, you run into diminishing returns at a certain point. A higher bitrate does NOT always equal a higher image quality. Lossless compressed RAW like ProResRAW is not worse quality compared to uncompressed RAW, even if the bitrate is lower. I also don't know why you kept referring to it as "speed", as speed has nothing to do with image quality. The only speed in question here is the speed in which you'll be filling up your storage. You brought up "lamenting CDNG over Discord" as an argument against BRAW. What? BRAW is most certainly not a "little, tiny bitrate", and anyone will tell you that no matter how much you punch in, you will not see a difference between the bitrate of true lossless compressed RAW and uncompressed RAW at this level. You may see a difference in noise patterns in BRAW, as I've mentioned earlier, but other lossless compressed RAW formats? No. And did you really just imply RUclips compressing video to 10Mbps is equivalent to the Pocket 4K recording at 1088Mbps as a cause for compression artefacts? Again, if this is not misunderstanding compression on your end, this is a bad faith argument, and the furthest thing possible from #FACTS. Your argument about sensor sizes is valid. The only thing I'd bring up here is the Pocket 6K having a larger sensor, equivalent to a Super 35. It's still smaller than a full-frame, but whichever format is more "cinematic" is completely up to taste. The Pocket Cinema Camera 6K G2 is currently being sold for $1,995, so I think it's still a fair comparison here. That's all I had to point out. Again, I understand your enthusiasm (look at how much I just rambled on about the stuff *I'm* passionate about), and I agree with a lot of your other points, I just had to address the few that I felt were either misguided or misleading.
Having used it a ton for both video and photo, its an amazing video camera as long as you're willing to work with CDNG. As a stills camera is far, far better than anyone has given it credit for. Not accounting for resolution, or the led flicker issue, it is far better than my Canon R5 and pretty much anything I've shot that isn't a GFX.
Did you forget to mention? The fp L is a little difficult to compare to anything else. Without a mechanical shutter its high resolution but slow readout sensor ends up being a little limiting in terms of what you can shoot with it (artificial lighting risks banding and any significant movement will be distorted by the rolling shutter effect). These same factors also count against it in terms of its video, even relative to its 24MP sibling
Bruh!!! Thank you,,,,finally a video that answers the questions i have, or had shall I say! Words can't describe how grateful I am, gr8 content👌🏾! Respect to you bruh 💯
Pawel Achtel is everywhere I look on FB groups and he’s the best. He’s always chiming in and gently putting people in their proper lane. If anyone can effectively sell the FP it’s him.
Man! You nailed my doubts in a coffin. I listened to what the haters had to say. They disguised it as the little camera that could, but then let it ride off a cliff. They were excited about the 12bit performance, but hit you with an uppercut because it was lacking something. Man! You nailed it! Straight facts! Outstanding imagery! Superb video quality! Thank you for your honesty and excitement about what you do. God bless you🥳
I remember watching reviews of the Sigma FP when it first came out and thinking, what a shame, they seem to have nailed the hardware, but the lack of functionality really lets it down. Then recently I read an article in RedShark News, about a the low budget feature Snow Leopard, being shot on a rigged out FP, in BRAW 3:1 recorded on a BlackMagic Assist. What can I say, the new firmware has made this thing a beast to be reckoned with. Sigma, although good at making lenses have never been taken that seriously in the cinema / video camera market. I think that is about to change.
A lot of people don't understand that 12-bit long and 16-bit linear produce the same color fidelity, as linear is only needed for a small portion of the values, mostly below 18% gray. For example the Arri Alexa uses a 16-bit linear DAC for the sensor signal and then converts it to 12-bit log (or 13--bit in the case of the Alexa 35 because of its 17-stops of DR). This is far more efficient as a fully linear gamma would include values that are not perceptible, and thus would greatly increase data processing and storage for no real value.
I have been looking into this camera a few years back now and was fascinated by its capabilities. being a canon magic lantern raw user this is the perfect camera to get going with raw at such a low budget! thanks a lot for that awesome review! exactly what i was looking for.Now I’m so motivated to buy it and film some crazy raw footage
Thanks for this excellent video. I love my fp for video. fpL I use for stills. Now the fp got firmware 4.0 with false colour and more separation between STILL and CINE setup. Yes, fpL can be charged while using it with the usb-c port, but when you use an external SSD on the fp, you don't have a way to charge even if fp also had the charging option.
One of the best camera reviews I've ever watched. I'm a Audio Mixer and watched this to the end because it was so engaging. I've never heard of this camera before either. This review will make me take a closer look.
Great video! I just bought the camera about two months ago and I absolutely love it. I have it with the ninja five, but I am looking forward to shooting cinema DNG. I think your next video should be your workflow with the cinema DMG.
You're right. I totally forgot about this camera. These are a great deal right now. I may have to find one. Although I have Speedboosters that never come off my P4ks due to shooting with fullframe lenses. Seems like a great option.
I simply adore how you dynamite 🧨 the RUclips Gear frenzy. You touch a point that many (caught on resolution and AF traps) chose to avoid - how much filmic look is really emulated.
Great video as always Justin! One thing I would like to clarify is the claim that higher bitrates = higher quality. That's true to a point and when comparing identical codecs, but when comparing between codecs the logic somewhat falls apart. H.265/HEVC is roughly 4-6x more efficient than H.264, with H.264 being 2-3x more efficient than H.263. This means that ALL ELSE BEING EQUAL (frame rate, resolution, bit-depth etc.) an H.265 file at 100mbps is about the same quality as H.264 at 400-600Mbps. CDNG is a BEAR to work with natively, and you end up having to convert to proxy footage for any sort of realistic workflow. Whatever money you save on the camera, you spend on either time editing or time transcoding. This is where compressed raw codecs like BRAW and .R3D come into play. They get mere mortals close enough without flying right into the sun. The fp has OUTSTANDING quality for what it is. Is it practical to shoot on EVERY job? Absolutely not. Does it make my tinker-heart happy seeing others play with this camera? Absolutely. It reminds me of the Magic Lantern days when I used to hack my 60D to get 12-bit 720p files. Kinda want to shoot with that again... Again, awesome video and cannot wait to see what imagery you can make with this camera! -George
100% agree... look, I'm colorist/finisher and I've run tests on many different codecs over the years - and a couple of years ago I took a test of Arriraw footage and transcoded it to Prores 4444XQ, Prores 4444, DNxHR 444, and DNxHR HQX. Even putting them side by side and pixel peeping on my 77" OLED at UHD, they were indistinguishable... I then layered them and put a difference filter, and only saw a tiny amount of mathematical difference from the DNxHR HQX vs Arriraw. Bottom line is, just like resolution and bit rate, you run into diminishing returns. If it makes no practical and perceptible difference, all you're doing is burning through cards and drives faster, bogging down your systems, taking up more HD room, taking longer to make backups, etc... and hey, if that's your thing, more power to ya, I'm just giving the facts here. The only scenario where I could make a case for shooting raw and as high of resolution and bitrate as possible is if you are planning VFX composite shots... Oh, and one last thing... who makes a camera which is intended to shoot raw, but not have the option for some form of a LOG profile? Just boggles the mind.
Also, there are some lossless compression in codecs like BRAW that makes the higher bitrates of CinemaDNG look dumb. The worst is that, even if you have a quick enough storage, you still needs a powerful CPU, because CinemaDNG was not optimized to be decoded on the GPU. So, a really bad codec in general.
Hello there im working with 6k and 4k cdng 12 bit files on 2011 hp 8300 sff machine. No proxy and reqltime playback full resolution up to 30fps. I7 3770 4x4gb ram ddr3 1600mhz Gtx 1050 ti Crucial ssd 256gb
@4:15 - Voigtlander makes a few wide angle (manual) MFT lenses that can open all the way to f/0.95. I own a 10.5mm f/0.95 MFT for my GH5. Easily my favorite lens to use even though not always practical for my filming style. They also make a 17.5mm f/0.95 to better fit what you said here.
Ahaha epic outro🤣 This video was so cool Justin and seeing how much love this camera gives you is so entertaining. Thanks and I'll have a think about this cinema camera 😊
Dude, I've been preaching this for 2 years now! I love my FP. Real RAW is the only way to go. This camera's color science is also AMAZING! Super underrated. Thanks for highlighting it.
@@TheMinistryFilmworksEST2018 actually just noticed it when messing around in directors viewfinder mode. i was like…this looks squeezed, so threw the aivascope on there, and bingo!
@@JustinPhillip Hey, so I started playing with the anamorphic hack you discovered, and it seems like the FP will let you shoot open gate in the director's viewfinder mode but at a much lower bit rate and codec. Normally the only way to shoot open gate was through an external recorder one HDMI. Have you seen/tried that?
Preach! I loved my original BMPCC, but the 4/6K versions sucked, so I got the fp, and could not be happier! Real RAW to a USB drive, or ProRes RAW out the HDMI, even BRAW if you like compression. It’s also a beast in low light!
Dude at first I was like, Justin is always buying new stuff this is just the next temporary love interest camera. But after watching this video and doing some researching I’m gonna sell my 6k pro rig which I NEVER thought I’d say! I’m blown away man. You killed it with this review
it's definitely a different beast from your P6K tho. I dont know if i would encourage that choice, but i certainly love this camera, however I do primarily use it for stills. But it does have excellent video capabilities, you just have to know how to use it. The waveform is a MUST for proper exposure, because the lcd and the EVF will trick you into thinking everything is blown. But also, with this camera being Cinema DNG codec, much like on the original BMPCC you MUST protect your highlights. it clips REALLY easily, however, as shown in this video, you can go 4+ stops UNDER and have a CLEAN image when lifted. In fact, whether im doing video or stills with the fp, i underexpose everything by 1 stop, and it always comes out looking so good compared to what it looks like on the LCD or EVF. Just a few notes on it, i LOVE this camera, and if someone told me to choose between the fp or the P6K Pro, i would choose the fp, however, they are two different workflows.
@@JustinPhillip gotcha. Thanks for the precautions. I’m definitely used to false color, tilting LCD etc. But the image quality just blows me away. I have a full blown rig with all the trimmings and really comfortable with waveforms so that’s not an issue. Noted on the highlights tip, that’s important. I love how the low end of the image is really protected-I love underexposed low key images. It definitley sounds a bit more high maintenance than my 6k pro but I just love that image
@@JustinPhillip if you were a total noob film maker with no skills or clue [yet] and you were about to buy your first camera would you go the Sigma FP, the Blackmagic P6KP, or something other?
Yo I can honestly say that your right on point with the DNG RAW being the best possible image you can get compared to film. The images I get out of my Ursa mini 4.6k with the Luca Adapters Magic Booster mod is insane. It turned my S35 sensor into basically a full frame sensor with zero image degradation and coupled with DNG RAW files, it kills any Pocket 6K image out there hands down.
I never last through a 30 min video. As an enthusiastic amateur taking landscape stills with my 5d4, I didn't even understand half of this but I had no desire to stray away. Thanks for this!
My two previous videos (smallRig RC120D review & Color Science for Dummies) in both those videos the side angle is the Sigma fp as well as the shot at the desk. And in the smallRig video all the B-roll shots was with sigma fp as well. 🤙🏼
You just convince me. I put it in the cart already, but I was wondering a suggestion on a cable for recording to ssd? Thanks. Fan for a long time. Keep up the good work.
Hey Justin, I'm just wondering on why is a cinematic camera like Sigma FP would be so much cheaper than one released by Canon, whilst also cheaper than Canon's DSLR / mirrorless that are non-cinematic? Thanks in advanced (if you're replying) and take care. Regards. p.s. I haven't yet the time to research into the cinematic cameras vs DSLR. To be honest, I've just started learning on cameras like 2 weeks back as I'm in the midst of deciding which camera model I'd get as my first.
The Sigma fp and fp L are really interesting cameras. They clearly put a focus on making them as small as possible, which does create some frustrations, but it also puts them in a pretty unique space. I can see it working as a b-cam with your considerations Justin, but I think where it shows even larger benefits is what it can do in it's form factor versus other competitive mirrorless cameras. It's much, much smaller than anything else on the market when it's paired way down. Excited to see whatever Sigma does with reinventing their Foveon sensor technology in a future camera. It holds a lot of potential. And yep, you're correct regarding using a native format versus a Speed Booster or even Reducer. Less optics is almost always more ideal especially if you want the best the lens has to offer. Cheers.
Just want to say that your videos are so effortless in the way you present & explain all the camera stuff. I always have a great time watching your content! Keep it up my man 👌
After checking out a bunch of reviews on the FP I finally ended up here… for $1599 including a pretty good $450 lens it’s kind of a no brainer. It’s a pretty odd little camera but with a grip it’s infinitely more usable hand held. I have actually been using it completely differently than I originally planned, I have a few fast fifties and some old Takumar, Panagor and Angenieux lenses from a lifetime shooting 35mm stills. All I can say is WOW! Shooting vintage glass with the FP has made shooting incredibly interesting again. I just wish I had bought an FP sooner. I gotta say that your review was pretty much what sent me down this path, so thanks! P. S. EVF-11 on its way ;-).
Your video showed up in my feed after getting back into photography and filmmaking lately after MANY years off, with major changes in technology and specs. I have watched about 30 videos already, and I gotta say yours was the best from a visual perspective, and how you laid out the info. So good I decided to watch again and take some notes on these things. Thank you for taking the time to do this great video in a thoughtful yet direct way!
This is the first video I see after the initial release of this camera. And yes, this looks like an amazing camera! Just needs a looot more HDDs ;)) And you are right, people now really want that 4k and 6k and 12k footage and forget about the bits and MB/s, the real quality! Love your videos, thanks for sharing and can't wait to see more videos from you, using this camera in different situations.
This is a great piece of work, thank you! Finally a review by someone that understands what this camera is for. If you want to know what the Sigma FP is, and what it's capable of, this is the review to watch.
Sold my 2 REDS for 4 Sigma fps. So many reasons why this was one of the best decisions of my career. One of which is I can now use all the available prosumer grip equipment and get all the camera mobility found on a full blown film set because I no longer have the ridiculous weight restraints of the REDS. All this with FULL frame. The few lost stops of dynamic range are worth the sacrifice in light of all these advantages. One more thing! A7SII low light capability as well!
Really interesting video! I’d still say BMPCC4K is the better camera for most people. BRAW may be more compressed but it’s a lot easier to work with and the file size is more manageable. In some professional circumstances I could see DNG raw being more ideal, but in the main BRAW is more then enough for most. There is a reason why the BMPCC4K originally shipped with DNG RAW and changed it to BRAW with an update later on. Also, the menu system on Black Magic’s is one of the best and simplest, while still having many features. Also 4K 60p is great to have. The main thing I’d say going for the FP is the full-frame sensor. Anyway, great video! It was really interesting to learn more about Sigma’s cinema camera offering!
me and a bunch of friends sold our pocket 4k and 6k cameras for the sigma fp. the file size is a bit obnoxious but the image quality is amazing. very easy to work with and we edit most our footage off our ssd or massive externals anyways. You can easily upscale to 8k and still have an amazing image on 8k TV. You can shoot at 3200 iso 6400 iso... let's just say you can crank the iso and not worry about the image falling apart. details and shadows don't fall apart like that on the pocket 4k and 6k. I've been lazy but I have comparison videos I made prior to selling both my pocket 4k and 6k and the sigma fp blew both out of the water. the camera is also small and light and can fit on the lightest and smallest of gimbals. What's really impressive is the skin tones. you don't get that green tint or pink tint you get depending on what batch of the pocket cinema camera you got. I was the last to pull the trigger on this camera and I kept swearing by my pocket cameras. but then I used one as a b cam and wished it was my main camera. So many Blackmagic people are switching to the fp and or komodo. I can't say much about the komodo seeing the only reds I used was the epic. But the fp doesn't feel like another camera added to your pile of gear. it felt like a major upgrade especially coming from the 6k. you honestly have to try it for it to make sense. the second you open and start editing you footage you literally get chills with the flexibility.
@@Seanvandeusen Interesting take, thanks for the info! It really depends on the videos you mainly work on. FP seems like a great camera as a B or even A cam for interviews because of the Raw flexibility for color grading and hq image… also, the lack of 4K 60p doesn’t matter for that circumstance. Where as run and gun filmmakers who constantly shoot motion with commercials, music videos, or anything that will require b-roll, black magics may fit their circumstances better because of the small(er) file sizes, 4k60p+ and easy to navigate menu.
I do hope they bring higher framerates with updates even if we get knocked down to a lower bitrate. I'm using it for travel videos and commercial work. I bought it for my company but found me using it for everything.
@@Seanvandeusen The main ko criteria of the FP is the micro HDMI. I´m a monitor filmer and also need XLR Audio ins. The data size of the BM 6k pro is still !!! ok. I definately don`t want bigger file size (and don`t need it I guess). If I prefer real cinema quality, I rent an Arri Alexa.
Your direct to camera is interesting. Slightly looking up. you've given your whole setup a almost claustrophobic feel while leaning towards cozy. impressive
There is a huge difference between lossless compression and lossy compression... Raw in lossless formats doesn't lose quality, because you don't loose any information.
Tell me one lossless raw except dng. R3d is 3:1 or more, so is braw, so is any other. Dng in pocket is less than 2:1 which is claimed to be lossless and analogised to zip but i don't understand how it is lossless because afaik lossless image compression doesn't exist. If it did we wouldn't have uncompressed openexr.
@@cmdr.shepard Of course there is lossless image compression. Speaking about OpenEXR... There are multiple lossless image compression methods for that particular format. E.g. RLE. Imagine you have a completely black image. You can either write the same value (0, 0, 0) into the file millions of times, once for each pixel. Or you can just say that the same value repeats for a million times. The information is exactly the same, the space needed is very different. (That's basically how RLE works btw, by combining repeated pixels into blocks.) Other lossless compression algorithms are much more complex, but the truth is that they do exist. Now with video there is also temporal compression. (e.g.: Pixels that don't change over time, are ignored until they do.) Let me give you a more approachable example: The Nikon D810 can either save to NEF-Raw or uncompressed TIF files. The NEF files are ~20mb while the tifs are ~200mb.. And yet the NEF files are the ones with superior quality. Now that said, it is true that most video compressions are in fact lossy. However, that still doesn't mean that comparing the bitrate based on filesizes in relation to footage length is an apples to apples situation.. Lossy compression might be using multiple compression algorithms at the same time... Some lossy, some lossless. So depending on how these bitrates were determined those numbers might be meaningless... Additionally it's an exaggeration to compare youtube compression to braw compression... It's bottom end vs top end... It's like saying: "People always complain that 720p is pixelated, but they ignore that 8K is better than 6K." Like sure... 8K is better than 6K (assuming all other quality determining factors remain constant) but at some point the additional quality is just imperceptible / not worth the trade off. In a similar manner, many professionals in Hollywood are perfectly happy with slightly lossy compression such as the one used in BRAW. The Hobbit movies were shot using 5:1 compression (RED) and while those movies are far from perfect, lossy image compression was never mentioned as one of the issues.
I currently own a Red Scarlet, Epic and an FP. In my day job we use Arris and Sony Venice's. But the camera that excited me the most is the FP. You need to have the discipline of an old school filmmaker (think S16 cameras). But with patience, the footage is exceptional. Truly "cinematic" - up there with the big hitters. Love it!!! Thanks for the great review
@@BrothaEnockFor me It's not a run and gun camera for someone who wants to use autofocus/internal stabilization, etc. For me to get the best out of it, you probably need to follow a more traditional filming workflow. Take time in setting up your shots - if you want the most cinematic look out of it.
Hey man thank you for all that info, I've been on that search for the cinema camera and I'll admit I was all about that high resolution too, but I really appreciate you breaking it all down with the Sig fp and the tastey science behind it all. Watched till the end and now I want this camera. I want as raw and best quality as possible, and you showed me that door. Thanks brotha. Loved the Batman reference too 👌
Great vid dude. Passion is the fuel of great filmmaking. I'm still on the look out for a 4k ish movie camera, stabiliser, and lights, for all under £1000. I'm getting there
So happy I stumbled into this video. Love my FP, This little guy was/still revolutionary. Most RUclipsrs minus Crimson Engine had terrible things to say about it, which is a testament to how to how much of a game changer it was at release.
Great video man! Definitely changed my perspective on the FP. I will say, I don't think Cinema DNG 12 bit is superior to 16 bit REDCODE RAW (or even 12 bit B-RAW), or that bigger sensors are BETTER than smaller ones. I think both of these opinions are subjective. Higher bitrate does not always directly correspond to higher quality. Cinema DNG is a wildly inefficient codec (in the way is stores sensor data), and thus has to record at a higher bitrate to capture all the information. However codecs like REDCODE RAW have a more efficient way of storing the SAME amount of data in a smaller package. Full frame does have advantages over smaller sensors, but there are other times when the "disadvantages" of smaller sensors can be used as an advantage. For example most legacy cinema glass only covers super 35mm sensors, so it is an advantage to have a s35mm sensor if you want to use it. Also there are times when you need the light capturing abilities of a T2 lens, but don't want all of the depth of field. All of that to say, every tool has strengths and weaknesses, and it's just about selecting the right tool for the job 👍
I disagree in regards to B-raw. Braw visibly looks inferior to,the dense color of cinema dng. I noticed this,when I converted my pocket 4k from dng to brag and nearly threw up in my mouth with how overly vibrant and artificial the colors, were dng looked more celluloid-ish.
CinemaDNG....was there in bmc..earlier and that led to storage problem...after that they converted into Braw with a compression ratio..but I don't deny that CinemaDNG output much greater than redraw footage too
![Stromae, Pomme - “Ma Meilleure Ennemie” (from Arcane Season 2) [Official Visualizer]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/1F3OGIFnW1k/mqdefault.jpg)
My fp kit: kit.co/jpOnFilm/sigma-fp-kit
Can you control the camera through gimbal and use a ssd at the same time?
Hi, I'm looking for a cinema camera to match with my komodo. Does this color match with Komodo??
I'm primarily a stills photographer but I literally didn't pause this video because it was so engaging and well-made. Love the no bs approach and easy to understand explanations about bitrate and resolution. Loved it all, Justin. Looking forward to watching and learning more!
Awesome! Thank you
I use the Fp for stills a lot and editing the DNG in On1, you can get some pretty great results.
@@jamescohen I really was considering the Leica SL-2s for a hybrid system but the Fp looks to be a contender. Especially regarding value. I love that viewfinder attachment a lot.
@@leedeleon2745 I haven't even tried the viewfinder. In bright sunlight you wish for one though, and yeah, the screen not tilting etc. means some minor acrobatics sometimes, but for the moment I can't justify the cost of the viewfinder, when there are so many lenses and SSDs to buy for the Ninja.
If you get it, post some samples! Love to see what you do with it. I have a few early things when I first bought it here online and I think one recent clip with the Ninja. I have a long way to go to learn to use it to its potential though, as I discovered from this video.
@@jamescohen Yeah! i use it for stills all the time! in fact, that's why i originally got it, all the video stuff i found out AFTER i bought the camera! LOL
Great overview of the camera though I have multiple issues with how the data was presented.
Now before I get into things, let me clarify that I still think that this is a perfectly good camera and I'd be happy to add it to my equipment. That said, some things were presented in a biased way.
First of all. Color accuracy:
While you did show the chromaticty plots at 9:29 you didn't explain them in full detail.
You were happy to mention how the Sigma beats the Venice in regards to the greens, but completely ignored the fact that the Venice wins in regards to blues.
If you look at the diagram you can tell that the Sigma FP doesn't even seem to fully cover the blue range of the sRGB colourspace.
And depending on the display that you are creating content for, this might actually be more important.
If you are creating content for Rec.2020 (the large triangle in the diagram/ used by typical HDR displays), then yes... the gain in the greens is probably the more important factor. But if the content you create is for sRGB monitors (the smaller triangle / what most people on the internet have.) Then all the benefits in the greens are clipped away anyway... and you will only be left with the poor performance in regards to blue.
This is made worse by the fact that the 1931 version of the CIE diagram (the one used in the video) is biased and allocates a larger area to the green tones, exaggerating the importance of the difference in green, while undermining the importance of blue... The 1976 version of the diagram is much less biased and should be the one used in such a case.
I understand however that both the type of diagram used and omitting the blues were dictated by the source material, so I can't really blame you for that ^^
While this isn't perfect, it's not a huge deal either, since highly saturated blues are kind of rare in nature anyway. So unless you set out to capture maybe kingfishers or one of those crazy blue butterflies, the lack of extremely saturated blues won't come into play.
Bitrates / DNG RAW:
Now don't get me wrong, I think DNG raw is great, but the importance is definitely exaggerated in the video. Comparing RUclips compression to RAW compression is basically pointless.... You can't compare top end to bottom end....
It's like comparing the difference between 720p and 1080p to the difference between 6K and 8K. Like sure the former is worse than the latter (assuming all other quality determining factors remain the same) but there is a point of diminishing returns.... 8K might be more useful than 6K in extreme cases and the same is true for DNG raw, but in most cases, the extra storage needed outways the benefits. If many of Hollywood's professionals don't even bother to use the least aggressive version of the lossy compression methods but instead opt for one of medium strength (e.g. 5:1 on the Hobbit) then surely that's good enough for most of us too?
Another thing that bothers me with the bitrate comparison is that it's not clear whether the data was gathered in an unbiased way.
If you just compare filesizes in relation to clip length, then you are taking a biased approach.
Lossy RAW compression typically combines multiple algorithms, some lossy and some lossless. So the filesize does not represent the information contained in the file.
(Example for lossless algorithm.: Grouping repeated pixels can save storage without losing any information...
What needs more storage:
8x "green"
or
"green" "green" "green" "green" "green" "green" "green" "green"?)
Less abstract / real life example: The Nikon D810 can stores images as NEF-Raw or as uncompressed TIF files. (And of course JPG, but that's the bottom end, so let's ignore that.)
The NEF files need ~20mb per image while the TIF files need ~200mb.... And yet the quality of the NEF files is higher... The only reason to ever use TIFF would be edge case scenarios where you need the files to be immediately readable by any software, without having any time to manually convert the RAW files. (Maybe for the usage in the press, where time is more important than maximising quality?)
So don't estimate the bitrate of the video based on the filesize. A better method to make such comparisons, would be to first convert both source files (BRAW and DNG RAW) to uncompressed OpenEXR image sequences and compare the size of those in relation to the number of frames.
At the same time another advantage of using an uncompressed DNG Raw is overlooked in the video.
AFAIK image/video compression is actually quite a computationally heavy task, which in turn leads to a noticable hit in battery performance. I can only assume that this is at least partially the reason why the batteries of the Sony FP seem to last so much longer than those of the Blackmagic Pocket Cinema Camera, despite having a smaller capacity.
Thanks for coming to my TED talk.
Hope you enjoyed the read... 😄
Thanks bro yours Is the best explanation on the subject I could find on line up to now . Consistent information.
Yeah, the whole thing with the bitrate had me scratching my head. The higher bitrate throughput of the FP is a material requirement of shooting a less efficient format, not an indicator that the FP contains full multiples more usable visual information. "Its bus is faster" is frankly meaningless if both cameras are capable of outputting their highest settings to internal media.
Thank-you. I got only as far as the confused explanation of bitrates in this video before realising this guy has no clue. It's not about which camera has the biggest numbers. It's about practicality. A BMPCC4K gives *you* the choice of how much compression to use in the BRAW files, and this means that you can make the *best decision* for your needs. The Sigma gives you *no choice* so you must always use the maximum amount of expensive fast storage... or forget RAW altogether.
Just because it's compressed, the image must be worse? That's wrong. Even at the lowest BRAW Q5 the BM4K produces excellent footage. There are many comparisons online of the different quality settings. The differences are negligible, seen only by pixel-peeping and not in real life work. Comparing RUclips compression to these file formats is simple ignorance.
The discussion of the depth of field possible with a larger sensor is also off base. Not because it's technically incorrect, but because not everyone wants super-trendy miniscule DOF. Classic Hollywood directors prided themselves on *deep* DOF which is *much harder* to obtain and control on set. The BMPCC4K has a Super 16mm sensor which is a conventional size that's been used since the 1960s. if it was good enough for the BBC, it's good enough for me!
People should choose the right tool for the job. Until Sigma provides options for RAW compression, the fp is not for me.
Yeah altho there's some lossy raw formats (often perceptually lossless, even with intense colour grading), what he said could amount to "those documents take way more space so quality is obviously superior than those same documents but zipped"
@@RobinParmar small correction, the 4k has a 4/3 sensor, the 6k has the super35.
i bought a sigma FP because of this video... a week later i got the smallrig cage.. completely rigged it out and just got a ronin SC... i'm bout to make a narrative mini series about bank fraud & the dark web. xD
You made me buy the camera man....got a brand new body only for just $1226 ... and an extra battery for around $30.. Awesome deal.
Where did you got it?
@@cesarlunakuri7213 at a shop in my city. Not online.
So cheap... You lucky
I bought this camera the day it was released and never understood the hammering it received. It is a tremendous camera and makes shooting a pure joy. Thank you for recognising that.
What i learned from watching so many videos about cameras is that it doesn’t matter what camera you have ( if it‘s somewhat good) its you who makes it
I can't afford to watch this channel anymore... Every time I do, I add something to my shopping list.
This was very helpful to me as an fp owner - I bought it exclusively for stills, because it can adapt even very vintage ultra wide angles and offers in-body flat frame correction for them (!!). I LOVE it for photography. Never been into video but now I have a cinema camera, I’ve been thinking I should learn, if only to capture short clips of the gentle movements of the nature I’m out photographing. Your video is tremendously helpful, and informative, even for a total newbie - thank you!
1:25 fun fact: the original name for the piano (instrument) was the fortepiano because it had much better dynamic range capability than the harpsichord, the primary keyboard instrument at the time.
Watching this sent me down a big rabbithole! I love watching your videos because you have so much passion and general excitement for what you do, and learning from your experiences saves me a lot of money in my decision making. Thanks for doing what you do!
Thank YOU 🙌🏼
I have never heard of this camera and now you have sent me down a rabbit hole also LOL I have a Blackmagic 4K so this has me very interested in maybe selling mine LOL
ok im just 5 minutes through the video and im blownnn away not only did i not expect sigma to be crowned for the title of the video but to see the comparison, spec wise to the bmpcc4k , the r5 , the s1 on so fort.. and to see that it clearly outsmart them , again at least spec wise is unbelieveable. not enough videos for this little camera for sure...
I definitely understand your enthusiasm and love for this camera, I get very enthusiastic about gear and topics that I love and enjoy as well, but your reasoning for why the lp "obliterates" the BMPCC4K is not completely based in reality.
BRAW is not "highly compressed" RAW. It is very lightly partially debeyared in-camera/recorder, but it's not *lossy* compression; it's lossless compression, meaning it's just a more effective way of storing the same raw bits. The only actual real-world difference coming from that partial debayering is a difference in the noise detail that is retained. The difference in detail retained is so minuscule that it simply does not matter in the real world, because it is not going to affect your colour grading even a little bit, it's not going to affect your dynamic range even a little bit, and you will not be limited in compositing the footage for heavy VFX use, either. The only scenario where this would make a difference is if all you're shooting RAW for is keeping the noise (digital noise, keep in mind) as true to the sensor data as possible. Otherwise, moot point; you're going to denoise (and regrain at the end for VFX) for final delivery and noise detail affects none of the signal integrity in the chain apart for the noise itself (again - digital, colourful noise - not film grain), and the difference will never be discernible in the slightest before punching in to 600% or above.
ProResRAW is closer to uncompressed RAW, as there is no partial debayering happening in-camera/recorder. You still get smaller file sizes, but even the noise detail is perfectly retained. There is not a single reason to shoot in CDNG over something like ProResRAW unless filling up storage drives as quickly as possible is your kink. Oh, perhaps software compatibility, but that's a different story.
So, no, BRAW is not "highly compressed", and for the rest of the video you talked about video codecs like H.265, which does not apply to the Blackmagic Pocket Cinema cameras when you have BRAW available.
And I don't think you're thinking about bitrates in a logical way, either. Your comparison image between 0.19Mbps-9.00Mbps is completely detached from your actual argument, to the point where it's arguing in bad faith, in my eyes. Like with every other technical number in the world, you run into diminishing returns at a certain point. A higher bitrate does NOT always equal a higher image quality. Lossless compressed RAW like ProResRAW is not worse quality compared to uncompressed RAW, even if the bitrate is lower.
I also don't know why you kept referring to it as "speed", as speed has nothing to do with image quality. The only speed in question here is the speed in which you'll be filling up your storage.
You brought up "lamenting CDNG over Discord" as an argument against BRAW. What? BRAW is most certainly not a "little, tiny bitrate", and anyone will tell you that no matter how much you punch in, you will not see a difference between the bitrate of true lossless compressed RAW and uncompressed RAW at this level. You may see a difference in noise patterns in BRAW, as I've mentioned earlier, but other lossless compressed RAW formats? No. And did you really just imply RUclips compressing video to 10Mbps is equivalent to the Pocket 4K recording at 1088Mbps as a cause for compression artefacts? Again, if this is not misunderstanding compression on your end, this is a bad faith argument, and the furthest thing possible from #FACTS.
Your argument about sensor sizes is valid. The only thing I'd bring up here is the Pocket 6K having a larger sensor, equivalent to a Super 35. It's still smaller than a full-frame, but whichever format is more "cinematic" is completely up to taste. The Pocket Cinema Camera 6K G2 is currently being sold for $1,995, so I think it's still a fair comparison here.
That's all I had to point out. Again, I understand your enthusiasm (look at how much I just rambled on about the stuff *I'm* passionate about), and I agree with a lot of your other points, I just had to address the few that I felt were either misguided or misleading.
Having used it a ton for both video and photo, its an amazing video camera as long as you're willing to work with CDNG. As a stills camera is far, far better than anyone has given it credit for. Not accounting for resolution, or the led flicker issue, it is far better than my Canon R5 and pretty much anything I've shot that isn't a GFX.
woahh just ordered today and supposed to cancel but stumbled on this comment. Waiting for it... 😄
How’s it better than the r5?
Did you forget to mention? The fp L is a little difficult to compare to anything else. Without a mechanical shutter its high resolution but slow readout sensor ends up being a little limiting in terms of what you can shoot with it (artificial lighting risks banding and any significant movement will be distorted by the rolling shutter effect). These same factors also count against it in terms of its video, even relative to its 24MP sibling
Your knowledge/depth and amusing presentation dripping with truth wrapped sarcasm is nice. Thank you!
Bruh!!! Thank you,,,,finally a video that answers the questions i have, or had shall I say! Words can't describe how grateful I am, gr8 content👌🏾!
Respect to you bruh 💯
Pawel Achtel is everywhere I look on FB groups and he’s the best. He’s always chiming in and gently putting people in their proper lane. If anyone can effectively sell the FP it’s him.
Can’t believe I watched all of this. So well made, good job friend!
I like your reviews. No BS, no crappy 'music', straight talking but passionate and full of good quality, real world examples. Thanks very much.
🙏🏼
No soft porn with slow motion girls in the beginning. This is too cerebral
Man! You nailed my doubts in a coffin. I listened to what the haters had to say. They disguised it as the little camera that could, but then let it ride off a cliff. They were excited about the 12bit performance, but hit you with an uppercut because it was lacking something. Man! You nailed it! Straight facts! Outstanding imagery! Superb video quality! Thank you for your honesty and excitement about what you do. God bless you🥳
I remember watching reviews of the Sigma FP when it first came out and thinking, what a shame, they seem to have nailed the hardware, but the lack of functionality really lets it down. Then recently I read an article in RedShark News, about a the low budget feature Snow Leopard, being shot on a rigged out FP, in BRAW 3:1 recorded on a BlackMagic Assist. What can I say, the new firmware has made this thing a beast to be reckoned with. Sigma, although good at making lenses have never been taken that seriously in the cinema / video camera market. I think that is about to change.
A lot of people don't understand that 12-bit long and 16-bit linear produce the same color fidelity, as linear is only needed for a small portion of the values, mostly below 18% gray. For example the Arri Alexa uses a 16-bit linear DAC for the sensor signal and then converts it to 12-bit log (or 13--bit in the case of the Alexa 35 because of its 17-stops of DR). This is far more efficient as a fully linear gamma would include values that are not perceptible, and thus would greatly increase data processing and storage for no real value.
I have been looking into this camera a few years back now and was fascinated by its capabilities. being a canon magic lantern raw user this is the perfect camera to get going with raw at such a low budget! thanks a lot for that awesome review! exactly what i was looking for.Now I’m so motivated to buy it and film some crazy raw footage
This review is so good that it has made me a subscriber.
Dude. I just bought an a7iv and am now seeing this and in love with it😂
Thanks for this excellent video. I love my fp for video. fpL I use for stills. Now the fp got firmware 4.0 with false colour and more separation between STILL and CINE setup. Yes, fpL can be charged while using it with the usb-c port, but when you use an external SSD on the fp, you don't have a way to charge even if fp also had the charging option.
Got it. And glad someone else gets it. Impeccable review.
One of the best camera reviews I've ever watched. I'm a Audio Mixer and watched this to the end because it was so engaging. I've never heard of this camera before either. This review will make me take a closer look.
I think this might be one of the best videos I’ve ever watched on RUclips.
Nice!
Dude, this video is making waves! You've really made me reconsider this camera 🤩
Great video! I just bought the camera about two months ago and I absolutely love it. I have it with the ninja five, but I am looking forward to shooting cinema DNG. I think your next video should be your workflow with the cinema DMG.
Second this too please
Boy... This an incredible quality review level. Amazing.
You're right. I totally forgot about this camera. These are a great deal right now. I may have to find one. Although I have Speedboosters that never come off my P4ks due to shooting with fullframe lenses. Seems like a great option.
I have been on and off looking at this camera, and yes it came out right before the 2020, thanks for talking about it !
Daaaang the amount of information is insane. I love your passion for this camera. Clearly you really like it a lot
Yes I do!
I simply adore how you dynamite 🧨 the RUclips Gear frenzy. You touch a point that many (caught on resolution and AF traps) chose to avoid - how much filmic look is really emulated.
Loved this video tutorial and Loved the Out Takes too!!! Lots of info and some fun.
Brilliant mate! such an education. I gave this option up over komodo a year ago. now, i am getting one too!
This was a super fun video. Love all the care and thoughtful insights you included. You rock my friend.
Thank you!
I found something very interesting about this Signa fp today! Thank you all for discussion
Great video as always Justin!
One thing I would like to clarify is the claim that higher bitrates = higher quality. That's true to a point and when comparing identical codecs, but when comparing between codecs the logic somewhat falls apart. H.265/HEVC is roughly 4-6x more efficient than H.264, with H.264 being 2-3x more efficient than H.263. This means that ALL ELSE BEING EQUAL (frame rate, resolution, bit-depth etc.) an H.265 file at 100mbps is about the same quality as H.264 at 400-600Mbps. CDNG is a BEAR to work with natively, and you end up having to convert to proxy footage for any sort of realistic workflow. Whatever money you save on the camera, you spend on either time editing or time transcoding. This is where compressed raw codecs like BRAW and .R3D come into play. They get mere mortals close enough without flying right into the sun. The fp has OUTSTANDING quality for what it is. Is it practical to shoot on EVERY job? Absolutely not. Does it make my tinker-heart happy seeing others play with this camera? Absolutely. It reminds me of the Magic Lantern days when I used to hack my 60D to get 12-bit 720p files. Kinda want to shoot with that again...
Again, awesome video and cannot wait to see what imagery you can make with this camera!
-George
100% agree... look, I'm colorist/finisher and I've run tests on many different codecs over the years - and a couple of years ago I took a test of Arriraw footage and transcoded it to Prores 4444XQ, Prores 4444, DNxHR 444, and DNxHR HQX. Even putting them side by side and pixel peeping on my 77" OLED at UHD, they were indistinguishable... I then layered them and put a difference filter, and only saw a tiny amount of mathematical difference from the DNxHR HQX vs Arriraw.
Bottom line is, just like resolution and bit rate, you run into diminishing returns. If it makes no practical and perceptible difference, all you're doing is burning through cards and drives faster, bogging down your systems, taking up more HD room, taking longer to make backups, etc... and hey, if that's your thing, more power to ya, I'm just giving the facts here.
The only scenario where I could make a case for shooting raw and as high of resolution and bitrate as possible is if you are planning VFX composite shots...
Oh, and one last thing... who makes a camera which is intended to shoot raw, but not have the option for some form of a LOG profile? Just boggles the mind.
Also, there are some lossless compression in codecs like BRAW that makes the higher bitrates of CinemaDNG look dumb. The worst is that, even if you have a quick enough storage, you still needs a powerful CPU, because CinemaDNG was not optimized to be decoded on the GPU. So, a really bad codec in general.
Hello there im working with 6k and 4k cdng 12 bit files on 2011 hp 8300 sff machine. No proxy and reqltime playback full resolution up to 30fps.
I7 3770
4x4gb ram ddr3 1600mhz
Gtx 1050 ti
Crucial ssd 256gb
@@smalldeekgeorge
Oh Yeh?!
@@EitamChannel Yup 👍🏻
I have two Sigma FP cameras... I love them!
@4:15 - Voigtlander makes a few wide angle (manual) MFT lenses that can open all the way to f/0.95. I own a 10.5mm f/0.95 MFT for my GH5. Easily my favorite lens to use even though not always practical for my filming style.
They also make a 17.5mm f/0.95 to better fit what you said here.
Mitakon also has a 17mm f0,95 for MFT. It’s a lot cheaper than the Voigtlander and there’s a cinelens housing option
@@marc.ristau I’ve owned the mitakon 25mm way back for my Sony. Another favorite of mine, actually owned that before the voigtlander
These Voigtlanders are only usable at f 2.5, in my opinion. A Laowa 10 mm f 1:2 costs about 490 Euros.
One of my fav review enthusiast videos about any topic. Thank you for sharing your perspective.
Ahaha epic outro🤣 This video was so cool Justin and seeing how much love this camera gives you is so entertaining. Thanks and I'll have a think about this cinema camera 😊
Nice, thanks! As a stills enthusiast calling full frame, Large format is unhelpful, even if coming from micro 4/3 cameras, it kinda makes some sense.
yeah i know that was my HUGE oversight. i definitely had a LOT of people calling me out for that when this video first dropped
@@JustinPhillipTop respectful answer, thanks!🎉
Dude, I've been preaching this for 2 years now! I love my FP. Real RAW is the only way to go. This camera's color science is also AMAZING! Super underrated. Thanks for highlighting it.
My pleasure!
@@JustinPhillip Also, Thanks for the ANAMORPHIC HACK!!!! Someone did a deep dive in that manual!
@@TheMinistryFilmworksEST2018 actually just noticed it when messing around in directors viewfinder mode. i was like…this looks squeezed, so threw the aivascope on there, and bingo!
I keep preaching
@@JustinPhillip Hey, so I started playing with the anamorphic hack you discovered, and it seems like the FP will let you shoot open gate in the director's viewfinder mode but at a much lower bit rate and codec. Normally the only way to shoot open gate was through an external recorder one HDMI. Have you seen/tried that?
Preach! I loved my original BMPCC, but the 4/6K versions sucked, so I got the fp, and could not be happier! Real RAW to a USB drive, or ProRes RAW out the HDMI, even BRAW if you like compression. It’s also a beast in low light!
Is the ProRes RAW or BRAW out of the HDMI as good or close to the DNG?
@@BeaumontsBrainsOut ruclips.net/video/qPB6wrVKHiw/видео.html
Dude at first I was like, Justin is always buying new stuff this is just the next temporary love interest camera. But after watching this video and doing some researching I’m gonna sell my 6k pro rig which I NEVER thought I’d say! I’m blown away man. You killed it with this review
it's definitely a different beast from your P6K tho. I dont know if i would encourage that choice, but i certainly love this camera, however I do primarily use it for stills. But it does have excellent video capabilities, you just have to know how to use it. The waveform is a MUST for proper exposure, because the lcd and the EVF will trick you into thinking everything is blown. But also, with this camera being Cinema DNG codec, much like on the original BMPCC you MUST protect your highlights. it clips REALLY easily, however, as shown in this video, you can go 4+ stops UNDER and have a CLEAN image when lifted. In fact, whether im doing video or stills with the fp, i underexpose everything by 1 stop, and it always comes out looking so good compared to what it looks like on the LCD or EVF. Just a few notes on it, i LOVE this camera, and if someone told me to choose between the fp or the P6K Pro, i would choose the fp, however, they are two different workflows.
@@JustinPhillip gotcha. Thanks for the precautions. I’m definitely used to false color, tilting LCD etc. But the image quality just blows me away. I have a full blown rig with all the trimmings and really comfortable with waveforms so that’s not an issue. Noted on the highlights tip, that’s important. I love how the low end of the image is really protected-I love underexposed low key images. It definitley sounds a bit more high maintenance than my 6k pro but I just love that image
@@JustinPhillip if you were a total noob film maker with no skills or clue [yet] and you were about to buy your first camera would you go the Sigma FP, the Blackmagic P6KP, or something other?
You got me. After seven months of fighting the urge I will get this camera.
Yo I can honestly say that your right on point with the DNG RAW being the best possible image you can get compared to film. The images I get out of my Ursa mini 4.6k with the Luca Adapters Magic Booster mod is insane. It turned my S35 sensor into basically a full frame sensor with zero image degradation and coupled with DNG RAW files, it kills any Pocket 6K image out there hands down.
I never last through a 30 min video. As an enthusiastic amateur taking landscape stills with my 5d4, I didn't even understand half of this but I had no desire to stray away. Thanks for this!
Clearly you’re not that enthusiastic if you can’t sit through a 30 minute video.
@@thedogs3467 You couldn't just keep going could you? You just had to stop and say something about someone you don't even know.
My two previous videos (smallRig RC120D review & Color Science for Dummies) in both those videos the side angle is the Sigma fp as well as the shot at the desk. And in the smallRig video all the B-roll shots was with sigma fp as well. 🤙🏼
Could I pair this camera with a Sony A-Series camera?
You just convince me. I put it in the cart already, but I was wondering a suggestion on a cable for recording to ssd? Thanks. Fan for a long time. Keep up the good work.
@@franciscomejias6994 the SSD you buy or have should have already came with a high powered usb-c cable
@@JustinPhillip yeah, but a type c to a type a.
Hey Justin, I'm just wondering on why is a cinematic camera like Sigma FP would be so much cheaper than one released by Canon, whilst also cheaper than Canon's DSLR / mirrorless that are non-cinematic? Thanks in advanced (if you're replying) and take care. Regards.
p.s. I haven't yet the time to research into the cinematic cameras vs DSLR. To be honest, I've just started learning on cameras like 2 weeks back as I'm in the midst of deciding which camera model I'd get as my first.
Wow, what a eye opening intro to a beast of a cinema camera!
Ok, was planning on getting a Black Magic soon but might have to go for the FP after this video. Thanks!
Well it's uncompressed 12 raw over partially debayered compressed raw with built in noise reduction and color frigging. That's almost video 😂
Good decision. Selling my blackmagic.
Y'all should just buy lights
@@jeremiahschuler3977 I have them 🤣
A super cool and informative video, cheers!
The Sigma fp and fp L are really interesting cameras. They clearly put a focus on making them as small as possible, which does create some frustrations, but it also puts them in a pretty unique space. I can see it working as a b-cam with your considerations Justin, but I think where it shows even larger benefits is what it can do in it's form factor versus other competitive mirrorless cameras. It's much, much smaller than anything else on the market when it's paired way down. Excited to see whatever Sigma does with reinventing their Foveon sensor technology in a future camera. It holds a lot of potential. And yep, you're correct regarding using a native format versus a Speed Booster or even Reducer. Less optics is almost always more ideal especially if you want the best the lens has to offer. Cheers.
Thank YOU for all that you do, Phil! 🙌🏼🙏🏼
Thanks. Watched this quite a few times :) Purchased the camera today 😍
Hey man, what a great vid, and your passion… woah, it’s communicative and a pleasure to see! Thanks a lot 🙏
Crazy camera! I have the R5 and work in Real Estate photography. But man this camera kills in video for sure! Great video man!
Just want to say that your videos are so effortless in the way you present & explain all the camera stuff. I always have a great time watching your content! Keep it up my man 👌
Thank you
Fellow FP owner here! Came thru to learn more about this beast. But gotta say: Justin, ur video is such good energy, keep it up man!
Justin, top notch! Thank you. Fantastic reveal of this gem of a camera and just a well-made video.
thanks!
Thanks for your effort in explaining the technical capabilities of this tool.
After checking out a bunch of reviews on the FP I finally ended up here… for $1599 including a pretty good $450 lens it’s kind of a no brainer. It’s a pretty odd little camera but with a grip it’s infinitely more usable hand held. I have actually been using it completely differently than I originally planned, I have a few fast fifties and some old Takumar, Panagor and Angenieux lenses from a lifetime shooting 35mm stills. All I can say is WOW! Shooting vintage glass with the FP has made shooting incredibly interesting again. I just wish I had bought an FP sooner. I gotta say that your review was pretty much what sent me down this path, so thanks! P. S. EVF-11 on its way ;-).
Your video showed up in my feed after getting back into photography and filmmaking lately after MANY years off, with major changes in technology and specs. I have watched about 30 videos already, and I gotta say yours was the best from a visual perspective, and how you laid out the info. So good I decided to watch again and take some notes on these things. Thank you for taking the time to do this great video in a thoughtful yet direct way!
This is the first video I see after the initial release of this camera. And yes, this looks like an amazing camera! Just needs a looot more HDDs ;)) And you are right, people now really want that 4k and 6k and 12k footage and forget about the bits and MB/s, the real quality! Love your videos, thanks for sharing and can't wait to see more videos from you, using this camera in different situations.
Dude your voice is so good its like listening to a storytelling. Subscribed. And yaa, sigma fp got me into deep thinking.
This is a great piece of work, thank you! Finally a review by someone that understands what this camera is for. If you want to know what the Sigma FP is, and what it's capable of, this is the review to watch.
Wow! This really is convincing. Might have to pick one up.
Sold my 2 REDS for 4 Sigma fps.
So many reasons why this was one of the best decisions of my career. One of which is I can now use all the available prosumer grip equipment and get all the camera mobility found on a full blown film set because I no longer have the ridiculous weight restraints of the REDS. All this with FULL frame.
The few lost stops of dynamic range are worth the sacrifice in light of all these advantages.
One more thing! A7SII low light capability as well!
This really feels like an April fools joke! I can't believe how amazing these specs are!
Really interesting video! I’d still say BMPCC4K is the better camera for most people. BRAW may be more compressed but it’s a lot easier to work with and the file size is more manageable. In some professional circumstances I could see DNG raw being more ideal, but in the main BRAW is more then enough for most. There is a reason why the BMPCC4K originally shipped with DNG RAW and changed it to BRAW with an update later on. Also, the menu system on Black Magic’s is one of the best and simplest, while still having many features. Also 4K 60p is great to have. The main thing I’d say going for the FP is the full-frame sensor. Anyway, great video! It was really interesting to learn more about Sigma’s cinema camera offering!
Totaly agree. I own the 4k and the 6k pro and keep my GH-5 for rough outdoor stuff and maybe change it for a GH-6 in the future.
me and a bunch of friends sold our pocket 4k and 6k cameras for the sigma fp. the file size is a bit obnoxious but the image quality is amazing. very easy to work with and we edit most our footage off our ssd or massive externals anyways. You can easily upscale to 8k and still have an amazing image on 8k TV. You can shoot at 3200 iso 6400 iso... let's just say you can crank the iso and not worry about the image falling apart. details and shadows don't fall apart like that on the pocket 4k and 6k. I've been lazy but I have comparison videos I made prior to selling both my pocket 4k and 6k and the sigma fp blew both out of the water. the camera is also small and light and can fit on the lightest and smallest of gimbals. What's really impressive is the skin tones. you don't get that green tint or pink tint you get depending on what batch of the pocket cinema camera you got. I was the last to pull the trigger on this camera and I kept swearing by my pocket cameras. but then I used one as a b cam and wished it was my main camera. So many Blackmagic people are switching to the fp and or komodo. I can't say much about the komodo seeing the only reds I used was the epic. But the fp doesn't feel like another camera added to your pile of gear. it felt like a major upgrade especially coming from the 6k. you honestly have to try it for it to make sense. the second you open and start editing you footage you literally get chills with the flexibility.
@@Seanvandeusen Interesting take, thanks for the info! It really depends on the videos you mainly work on. FP seems like a great camera as a B or even A cam for interviews because of the Raw flexibility for color grading and hq image… also, the lack of 4K 60p doesn’t matter for that circumstance. Where as run and gun filmmakers who constantly shoot motion with commercials, music videos, or anything that will require b-roll, black magics may fit their circumstances better because of the small(er) file sizes, 4k60p+ and easy to navigate menu.
I do hope they bring higher framerates with updates even if we get knocked down to a lower bitrate. I'm using it for travel videos and commercial work. I bought it for my company but found me using it for everything.
@@Seanvandeusen The main ko criteria of the FP is the micro HDMI. I´m a monitor filmer and also need XLR Audio ins. The data size of the BM 6k pro is still !!! ok. I definately don`t want bigger file size (and don`t need it I guess). If I prefer real cinema quality, I rent an Arri Alexa.
Your direct to camera is interesting. Slightly looking up. you've given your whole setup a almost claustrophobic feel while leaning towards cozy. impressive
There is a huge difference between lossless compression and lossy compression... Raw in lossless formats doesn't lose quality, because you don't loose any information.
Tell me one lossless raw except dng. R3d is 3:1 or more, so is braw, so is any other. Dng in pocket is less than 2:1 which is claimed to be lossless and analogised to zip but i don't understand how it is lossless because afaik lossless image compression doesn't exist. If it did we wouldn't have uncompressed openexr.
@@cmdr.shepard Of course there is lossless image compression. Speaking about OpenEXR... There are multiple lossless image compression methods for that particular format. E.g. RLE. Imagine you have a completely black image. You can either write the same value (0, 0, 0) into the file millions of times, once for each pixel. Or you can just say that the same value repeats for a million times. The information is exactly the same, the space needed is very different. (That's basically how RLE works btw, by combining repeated pixels into blocks.) Other lossless compression algorithms are much more complex, but the truth is that they do exist. Now with video there is also temporal compression. (e.g.: Pixels that don't change over time, are ignored until they do.)
Let me give you a more approachable example:
The Nikon D810 can either save to NEF-Raw or uncompressed TIF files. The NEF files are ~20mb while the tifs are ~200mb.. And yet the NEF files are the ones with superior quality.
Now that said, it is true that most video compressions are in fact lossy.
However, that still doesn't mean that comparing the bitrate based on filesizes in relation to footage length is an apples to apples situation.. Lossy compression might be using multiple compression algorithms at the same time... Some lossy, some lossless. So depending on how these bitrates were determined those numbers might be meaningless...
Additionally it's an exaggeration to compare youtube compression to braw compression... It's bottom end vs top end...
It's like saying:
"People always complain that 720p is pixelated, but they ignore that 8K is better than 6K."
Like sure... 8K is better than 6K (assuming all other quality determining factors remain constant) but at some point the additional quality is just imperceptible / not worth the trade off. In a similar manner, many professionals in Hollywood are perfectly happy with slightly lossy compression such as the one used in BRAW.
The Hobbit movies were shot using 5:1 compression (RED) and while those movies are far from perfect, lossy image compression was never mentioned as one of the issues.
Going to purchase this camera now! Wish me luck 🥺☺️
I currently own a Red Scarlet, Epic and an FP. In my day job we use Arris and Sony Venice's. But the camera that excited me the most is the FP. You need to have the discipline of an old school filmmaker (think S16 cameras). But with patience, the footage is exceptional. Truly "cinematic" - up there with the big hitters. Love it!!! Thanks for the great review
May I ask why you need the discipline of an old school filmmaker with this camera? Those words just stuck out to me.
@@BrothaEnockFor me It's not a run and gun camera for someone who wants to use autofocus/internal stabilization, etc. For me to get the best out of it, you probably need to follow a more traditional filming workflow. Take time in setting up your shots - if you want the most cinematic look out of it.
@@globalturfwar what cinema camera would recommend for run & gun?
@@BrothaEnock I'd say Sony's or Canons. I was using an FS5, but I'm sure there's others who'll be able to provide more info.
I like it!
This one is worthy of my time to start researching!
Thank you for doing this!
Also... subscribed!
Hey man thank you for all that info, I've been on that search for the cinema camera and I'll admit I was all about that high resolution too, but I really appreciate you breaking it all down with the Sig fp and the tastey science behind it all. Watched till the end and now I want this camera. I want as raw and best quality as possible, and you showed me that door. Thanks brotha. Loved the Batman reference too 👌
RUclipss algo is working again. It just recommended this gem of video to me and I really really enjoyed it from 🇿🇦🇿🇦🇿🇦🇿🇦🇿🇦🇿🇦🇿🇦.
Noice!
Most interesting and fascinating video I’ve seen for months!
I've never seen such a indepth review on a camera before keep shining like u do King
I use two of these cameras and even use one as my web cam when I need it,
Great vid dude. Passion is the fuel of great filmmaking. I'm still on the look out for a 4k ish movie camera, stabiliser, and lights, for all under £1000. I'm getting there
Absolutely great video about what is clearly a great camera.
I had no idea this camera existed lol. Good to know
So happy I stumbled into this video. Love my FP, This little guy was/still revolutionary. Most RUclipsrs minus Crimson Engine had terrible things to say about it, which is a testament to how to how much of a game changer it was at release.
Best video I watched this week. Thanks man!
thank you for your passion and so much information about this tiny beast! best regards from Brazil!
you bet!
Ok. I'm sold.
Wow great video man! Well explained benefits 🍻
Thanks Sam Rockwell for this well produced video. I really like the great audio on this one.
Great video man! Definitely changed my perspective on the FP.
I will say, I don't think Cinema DNG 12 bit is superior to 16 bit REDCODE RAW (or even 12 bit B-RAW), or that bigger sensors are BETTER than smaller ones. I think both of these opinions are subjective.
Higher bitrate does not always directly correspond to higher quality. Cinema DNG is a wildly inefficient codec (in the way is stores sensor data), and thus has to record at a higher bitrate to capture all the information. However codecs like REDCODE RAW have a more efficient way of storing the SAME amount of data in a smaller package.
Full frame does have advantages over smaller sensors, but there are other times when the "disadvantages" of smaller sensors can be used as an advantage. For example most legacy cinema glass only covers super 35mm sensors, so it is an advantage to have a s35mm sensor if you want to use it. Also there are times when you need the light capturing abilities of a T2 lens, but don't want all of the depth of field.
All of that to say, every tool has strengths and weaknesses, and it's just about selecting the right tool for the job 👍
I disagree in regards to B-raw. Braw visibly looks inferior to,the dense color of cinema dng. I noticed this,when I converted my pocket 4k from dng to brag and nearly threw up in my mouth with how overly vibrant and artificial the colors, were dng looked more celluloid-ish.
agree, all tools have a place and time. no way I'd shoot a wedding with cinemadng.
@@seanwan30 Well youtube isn't the final goal. its just us sharing what we can with the public.
Great vid! Much respect for being a working LA pro and still doing these long vids about awesome dark horse gear
Dam good review my man ! FP & FPL shooter here.
This is the review I have been waiting for since the release! I love my fp and it’s always in my bag.
Nice take on this camera guys
One of the best reviews I have ever watched. The material and manner of the information presented was fantastic.
Thanks!
CinemaDNG....was there in bmc..earlier and that led to storage problem...after that they converted into Braw with a compression ratio..but I don't deny that CinemaDNG output much greater than redraw footage too