FRIEND OF BRANDON BOUDREAUX and MELANIE PALOWSKI BREAKS SILENCE
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- Опубликовано: 1 окт 2024
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Jes was a close friend of Melani Palowski for over a decade, and is a close friend of Brandon Boudreaux. Her husband is Brandon's business partner. She also knew Lori Vallow [Daybell]. ...Jes shares her harrowing experience trying to help her friends, and the fear she experienced for months while people kept dying.
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Dr. John Matthias is a licensed clinical and forensic psychologist with twenty-five years’ experience in both clinical and forensic work. He has performed over 500 forensic and psychological evaluations and risk assessments for the courts since 1996, assessing the risks for violent and sexual recidivism for both adults and juveniles. He serves as an expert witness for the federal government and he has consulted on numerous high-profile cases for District Attorney’s offices and defense attorneys in several states. He is a certified court evaluator in several Western states, and he has forensic evaluation contracts with the federal government. He recently started a podcast, Hidden: A True Crime Podcast, with his journalist wife, Lauren, to present forensic psychology to a broad audience. The current season of the podcast explores the psychological dynamics behind the Vallow/Daybell case.
In the forensic area, Dr. Matthias has developed expertise in personality assessments, hidden behavioral motivations, complex trauma and criminal psychology. In the clinical realm, he has worked with numerous victims of abuse and trauma, including with survivors of the Las Vegas shooting massacre in 2017. He also received his Master’s degree in Marriage, Family and Child counseling from the University of Southern California and he has worked with hundreds of families, couples and children over the years. He supervises UNLV doctoral students on forensic assessments, clinical case formulation, and various therapeutic approaches to clinical work.
Dr. Matthias graduated with honors in philosophy from Princeton University, and won the prestigious McCosh Thesis prize while there. In high school he graduated valedictorian from a large public high school in Chicago where he was chosen to participate in a ground-breaking valedictory study that continues to this day. He received his doctorate from the University of Southern California.
Lauren Matthias
Lauren has worked as an anchor and reporter for ABC, NBC, and FOX News in East Idaho, Boise, Idaho and Salt Lake City, Utah. She spent a decade reporting on a diverse range of topics from high profile crimes to Presidential visits. Most recently, she reported for Salt Lake City’s ABC affiliate News4Utah. In 2015 she received the Idaho State Broadcaster’s Association Best Reporter award in addition to receiving the best report of the year in 2015 based upon a short documentary she did on LGBTQ rights. She was hired by Milwaukee’s ABC affiliate to be their lead reporter in 2015. She recently left the reporting world to stay home with her son and to produce and edit, Hidden: A True Crime Podcast. She currently works as the executive producer of the Hidden podcast
Great interview. Arguably the most revealing of the insider information thus far since Zac's interview. This woman came off so bright, sincere, thoughtful, and caring. Very impressed by her and her courage. Great work Lauren and thank you.
Thank you so much.
💯 agree.
Totally agree. Came here to comment same but could not articulate the sentiments any better.
So excellently expressed.
I hope you don't mind but I thought I'd add another point which might resonate with you. It was alluded to several times in this interview by Jes but also has been brought up in Lauren's other videos which is why I find Lauren's (and John and "good" Lori) work relatively unique and a special contribution to the true crime community.
I think that, as a science and philosophy educator, who has spent a decade trying to pass on some of the things that we can say about human nature, our behavior and psychology, that part of the fascination that humanity has with crime, (especially the most egregious) is trying to understand what it says about all of us, about humanity.
We far too often prefer to vilify and otherize the most violent criminals in an effort to distance ourselves from them. I think it so confuses us that we need to believe and treat these people as if they're not even human at all. We prefer to believe they are something different from us. After all, no moral and functional human being could ever do these things to another, right? Clearly, this view, while understandable, is not only wrong but probably immoral as well.
They are very much human.
I think that probably scares us the most because somewhere in the darkest cavities of our conscious and unconscious mind, we have an inkling, a sort of uncomfortable twitch that forces us to wonder if we too could ever do such a thing. I am human and they are human yet these people do the most unthinkable (and seemingly inhuman) of things. It can't possibly be true that we are the same sort of animal. They must be a different sort of animal, rather a monster.
What Jes painfully expresses in this interview is the reality that Lori is not all bad. She was not all bad. She had not always been all bad, however you wish to qualify it. She clearly has good in her, likely to this day. Jes' poignant testimony really brings this home when she discusses not only Lori's good qualities but also those of Melanie.
It's just not simple enough to try to understand these people in a nuanced fashion; to accept that they are not monsters. Dysfunctional? Damaged? Possibly genetically inclined? Brainwashed? Greedy? Poor judgment? Desperate? All of these things and many more not listed. But we always prefer simple answers to complex ones, so monsters they must remain for most of us. That protects us as well. That simple answer is reassuring. It provides us with security in the belief that we are not monsters and could never become one.
While some might take issue with this position presuming it to mean it is either a sort of denial of "evil" or a show of excessive and weak compassion, I think that position is horribly misinformed about the sort of animal that we are.
Trying to better understand extreme and harmful human behavior should be the objective, not simply to identify "good" and "bad" humans. Empathy and compassion are also a central part of what it is to be an evolved social animal. And it is a required quality for those who are curious and wish to learn.
And none of that excludes the realism that some people simply need to be removed from society to the extent that we have every good reason to believe they are harmful not only to others but to themselves as well.
If the empirical, scientific evidence is present to show that people can be rehabilitated, we should attempt to do so. And if the empirical evidence of likely recidivism is present, we must not make the mistake of liberating them from secure environments.
So thank you Lauren, to you and your husband, for both also exemplifying this crucial part of the puzzle; a sensitivity, curiousity and empathy to try to educate others and help us all better understand how we tick. That seems part of the right pathway, in addition to analyzing the cold facts, in order to ultimately find ways to reduce the likelihood that events like this continue to replicate.
When I found out from kay and Larry that Brandon went out of his way to show up, comfort them, support them and identified JJ so they would be spared any more horrific memories I knew he was a good person. That had to be very painful for him as well but he knew that might have ended Larry. That is the definition of a kind, empathetic, moral, man.
Plus that could have happened to him and his own kids too. The same fate
AMEN 🙏😢💔
Amen 🙏🏼
Amen! 🙏❤️🙏
Totallly sgree.. that scene from the documentary showing Brandon, Kay and Larry going through that made me cry.
The fact that so many ppl stepped up to hide Brandon, and that he ID'd Tylee & JJ for Kay's husband shows what a wonderful man Brandon is.
Proof that no one can put their trust in the police department there.
And all this time the Chief of police had more important things to take care of !
I can never find the words to describe how angry this makes me. The audacity of Melani to act so smug about this whole situation. She is just as evil has Alex, Chad, and Lori.
I feel angry as you, I felt the beginning she know a lot, and did nothing
I agree
Melani Pawlowski needs her kids taken away from her and she needs to be arrested. If Ian remains with her, he is part of it. Thank God Brandon got away from her.
Oh definitely!!!!
Thank God for Larry and Kay who got the police involved which brought the media attention!❤
AMEN TO THAT!! If no one takes the time to "do something, Anything" people get away with ALOT. God Bless there hearts forever.
The REAL GOD will watch over them. I just pray she doesn't get ANYTHING for testimony she DID GIVE ENOUGH OF,to save herself. She help in this and tried to kill Brandon. TRULY BELIEVE...
I think its time for Law Enforcement, Family courts, DV advocates, shelters, mental health professionals, etc. to be Educated on the fact that Men can also be victims of DV & the Hateful wrath of others. Brandon and Charles deserved so much more from the people they reached out to for help. All of this could have been avoided had someone taken them seriously.
YES YES YES!!!! I say this all the time.
Most of those people know it but the day to day cops have a macho culture where they ignore most women’s pleas as unworthy and disdainful and 100% of men’s pleas-they MOCK. It’s a vile culture helping no one except maybe the city’s pocketbooks and some roadway clean up and help-most of which could be done a better way by someone else.
And the public needs to understand how common false allegations of dv and child molestation are against innocent men, especially during divorce/custody disputes. I tried a case once (many years ago) where the accuser made up a false claim in order to get her ex deported.
I totally agree! Lay Crisis Counselor/First Responder 45yrs in Seattle area & I think I have aided more male victims than female!
There are absolutely no shelters for men to go to get away from women who are "domestic abusers." Often men don't report it because they are shamed by police as it not being man enough! Femphatals! Female killers!
Yes...Justice for Brandon Boudreau 💙
What happened to Branden
@@beautifuldisaster8006 Alex tried to shoot and kill him. There was speculation of his life insurance policy being a major reason. He had to stress about protecting their 4 children from her, after the attempt made on his life.
I cannot believe that Lori & her so called group destroyed so many lives and got away for so long...
I hope Brandon & his kids will find peace one day & RIP TO all the murdered victims...
Justice for all...
Please don't let anything happend to Brandon and his children God please put your protection. and Love around them keep them safe and sound these are your children in Jesus Name Amen God your words say ask anything in your name it shell be done so I am asking you now because I just found out
That’s speculation no proof or evidence. No nobody has been charged. People are stupid that’s why innocent people are sent to jail via jury trial because people get emotionally invested in these cases and assume guilty unless proven innocent. Without any facts. The candle light vigils the memorials with cheap teddy bears and gas station flowers. People love to mourn as if they knew these people. They move from one tragedy to another the watts family, JJ and Tylee now “America’s daughter Gabby Pettito. People in this country have too much idle time.
It’s about time Melanie P was held accountable, she was clearly up to her eyeballs in the crazy.
I’m sorry if I seam slow I’m new to the case since she was not getting charged I felt like she was very privileged and it wasn’t fair so I left the case in the beginning can you tell me who melony is and by privileged no i don’t mean white I mean suburban, upper class!
She was also clearly on board with having Brandon killed. The father of her children, they are so warped.
@@juelzmartinez5694 Melanie P is Lori Daybells niece, her mother died young so she considered Lori a mentor. 🤢
💯
@therealz 360z its sad for the kids for sure. Not likely a snap out of it situation. If past behaviours are best predictors of future behaviours, most likely she will be in handcuffs before long, and asking the court to delay her hearings next, for incompetency. Monkey see, monkey do.
I don't understand how Melanie has any type of custody with her children
I wonder why LE didn't listen to Charles. If they had, he would be alive. Could it be because they're also LDS church members?
@@dorothyd7929 probably. The LDS and religious people in general have some crazy reach, especially the zelots
Does she have visitation? That's scary.
@@carlamarlene2927 yes, a judge awarded 50/50 custody. I'm really hoping that maybe after things in the trial come out that maybe Brandon can gain full custody. I mean...she was totally ok with her kids being taken out due to being dark. I don't know how there's any coming back from that.
@@dorothyd7929 Charles’ interview pleading outside on the lawn was heartbreaking. He tried SO HARD! He wasn’t vindictive toward Lori but seemed genuinely concerned she needed “help” via mental health treatment-- but this is EVIL. ☠️👺☠️💀☠️👺☠️
Just the fact that grown adults were truly living in daily fear of Lori, Alex, and Chad...Tylee and JJ lived in that chaos daily. If adults feared for their own lives, then you KNOW the kids did too.
I love how Chad can label everyone's kids dark who are all still at school age but all 5 of his own adult children are light. Narcissistic at his core! Did his own followers at least question that?
Followers don't question. They jump on the bandwagon and THEN ask, so what do we believe?
@@hazelwalker6570 thank you for that information, I did not know that.
if his children are light. im just wondering why his wife tammy was dark? its so confusing
@@hazelwalker6570 I think there is a special allowance for frog faced monsters that receive messages through portals……I mean when a guy like Choad comes along their judgement of light and dark is simply not to be questioned!
I’m sorry I needed to write that sarcastic rant because when it’s spelled out I’m reminded of exactly how unfathomable it is that it went so far! I have started to forget some of the details but I don’t ever want what happened to become anything less than horrifying to me. Apathy and numbness will do a disservice to all who lost their lives. So many people are going to have to be the voices of all who were murdered and insure that this never is able to happen again.
I seen a news clip of his kids in action cursing and flipping off the camera and laughing and this was right after Tammy had been buried. That video has disappeared 😕
I’m surprised that Melani P has access to the children. I don’t trust her.
Especially when 2 of her children were deemed "dark" by Chad along with Brandon
Or her new born…just shows you Brandon is a kind man…puts his children s needs before his own bitterness…i do hope those visits are supervised!!!!thats a wonderful man!!!
@@waynejohnston9982 I think they are supervised
@@DorothyJanetoo I sure hope so, she should be in jail, she tried to kill the father of her kids.
@@DorothyJanetoo I think I saw their custody hearing and they settled recently. A plan was set for her to transition back into having them unsupervised starting this month. Terrifying.
Imagine how it must feel for Brandon when he has to send his kids to visitation with Melanie knowing what he knows about her ..
It must be hart ranching for Brandon, knowing two of his kids where considered dark.
She should be supervised visitation only
So, what if melenie polouski see's anyone of their children as dark ? What would she do to those children ? After what lory v dabell did to Tylee and JJ ? melenie must not be trusted at any given TIME ?
@@annramjattan510 Has Melani not proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that she lacks judgment?
I believe it's of benefit to the children to have the closest relationship possible with their mother.
For their own safety, however, that access must be restricted until Melani demonstrates that she no longer subscribes to her previous dangerous quack religious beliefs. And that she no longer believes that cold-blooded murder is an acceptable method to solve her problems.
I am curious; do you believe that previously, during the years when she was espousing her aunt's heresy, that Melani treated her two _dark_ children the same way that she treated her light children?
Poor lambs. What a scary and confusing ordeal for little ones to suffer through.
Thank heavens they have such a protective, loving and devoted father!
Yeah that judge really blew it !
You are a remarkable young lady , you saved 5 lives whether you realise it or not , if you didn't help
Brandon ? He probably wouldn't be amongst us ? You are right in saying you lost a friend on that day . Don't have any regrets for helping Brandon and kids , hats off to you for doing the right thing at the right time . Friends come and go you are better of without her .
The very persons to help and protect the Cox children, grand children etc. were the very ones who literally destroyed them. Barry and Janice Cox. Pride manipulation and control in my humble opinion destroyed this entire family and brainwashed by the Book of Mormons. Joseph smith and angel moroni.
Chad was already saying his kids were ‘dark.’
I saw Brandon testify yesterday and it was heartbreaking! They had to stop because he had started crying talking about JJ. You and your husband and all the others are very brave for protecting him and a HUGE Thank you to you. Great interview and loved the poem 💔
Is his testimony on video?
Can we all chip in a dollar and get this gal some flowers? Or like, a super-healthy edible arrangement? What a brave soul, for real. Thank you for your insight, Jes.
Sounds like Brandon was the only fully clear-eyed/critically-thinking person early on in this whole chain of events, to lay this out to law enforcement who themselves seemed unable to put the pieces together…
One of a very few, for sure.
Charles Vallow was clear eyed too. He just couldn’t convince the police to act.
Charles, Adam and Zac too.
This is so unbelievable it a long while for law enforcement to believe it all, had the children not been missing, the police would have thought this was all divorce nonsense.
This was a really gripping and dad interview. The Chandler Police look extremely incompetent. At least by the time of Alex's death they had the foresight to take his and Zulema's electronics. I suspect that Zulema killed Alex.
I read that Brandon went to ID JJ because Larry was so heartbroken it exacerbated an illness. That is one stellar human being and I’m sure heartened he is going to provide his children with an amazing role model. He is obviously a man of great character.
Yeah, Brandon is the shit. Too bad NObody listened.
@Ms Bliss JJ’s body was buried intact shortly before the ground froze so it wasn’t as decomposed. That’s why it took them so long to recover the bodies. The frozen ground preserved JJ’s body,
This girl is the most truthful person I've seen
Unbelievable. This to me is just unfathomable what families have gone thru and how the ripple effects have touched SO many lives.
Mel gave up a gem.
This is one of the things I really hold against Melanie Gibb. She was trying to find Brandon and the kids, too.
I did hear Melanie Gibb say in her interview with Nate Eaton the Lori asked her to go to Brandon’s home and see if he was there… There was no one there. The neighbours came out and she asked about Brandon. Neighbour told her he left after the murder attempt. Melanie G said that was the first she had heard about the shooting. I find Melanie to be a weak minded person who was manipulated and used by Lori… stupid yes but I don’t reckon she was actually involved in the murder side of it all. Just the feeling I got from listening to a lot of her interviews. But Melanie P is up to her neck in all the murder side and definitely needs to be held accountable.
@@luckysunbird8862 I agree why hasn’t Melanie P been charged with attempted murder on her ex?
@@MarleneDeal-dl3ci definitely. Can’t wait
@@luckysunbird8862 they are both in up to their necks. To stay with someone who says their children are Zombies would be enough to run like hell straight to the FBI!
@@luckysunbird8862lol nooo..Melanie g is a huge narc she's as bad as Lori. Not manipulated at all. Both Melanie's are horrid pplboth of then could have saved those children, they are offering up bs excuses to make themselves seem innocent. They are not at all
I can only imagine how terrifying it was when Melani Pawlowski showed up at Brandon's parents house and then finding out Alex was parked down the street. I've got goosebumps.
What a powerful interview. What a beautifully kind, sincere and just.. my God. How amazing it would be for everyone to have someone on their side that is as devoted as she is to those the loves and cares about. You can see she's a genuine human being and it is beautiful
It was Melanie Gibb who showed up looking for Brandon 👹
Brandon put his foot down and helped break this case open...I hope his case goes to court and people involved get prison time.
Original whistleblower and then it’s like the dominos began falling
Thank God for Brandon and mom.
Thank God for these heroes.
@@diffiCULTresearch Your saying you were the original whistleblower?
@@shawnapenn7836 I believe she's agreeing with the original comment in saying that Brandon was the original whistleblower. She's not claiming that SHE was.
This is the first person with true emotions I've seen in this whole case. What a powerful interview, she really brought reality to this whole twisted situation
And great job, Jes. It can't be easy to talk about these people who were so close to you.
She sure did 🙏⚖️💜🕯💜🕯💙🕯💙🕯💙🕯
What a courageous woman with a down to earth description of the situation. In my past I have had to divorce myself from loved ones who are toxic. All you can do is pray for them and make sure your actions have integrity like this young woman
Don’t forget Lori’s oldest son
Yes. Annie, Joe’s sister, has too.
Melanie P is absent NOT INNOCENT!! Don’t you even worry sweetheart, you did the right thing!!!! You and your husband and friends should be so proud of yourselves & know THAT YOU DEFINITELY SAVED LIVES!!! Brandon & all his beautiful babies at MINIMUM!!
She is a horrible person! And she needs to be in jail as well!
This case IS like an onion...when you peel the layers back you find that there's nothing but tears.
A year after this video was posted there's STILL ongoing investigation with this and Lori was found competent to stand trial. God willing neither she, nor Chad see the light of day again. And may Melani P spend every single day of her life thanking God that she got immunity because I don't doubt for one second that she knows way, way more than she's let on.
Amen, I like how you used the onion 🌰 analogy...so true 👍
Yes onion analogy was quite appropriate!
Absolutely. The 2 Melanies , Zulema, and a few more....
Yes that was some bs agreement
I know this is an old video, but I just want to thank Jes for sharing her story and perspective. I don’t think I fully appreciated until listening to her just now how in danger Brandon, at least a couple of his kids and others still were. The Woodcocks are heroes for being so persistent in seeking help and getting the media involved. My heart breaks for them, the community in Arizona, and all the other victims. I hope you all find healing and peace. ❤
I don’t have the answers, but it seems like more could have been done sooner to protect Charles, JJ, and Tylee. If more had been done, perhaps Tammy would also still be here. If you see something, say something. Don’t assume someone else is blowing the whistle. We also really need to address stalking and take harsher action against people who stalk or threaten others.
I don’t think you will EVER owe Melanie P an apology. My gut tells me so.
I believe maybe Melanie P. was also interested in a life insurance payout on Brandon too ??? What about her new husband - did he know of their plans ??? Were they all involved in the plot ???
New husband found out the about on their wedding night , he was already Hooked.
Melani P owes the world an apology and a better, more straightforward explanation not spoken in circles
@@blazefairchild465probably because she is pregnant with Ian's child
@@darklorddisco Melanie P is Very Evasive about Much. 😒
She's been married to Ian (what...) 5-ish years now? How many kids have those 2 produced at this time? Imagine the dysfunctional dynamics of this swift marriage, and being bound to a woman that withholds a portal closet of secrets and skeletons. Surprised Ian has not removed himself, so he must truly love a woman that could walk away from her own children w Brandon and go along w a plan to upend him/Brandon. Hmmm! Something's gotta be off about him...in his belief system. Sure as hell, Ian has a great deal of faith this is all going to work out, so keep popping out more babies...as they do.
Brave lady and a true friend to Brandon 🥰 Melani has lost a lovely friend
I have wanted to hear more of this mel p situation so much and have been waiting to hear from anyone o this..so delighted to see this pop in my stream... i am very well studied on case all the playerz, stc. I have consumed every drip of info coming out.
kinda flabbergasted I am sure the bones of what she is saying is true. i have to be honest though the way she has told her story the amount of drama, the long drawn out stences crocodile tears , shakiness in her voice...this woman was not in danger shez has whipped herself into a frenzy and wants more than her 15, out of all unique individuLs involed in the case handz down she gets most intolerable award.... knocking out longtime standing champion julie row..i would rather have to spend 3 hours watching julie row ribbon dance while she sang dirty hip hop on a infinite loop... i am.gonna do this ten chunkz at a time
my advice would be for her to take down more than notch or too like several levels..i hope she gets what she was seeking
@@AnnieTyme I think you and I have just watched different interviews.
wonder what dr john would say
@@AnnieTyme I feel sorry for you in that you cannot understanding someone being emotional after being put through an ordeal such as this. She was in the mists of a serial killer who has killed her kids, husband(s) and future husband’s wife! Is there ice running through your veins?
@@lkenady52 they didnt kill this ladys kids. what are u talking about? i am confused. and no indont have ice in my veins i just recognize when someone has narcissistic traits and the woman in interview has them shes extremly attention seeking in the way she represents herself and speaks as i would say again i wonder if dr john notices the drama of the this girl... i feel for brandon b i agree melanie may have been invovled for sure lori and alex were.... i get hed husband was friends with brandon but i highly doubt at all they were ever a target she obviosly whipped herself into frenzy for no reason did lori have life insurance policiy on her no..undo realize all victims,targets had life insurance policies too fund their secret combination or were minor children they had custody of..
The way Melanie Pulaski sat outside of Brandon's house trying to tell the cops that her children were in danger from Brandon that just made me sick that just showed the level of evil in Melanie Pulaski I think
Melanie Gibb is much more involved than she’s admitting to. The more I hear about this case, the more I believe this to be true.
Do you mean Melani (Boudreau) Polowski?
@@shiningstar2903 both Melanies actually. Zulema too.
@Kimberly Rogers yeah, I agree about Zulema. Not sure about Melanie Gibb. She new that Lori and Chad were trying to manipulate her but did not know why. I'm sure she is crushed to know what they were really doing was far worse than manipulating her.
Oh my goodness I can’t wait!! Justice for Brandon!! 💜
Right?? Missed his head by mere inches. He's lucky to be alive!! 😒😳
Justice for ALL!
I wonder if Melanie P. has an alibi for when Brandon was shot at ??? Some think she may have been driving the Jeep ???
That’s awesome. I’m glad people are coming out disclosing things
She's the first person in the whole bunch who's made any sense to me.
Zach's interview was good
Charles and Brandon did not deserve any of this.
Brandon kay Larry Lori brother Adam Charles children . There are many .
Heather Daybell’s was amazing also.
Just when I thought I couldn’t be more horrified by this case, I watched this interview. God bless and protect this poor woman and her family. She comes off as being very sincere and absolutely shaken to the core by these people. I know this has been said before, but the cops were beyond negligent. Like She said, “People kept dying and nothing was being done.” What on earth was LE doing?? All those lives down the drain because the police turned a blind eye!
It could not be more clear.
Husband dies, wife dies, two kids die, brother dies,
Wedding in Hawaii?
Oh yeah.
Lori duped the cops & everyone else.
The cops were firting with Lori. So Sick .
What a brave young woman! Also you did a great job interviewing by letting her talk without unnecessary interruptions.
Beautiful person! Melanie should have stuck with her. She seems so honest and caring ❤️
Thank goodness she didn't! This woman may have been murdered by LORI'S CULT too!
Think of the friends and acquaintances Melani P. had pre-cult and post-cult! What a change in “lifestyle!”
Thank God for people who speak out, about those involved in this nightmare, and for those who give them a safe forum to do so.
Yep she is so right authorities didn't even hardly do anything because when Charles was begging for help those cops laughed at him and thought he was a joke but they brought it up with Lori and when they were laughing and giggling with her that's what's messed up because they could have saved his life and those kids
Well, they do get jaded watching couples break up, ALWAYS calling their exes crazy, wacko & insane.
Lori was just a flirt. She is con artist. The police was not experienced enough to keep their attention on the deal at hand. Lori needs to only have women deal with her. Including the Doctors, Attorney’s, Social Workers, Jailers and maybe a Judge. Maybe a women can deal with her better - by not being attracted to her. That said, she wraps men around her finger in my opinion.
@@nancyhenderson8001 I agree it needed to be women with authority to deal with her cause they would have caught the red flags immediately! Like that female detective who questioned her after Charles got killed, she was very assertive towards Lori and lori fell back and cowered! All those male police officers saw was a “pretty women” with a “crazy husband”…little did they know she was the crazy wife!
Absolutely! Shame on them
I'm sure those officers are feeling bad enough now.
After listening to someone on the stand at the trial, we now know that Lori and Melanie flew to Missouri or somewhere together after the kids were missing, so of course Melanie knew they were dead.
Watching the flippant female officer handle the Brandon attempted murder is so infuriating and frustrating. She’s clueless while the shooter, Alex, and the driver just drive further and further away. She blew it.
It's amazing how long these people got away with murder and attempted murder. Both melanies were in on this horror and I hope they fully investigate their involvement before this happens again.
Well, I think she at first came across as flippant because Brandon told her he thought it was a BB gun...etc..and just trying to figure it all out . . . as she and more officers continued to look at everything...she obviously because more concerned in trying to figure out what happened and also when she saw the bullet in the vehicle knew it wasn't a BB gun . . etc.. This incident obviously was not taken flippantly in the end as they continued to investigate and now charges for it are being filed.... I think her initial discussion is also trying to keep the situation calm and find out what was happening....
Her and the arrogant cop who Charles spoke with. Charles was pleading with him and his flippant attitude, like "I don't want to be here talking to you" ticked me off so much
I felt the exact same when I watched the body-cam footage. It was like watching the officers who were all so dismissive to Charles. It makes no sense and is concerning.
I didn't feel that way at all, I thought she kept calm, took him seriously and was trying to figure everything out. A world away from the flippant dismissive cops who Charles tried to talk to and who could have saved his life, they seemed to be mainly focused on doing as little work as possible
Lauren, this is a wonderful interview. Wow.
I have a friend, that used to work for Brandon and his business partner. Her husband. My friend thought Brandon was truly amazing and never understood what he saw in Melanie because she came across as extremely helpless. According to my friend, Brandon was 30 years old (when she knew him) making like 250-300k per year. She said he was the most humble and down to earth person she’s ever known.
Many people are blinded by love & Brandon was one of those people until his wife divorced him.
What Melanie was trying to have Alex Cox - do “take Brandon out” was A. Very risky let alone a crime & B. Risking the thought - even today 2yrs later a sizable RED flag 🚩 that she is a danger to her own children! The grief Jes (as well as many others endured) is inexcusable! Definitely a CULT CULTURE!
You can truly feel the fear this poor girl felt…her voice is shaken talking about it. I feel bad for her & the trauma she is suffering. Thank goodness she shared her story with us 🙏🏻❤️
I agree. How brave you must be to bare your thoughts to complete strangers!! She is the second woman, Heather Daybell is the first, so bight, so courageous to tell it like it is, rather than how you wish it is!
She could be scared yet
Melanie Gibb left her husband and children and is still a sought after speaker in this fringe group. Her bf, David, is one of the leaders in this fringe group.
Melani Pawlowski left her children and husband.
Did Alex have a life insurance policy and whom was the benificiary? Zulema?
MG is divorced from David now.
@@twinsmommyn2 She was never married to David. David is the new bf, a leader in AVOW and Preparing A People.
Even after Lori and Chad being arrested, Melanie Gibb was still out and about giving speeches to this fringe group. Nothing leads me to believe she still isn't involved.
They’re not divorced they were living separately and possibly attempting to save their trash pact together. It’s a joke. He’s also not a leader he’s just a worker bee.
I have always wondered about this angle of the case. Lori's friend April (in Hawaii) stated that she was told by Lori that to be a part of the 144K she would have to leave her children behind. How many other women were approached to "join" and told the same thing? I think Lori killed her kids as an "example" to all the women she was trying to "recruit". "If I (your leader) can do it...so can you." I realize thls is far reaching theory, but I wish Dr John would address it.
@@bababythesea4389 Ya and all the while Lori taking out life insurance policies on them.
In 1970, when members of the Manson family went to trial, I was about 16. It felt as if genuine evil had come to Earth. Now, with Chad and Lori, it feels like that again. How could so many people die while so many people knew about it...
Same
I agree. They're very similar. Scary stuff the same high level.
These things happen everyday. Evil is all around…but there’s a lot of goodness and beauty in the world too. Be cautious and discerning.
It's genuinely horrifying, watching the interviews on your channel over the last few days, to see how many victims/surviours Lori and Chad and Alex and their cult have created. I remember, all the way from here in New Zealand, years back hoping the children were alive and hidden. Now watching the trial and these interviews, this beautiful young lady, the sister in law, the cousin... The human suffering is immense and the ripples seem to go on forever in these communities and families. Dear Jes, you have the right to feel however you feel. Thank you for letting us understand a fraction of what this has been like for you. I hope you can heal, you're an amazing person. x
Lauren - you should interview Natalie Pawlowski next!! That would be AWESOME to hear her side!!
Agreed 💯
Melanie P. Is a lier- she will come, talk, play victim and continue to lie with her word salads!
Do you mean Melani?
@@brendaredmond4678 no, not Melani, Natalie Pawlowski is Ian’s ex wife. I think she would have a lot of helpful info to share!!
@@karilivingston9974 Yes absolutely! I agree,
I pray that Brandon has the strength to see this til the end.i pry he doesn't give up . He deserves justice along with all those that lost their lives because of these horrible people.
I agree!! Poor Joe Ryan…I think Brandon’s got a lot more ppl and info behind him and he’ll make it. Joe was alone when he was being attacked and I hope they investigate his death too.
Also, he just won a $12 million lawsuit so he and his kids should be well protected with resources like that.
Brandon has showed TREMENDOUS strength & fortitude since day one. There is no doubt in my mind he will endure the full trial and is an AMAZING example for his children as well as friends and family around him! He will be blessed and protected.😇👣👣👣❣👑
@therealz 360z true. And coming from someone who had a crazy mom, I would never claim that the money makes up for that
Lori was grooming Melanie P 😭😭😭
Oh for sure, she zoned right in on Melanie’s weakness and vulnerability and moved right in, wringing her hands together while smirking 😏
Both Melanie’s must be held accountable for what happened.They could have stopped this tragedy.
Yes!!!!
Yes both. MG tells everyone she didn’t believe but she was right there doing podcasts and going to all the conventions and all the private meetings. She was into it.
Agreed
Now seeing Jess, Colby and Zack in interviews, the emotional roller coaster that you guys have been on has been so sad yet very brave. Melanie Gigg interviews are so disconnected from reality and emotionless, not one tear from her just surprised me.
Melanie Gibb only cried for herself.
I think the reason MG got so upset when Lori asked her to tell people that JJ was with her was because she knew that the children were dead and then decided she didn’t want to be involved anymore. That’s why she recorded the phone call, to save herself. I’ve got a message for MG no one believes you didn’t know and that you didn’t believe what Chad was saying. You were all up in that group, and liked being a part of that group.
Jess, you are so courageous. Thank you for blessing us with your story. Your pain and trauma opened my eyes to countless others that were impacted by all of this evil that we never hear about. Praying for you and your family. Praying for peace and comfort. Thank you.
This is outstanding. So helpful to hear from someone in the circle who watched this tragedy unfold.
I wouldn't call her a person "inside the circle"
OMG, to hear the extent of the fear that this Cult generated is disgusting. Who are these Angel warriors helping Melani? I’m now thinking that Alex was taken out because he was getting too dangerous even for Chad and Lori. Justice for Brandon too
Don't forget the neighbor
@@bulletsfordinner8307 oh for sure...i don't blame his loved ones for their not wanting his death be ANY part or slightest connection w Chad Daybell...frankly, I fully believe the simple answer is demon possession for ALL WHO got involved w these fringe benefits and this is ONLY the beginning of spiritual warfare.
Pool party for dark “angel warriors “
@@bulletsfordinner8307 ikr! I think about that neighbor, and his cause of death often. I really hope they are looking into that
Yes, her obvious trauma re-welled up the rage I feel toward LVD n CD too. It's not fair!!!
Having now heard Brandon's moving, heartbreaking testimony in Lori's trial, the truth and the absolute horror of all that's happened is all the more real. My heart aches for all those touched by this tragedy.
Wow!! I am appreciative that you shared all this background information to the Vallow-Daybell atrocities. And the sham of FLDS.
This poor woman and her family were living in lockdown long before the rest of the world! What a surreal existence...my heart breaks with all this crazy😪
How was Brandon to know he married the Devil's daughter? What was the idea Mel, kill Brandon get custody of the kids then kill them too? This testimony reveals a different angle on this, I'm getting a Manson family vibe now.. death cult
Melanie and Brandon were good till Lori started putting stuff in her head and when she met Ian.
Jess demonstrated incredible bravery and raw emotion. Jess, your authenticity is admirable. I pray that you will be relieved of the burden that you obviously carry so deeply in your heart. This is not your burden to carry, but I understand it is a process. In my opinion, you could not have selected a better journalist to discuss the truths you are permitted to reveal. There are so many good people who follow this matter (I can’t refer to is as a case as there are several) and these people stand with you. Thank you for allowing us to hear your story, and abundant gratitude for playing an integral role in the safety of Brandon and his children. You’re a beautiful, intelligent young woman who seems to have a heart of gold and my thoughts and prayers will be with you, your family, and your “adoptive” family in the area. The amount of grief you’ve been dealt is unfair and unjust. I completely support and am socially indebted to you for your decision to hold things back and to be accepting of the time it may take for a successful prosecution. Love and light to you. @Hidden True Crime - Lauren, as always, did a masterful job with this interview.
Brandon almost definitely saved his childrens lives , they got in the way of Melanie's mission and she hated Brandon at this point so they were definitely in danger
The police and coroner failed everyone
This poor woman’s voice sounds at the verge of tears the whole time.
I nearly cried just listening to her recount how after they found Tylee and JJ all she could picture is her own kids being found that way. I feel so badly for her and everyone else who lived this terror in real time, unsure of their own and their family's safety.
Yes all those deaths and near death of her true and close friend.
PTSD and grief.
How have the Melanie’s not been arrested yet!? 🤷🏻♀️ How!?
Both Melanie’s!
Immunity agreement
This interview was absolutely one of the best yet!
Understanding her fear and emotions is an so heartbreaking!
I cannot imagine what it must feel like to have been in that circle of people/loved ones,close friends!
I know none of them (even though I feel like I do) and I am an emotional reck over this horrific story!
So so sorry for your loss and the emotional mess you been close to!😢
We can offer our prayers for those who've suffered horrible losses like Jess. This case scares me even reading or discussing it because I believe it's demonic posesion down to their bones!
@@ZeldaZelda-RichesToRags you know, I think about this case every day. I've tossed around in my mind, that Chad had brainwashed Lori (bc everyone that knew her bfor and after she started reading his books, say she had DRASTICALLY changed) .. smh I just don't know! But I literally feel the evil and I have to agree.. this is full of demonic energy (for the lack of a better way to put it?)
@@chasity71mvp19
Lori has showed signs of her narcissism/psychopathy for many years, long before Chad. Things may have taken on speed and reinforcement with the two of them together, but they both had a propensity for such evil within them already. Look up those personality disorders, and everything will make more sense.
@@ahe79 I agree, it makes more sense that someone already has something within them, to drastically change as lori "seemed to" .. it is absolutely terrifying, that someone can get to a point where killing ppl, even their own children, and think that it's as normal as breathing air.. 😳 The damage they have caused.. and omg, the damage they could have caused others .. I'm glad they were caught .. wish it was bfor anyone else had to die tho
To me, it's another sniffley, hesitating, careful, 'I'm so scared' interview, but not one tear is actually shed. What is this exclusive source 'they' are all hearing all this information from? It almost sounds like a self-protection interview. I wouldn't trust any of these people who are now eager to talk--before they are sworn in at a trial.
Woah, this story is even bigger than we all thought, Falsely accusing someone of a crime is almost as bad as murder. It can destroy their lives. Lori did it to her third husband and it looks like Melanie did the same. This is not done yet. Great interview and brave revelations by this person. It is shocking how many people were afraid of Alex and knew that he hade done things.
Serial killers 😳 I been following this case ever since Nate Eaton went to Hawaii and I just keep finding out more and more stuff from the trial and older interviews like this, it's just insane
So Ians family drank the koolaid? Hope they watched the trial and heard Melanie P and Lori’s texts about mels kids.
We need to call these people involved " the life insurance cult" as they all had large insurance policies in place as a major reason to kill.
Oh man😒I feel so bad for her... she's hurting ☹️damn. I hope this interview will inspire more people to come forward and confess their experiences like she did. She's so brave💪😕damn.
Just to clarify, Melani P's inlaws are in full support of all these shenanigans that they inherited when their son married a woman after a two week courtship? His ex Natalie is not so forgiving or gullible it seems.
Makes you wonder if they were already part of AVOW/Preparing a People, doesn't it?
I hope Melanie P and Ian P will be prosecuted for their cover ups, backtracks and Lies. Both r evils
@@StephanieSoressi there’s a reason he married her. They had to be connected in someway other than a dating app. Unless of course that dating app had something to do with AVOW or preparing a people.
@@LadyFDD Agreed!
This has got to be the best informative interview ever! How scary for this lady to even now put her life on the line! Meloniece is still out there and one request (from behind bars) from Chad and Lori she could be killed! I praise this lady for her courage and hope she takes precautions to this day!
Had to Re-Visit During Chad’s Trial. Super Insightful Interview.❤ Justice!🤲
This is insane how many people feared for their lives!
I'd still be afraid, Alex was just one head of the Hydra. The rest of this group has slithered into the shadows, hiding in their pretense of Mormonism. The church is being exploited and needs to step up.
@@sew161 The "church" is a cult already and with a small tweak these people were ready for murder. That small tweak being believing in Chad the way they believe their bishops have visions and insights. Chad was benefiting himself while leading the gullible. So do the mormon church! I call bs on the whole mormon religion!
@@heatherh3330 With all due respect, you have no idea what you are taking about. These people and their cult are in no way “a tweak” away from the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. They are the opposite of it.
@@freedom24-2x incorrect. Lds are a cult.
Im so grateful you chose Hidden True Crime to tell your story . They have impeccable integrity and heart. Your poem is incredible!!
Thank you! 💗 I’m so grateful Jes chose us too.
Credible, courageous lady. She's the type of true friend you're blessed to have in your life.
Those two left a lot of broken hearts in their wake.
That Melanie Gibb is not innocent.
Excellent interview! So many victims, so much trauma. Thank God the media picked this up. I cant imagine everyones frustration with police beforehand!! To say law enforcement in Chandler dropped the ball is an understatement. JJ, Tylee, And Tammy might still be alive. Heck, Charles would be alive too if they just listened to his pleas!! I hope justice for Brandon will be coming soon as well!
Another great interview! You could tell it was so very painful for her to speak about this atrocity. So many victims that Lori & Chad ruined.
@Sue Komernicky and dont forget Alex
This was a great interview. My sister in law fell into the same type of cult back in 2003. She had a pendulum that she would talk with the spirits. She said she was a prophet and she totally believed it. She left my brother for another man in Kauai and thank God my brother got custody of his children. It was scary, we thought she was going to hurt my brother and her kids.
That was almost 20 years ago… did she ever get out?
So Sorry to hear about your Brother and the children, Thank God your Brother moved on, Prayers and Blessings 🙌 🙏 ❤
It's actually is a good thing that your ex-sister-in-law left your brother & that he got custody of his children. When these people get impressions from the spirit world anything is possible. She left your brother for another man so her affections were no longer in a positive way! Glad that they all got away!
I know I’m late to this one but wow wow wow. What an incredible woman and that poem gave me head-to-toe goosebumps. Her trauma and agony is palpable. Jess - If you ever read this … no doubt, you are allowed to feel the pain and trauma that is yours. You mentioned something about it maybe not being warranted as others but your pain and suffering is yours… and yours alone and never ever discount your feelings or compare them to others. You are a brave soul and within just this hour + interview can tell you are an incredible mother, wife and friend. Please keep writing. It’s so cathartic. You are such an empath and I know life can be harder on those who feel everything. I hope within this year or so since the podcast you have found additional peace and you continue to find it. All my love. ❤
What a sweet lady. Thanks for sharing.
Wow she really made it real to me.
Me too
Thank you Jes for being brave enough to tell your story. It's important for all of us to hear how this group of murderers cloak themselves in purity and innocence all the while being wolves in sheep's clothing. I pray you get some healing from this nightmare.
Yes especially Melanie Gibb. You would swear she was an angel of pure heart. A good soul who let 4 innocent people die before she went to the police.
My first questions would be...How does Brandon's kids are living with this readaptation of being with their mother again? Are they feeling secured and love from their mother now? How was the transition for them?
You see I'm a preschool and early childhood educator so this is my concern, their all around developpement emotionally and psychologically in this very difficult situation where they might of felt some loving and caring rejection from their mother.
That must of have affected their reunions at one point, mostly from the older ones.
This is just still so painful to think she did something like this to them...they might also be or revolted or scared to lose her again if they are not perfect with her....I'm trying to figure what can pass through their little head...from a kid's logic. They didn't deserve this, neither Brandon.
Such good questions! Jess had a few understandable rules for this interview -she loves those children, and she felt she shouldn’t talk about them. But I have these same questions you do.
I just love you so much @Isabelle Legault! Thank God for you! I tell this to myself so often and I just want you to know how much I treasure you!! I really do!
@@diffiCULTresearch Aww thank you my friend. Love you too my sweet Kresha and I really mean it also. xxx
@@HiddenTrueCrime Oh I respect this limit of hers. Her caring and loving is showing by this. So all I will say is that I keep these little ones in my prayers, hoping for the best for them all.
Hers and Brandon's children are back with Melanie? I thought she only got visitation rights to them and not custody.... i am scared for them xxx
She needs to put all of this into a book! This interview and her book would be a great history lesson. Not to be forgotten. Not to be denied ❤ So many victims ❤
It was said That Melanie Gibb was sent to Brandon’s house to check to see if the family was there by Melanie Polowski and Alex Cox because people think they were trying to set her up as possibly the shooter or the fall guy or fall girl for the whole situation of Brandon being shot at
Wasn't she sent to the old address?
The poem is so moving. I do not know you or any of the people that share your same nightmare. I have followed this case from the beginning and have shed many tears. Tonight I felt your pain. The pain that only someone you loved and held dear can create. In your daily nightmare you kept hope and faith by not allowing yourself to believe the unimaginable. The day you found out what happened to Tylie & JJ was the moment you realized that anything was possible because the impossible became reality. You are not a victim, you are a survivor that has experienced true betrayal and evil. You and your family beat it! You are a good honest loving person. That is why you still experience such strong emotions related to your trauma. Continued prayers to you and your family as you continue to heal. Thank you for sharing your story. you are an amazing survivor.
❤️🙏 well said!
Beautiful.
AMEN !
TGIF! 🍷Jes will be great, glad she decided to share her story.
And don’t forget Alex was the main caregiver for Melanie. P. Mother Lori’s mother said so in a interview. Summer Lori’s other sister was Lori’s informant. Lori’s the evil one and Chad is her fall guy. She needed Chad to take the blame. Melanie P. Has her kid’s back. I’m concerned about that. Even though Alex is dead. I believe both Melanie’s need to be charged as well.
I agree,I think Lori is the mastermind here in all this.
The Chandler PD should be sued for ignoring the murder of Charles. It was OBVIOUS even to a brain dead person he was murdered at the time. During the van transport the cops knew Lori was behaving like a killer
Absolutely blown away by this interview. Every time I think this can’t get any worse, I see this. I’m so glad for everybody surrounding the Chad cult, that justice is coming 🙏🏻
Ian's families responses to that Facebook post was disgusting
What did they say???
Well Ian is slow and also a 🤥.
@@sarahholt5575 I'm curious too.
Yea what was said😅
Both Melani's knew about this, both should be arrested.
Though I don't like Melanie Gibb that much at least she did turn on Chad and Lori and is cooperating with law enforcement.
Melanie G. turned when the rope ran out. Begs the question... Was she at that pool party? Her and David went to Rexburg to possibly buy property right next to Chad. That was after Charles death and she was complicit in Chad and Lori’s affair. If she couldn’t see how wrong that was, her moral compass was beyond broken. Especially for one who attended the temple and studied scripture. I call BS
@@sjrlas after everyone was murdered
@@catherineseiler7407 yes, sad but true.
Unfortunately Melanie Gibb has immunity from any charges. She may think she is innocent but my god how could she be so stupid. If somebody said to me Tammy will die and she dies ??? That should have been a red flag. Charles will die and he dies yet another lightbulb moment. I find it hard to believe she had no idea what was happening.
Wow! I'm pretty shocked at Ian's family treating Jes like that. Does this mean the Pawlowski's are all in with Melani's beliefs?
It seems to me this town of Rexburg is the biggest hub of this cult. Everyone there knows everyone, and they are all Mormons. Therefore, almost everyone is related by family or marriage. Mormons have big families.
melanie palowski is up to her eyeballs in this. i was disgusted she deliberately watched/read what was happening with Lori's case to get out of testifying. Shame on her. No regard to those who perished by the devil she knows ppfftt. Jess, much love to u.
Listening to Jes's testimony adds so much validation and context to what we know now. I'm so grateful she had the courage and trust in Lauren to share with us. My prayers are with Jes and everyone whose lives have been damaged by the evil wrought by Chad, Lori and their minions. 🙏🏻💔🙏🏻
This took so much courage for this friend to come forward. I still don’t think Melani should be allowed around children, especially since she claimed two of her own were “dark”. Melani threw away a Diamond for pond slime. Ian’s family sound like they also drank the Lorie Chad Koolaid.
When are they going to charge Melani P ?
What a powerful interview. Thank you, Jes, for sharing your story and your amazing poem with us. I hope it’s brought you some peace.
thank God Brandon left with those kids... sounds like Chad was on the way to being the next David Koresh.
It would not surprise me a bit if Alex wasn’t responsible for the death of Melanie Ps mother. It was up to him to keep an eye on her when her parents went off on vacation. I think there was insurance money there to be had as well.
That's exactly what I think, Alex, under Lori's direction. I wonder who financially benefited by her death....