Is Riot Games ACTUALLY Spying on your Computer?
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- Опубликовано: 10 июл 2024
- League of Legends officially released Vanguard as a mandatory anti-cheat in May 2024. Since then, many players have run into technical difficulties through interactions with the program. There has also been many questions regarding Vanguard's integrity and safety for it's users. However, this has resulted in a lot of misinformation and creating fake outrage.
Today we take a look into exactly what Vanguard is about and figure out if it's as bad as some people make it seem to be.
Links to sources of the videos and data used:
Riot Games responds to Vanguard Bricking computers: / update_from_riot_on_va...
Official League of Legends video speaking on banning 40k cheaters: • Gameplay, Esports & Ar...
My social medias:
Twitch: / lolnicolai
Twitter: x.com/lolNicolai
Instagram: @LeagueOfNicolai
Discord: / discord
Thanks for reading and watching!
Basically "Trust me bro."
if vanguard works only when league/val is played, then why cant you run it NOT rebooting your PC like f.e. FACEIT does? It forces players to let it run 24/7. Its sketchy. You base your trust on one blog post Riot made, we don't know what data is shared with Tencent, and even if right not it isn't, what about the future? Despite my huge love to league I uninstalled it, I may come back when I'll be able to afford second PC only for this game. Respect your privacy, don't allow corporations push the boundries even further
Kernel level anticheats aren't even working that great, it's not something you cannot bypass and we can see it being cracked right now
My brother in christ. You can disable it on start up and league still runs.
I checked my fucking stuff and when league aint open. It doesnt run
Only thing tencent can steal from me is some Winnie the Pooh hentai
@@kogamustard7717 Shill
@@ConfusedOwl92FR LOL People really thinks that they are THAT important
Vanguard also tend to lag your computer and internet on purpose when you play other fps games and persists after uninstalled. They're like your clingy ex-girlfriend after they saw you happy with another partner.
Title: Is Riot Games ACTUALLY Spying on your Computer?
8 minute long abstract video with random facts that prove nothing...
And then comes the answer in the last ten seconds (8:04) which basically translates into "ACTUALLY I don't know"
First time on the internet?
@@BadConeja rather, a rare visitor at cheap speculation videos. Got clickbaited this time(
@@Moonflush This dude sounds like every roblox and runescape gamer trying to tell people how technology works. Absolute runescape/roblox brain.
@@davidmoak1219 lol
I uninstalled League before Vanguard launched.
Vanguard literally broke my pc. One day the SECOND i started league, my pc crashed. It wouldn't boot up. Vanguard fucking deleted/corrupted a boot file in my system and it wouldn't turn on anymore. I tried everything, from resetting that file, repairing the system with usb, nothing worked. I couldn't even access the disc following the notepad method. I needed to take it out and wipe it out completely after 6 hours of trying. Hell, the disc got even encrypted so NO FILES got saved in the meantime. Yesterday, when I opened league same shit happened- a blue screen. I got fucking ptsd from it, but this time it was just a crash.
Ps. No, this never happens with any other games or programs. My pc NEVER crashed like this prior to these 2 situations... and my pc is 4 years old.
It happened with my brother's laptop and he's doesn't know what to do I hope riot can fix this fast before more PCs & laptop face the same
What did you do to fix it please help it happen to my laptop too?
That is not possible. You don't know how to use a computer is all. Repair BSD is pretty easy.
@@maker000 And you apparently cannot read, because thats exactly what I did. I repaired the boot file, which wasn't repairing because the disc got fucking locked off (encrypted) and was untouchable. The only option was to wipe it all using another pc.
Btw, I work at a repair company where we do mainly pcs and phones. I asked everyone out there but they said the same thing. I sincerly hope that it happens to you too and we weill see how well you can use yours :)
happened to me aswell, had to install a whole new system from my flash disk cuz my pc can't even boot up to the system XD, always shows a bluescreen that there's a corrupted file sys32 something, it was painful to deal with
I uninstalled league because i don't trust riot's ability to balance or design the game.
Way before vanguard.
If they're up to say "we don't think our champs have overloaded kits," then no way they should be trusted with security even if they're genuine.
you know the people on the balance team and design team aren't the security team right? Your conclusion to not trust their security is probably on point, but your reasoning is wild.
@@TheAcaciaStrain1typical reasoning without actual facts
@TheAcaciaStrain1 It doesn't require quantum physics to figure it out.
My point is: if riot can't be competent in balancing, designing, and above all, not be ignorant about their champs and state the literal obvious (eg: saying new champs don't have overloaded kits?), then I doubt they'd be competent in anti-cheat security. Different parts, but still the same game.
The client is still a mess, vanguard causes bugs to the point it crashes people's PCs until they disable vanguard or straight up remove it. As if the league client was any better and kept telling them to fix the client prior to vanguard. Years even.
Call it wild if you want. At least riot's incompetence is wilder by a 100x.
@@TheAcaciaStrain1 you know that their security team has already proven to have failed to let it come so far? you know their coders have already proven that they can't come up with a good client, even if they rework it?
you know that this doesn't qualify them at all to program an anti-cheat that they probably have to experience with whatsoever?
you know that history has proven already that they were not able to come up with a good working and functioning anti-cheat without a huge amount of issues??
@@nadvic1797 you know that all of that you just replied is literally not relevant to my comment? Learn to read please
love lines like "You already have programs like this" after which a bunch of games that I don't even own are listed. No I don't and even if I did that changes NOTHING about the problem at hand.
Exactly, I dont own any of the games listed.
I have a huge mail to mail argument with Riot that Vanguard bricked my pc and destroyed my important files ...but neither they taking the blame nor they are ready to pay for the damage
prolly cuz it didnt
Cap
it didn't
Don't worry man, surely everyone that has experienced it is just wrong, these brainrot leage addicts are the smart ones. I hadn't had a blue screen for like a whole year until my brother downloaded the vanguard league update which I wasn't planning on getting. Then out of nowhere blue screen. Coincidence surely.
Edit: spelling
Share, or send it to Gamers Nexus, they probably get a few of those claims
I'm actually thankful to Riot! Vanguard is the thing that made me quit League!
honestly. regardless if it spies on me or not, it's just another vulnerability on my computer that runs all the time. There's no need for a game to be that invasive over my privacy, software and hardware.
Yeah, that's what happens when cheaters get rampart. We get very aggressive anti-cheats. You might as well just quit gaming overall as they gonna implement with time to all games.
THIS is what the actual problem with Vanguard is, not that its potential chinese spyware, but the fact its a literal a backdoor into your system unless you manually close it every time youre not playing League. Lets leave aside if you trust Riot or not, all it needs is for someone malicious to get control of Vanguard and every system with it installed is now at their mercy, and if you add the fact that Leagues source code already got leaked once, that was just a risk I refused to take
@@DustD.Reaper It only takes a window of time for someone to hack your system. If you play ANYTHING with an anti cheat, even such as EasyAntiCheat. The moment that turns on, they can inflict your computer for that duration...
The only people are not refusing to 'take the risk' have no actual knowledge on what they're talking about. Literally at all.
yea bro but you already installed league. if they wanted something from you they already got it xD.
nah u cheated cuz u couldnt script no more
47,000 cheaters in a game with 100 million unique monthly players (suposedly) is so ridiculous insignificant for a program as invasive as vanguard. It's 0.047% of players, and if even a small fraction of those are the lobby revealers then either: There wasn't a big cheating issue in the first place OR vanguard isn't capable of detecting the scripters.
Okay, this was my exact thoughts. 47k, should be more like 1mil or at least in the 100's of thousands. I think it's probably poor at detecting scripters because you can just store it into ram still. The real trick that needs to be done is storing into RAM before Vanguard is running and having it persist. Its been a while since I've been in the cheating world and when I was it was for FPS not MOBAs.
Thing is the CCP can force Tencent to bow down. All good intentions and promises aside. For me thats a quick deinstall.
The NSA can force Riot to bow down. Just as they force Windows to bow down, which you'll now have to use in order to play, since a kernel level anticheat programmed for Windows won't work on Linux.
A company called "Riot" basically does the biggest b*tch move and obeys to 2 governments through 1 change.
All that instead of coming up with an actual working anticheat solution. A solution to a problem that i as a guy with probably around 5k hours played didn't even know actually existed. I've seen like 10 cheaters in 10 years of playing, and i at least was in and around Diamond games...
What i see as a huge problem as well is: Riot can't code. They've proven that with their client, their client rework, and now also with their not working anticheat. Am i really trusting them to run a program in my PC 24/7 who can access everything? Even more so, when hackers could take advantage of vulnerabilities, which WILL inevitably come up? Nopenopenope.
Ok, let's dig into this.
Your arguments:
1. other games have kernel level anticheat
2. Riot says that nothing is interchanged with Tencent (and their AC team)
3. only collects data when playing league
4. screenshots are actually done
5. Riot suggests that the cheating problem is worse than we have imagined
6. people lie (the system32 story)
7. Cheaters are not stopping cheating
8. Cheaters lied about "not cheating" and still getting banned
9. Cheaters are getting banned and this is the necessary evil
10. just trust Riot to not leak your data to china! :)
Ok, let's quickly go over it, i'll try to keep it short:
1. yes, they do. and yet, that isn't the point. Riots anticheat is always on, 24/7. The average user won't disable it when they don't play League, that just won't happen, and we all know that.
Additionally, Riots anticheat just kills drivers. Other anticheats instead just tell you "sry, program XYZ is running, please stop it so you can run the anticheat and the game!". This is VERY bad for everything driver related, as the average person has no idea what is done in the background, neither will they check. Drivers can be for example little software scripts that control your fan speed, and if it doesn't work, they might just not spin at all. Which can be bad. And sure, Vanguard isn't per se targetting those. But mistakes can happen. And let's face it: they will happen, just as they already did happen.
And yes, that could also mean that you keyboard or mouse stops working. Technically, that is VERY MUCH POSSIBLE. If that is a lie or not, is of course another, rather philosophical question. People will lie. On both sides.
2. sure, trust me bro. and even if they won't, their software can still have bugs and vulnerabilities, which means that they can be targeted by other users. and since they've had a huge data breach beforehand (regarding their source code), i just wouldn't trust that we're 100 % safe with them. Just as with anyone else.
The rule of thumb in security is: the less cooks, the less problems. If you install everything on your PC regardless from who it comes, chances are that you do have huge vulnerabilities in place, that at some point in time will be exploited.
So my concern isn't even the CCP getting the data through Tencent (through Riot). My concern is them coding badly. And they've proven often times that they're very much able to do that...
3. sure, trust me bro.
don't just trust companies ... they don't trust you, the average player, to not cheat. why should you trust them with your data then? there is ways like a good "tribunal" system to get rid of cheaters AND clean the community of toxic people. but i guess that the toxicity is so ingrained, that we don't even care about it anymore, do we?
4. yes, and that's also completely fine. in fact: as long as my pc is running League, i, as someone working in IT, do expect League to be able to grab all the data of running processes and alike. but neither to just share it fully either and access any kind of file on my system. it's crazy that they actually said something like "we don't grab more of your data than we previously did". well, yeah, they don't grab more. they already grabbed everything beforehand... that isn't good either.
but sure, screenshots and stuff like that of the game window, are a completely normal way to "detect" cheaters.
5. well, they can suggest as they like. i personally didn't ever encounter any huge issues with scripters and bots in my last 10 years of playing this game like 3-4 hours a day on average. i noticed like 10 scripters over all my years, and the bots were somewhere in actual bot games, where they wouldn't farm as many reports, i guess (which is where i've found a few of them over my whole time in that game) indeed. and sure, that isn't "nice". but it also isn't a huge issue. and it could easily be fixed through a working tribunal (Overwatch from CS:GO) system, without an intrusive anticheat...
6. yes. people lie, on both sides. that isn't an argument for either side...
7. yes, they won't stop cheating. so ... we just got that intrusive anticheat rolled out, which impacts our privacy, and didn't even fix the problem? hell yeah we did exactly that! cheaters will still exist, just as bots. this did basically throw the cheaters back for a few percent, and they'll be back even stronger next week. that's how fast the cheaters often enough adapt. meanwhile, the privacy will be lost forever...
you know what could've instead fixed it? a tribunal system maybe, something like Overwatch from CS:GO, which would give cheaters (and new players, to be fair) a "low trust value" and then match them together into other games with low trust value. and a high trust has to be earned over a long time. meanwhile actual humans interpret if someone was cheating. or if someone was misbehaving (like in the chat, or by griefing). imagine the possibilities ... yet, we fixed a (maybe even self created by slacking) issue temporarily, which will be "un"-fixed faster than we can look, while the community will stay: full of cheaters, full of toxic people, full of griefers, while we have lost our rights and won't get them back. hell, this change going through is just another inspiration to take away further rights in the future, or for other companies to do the same...
8. yes. see point 6
9. well, some are. and they'll be back. an account, even in high elo, costs a few bucks at most. i've heard a while ago that low elo accounts cost even more than high elo...
and so, no, this isn't an necessary evil. the tribunal was working, until it stopped working. and instead of fixing it, we've let the cheater (and the toxicity) problem get out of hands. create a problem, and then feed the costly solution as the only solution...
meanwhile, a huge ban wave in cs:go banned most cheaters even in higher elo games. even without kernel level. i wonder how they do it. could it be ... that they were just programming a good anticheat? and were not relying on their players giving up all their rights either?
it's nearly as like this escalation of priviledges just does this: impact the average player, while the average cheater won't give a damn. this won't impact the cheaters, but it will forever impact us if we just live through this without fighting back.
10. trust me bro. riot good guy riot never spy! it isn't like them just being bad programmers could lead to EVERYONE spying on me, even if china didn't.
and it isn't like they didn't have to lie about it, even if they did, because that's chinas law after all. (and let's be real, the NSA wouldn't have done it differently).
so in my eyes:
a long story of bs. they first create a problem and then sell us the expensive, only and ultimate solution, which ultimately isn't even a solution in the mid- to longterm at all. meanwhile, we're thrown at each others necks by them calling the ones concerned with privacy of us "scripters" and "liars", and us calling the unaware side "idiots" (because they kinda are)...
meanwhile, nothing changes and the average playerbase just eats it like a good little boy, even if if shows MAJOR FLAWS during early rollout. and yet, they continue. and yet, they don't roll back.
the world is a fckin joke.
meanwhile: i've unsubscribed from EVERY single content creator of the league universe (since they sadly are supposed to bow to riot based on their contracts), and have stopped playing. because THIS is what the average consumer SHOULD do in order to not lose any right that any corporation just wants to take from them.
we DO have the power. we just need to start using it. boycott Riot games. boycott Riot's games. Riot against "Riot Games". This is the only way they'll learn.
there's other good games, with a better perspective, better balancing and MUCH better ideas about privacy and respect for their consumers out there!
Bro you just had to counter his arguments not humiliate the poor idiot puppet
you concerns are that:
your computer could implode into a supernova
the chinese government will steal your data and know your favorite song to shower to.
You are obviously not a cheater in disguise or whatever, you're just a crazy person.
no ones gonna read this bro
I came to the same conclusion as you (although i didnt read your 10 points).
I still remember vanguard having an issue a few days ago. It kept saying "you need to have vanguard open to play". I was in the middle of a game when the game crashed, i wasn't the only one in the game who had the same problem. My boyfriend had the same problem too after his game and they just said it was a 'login issue'. We only didnt get a leaver buster because of the game itself having issues.
why is an anticheat not being recognized as open a "Login issue"? what does a fckin anticheat "log into"???????
i stop playing lol after venguared bug my pen tablet, mouse , give me black screen in game, from 200 fps to 30 fps and lag
and aw yeah also i was not able to join the game because i could open the damn game
@nadvic1797 I know right? That's what I thought too. They didn't even just cancel the game since so many people were disconnecting. They eventually fixed it but come on!
@@SophieGirl2001 bro i am so scared even playing lol considering they bug my pan tablate so bad thank God it was under guarantee that they have to get a new one.
i am not going to destroy my lively hood and something that is my art business over a dumb game its not worth it .
omfg 1 or 3 bad games are not worth it getting my full set up ruin just to stop some hackers or bots.
Before vanguard, I had never seen a bot in aram, but ever since vanguard was released I have seen soooooo many bots in my aram games. I haven't seen bots in my games like that since twisted treeline. on top of that, I have had A LOT of in client issues since vanguard released. my client constantly runs slow, my client gets stuck in a loading screen between the match I just played and the teammate honoring screen causing me to have to restart my client and losing out on honoring and seeing if I was honored, my game sometimes gives me an error during a match telling me I need to have vanguard running even though I already do and then closes my game during the match.... etc
yeh idk about the bot thing, obviously i can't say you're wrong, i wasn't in your games. but i have thousands of arams played (hundreds since vanguard) and not a single bot. There's 0% chance that vanguard increased the amount of people botting in your games, if it was anything, it would be the same amount of poeple botting assuming vanguard failed as an anti cheat
I seen bots in aram, but only on low level alt acgrams. Pre vanguard. Don't think I ever seen one on my main with 10k arams.
@@LightshaverConstellation yeh I was about to ask if he was on a new acct but then I remembered with vanguard you don't even see bots on alt accounts on aram anymore
@@TheAcaciaStrain1 have seen none before either, and couldn't see any after, since i uninstalled it. i have seen scripters in like 10 games of mine over 10 years, and i was in games around emerald to low diamond elo for the last few years.
i won't just admit defeat against them. i won't install this. i won't comply and give them even more of my data for playing a game that was fun like 3 years ago either way...
give us 5 new "durability" patches and get rid of vanguard. then i'm coming back. until then, i won't even consume league content, so that noone new comes to the whole league universe through me. the only thing i'll do is complain about the state and drag attention to this issue. if all of us did that, we had the power... i can just ask you friendly to join me ...
@@TheAcaciaStrain1 my theory is that the people that would normally bot in summoner's rift games decided to start botting in aram instead because they thought it's less risky
My pc has started crashing everyday since i started using vanguard
You most likely have another program running (at start up) that is conflicting with it. Have a look at the programs you're running on start up and if you can be bothered, turning them off one by one and restarting each time. You can access this by going to: Settings > Apps > Startup Apps. Hopefully that can solve your issue, You might also want to check your specs (Speccy is great) to see if you can run Kernel software like this in the background and also play the game on your current settings. See how it affects your RAM and if your PC/Laptop can handle it running constantly in the background. If so, maybe terminating on boot up can help. Hopefully something works man, Good luck!
@@jacob96014thanks but idk my pc should def be able to handle it and I already turned most startup apps off since long ago. But recently it started crashing
@@jacob96014 someone actually trying to be helpful on the comment section
what the fuck
@@jacob96014 This is definitely not the case man. You're just going to make this guy waste his time and go down the wrong track. SMH
Run CMD as administrator and use this command without qoutes: "sfc /scannow"
If the issue persists then it's going to be more complicated than something I'm willing to type here. Likely bios related stuff, Auto ram speed detect not working right or set to not the right value, could also be XMP if that's enabled. Most BSOD issues are going to be pointed at OS files, Bios config or hardware failures.
Vanguard is literally fucking up my Discord tho xD. Like the moment I turn it off discord stops fucking up.
edit: by fucking up I mean my bros were telling me my voice was stuttering like crazy for over an hour. Then I tried terminating vanguard and it magically fixed itself.
I'll take stuff that didn't happen for 100$
You were short on RAM most likely, because the minimal requirements should've get updated by now considering Vanguard also takes some resources
@@joetri10 i'll take that stuff did happen for 10000 $
vanguard likes interacting with microphone drivers and alike, and shutting it down or just making it not work correctly. i know someone who also had similar issues.
how about you already tell us your League account name. i'd bet 1000000000 $ it has "Riot" in front of it...
@@i_saidmeow2469 "minimal requirements"
is there even a word for minimal requirements of an application that is running PERMANENTLY?? i actually doubt it...
@@nadvic1797 False. Anyone with an ounce of knowledge knows you're lying.
The fact that I can't even uninstall league because it says the riot client is still running even though I shut it off in every way I could. If that doesn't scream malware idk what does
formatea windows, no queda de otra opcion
that doesn't scream malware for me. that just screams that it's a very badly programmed piece of software.
and that SCREAMS LOUDLY that you REALLY SHOULDN'T install a piece of their software into your KERNEL through a driver like a kernel-level based anticheat ...
You know this Windows message telling you that a software is running in the background in your pc after you close it, I closed Vanguard and I had this message but the first character was in Chinese
I was like O_o
about a week ago i felt like playing league, which i havent played in like 4 years. got to a screen saying i need to install vanguard. instant uninstall. never played valorant for the same reason despite looking forward to it before it came out. curious how much of an impact this has had on the playerbase
Didn't really have any impact. Most just don't care (except maybe memeing it), but you see the few people complaining in comment sections such as this one. All the people saying they uninstalled are really a very loud minority
@@fis001r no mientas, el juego esta tan muerto que las colas de espera superan los 15 minutos
@@raidmanxd5380 if my 4 years of Spanish + Google translate are correct, you're saying that the game is dead and you get 15 minute queues. What? Maybe it's a server thing, but here in EUW it's rare for me to get queues that take longer than a minute
@@fis001r well, that's since the people caring for privacy are also just a very loud minority. i've uninstalled as well. and you should, too, if you knew what was good for the average consumer. stop giving away your rights.
it's like with preordering: you have people actually defending a system that makes AAA companies take your money before you'll even see what you get. and when it's too late, they won't even come up with anything that resembles quick fixes for the millions of issues. meanwhile, the defenders say that they'd "un-preorder" or "give it back". and we all know that only just a very small minority would do that, and everyone else either forgets about it or "waits until it gets good".
and this really just enables REALLY bad companies to take advantage of the consumers. because nobody buys with a brain anymore, and nobody actually boycotts anything that isn't cancelled for racism on twitter. sry, X.
stop consuming bs. stop being a bs consumer. start creating value and stop buying crap. and well, every minute of my life that i've wasted into this game is actually wasted (which, with videos and streams, combined with playing and waiting in queue, will probably be around 10k hours or even more). sure, it was fun wasting it. but it will now even be more fun with other games... which have good devs that care about creating a community that isn't toxic as hell...
just look at AOE 2 DE. there's actually friendly players there in multiplayer. i've played online games for like 15-20 years, and i haven't EVER seen such a great community...
meanwhile, the tribunal was banned. and this is basically what they've come up with to replace it.
all that while unbanning people like Tyler1. Do i really have to continue about companies having bad values?
I litterally had vanguard brick the keyboard of my laptop and when I asked riot support for help, they said "thats not possible" and instantly closed the ticket. Small indie company
Yes because it's not possible.
@@joetri10 you can't tell me something I saw happen didn't happen. Riot's boots can't possibly taste that good
@@jacobnusbaum8586 It didn't happen bro lol. Don't be so desperate to be part of a crowd lol. Such a process does not work in a way to mess with hardware or drivers lol
@@joetri10 xd. It didn't happen even though you saw it because uh. It doesn't work that way? What do you mean it littlerally did? No
This never happened🤦🏻♂️
I don't play kernel included games. Was playing league since 2013. It was a sad day. I only played against the AI. Just liked to chill and kill stuff.
So no online games at all then?
@@vastayanvixen685 That's exactly what he might be doing. You with your gayass champ pfp supporting the 500$ skin should go rush role+chair build.
@@Safineya I’ve played league and Ahri since season 3, I love the champ and hate the idea that they even thought of it being $500, remember back when $25 was outrageous for a skin? I don’t know why you’re taking your anger out on me though, might need to talk to someone about that. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
@@vastayanvixen685 Yeah bro just attacked you out of nowhere for having an Ahri pfp xD i have Ultimate Lux, Ezreal and Sona skins and i paid $30 AUD for it. Totally worth it imo, haven't played league in years but my account is currently worth $4,300. You should look yours up and let me know what you got. Have a great day man! hopefully this comment balances out this douches bad one haha
@@jacob96014 IIRC the website doesn’t work anymore, so idk how to see my current balance. And yeah no worries, Ahri players are under fire regardless of whether they support riot’s decision or not.
I’m sure 99% of NA players don’t agree with riot. But we all know this was a cash grab for the KR/CN players.
0:16 what the music track? Sounds like something from a DS Pokemon game but I am not sure. Thanks in advance!
Okay it's the Wi-Fi connection music from Gen4 and Gen5 games
@@pateras_siderompounias That's correct! I think specifically this was the WiFi music in the DS settings though. The one in the Pokemon games is very similar though.
My computer struggles to load into any games now
kinda sketchy when they make it the HARDEST time uninstalling the riot client from your PC, i had to factory reset
We're playing league for more than a decade without this vanguard, this program looks suspectable.
I mean I noticed it operated on my laptop every start up so I turned it off in task manager, I'm just assuming every time I go into league it will start then because I haven't any issues playing league so far so I think that type of disable is okay but who knows I keep my current pc ultra clean clearing things pretty frequently just to make there's no sudden melt downs on me.
Its not a solution and will never be
short answer: yes. long answer: yes, but longer
1:11 yet they don't force them to run 24/7 and force to reboot your system in order to play a dumb game
and in valve anti-cheat you can disable it
if you don't want it, you can still play the dumb game.
I downloaded vanguard one time and 30 mins later my pc just started a giant fire, now i have to play league with a partially burnt pc/monitor
Not related to this but I have my facebook account hacked for some reason. When I tried to reset my password, I got told by the system my password changed in China at night. This happen after LoL new anti-cheat update. I wonder why? 🤔
I think its just incompetence on riot's part with the issues people are having. People had issues with vanguard on valorant release, but most of those people just decided to not play. This crap being forced on people who've played for years issue free is the biggest problem with it imo. They are forcing you to give complete control to a company. I dont think any company besides maybe the os maker should have this access to people's computers because it just creates a security issue for anyone trying to not give away all their info. It also stopped the game working on linux as well which is annoying, but understandable, as it wasn't officially supported to begin with and the linux playerbase isn't big at all, but still sad as I stopped using windows a few months before vanguard was announced. The game ran better for the most part for me as well compared to my Windows 10.
The people making things up about vanguard don't help as it just adds to the confusion about what vanguard actually does.
1% doing bullshit but 99% has to suffer for them, great as always.
It open in random games if i off it, it crash any open game... Alos i need restart lol to play again bcs game will not open it again
Riot launching Vanguard was a blessing. It helped me kick my 15 year league addiction and other online games that implement similar technology as well. Sometimes I am bored out of my mind but I find myself reading/working on my professional skills more.
arent most twitch streams also being "pro vanguard" because of the money?
No, it's not "nessesary evil", you can still cheat with kernel level anti cheat, look into raspberry pi cheats or input parsing per example, where you have another piece of hardware analyze the output from your game client and emulate optimal inputs. What actually works is proper review and ban waves so cheat devs don't get immediate feedback on how they get detected. This argument is mainly there so Riot can do whatever they please and hide behind that argument while they roll out invasive and undertested security measures.
While rootkit anitcheats were already big debate no anti-cheat before required specific BIOS settings to be selected to not brick your PC. It's insanity and it's here not because it's needed but purely out of end users ignorance. Privacy is big issue and I hope more people actually look into protecting themselves, but it has nothing on the fact that you actually opening up your whole PC to be wrecked because anti-cheat devs overlooked a nieche user scenario. Vanguard should have never been released.
i wouldn't even call it a privacy issue anymore, i fully agree on that phrase "end users ignorance". nothing else. they just don't care anymore. they know that privacy is important. but "because nobody will stop playing" is a fundamental part of their believe (as they themselves won't stop playing), they believe that they have no power.
fck this. we DO have the power. i stopped playing. i even unsubscribed to EVERY SINGLE LEAGUE CONTENT CREATOR that i subscribed to over the past 10 YEARS, in which i probably watched and played through like 8-10k hours of game content. i merely found this video by luck and curiosity of how its going.
and its sad to see us consumers just throw away our power like that.
capitalism is REALLY bad. capitalism needs regulation. and since we don't have that regulation, since our governments are shit (please ffs vote for privacy aware parties/candidates), companies will do whatever they fckin want. unless we stop buying and giving them power, aka money.
stop giving evil corporations money. (and since time is money, also don't spend your time with their content)
@@nadvic1797 Good luck, I respect the motives.
someone has bypassed the anti-cheat, therefore it is useless to have one at all.
some criminals have gotten away with crimes, so we should stop enforcing laws completely.
unless you are a die hard privacy truther, then nothing will convince you otherwise.
league will keep vanguard, just enjoy the time you have left with some personal privacy
although I see that you have a youtube account, so your data is already bought and sold :)
@@drjamaymay405 extrapolation and ad hominem. Unbreakable arguments my liege
P.S. next time read whole comment maybe? Ie the part that talks about bricking pc? Cause it literally says privacy becomes secondary problem. Also look up some game security people who actually have materials on what to do to ACTUALLY "enforce law", cause vanguard is leaky af.
@@noodletrashcan
you will never play league again, and that bring a smile to my face. all those hours wasted.
and you are also a loser, sucks to suck I don't make the rules
If riot wanted to spy on you, which I am not saying they arent or are, they could just do it with the client, no need for kernel level access for that. The kernel level thing is a problem because it's an extra vulnerability for somebody that isnt Riot to exploit and potentially harm you through.
^Pretty much. It's a lot easier to spy through the client and even uf they were to get the user's data the fines given compared to the data gotten sold would not make it a profitable venture.
@@machinagenex101 also it would be stupid of them to put their reputation on the line to sell data but potentially lose millions of players when league is already a money printing machine
You're putting a helluva lot of trust in a company like Riot to behave ethically when given that sort of authority.
@@cosmefulanito6713 you didn't fucking read my comment and if you did, you didn't fucking understand it.
I find it weird how people have had issues I've had vanguard since the release of valorant not that I play it much anymore but I have never had a single issue with it ever so I'm confused with people saying that it has bricked their computers
I turned it off in the program start ups. And dont have it start up when launching league as of right now i even open up my task manager and look for it everywhere.
Vanguard from the perspective of security professionals is fucking crazy. Not to mention it still really isn't doing that much. I'm still get cheaters in masters and looking at their accounts they haven't been banned while going fucking crazy and dodging the most insane skill shots. I'm almost a milimeter a way and they are dodging my skillshot? No way. I don't like having to user kernel level anti cheat so we can have a slightly higher ban percentage than before.
At this point I'd rather quit league and move to linux. Microsoft taking screenshots of peoples pc while it doesn't effect us now will effect us more with future processors and people are taking it like a grain of salt. Vanguard is actually unironically also taking screenshots of you pc, but only when you are playing the game. Yeah sure I guess that could be forgivable, but I don't trust a fucking gaming company that says "Trust me bro" when it comes to this shit.
People are too forgivable when it comes to privacy. "If yOu GoT nOtHiNg To HiDe WhY dOeS iT mAtTeR" everyone has something to hide. Medical information, credit information, and so much fucking more my guy. We are giving these screenshots to a company while they could do nothing, what if they get hacked? What will those people do with our information?
"it still really isn't doing that much" is such an insanely delusional take. like in CSGO, you literally have to use a THIRD PARTY TO PLAY GAME LMFAO
it's not a coincidence why VALORANT has the least amount of cheaters in modern FPS
So what degree you have in cybersecurity exactly? And wanna share opgg? Cause in my games around d1-low master mmr amount of scripters insanely decreased, i saw maybe one in past month, so id love to watch your vods where you say you had a scripter
Apparently, this "security professional" don't know that kernel access is redundant when all they need from you is permission to make changes on your PC, something you already gave when you first installed the app
As for its effectiveness, did you know that a condom would be 98% effective if everyone was perfect? But since we have people like you, it's only about 87%. Nobody says condoms are useless.
Airbags and seatbelts are only about 53% effective at preventing fatalities, yet no one advocates to have them removed because of their ineffectiveness.
There's no such thing as a 100% effective product, anyone that tries to sell you one is peddling snake oil.
Apparently, this "security professional" don't know that kernel access is redundant when all they need from you is permission to make changes on your PC, something you already gave when you first installed the app
As for its effectiveness, did you know that a condom would be 98% effective if everyone was perfect? But since we have people like you, it's only about 87%. Nobody says condoms are useless.
Airbags and seatbelts are only about 53% effective at preventing fatalities, yet no one advocates to have them removed because of their ineffectiveness.
There's no such thing as a 100% effective product, anyone that tries to sell you one is peddling snake oil.
You got me going until the master parts
Vanguard is still disabling my Corsair mouse randomly, NICE! (Only when playing Valorant, until I reboot my computer)
I do not care that it takes my information there are at least 12 other website that do i just want a better ranked quality games, is that so much to ask RIOT?
People, who are ignorant, like to reassure themselves by misrepresenting real concerns with facetious ones so they don't have to deal with the consequences of their actions, along with the effects it can have on everyone else's lives. Computers are not just a toy, they are a work machine for many. And to have this level of a backdoor with a company with such baffling track records when it comes to data leak is a real risk.
Imbecile, they don't need kernel access. Every app you have installed on your PC is backdoor, you already gave them permission to make changes on your PC when you first installed it. This is exactly how you get viruses on your PC. All they have to do now is include a spyware in any of their mandatory patches. Now if you're that paranoid, you better throw away your PC because even the OS can also spy on you.
Nobody should be playing games and doing general day to day stuff on a machine they work on. That's just stupid.
If you had a working brain, you'd know they don't need kernel access to "spy" on you. All they need is permission to make changes on your PC, the same permission you gave every app only our PC when you first installed them. It's the same way you get viruses on your computer.
@@joetri10I've seen you here many times, tf are you on licking riot's boots like the CCP?
@@joetri10 "Nobody should" never prevented anyone from doing anything alike what they shouldn't do. Especially not the normal, average person.
I'd argue that at least 95 % of people will use their PC for different, work or study related things as well. And 99 % for the whole group of work, study, banking and buying stuff online (if you don't work and study yet).
This is not a good argument at all...
also two years ago i said on twitter to riot "your game is full of scripters" they claimed you only encounter a scripter in 1-100 games! now they're saying they banned 47 THOUSAND people. STOP THE CAP
ngl i have soooo many third party apps running but none are cheats and i was a bit worried but looks like i had nothing to worry about however i notice less cheaters and more people who just give up 5 minutes into a match like what is this what were left with???
That's what you get when the people who want the game to play out cause they know they cheating are no ponger in the game xD. People know how shit league is now and it's not worth playing if you behind 5 mins in the game.
Maybe an HDD PC, HDD is too slow for the modern usage of computers, almost everyone uses SSD's. This happened to me even before Vanguard, and I was the cause for using a bad PC with less than 4GB RAM and 2.5GHz processor
I don't think you understand the difference between other kernel level anti cheats and vanguard. Not sure if you are in the riot content creator program but this video was poorly put together and basically says - yes Vanguard is good and Riot won't fuck up.
But then again they had a breach 2 years ago so sure... keep using Vanguard 😂
I just wanna play league but vg has so much problems and bugs i cant even queue, open rune pages, open setting and i cant even close the client without ending the task. Cmon rito i just wanna play.
The issue is not the spyware. It's the amount of issues it causes. Ex, I've had to reinstall windows due to vanguard 2 times. One time I didn't install it after the reinstall it all worked properly. Then installing league a month in on this installation, issues occured again, especially in VR games. Then I uninstalled it since 1 week ago and it works
Why are you using aí in the thumbnail?
why not
@@SearedBiteI agree. I think a crayon 🖍️ drawing wood 🪵 have been equally effective and engaging
Don't care, still not installing it.
Literal malware. Not putting that sh*t in my pc
Yes it is. News flash: nearly every program on your computer is spying on you regardless of root access. But guess what so is your operating system, unless you're running linux/bsd, and that has root access just like Valorant.
The big difference is in you, the user,'s ability to spy on vangaurd easily.
Spying up the permissions higharchy is prevented* system wide, so the only* way to spy on a driver is to be at driver level privlages or greater.
*unknown exploits exist of course.
@@Dogo.R wow just like windows and macOS...
@@Bagginsess Shill
@@Bagginsess I never said whether I think its good or bad.
You litterally just imagined I stated an opinion. Crazy
@@Dogo.R you said there was a big difference in spying due to root access... operating systems have root access...
the reason why there is less cheaters, is because they are doing manual bans, the game would be the same without it. also not being to reinject it without restarting is weird asf, it even blocks mingw64 which is annoying
the vanguard system also upgraded their capacity to do manual bans.
vanguard isn't just a background service that automatically bans cheaters, it is constantly being messed with by the anti-cheat devs and adjusted to improve it effectiveness.
Manual bans are and always will be part of the the anti-cheat process, otherwise how will the anti-cheat know what constitutes as a bannable offense.
Did you use AI art for ur thumbnail?
I think Microsoft should also get part of the blame. Windows is the last major operating system that still allows kernel extensions of that kind without any meaningful restrictions. On Linux, while you can do technically whatever you want, kernel extensions are not really popular and many distros don't support them out of the box. MacOS straight out kicked kernel extension support out for good.
After the vanguard update, I literally cant play the game.
It frozes right after loading screen. Doesnt matter what I do, I have reinstalled twice, it just doesnt work
Best bug ever. I have been clean of league for months now
League support ticket
@@ibrahim5463 I know, but its better this way, dont you think?
@@Daniel_Vital yep
I feel lucky that i uninstalled league around 6 years ago.
Why does everybody ignore the fact that vanguard UNLIKE easy-anticheat and co is running on startup ?
This is genuinly a giant issue, since its just another thing that could be exploited (remember genshin anti cheat ?)
Edit: Remember how horrible riots track record is for handling data leaks and giving notice about them ? :)
Yea having to turn that sht off on each startup is annoying but hey. Riot is riot and they never go na go back on this. Afterall thwy banned a grand total of like 5% of cheaters with this!
Yea it just feels like a lot of the League playerbase is just willfully ignorant can only comprehend a single moment and everything before or after that no matter how many times you explain the actual danger of Vanguard, they just say "eVeRyThInG ElsE AlReAdY TaKeS YoUr dAtA" or "wElL Im nOt hAvInG PrObLeMs wHiLe iT RuNs" and the most baffeling resons I heard from someone "just by a seperate system for League"...I am not kidding, someone geninuely told me buy a new PC just to play a FREE GAME...that guy probably bought the scam Ahri bundle aswell
@@DustD.Reaper People, who are ignorant, like to reassure themselves by misrepresenting real concerns with facetious ones so they don't have to deal with the consequences of their actions, along with the effects it can have on everyone else's lives. Computers are not just a toy, they are a work machine for many. And to have this level of a backdoor with a company with such baffling track records when it comes to data leak is a real risk.
You guys can literally disable it on start up ya know .v.
@@kogamustard7717average Player wont do that. Absolute bs Argument.
Nah, im not sure about that. Im playing elden ring nowdays and my FPS goes hard down, i just turn off van and everthing comes to normal, it still works in background btw
formatea y reinstala windows, ese virus te quemara el pc
I have not been this early to a Nicolai video before, big hype
😮
Thank you for being here so soon, Yuumi Gamer1243!!!
lol the vid necrit refuses to make
i don't care really care about privacy stuff, i am using windows after all.
what's it to me that americans have a spyware or the chinese or both at the same time ? nada. same thing.
we have a damn spyware in our pockets at all times.
however, what is fvcking idiotic and mighty disrespectful is that a lot of people have issues after the vanguard update. the blue screens. windows update encountering an error an require system restore 2 or 3 times until the update gets through. the random RAM memory leaks (randomly, a process goes up to 50+gb ram). the god damn pc shutdown in the middle of binging supernatural for the 50th time.
the performance drop in other processing programs (work programs) and even in other games.
and riot says: nahh fam, vanguard ain't breaking your pc. is imposibru.
BRO. my pc was hella fine, before vanguard. i uninstalled league and guess what: THE PROBLEMS I WAS EXPERIENCING STOPPED. why is that ? "oh, clearly not vanguard" - riot, probably
i dont have vanguard same with my other friend
i uninstalled it and we still somehow can play the game he had problem with it cuz he couldnt play the game WITH it and i was just trying to mess with it cuz i always look for bugs but idk what i did and i just dont have it and still can play the game :C
second thing is that vanguard or just game it self have so much lower FPS then before i had 800-950 fps and few of my friends had that too
but now we have ~200 fps sometimes dropping to 0 for like 0.3s and its a bit annoying cuz we have really good computers and somehow this game is lagging?
If cheaters want to cheat, they can just use VMs, its not about anti cheat programs being outsmarted but Riot being incapable of making a proper anti cheat so they use this crap. I just wanted to play tft during my lunch breaks... and spam emote 3 with my cute lil champ. Now Im spamming mercy emote in overwatch. I guess its kinda the same. Both will result in someone yelling at me.
Literally one day after installing vanguard on its release it bricked my computer and it wasn't turning on anymore, I had to reinstall windows and lost everything I had, fuck Riot
I installed Vanguard and my pc started crashing and my mouse started disconnecting all of a sudden.
Uninstalled league altogether.
Thanks RITO for making me quit your shitty game after all these years.
'mouse started disconnecting ' -- We all know that didn't happen bro lol. Don't be so desperate to be part of a crowd.
@@joetri10 unless you were there I don't think it's a good idea to be saying stuff like that
It completely froze my PC.
no way
god this video feel like a paid riot TenCent gaslighting.
yeah, lets trust the same ppl who can't update the lol server to run in 1 server not 2 but just 1 to tell me how they will go full overkill because cheating in lol matters now
aw how connivant .
i legit watch a vid of kid complaining about dealing with hackers, yet vanguard is still running 24/7
In current times, saing that software is not doing someting is not any argument, its just one auto update away from doing it if the developers want it. Problem lays in how much access it have, that it works al the time, and who own it.
Riot explaining that thay dont share any code or data with tencet is so stupid i cant even explain... for anyone that still dont know it, currently riot = tencet, tencent bought whole company, 100% of it, thay can do anything thay want, so staiting that thay dont share code is just stupid.
Also you can fight with cheating on multiple different ways (like doing it on server side) so its not "nessesery evil" as author said. Thay do it only beacuse its easies for them, and instead of researching new ways of doing it in a way thats not creating privacy/security problems, thay just try to reause old concept with even more problems.
I have a separate 970m laptop just to run league and that spyware vanguard.😂😂😂
Never used scripts in League, I used to use the crappy virus ridden clients for Minecraft though
But... They are pinky promising its safe 🥺
It still breaks my mind why everyone focuses on RIOT SPYING... the problem is not that. The problem is that you have a kernel 0 level program that runs PERMANENTLY, not like EAC or xigncode. What if this program can be exploited by a 3rd party. Happened to a version of EAC in genshin, that resulted in pcs running crypto miners, and lost, stollen genshin accounts... (YES, even though that have not run 24/7 on target computers)
They can say they will not share the source code, but they had data breaches before, and it WILL happen again. Also, someone might just happen to find a vulnerability in the code by chance, without the source code.
Riot's bounty of a $100k for reporting that in the vanguard code will not put a dent in the issue as they could sell that vulnerability for potentially more than tens of millions on the dark web.
This is the problem, but somehow people only care about riot spying on them..
it’s mostly the people defending vanguard who focus on riot spying, because it’s easier to counter by saying ‘you’re already getting spied on’.
when it comes to the vulnerabilities and problems it creates on your pc, those are not so easily downplayed.
you could get hit by an meteorite, don't worry about things that aren't going to happen.
And this is some crazy conspiracy theorist shit
Riot is going to pay up the 100k bounty and immediately sell the info it to cheat devs for profit?
You first sentence was great, I thought you were going to make an insightful comment. turns out your medication wore off midway though and the demons got to you.
kernel level access to your system and running all the time is insane. nothing should have that power over your computer nor should it be running unless league is running, period.
True. Use it on a pc only for gaming and don't store private info on it.
@@a96futurecreator96 not everyone can afford to have two PCs....
When vanguard dropped, after not playing league for 4 day then came back, I.was Permanently Banned for third party tool with no proof, Thank Riot
Cope hard bud cope
If this is true you should definitely email them to see what they say.
Yeah, sure! That's what all cheaters say.
I know you gotta be nice to them and all but let's face it, Vanguard is not good for your PC at all and I don't trust a company owned by Tencent.
Not only can Riot not make a balanced game with few bugs, but they can't make an anti-cheat program. My main issue is that it's on 24/7 when it shouldn't. The average player won't be on for that long, or know about this. It would be a hastle to turn it off and reboot every time. This all just boils down to trusting Riot, but Riot has proven time and time again that they can't be trusted. Hell, they even got hacked a couple times before. This isn't just about Riot being owned by a Chinese company, its more than that. In general, you shouldn't trust any company, I'm just less likely to trust Riot of all companies.
1312 views in 41 minutes? Bro fell off ☠️
Spying is of no interest to me. Riot possibly making mess with my PC drivers, slowing net connection and computer is reason I uninstalled LOL. And I really don't want to ruin my hardware when Tencent decide it is time to start BitCoin mining operation.
I am really rooting for riot on this one as i think the whole thing is blown out of proportions, but. "Vanguard data never left Riot warehouse." is either admission of a pretty serious crime or straight up bullshit, as stated in multiple laws in China any Chinese owned company is required to share all of its data with not only various government bodies in china, but straight with the communist party as well. Also all companies within China and all their subsidiaries are by law under the supervision of the communist party. That is not to say that that is something out of the ordinary, any other company will sell their data and they will inevitably be bought by for example the US government, but saying that the data never left their warehouse is fucking lie.
Vanguard actually has such low level access to your pc. the hysteria and paranoia are unwarranted. Vanguard is run completely by an AI. it has helped riot not only stop cheaters but pinpoint other cheats that normally go undetected. You can of course bypass vanguard; but you won't last long. vanguard knows when its not running you can not fool it indefinitely
i play many games with zero issues, no crashes so system bugs. since ive came back to league and downloaded vanguard my entire PC is just destroying its self to a point im now gonna have to wipe my pc because it wont even let me uninstall the game. Stop playing and wipe your PC before you do permeant damage.
The big difference is that Vanguard is always on.
Other kernel anti-cheat WHICH IS STILL BAD is only active as long as the game is.
Vanguard is functionally malware.
Piss off with the apologia.
Vanguard is secretly CCP's malware
The differences between vanguard and any other anti cheat its that is always on EAC starts only when you start the game its a huge no for me I uninstalled before they deployed vanguard on league I dont want any malware/bloatware on my pc
This video is too short, it doesn't answer the questions at hand. Which message do you actually want to send to viewers now? Constantly going back and forth is good because there is a lot when it comes to dicussing Vanguard. Howerver, not ending on a conclusion is weird. What do you do personally? What is your assessment? Got a clear cut opinion? Do you think players who deinstalled League with the launch of Vanguard are overreacting or not?
The discussion this whole thing stirred is interesting, and I highly appreciate you making a video about it, especially now because the dust has settled. Everything is complicated and you did well to sum it up in a short video. It just ended abruptly.
Personally, I do think players who make a fuss about it are clowns, if you don't trust Riot Games and/or Tencent, you are years and years too late. Whoever quit the game for any reason, good for you because it was probably bad for you, for those who are still playing I hope we enjoy a highly competitive MOBA with an active playerbase and less cheaters now.
Pretty uninformed take with some clear biases.
basically you're a riot dog that can't even confirm that vanguard is safe.
Today we are ok with these kinds of programs where they watch our pcs, in future we will be ok with even our life being watched to make us safe, right?...
You literally are using proprietary operating system from Microsoft that watches everything you do already lmao
I mean Riot owns by CCP
CCP even DDOS their own server because they got humiliated by Korea T1 Vs LPL. Mr Xi Jin35ping is mad
The amount of children commenting here that are QQing about being banned or there computer having issues is jaw dropping. Everything from broken BSD to home network issues, they're all very quick to point at Riot for being the problem.
Like I really don't understand the big complaint here, would you have rather them do nothing. This is the best thing on the market for now. Perhaps, in the very least, it will have people learn a bit more about how there computers work.
🤡
After riot takes media off my PC…
On Riot and Chyna’s door 🚪
Knock knock knock ✊🏻 FBI open up!
(They may be curious where the media originated 😂)
Nothing too bad but fr… I doubt they want the terabytes of what I got 😜
Vanguard is a piece of garbage causing the client to be extremely unstable. 😂😂😂😂
Ai thumbnail :(
So you now rely on clickbait? How utterly disappointing
This video is way apologetic. I recomment to watch this Brazilian video with auto subtitles on: O QUE NINGUÉM TEVE CORAGEM DE TE CONTAR SOBRE O VANGUARD
The br video actually shows the real problems of Vanguard.
I WANTED TO REINSTALL LEAGUE TODAY... This shit appear below my installation screen telling me "I HAVE TO INSTALL VANGUARD BECAUSE ITS ANTOCHEAT SHIT..." (i jumped to videos like this and... XD ITS TRASH! I REALLY WANTED TO PLAY THE GAME BUT WTF??? F@CK OFF RIOT, THERE A LOT OG GREAT GAMES OUT THERE TOTALLY NEW AND THEY DO THIS KIND OF BULLSHIT! BYE...)
oh thats why pc bricks when I play VALORANT
Riot games are bullshit