Will Car Oil Ruin Your Motorcycle Engine? | The Shop Manual
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- Опубликовано: 7 июл 2024
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Will Car Oil Ruin Your Motorcycle Engine? | The Shop Manual
Cynics say the only difference between motorcycle oil and automotive oil is the marketing on the bottle. What are the distinctions, and more importantly, can using auto oil in your bike damage the engine?
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Mobil 1 oil: rvz.la/3oqI1ps
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Bel-Ray EXP oil: rvz.la/3iptruh
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LiquiMoly 4T Street oil: rvz.la/3F9ltzb 
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What happens if you use car oil on a motorcycle that have all the oils separately for exemple Harley-Davidson Big Twins? in fact that this engines run on lower RPMS range and all the fluids have their own compartment that question is in the back of my mind for quite some time that would be an awesome video to complement this one.
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@@andrelouro88 If I remember correctly the clutch and gearbox use the same oil as the motor.
Do you have to use separate oil for the transmission and clutch?
Shaft drive oil is something else, also the "oil" for the hydraulic clutch is different and it is used only for sending the action from the level to the clutch,
@@showmytime9177 Harley's Primary Fluid lubricates the primary drive chain and the Clutch only. The Trans fluid is separate as is the Engine oil.
I use extra virgin olive oil for my Ducatis. These Italian bikes sure love the Mediterranean flavour that is close to its root
Goes well with the spaghetti noodles described by Ari. Smart!
It is a little thick so i cut mine with balsamic......
A little hot pepper for the higher revs!
🤣🤣👍🏽
Recycle the oil into a "spaghetti feed" for the neighbors and when they ask how you got that "smoky" taste in your spaghetti, just say, "From the burnouts on your lawn the other day." That should make some noodles come out their nose!
Oil debates are probably even more stressful conditions than inside a motorcycle engine
I agree!!!
LOL agreed
What blinker fluid should I use?
@@tongyang1631 The one with all the disspersents
There are entire websites and blogs dedicated to oil arguments. LOL
I use Rotella. Not only is it the greatest oil ever made it's great on a salad and it once saved my wife from drowning.
Yeah, isn't it for Diesel engines? Rated JASO MA also.
@@daveyt4802 Can confirm that my T6 jug says JASO MA/MA2. It saves a fair bit of money because dedicated motorcycle oil can be stupid expensive and hard to find. T6 is full synthetic too. Just not available in every weight you might want so you might have to compromise.
Rotella fathered one of my children, it's part of our family.
Same here, have used rotella T6 full synthetic for years. Yes it is designed for Diesel engines and protects against sheering.
I have always been a conventional oil user so I started using T4 a couple years ago. It had an aroma similar to the Suzuki oil before the China virus stole my smell. I've been running it my fsxr750 track bike and I am pleased with it. A little over 30 bucks at the farm store for 2.5 gallons!
Rotella in everything, bike truck mower and even a little in the old lady if she starts knocking.
Ari is a brave man, trying to convince the Rotella-gang that they shouldn't use Diesel-engine oil for the bike.
Rotella T6 despite being advertised mostly for diesel engines, technically it meets the Jaso MA\MA2 standard required for motorcycles so nothing wrong with using it.
Ari is great, but I think this was a bit of a supporting shill job for the motorcycle specialty oil distributors. Rotella T6 meets all of the same criteria and is cheaper and widely available 24/7 (Walmart). He could have just said that but that would alienate the industry.
@@rick-hm3ji with the amount Ari rides, I’m sure he’s an avid Rotella user when on his own dime. However, the motorcycle industry needs to live too.
Used in my Honda CB. Clutch slip. Never used it again.
106k miles on a tiger 800xc using rotella t6. 100k service had 4 exhaust valves need shimming, everything else was fine.
I’ve been using Nutella for years now, or was that Rotella.
Rotella is delicious. I like dipping cauliflower and Frito’s in that 💩.
Rotella is the chocolate stuff. DON'T PUT THAT IN AN ENGINE!
Both good stuff. Didn’t know they were interchangeable. Learn sumthin new everyday. Cheers.
Oils do not get thicker when hot. The viscosity modifiers make oil behave like a thicker viscosity oil when hot. It still gets thinner though.
Been using Rotella T6 which is marketed as diesel truck oil for more than 100,000 miles over several bikes (s1000r, 1098s etc) It's JASO MA2 rated, and cost me $20 an oil change.
I even send out my oil to the lab to get analyzed and always comes back clean results and recommendation to run on her than the 5000 miles that I do.
I'm 61 when I was riding in the 90s I don't even think there was such a thing as motorcycle oil I had an 80s Nighthawk 650 and I changed the oil quite often.
That's my thinking as well. I'm about the same age and never remember there being a motorcycle specific oil in 1980 which is the year my current XS1100 was built. My take is that most oils on the shelf today, even the cheap ones, are better than what was around back then. Besides, I've got a real problem justifying spending $40 on just the oil for an oil change.
Experienced this before with my Bike. Changed the oil with car oil and after a few Kms, The clutch started slipping. Ended up replacing the clutch plates and clutch linings Because I thought they were worn out, when actually it was just the oil causing it to slip. Lesson learned, Thanks Ari!
Likely to be able to find Rotella at truck stops, and it meets JASO and JASO M2. It's what thousands of us use in our bikes every day.
I’ve read a few comments about Rotella. And diesel oil.
I couldn’t tell if it was a biker inside joke I am not aware of. Especially after the Ducati/Extra Virgin Olive Oil comment.
I did know that was a joke.
So please explain?
Can't believe I get to put the first Rotella comment on this video. I'm so proud. Something something Rotella something something JASO something heavy duty diesel
Yep rotella t5
Been using it since before Jaso was on the bottle. Syn version made my clutch slip at wot, went immediately back to 15-40, all good, 30k miles.
PREEEEAAACH BROTHAA rotella t6 for life 😭
The V strom was practically a tractor so T4 did just fine
I use Rotella t6 in my Triumph Tiger. I don’t see the JASO on the Rotella container anymore but I don’t care. It works great.
I topped off my DR650 with one of those car "non-smoke" oil additives. Big mistake. Clutch glazed over and was slipping in little time. Drained the oil, but the damage was done.
You can't argue with a used oil analysis.
The one I had done for DELO 400 after 10,000 km showed no wear metals and little degradation ,with a recommendation that a further 2000 km before changing would be no problem.
And this on a bike with 20,000km on it ,where you would expect elevated wear metal as it is still breaking in.
Diesel lubricants have robust VAIs because the valve train is often gear driven and the fuel injection pump is also hard on lubricants
20.000Km is "still breaking in"?
Break in period for most bikes is somewhere towards 10.000
What do you ride? Some strange exotic Italian bike that needs oil blessed by the Dalai Lama's hairdresser, to not fall apart after 3 minutes of running the engine at 2537,14 RPM?
I've used car oil for years 😅 never have had a single problem with any of my motorcycles 🏍
Dude, thanks for clearing that up! I am running a 2001 Ducati ST4 that is designed with a dry clutch. I kept contemplating using a full synthetic oil for cars such as Mobil 1since I have the dry clutch, but now I see that there is much much more science behind the oil in protecting the engine components than just additives for the wet clutch bikes. Right on ! I'm sticking with Motul...
I actually called Amsoil a couple days ago for a Sportster primary/ transmission case oil. Turns out their 20W-50 is formulated for that too. I asked them about gear oil and they basically said the same thing you guys just explained and that they made their oil universal for Sportys so that’s pretty neat.
Have done over 30 000km on my last Vstrom dl650 with simple Rotella T 15w40 diesel oil like many people ( it have JASO MA spec ), even at 5000km oil changes, the oil level was always perfect and no comsumption at all
I used Mobile Delvac Super 1300 15w-40 for years in all my Diesel Trucks and in my Yamaha YZ-F-400
I use Castrol 10w-40 Mineral oil in my Yamaha FZ-07 Change the oil and Filter every 5,000 miles.. 5 quarts cost me like $18.00 use like 2.75 quarts for an oil change..
If it reach the constructor's spec requirement, no problem.
30,000 is barely scratching the surface. Coming from a country where a fair amount of bikes make it to 6-digit mileage, you can only really tell the long-term damage when the mileage starts to rack up.
I have a 2008 Yamaha FZ1 bought it new . It has 156,000k,s only use Rotella T4 15x40 Still the original clutch
30000 kilometers ! Thats nothing! Cmon when drove over 100k kilometers.
Then we see. Rotella! 🤣🤣🤣
Good vlog.
Both my road bikes run a dry clutch and seperate gear oil, and my go to engine oil is 20/50 diesel truck mineral oil designed for older, all iron, ohv motors, readily available everywhere, cheap, and change regularly.
Bikes are an 89 Guzzi Cali lll, and a 79 Triumph Bonneville with an open belt drive primary.
The trouble with the new m/c oil for the masses ie popular in most shops, but not specialist, is they are designed as you say for wet clutches and gearboxes, but also, high rpm and DOHC, not OHV and tappet loading on a cam lobe...
Had been using generic brand automotive oil for years on a wet clutch without any issue. Mostly 5w40 and above are safe to use on a shared sump. Cbr600rr with 240,000+ km on the clock with original engine and clutch. Oil is changed every 7000km and filter, every other oil change.Used daily for commuting to work.
This is mainly info for people in the united states because of the EPA mandated additives that cause damage to motorcycles. There's a lot of misinformation on the internet telling people to run automotive oil. Other countries don't have the same additives in there automotive oil so this information isn't relevant for non us riders.
Same here. 05 Zx10r with 102,000 miles. I've used the cheapest automotive oil, changed at around 4-5k miles and change the filter every other time. And I live in the states. Still running strong and doesn't burn oil. Hell most sports bikes don't live long enough to even justify the cost of specific oil.
@@steve23464 Precisely, there is no justification to pay a higher price for something that will work just fine as most motorcycle oil contains moly anyway.
Same here : drove a Honda 650 Deauville for 140 000Km with synthetic 5w40 car oil. Original engine, clutch and transmission. Never had an issue, never burned any oil.
I do the same with 2 Kawasaki Versys : 80 000Km on the clock and again, no issues.
Changing the oil on the correct interval is, to my opinion, far more important, than debating about which oil to put in. Basic 5w40 API SN will do for most bikes.
@@sv650touring Your comment to the OP's statement of he will get more mileage out of his CBR had he used motorcycle oil, is in contradiction to agreeing with my statement of motorcycle specific oils are generally a waste of money(3x the cost) for the average rider. How do you know how many miles that bike will eventually end up with? Unless I'm missing some humor buried in there to which, my bad.
Probably would have been cool to include a little caveat about some of the oddballs like Guzzis, the BMW boxers, etc. Those longitudal motors with separate gearboxes/dry clutches.
Also Harley’s which have separate engine, transmission, and primary oils.
@@alexfraley And those of us running classic bikes that also have separate oil for the engine, chain case (clutch), and transmission. In short this video is woefully inadequate.
And if you have a motor scooter with CVT no need for motorcycle specific oils.
i just wrote a question about that because I own a bmw lol
Not to mention scooters with dry clutches AND separate transmission oil.
Bacon grease ! You gotta let it warm up a bit b4 revving to 14000 rpm but once under way it smells great getting down the road.
Ahhhhh, don't you just love project farm!
Which does it clog faster, your oil galleys or your arteries?
@@ObamaoZedong Who cares, 'MERICA
@@ObamaoZedong You shouldn't eat your friends if they're fat
@@chrispekel5709 My username is actually part of a quote by George Bernard Shaw.
I worked at a Valley Honda Motorcycle Shop in 1975 and they bought Castrol 20W50 by the barrel.When we put a new motorcycle together (out of the crate} we drained the oil and installed Castrol 20W50 in it's place.
Great video and something I was wondering about. Thanks! Keep up the great work.
Rotella T4 and T6 meet the performance requirements of JASO MA. Look for diesel oils, not car oils.
YES THIS IS THE COMMENT I LOOKING FOR. He just focused on passenger car motor oil, not a single bit explaining about diesel or heavy duty engine oil. Mobil delvac1 5w40 works great in my yamaha r25
What about foaming with the higher RPM?
Diesel engine: Low revs, huge bearing surfaces, TONS of oil volume, short oil change intervals, lower extreme heat, lower sheer conditions, higher soot.
Motorcycle engine: extremely high revs, small bearing surfaces, small oil volume, longer oil change intervals, high extreme heat, high sheer conditions, clutch and transmission debris.
Seems like diesel oil is the PERFECT solution. Because is won't slip a clutch.
Comon morons.
Not only that, but the cheapest junk automotive oil at your local 7-Eleven is going to have higher tolerance to heat and sheer than your beloved Rotella diesel oil.
Spend 4 dollars more every oil change. Or continue to exercise your right to cognitive dissonance and dumb tradition.
if I'm a moron for using Rotella, I'm a happy moron! Goes in both my 4 stroke bikes, can be found in just about every nook on earth, cheap enuff to change often, & no problems.
Just imagine how much better you'd protect all that equipment with some actual motorcycle formulated oils.
I mean, how many diesel truck drivers do you know who fill their crankcase with motorcycle oil?
Thank you so much :) had this discussion with some friends on a roadtrip, who were going truely mental when i topped my 10w40 off with 5w40 at a highway gasstation because thats all they had. Guys, its 36C outside and the high temp viscosity is the same, come on!!!
I did a oil change as soon as i could tho, since i eveporated 1.5 liters of oil in a trafic jam (was a old air cooled bike, over 4 hours of traffic jam in hlt weather..)
I ran my 1979 Honda CB250N on Castrol GTX for years and it was fine, I also used to thrash the bike all the time!
Always wondered. Thanks for the info!
I can't believe you got a sponsorship from Kershaw! I also can't believe we're still discussing car vrs. bike engine oil! :)
I've used Pennzoil from Walmart without resource conserving additives in all my gsxrs and two stroke and 4 stroke dirt bike gear boxes for many years without problems
Thanks, Ari. For dry clutch bike engines like many Ducatis, I run automotive synthetic, but shorten up the change intervals.
Nope, the transmissions still run in the same oil, meaning auto oils are still bad news, whereas diesel oils (even 'non-JASO'
rated) would fit the bill just fine.
I have had no issues running regular car Castrol in my bikes but went to Castrol Actevo semi synthetic and noticed a huge difference in engine noise as well as better shifting.
Brief and info-packed. Thanks for this, Ari & team!
Car engine oils are made to certain specs. Coincidentally, motorcycle oils also are made to certain specs. Weirdly, both car and motorcycle manufacturer state which specs to use in which of their engines. It seems to make sense that if you're someone wanting to do your own maintenance, you'd use the spec the manufacturer recommends. I've got two bikes at home who can use car oil, because the specs recommended by the manufacturer can in fact be found in certain car oils. Asking questions like "can I use car oil in my moto" or stating replyies like "moto oils are more shear-stable than car oils" are far too broad, and should beg for clarification.
I don't see why you think moto transmissions are any harder on oil than car transmissions. They are almost exactly the same, functionally - the only difference being the drive ratios.
Your suggestion regarding clutch performance is spot on, and if the manufacturer suggests to use a certain spec oil, use it.
Telling people at the end that car oil is not robust enough, that is just pure BS. Buy the oil to the correct spec. Oil robustness is not a thing. Please put in a little more effort to be a little more precise when trying to describe engineering topics, or don't bother. We don't need another Scotty Kilmer on RUclips.
Thanks Ari! Really doing some good work out here
Very informative. Thank you.
Rotella T6 for diesels was used in my BMW K1200R Sport, R1100RS, K1200RS (flying brick). Also, in my Goldwing 1500, Harley Softail Heritage Springer with the Evo motor, Road King CVO 103 cu in, my ZX12R, CBR1000F, TL1000S, and my Royal Star Venture. Used it in my KZ1300A2, B2 models. My FXRP 1340 Evo, my EN500, S40 Boulevard, Rebel 250. How about my Valkyrie 1500, Vulcan 1500 Drifter, M109R, Victory Touring Cruiser, Vmax 1200, Cavalcade 1400 LXE, 1990 Sportster, 1997 Sportster, 2001 Sportster. The only bike I have not used Rotella T6 in was my 1973 Sportster that required 60W and dripped oil onto the chain from the crankcase!!! Harley said, "Check your oil ever 500 miles." No sheet Harley, you designed a motorcycle engine to leak its oil onto a chain from the crankcase making it a positive loss system!!! How many clutch, engine or transmission problems have I had? Zero and well over 1.5 million miles of riding since Feb 1974. Oh, I did not use Rotella in my 1968 Honda Super Hawk 305 since it was my first bike I owned, in 1974, and never changed the oil in 4,000 miles of riding that brakeless mutha....
I can confirm the clutch slippage issue. Went through two clutches on my race bike before I figured it out 🔥💵😢. Now I just stick with manufacturer oil and no problems.
You also quit dragging the clutch around the corners.
I used 5W50 Mobil 1 on my 1999 GSX750 for 12 years and 70k miles. Bike ran like new when I sold it 6 months ago. It had 105k miles on the clock. Never even adjusted the valves or opened the clutch. Swapped oil at every 3k miles.
Mobil car oil did awesome.
Great video. Thanks, man!
45 years of moto oil changes and my motto for the last 20 has been " JASO is a go , no JASO no go "
Yep, Car oil was changing fast when JASO came in, there were additives going in that was not so good for clutch and trans.
Nothing in JASO T-903 or T-904 tests addresses the fantastic claims made in this video re: transmission gear shear. The JASO MA/MB rating covers nothing but generic basics for gasoline engines and friction in JASO's unique clutch which uses no components found on a Japanese motorcycle.
So, any motor oil you use in which your precious motorcycle clutch does not slip has passed the exact same criteria as JASO uses.
The short answer is: refer to your bike's manual. If it says to use SAE 10w40 SF or SG, that's all the advice you need. (You'll probably have to use SL though, but that happens either its car or motorcycle-specific oil.)
3:34 that's shear stability as in shear force, not sheer as in unmitigated. Good vid, useful info, thanks. I couldn't get JASO MA1 so I used MA2 and immediately noticed the harder clutch grab.
Great presentation; brief, but clear and concise.
I just spit on it when it needs extra lubrication...
But on a more serious note, the use of correct oil and proper oil change interval are important to component longevity, especially with modern engine that have variable valve technology that heavily relies on oil flow and pressure. Additive package are added to base oil and it dramatically changes their characteristics, which makes modern oil specialized and great for a specific application.
If you want to use automotive oil in motorcycle, *cough Rotella T6 *cough, just make sure to always change oil on time.
Excellent video and content.
Thank You for the excellent info.
Very helpful. Very informative. Thanks again!
I love watching these, even when I already know the answer. There is always some nugget I didn’t know.
I like nuggets.
Especially the chicken kind .
The BMW R1200GS/A & 1150GS/A have independent engine from transmission & dry clutch compartments, that plus, being non high rev engines allow them to use engine oil without issues.
not to say about wet clutches as this video perfectly explains
Important to note that the R1200GS did switch to a wet clutch, and semi-liquid cooling, in the 2013 model year without changing the model name. Currently the only bikes BMW makes with a dry clutch are the R9T and the R18.
@@magicoddeffect good point you are right, thanks
Been running Mobil 1 in every bike I've owned since 1975 including the tranny and primary drive. Never had a problem.
Thanks mate, very informative video!
Just a small data point in a sea of info, but I used car oil as a poor college student (late '80s) in my fj600 and it eventually seized up the motor (camshaft bearings took a shit). Not a smart move.
just another small data point ran nothing but car oil in my Suzuki bandit 1200 from 10-50k miles have since switched back but over that period the valve clearances didn't move. and it is still running great. maybe I just got lucky?
had to put a bigger Belville washer spring in the clutch to get it to work tho.
@@nick4506 people also run auto tires on bikes too w/o issue. wouldn't do that either.
I don’t believe that for a second. There’s no way that just because you were using auto oil that your motor seized up. You had other issues and I’ll guarantee you that it would have seized regardless. Or you were using straight garbage ass oil which there was a lot of back in those days. Now days all oil is pretty damn good and nobody used paraffin wax anymore which is what caused a lot of problems back then. As the Video said the only thing with modern auto oil you need to watch out for is the energy conserving but most of that is on very thin weights which bike don’t use anyway.
@@cfltitan How could your "belief" possibly know, for sure, what was happing inside my motor several decades ago? Is it that omnipotent? What does it say about tonight's lotto numbers? Asking for a friend.
BTW, I don't know for sure what happened, which is why I said my anecdote was "just a small data point in a sea of info".
Anyway, let me know about those winning numbers, OK?
@@nick4506 yeah but that's a bandit. You could put some tar from the la brea pits in it and it would chug along just fine.
I thought I knew the answer already. Turns out I did (the clutch slip part that probably everyone has heard) but I also learnt some new stuff too 👍 great job.
Yes you are correct. I have only used Automotive OIL in my motorcycle. Changing it every 5000 miles too. BMW K1200RS for now. And it works! 20W50 when the Sun is bright and warm. 15W40 When Winter is around the corner. No wet clutch and 6 speed tranny is separate. Driveshaft used to need 90 weight oil back when it was just Air Head BMWs. The K bike changed that. Lots of differences. Keep Riding!
I use rotella t6 on my cbr 600 and my wrx and also on my wifes mini cooper s. Have had no issues bike is at 40k 14 years of running rotella,
Bike runs great clutch is fine wheelies every day.
Great breakdown on why it matters, and more importantly that you’re still better off running a mix of junk than going short (because we’ve all done that, and I’ve always wondered how much it mattered).
When I was young several mechanics told me to put diesel oil in, since motorcycle-specific oil was almost impossible to get. Based on your explanation that’s pretty good advice, but still not as good as motorcycle oil.
Shell Rotella T4 and T6 oils in the 15w-40 viscosities actually meet the JASO-MA Japanese motorcycle oil standard and are therefore safe for wet clutches.
puuuuhhhhleeaaze.. Rotella T6 is the best out there. All these moto oils are way too expensive and they're most likely the same stuff. T6, have run it for YEARS in motorcycles and quads. NEVER had any oil related failures. Matter of fact, no wear at all.
What viscosity?
@@fyyff52 5w40
Suddenly I feel very warm and fuzzy about choosing an older motorcycle with a dry clutch in a transfer case between the completely sealed engine and the completely sealed transmission with which it shares zero oil...
Very informative as always!!
Been using Rotella T6 on my 2013 Tigerxc. I have not noticed any difference whatsoever in the performance or shifting and I beat the 💩 out of this bike. I also ride 30 miles daily on the highway to work. I figure if it’s good enough to lubricate Diesel engine turbos then it’s good enough for my Triumph.
T6 is JASO MA2 rated so it's perfectly safe in motorcycle wet clutches. It's also a fantastic oil
@@JoshNewby84 I had another post about JASO certification. My bottles don’t show the certification although it’s on the website. I use 5w40 because I ride it in cold weather too and thought 15w40 might be too thick for cold start up.
@@JoshNewby84 rotella t6 is Jaso ma0 not 2 that directly from shell. It is barley wet clutch compatible and shell recommends using their actevo line of oils for motorcycles. The higher the ma rating the better it is for the clutch and transmission. Also the zddp has been removed from the oil to comply with EPA regulations since like 2007.
For 4t scooters (dry clutch most of the times) a car oil is perfectly suitable.
Agreed I’ve been using it for years in 4t scooters never any issues,
Exactly
Wow.... Have been researching about this topic & saw alot of these comments, it is cheaper to than buying a 1 litre specific scooter eo. Plus in my country alot of the motorcycle oil tends to have clone ones in the market as well
Im using shell rimula R4X on my 135cc yamaha soul GT (scooter matic).
Almost a year and its fine and clean. Compared to my brother bike using dealer recommendation oil (yamalube super matic).
My dirtbike (honda crf250x) has separate engine and transmission oil. I use honda oil and change it often. (every 100-200 miles) I also clean the air filter after every few rides. (Maybe after one ride if it is very dusty) This is key if you want longevity in a small dirtbike engine that holds less than a liter of oil.
However, no oil above 10w30 weight typically has the energy conserving additives, as they're not used in cars.
I know a lot of guys swear by Mobil 1 or Rotella T6 full synthetic truck oils. However, they may not have the full slate of EP additives that a good motorcycle oil will.
This used to be true for years, it isn't any longer. For years I had used Castrol GTX 10w40 in my 80s Shadow, because it had no friction modifiers etc. Then with new packaging the clutch started slipping. I contacted Castrol and they advised it had changed, even with the API bullet being empty on the bottom the latest API Spec SN allowed more slip modifiers to be added. Shell also confirmed there were additives in the 10w30 multivehicle, and Rotella T6 0w40 (but not their T4 15w40 or T6 5w40 those are Jaso MA / MA2)
Is it not "shear" stability, as in shear stresses?
Ayup, it sure is! 🤦🏼♂️ That’s embarrassing…
@@AriH211 The correct spellings of other words are the sneakiest typos to catch! Thanks for the video and congrats on the new sponsor!
I ran dello 400 for 8 yrs in my super moto no issues, keep it clean,on a regular schedule!
I Use Liqui Moly 10W40 MoS² Anti-Friction (P# 2042),With a Fram PH6017A In my 99CBR600F4. I haven't Had any slippage on my clutch so far. I quite like the way this oil acts in my bike, my 08 CBR125R doesn't like it, but my 99CBR600F4 Loves it.
I haven’t watched this video but I will tell you what I know about the difference between car and motorcycle oil. In the late 1980s, the government went to the oil manufacturers, and the car manufacturers to ask them how we could get more gas mileage with our cars. If every car would just get one mile more mileage per tank of gas, that would save millions of gallons of gasoline every day.
so the oil companies in the car companies came up with a suggestion. make the oil thinner. Thick oil actually has more friction, more friction than thin Oil..
so in case you haven’t noticed, we now have 5W 20 and 0W 20 motor oil‘s.
they reduced the amount of zinc and phosphorus from the additives added to car oil to thin the oil out to reduce friction to get more gas mileage.
so what does that have to do with motorcycle oil?
car oil is engineered to withstand high temperatures, sometimes in excess of 450°. Just picture a car on a freeway on a 95° day with the air conditioner on stuck in traffic on blacktop asphalt. car oils actually have less shearing than a motorcycle with the transmission being lubricated by the same oil. The most difficult area in most cars on oriole is, where the cam strikes the lifter.. every place else in a car engine pretty much floats on a hydrodynamic wedge of oil and has little metal to metal contact under load..
Motorcycle oil does not get nearly as hot as car oil routinely does. But motorcycle oil is subjected to shearing in a transmission when it is lubricated by the same oil as the engine, which is most 4 stroke Japanese motorcycles.. with some of the high powered sport bikes today, and since 1989 actually, the pressure exerted on the gears in the transmission is in excess of 100,000 pounds per square inch. The oil in that transmission is sheared. That means, the molecules in the oil are constantly being cut in half like spaghetti strands being cut in half over and over due to the process called shearing.. it doesn’t take long before that oil loses it film strength because it is sheared at the molecular level…zinc and phosphorus are what gives oil it’s film strength to resist shearing. Car oil’s do not have high quantities of anti-sheer additives. You can feel it in the shifting when the oil is worn out..You can tell. Whenever it becomes difficult to shift, or difficult to find a neutral, your oil is probably shot/Sheared..
motorcyclist magazine did an article on what was done to car oil’s and why you should never ever run them in your motorcycle engine if the engine runs the same oil into the transmission for lubrication… they explained this in detail in the early 1990s. They actually said that there were going to be catastrophic transmission failures in motorcycles that people use car oil in..
so, oil is not just oil.. always always use the weight oil specified in your owners manual. Never put additives in your oil never.It’s also a good idea to use OEM oil filters, especially if your motorcycle is still under warranty, because, when I was a motorcycle mechanic for a /Honda dealership… a customer had an engine failure on his still under warranty Goldwing. We were all suprized because Honda refused to warrantee the engine because, the owner did not have an OEM oil filter. That is clearly stated in the owners manual of every honda motorcycle… the customer had a chinese aftermarket filter that was chromed He liked the chrome filter better.. Honda did not cover it. The owner of the dealership did not leave that customer out to dry. He took the bike in on trade, and bought a replacement engine from a salvage yard…
it’s also a good idea to change the oil in your brand new motorcycle the first day you take it home. If you don’t believe me, just do this one little thing. Get yourself a coffee filter, and put it into a funnel. Also put a magnet inside the coffee filter, and drain the oil out of your brand new motorcycle the day you take it home, making sure that that oil goes into the coffee filter with a magnet in it. Do it while the engine is as hot as you dare to touch the drain plug.. The oil will not want to go through the coffee filter as fast as it will pour out of the drain plug, so be ready for that. You won’t believe how much metal, Ferriss, and nonferrous will come out of that engine with aluminum, clutch fiber, magnetic black grit, shavings from manufacturing/ thread tapping, ect… if the drain plug does not have a magnet built into it, it is not a bad idea to get a small powerful magnet and attach it to your drain plug permanently on the outside of the drain plug of course, not in the engine..
One other little thing. fill your oil filter up with fresh oil before you install it. Of course, before you fill the oil filter, put a clean rag into the threads of the oil filter and clean that out. You’ll be surprised your pole shavings, and black cutting oil with grit in it out of the threads many times on the oil filters. if your oil filter is mounted horizontally, you can still saturate the paper in the filter by pouring some oil inside the filter so you don’t half five or 10 seconds on start up that your engine doesn’t have oil pressure until it fills the oil filter.
The most damage your engine seize every day is on a cold start up. Especially if you have an engine that is water cooled.. inside the combustion chamber of a water cooled engine on cold start up, the incoming fuel condensers on the cold cylinder walls, just like humidity condenses on the outside of a cold glass of water in the summertime. water cooled cylinders stay cold longer than air cooled cylinders.. that environment is what is known as corrosive. That raw fuel condensed on the cold cylinder walls actually rinses any oil off of the cylinder walls. That raw gas does get into the crank case diluting the oil also. just open the oil fill cap on an engine sometime and smell it. A lot of times you will smell gas that is in the oil, which makes that oil contaminated, and should be changed immediately if you can smell gas in it. gasoline contaminated oil was very common back when motorcycles had carburetors and pet cocks on the fuel tank. Riders would leave their petcock on unless it was a vacuum petcock, and if the carburetors had a bad needle and seat, or if the motorcycle was just leaning enough to make the float drop a bit, That gas would flow through the carburetor and get into the cylinder and down into the crank case a lot of times.. I have had 108 motorcycles counting the ones I used to just buy to flip them. I always smelled the crank case oil before I would buy a motorcycle. If I smelled gas in there, I didn’t buy it..
if you have a two-stroke motor cycle , do you have to run four stroke motor cycle oil in the gearbox also, not car oil.. no 2 stroke Engine is going to put 100,000 pounds per square inch of sheer stress on its transmission gears white high horsepower four stroke machines do such as the Hayabusa, but a two cycle transmission has a slightly tougher duty cycle because, they don’t have oil filters, So you have to change the oil on 2 cycle gear boxes more often, and they can benefit from a magnet attached to the outside of the drain plug also
Clutch slippage has always been my go-to argument when advising new riders against automotive oil in their their bikes, but I learned a few new things after Ari's latest enjoyable and informative episode. Always spot-on!
In my old bike I always used a good 'standard' (automotive if you must lol) semi synthetic oil (Mobil Super 2000), without issue for years. If you are getting clutch slippage I can guarantee it's due to wear, or oil changes not being done regularly enough, or even the bike not being used often enough.
Although I rode that bike very hard still, I have now moved to Motul 7100 fully synthetic (bike specific) oil due to the age and type of bike I now have (previous 2008 Kawasaki ER-6f aka Ninja 650r, now 2000 Kawasaki ZX9r). But that's more to do with using fully synthetic due to how it keeps it's viscosity more consistent at higher temps, and the reasonable price of the Motul 7100 compared to other brands fully synthetic oils.
You made a very complicated thing simple thank you.
I ran my XS650 with diesel oil (Shell Rotella) for a while. Seemed to not suffer from clutch slip and performed fine.
Rotella T6/5 meets all JASO requirements for my bike.
That’s what I use at 1/5th of the price.
Shhh secret
T4 resists shearing better after the initial breakdown than T5 or T6. That's only a concern if it runs through a transmission or a lot of gears, so it's probably the most popular for Japanese bikes.
Can you do a similar episode but with heavy vehicle (diesel) engine oils please.
I’m a truckie and the loads and heat experienced are probably more similar to a motorcycle minus the enormous revs and there are suitable Diesel engine oils which are safe to use with motorcycles as long as they don’t have certain friction modifiers.
I wouldn’t race out and start servicing a super bike with truck oil but on a low revving thumper like my DR650 it’s a viable option especially when on overland adventures.
My Harley owners manual for my old 93 FXR, lists diesel oil as a short term top off if you are where you cannot find "Harley" oils, but change it as soon as you can. There is nothing about warranty voiding. So I figured back then, that I would run Rotella. It has been in all my Harleys ever since.
@Peter Angles That'd be because Rotella (at least some of them) are JASO MA rated.
@@mtevilone same here... my 89 fxsts get diesel oil for engine...my 14 xl1200c gets diesel oil as well...no issues what so ever...plus you would think the extra "cleaning" additives would be better over all
Shell Rotella T4 and T6 oils are both JASO MA2 certified for use with wet clutches. They are both also formulated to resist shearing by gear contact due to virtually all diesel engines using a gear drive under the front cover to drive their cams, injection pumps and other accessories. They both also contain a very good dispersant package to keep the diesel soot in suspension and not sticking to engine components. It sounds like both T4 and T6 oils check the right boxes. Fortunately, my motorcycles can't read what is printed on the oil bottles so they don't get too upset about having Rotella poured into their crankcases.
Well, I used 20W40 car oil in my 2002 FZ1 Fazer for over 8 years without any issue. Engine is still quiet and still runs great at high rpms. But I will admit I learnt something new from the video.
This might be the best motorcycle oil video I have ever seen. I use Shell Rotella T6. JASO MA rated.
My V strom got the finest Rotella diesel oil, seemed to be the preferred drug of the Stromtroopers, made that clutch butter smooth
Heck yes!
i have a vstrom 650 2005 with 56000 kms mostly combined cycle never used car engine oil i use motorcycle specific oil either motul 7100 10w40 or shell advance ultra 10w40 and occasionally castrol power1 10w40 never had issues with the clutch or the gearbox and it does not burn oil at all and since its fairly cheap especially the shell i really dont see why you would even consider putting car or heavy duty diesel on a high revving engine with wet clutch
Thought about it. But my SV racer buddy said the oil will kill your cams and valve buckets.
@@dimos5422 9500rpm isn’t really high rpm. Had the DL1000 and after 3-4000 miles the oil came out looking just as clean as when it went in. Guy overseas ran his to 400k miles on synthetic car oil 🤷♂️
@@nitrofish8908 how many engine cars you have seen running above 5500 rpm regularly ? its not that high if you compare it to a 600 supersport yes obviously but its really high for like 99% of passenger cars. 400k miles on a wee?? how do you even do so many miles on a bike ? let alone without the engine giving up
Im using car engine oil on my bike for years now (not the "energy conserving" one) 😅
we got this community called "LDIC" or Long Drain Interval Community where we talk about how to use HDEO/PCMO oil for bikes.
a lot of the members are also people from "oil factory" or people with degree in tribology and such.
I dunno, my engine is clean and all, and never got any issues for years since I'm using "car" oil for my bike.
people usuall called us "sesat" (indonesian language) which mean "astray" 🤣
Kaya kenal grup nya🤣
@@Vieri920 pasti warga sana juga ya mbah? 🤣
Yes some differences buuuut........ My bike is a low revving ~80hp boxer engine with a dry clutch & separate gearbox, while my car is a 1litre 125hp , turbo , triple. I do enjoy the channel and content, thanks guys.
My Jawa 350ts likes castor oil in sae40!. Smells lovely too!
Mate, enjoy all your videos, very informative, total respect. Just one thing, my bike BMW R9T (maybe all boxers), dry clutch (like a car) separate gearbox (like a car) could I use car oil ? Well maybe I could, but I don't, I use motorcycle oil. Why ? Well, it's motorcycle oil innit. If they made motorcycle specific beer I'd buy that too. Keep up the good work.
@@AriH211 The R9T does not share oil between engine and gearbox. Engine, Gearbox and Bevel Box (or final drive if you prefer) are all completely seperate from each other.
Guzzis have exactly the same set up and it's a common configuration on shaft drive motorcycles employing in line cranks and dry clutches. I'm unsure about the BMW but certainly with Guzzis it's not uncommon for owners to use car engine oils. The oil for the BMW engine is a semi synth 15W/50, personally I'd use a full synth and as long as the oil meets the recommended specs I'd have no problems in using a car engine oil.
I don’t own an r ninet but I do have an r1100gs. Everything is separate as described. I use proper weight mobile1 full synthetic in the engine and liqui moly in the trans and final drive. Have used diesel formula oil as well and it works great.
@@MistaWeeGee Same. Youre not dealing with insane power/heat/compression and the clutch and transmission are external, there is no reason not to run car oil. I still prefer full synth as well just because it wears better over time and I tend to abuse my bikes more than an average car (spend a lot more time up in the high revs, well what a Guzzi calls high revs).
My Duc, MV Agusta, and Kawasaki live in 300v. But youre talking about 200hp/liter and 13k RPM ranges, something most boxers/guzzis dont do...
There is …. it Yuengling Lager.
Pretty general commentary. 2 out of my 3 bikes are pushrod engines with separate transmission and engine oil. I believe it may be more accurate to say that many auto oils will require more frequent changes. I run VR1. Change based on viscosity and dispersant test. Drop some oil on coffee filter change when ring forms. Oil is cheap engines are not.
Right before the end, I was thinking it and you said it. Any oil is better than no oil.
5:42 such a relief. Just added abit of transmission oil in my bike.
I'll use what the owner manual calls for.
I have yet to see one asking for "motorcycle" oil.
My Kawi one does
Rotella user: is that a question?
I use rottela t4 15 40 in 3 quads and a grom with a 181 big bore. My 2000 Tacoma used to burn thru Half it’s oil in 3k miles I put t6 full synthetic in it 15-40 it has not burned any since
Great video! Could you please do a video on how to rebuild the rear suspension?
Also even in dry clutch motorcycles you need to be careful. Most Moto Guzzi's for example uses flat tappets and modern car oils don't account for this either.
Flat tappets are used by most every overhead cam automobile engine made. Every Toyota the past 30 years that I know of. Even if not at the valve there is a flat tappet at the hydraulic lifter in contact with the camshaft but in the rare cases a roller lifter is used.
@@N4HHE DOHC and SOHC on bucket work a little different than a push rod flat tappet... and not every over head cam uses a bucket and some have followers etc.
@@andrewhannam. camshaft operating on a flat tappet aka lifter is the same as on a bucket. Two flat sufaces running on one another. The leverage ratio of the rocker arm in an over head valve engine is the only difference
@@holmes1956O it has been sometime since being in engine theory but my understanding was the forces were different as a tappet is designed to rotate in their bores as shim over bucket is "pinched" on the cam side... This explains why engines with flat tappets should have oil with more zinc... I think the GM fans can pipe in as this is a well documented problem with many modern oils.
@@andrewhannam. For a given displacement and maximum engine speed a pushrod engine is going to need much heavier valve springs than OHC, and has a lot more inertia in the valvetrain. That means more force on the valve followers and the cam lobes, and probably explains the need for better EP additives.
Drivning a China 125 cc scooter when commuting to work, no clutch and no gearbox.
Have no problem with putting car oil in it! I can do a oil change for 5$ in 10 minuters a couple of times per season (1 april - 1 nov).
It has no "real" oil filter so have added a magnet by your suggestion!
Actually it does have a filter
It's a centrifugal type oil filter either right on top of the crankshaft or on oil pump or on some smaller bikes built in the clutch basket.
There are funny looking groves and passages in it and the heavy metal debris and junk get stuck in there due to centrifugal force when the engine's running. It does need to be cleaned every 2 3 year or something because it gets full or crap
@@mustafayaminkhan5867 Well, it all depends on what you count as a filter, that why i wrote "real" filter.
It has one of those steel wire net shaped as a little bowl, it may catch stuff at the size of a spare piston flying around but not much else. Stuff as big as a grain of sand just fly thru.
@@BS-mi7pc hahaha lol
Great informative video! Thank you Revzilla and TSM for dealing the straight science and facts that help the public make informed decisions. For those who may not know, this is what s called a "reputable source". Well done.
Not really, no. This is more of an outlet of the motorcycle industry and they would rather you buy motorcycle oils. The science doesn't lie, nor do certifications.
Rotella T6 is JASO/MA2 certified and 100% safe to use in your motorcycle. I don't use it, but there's nothing wrong with it.
I remember learning about motorcycle specific oil . Never changed a clutch again. Seems like they didn't make a point to tell people to use it until the late 90s or early 2000s . I even remember motorcycle shops using Castrol GTX , Mobile One and other automotive brands.
Surprised he didn’t talk about the T6, has the jaso MA rating..
Yes, but Rotella-T6 is no longer SAE/API S-category rated for gasoline engines.
KLR owner will call for 15w40 all day....I have a DR and do the same. If I had an inline 4 or some sort of fancy European stuff - I would probably stick with motorcycle oil otherwise car oil is good for my thumpers.
We use Diesel oil. Rotella T6.
@@Tb0n3 that's what I was referring to
@@adisyamadasa4238 Just checked the jug again. Rated JASO MA/MA2. 👍
Whelp, time to change my oil. Thanks for this.
Mobile One 15w-50 car oil, cant beat the price, and bike motors, trans, and wet clutches love it.
Thank you for the detailed explanation. Still, no motorcycle of mine will ever be running "motorcycle specific" oil. My oil cooled Bandit 1200 ran 200,000Km on Mobil 1 15W50 and it's engine hasn't been opened past the valve check. I'm on my third maxi scooter (over 150,000Km in total) running on Shell Rotella T6 5W-40 with no issues whatsoever. Pardon the expression, but you can stick Yamalube where the sun doesn't shine.
I agree!!!!!
Krill oil or nothing. Plus, it attracts cats to keep my bike warm in the winter.
Just kidding. I use whatever JASO MA2 approved full synthetic is on sale at the time.
Thank you 🙏.