Will Thinner Oils Damage Your Engine?
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- Опубликовано: 28 июл 2020
- Can thin motor oils protect your engine?
Sponsored by Mobil 1 motor oil - Visit AutoZone to find the right Mobil 1 motor oil for you: bit.ly/2P218TW
What do oil weights mean? What does 5W-30 mean? Do thinner oils get better fuel economy? Do thin oils like 0W-20 protect your engine? I spent some time discussing these questions with Mobil 1 engineers and am excited to share what I learned. There’s an incredible amount of testing and verification that goes into labeling a motor oil’s viscosity rating, which is the single most important factor for how a motor oil will perform in an engine. Motor oil is responsible for protecting your engine, removing contaminants, reducing friction and cooling your engine. Plus, motor oil creates a protective barrier between moving metal parts allowing for your engine’s longevity. In this video we’ll use a 6.2L V8 engine cutaway from the C8 Corvette to better see and understand how oil interacts with automotive engines. #Mobil1Partner
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*Clarification!* There still seems to be confusion about the viscosity decreasing with heat, yet the number is higher, for example 5W-30.
1. This is explained from about 1:05 to 3:05.
2. All motor oils (basically) will decrease in viscosity as they heat up (become thinner).
3. Motor oils will increase (become thicker) in viscosity as they cool (as demonstrated in the video with graduated cylinders).
4. A 0W oil has a lower viscosity than a 10W oil when it is cold (the number is lower).
5. A 40 grade oil is thicker than a 30 grade oil when it is hot.
6. A 10W-30 (as shown at 2:28) will be thicker at cold temperatures, but thinner at high temperatures, versus a 0W-40.
7. The rating is temperature dependent! There is a cold rating, and a hot rating, which comes from tests (shown at 3:17).
8. Even though the number increases as it gets hot (like 5W-30), the viscosity decreases. It means the oil behaves like a 5 grade oil when cold, but a 30 grade oil when hot. How?
9. Viscosity modifiers are molecules that expand as they heat up, which decreases how much thinner the oil gets as it heats up. It still gets thinner, but not as thin as it could get if the viscosity modifiers were not in there. This is what makes it a multi-grade oil. Because it behaves like different oil grades depending on temperature.
10. In summary, a 5W-30 will decrease in viscosity as it is heated, however its hot rating is a thicker grade oil than its cold rating. See plots in video (2:28) to see what this looks like.
You didn't say "always" enough. Now I'm gonna switch to sewing machine oil. Thanks! ;-)
I know you said to use what the Manuel recommends. I have a 1984 3.8l v6 gm motor. It’s an older motor a recommends sae30 non synthetic. Will it be safe and or better to to use the modern 10w-30 full synthetic?
If you could have got some, you should have done the beaker test with frozen 10 weight with frozen 10w-30 to show how the cooler oil acts like the lighter oil, and then straight 30 at high temp alongside 10w-30 at high temp.
This is a point less video!! The engine was engineered and tested with the oil the manufacturer recommends! I don't understand the misconception of motor oil!!
USE WHAT YOUR OWNERS MANUAL RECOMMENDS!! You can't go wrong!
Knowledge is power...
Thank you for the clarification! What has gotten me all these years (and perhaps some other viewers) was thinking the number was an absolute measurement of viscosity, hence thinking 30 would be thicker than 10 in a 10w-30 oil. Similarly, thinking that just a base oil would change it's grade number as temp and viscosity changed. It seems your "behaves like" statement is what I should have keyed in on. If I'm understanding now, a 30 grade oil will always be a 30 grade oil, regardless of what temp and viscosity it is at any given time, and the two numbers in a rating just signify different characteristics, and not straight up measurements of viscosity itself. Pardon my long comment, but basically THANK YOU. These videos are so informative.
As a Chemist, I can confirm that honey does have a higher viscosity than water.
Excellent, glad that portion was accurate!
As a bee, i can confirm too
As a Biochemist, I can confirm that honey does taste better than water even though it has a higher viscosity. Put an adequate amount in your body engine and it will convert into ATP and gives you energy boost.
lol!!! I am not but we don't need to have a degree to realize honey have higher viscosity than water... but thanks for your help btw
Too late for me, I've been dragging my hand through honey all morning.
He's right, nobody with a Corvette cares about fuel efficiency.
Actually corvettes are known for getting very good mpg due to low rpm torque and tall gear ratios combined with very good aerodynamics. Alot of the modern ones were getting upwards of 30 highway which is quite decent
exactly nobody buys a vette for moving from a to b efficiently
@@TheCulnes Agreed. I can easily get 30mpg doing 70mph on the highway in my 2012 corvette.
In my moderate climate near Portland OR, I use RedLine 20-50 in my LS-1 powered 1998 Corvette witch is fitted with a higher numeric ratio diff, that decreases top speed, decreases mileage, and increases acceleration. I dont give a rip about milage. Thin oils are there to increase CAFE mileage numbers, NOT reliability over time. When I was younger I knew professional race engine builders. When they built a drag engine that only needed to last a few seconds, they used exceptionally thin oils for max power. When the built an endurance racer, they built for 40 or 50 wt oils, and beat it into my head for longer life I should be using 20-50. I have seen hundreds of common street engines shredded to crap at 90,000 miles on that thin crap oil used for high MPG... and many running fine at 300,000 when they live with higher viscosity and 'stickier' surface adhesion oils. You all can keep the shitty thin oils and I'll see ya looking for a new engine, or at the freaking crusher, at 120K miles
RUclips ECOVETTE, VETTES ARE UBER FLEXIBLE CARS
As with any car manufacturer there is always one exception to the owner's manual. The current Subaru engines all use the 0w20 oils. The same engine built in Japan all use the 5w30 oils. There are a great many cases of oil consumption in these engines in the US using the 0w20 oils. Most when moving to the 5w30 oils can eliminate the oil consumption issues. Since I live in an area that can have colder winters I elected to run 0w30 oils in my Subarus.
my jdm subaru used 0w20, it said that on oil change sticker
It is believed that the viscosity was lowered to increase fuel efficiency due to emissions regulations, so I think it may be better to increase the viscosity for fast-running cars.
Remember that cars are used much differently in Japan; you won't be driving at 80 MPH for six hours there.
Subaru's burn oil when new & old. Thats why I can never own one.
@@VideoArchiveGuy Exactly. I avoid Subaru's anyhow. Don't like my engines to burn oil.
I had my subaru tuned by the leading engineer of mitsubishi's efi setup, when mitsubishi closed down here in adelaide/south australia, he started his own tuning business - steve knight racetech. He told me to go higher on the second number to 50 or even 60 (so 10w50) when I do track days or go drag racing, as the oil takes longer to be displaced in the bearings and will prevent spun bearings, and never go to a smaller number unless I wanted to spin a bearing. He built and rebuilt many race engines in his life. I follow that rule, and have never damaged an engine.
That's changing as manufacturers are building their engines to be tailored to lower viscosity oils. They now have tighter bearing clearances, are engineered for high *flow* instead of high oil pressure, and use vane-style oil pumps that are optimized for the viscosity the engineers designed the engine to use. Contact the manufacturer if tracking a vehicle and are concerned about oil viscosity. Most will probably tell you to use a heavy weight oil on race day and immediately drain it out and replace it with the correct oil after racing.
I'm an aircraft mechanic and I used to work in gas turbine engines.(jet engines) The synthetic oil used in those engines that reach 60 000 rpm was so thin you couldn't tell the difference between the oil and the jet fuel.
Makes sense, protection of a journal bearing is mainly dependent surface area, speed and sheer stress of the oil film
Sounds like it's close to diesel oil
@Tah BOO in a jet engine, the bearings are hydrodynamic. The rotation of the shaft creates a boundary layer and the shape of the bearing has shallow semi-circular pockets machined into the bearing on either side of the loaded area (the oil inlet is typically in these pockets as well.) that acts like a wedge to force the oil to compress in the areas that have higher load to maintain the oil film. Whereas hydrostatic bearings simply use the pressure generated by a pump to force oil into the annular area between the bearing and the shaft.
So what are you saying ?
Was it a 1.9 tdi in the aircraft by any chance?
I’m glad to see you are gaining industry respect. I don’t think GM shares their very expensive demonstrator models and research data with just Any RUclipsr. You have earned this kind of recognition and I anticipate it’s going to continue.
GM V8 engines are pretty much dinosaur engines compared to the Ford V8 modular engines.
@@ronp1018 And yet they still make great power and are cheap. I see LS swaps everywhere…..
@@ronp1018look up 7 Marine. GM pushrod engine rules the outboard world. Once you put a huffer on an engine, cams don't matter worth the money they cost
@@brucejohnson8521 oh, I thought you were talk about the crisscross with the Ford engines
@@ronp1018 right! Seems wasteful to me for Ford to have all those extra parts and complexity for less power in the end. You'd think they'd go for higher numbers in their performance engines 🤷♂️
I was always told by a good family member who was a mechanic it’s thinner oil in the winter so the engine warms up faster and a heavy oil in the summer because the engine gains more heat and so far I’ve been doing it past 35 years I don’t have a problem
Heard this everywhere here in Saudi Arabia. Nobody would recommend a 0w-20, they would all recommend a heavier oil like 5w-20 or even 10w-20 😅
@@yasir6402my manual says 0w20...i use 5w20....works great.
You can usually drop the cold number with no issues. Cars from 20-30+ years ago may call for 5-30 or 10-30 because there was no 0-30 available at that time and the dealers dealers would have to stock a new oil. I run 0-30 in older cars and trucks at our landscaping company and in my personal cars we had no oil related failures. A 0 weight oil may even provide better protection since it can quickly get into all areas of a cold motor.
have you used 0W oils in cars from around 1995 - 1999 ?
i read in the owner manual that 5w30 viscosity oils should only be used for cars from 2000 and later
@@difsid569 I have used 0-30 in older cars. Some car makers like BMW put out notices saying the newer 0w-30 oil can be used in cars requiring 5w-30.
@@difsid569 Noack volatility affects how fast oil burns off on an older engine
Well yeah 0W is obviously going to be better at winter than 10W
Guys... IT ONLY DEPENDS ON AMBIENT TEMPERATURE. If u live in a warm climate... RUN 15W-40 synthetic DIESEL OIL, and your engine will love you forever. If u live in Montana like me, I run 5w-40 year around, and plug my truck in when it's below 10°
That's the best looking, cut away motor, I've ever seen!
I've seen a VW V10 diesel that looks as good and a big Cat truck diesel and some others, but yes it is good looking.
Best cut away was a v12 Merlin.
I thought the same thing
I just hope that going with lower viscosity oil to increase efficiency by 1%, is not causing 10% shorter engine life. I'd like to see data that proves that engine life isn't sacrificed at all.
I have trouble believing that super-thin oil will have sufficient film strength.
@@michaelbenardo5695 Then how do you explain cars using 0w-20 oil going over 250,000 miles?
@@jobidentouchedme767 How can that be possible? 0w-20 hasn't been around long enough for that.
5 yrs ago NASCAR teams used 0W8 oils. Film strength issues didn't appear.
@@FrankyRedEyes Wierd. Although you have to remember, racing engines are overhauled after every race, so as long as it doesn't lose power during the race, condition after the race is not that important.
“Always always always” as I drive back from Oreillys with 0w-40 for the winter. Great video
I love you because you said 'criterion' for singular rather than the plural version "criteria." BRAVO!
I know the bar for literacy is very low these days, but congratulations for finishing high school?
Pedantic
"As long as the engine lasts for the warranty period, we don't care what you put in it." -Ford Executive
Who said that?
@@Jedi391 a Ford executive
American Greed.
Proof? Name the executive, and when this was documented. We'll wait.....
LoL parrot.. Ever worked on a french car?
Use manufacture recommended oil. Mazda RX8 has left the chat.
That’s a great engine. 😉
Lol..recommended...minutes later, seizing rotor........
13B RENESIS has left the chat, without compression...
together with 350/370z :P
The secret to a long lasting RX8 engine is to never start it
My 2018 Volvo came with a manual recommendation of 5w-30. They actually sent me a letter with a sticker to put in my manual to change to 0w-20.
I'm at 277k miles and still running strong after switching about halfway through
That's insane and hilarious at the same time 😂
Was probably regulatory to send the sticker to meet CAFE standards and keep the MPG a tiny-tad higher so they wouldn't get fined
I would have wrote back telling them to pound sand. F*ck their CAFE penalties
Excellent video, this what I was looking for, no one really unstood the details and explained it the way it is explained in this video
"Always use what's recommended in your owner's manual."
Me, channeling my inner Derek while buying a gallon of Rotella 15w-40 and a bottle of Lucas for my F-350: "It's got dinosaurs and vitamins in it. Plus, it was on sale."
Derek is hilarious, and quite capable.
Look up Vice Grip Garage.
Derek put gear oil in his crank case, lol.
Nope
@@trumpisaconfirmedcuck5840 ,
If you've ever bought a car from a used car dealer, you can be sure that there was at least a percentage of gear oil in the crankcase.
They buy that stuff in 55 gallon drums, and it makes even the most worn engines run quieter and stop burning oil.
I just run straight 50W in my non diesels...
"Use what the manufacturer recommends" ...until they recommend a lower viscosity on the same motor later in production to increase fuel efficiency at the expense of wear.
Ford 5.4 L Triton has left the chat.
@@danhg3885 Ding ding ding we have a *@*##@$&% winner!!!!!!!!!
My car has a 10w40 recommendation but I find that the engine sounds like it’s running dry while cold if I use that so I switched to 5w40 and it runs marvellously now
Can someone answer why dont we just use 0w 60 so that we have the ability to run smooth really hot or really cold?
0-40 is the closest I've seen on shelves, and that's what I like to use.
Good video. Other things to consider: Over time engines have been designed with tighter bearing clearances, thus the thinner oil is needed. On the other hand, ring seal will suffer if the oil is too thin resulting in loss of power. under load.
its cafe. the silverado and corvette have the same clearances yet one says use 0w20 the other says 5w30 up to 20w50.
Best video in describing viscosity and the relationship with weather and engine temperature.
Just subscribed and I'll tell you why. Instructions were clear and concise without overbearing music to contend with, really no "extras" thrown in just to hear your head rattle, and finally camera work was well done without shaking or wondering. This should be a lesson for other RUclipsrs. Thank You, JD
I had a 1964 mercury with a 351 windsor engine, I used a 10w30 oil with a can of STP
It ran really good with regular tune up and oil change every 12,ooo miles
The graph and explanation at 11:00 is fantastic. That is the most helpful thing in the video for me, and it makes complete sense.
When the automotive industry talks about 'adequate protection' for the 'life' of the engine what they really mean is that it won't fall apart or start smoking during a cars typical life span. That does not automatically mean a different oil won't offer more protection or extend the life of the engine. I'm skeptical of claims the automotive industry make. Automatic transmissions that are 'superior' to manuals for example where they are horribly programmed and refuse to dowshift yet upshift at every opportunity because drivability was tossed out the window in favor of fuel economy.
That's exactly what I wanted to write. A manufacturer claiming "wear is not an issue"...really? You mean for 10 years after which we should buy the newest model, right? Fk that, I stay with my 5W-40 fully synthetic SynPower.
Manufacturers put thinner oil as the suggested oil to get better mpg but that of course will protect the engine less.
Cafe standards rule the day. Whats next, water 5 weight :-)
It's all about the film/shear strength of the oil. Viscosity has nothing to do with it. Take a look here: (540ratblog.wordpress.com)
@@MrDLRu I'm not going to read an article claiming viscosity _has nothing to do with it_. Viscosity is arguably the most criticsl property of a lubricating oil. VIscosity, pressure and velocity is what determines film thickness. If viscosity didn't matter, differentials would use ATF fluid.
Gotta love an automatic transmission that hits third gear at 12 mph, half throttle with the torque converter locked up paired to a 4 cylinder making 35lbft at 1100 rpm...
Loved the water skiing analogy as it relates to the piston to cylinder wall interface.....very clever !!
jet guy A human body itself would be a better example. If you hit the water tangentially at very high speed, you’ll skim on the surface. If you hit tangentially at low speed, you’ll submerge. No skill involved.
I actually remember the days of factory carburated vehicles and running a thinner oil in the winter. Good stuff and brings back positive memories.
Yes, the days of 10-30 in the summer and 5-30 in the winter along with letting the engine warm up on high idle in the winter before ‘kicking it down’.
I too am nostalgic for the stench of unburned hydrocarbons gushing from these classics! I also miss the waterbed suspension characteristics of my dad's 1967 440 CID Newport.
What did not mentioned in your video is mixing 50/50. Combining 2 quarts of 20w 50 and 2 quarts of 0W 20 on 1998 Honda Accord.
Wow, I’m a 67 year old guy who just learned some thing new! My 19 Camry uses 0 W 16 and I was wondering how could this oil protect my motor. Thank you.👍🏻
Hi Don from Don
Don Finkey, 0W oil is for new cars that have gasoline direct injection (gdi). 19 Camry use gdi so you NEED to use a 0W rated oil to avoid oil dillution issues.
It will get you through the warranty period, but if you want it to last it won't.
@@656hookemhorns It's a Camry of course it'll last lol
@@will3tm How protects a thinner oil 0w a GDI combustion chamber better than a 5w?
thank`s in advance
BimmerN53
Surprised he didn’t mention how some car manufacturers will have a graph in the owners manual telling you what viscosity to use depending on your average or ambient temperature where you live
Definitely something to take into consideration. If you are in very hot weather or extreme cold. My car uses 5W 20. Currently weather is cold mornings and evenings. Summer time its very hot round the clock and I may switch to 5W 30. Both oils are full Synthetic for my 160,000K engine.
@@z31rider24 ~ Since a few years back I have gone to Castrol 5W-40 synthetic for my now 356,400 K '99 Tahoe engine. Prior to that I had been using 5W-30 synthetic. I top up with either 5 or 10W-30 "organic" oil as I get it free at a county household hazardous waste facility.
.
They put out usable car chems and household cleaners, paint etc for take back which saves on the cost of paying Clean Harbors to take it away. I have about a dozen brand new unopened bottles of full strength anti freeze and a nice supply of Dexron 3 for the transmission. More places should have such a program tho' it is costly to run and the take away fees for "disposal" are not cheap. Large metro areas should be able to budget for this kind of environment saving measure.
True fact! I live in Houston. We RARELY have freezing temperatures, but routinely have temps over 100F in the summer, and that does change things significantly, especially with stop and go driving.
@@Rorschach1024 you’re sure about that? Does the oil temp actually get higher in ‘stop and go traffic’? Oil companies like to convince us that this is ‘severe service’ but in reality it’s not. Track days in high heat, that is severe.
@@jimstenlund6017 given that I'm in Houston where summer lasts 9 months out of the year, yeah, it most definitely gets pretty toasty.
So clear, easy to understand for an ordinary person who is not well conversant with automobile engineering principles .. thanks dear for a wonderful guide
That cut-away engine is a work of art. I would have that in my living room as a sculpture (if my wife would let me...).
I was thinking the same thing. Maybe in the bedroom. I don't want to take up any floor space in my shop.
I could stare at it for hours.
You may or may not have seen a line o type machine. They were for casting a "line of type" when newspapers were printed with melted/cast lead type. There was a period where you have them for hauling then away. I said the same thing. I'd have one in my living room for that very same reason. My wife of now 43 years would have put out a contract on me:)
@Ethan Wood I also wear the pants in the family!, and i have my wife's permission to say so!
@Ethan Wood I'm surprised your wife allowed you to comment in this way.
That demo with the grad cylinders was great. Thank you.
I’ve been trying to figure this out for years. Finally I understand, thank you!
:😂)
I never realized the bearing drop test bud. That’s awesome 👏🏾
The last few minutes explained it all simply for me to understand. Thanks.
Thing with the manufacturer recommended oil weights is that they’re universal for climate regions. They’re meant for the dead of a Canadian winter or August in Texas so you CAN fudge those numbers depending on the climate where you live, just don’t go down (ie 5w30 to 5w20). Up though, especially for the year-round “hot” climates like Texas there is absolutely no problem raising those numbers. In fact it’s probably recommended. You’ll never have the low flow cold start problems to worry about but rush hour traffic on the freeway when it’s 105*F ambient and 130*F+ on the road with your AC cranking and no airflow through the cooling system your engine will appreciate the extra viscosity.
I've seen some owners' manuals (Kia, I think) where different oil viscosities are recommended depending on ambient temperatures ranges.
I agree. I have a shop here in Hawaii and we put 10W-30 in everything. Temp never goes below 50F.
i used to work in an auto parts store back in the 70s...we had a 3rd option back then which was straight SAE 30.....some vehicles used it but oils got better over the yrs thus protecting more at the lower/start up temps AND the tighter tolerances that occurred as the engines got higher revving and more fuel efficient
Im pretty sure a 428 or 351 could run on 60w as there was so much bearing clearence in them
I've always ran Castrol 20w50, or Valvoline racing straight w50, in any of my V8s after they've gotten some miles on them. Never had a problem. And the few that I opened up and looked at after many hard miles, looked as good as they did when I assembled them.
When I was kid--back in the Stone Age--you only used straight 30W(non-detergent) oil, for about 800 miles after you re-built a diesel or gas engine, and then, once it was "broken in", you went back to the recommended SAE ratings.
My 2018 camry has a unique oil pump system , so ow -16 ( manufacturers recommended) is definitely my go to.
Some old motorcycle engines had components that were exposed and never saw any oil at all... Such as the tappets on the exposed valves of a 1930s Douglas. The metal was so glass hard that it didn't wear.
Also most two stroke engines are lubricated with petrol that has just 1/50 th part of oil in it.
(Oil Guy forums implode)
What was that noise?!?
Oh, someone said “Viscosity” on the Internet.
Bob, is that you?
catsspat Molakule has awoken from his sleep with this video lol
Too funny!
lol im on bitog right now
lol that place is so full of shills. the uoas are mostly legit though so its not without its uses
I have a 2003 Ford F250 Super Duty truck with a 5.4 motor gasoline engine. I do not use the recommended oil for my truck. I noticed if I use the recommended oil 5W-30 the motor starts to make a ticking noise. It has 366,000 miles now. I been using regular castrol gtx 20/50 for 5 years now and changing the motor oil every 2500-3000 miles. I haven tried the synthetic 20/50 motor oil and my trucks engine makes a ticking noise with that one too. I am surprised how great it sounds just with the regular 20/50 castrol gtx oil. This truck does not want to give up yet. Amazing truck!
Used Mobil Oil in industrial oilfield engines since the 1960s, great performance, worth every cent.
Oil lubricates the engine
Dodge 5.7 camshafts and lifters left the chat.
6.4s too, we just lost one at 40k miles. Horrible design failure!
@@gwmier My 6.4 is going to the dealer with lifter tick at 10k
@@Salty_reviews damn!
This is why I'll never buy a Hemiroid
@@gwmier it's terrible. Dodge probably wishes there was a -5W16 oil or something lol
As a sales person in a parts store, I can tell you it's very frustrating and cringeworthy when someone comes in and wants 20-50 for their everyday driven 4 cylinder Honda/Toyota, etc. This happens often. I always recommend sticking to what's marked on the oil cap.
As the engine gets older and begins using oil the higher hot weights help prevent seal leakage.
When you put 20-50 in your Honda engine you’re just experimenting, not knowing the outcome.
When the mileage is high , try high mileage oil . They have additives designed for these engines .
@@billsmith2212 or try straight Bardahl or STP oil additives in smokers and high milers. Even today you can get a 90's foreign car or van for $500 and keep it running. I've done it for years ever since our avionics tech showed me he ran his V8 Chev pickup (vintage about 1970's) on non-detergent 30 weight oil.
I went him one better and drained all the oil and run straight STP (or Bardahl if I can ever find it anymore.
The only caution is NEVER rev it cold- it's like molasses when cold.
@@billsmith2212 Or change it more often..
Absolutely superb. Quite possibly the best explanation of how important the correct grade of oil is that I have ever seen. Looking forward to watching more.
Today engines run on anti friction bearings so very limitless oil is needed to lubricate them.
And yet theres still ***** out there putting thicker oil cuz they think this improves the lifespan of their engine 🤦♂️
Best explanation I ever had!! Thank you !!
Did your homework man, glad to see someone telling the right things
You truly are the best! Deep knowledge explained in vocabularies that are easy to understand. Captivating presentation too! Really appreciate your sharing of information!
Very interesting! I better be careful with using modern oils in some of my older vehicles, although as stated a slightly lower winter or higher summer number isn't as bad as going the opposite way. Thanks for the info.
One grade up or down doesn't hurt engine in long run depending upon ambient temperature
Thanks .for that like always you take a very complicated subject and bring it down to a level where we can understand. That was very clear. Thank you.
Glad to see you've come this far. Great content still. I'm basically falling asleep at night to it because of my curiosity and I'm enjoying the education, regardless of me already working on my own car
Over 35 years ago, I was studying electrical engineering in Kingston UK. We were lucky enough to have two lecturers with a boundless depth of subject knowledge and were equipped with the means to communicate that knowledge. I said at the time that as students we were enjoying a charmed education. Your presentation and communication skills mirror those days. Fantastic! Oh! And one more thing, thanks. Mike. RIP Tom S.
Hello, everyone. What are your thoughts on mixing Marvel Mystery Oil with synthetic 5w30 motor oil? Marvel recommends replacing up to 20% of your engine oil with MMO, but MMO is a lubricant with a thin viscosity and would seemingly lower the 5w30. Does this mean that MMO would harm an engine that specifically calls for 5w30?
@@hazwell6811 I personally never mess with these great oils. They perform so well, something like MMO can't improve it and would likely degrade the oils performance. Snake oil isn't real oil.
part of the issue of changing viscosity is also the oil pumps flow rate and pressure relief valve. if you use a thinner oil then you could end up with low oil pressure at low revs. if you use thicker the pressure relief valve will bypass and reduce the flow around the engine.
Will this really make a difference in fuel use.
Wrong, bypass functions on pressure differential not absolute pressure.
Loved this video. Did MOBILE ONE mention that the price of gas has gone down and the cost of oil has almost doubled in the last year.
Whenever I see you I run catching my notebook . So much details so much learning. Thanks a lot.
Thanks for the last 5 mins of this video. it answered many questions!
The best aspect of this presentation is clarifying that the two parts of the multigrade designation are not about WInter vs. Summer (although I think that was the origin of the 'W'), but Cold Startup vs. Hot Operating.
HOWEVER, there's a catch with manufacturer's recommended viscosity. When running the EPA fuel economy test they look for every possible legal edge to improve the results (because marketing). One of those tricks is to test drive with thinner than optimum oil viscosity. BUT, they are then legally obliged to make that grade their official published recommendation (i.e. your owners manual). That is why I don't worry about running slightly thicker in summer. My OM recommends 0W-20 and I have no concerns running 0W-30 in summer.
Hi Jason, i followed you for 7-8 years and learned so many things that Schools don't teach, as for Mobil 1 Synthetic i can say its one of the best engine oil on earth and proven by my own tests. i've been using "Mobil 1 Syn engine oil" for 20 years on my 2001 Toyota Solara 3.0L V6 for around 20 years before i gave up the car. The car was rusted and toning apart but the Engine still runs perfect smooth and strong with 0 Problem ! no noise nothing, Rod bearings still in good shape.
This 3.0L Toyota Engine you can find it in the Camry and Lexus ES350 introduced in the mid 90s, now i've jumped from Toyota 3.0L engine to Lexus 3.5L engine and still using "MOBIL 1 Syn Engine oil" for 8 years now its smooth and quiet like new Engine from Lexus Factory.
People asked me how ??
I have talked about Mobil 1 synthetic in the last 15 years since RUclips or Forum has a few video/post online and Real Life...some trusted me some don't !
1. I do car mods and race in the 90s
2. Change engine oil every 5k miles ( i maybe the first or the second who done this )
3. I've used Thicker Oil when my car mileages is high !
( For example : Toyota 3.0L Engine suggested 5W-30, i used 10W-30 when my mileages reached over 150k miles.) One of the Toyota Engineer told me this, back in the 90s, he also told me if I lived in North America like US-Canada, use Mobil 1 Synthetic engine oil.
So bottom line is, Toyota/Lexus V6 Engine + Mobil 1 synthetic oil = God Mode !
Let’s talk about oil filter bypassing as viscosity goes up.
Some old engines don't have a filter. You just change the oil more frequently.
Or idle oil pressure drop as viscosity goes down. Thank Berg for high volume pumps.
Some old engines are.... Just shut the hell up.
@@FixingWithFriends some old engines are started using a shotgun cartridge.
@@adamkendall997
Some old engines are.......just old ?
"You should always, always, always"
Me: Haha. Lucas oil treatment goes glug.
Well, Ford called for 10w40 when it designed the engine in my truck, revised it to 10w-30 when my truck was built, and reverted to specing 0w-20(!) for CAFE credits in the aughts. What oil am I "supposed" to use? (FWIW, I run Rotella 10w30, with an extra splash of ZDDP in my 300" inline 6.)
@@bcubed72
Use the grade Ford recommends for the specific year. It's likely their manufacturing tolerances improved over time, so internal engine tolerances got tighter. Longevity is maintained, while efficiency is improved. It's one of the 'lengths manufacturers go to' discussed in the video.
I guess ZDDP is some kind of 'oil improver'. That type of product is a waste of money, IMO. Some people will freak out and vehemently disagree, but I stand by that statement. Serious oil makers (i.e Mobil One), like engine makers, are not leaving anything on the table. If there is real benefit to be gained from an additive, it's in there.
@@bcubed72 That's a trick question. It's a 300 straight six, you can put any oil whatsoever into it and it will never die.
@@michaellorenson2997 shows how much you know. They were putting it in there until the epa told them not to.
If you have a classic vehicle, you may want to change the oil spec since technology has moved on so much but it has to be done carefully.
Look his smile he enjoys informing people awsome man
Dear Jimbo, I love watching you do ‘stoopid stuff’!
I recently purchased a used 2017 Honda Fit automobile and was surprised that the engine oil spec'd in the owner's manual for my area (northeast USA) is 0W-20. That thin of an oil runs against my thinking..but I have to trust that the engine was designed for that weight oil. My 1992 Corvette with LT-1 engine is spec'd to use 5W-30 synthetic only..and I was surprised at that weight (but not surprised spec'd for synthetic only). It's amazing to me that modern automobile engines are spec'd for lower weight/viscosity oils..used to be I routinely added a pint of STP oil additive when I did oil changes myself but that was years ago for small block V-8 engines. Now I get oil/filter changes done at a local garage they always put in the oil spec'd by the manufacturer I have to trust that is best for the engines.
Thank you for doing all the footwork, EE. I have often wondered about these lubrication questions.
3:31..Q Jet baby! Easily the coolest sounding secondary howl ever!
With a 2 1/4" secondary and 850 CFM w 1 3/8" primary. The air door spring can be adjusted for peak power or response. Also sound. Very tunable carb. to get what you need.
I've seen technicians at dealership using 0w-20 oil for cars that are supposed to use 0w-30 in tropical weather. I looked up the manual and it specifies that 0w-20 is supposed to be used on cold weather and winters and not for summer / tropical weather. So always lookup in the owner's manual. The oil gets thinner when the operating temp gets higher. If you drive your car hard then please select the heaviest weight oil specified in your owner's manual.
Read my posts above. 0W-20 is for Nome AK in January.
Going to be honest, unless you plan on keeping it a half a million miles or racing hard events it's not going to make much difference for the average owner to put only a 10 weight difference from the manual.
@@R3APER50 Disagree... but in a positive way 👍 All this new BS recommendation for 0W-20 or even 5w-30 in warm climates shortens the life of rhd motor A LOT vs 10-40. I run 10-40 with STP in the summer, and 0W-40 with STP in the winter. 0W-20 is for friggin Nome AK from December 1 - April 15, and sure as hell isn't for ANY warmer climate - but they "recommend" it because they know people expect a motor to only last
Let's not forget how they call this oil reverse comparable. Which is not true. Plus they have removed most of the zddp because of the I'll effects it has on emission control devices.
Ya I usually run 10w 30 on out 5w 30 vehicles sometimes going into winter I'll get 5w 30 but I live in Central Texas so it's fine
Dear you have explained so well in a very lucid manner , all doubts solved
Long story short: as long as the oil is thick enough to provide oil pressure that's high enough to make sure there's no metal to metal contact, it's thick enough. Any thicker is wasted energy at best and accelerated wear at worse since the excessively thick oil can't flow well enough.
I ruined my Passat engine by adding in some 15w-50 the oil couldn't flow through the VTech valve and caused my cam shaft to seize ... I don't think I have to explain what happened next original oil called for 5w-40
Goldilocks oil.
Bryan Jaime at least you’re open about your mistake and you’re not afraid to speak about it. Others are still repeating the same mistake over and over again.
That's basically true for rod and crank bearings but oil does a LOT more than that these days (and even in the past). I suspect a Chrysler Hemi could hold pressure just fine on 0w-16 but I bet the roller lifters would be junk in no time flat.
But if it's too thick to flow nominally it won't cool properly. Which is the other important thing..
"how cool is that engine" man, that finish they put on the steel is so enticing. I wish i could touch it.
Engineering Explained is great for snow storm days. I can’t put this guy away.
You should clarify that many world market engines specify a broad range of both cold and hot viscosities based up temperature and use (not just track).
Cool video ! Had an Audi Q5 3.2 v6 gas, took 0w-40, above average mpg for that much v6, ~ 23-24mpg. Now got '19 VW Tiguan AWD, takes 0W-20 and again I average way more than the stated mpg, 30+mpg. Awesome, I'll take it :D
The real question is: can a high mileage car run on the same oil grade than the one when it was new?
Do climate play a role in oil viscosity?
Yes, climate plays a huge role in oil viscosity. Hot climates like in the southernmost states of the United States don’t often or continuously stay at or below freezing so thin oils are not needed for cold start flow. The thin oils are for the subzero winter dwellers anyways. But summertime temperatures are much higher thereby increasing engine operating temperatures and oil temperatures, especially if one commutes in high population density metropolitan areas where traffic is a common hinderance. With old engines, if it’s a properly maintained system bearing wear should still be minimal even after 100,000 miles. Bearing clearances are what affect oil pressure the most so as long as those remain good thicker oils will do nothing to extend engine life. Cylinder wear isn’t really an issue on modern fuel injected engines unless, again, the vehicle’s maintenance history is just abysmal. But cylinder/ring wear is what usually causes oil consumption but with worn bearings or worn cylinders thick oils are just a bandaid over an amputation, they won’t save your engine, they may not even buy you time. They just make you feel better until the inevitable happens. Should’ve changed the oil on time and used a quality filter.
I would only run thicker oil if it burns it. Thats the only thing Lucas Oil Stabilizer is good for, smoky tailpipe, and people put it in perfectly good engines for some reason.
Agree 115k on my engine and switched oil from a 5/30 to 5/40, with a Lucas oil stabiliser, runs so much better and doesn't burn through it 🤷🏼♂️, live in Scotland also
@@coryholbrook4643
Nice
@@coryholbrook4643 question. I have a 2002 Chevy Avalanche with 183k miles on it. In the summer months im using 10w40 and in the cold months 10w30. Should I drop to a 5w40 in the cold months based on the info you and the video provided and keep using 10w40 in the summer?
Great analysis. I would have liked to have seen some analysis for race/endurance engines on recommended race oil as I have a new C8 and I plan to enter some endurance race events where the engine will be operating at or near max RPM for 45 minutes to an hour. I have used 20-50 race oil in the past in other races in other cars.
Thanks for the video. The EPA is ruining the ICE. For example, take my 2.0T Honda Accord. 0W-20 is the spec for North American vehicles. However, other parts of the world call for 5W-30. Additionally, fuel dilution is a major issue with Direct Injection engines, like mine. The thinner the oil, the more damage fuel do to the oil. These long intervals are a nightmare for long term internal damage to a motor because of that. I'll be running 5W-30 on 5,000 mile OCIs from now on, on all of my Honda engines.
0w is better for starts. Cold or not cold.
Many engines are speced for thicker oil in countries with no CAFE standards. The oil passages are Not smaller on these engines that spec thin oil in the US. Not sure who keeps perpetuating this myth.
In reference to CAFE ICE vehicles & Non-CAFE ICE vehicles...Are there any differences any where along the lines outside of oil passages though...? as in emissions things downstream in the exhaust track. @@wolfeadventures
@@loseerich493 nothing requiring thin oil.
It’s amazing how these manufacturers are able to protect engines with such low-viscosity oil.
nice supra :p
And worrisome... Good old thick oil in cast iron blocks will outlast any modern mini rattler
@@johngoe420 That’s just not true...
Maybe, just maybe... An oils viscosity is not the only factor that determins how good of a lubricant it is? Perhaps a modern 0W40 is much better at taking pressure without breaking the film, than an old mineral based SAE 80 oil... It's almost like there has been, and is continous development of lubricating oils...
@@johngoe420 Lol nah
Its funny how most people are so quick to take the advice of a friend who heard from a mechanic that doing _____ will give your car more power/reliability/efficiency. But refuse to believe what is written in the official service manual from the people who designed the thing!
Yeah, listen to the engineers.
Just like the waaaay out-of-date 3K oil change interval "recommendation." Not needed anymore! And for drivers who still want to do it and claim "Well, it's cheap insurance" then for less than the price of an oil change you can send a sample of your oil in for an analysis when you hit the 3K mark. You will then know forever and ever whether you should be changing it at 3,000 miles.
It could be because the mechanics have to fix the engineers mistakes.
Sometimes the owners manual or service manual is wrong (no longer the best) and third parties have verified an alternative works better, especially if dealing with cars that are 20-30 years old and technology has improved
Engineers are human also and far from perfect. Also new models are always coming so not enough time to "perfect" the engineering time to move onto the next model
Good description.
I use a 0 w 50 in a special build where. I have .
Also sheer temperatures are near 300F for mobile 1 , as well as sheer strength. Where others measure viscosity , not mention flim strengths.
Outstanding presentation. I have a much better understanding. You are very clear and precise.
I use a 0w instead of the recommended 5w on my car, but I live in Canada 🇨🇦. So the 0w is definitely better in -30 celsius.
Like how turbo BMW owners here in ZA tend to use 5W40 instead of the 5W30 that BMW sells. Because of the heat of the turbo (and out climate), the thinner oil tends to break down more easily.
I"m the opposite ! I live in Arizona, supposed to be 48 C here today . I worry about 0w20 oil protecting my engine here. But my car is 4 years old with 100,000 km and runs like new. So I guess its doing its job !
@@zonie1953 you could go with 0w-30 in that case
The thinner the base oil, the higher the loss of evaporation (with the same quality). keep that in mind.
Your engine will explode any second. 💥
Wife's 2016 Odyssey calls for a 0w-20 oil and was consuming a good bit after 120k miles. I swapped to 5w-30 and it runs much better and didn't notice any decrease in MPG.
Take a look at 10/40 Liquid moly motor oil. You can RUclips Mercedesource Kent says its great oil for high mileage engines and thats what he prefers in high mileage Mercedes. Type in Kent Bergsma and Liquid Moly oil.
Cuz of the wear n tear from miles ova time, good job
Thank so much for making such clear sense of oil viscosity! It’s crazy to think I’ve been wrenching on cars for almost 30 years and I’m just now understanding what the numbers actually mean. The main reason I wanted to know is because I just had my first complimentary oil change done on my 2022 Hyundai Elantra N. The dealership put in 0W-20 when the manual calls for 0W-30. After calling a different Hyundai dealership and Hyundai Customer Care, they all confirmed despite what my owners manual says, they can put in either 0W-20, 0W-30 or 5W-40. Needless to say I was both confused and concerned. I had a Hyundai tech on one of my FB groups insisting that’s not true and I should only be using 0W-30 like the manual says. Long story short I now understand the difference between the oils and will be draining the 0W-20 and filling it back up with 0W-30 ASAP.
20 years working on cars and you didn't know what those numbers meant? Really?
@@severnsea3924he never got paid to do it likely..
Run 5w40. It's only for fuel efficiency sacrificing longevity of your engine.
@@scottp6761 The video says just the opposite.
@@rastapete100 if you use thinner oils be my guest. I run 5w40 Valvoline premium blue in all my cars. Diesel or gas. Best oil in the world next to Amsoil
Climate plays a major role in oil selection. If you live in Chicago, extremely cold starts are normal in winter. A lower "W" number can save your engine, and allow for faster warm up. But, if you live in Los Angeles, winter freezing are not an issue. During sustained driving on long freeways, and highways, and especially long trips through desert conditions, means your high end viscosity can become critical. It is always smart to allow warm ups before driving after long cold nights. Change your oil before it begins to break down. This keeps internal dirt, tar, and debris to a minimum. Always use better brand filters!
Love this channel. I hardly ever have further questions after watching any of his vids. He seems to answer what you may be thinking.
Always well explained, thank you!
Mazda recommends 0W-20 for my engine. For the same engine, in Italy Mazda recommends 5W-30. Why? I suspect 5W-30 is a better oil for this engine and there are no CAFE requirements in Europe.
I was waiting for you to discuss oil shear in race/ track scenarios.
I had a big argument last week about this
Most people want thick oil
But they dont understand that thick oil cant previde lubrication when cold and thin oil can go between those tiny gaps that modern cars have now.
Just use the oil the what the manufacture recommand
unless it has piston slap. 2 quarts of used diesel oil shut the 4.0 up in a 99 WJ pretty good lol. that thing slapped more than my 7.3 idi before. ended up selling it to a friend who drove it for 2 more years with no issues, other than the CPS.
What if your manufacturer specifies you can use thick or thin oil? Like an engine that can take 0W-20 or 5W-30? Or 5W-30 vs 10W-30? If both are specified, there should be no harm to the thicker one.
@@Unb3arablePain Sometimes manufacters use different grades of oils in different markets. The same car uses 0w-20 or 5w-30. In EU mazda recommends 0w-20 and outside Europe 5w-30. I asked some technicians at the garage and they said with the 0w-20 the engine burns some oil, advise was to use 5w-30 with a small increase in fuel consumption.
@@frostbite1991 Well, if it's worn out, you can do that. I'd still use the lowest cold viscosity I can find. When it's cold the actual viscosity number is not that different. It's much less about the thickness than the film strength.
@@cosmin10b
Some manufacturers actually provide ambient temperature vs. suitable viscosity charts, though sadly some of them can be outdated due to using mineral and semi synthetic oil instead of full synthetic oil as their basis. For instance, my car's owner's manual says 5W-30 and 5W-40 are too thin for my driving conditions but in reality, I have run full synthetic versions of both viscosities with excellent results. The manual recommends 10W-30 for my particular engine variant but in reality, modern 0W and 5W full synthetic oils work extremely well as long as the warm viscosity is 30 or 40.
Finally found a video on this topic, thank you
Sir you are brilliant, love to hear you talk.
Very informative and well done, thanks!
I've found that using thinner oils results in moderate oil consumption.
When I use 5W30 my 4 cyl car uses no oil between 5000 miles OCI.
Using 5W20 the same engine is about 1/2 qt low by 5000 miles.
The engine has 45,000 miles.
Mix em
Keep using 5-30. I switched for different reasons: 4.6 Ford V8 chain guide will fail early on 5-20. That got my engine going smooth to 215k before selling it with zero problems. Listening to smart a mechanic is always better than one that says 'always do what the manufacturer says'. Also, transmission fluid needs changing: unlike what the manufacturer says!
You should be changing your oil at 3000 miles regardless of what the oil manufacture claims the oil can protect to no matter how good the oil is or how good your oil filter is the oil can not remain clean past 3000 mile or 3 months which ever comes first
@@victorypledge3262 Good advice if you like to waste money or own an oil change shop. It depends on the engine and where and how you drive it. Oil coming out after 6,000 in one car can look like new while coming out of another at 3,000 can be dark and saturated with contaminants.
Of course it's going to consume because you are running a thinner oil at operating temperature which is probably slowly seeping into your combustion! I guess he didn't say it enough. Run what the OEM recommends.
“ALWAYS use manufacturer specified oil viscosity”
Everyone in the comments-
“Nah...”
@Johnny Tyronne I think the company is trying to tell you 5w30 is just as recommend as 5w20 and they hope you choose 5w30 because, "forget the 1/10 of a mile" you might save with 5w20, it's the heat they want to quell because heat kill cars.
Thin oil - heat
Car company want to use thin oil luring customer with 0.01 more mileage
But reality is wear and tear
Stick to old world grades like 10 40
@@SY27196 or choose other option that your car can use.
@@SY27196 well, if 10w40 is an option you can use it. My oil cap has 5w20. The manual has 5w20 and 5w30 listed in the same temp range and 10w30 when it's "warmer" out. I jumped to 5w30 just now, at 55k.
The cars manual only states vw 505 specification. Which is better to use 5w30 or 5w40? My car has high mileage.
gm changed recommendation on at least the 6 liter chevy from 5w to 0w in general most wear is at start up and going to a 0w always gives better start up oil flow. Do keep the hot number the same with the exceptions mentioned or in hot weather states in the summer, trailer tow etc where going up will help
Absolutely correct, my car recommends 5w-30, but in Michigan during winter I swap to 0w-30 to help with cold start wear 🤙🏻👏🏻
For some reason I found myself running 0W-40 all year round.
@@Scotford_Maconochie turns out it will work better - 10 W40. Lol, I need to change oil in the middle of winter one time around 0 degree celsius. I am not very impressive how the 0W floor. So, I put on 30 mind block heater once the night time temp drop below - 5 degree celsius.
I find myself hating my car during the winters in Michigan. I dread going out there to start it, cringing everytime hoping it starts. But I’ll be giving it a try to a 0w-30 for that reason.
林振华 . I remember changing oil at -15C and watching the 5w30 slowly "pour" out. Makes me wish I was using 0w.
I had a bottle of 10w30 and out of curiosity I wanted to see what that was like, the differences are more than I expected.
Put an electric hydraulic pump and heater
Back in the day when I was a Ford tech, Ford training classes always stressed that 90% of engine wear happens at cold start. So they want an oil that will come up to pressure quickly when started.
Have a FORD 500 and a dealership (not FORD) who sold the car had an oil change deal. The car calls for 5w20 but they’ve been using 5w30. I noticed the gas mileage is bad. Have they been hurting the engine? It also smells like burnt rubber after driving.
@@mem1701movies Hi Matt: Ford 500? what year, miles? However changing the oil from 5W20 to 5W30 is not going to cause the issues you mention. The car has other issues that need to be looked into. But making a slight change in oil grade is something that is not even noticeable. Nevertheless if memory serves me correctly the Ford 500 is notorious for poor fuel economy. Keep a close eye on the trans. Being a CVT I saw many failures of these.
Interesting. I would not have guessed it to be that high. Therefore, would engine oil warmers help decrease long term maintenance costs for all engines in cold climates?
@@winnebagus4476 I do believe that would be a help in cold climates. To what degree it would decrease start-up engine wear I'm not sure. Sounds like a good place to get a multimillion dollar gov't grant to find out though (-;
@@mem1701movies This video mentions that it is ok to increase summer viscosity, or decrease winter...
Great video. Thank you. I trust Mobile 1 in all 4 of my vehicles
very cool engine cutaway!!
I liked the ball bearing test, I really would have liked to see the 0w version of the drop test though.
Fritz Höppler would be proud
There's very little difference between 10W and 0W at 0C. 0W is able to get much colder though before thickening up too much.
@@kamX-rz4uy and at 20-30 deg Celsius, is there much dif between 10W -0W ?
@@leoyru.3361 Not much difference to the eye, which would be true for two oils very close to each other on the SAE scale. The 0W will be little less dense and flow faster but not a huge difference. As temperatures rise it will be more dependent on the non-W number. It would have been interesting to see it compared to an SAE 60 oil.