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My theory is that when Cloud, Aerith and the others defeated the arbiter of fate it caused a butterfly effect where every action made by whispers before were nullified and thus the world where the chains of fate were broken forever was created. This theory fits with the devs statement of Cloud's party following the og story but Zack's story being completely new take. I think the events of og ff7 happened in this new world, but differently and the outcome was also different. Cloud was never part of Avalanche, Tifa and Barret somehow met Aerith earlier than in og, Shinra dropped the plate, Aerith saved Marlene and they had that *moment* where Marlene saw a glimpse of future including Aerith's death. Aerith gets captured by Shinra. Tifa, Barret, Jessie and Wedge tried to save Aerith from Shinra HQ. They managed to rescue Aerith and also Red XIII but Jessie and Wedge both die at Shinra HQ. Tifa, Aerith, Barret and Red XIII escape from Shinra HQ but their escape was cut short by this weird tornado at Midgar highway. Tifa, Barret and Red die. Aerith survives but she is critically injured and is captured again by Shinra. Zack arrives to sector 5 slums and sees this shinra news report where shinra troops are taking dead bodies of Tifa, Barrett and Red away and he notices injured Aerith in Shinra helicopter. Zack leaves mako poisoned Cloud to Elmyra and breaks into Shinra HQ, saves unconscious Aerith and brings her back to Elmyra. Back at Elmyra's place Marlene tells Zack about that vision she had when Aerith saved her before the plate fell in sector 7. Zack learns that Sephiroth is alive and he is planning to kill Aerith in the forgotten capital. This is just my theory but it makes the most sense imo.
I am pretty sure Sephiroth is either completely controlling the whispers or in some other way using them as a tool to achieve his goal. Sephiroth clearly has knowledge of the events of the original game, he knows he lost and seems to have a plan how to win this time around. But for his plan to work, he needs to be able to predict when and how certain events will happen, which is ensured by the whispers intervening whenever there is a risk of big events happening different way.
Great thoughts here. I like the idea of two realities contained to Midgar. I do wonder if the reason we haven’t seen scenes beyond it is because we haven’t met characters beyond it that we care about yet, it would know the difference in their fates. You’ve given me a lot to ponder
Yeah it's very possible we just haven't seen outside of Midgar yet and therefore thats the only reason we aren't seeing the "other timeline" One fun thought is what if we have seen it and just haven't realised...
I think the Whispers did create the bubble around Midgar specifically to keep Zack out. The Whispers, IMO, are not "plot ghosts" or preserving a "timeline", they have one goal: Ensure the demise of the planet, which has been its eventual fate ever since Jenova arrived. The Cetra delayed the inevitable but humanity brought the threat of Jenova back, and Armageddon is back on again... I think from the planet's perspective, there is one crucial event that could "forestall" the fate of the planet. And that is the reunion of Zack and Aerith. That is why they cannot allow Zack's soul to return to Midgar, and why they desperately want to ensure his fate remains sealed. Sephiroth drew the whispers surrounding Midgar, into himself, and allowed Cloud to destroy them, thus breaking that barrier. And allowing Zack's soul to return to Midgar (where the "white" half of Sephiroth) wants him to go, rather than go back to the heart of the planet where (Jenova wants him to go.) And the reason for this may be explained with Rebirth. Aerith will "follow the yellow flowers" (translation: reunite with her lover) when she returns to the lifestream. Much like how Zack survived his death, she will also return to Midgar, rather than go to her fate at the heart of the planet. And thus, ultimately, this is how we wind up with OG FF7's ending where Aerith randomly comes back at the end to save the day with the lifestream. Because by the end of Rebirth, she and he will both be free agents within it. I think what Mako poisoning is btw, is the influence of the Whispers on your body. Aerith says the more they touch her, the more she loses of herself. The deeper you go into the planet's heart (or the more poisoned you become from Mako), the more you lose of your identity. Until eventually you're like Jessie's dead, in a coma trapped between your body and the heart of the planet. The whispers guide souls to their end and rebirth at the heart of the planet, and they are also guiding the planet itself to its own end and rebirth (the edge of creation) with the arrival of Jenova. I think this trilogy is trying to explore the inner conflict between the good and bad in Sephiroth. The prisoner and the free agent. This is mirrored in Chadley's story btw, how he is a slave created by Hojo, but through Cloud, he breaks his programming and learns free will. I think the Remake is ultimately just explaining to us, the mystery of how Aerith's consciousness withstood dissolving into the lifestream, and how she was able to come back at the end. Both Aerith and Zack died, but even though their bodies have perished, their spirit is still fighting on in order to reunite with the other. I also think this is why Aerith has things like her song, to make the player clear about where Aerith's heart lies. And it will make it all the more heartbreaking for Cloud that she not only loses Aerith, but that she is Zack's soulmate not his.
Btw, to add onto this, and reinforce it, we have the line from Loveless. "Even if the morrow is barren of promises Nothing shall forestall my return." What this means is... Fate itself (the whispers) have stepped in to break Zack's promise of a reunion with Aerith. But even Fate or Death itself will not be strong enough to make him break that promise. Zack still finds a way back to Aerith, and she to him. He gives his honour and legacy over to Cloud upon his death, who then takes up his mantle, and destroys the Whispers, ensuring the survival of his spirit. So he did, in the end, did win that battle with the Shinra soldiers, not physically but spiritually. "To become the dew that quenches the land. To spare the sands, the seas, the skies I offer thee this silent sacrifice." The silent sacrifice Zack and Aerith both offer is their deaths, so that they can enter the lifestream (become the dew - as water is symbolic of life in FF7), and use the stream's power (of free will) against the power (of fate) that Meteor possesses. Which tips the tide and saves the planet (the sands, seas, skies.)
The merging of worlds... I think this can be ambiguous. It may mean the influence Aerith and Zack exert on the surface world of Cloud. So the summoning of the lifestream is the merging of worlds. But I think mainly, we've already seen the merging of worlds at the Edge of Creation. The white nebula which is dying, and the red nebula which is being born. And Sephioth and Cloud are standing upon Meteor which merges these two worlds together. When Meteor does its thing, the worlds merge. A planet becomes one with the cosmos and the entire lifestream dies and is reborn. The "merging of worlds" is something that the black feather Sephiroth seeks as a pawn of Jenova, and the white feather Sephiroth is trying to prevent. I also think Genesis is an interesting character for this, as his name is a synonym for Creation. So would Genesis be seeking the creation of a new world? And thus, to stop Zack and Aerith? And ensure that the worlds do merge / meteor succeeds? I think that perhaps the gift of the goddess is Meteor. The gift of slumber and rebirth. So maybe Genesis works out that he has to preserve the gift of the goddess and becomes a main villain to Aerith and Zack to overcome (as he is in Midgar and likely liberated by the Whispers dying there.) Obviously Genesis would lose this fight, but that may be why he flies off again at the end of Dirge of Cerberus, with a black wing symbolising that he is still trying to fulfil Jenova's fate.
This makes sense from a design perspective as well. Instead of two timelines where you have to recreate the entire world twice it makes more sense for them to reuse the assets from part 1 and tweak them for Zack's part of the story. I wont be surprised if all of Zack's role in Rebirth is 95% in midgar only. This is another reason i was never on board with two timelines, because i thought it was too much to make satisfying for the player. But the pocket midgar idea makes more and more sense as you think about it.
This makes zero sense from a story and design perspective. They arent connected and reusing assets from last 1, of course they will do that, that happens in games ALL the time even games that arent connected and almost never effects the story direction. If it's only Mosgar that was copied it wasn't because of a design choice. The game is over 100 gb and if you go by your logic, they already created the world for Cloud's party... why not reuse it for Zack's timeline... your own logic works against you.
@@ClassyCrustatio there hasn't been a single scene of zack outside of midgar so far in the trailers. You're leaping a lot more assuming the GB's have anything to do with a second open world that they've decided to hide in their marketing. We'll see!
There is a scene in the TGA trailer that appears to be Zack at 00:28 (timestamp of the tga trailer) and it is outside Midgar (Kalm) it also can be Cloud, but the hair looks a lot like Zack's
The same thing can be said about Nibelheim. There's one reality where it burns down, and another where no citizens have any memory of that ever happening. I wonder how that will play out in Rebirth.
This makes a lot of sense to me. If I were Sephiroth from the future, I would want a world where Aerith and Cloud are taken off the board. And in regards to Aerith, imo a comatose Aerith is less of a threat than a dead one.
Sephiroth would certainly want Aerith and Tifa out of the picture. Aerith is the biggest threat to Sephiroth so if she stays alive or in coma it would benefit him. Tifa however is the key to fix Cloud's mind so if she is dead Sephiroth can easily manipulate Cloud into his puppet. Sephiroth wants more than just kill Cloud. He wants to break him mentally and turn him into his mindless slave. However it seems Sephiroth made one small miscalculation and forgot one key element: Zack Fair.
I think it's the opposite, as far as the "bubble" is concerned. Aerith creates a bubble with the greater world at large as the contents of the bubble. The new world displaces existing Lifestream energy and causes the "dead" to walk the planet. The merging of the two worlds is the death of Aerith. When she dies the bubble collapses. What she essentially is trying to do is segregate Cloud from Sephiroth so she can summon holy but Zack's existence throws a wrench in the whole machine.
Your explanation is not simple because it requires a lot of things to ignore. For instance, Zack and Cloud are outside of Midgar not in it, then they suddenly walk into the bubble? That doesn't make sense because if your theory re correct then only the whispers covered Midgard meaning ONLY Midgar was "copied." Not the area where Zack made his last stand. 2: the whispers are around the soldiers that Zack is fighting, meaning they are there to insure Zack dies. But when the party destroys the harbinger, the whispers dissappear to go stop sephiroth in the singularity allowing Zack the ability to survive and create a separate timeline/reality (what ever you want to call it its the same thing). 3: there are 2 Midgars because The turks and Rufus are in Midgar when all of this happens, if it because a "different" or "broken" Midgar then hoe do they leave with everything being as it was in the Cliud timeline? Wouldn't that mean Cloud and Co could enter if people can leave? The implications actions of there being discrepancies would HAVE to be talked about in the rest of the world wheh theblargest mega city auddenly has peoppe alive that shouldnt be and visa versa. If there a re 2 tinelines/realities then of course there are 2 Midgars. No this wasn't intentional, because Sephiroth breaks free and all of the whispers went to address that issue. Meaning multiple timelines were created. It took me 10 seconds to think of this to debunk it.
1. So as I explained in the video, it's seemingly to do with being in the radius of the falling lights which we do see around Zack and Cloud at the end of Zacks last stand. Also yes, seemingly only Midgar was copied, but there was clearly some affect to Zack and Cloud as well. 2. The whispers were around Zack and we're assuming it was to make sure Zack dies, could've been another reason. 3. There might be two Midgars, a normal Midgar and this other Midgar, something I also question in the video. There might not be two complete timeliness again, as stated in the video. How do we know that this wasn't Sephiroths plan all along? How do we know that the whispers haven't done this as a last ditch attempt to protect the time line? We don't. So I'd probably give it more than 10 seconds
Or is it... The pocket dimension (fantranslation, more literal is "singularity") in the sky that the world ender is fought in, where a replication of Midgar (where every replication has no people in it) that once the world ender is defeated by the Turks in before crisis, they are launched all over the world. In ff7 rebirth, it could be Zack doesn't die in September 17th because whispers are spinning around. The quote translated from the Japanese trailer in place of feeling every bullet is a complaint about how windy it was as a whisper zips in front of the bullet. Anyway. Zack lives, arrives sometime September to October. October 2nd, before crisis, a Cissinei that doesn't believe the report of Zack dying insists on going to the church, ends up being attacked by the avalanche old guard and some anti soldier Ravens. Fuhito makes a big move, takes over some areas which also affects sector 5 and tries to summon the Zirconiade by knocking out Elfe. A pocket dimension (singularity) forms in the sky. The Zirconiade, also nicknamed the World Ending summon as its task is to genocide all life to return it to the LifeStream in preparation for a planetary Rebirth (huh, where did we hear that before? Hmmm) is summoned and in before crisis killed, forever risking the doom and damnation of the planet. In retaliation Jade weapon is launched and killed the night of the reactor 1 bombing. Killing the Zirconiade in the singularity launches the Turks in exile all over the world. If Zack happens to participate he'll be launched with them and will take a while to get back to Midgar, leaving Cloud all alone likely with the Buster Sword to perform everything we saw with ff7 Remake, especially with the absence of a dead Zack advising him in all the places Nomura said are definitelu Zack speaking to Cloud in the OG in the midgar section; in Zack's absence future Sephiroth is free to tug on cloud's heartstrings to pull him to the dark side.
If this is the case im worried it over complicates the story, if we have to not just work against these three worlds but add pocket dimensions to that....eehhh
@MoogleMom Actually it massively simplifies the story. One world, one ongoing, altered timeline All it is is "3 months earlier". This happened Before Remake did. Zoom. Today. Done. If anything, Dirge effectively tells us the big event in Remake happened in the future... and remake showed us it happened in the past. The whispers are described as moving "now, before and after through all points in time." They surrounded Midgar in Before Crisis, and the singularity burst raining glitter down. They surrounded Midgar in Dirge, Reeve describes them in detail for a five minute long cutscene, spending 3 minutes on describing how every night there's been the howling and screaming of a thousand souls surrounding the Shinra building, expanding outward throughout Midgar, and always at the same times of day and night. (Before Crisis/Zack's event, day. Remake, motorcycle, night). When Dirge ends, a singularity bursts, and glitter rains down. Remake happens. It ends, a singularity bursts, and glitter rains down. Advent children happened. We don't see a singularity, but every time the singularity reflects what is shown in Advent. Sephiroth is defeated, he bursts into the air...and it rains glitter. Seems to be an ongoing trend. (Also, a funny thing: If you watch Bugenhagen's planetarium scene in the ORIGIANL game... you can see the singularity there, the cinematic showcases half a dozen asteroids getting sucked up into it. It's the same one.)
So I've seen a couple of people say this but I can't recall when we've seen either Marlene or Elmyra. I mean we've seen them both in trailers but only in Midgar, so nothing to suggest they're in both timeliness, unless I missed something!
This similar lan battle network exe beast gotten into that old build get meet colonetial actual see holograms scientists walking building yup this second chapter
What if…. Zack is very much not alive…. And what he sees and his location is a manifestation of the lifestream… he’s wishes and where he ultimately wanted to reach. That would not only respect the OG but also add to it. At the end also give us a new shocking scene where he realizes he’s actually dead.
Impossible. 1. The devs said that Zack is 100% alive. 2. Elmyra, Kyrie and Marlene are alive. They can't be in lifestream. 3. Jessie and Wedge are dead in Zack's world. If this world is in the lifestream then they should be part of it but we know that is not the case.
@@NordicWiseguy true. That would need a different explanation. Nothing is really impossible in a story like this tho… we just don’t know the explanation yet. Zack is 100% not alive in the groups timeline tho. That is more than clear.
@@dangy785 Yes. Zack is dead in remake world. My theory is that the ending of remake created a butterfly effect that nullified every action that whispers had ever made and it created an alternative world where the chains of destiny are now forever broken. This would line up with the devs statement that Cloud's party will follow og story but Zack's story is entirely new.
@@NordicWiseguy I wonder. If reviving any previously dead character would be a good idea. Since those deaths had an impact on players who played the games before and remember the stories for the impact they caused. Let’s see what ends up happening. Really excited for it regardless.
@@dangy785 I like that Zack is back. When you really think about it in a way Aerith saved Zack's life in remake and it seems Zack is now saving Aerith's life in his own world. It's like poetry. My guess is that Cloud's party will go through the og story, Aerith dies etc but in Zack's world things go wildly different. Zack saves Aerith from Sephiroth, Cloud turns into Sephirot's puppet because Tifa is dead and she is not there to fix Cloud's mind and Zack has to kill him and finally these worlds will merge into one. World 2 Zack and Aerith will meet World 1 Cloud and his party and they will join forces against Sephiroth. Aerith 1 is in the lifestream and saves the planet from meteor wheres Aerith 2 helps the party defeating Sephiroth. In the end these merged worlds will separate permanently, Zack and Aerith will say their goodbyes to Cloud and the others and they return to their own world and live together. I think these worlds will become like mirrored versions of themselves. *World 1* Cloud (alive) Tifa (alive) Aerith (dead) Zack (dead) *World 2* Cloud (dead) Tifa (dead) Aerith (alive) Zack (alive)
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There is also Kyrie & Aerith mom who is both alive and awake. You see them interact with Zack in previous trailer
Giant gash in sky… seems kinda broken…
Thats just RGB 👀
My theory is that when Cloud, Aerith and the others defeated the arbiter of fate it caused a butterfly effect where every action made by whispers before were nullified and thus the world where the chains of fate were broken forever was created. This theory fits with the devs statement of Cloud's party following the og story but Zack's story being completely new take.
I think the events of og ff7 happened in this new world, but differently and the outcome was also different. Cloud was never part of Avalanche, Tifa and Barret somehow met Aerith earlier than in og, Shinra dropped the plate, Aerith saved Marlene and they had that *moment* where Marlene saw a glimpse of future including Aerith's death. Aerith gets captured by Shinra. Tifa, Barret, Jessie and Wedge tried to save Aerith from Shinra HQ. They managed to rescue Aerith and also Red XIII but Jessie and Wedge both die at Shinra HQ. Tifa, Aerith, Barret and Red XIII escape from Shinra HQ but their escape was cut short by this weird tornado at Midgar highway. Tifa, Barret and Red die. Aerith survives but she is critically injured and is captured again by Shinra. Zack arrives to sector 5 slums and sees this shinra news report where shinra troops are taking dead bodies of Tifa, Barrett and Red away and he notices injured Aerith in Shinra helicopter. Zack leaves mako poisoned Cloud to Elmyra and breaks into Shinra HQ, saves unconscious Aerith and brings her back to Elmyra. Back at Elmyra's place Marlene tells Zack about that vision she had when Aerith saved her before the plate fell in sector 7. Zack learns that Sephiroth is alive and he is planning to kill Aerith in the forgotten capital.
This is just my theory but it makes the most sense imo.
Dio's quads extend into at least 5 different timelines
Does anyone else feel like Zack and his Cloud have been pushed forward in time because of Zack talking to post Midgar Biggs and Marlene?
There has to be some reason why the whispers collected over Midgar. So this is interesting. I'm surprised no one else has suggested this!
I am pretty sure Sephiroth is either completely controlling the whispers or in some other way using them as a tool to achieve his goal.
Sephiroth clearly has knowledge of the events of the original game, he knows he lost and seems to have a plan how to win this time around. But for his plan to work, he needs to be able to predict when and how certain events will happen, which is ensured by the whispers intervening whenever there is a risk of big events happening different way.
Great thoughts here. I like the idea of two realities contained to Midgar. I do wonder if the reason we haven’t seen scenes beyond it is because we haven’t met characters beyond it that we care about yet, it would know the difference in their fates. You’ve given me a lot to ponder
Yeah it's very possible we just haven't seen outside of Midgar yet and therefore thats the only reason we aren't seeing the "other timeline"
One fun thought is what if we have seen it and just haven't realised...
@@Sector6UK true! I simultaneously want to see more and no more til Feb 29 lol
I think the Whispers did create the bubble around Midgar specifically to keep Zack out. The Whispers, IMO, are not "plot ghosts" or preserving a "timeline", they have one goal: Ensure the demise of the planet, which has been its eventual fate ever since Jenova arrived. The Cetra delayed the inevitable but humanity brought the threat of Jenova back, and Armageddon is back on again...
I think from the planet's perspective, there is one crucial event that could "forestall" the fate of the planet. And that is the reunion of Zack and Aerith. That is why they cannot allow Zack's soul to return to Midgar, and why they desperately want to ensure his fate remains sealed.
Sephiroth drew the whispers surrounding Midgar, into himself, and allowed Cloud to destroy them, thus breaking that barrier. And allowing Zack's soul to return to Midgar (where the "white" half of Sephiroth) wants him to go, rather than go back to the heart of the planet where (Jenova wants him to go.)
And the reason for this may be explained with Rebirth. Aerith will "follow the yellow flowers" (translation: reunite with her lover) when she returns to the lifestream. Much like how Zack survived his death, she will also return to Midgar, rather than go to her fate at the heart of the planet.
And thus, ultimately, this is how we wind up with OG FF7's ending where Aerith randomly comes back at the end to save the day with the lifestream. Because by the end of Rebirth, she and he will both be free agents within it. I think what Mako poisoning is btw, is the influence of the Whispers on your body. Aerith says the more they touch her, the more she loses of herself. The deeper you go into the planet's heart (or the more poisoned you become from Mako), the more you lose of your identity. Until eventually you're like Jessie's dead, in a coma trapped between your body and the heart of the planet. The whispers guide souls to their end and rebirth at the heart of the planet, and they are also guiding the planet itself to its own end and rebirth (the edge of creation) with the arrival of Jenova.
I think this trilogy is trying to explore the inner conflict between the good and bad in Sephiroth. The prisoner and the free agent. This is mirrored in Chadley's story btw, how he is a slave created by Hojo, but through Cloud, he breaks his programming and learns free will. I think the Remake is ultimately just explaining to us, the mystery of how Aerith's consciousness withstood dissolving into the lifestream, and how she was able to come back at the end. Both Aerith and Zack died, but even though their bodies have perished, their spirit is still fighting on in order to reunite with the other. I also think this is why Aerith has things like her song, to make the player clear about where Aerith's heart lies. And it will make it all the more heartbreaking for Cloud that she not only loses Aerith, but that she is Zack's soulmate not his.
Btw, to add onto this, and reinforce it, we have the line from Loveless.
"Even if the morrow is barren of promises
Nothing shall forestall my return."
What this means is... Fate itself (the whispers) have stepped in to break Zack's promise of a reunion with Aerith. But even Fate or Death itself will not be strong enough to make him break that promise. Zack still finds a way back to Aerith, and she to him. He gives his honour and legacy over to Cloud upon his death, who then takes up his mantle, and destroys the Whispers, ensuring the survival of his spirit. So he did, in the end, did win that battle with the Shinra soldiers, not physically but spiritually.
"To become the dew that quenches the land.
To spare the sands, the seas, the skies
I offer thee this silent sacrifice."
The silent sacrifice Zack and Aerith both offer is their deaths, so that they can enter the lifestream (become the dew - as water is symbolic of life in FF7), and use the stream's power (of free will) against the power (of fate) that Meteor possesses. Which tips the tide and saves the planet (the sands, seas, skies.)
The merging of worlds... I think this can be ambiguous. It may mean the influence Aerith and Zack exert on the surface world of Cloud. So the summoning of the lifestream is the merging of worlds. But I think mainly, we've already seen the merging of worlds at the Edge of Creation. The white nebula which is dying, and the red nebula which is being born. And Sephioth and Cloud are standing upon Meteor which merges these two worlds together. When Meteor does its thing, the worlds merge. A planet becomes one with the cosmos and the entire lifestream dies and is reborn.
The "merging of worlds" is something that the black feather Sephiroth seeks as a pawn of Jenova, and the white feather Sephiroth is trying to prevent. I also think Genesis is an interesting character for this, as his name is a synonym for Creation. So would Genesis be seeking the creation of a new world? And thus, to stop Zack and Aerith? And ensure that the worlds do merge / meteor succeeds? I think that perhaps the gift of the goddess is Meteor. The gift of slumber and rebirth. So maybe Genesis works out that he has to preserve the gift of the goddess and becomes a main villain to Aerith and Zack to overcome (as he is in Midgar and likely liberated by the Whispers dying there.)
Obviously Genesis would lose this fight, but that may be why he flies off again at the end of Dirge of Cerberus, with a black wing symbolising that he is still trying to fulfil Jenova's fate.
This makes sense from a design perspective as well. Instead of two timelines where you have to recreate the entire world twice it makes more sense for them to reuse the assets from part 1 and tweak them for Zack's part of the story. I wont be surprised if all of Zack's role in Rebirth is 95% in midgar only. This is another reason i was never on board with two timelines, because i thought it was too much to make satisfying for the player. But the pocket midgar idea makes more and more sense as you think about it.
This makes zero sense from a story and design perspective. They arent connected and reusing assets from last 1, of course they will do that, that happens in games ALL the time even games that arent connected and almost never effects the story direction.
If it's only Mosgar that was copied it wasn't because of a design choice. The game is over 100 gb and if you go by your logic, they already created the world for Cloud's party... why not reuse it for Zack's timeline... your own logic works against you.
@@ClassyCrustatio
there hasn't been a single scene of zack outside of midgar so far in the trailers.
You're leaping a lot more assuming the GB's have anything to do with a second open world that they've decided to hide in their marketing.
We'll see!
There is a scene in the TGA trailer that appears to be Zack at 00:28 (timestamp of the tga trailer) and it is outside Midgar (Kalm) it also can be Cloud, but the hair looks a lot like Zack's
It's been confirmed to be Cloud just dark lighting and weird angle
The same thing can be said about Nibelheim. There's one reality where it burns down, and another where no citizens have any memory of that ever happening. I wonder how that will play out in Rebirth.
Aerith’s fake mom is alive and awake in both time lines. Also keerye that grand daughter of angel of slums.
This makes a lot of sense to me. If I were Sephiroth from the future, I would want a world where Aerith and Cloud are taken off the board. And in regards to Aerith, imo a comatose Aerith is less of a threat than a dead one.
Sephiroth would certainly want Aerith and Tifa out of the picture. Aerith is the biggest threat to Sephiroth so if she stays alive or in coma it would benefit him. Tifa however is the key to fix Cloud's mind so if she is dead Sephiroth can easily manipulate Cloud into his puppet. Sephiroth wants more than just kill Cloud. He wants to break him mentally and turn him into his mindless slave.
However it seems Sephiroth made one small miscalculation and forgot one key element: Zack Fair.
I think it's the opposite, as far as the "bubble" is concerned. Aerith creates a bubble with the greater world at large as the contents of the bubble. The new world displaces existing Lifestream energy and causes the "dead" to walk the planet. The merging of the two worlds is the death of Aerith. When she dies the bubble collapses. What she essentially is trying to do is segregate Cloud from Sephiroth so she can summon holy but Zack's existence throws a wrench in the whole machine.
Keeyre is definitely in both timelines
On media blackout but commenting because RUclips + Content Interaction
“When worlds collide”. Isn’t that what Sephiroth said? There’s evidence for and against this theory.
Yes. Sephiroth wants to merge these worlds.
Kyrie is in both versions for sure
She could be in none if you ask me haha
Your explanation is not simple because it requires a lot of things to ignore.
For instance, Zack and Cloud are outside of Midgar not in it, then they suddenly walk into the bubble? That doesn't make sense because if your theory re correct then only the whispers covered Midgard meaning ONLY Midgar was "copied." Not the area where Zack made his last stand.
2: the whispers are around the soldiers that Zack is fighting, meaning they are there to insure Zack dies. But when the party destroys the harbinger, the whispers dissappear to go stop sephiroth in the singularity allowing Zack the ability to survive and create a separate timeline/reality (what ever you want to call it its the same thing).
3: there are 2 Midgars because The turks and Rufus are in Midgar when all of this happens, if it because a "different" or "broken" Midgar then hoe do they leave with everything being as it was in the Cliud timeline? Wouldn't that mean Cloud and Co could enter if people can leave? The implications actions of there being discrepancies would HAVE to be talked about in the rest of the world wheh theblargest mega city auddenly has peoppe alive that shouldnt be and visa versa.
If there a re 2 tinelines/realities then of course there are 2 Midgars.
No this wasn't intentional, because Sephiroth breaks free and all of the whispers went to address that issue. Meaning multiple timelines were created.
It took me 10 seconds to think of this to debunk it.
1. So as I explained in the video, it's seemingly to do with being in the radius of the falling lights which we do see around Zack and Cloud at the end of Zacks last stand. Also yes, seemingly only Midgar was copied, but there was clearly some affect to Zack and Cloud as well.
2. The whispers were around Zack and we're assuming it was to make sure Zack dies, could've been another reason.
3. There might be two Midgars, a normal Midgar and this other Midgar, something I also question in the video.
There might not be two complete timeliness again, as stated in the video.
How do we know that this wasn't Sephiroths plan all along? How do we know that the whispers haven't done this as a last ditch attempt to protect the time line?
We don't.
So I'd probably give it more than 10 seconds
Or is it... The pocket dimension (fantranslation, more literal is "singularity") in the sky that the world ender is fought in, where a replication of Midgar (where every replication has no people in it) that once the world ender is defeated by the Turks in before crisis, they are launched all over the world.
In ff7 rebirth, it could be Zack doesn't die in September 17th because whispers are spinning around. The quote translated from the Japanese trailer in place of feeling every bullet is a complaint about how windy it was as a whisper zips in front of the bullet.
Anyway. Zack lives, arrives sometime September to October. October 2nd, before crisis, a Cissinei that doesn't believe the report of Zack dying insists on going to the church, ends up being attacked by the avalanche old guard and some anti soldier Ravens. Fuhito makes a big move, takes over some areas which also affects sector 5 and tries to summon the Zirconiade by knocking out Elfe. A pocket dimension (singularity) forms in the sky. The Zirconiade, also nicknamed the World Ending summon as its task is to genocide all life to return it to the LifeStream in preparation for a planetary Rebirth (huh, where did we hear that before? Hmmm) is summoned and in before crisis killed, forever risking the doom and damnation of the planet. In retaliation Jade weapon is launched and killed the night of the reactor 1 bombing.
Killing the Zirconiade in the singularity launches the Turks in exile all over the world. If Zack happens to participate he'll be launched with them and will take a while to get back to Midgar, leaving Cloud all alone likely with the Buster Sword to perform everything we saw with ff7 Remake, especially with the absence of a dead Zack advising him in all the places Nomura said are definitelu Zack speaking to Cloud in the OG in the midgar section; in Zack's absence future Sephiroth is free to tug on cloud's heartstrings to pull him to the dark side.
If this is the case im worried it over complicates the story, if we have to not just work against these three worlds but add pocket dimensions to that....eehhh
@MoogleMom Actually it massively simplifies the story. One world, one ongoing, altered timeline
All it is is "3 months earlier". This happened Before Remake did. Zoom. Today. Done. If anything, Dirge effectively tells us the big event in Remake happened in the future... and remake showed us it happened in the past. The whispers are described as moving "now, before and after through all points in time." They surrounded Midgar in Before Crisis, and the singularity burst raining glitter down.
They surrounded Midgar in Dirge, Reeve describes them in detail for a five minute long cutscene, spending 3 minutes on describing how every night there's been the howling and screaming of a thousand souls surrounding the Shinra building, expanding outward throughout Midgar, and always at the same times of day and night. (Before Crisis/Zack's event, day. Remake, motorcycle, night).
When Dirge ends, a singularity bursts, and glitter rains down.
Remake happens. It ends, a singularity bursts, and glitter rains down.
Advent children happened. We don't see a singularity, but every time the singularity reflects what is shown in Advent. Sephiroth is defeated, he bursts into the air...and it rains glitter.
Seems to be an ongoing trend.
(Also, a funny thing: If you watch Bugenhagen's planetarium scene in the ORIGIANL game... you can see the singularity there, the cinematic showcases half a dozen asteroids getting sucked up into it. It's the same one.)
Im fighting the urge to pivot back to my original Lifestream theory. I know its dumb, but everything else Ive considered feels way dumber
Glenesis did it
Maybe it’s the same like dream Zanarkand it’s the same universe of ffx
you kinda sound like Ralph Ineson
Elmyria and Marlene has been in both realities?
So I've seen a couple of people say this but I can't recall when we've seen either Marlene or Elmyra.
I mean we've seen them both in trailers but only in Midgar, so nothing to suggest they're in both timeliness, unless I missed something!
kyrie
This similar lan battle network exe beast gotten into that old build get meet colonetial actual see holograms scientists walking building yup this second chapter
What if…. Zack is very much not alive…. And what he sees and his location is a manifestation of the lifestream… he’s wishes and where he ultimately wanted to reach. That would not only respect the OG but also add to it. At the end also give us a new shocking scene where he realizes he’s actually dead.
Impossible.
1. The devs said that Zack is 100% alive.
2. Elmyra, Kyrie and Marlene are alive. They can't be in lifestream.
3. Jessie and Wedge are dead in Zack's world. If this world is in the lifestream then they should be part of it but we know that is not the case.
@@NordicWiseguy true. That would need a different explanation. Nothing is really impossible in a story like this tho… we just don’t know the explanation yet. Zack is 100% not alive in the groups timeline tho. That is more than clear.
@@dangy785 Yes. Zack is dead in remake world. My theory is that the ending of remake created a butterfly effect that nullified every action that whispers had ever made and it created an alternative world where the chains of destiny are now forever broken. This would line up with the devs statement that Cloud's party will follow og story but Zack's story is entirely new.
@@NordicWiseguy I wonder. If reviving any previously dead character would be a good idea. Since those deaths had an impact on players who played the games before and remember the stories for the impact they caused. Let’s see what ends up happening. Really excited for it regardless.
@@dangy785 I like that Zack is back. When you really think about it in a way Aerith saved Zack's life in remake and it seems Zack is now saving Aerith's life in his own world. It's like poetry.
My guess is that Cloud's party will go through the og story, Aerith dies etc but in Zack's world things go wildly different. Zack saves Aerith from Sephiroth, Cloud turns into Sephirot's puppet because Tifa is dead and she is not there to fix Cloud's mind and Zack has to kill him and finally these worlds will merge into one. World 2 Zack and Aerith will meet World 1 Cloud and his party and they will join forces against Sephiroth. Aerith 1 is in the lifestream and saves the planet from meteor wheres Aerith 2 helps the party defeating Sephiroth. In the end these merged worlds will separate permanently, Zack and Aerith will say their goodbyes to Cloud and the others and they return to their own world and live together.
I think these worlds will become like mirrored versions of themselves.
*World 1* Cloud (alive) Tifa (alive) Aerith (dead) Zack (dead)
*World 2* Cloud (dead) Tifa (dead) Aerith (alive) Zack (alive)