Why is there OSB, ZIP, and Housewrap on this house?
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- Опубликовано: 10 ноя 2022
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This is a good book. Does provide a step by step introduction to how to build things ruclips.net/user/postUgkxhgbP-6hUnXu_QRaoHgLztgsI0YF3HqR0 , also does offer some steps. Includes pictures to give you ideas for layouts and such. If you are looking for a guide, this is not exactly what you want. But if you are trying to familiarize yourself with the way that pole barn building and other out buildings, are made, then this will work just as you need it to. A few things in this book are a barn (of course), detached garage, storage building, and coops.
I can't believe Matt is reviewing a house that is less than 3 million and less than 9,000sqft. Never thought I'd see the day.
Great to see a community building something normal folks might dream of affording.
What do you consider affordable? How much would you pay for one of these?
@@publicmail2 I see reasonable size, reasonable finishes, and good thermal performance. I can't comment on property values there soecifically, but there's a huge hole in the market nationwide. Builders only want to work on 2800sqft mcmansion neighborhoods.
In our area that manifested as a pretty big gap in the market when we were looking. There were a lot of $100kish mid-1900s bungalows that needed gutting, and $400k+ monstrosities.
We ended up in a near 100 year old house that needed a lot of maintenance and updates that had been put off by previous owners. That's been it's own adventure. 🤣
With performance included.
Yeah they’re only 675k to start!
@@pj406mt I just panned through some of Bozeman... and that is the LOW end.
I feel like these two guys were defending their masters thesis for building best practices with Matt just grilling them... They certainly passed with flying colors!
Haha... yah, these builders are quite young. They built some nice homes.
Building in Bozeman MT is a whole lot harder than other places. Then again, with humidity and the southern climates you get a whole different set of circumstances. I Love watching this show and seeing what good builders do.
@@danielhochstetler4324 Why is it more difficult to build in Bozeman, MT?
@@ShikokuFoodForestmuch higher insulation r-value required. Cold climate. Additionally, the element of standing water from snow melts.
Median home price in Bozeman is around 850K... in a state that is in the bottom five of average salaries. The math doesn't compute. My Montana town has a 114K difference between what the median salary affords you and what the median home price actually is. More communities need affordable developments like these.
The financial situation you describe is much worse up north in Canada. Average home prices in Vancouver, BC CANADA, where I’m from, are $2M now. I could never afford to buy in and I’m a working professional. Offshore investors from Hong Kong, China and elsewhere drove the prices up decades ago. Gov’t action to prevent this was too little too late. I could never afford to live in the city I grew up in and I’m a scientist and Engineer. Looking at living in a small cabin in the forest up north in the deep snow. The homes in this video are lovely. Wonder the price range.
The math checks out if half of the housing is +$10 mil and the other half is sub $500,000. Similar all over the mountain west where there are multimillion dollar second and third homes for the Uber-wealthy.
@@TylerDickey1 I didn't mean that the median house price didn't check out, I meant that the low wages in Montana don't support $850,000 homes. They really don't support $500,000 homes.
@@TylerDickey1 I think what you are saying is people with a median salary can afford to buy a home IF it is less than the median home price. You are right. Just because the median price is high, does not mean people can’t afford to buy a home. There are often, but not always, homes below the median home price that are affordable. The other part of this is not everyone has a salary close to the ‘mean’ salary. It may very well be difficult for people with a salary well below the mean to buy a home below the mean home price. Depends on the market and each person’s exact salary. Can minimum-wage earners afford to buy a home? Perhaps not. There lies the real problem. If I remember statistics, 50% of the population earn less than the median salary.
I suspect these homes aren't affordable for most residents in Montana. I am guessing these homes probably would cost around $500K, considering the cost of materials. These are likely homes for people fleeing the West coast that have money, and probably are able to work remotely.
That said, we are the cusp of a another housing market crash, now that mortgage rates are over 7%. The middle class is evaporating as high wage jobs continue to disappear do to a combination of outsourcing & automation. At least 1/3 of all office jobs are going away due to automation & outsourcing. A lot of people are now stuck working multiple jobs to meet ends.
It's good to see a builder going after the affordable market with quality and design details from a core perspective that are generally reserved for the higher end of the market. Everyone deserves to have a well built home that is energy efficient and comfortable in even the coldest climates.
Taxpayers footing the bill?
@@weekendwarrior3420 From what I understand there is a major housing shortage, giving builders incentives to build homes like this instead of giant 3000+ sq ft homes makes sense, not everyone needs a 5 bedroom house
We need to see this level of craftsmanship become the standard everywhere. The efficiency and quality will make these houses extremely long-lasting and affordable in the long-term!
I doubt these homes would be considered afforable. I suspect they will sell for around $500K. I believe the market for these homes is West coasters fleeing into northern rural states to escape the taxes, crime, and other non-sense. The people buying these homes likely are tech workers that can work remotely & have six figure incomes.
It is subsidized by the gooberment. It is not affordable or sustainable. It is fantasyworld.
Finally got to see cold weather details with advanced building techniques. Absolutely loved this.
Matt, thanks for pushing the envelope and making them show us the basement.
Agreed. Best part with the erv hidden down there
Just incredible to see this level of detail and thoughtful thinking in home design on a more affordable end of the spectrum. The ultimate goal for Passive House design is that most, if not all, homes should be built to this degree of performance and air tightness. High quality and comfort shouldn't be restricted to the ultra-wealthy.
Affordable = 600k.
This is my favorite video of the year! Such a cool project, nice work!
Nice to see house construction that build details to make energy efficient
Great episode. So nice to see a builder putting the care and detail into an affordable home.
The representatives in this video are great, noble, managers of construction. So happy to see their knowledge of their project
Love it when you look at more affordable housing! Matt: from a building science perspective you might be interested in learning about the noble gasses like Argon/Krypton/Xenon (on the right side of the periodic table) and why they're used in all your windows ;) It was unintuitive to me at first why heavier gasses would be better insulators. As a bonus (and for a chuckle), check out Cody's Lab's video "Breathing all the Noble Gasses!"
Matt, what is the benefit of going this route with the Zip, insulated OSB and housewrap instead of just using the Zip-R with the insulation attached to the Zip? Also, how are corners handled when you have the insulation attached to the OSB or Zip? Thanks.
Omg the sunglasses tan line😂
Thats a working man right there.
Thats a working man right there.
I really enjoyed seeing so many stages of the builds in the works -- a lot of details were shown that I haven't seen in other videos, especially around the window bucks. Thanks to the crew for the welcome to the Build Show, and thanks Matt for sharing this great content!
So glad to see a regular house (middle class) being built to these standards!!! I'm trying to work with a modular company to modify their typical system to get us close to under 1 ACH.
Great work, I recently built a new home and had to teach my builder most of these concepts. Nice to see true professionals doing it right.
I worked in a window manufacturer, for 4 years 2015-2019, the Krypton got very popular towards the end. it's such a pain in the ass, b/c it took so long to fill the window cavity. But they said the Krypton (our engineers said its chemically heavier, therefore providing a denser barrier against the elements) idk if they were just trying to justify it too us, b/c we were production based and these slowed us down a lot. However, they guarded that Krypton like crazy, as they said it was 10x more expensive than the argon
Trying to understand why they're building this way rather than with integrated foam like a Zip-R type product... Is there cost savings? Looks like more material and labor with all the Tyvek and OSB! What am I missing?
Zip R probably doesn’t meet the wind code requirements for shear if I had to guess but I didn’t take the time to research that.
Agreed. I would assume(not a builder) that a full zip-r exterior would be much less labor than weird layers, unconditioned attics. Weaving the barrier and insulation through the structure instead of all on the exterior sounds unnecessary (especially if you watch this channel).
I could be wrong but I believe zip-r only comes in polyiso not eps, it could be for this climate they want a vapor open insulation system. Zipr has the negative also of the wrb being outboard of insulation, could be a condensing surface in this climate. Also not a builder not an expert though.
Bozeman is in a seismic zone (right next to Yellowstone) and I doubt Zip-R has the required shear strength so sheathing must be nailed directly to the studs.
Matt's all zipped up against the chill while the other guy's in short sleeves. LOL We know who's local!
Great video, Matt! Some cool production adaptions. Going with detached garages, some combined with the neighbors. Interesting.
The Radiant heat is quite common in the upper west. I have 10 units in my house. But my basement is in floor Radaint hot water with a Propane boiler. Of the 10 units I only use 3 and then only sporadically. We have a Kozy Heat Fireplace that's around 77% efficient and we burn wood to heat the main floor. Our basement is ICF's and the main floor is 2x6 construction with 1" of exterior foam and 3" of Closed Cell inside. The great room, where the fireplace is, is around 800 SF and has a lot of glass. The back of the house, bedroom, office, pantry and entry are always comfortable and we never have had to heat them other than the electric in floor (DietraHeat) in the bathroom. The radiant cove in the great room is primarily used on moderate temperature days where the fireplace would drive you out of the house. I'm considering a mini split for the great room. We rarely would benefit from AC, but it would be nice on those infrequent hot days. The Heat Pump aspect is more appealing. For a 1500 SF house that's otherwise all electric including a well pump, our annual electric runs around$1300
Those houses looked well built. Good job!
super high quality build, these houses must be super quiet 🤫 too, really nice being that close to neighbors.
Just for everyone’s information, the small little blue house with the yellow door is listed for a cool $650,000 dollars. So, not really sure I would classify this neighborhood as modestly priced.
2401 Blue Silos Way, Bozeman.
Not to mention a $200/mo HOA.
@@chrismillersr Forgive me for asking, what is HOA? $200/month?
$650K may be market value, but I wouldn’t pay $350K for it. How much of that do you figure is land value... 80%? The house is perfectly livable, just not $650K for me anyway. A first-time home buyer without financial help from their parents will likely be paying for that home for 30 years. They’ll just have it paid off when they retire.
@@ShikokuFoodForest Yeah I’m sure the location is the majority of the cost. It only comes with 0.06 acres of “land”, or right at 3,000sq feet, so, tiny lot.
@@jimyeats Hello, I’m Canadian living in southern Japan. Average residential lots here are 1500sq.ft. New pre-fab, timber-frame homes, which are the norm here, which are dried in within a few days with 10 carpenters, sell for $350~$500+K. They only use house wrap here, no ZIP sheathing. I bought a 70-year old timber-frame home on 6000sq.ft. of land for a fraction of this price 6 years ago. Planning on selling and building a cabin in Canada next year. Building science is my hobby. I’m not knocking the quality of these homes at all. They look very well built, being LEED certified, etc. I just question the value at this price point ($650K). Prices are high everywhere now, not JUST this development. Respect to these builders.
Mass production can build very affordable houses. People complain about looking the same but it's better than an apartment or a row house.
A truly inspirational video Matt! Those who know better are building better! Making the effort to put forward the best building practices at ALL housing prices points is better for our communities, our county, and the Earth.
So awesome. Love what y'all are doing
I love the Build Show. New construction techniques and materials and all the way to the screws used.
If you want to know how to really insulate a building in this northern tundra - go watch some of the cold climate institute videos about Alaska and Canada. they will blow your mind on insulation, rain screens, crawl spaces.
This is an awesome development. Huge kudos to these builders.
Poured concrete walls in the basement is teh best way to go
incredible place!! many thanks!!!
Fantastic project!! Love the attention to detail
Great video, thanks Matt!
Great video. Love the project. Good homes and good deeds.
I was noticing that when you went down in the unfinished basement the PVC drain lines didn’t have purple primer do they use clear primer or just cement I would hate to think they would build the houses like that and not use primer.
here in my state code doesn’t call for primer but me as a plumber since the late 80s will never not use primer I’ve been on to calls where so called plumbers didn’t use primer and the pipe from hot and cold weather caused the pipes to come apart but almost never have I been on a call where primer was used and the pipe came apart.
So I’m a strong believer in primer I use both clear and purple primer clear in the house and purple underneath the house and I don’t mean clear cleaner I mean clear primer.
Absolutely beautiful homes. Hope to see this catch on in texas.
Great stuff, Mr Risinger! You are the Home Builder I wanted to be. I'm not jealous, at all...
Amazing engineering and I love the quality of workmanship. Congratulations.
Interesting show thanks Matt
Liked the house- Those Cove heaters along the ceiling- stayed in a log cabin and they had those. nice house. I would feel good about buying one of these.
I wonder if the zip R stuff costs way more then the system of zip plus nail base and tyvek.
I know tape exists that air seals OSB. Could you switch zip for OSB and tape the seams?
I like this system better than zip R bc the osb is protected by the foam instead of backwards like zip R. And the double protection of zip and tyvek and foam. Nothings getting thru that
Yeah, OSB is a pretty good air barrier if you just tape the seams.
Used to work there, good company
I am so excited about home building these days. This video is a great introduction to the various phases of a single home's journey to passive perfection. I can't wait for my next home!!
Great tour. It's awesome to see such great detail be put into affordable houses. Thanks Matt!
It's not "affordable". It is subsidized by the gooberment and called efficient and sustainable. More green nonsense that is not affordable
Great stuff. We need WAY more affordable high performance houses in this country.
Awesome! You won’t see this type of construction detail in Rural Utah where I live! Very little has changed here since the last 50 years
So very nice to see such attention to ensuring the continuous exterior insulation! The only thing that left me wanting were the eaves of modest length but I don't actually know the climate zone. Perhaps they are sufficient.
Exceptional work. I have been seeking a builder in Spokane who can build to these materials and details but most what I see is basic housewrap. We need a builder who knows these new processes.
Bridger View’s market-rate homes are being sold by ERA Landmark. $550,000 - $775,000.
Bridger View’s below-market homes are being sold by Headwaters Community Housing Trust (“You own the home and lease the land, which is held in trust for the community.“)
As Bozeman seems to have an affordability problem and you've referenced this project as being some sort of public-private partnership, what's the price point for the smaller and larger houses? It looks like a brilliant little community, but very curious about what price point they're trying to hit (and how much that price point is subsidized). The unconditioned attics seem really strange, and I had the same question lots of others had about "why not ZIP-R" instead of the complex layering of exterior materials they're doing, but this is a whole heck of a lot better than any builder grade stuff. Really glad you did this video.
The blue house with the yellow door is listed at a cool 649,000 dollars.
@@jimyeats Dang. Uh, not sure this is going to be affordable for those working Joes and Janes of Bozeman. :(
@@jimyeats $649K sounds much cheaper than $650K. Smart marketing! Haha. Here in Japan, a lot down the street was listed at $200.6K! I’m sure the price was not negotiable either. That $0.6K shows how strict pricing is in Japan. In America, we like our 9s. Everything is $...9999.99. That $0.01 less makes such a psychological difference.
Yall should come show florida how to build houses those look way better quality and that's the cleanest new construction site I have ever seen
Surprising to see the supplemental heat installed up toward the ceiling-- I would have gone for having it down at the baseboard level.
Apparently up & out of the way trump’s “heat rises”….
I’m guessing because it’s small room putting heater at floor level would limit couch and other furniture placement, up top it can be out of the way and air can be circulated back down with a mini split.
They are radiant panels, believe it or not but those panels will heat the objects on the floor before heating the air. They feel just like the sun's radiant heat shining down on the room. I lived in a home with radiant ceilings, it was always funny sitting down on the couch or getting into bed and having it be warmer then the air temperature.
Love these build shows, and kudos to Langlas for building good performance for a good price. i still miss having som ventilation behind the cladding though, but are all houses using pvc cladding?
Cute house!
I can help wonder why no spray foam at the rim joists.
The floor covering in the bathroom reminds me of the "battleship" lino used in commercial in the 50s & 60s, guess nothing is new, it just comes back.
Just think its too bad they have to use dimensional lumber when I joist is so much better a product.
But bonus to them for using the lumber packaging from the windows!
Beautiful Montana. It’s a shame the locals are being priced out. Thanks for showing homes that don’t have over-the-top features. Aaron could always become a JC Penney catalog model, if this construction gig doesn’t pan out , he’s definitely got the look.
Thanks Marilyn 🤣
@@aaronreay2099 get a room you two 😂
Awesome ideas
Great stuff
great video!
Comfort Cove heaters are great. I installed them years ago. On demand instant heat and savings when no one's home.
I'm doing the same thing with zip board and 3 in poly, but have hung furring strips every 16 to create a rain screen and to attach the signing on the outside as the rain screen as per Matts videos and "the perfect wall" system.
Everything dries to the inside of the house, which means you can't use closed cell insulation inside.
I have the rain screen on the outside of the polyester before the vinyl and metal siding combo. No tyvek.
I covered my polyiso with a spray on liquid *vapor permeable* air barrier, and the zip system seams and penetrations too, but I think it's belt and suspenders.
Could not get an answer from perfect wall guy in Boston.
Good looking out with that iron worker construction helmet. Safety first bro.
Does zip not offer a 3 inch foam? Just seems like a lot of work to put up sheathing twice
It has 2.5", but the structural value of it goes way down. It might not be adequate for shear in this location. I often see just the exterior insulation board go up (no attached sheathing), then strapping on top for the rainscreen air gap plus siding attachment. I'm not sure these ones have a proper rainscreen.
Cove heaters: a first saw one in a house i was touring with RE agent. I asked if it was just electric resistance heating and he had some story about how they are electric but more efficient than baseboard. I could tell he didnt know resistance is resistance. And cove heaters now have this odd urban myth that they are some kind of magic resistance heater. Theyre all the rage and popular im new $2m builds where i live.
when moisture gets between the zip and the foam, how is it getting out?
It isn't. Building science says max 1 vapor barrier and this building design doesn't meet that criteria.
EPS insulation is vapor open, and the OSB and Tyvek would allow drying to the outside, right?
@@seattlebitcoinbroker6564 where do you see two?
I am curious as to why they chose the materials they have for the outside sheathing. To me it seems like a cheaper alternative would be to use regular OSB first then either ZipR or polyiso and then regular Zip. Eliminates the need for the Tyvek for most siding choices. Also no blocking around windows would be needed and you can also oversize the rough opening an additional inch and use zip as your return piece for a solid and watertight rough opening.
Good content. 👍
They could save a lot of money going to a heat pump air handler with heat strip, the exterior system is really cool, could be applied to a sea can house with a few tweaks
Wondering why they wouldn't use Zip R vs. the OSB with XPS on it? Seems like an added cost layer that could have been solved with Zip R, while still having a nailbase.
🤔
Anyone know what Zip-r costs right now? The only place I can find online with actual prices shows like $100 a sheet for r-6 😬
@@timgleason2527 winner winner chicken dinner
Zip_R only has a maximum foam thickness of 2", not 3". Also, EPS would lose a lot of R-value at cold temperatures, so XPS would make sense since it's performance doesn't degrade in cold temperatures. However, at about 11:18 it sounds like he said 3" EPS, not XPS.
@@ryan52403 Zip R isn't backed with XPS, it's polyiso. 3" of XPS has an R-Value of around 12.5, Zip 2" polyiso is R-12. I maintain my early position that Zip R seems like it would have served the same purpose and likely cheaper, while simplifying the assembly and reducing the amount of face areas for issues to happen on.
.5 more of R-value seems negligible.
Would love to hear their rationale on the assembly.
Bozeman is in a seismic zone (right next to Yellowstone) and I doubt Zip-R has the required shear strength so sheathing must be nailed directly to the studs.
Great episode. Was wondering what type of insulation will be used on the interior? Spray foam?
Probably just bat insulation since they are going for a low enviromental impact construction. Probably Rockwool.
these are cool!
Forbo Marmoleum (flooring). the new lino.
Is there insulation in the wall cavity or did I miss that?
When adding the different thicknesses of foam. How are the fasteners in tornado or hurricane coded areas
Great video and love the houses. Question: What's the LEED point they're getting for using 2x structure instead of engineered joists. I'm not familiar with that, and I'm curious what the LEED intent is there...
It is tree hugger land subsidized by the gooberment
Awesome
nice to see quality on smaller homes. seems like only the big boys get the good stuff.
Is there a Micro Lok mineral wool version ? Rather have that than fiberglass since pipes tend to get condensation
Wow a non custom home builder that actually cares about quality! It’s a unicorn!!
Non custom building charging custom prices. That tiny blue house with the yellow door is listed at 650,000 dollars.
@@jimyeats mechanicals, finishes, quality materials, blower door aka ach value, r value plus the average regional home price all contributing factors. Craftsmanship and detail execution also appears far superior to non custom builders so that's going to constitute a higher labor cost. I agree it would be nice to see people build quality homes for less but with the scarcity of actual craftsmen in the labor pool builders that do things right can certainly make a profit with the demand for quality work.
@@isaacbeckel2044 Certainly. I think the bloated market of Bozeman has the most to do with it. Just kind of insane that a “working class” home costs 650k and is 2 bedroom 2 bath with 1100 square feet of finished home (1800 with the basement) and is sitting on a lot that is 0.06 acres (3,000 square foot lot).
@@isaacbeckel2044 Yes agreed!
For the non-professional builder viewer, I enjoy seeing the “build science” systems used to create an energy efficient, yet high quality living environment. As a 12x homeowner, one that just downsized from 6k sqft 20yr old golf course home in N.Dallas, to a 3.5k sqft new build golf course home, here in NW AR, I am so looking forward to living in a new high-tech build, focused on efficiency, and a healthy living environment. Seeing the new advances in bldg science make me think I should plan on building a new home in another 10 yrs or so…
Do you really think building science is advancing that fast and will significantly change 10 years from now?
If you’re not first, you’re last!
Nice
Beautiful homes. My only negative comment about the project is there is no emphasis on passive solar. The project started with an empty large piece of land where all the lots and streets could be laid out so that passive solar was a dominant feature in the community. Such a design aspect would further reduce energy requirements in both heating and cooling.
The glass was high gain glass... I forgot mention that part
Hello. there is a layer between the siding and the OSB board. And is there a layer on the inside in front of the drywall sheet?
Working class? Dam so for the people that actually do the work
Rather than 7/16" ZIP + 3" EPS + 0.5" OSB + Tyvek, why not two layers of 2" Zip-R9?
Something funky going on with the image stabilization.
I was just thinking the other day about how single-family dwelling new builds in my area ere NEVER below 300sqft. Everything that "affordable" are townhouse condominiums. So frustrating.
1. EPS below grade not a good choice. Issue is that bugs will turn it into swiss cheese by burrowing tunnels in it for homes. Either use a fiberglass mat or get foam that has a pesticide in the foam so bugs won't tunnel through it. Another issue with EPS is that its insulation value degrades over time.
2. A better way for exterior insulation is to just use standard foam panels & 1x4 or 1x6 boards for the nail base for the siding. I suspect the OSB bonded foam insulation is considerable more expensive.
3. For the window buck, It would be ideal to use some ridge foam sandwiched between the wood frame and the wall frame as a thermal break, At the very least use some sill sealer as a thermal break.
At 3:40, the discussion of joists being solid wood rather than engineered wood to help with LEED certification. Why does LEED care about avoiding engineered joists? Looking at the self-proclaimed goals of LEED, I cannot figure out what part of their mission this would fall under. (To avoid the need for fire protection?)
what is the effective R Value to the wall system? Is there an interior poly & batt in the stud space? 2x6 wall?
If you are in Bozeman again, you should lookup Brandner Design
Man I want these guys to build my house. Can I fly the team to Washington?
Basement Floor joists Cross bridging or solid blocking ? Over 7 foot span?
I wonder the cost difference for just using Zip-R instead of the extra panels.
Matt, if I'd won the powerball lottery, the first business I'd have begun was high end custom homes. I'd have been in touch... A man still dreams time to time.
I interested to know why there are LEED credits for solid sawn floor joists vs. I-joists?
I would guess the resins in the I joist not sure though. Good question!
yeah, what Issac said, has to be an off-gassing, air quality thing.
Likely locally sawn
Maybe I missed it, but do they also insulate between the studs on the outside walls? Or is the 3" foam adequate?
They said the nail base was R15 and I think min framed wall insulation requirements in code for that region require R20+ total so I would assume they’re doing something inside the walls too
I seriously want to know why they didn't just use ZIP R instead of twice the labor?? Was it a chemical issue or supply chain, or what??
Eps foam is manufacturered locally so they may get a leed credit
there is definitely something odd here in the materials. like some subsidies/credits/kickbacks. as you said the labor part doesn't make sense.
Eps is better than iso in the cold.
How would it be better if it has half the R value