*And this is how a few cones can create a huge mess in one of the busiest airspaces in the world. Cones on the way, an aircraft blocking the main landing runway and minds starting to blow! KUDOS FOR THOSE APPROACH CONTROLLERS!*
We request the continuation of story. Who put them, why they were there, why no one notied them and who got lost his job. I think it is the "goodbye salute" of a retiring worker.
+Devon Perry Or one of the $0.01 screws or whatever marked by the cones ;-) Like in the famous Concorde crash where "aircraft ... ran over debris on the runway during takeoff, blowing a tyre and puncturing a fuel tank" killed 113 people: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_France_Flight_4590
I love how neutrally angry the controller is. Sounds like he's going to give the pilot a new asshole until pilot says "cones on the runway" and he's immediately angry with someone else and gets it resolved.
@juggliar I don't think he was being an asshole, I think he was trying to encourage the pilot to communicate with him in a more timely, urgent manner considering multiple planes were trying to come in behind him.
@@sandydog426 yes the pilots were very slow with their communication & were also crawling slowly to get off the runway the whole time ... before they knew about a cones situation 👀💬✔
Doesnt have to be that their english is limited. They might be fluent even. Its just that cone isnt word you need to use everyday. I often forget words in my native tongue and have to think for a second to remember.
The trick is to use words that come to mind that still provide the essential information. For example the pilot could say "runway is obstructed" or "objects are on the runway".
I think it was an excellent distinction to make, especially with foreigners who may not understand the tone used and might assume incorrectly. It was a nice way to deescalate before it needed to be deescalated by simply saying "my bad, I realize this is tense and I don't mean to sound like a dick". Give the ATC credit for recognizing he may have been misunderstood as hostile.
I wouldnt say good job really, they handled it but they were really i guess you can say rough with the controls. I get its super stressful and they sounded that way but for example at 5:25 his responce was pretty rude. Once again i get that he doesnt know if 13L will be ready for the American Airlines arrival but the pilot or F/O was just asking. Ive watched many of these videos with ATC acting more professional and calm in a much more stressful case.
In the UK, people say there is the NCB - National Cone Board reesponsible. Is there a counterpart in US America? May be they are all send to south border setting up cones against immigrants :-/
The Aeroflot pilots needed a couple of second to figure out the word "cones" there xD But they are undeniably *very* polite, apologizing for the chaos indirectly caused; Kennedy Gnd had to keep saying that "it's not your fault, sir". Very professional showing of everyone there. Kudos!
To be fair, they might not be too proficient with "everyday" english, and I highly doubt that traffic cones are something that interfere with pilot's work on a daily basis :P and yep, very professional on their side.
@@Riker1990 Exactly! I may have misconstrued my intention there... not making fun of them for not remembering "cones" earlier. Heck, in the same situation, I too would do the same... and probably end up saying "those orange triangle thingies" xD
Pandu Poluan ... I'm not so sure ... maybe reporting the facts appeared too embarrassing to report and believed ... fear of being ridiculed for seeing things that are not supposed to be there in the first place ...
Lmao that poor aeroflot pilot sounded so bewildered by the whole situation. Even though it wasn't his fault it still has to feel awful that it is because of your plane on the runway that all hell is breaking loose.
Well, if he was looking a bit ahead he may have prevented the blockage of the active runway. It is not his fault by any means but with teamwork they could have gone any other taxiway.
I've read some article about aircraft couldn't take off at Hawaii, or somewhere like that, because Space Shuttle taking off at Florida and scheduled to drop their fuel tank to reenter and burn in atmosphere above Pacific. But then, Space Shuttle got delayed because their alternate landing airport in Africa got closed for some reason.
@@davidliu2243 i thing with planes gallons/liters become irrelevent. I believe they use Lbs/Kilos since plane essentually burn off Gallons/liters very very quickly.
And then another plane shortly after: "Tower, our left engine is defective. Needed to abort takeoff." - "What happened?" - "We suffered a cone strike." - "And I know exactly what you mean."
Every time you feel like the world around is going upside down and everything is wrong, just listen to the way these guys are making their jobs. Just amazing
God bless the kindness Steve showed to the initial pilot. Poor guy was apologizing and he kept reassuring him it wasn't his fault. He didn't really need to but he did anyway.
'No need to worry' is a reply on the question from TWR wether they have an emergency (since they suddenly stopped moving). They are just unable to move ahead and meanwhile using Google translate on конус. I'm pretty proficient in English (I'm Dutch) but had to think about the Dutch word for these (kegel/pilon/pion) let alone translate it to English. It's not something that comes up often unless you work in traffic routing or sports.
Someone in ATC should just climb out of the tower and get down to the field and take away their cones. Tell the Port Authority they can pick up their cones tomorrow if they want to play with them some more.
I know you’re probably joking but that would be dangerous. The ATCs job is to direct air traffic and if they got out and left there’d be a whole lot of pilots with no instructions on what to do.
All they have to do is call one of the airport cars and have them pick them up. Looking at a map of JFK, the intersection of 13L and 22R looks to be about a mile away from the tower. That's a 40 minute walk, round trip. Of course, if a Ground Controller did that, he wouldn't really need to return to the tower. He'd be fired before he got back.
A thing that many people seem to be missing is that apart from the potential damage to the engines, if they suck up the cones, they are usually placed for a reason. If there was ongoing repairs on the runway, you could risk destroying the landing gear if it dropped into a hole, or risk a truck crossing the runway, assuming that it would be empty, because it is closed off.
@@gabrieltassi4030 I find it dangerous that you start expecting, instead of listening. One of the previous videos, it was clear the ATC was hearing what was expected, but the pilot was confused and saying other things. Almost caused a collision.
@@rogerwilco2 What I meant by that is that you still listen, but you expect what to hear. For most of these atc recordings we listen here, we are not familiar with the area or familiar with the procedures. These pilots/atc are immersed in the situation. They know which arrival/departure they are doing, relevant fixes nearby, taxiway names...
Adam L ... in Germany they have a game called "Fang den Hut" ... played with cones where you try to land on top of your opponent and capture him ... hahaha ... some German U-boots had that game logo painted on the hull ...
to be honest - i didn't get that part of video. What was happening there? Why did they stop Emirates? Did they suspect him of placing cones ( LOL ) or what?
The ATC's tone when he said "There's CONES on the runway???" xD And that poor pilot! Glad they got it worked out and no one was mad at him. He handled it quite well :)
Yeah it’s a test in communication skills, organization, and paying attention to developing situations all at the same time and a mistake can be costly in money and somtimes lives
The guy in the tower is good. The pilot in the plane that saw the cones wouldn't say why they couldn't move and the tower guy didn't just repeat the same thing over and over. In other videos ATC keeps saying the same thing and getting the same response back.
I don't know about ground crew, but a general philosophy in aviation is that blaming someone is much less important than fixing the issue and figuring out how the issue happened in the first place. Then again, this is 'Murica, home of the lawsuits.
@@loveforsberg530 Probably depends on the error and what caused it. I work on the ramp for UPS and usually if its something unforeseen or very unusual they take that attitude. That being said I have seen people getting a cone shoved up their backside for driving behind a plane I'm walking out or parking in the way and ignoring wingwalkers.
NOTOMs were published that runway 4L closed and runway 31L southeast side shortened. I'd say they were relying on ASDE-X too much and not looking out the window
A flashing X should have been placed at the 4L threshold then, and then cones on the taxiways south of the 13R/31L runway. 31L wouldn't be relevant since takeoffs were the opposite way (13R). If Kennedy Steve hadn't retired...
A Cone Placement Technician 3 is not authorized to contact the tower. The communication operator in the Cone-trol Center has to contact the Control Tower. He can’t pick them up, either: that’s the responsibility of a Cone Recovery Specialist 2 or higher. Union rules.
A seemingly minor mistake of forgetting some cones that could’ve turned very bad. That’s a HUGE safety issue! Luckily everyone remained calm and professional on frequency and that’s a great job by the Approach Controller!
ATC: “okay you can’t land on 13L, can you land on 13R?” China Eastern 297: “yes we accept 13R.” 30 seconds later China Eastern 297: “can we have runway 13L?” ATC: u wot
Wow, those dispatchers are really pushing the limits of the airport's capacity! Not like it's a bad thing, but telling pilots to hurry up on the runway because someone is already landing right behind them isn't something I'd expect to hear on ATC radio.
spooks77 more likely (pieces of?) a cone or two get sucked into 1 or more engines, and I don't know what happens then but I'm pretty sure no pilot wants to find out. And especially no mechanic would want to find out.
Russians may seem cold but they do genuinely care a lot when it matters to them; I’m sure he was sitting in the cockpit like “it may not be my fault there’s cones but it is my aircraft blocking landings” poor guy wasn’t having a good day
Wow! I have become fascinated by these videos and all that goes on in them. The ATC's are simply amazing. How they keep it all straight in their minds with proper altitudes, where everyone is, and what is going on is amazing to me.
That this could happen without ATC being aware is a real indictment of some serious system problem and also a massive lump of stupidity from someone! And that the Russian pilot/CP knew the English for cone is pretty good - well done Aeroflot!
Years ago when I was in a flying club, I took a Cessna 172 around the pattern one night. The winds were crazy but didn't have any problems. While taxiing back to the club parking area, an orange cone from a construction zone had blown onto a taxiway and was blocking it. I was able to squeeze around it but contacted the tower. They said they had no personnel to remove it. So I volunteered to walk out and remove it. There was already a twin engine aircraft stopped not able to proceed. I removed it and things kept moving.
After listening to half of this video my head hurts and I'm beginning to wonder how there's not more accidents. That's a lot to keep track of, so many planes, and some cones. Happy to stay completely oblivious of what's going on while I'm comfortable in my seat in the cabin. A fact that will not change even after this video.
Can hear the stress in ATC voices even before there is an issue. They really need to do something to alleviate the pressure on them, it’s only gonna cause accidents otherwise.
Those ATC controllers deserve some type of promotion for that. Definitely a lot going on at once and they handled it like pros! Most controllers rage and lose their cool but these guys kept it professional all the way. Props to y’all
Best way for the ground staff to take revenge for holding their paychecks ;) Make them hold the planes ! Even the Super ones !! On ATC side.. Its a symphony orchestra ! God give the controllers more eye's and ears.. ! Good coverage.. Well edited.. Felt like a thriller movie.. So many aircrafts so many voices.. An end with a Cresendo, and then again comes the dejavu ! ( we found cones again !! Lol.. )
Its terrifying to hear that the clearest, slowest and most understandable accent of all these calls is the very heavy, but slow and clear, American 1142 pilot with the southern accent...
What I find weird is were the cones placed there or somewhere else and have then been moved by wind onto the runway. Or who is the intern that are so insane to place cones on a active Runway?
counterfit5 are they? Seriously ! Because then I find it even more worryingly. You can’t have light objects flying around on a airport that’s absolutely insane.
Wow, what a chain reaction. JFK is such a tight knit net. I can't imagine an airport more stressful for an ATC. Inredible that humans can keep so calm under such constant pressure.
Pilot: “… waiting for our RWY assignment” ATCO: “so am I” 😎😅 Then straightaway Pilot 2: “waiting also for RWY assignment” ATCO: “alright, all station standby, we have an issue …” 😤 Seems like these pilots didn’t care listening to the frequency and disregarded that RWY 13L was blocked and that the ATCO was busy resequencing all other AC in order of priority and level order. I felt for that ATCO.
This reminds me of the scene from"A Bug's Life" when the ants trail gets blocked by a leaf. They can't move until another ant comes and guides the first any around the leaf and back onto the trail.
Being an ATC is rated at one of the most stressful jobs, even above a marine door kicker. Take a moment to think about that. Someone who breaks into enemy territory constantly at risk of being shot, exploded, tortured, killed, are generally less stressed than ATCs. Some might not understand so let me put it to you this way. One single mistake or miscommunication and YOU killed possibly hundreds of innocent people, costing MILLIONS of dollars, lost your job, and are looking at felony charges. They have to have a 100% success rate.
Such a critical situation affecting ground controller - TWR and then APP. However, the ATC did a great job and acting rapidly, maintaining safety and expeditious. So proud of you guys! Thanks for sharing!
Even CTR controllers might get affected by this situation holding traffics from up above so that the Tracon doesn't get congested. Few cones = Mess everywhere.
I don't see a problem here. Last minute change runway assignment. China Eastern tried to accommodate 13R. Then realized approach was a bit high.Then they decided go around instead of foring the airplane down.its a good airmanship here.
Something I simply HAVE to mention since everyone is complaining about Chinese pilots all they time: They perfectly understood ATC, they spoke good English and the realized they were coming in a little too high. That’s how Chinese crews work in general, just felt like I needed to say that.
They were unsure whether they could accept 13R or not. Then they just took it according to the standard asian uncertainty culture... And to top it off they then didn't even manage to execute a standard visual approach. But they spoke acceptable english you are right there.
Ni Pr tell that to the chinese pilots who skid off the runway in naia international airport last month. That mishap caused a huge ripple effect. Had an important meeting to attend to in manila but airport/runway is closed due to that. So I wasnt able to attend.
Wow. That whole mess due to some cones. (I do understand that the plane cannot ignore the cones, and must wait for them to be removed.) Much respect for the ATC and how this was handled.
Something about the speed and efficiency of operations like this is fascinating to me. I'm very fortunate to have been trained in an environment like this and I have no problems talking to ATC because of it!
Sounded like Kennedy Steve on Ground. It was a very slightly panicked "He's not on my frequency any more!" but he bounced right back with "The port authority's playing games!" Simply amazing the confusion a few traffic cones can cause when nobody knows they're in the way till a plane's almost on top of them! Great teamwork all round between the various ATCs, though!
![[REAL ATC] American B738 forced to land WITHOUT FLAPS AT JFK!](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/ATVYGjkgq2A/mqdefault.jpg)
![[REAL ATC] American B738 forced to land WITHOUT FLAPS AT JFK!](/img/tr.png)
![[REAL ATC] Aeroflot has PREGNANT WOMAN on board GIVING BIRTH!!](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/5pZ3VOPlarw/mqdefault.jpg)
*And this is how a few cones can create a huge mess in one of the busiest airspaces in the world. Cones on the way, an aircraft blocking the main landing runway and minds starting to blow! KUDOS FOR THOSE APPROACH CONTROLLERS!*
We request the continuation of story. Who put them, why they were there, why no one notied them and who got lost his job. I think it is the "goodbye salute" of a retiring worker.
China Eastern is not helping, lol... Ps: Like always, another cool stream, VASAviation!!!
@@oscarolie5743 What? The Chinese pilot spoke and understood English well. No point did they made a mess.
Yeah, CE should have just run over the cones.
When was this? Did Chris Christie move up from shutting down bridge approaches to shutting down runways?
The CONES forgot to contact ground on 123.9 to taxi off the runway.
123.9 is JFK TWR.
Maybe they're taking off. Then it's 123.9 or 119.1
Mr. Ramirez this made me cackle at 2 in the morning thank you
@@craigbryant3191 classic Steve!
You see they called Ground, "RAMP", and no one is talking to them for the rest of the day for such disrespect.
Who would win.?..?
1. A multi-million dollar vehicle.
2. Some orange white plastic things.
They could mark something important like a damaged runway or stuff on the runway. Both and the cones can be dangerous especially at high speeds.
It’s more like who would win:
$7 traffic cone
$54,000,000 engine
Unfortunately probably the cones
A multi million dollar engine would certainly lose to an ingested plastic cone!
+Devon Perry Or one of the $0.01 screws or whatever marked by the cones ;-)
Like in the famous Concorde crash where "aircraft ... ran over debris on the runway during takeoff, blowing a tyre and puncturing a fuel tank" killed 113 people: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_France_Flight_4590
When a multimillion dollar turbofan engine ingests a $50 “orange white plastic” bit of FOD, there are no winners.
I love how neutrally angry the controller is. Sounds like he's going to give the pilot a new asshole until pilot says "cones on the runway" and he's immediately angry with someone else and gets it resolved.
@juggliar I don't think he was being an asshole, I think he was trying to encourage the pilot to communicate with him in a more timely, urgent manner considering multiple planes were trying to come in behind him.
@@sandydog426 yes the pilots were very slow with their communication & were also crawling slowly to get off the runway the whole time ... before they knew about a cones situation 👀💬✔
Air traffic controller, one of The Most stressful jobs. Mandatory retirement at 56.
Nah, he's not angry. He's from New Jersey.
First time I've seen "neutrally angry". I'm used to seeing "passive aggressive"
Who installed VLC on that runway?
I just have to tell you, that comment made my day! LOL
@@techelpr
LOOOOOOOOOOOL :D :D :D
I LOVE YOU
😂 well played
I feel for the Aeroflot pilot. When you know 25 words in English and "cone" is not one of them... I know that feeling.
ORANGE POINTY THING! , wait what? :D
Doesnt have to be that their english is limited. They might be fluent even. Its just that cone isnt word you need to use everyday. I often forget words in my native tongue and have to think for a second to remember.
The trick is to use words that come to mind that still provide the essential information. For example the pilot could say "runway is obstructed" or "objects are on the runway".
ice cream cone lol
Reminds me of my childhood. English was hard, so many words!
"I'm not yelling at you, I'm asking you" lmao classic JFK
He was like, oop that last bit sounded harsh.
Yeah New Yorkers are trash. They don’t know how to speak without sounding like they are yelling or being rude.
@@bsce100 So true. Only peopel who live or travel through NYC know this. Total shithole now from the riots.
I think it was an excellent distinction to make, especially with foreigners who may not understand the tone used and might assume incorrectly. It was a nice way to deescalate before it needed to be deescalated by simply saying "my bad, I realize this is tense and I don't mean to sound like a dick". Give the ATC credit for recognizing he may have been misunderstood as hostile.
@@Salsuero you're blessed a right brother
Tower: “Cleared to ASALT”
Pilot: “Affirmative. Assaulting co-pilot now. I can’t stand this guy.”
William J. That is good
What did “ASALT” actually mean? I’m just curious
Hectic Hive I believe it is a Rnav waypoint
That’s a Kennedy Steve moment right there
William J. Oh my god 😂
Great job by ATC and the pilots. Not so much Port Authority Department of Cone Management
Dept of Cone Management is responsible for cone PLACEMENT ONLY. Not cone pickup. C'mon man.
The Department of Cone Removal will be formed in the next fiscal year ...
Darn coneheads
I wouldnt say good job really, they handled it but they were really i guess you can say rough with the controls. I get its super stressful and they sounded that way but for example at 5:25 his responce was pretty rude. Once again i get that he doesnt know if 13L will be ready for the American Airlines arrival but the pilot or F/O was just asking. Ive watched many of these videos with ATC acting more professional and calm in a much more stressful case.
In the UK, people say there is the NCB - National Cone Board reesponsible.
Is there a counterpart in US America? May be they are all send to south border setting up cones against immigrants :-/
The Aeroflot pilots needed a couple of second to figure out the word "cones" there xD
But they are undeniably *very* polite, apologizing for the chaos indirectly caused; Kennedy Gnd had to keep saying that "it's not your fault, sir".
Very professional showing of everyone there. Kudos!
Rubber products.
To be fair, they might not be too proficient with "everyday" english, and I highly doubt that traffic cones are something that interfere with pilot's work on a daily basis :P and yep, very professional on their side.
@@Riker1990 Exactly! I may have misconstrued my intention there... not making fun of them for not remembering "cones" earlier.
Heck, in the same situation, I too would do the same... and probably end up saying "those orange triangle thingies" xD
they could just say orange FO
Pandu Poluan ... I'm not so sure ... maybe reporting the facts appeared too embarrassing to report and believed ... fear of being ridiculed for seeing things that are not supposed to be there in the first place ...
Lmao that poor aeroflot pilot sounded so bewildered by the whole situation. Even though it wasn't his fault it still has to feel awful that it is because of your plane on the runway that all hell is breaking loose.
Johnny he also probably had to look up the word for the stupid orange things in the way.
@@carschmn The first officer was certaily looking them up on Google translate lol.
@@wetlettuce4768
"Aeroflot 122..."
"Aeroflot 122 we cant move... because there are uh.... cones in the runway"
@@wetlettuce4768 idk why I'm laughing 'cause I had to look up cones on Google translate before I watched the video
He should have said why he couldn't proceed instead of just repeating that he could not proceed.
Half expected the pilots to climb down, remove the cones, get back in the plane and continue taxiing. It's Aeroflot after all.
AamarAV remember the Lufthansa pilot who climbed down the cockpit ladder to check a panel? ;)
If somebody landed in a smaller prop craft, I can assure you that would of been the case.
Remember the German pilots who got out and closed a door on their plane? Haha
Mark of Excellence that’s exactly what I said already
Mark of Excellence they do, they do ;)
Aeroflot pilot too kind keep saying sorry when its not even his fault
Anyone who flys into JFK know that controller is notoriously hot-headed, although he's very good.
I miss Kennedy Steve.
He’s apologizing cuz he has no idea what’s going on with their basic English
Well, if he was looking a bit ahead he may have prevented the blockage of the active runway. It is not his fault by any means but with teamwork they could have gone any other taxiway.
Saying sorry doesn't always mean you are admitting fault.
"The Port Authority is playing games" LMFAO
They were re-enacting the Cone Wars.
The New Yorker jumped out
It was the annual Port Authority autocross that day and they forgot to pick up their cones.
Call your boss.... So you can not HAVE a boss anymore
@@adamjacobs8606 Sorry Control Tower, you may not have your boss
Wow! The ripple effect of those cones was unbelievable.
It's the Cone Effect.
I've read some article about aircraft couldn't take off at Hawaii, or somewhere like that, because Space Shuttle taking off at Florida and scheduled to drop their fuel tank to reenter and burn in atmosphere above Pacific. But then, Space Shuttle got delayed because their alternate landing airport in Africa got closed for some reason.
If one of those got sucked into an engine, the result would not be a good thing.
A cone standing on JFK runway produces delays in BKK, FRA, SFO half a day later.
Just like the Ever Given.
Tutorial: How to mess up every Pilots day.
Step1: place a cone on the runway.
Step2: watch what happens.
How to destroy an aircraft and endanger everyone on board
Step1: suck a traffic cone into a turbine engine
Step2: pray
@@MichaelClark-uw7ex works as well
"Those should not be there."
I'd have responded: "Was my guess, too." 😆
“I am sorry for that. I get back to you in a minute.”
when you accidentally dragged a PDF file into VLC Player
Then it tries to play it anyway, and since you have repeat on, it just keeps trying to play it until it crashes.
How many thousands in jet fuel spent as a result of this mistake?
A whole lot of pounds and dollars...
@@VASAviation *That's* a phrase you don't hear every day!
Well over 5000 gallons of fuel
Do they get wholesale prices on that? 🤔
@@davidliu2243 i thing with planes gallons/liters become irrelevent. I believe they use Lbs/Kilos since plane essentually burn off Gallons/liters very very quickly.
Now imagine Air Jamaica saying “request go around , we’re a little high”.
Can't go down when you have the HIGH GROUND
i laughed way harder at this then i should have.
@@hihfty same 😂
lulz
Just spit coffee out of my nose...THANKS!!! :D
In Russia, they would Reverse Thrust those cones off.
Krishna Malhotra lol, but no. SOP is very similar in Russia. RT is still a big NO NO. Only for deceleration.
ariannasv22 me2 Xd
And then another plane shortly after: "Tower, our left engine is defective. Needed to abort takeoff." - "What happened?" - "We suffered a cone strike." - "And I know exactly what you mean."
Tower - “there are cones in the runway!”
Aeroflot pilot - “Fuck Them.... this is Russia!!!””
xD
Every time you feel like the world around is going upside down and everything is wrong, just listen to the way these guys are making their jobs. Just amazing
I think you just put your finger on one major reason I get so much enjoyment and fulfilment out of watching these videos
God bless the kindness Steve showed to the initial pilot. Poor guy was apologizing and he kept reassuring him it wasn't his fault.
He didn't really need to but he did anyway.
I recognized that voice as Steve’s
You know its worse than "Call me, say when ready to copy towers number" when he says "CALL YOUR BOSS!"
I had a laugh-out-loud moment just after 8:57 "so am I".
"TWR this is JFK FINAL APP, requesting 13L"
When you're just lazy to say out the whole thing again lol
"no need to worry (...) we're unable to move ahead"
funny guy.
How long would they have just sat there after saying that?
'No need to worry' is a reply on the question from TWR wether they have an emergency (since they suddenly stopped moving). They are just unable to move ahead and meanwhile using Google translate on конус.
I'm pretty proficient in English (I'm Dutch) but had to think about the Dutch word for these (kegel/pilon/pion) let alone translate it to English.
It's not something that comes up often unless you work in traffic routing or sports.
When listing to it again I’m pretty sure he actually said “nowhere to go, we’re unable to move ahead”
Whenever something goes wrong on JFK Ground:
"Get me Car 99 immediately!"
Someone in ATC should just climb out of the tower and get down to the field and take away their cones. Tell the Port Authority they can pick up their cones tomorrow if they want to play with them some more.
Greg Stark then tell them they have proven themselves unable to be responsible to have cones and take away their cone privileges for 1 month.
I know you’re probably joking but that would be dangerous. The ATCs job is to direct air traffic and if they got out and left there’d be a whole lot of pilots with no instructions on what to do.
All they have to do is call one of the airport cars and have them pick them up. Looking at a map of JFK, the intersection of 13L and 22R looks to be about a mile away from the tower. That's a 40 minute walk, round trip. Of course, if a Ground Controller did that, he wouldn't really need to return to the tower. He'd be fired before he got back.
A thing that many people seem to be missing is that apart from the potential damage to the engines, if they suck up the cones, they are usually placed for a reason. If there was ongoing repairs on the runway, you could risk destroying the landing gear if it dropped into a hole, or risk a truck crossing the runway, assuming that it would be empty, because it is closed off.
Yeah, even if tower took accountability, if there was something there, everyone would have gotten in trouble.
I am always wondering how those ATC can understand what some pilots say, that’s pretty impressive lmao
It's really hard at first, but you get an ear for it over time. I did ATC in Japan and trying to figure out the "English" spoken there wasn't fun.
Panzer VI Tiger Audio quality is much better up there. Also, they are kind of expecting what to listen
@@gabrieltassi4030 I find it dangerous that you start expecting, instead of listening. One of the previous videos, it was clear the ATC was hearing what was expected, but the pilot was confused and saying other things. Almost caused a collision.
Honestly surprised I haven’t heard a controller tell a pilot to stop deep throating a mic yet, I know I want to.
@@rogerwilco2 What I meant by that is that you still listen, but you expect what to hear. For most of these atc recordings we listen here, we are not familiar with the area or familiar with the procedures. These pilots/atc are immersed in the situation. They know which arrival/departure they are doing, relevant fixes nearby, taxiway names...
"Emirates 43C, the port authority is playing games now, standby."
The next Kennedy Steve in the making :D
@@PanduPoluan I was sure this was the voice of Kennedy Steve but then I saw the date!?
Adam L ... in Germany they have a game called "Fang den Hut" ... played with cones where you try to land on top of your opponent and capture him ... hahaha ... some German U-boots had that game logo painted on the hull ...
to be honest - i didn't get that part of video. What was happening there? Why did they stop Emirates? Did they suspect him of placing cones ( LOL ) or what?
Withdrawing my question. I missed one sentence while listening that there also were cones on his way. JFK got a bomb (cones) alert all around it. :)
The ATC's tone when he said "There's CONES on the runway???" xD
And that poor pilot! Glad they got it worked out and no one was mad at him. He handled it quite well :)
First we've got unruly airmarshal, now we got unruly cones...
Reddytheteddy Reddytheteddy and a unruly flu virus as well
Not the cones fault, they were put in a bad position.
I myself identify as a cone. You saying they were put there would make it kidnapping and possible sexual harrassement. Cone live matters
@@weidwingelobjegdiv I mean psychologically they were put in a bad position. Cones lives matter
Same thing isnt it? lol
This is why being an Air Traffic Controller is one of the most stressful jobs in the world.
Yeah it’s a test in communication skills, organization, and paying attention to developing situations all at the same time and a mistake can be costly in money and somtimes lives
They can only do 2 hours before government regulations say they need a break.
@@electricheartpony at JFK it's 60 minutes or 75 minutes at the absolute max apparently
totally understandable, you want these people well rested and at the top of their game @@alyx6427
JetBlue 1001 was really trying to be efficient in their communication when they realized ATC was having trouble managing this mess, love to see it!
Geez! The cone-spiry in this is unimaginable. Just the feeling of stress must've been huge. Kudos to cone-trollers. Stayed calm and collected.
Tower sounds an awful lot like Kennedy Steve… but then I noticed there weren’t ANY sarcastic comments, so…
THOSE should not be there.
but it really sounds like him!!
The ‘playing games’ comment seemed very Steve-like
It was him. @@moritz1932
The guy in the tower is good. The pilot in the plane that saw the cones wouldn't say why they couldn't move and the tower guy didn't just repeat the same thing over and over. In other videos ATC keeps saying the same thing and getting the same response back.
*couldn't, not wouldn't - as an apparent EFL speaker, the pilot's need of a minute to translate "cones" was entirely reasonable imho!😊
You mean ESL?
@@watermelon6631 The more basic English as a Foreign Language, as opposed to English as a Second Language, which is more in-depth
@@watermelon6631 ...is what I meant - though I could be wrong, as "cones" would undoubtedly be a little obscure either way!
@@Tricia_K ok - thanks! i just read it as like English as a first language so i was like??? - yeah cones is not a n=commonly used word.
some person went home that day with 50 cones stuck up their backside right?
They weren't going home except via a *really good* proctologist
Someone might have had to wear one as a hat for a long time.
I don't know about ground crew, but a general philosophy in aviation is that blaming someone is much less important than fixing the issue and figuring out how the issue happened in the first place. Then again, this is 'Murica, home of the lawsuits.
@@loveforsberg530 Probably depends on the error and what caused it. I work on the ramp for UPS and usually if its something unforeseen or very unusual they take that attitude. That being said I have seen people getting a cone shoved up their backside for driving behind a plane I'm walking out or parking in the way and ignoring wingwalkers.
"You shall not pass"
- Sir Orange Cone
Lets start with a NOTAM and work from there. How do you block a runway without ground/tower being aware?
my thoughts too... mustve been closed, and after that ...a visual inspection isnt required?
NOTOMs were published that runway 4L closed and runway 31L southeast side shortened. I'd say they were relying on ASDE-X too much and not looking out the window
A flashing X should have been placed at the 4L threshold then, and then cones on the taxiways south of the 13R/31L runway. 31L wouldn't be relevant since takeoffs were the opposite way (13R).
If Kennedy Steve hadn't retired...
It's NY, Mike - I rest my case.
"Stand by with that!" Savage.
Yeah! 5:25
At the same time, it was the 2nd time in 2 calls. Like comon guys haha
I believe the runway had just been mopped. They don't just put cones on the runway for no reason. Duh.
Crispy .... that's the new law for the cleaning women in public places in Germany to put up cones ... they read "Caution - slippery when wet"
They were installing VLC
How does someone forget they put cones out on a runway of all places and then leave?
A Cone Placement Technician 3 is not authorized to contact the tower. The communication operator in the Cone-trol Center has to contact the Control Tower. He can’t pick them up, either: that’s the responsibility of a Cone Recovery Specialist 2 or higher.
Union rules.
They’re actually called Cone Placement Technician’s?
It’s a joke…
Oh thank God...
"Cone-trol Center" #Dead
A seemingly minor mistake of forgetting some cones that could’ve turned very bad. That’s a HUGE safety issue!
Luckily everyone remained calm and professional on frequency and that’s a great job by the Approach Controller!
yeah, especially as cones usually indicate a closure or similar
ATC: “okay you can’t land on 13L, can you land on 13R?”
China Eastern 297: “yes we accept 13R.”
30 seconds later
China Eastern 297: “can we have runway 13L?”
ATC: u wot
Yes, that was very irritating.
Great video. Too bad Kennedy Steve wasn’t around for this.
Michael Rogers gosh it sounds like him....
I can't even imagine all the snarky comments he would be making haha!
He wouldve seen the cones and got tug99 to go pickem up. lol
00Billy and yelled at Delta tug to go faster 😂
oops..thats right delta tug...lmao.
If alien airliners ever invade the earth, we'll know how to stop them! Cones!
Best comment ever!!
"Its a fluid situation"
- Kennedy Steve
;)
"Who's the Cone-head that placed those on the runway?"--Kennedy Steve.
The graphics showing us what's going on are both adorable and invaluable! Thank you!
Great job by the crew. Thanks for sharing!
Those Russian pilots looking up the word "cones" in their dictionary before they can answer. :-) At least that's what it sounds like.
It would be interesting to hear that conversation after about what were the cones doing there, and why the ATC controller didn't know about them
Wow, those dispatchers are really pushing the limits of the airport's capacity! Not like it's a bad thing, but telling pilots to hurry up on the runway because someone is already landing right behind them isn't something I'd expect to hear on ATC radio.
JFK is one of the busiest if not the busiest airports in the world. Everyone can't keep circling just because Aeroflot wants to take their time
Imagine if some cones had been out in bad weather and reduced visibility
dont wanna even think of that
It was at night so...
i imagine the plane will be just fine, those cones will get rpped to pieces or easly steered around, if u can see them
spooks77 more likely (pieces of?) a cone or two get sucked into 1 or more engines, and I don't know what happens then but I'm pretty sure no pilot wants to find out. And especially no mechanic would want to find out.
Chances are the 22s or 4s would have been active via an ILS approach.
12:16 “the port authority is playing games”🤣🤣🤣
"Sorry for that"
- "That's not your fault sir".
3 times.
Are you sure these are Russians and not Canadians?
Russians may seem cold but they do genuinely care a lot when it matters to them; I’m sure he was sitting in the cockpit like “it may not be my fault there’s cones but it is my aircraft blocking landings” poor guy wasn’t having a good day
😂😂😂
Requesting a Go Around :D
Aeroflot, go around, cones on the runway.
Roger
*the plane lands, went around the cones and exited runway *
'No you are not allowed to go around' :P
Unable, continue approach)
no that would be Air Canada.
Wow! I have become fascinated by these videos and all that goes on in them. The ATC's are simply amazing. How they keep it all straight in their minds with proper altitudes, where everyone is, and what is going on is amazing to me.
That this could happen without ATC being aware is a real indictment of some serious system problem and also a massive lump of stupidity from someone! And that the Russian pilot/CP knew the English for cone is pretty good - well done Aeroflot!
Years ago when I was in a flying club, I took a Cessna 172 around the pattern one night. The winds were crazy but didn't have any problems. While taxiing back to the club parking area, an orange cone from a construction zone had blown onto a taxiway and was blocking it. I was able to squeeze around it but contacted the tower. They said they had no personnel to remove it. So I volunteered to walk out and remove it. There was already a twin engine aircraft stopped not able to proceed. I removed it and things kept moving.
After listening to half of this video my head hurts and I'm beginning to wonder how there's not more accidents. That's a lot to keep track of, so many planes, and some cones.
Happy to stay completely oblivious of what's going on while I'm comfortable in my seat in the cabin. A fact that will not change even after this video.
Can hear the stress in ATC voices even before there is an issue. They really need to do something to alleviate the pressure on them, it’s only gonna cause accidents otherwise.
a pandemic and drastic reduction in air traffic would do the trick.. oh wait..
Those ATC controllers deserve some type of promotion for that. Definitely a lot going on at once and they handled it like pros! Most controllers rage and lose their cool but these guys kept it professional all the way. Props to y’all
So much respect for those ATC folks. They do an amazing job.
JBU704: still standing by for runway assignment.
ATC: So am I
🤣
It is a joy to listen to these professionals. Thanks for sharing.
I have little idea of what their saying but the effective communication and organization when it comes to airports is so satisfying
"The Port Authorities playing games" 😂😂😂
Best way for the ground staff to take revenge for holding their paychecks ;) Make them hold the planes ! Even the Super ones !! On ATC side.. Its a symphony orchestra ! God give the controllers more eye's and ears.. ! Good coverage.. Well edited.. Felt like a thriller movie.. So many aircrafts so many voices.. An end with a Cresendo, and then again comes the dejavu ! ( we found cones again !! Lol.. )
Its terrifying to hear that the clearest, slowest and most understandable accent of all these calls is the very heavy, but slow and clear, American 1142 pilot with the southern accent...
I love the work you´re doing! This stuff is fun to follow!
Congrats to you all for getting around that mess.
Cone Management.
Now THAT is what we call a class A cluster#@!& !! 😂
Nice job by ATC handling that mess! 👍
Thanks for the amazing and interesting animations which made this video even more fun to watch!
Who needs to watch a soap opera. This is so entertaining and it’s just “cones”.
Sounds like ATC memes
#squawkdirtytome 🤣🤣🤣🤣
What I find weird is were the cones placed there or somewhere else and have then been moved by wind onto the runway.
Or who is the intern that are so insane to place cones on a active Runway?
Common Sense well it was only 10 knots so it shouldn’t do that
They're very light cones
counterfit5 are they? Seriously !
Because then I find it even more worryingly. You can’t have light objects flying around on a airport that’s absolutely insane.
its like a play cone that kids use while playing outside
Nicky D I doubt it.
But if that’s true and the airport uses that kind of equipment.
Then I’m sorry there is a extreme safety concerns.
Biggest delay caused by "Ey, u, Passangers!.....How u say "cone" in English?!"
Wow, what a chain reaction. JFK is such a tight knit net. I can't imagine an airport more stressful for an ATC. Inredible that humans can keep so calm under such constant pressure.
Pilot: “… waiting for our RWY assignment”
ATCO: “so am I” 😎😅
Then straightaway
Pilot 2: “waiting also for RWY assignment”
ATCO: “alright, all station standby, we have an issue …” 😤
Seems like these pilots didn’t care listening to the frequency and disregarded that RWY 13L was blocked and that the ATCO was busy resequencing all other AC in order of priority and level order.
I felt for that ATCO.
Cones: YOU SHALL NOT TAXI!
Excellent job right there!
how the hell can anybody understand anybody else and planes just don't crash into each other all the time is amazing. ATC is legend.
This reminds me of the scene from"A Bug's Life" when the ants trail gets blocked by a leaf. They can't move until another ant comes and guides the first any around the leaf and back onto the trail.
The JFK controllers have nerves made of steel. I would get a nervous breakdown.
Being an ATC is rated at one of the most stressful jobs, even above a marine door kicker. Take a moment to think about that. Someone who breaks into enemy territory constantly at risk of being shot, exploded, tortured, killed, are generally less stressed than ATCs. Some might not understand so let me put it to you this way. One single mistake or miscommunication and YOU killed possibly hundreds of innocent people, costing MILLIONS of dollars, lost your job, and are looking at felony charges. They have to have a 100% success rate.
He had no other option
This video is an absolute classic .
No idea how many times I‘ve watched it at this point
Such a critical situation affecting ground controller - TWR and then APP. However, the ATC did a great job and acting rapidly, maintaining safety and expeditious. So proud of you guys!
Thanks for sharing!
Even CTR controllers might get affected by this situation holding traffics from up above so that the Tracon doesn't get congested. Few cones = Mess everywhere.
True!
I don’t understand why China Eastern accepted 13R when they sounded like they couldn’t make that landing from the get-go.
Maybe the thought they could descend and later realized they were not gonna be able.
When performing Canarsie approach at JFK runway 13R can be much more difficult than 13L
I don't see a problem here. Last minute change runway assignment. China Eastern tried to accommodate 13R. Then realized approach was a bit high.Then they decided go around instead of foring the airplane down.its a good airmanship here.
They could have just slipped the airplane.
Something I simply HAVE to mention since everyone is complaining about Chinese pilots all they time: They perfectly understood ATC, they spoke good English and the realized they were coming in a little too high.
That’s how Chinese crews work in general, just felt like I needed to say that.
Or anchorage flash backs.
Ni Pr Yeah. I agree, but hearing some ATC, it's kinda rare to see any Chinese pilots to speak broken English.
They were unsure whether they could accept 13R or not. Then they just took it according to the standard asian uncertainty culture...
And to top it off they then didn't even manage to execute a standard visual approach.
But they spoke acceptable english you are right there.
Hum...
- CES297 Heavy, do you have the airport in sight ?
- Uugh... Roger CES297
Ni Pr tell that to the chinese pilots who skid off the runway in naia international airport last month. That mishap caused a huge ripple effect. Had an important meeting to attend to in manila but airport/runway is closed due to that. So I wasnt able to attend.
By far.. The best and most entertaining I've watched in the ATC chronicles... 😂
I have many more interesting videos
@@VASAviation yup.. I've watched almost all of them.. Keep it up.. You're doin a great job and thank you for sharing them..
Wow. That whole mess due to some cones. (I do understand that the plane cannot ignore the cones, and must wait for them to be removed.) Much respect for the ATC and how this was handled.
Something about the speed and efficiency of operations like this is fascinating to me. I'm very fortunate to have been trained in an environment like this and I have no problems talking to ATC because of it!
Exactly why you triple check personnel and equipment after airfield operations are completed and only then are NOTAMS terminated.
Very helpful videos. Thanks
Ground crew: „damn! Forgot the cones!“
I was praying Steve would be in here and I was NOT disappointed! :)
i have too much anxiety just watching this. kudos to the guys and gals that can handle this on a daily basis.
Sounded like Kennedy Steve on Ground. It was a very slightly panicked "He's not on my frequency any more!" but he bounced right back with "The port authority's playing games!"
Simply amazing the confusion a few traffic cones can cause when nobody knows they're in the way till a plane's almost on top of them! Great teamwork all round between the various ATCs, though!
Literally no one:
JFK airport: *CONESS!*