As a Sona/Shyvana main, I can understand where people are coming from... Still, Shyvana isn't a floating musician. She's a soldier, one who could easily pick up Sett and hurl him halfway to Noxus. I don’t think she should be Udyr's size, but she should at least be bulky enough to make Jarvan cry. You may interpret how you want. I just hope she gets to keep the flexibility to be an unkillable tank or a walking fireball dispensary.
Thats just your stupid fantasy of having a couple where the female is bigger and bulkier than the male. You literally used it as an argument, I hate how this stupid game is doing stupid changes for the sake of weird people with weird taste. SHYVANA DOESNT NEED TO BE GIANT, SINCE SHE CAN LITERALLY TRANSFORM INTO A DRAGON, SHE DOESNT NEED TO BE GIANT, FEMALE WARRIORS IN HISTORY WERE NOT BIGGER THAN MALES, THEY WERE SKILLED WOMEN.
I think her slenderness works for her. She doesn’t need to be bulky BECAUSE she’s a dragon. She’s not defined by human standards, those muscles can be lean and still pack more punch illaoi and that’s one beefy chica. That said, this someone’s interpretation of her and her concept so it’s not that big of a deal to begin with
@@VortexTalon there are frankly too many slender women in League already. There's plenty of room for a bulky, muscular, feral female dragon lady. Slender egirls are overdone and would be an insult to her concept.
@@liamcostello8314 not in the slightest. You’d be better off arguing that for Leona than shyv. Even riven would be a better one to argue that it does her more of a disservice. Shyv is a dragon, even in human form. It’s more her armor that does her a disservice than anything. Please listen carefully, she doesn’t NEED to be bulky but she CAN be if the designers so decide. Just because you run into a slender dragon doesn’t suddenly make it less threatening. It will still overpower you in every way. Besides, it’s not like she’s got no definition or anything she’s still got muscle shes just slim, which is not a crime for her
@@VortexTalonlet’s be real here, riot isn’t the best at implying muscle on a slender figure. Sure she’s a dragon but she’s also a soldier, it makes sense for her to be built. Of course they could make her super toned but I really can’t see them going that direction when the body types are either “slender model who is fasting” and “buff”
I don’t care if they go buff skinny or anything in between, as long as they make her look intense I’ll be happy. Her whole deal in game is slamming down on an enemy in dragon form and smacking them to death, she should look brutal / scary.
@@FrankieWilliams-kx9gpi see noone read her lore I guess, she's supposed to be someone restricting who they want to be, because they want to be accepted. Her whole deal is a critism to how demacian's one world view just prevents varity of heroes in their own ranks, resulting in way less powerful individuals to become those heroes. Shyvana wants to be accepted but misunderstands who she should look to be accepted by. So skyen's own take is the best for her as character keeping her Dragon and human leigange as dragons are beefy and as a frontline warrior she should be one. But one thing che shouldn't be at all is vicious, that would get her whole goal in the first place. She isn't some pathetic monster walking mindlessy attacking whatever she can find or angsty teenager. She's a person who wants to be loved just sadly that love is conditional for who she finds. Thats what makes her unique as a character, being a suversion of the muscular monster sterotype. They instead should leave that idea for primal shyvana who's skin is about becoming more animalastic or the Tiger based skins. There the idea is actually fitting and enhances that fantasy.
@@alexcat6685you can have all that with her looking buff. Her looking clearly animalistic would be even better bc its something that no matter how much she tries, she can't hide that "otherness". Her looking like every other female character would be frankly boring
As a main shyvana and since she appeared in this game a long time ago, I understand why the community may want one thing or the other in terms of her physique. Personally, the important thing is that her aesthetics, body, skills and lore are coherent and striking, that it is unique. Of course, being a dragon and a trained warrior... I think her physique should represent her in the best way possible, as well as her skill kit, I'm not a fan of the Shyvana AP, I would prefer a melee warrior and keep the W almost intact. Thats because i love your designs!!!!
There are very few characters that I think should look like “mess around and find out”. On the female character roster Shyvana is one, along with Illoai and Vi. Give us build Shyv, whether that be built up or absolute unit, make her Muscle Mommy!
@@Deltastream7567 I loved the design for Arcane, fits a bit better for what she is meant to be. I’m happy they gave her the design as a skin but I think it would have been a great opportunity to overhaul her design. Same with Caitlyn.
@@ariesoginaro1062 they both look wayyyyyyy better in arcane, i know league have to deal with the curse of top down games by having to have INSANE proportions for every character to be instantly recognisable. But Corset skinny Vi and at-the-edge-of-breaking-her-own-legs stock Caitlyn are not the best design choices for those characters :c
"We want sexy anime girl, if not we gonna boycott" . Dudes, sexy anime characters is what we've been getting for the past 5 years, not mentioning every skin line for the past 6 years. I like anime, but cmon, you can't tell me you don't like playing with a world ending, all consuming avengers level threat as Cho'gath or the literal incarnation of nightmares that Nocture could and should be but we don't talk about that.
@@patrickcarter2829 What are these "extreme niche kits" everyone keeps talking about? Hwei, a human champion with a very weird kit for League standards, is one of the most popular champions in the game right now whereas Naafiri, a monster champion with a very straightforward assassin kit, has 1/7th the play rate and is one of the least popular champions in the game. Also, it completely ignores the simple fact that if Riot gave those exact same "extreme niche kits" to a human champion their playrate would be 10 times higher. Humans like humans, it's as simple as that.
@@leetri perhaps the more apt term is "unconventional"? My personal reference is to the likes of Rek'Sai and old ASol; kits that require an almost Specialist mindset that leads to very few players utilizing them. This is a nitpick, but Naafiri is more of a creature design than a monster (like Lilia or Smolder): designs that are familiar enough that they don't feel monstrous. Pretty much, my interpretation of a "monster champion" are champions like Fiddlesticks, Vel'Koz, Cho'Gath, etc.: designs that lean more towards the abstract, looking alien from the wildlife of Runeterra; Naafiri's design (from my perspective) is too simplistic. I kinda wished it played more into body horror.
People will really see a character design from Riot, go "Wtf is this? I can't fuck this!" and proceed to dislike that character as their one personality trait
Dude power to you for ignoring the people with the brain dead sex sells takes. We love a thick lady, a muscle lady, scars, everything has beauty in being. And as someone who enjoys all the fantastic directions you take your art and stories, thank you for keeping people engaged and creative. Been watching a long time, thanks for making it worth it
both pls and pls not get this as a evil message to you but pls say not shyvana noob champ i think people who write her with 2 n never played more then 1 game with her and then say noob champ etc. sorry that needet out , she is out since nearly beginning and nearlly 80% of the community not know how to write her name ^^
@@thatguyoverthere8823 i just made a joke post , on shyvana buf i wish a buf, vgu and kit rework and sexy . Ahri is ugly and have a massive fan base kindred just furry but too a monster fan base lets give her too one maybe less armor more boobs idk xD or people just fear dragons too in fantasy and pref demons who knows x)
I know I most probably agree with you because I have leaned a significant amount from you and as an artist I value that but I can not imagine a world where I would prefer her to stay the way she is now or turns into a generically appealing design with nothing to differentiate her from all the rest
Everyone complaining about your Shyvanna rework being too bulky are cowards of the highest degree. It's not the Shyvanna they deserve, but it's the one they need to finally appreciate some good design
I prefer the bulk, but if someone prefers the slender Shyvana, that's fine. Having an epic warrior with a "traditionally feminine" look is neat in it's own way. But I think that's already pretty represented tbh
I love a Muscle Mommy. Illoai is one of my favourite champs, and your Shyvana design was rad as hell. With this VGU I guess I'd appreciate a different flavour of Muscle Mommy. More of a UFC build than a StrongMan.
@joshjo9405 exactly. Personally if I was involved in this VGU I'd be pushing for a top heavy 'dorito' look. Big, broad shoulders. Like a swimmer's physique. Definition as opposed to Illoai's bulky hourglass.
on the scale from sejuani to illaoi, i would love if she was like 65% on the way to illaoi. i want her to look like she could choke a man with her elbow. this could be little lesbian brain infatuation with women who can hurl me halfway back in time to the roman empire, but shyv is like… strength trapped in a repressed shell that’s begging to come out. if she just has ahri body and sejuani face, i might stampede riot and delete yasuo or one of their favorite champs. but you’re right, she should have a less udyr/illaoi flavor and moreso a sejuani on roids flavor. i’m excited!
It really isn't; if the choice is between sexy but not buff Shyvana and buff but not sexy Shyvana, some people want the former. And yes, despite your personal preferences, there is such a thing as buff but not sexy. Generally, such a person is buff, but not in a proportional or balanced way so their mix of hypertrophic and unmuscular body parts creates a visually displeasing appearance.
@@pokinfunatcartman hey buddy have you ever considered that a literal half dragon woman wouldn't ever have a lean build? would make more sense to make her built more like Ilaoi
There are people who already love shyvana, wich are imo more important in the decission than some random people that dont even care what the champion was before the rework.
@@bloodworkdc2106i just don’t think league has to pander to that demographic so hard it completely undermines shyvana’s design. she is improved by being buff from a design standpoint, it expresses her character. people liked vi before arcane, does this mean in a vi asu she should keep looking the way she does without any influence from the design that better explains her character (arcane)? besides, bringing in new audiences to understand and appreciate shyv is an upgrade.
@@bloodworkdc2106idiotic take, when people who do love her, want her to be buff dragon lady. also if you just look at her story, it makes no sense if she isn't a "fuck around and find out" buff lady. Besides we have 2933843 skinny sexy girls already.
@@sleepyrose69 Why cant you make a single valid or logic argument? What of being buff expresses her character? That makes no sense, what character are you talking about btw? Her being half dragon? Her personality? Being buff isnt needed to reflect she is half dragon when she literally have more traits of dragon than human even in her HUMAN FORM. She has dragon scales, purple skin, dragon eyes, dragon feets. Tell me a single HUMAN TRAIT in her dragon form my friend.... Not a single one. You telling that being buff, bulky or whatever expresses her character is just your fucking opinion and its objectively stupid. From the huge amount of hybrids we have in league (vastayan or not) she is the female one that expreses her beast nature the better. Just compare Shyvana human form to fking nidalee or Xayah. Shyvana doesnt need to be bigger to express anything about her nature, that is just how you would like her and priorizing your opinion over the people who for years have played her and liked her design. And for some reason, treating your subjective opinion as an argument.
the part where u showed the negative feedback to your design made me unreasonably mad and i am not proud of it. i don't exactly know how people see the highlight of Shyvana, an elemental dragon who found her way into society and is making a change in a heavily against magic nation by showing them that she is as "human" as they are (even though i don't enjoy the part where she kills her mother trying to "rescue" her), being a "sexy dragon"... i always thought there was a consensus that her being model slim and sexy acted as a detriment to her character, what is wrong with these people?
the comment that said "Removing shyvana's sexiness loses a bit of her" enraged me so deeply and i don't fucking care BECAUSE WHERE IN THE ACTUAL FUCK IS IT EVER ACKNOWLEDGED OR EVEN HINTED THAT HER SEXINESS IS AN IMPORTANT ASPECT TO HER CHARACTER. HER APPEARANCE IS LITERALLY MEANT TO BE MORE MONSTER-ISH BECAUSE SHE'S A MAGICAL MONSTER TRYING TO MAKE HERSELF FIT INTO A COUNTRY THAT'S RACIST AGAINST ANYTHING MAGICAL. Like just tell me you don't read the lore without telling me you don't read the lore.
@@Lolamy RIGHT??????????????? HER LORE ACTUALLY INDICATES THAT SHE WOULD IN FACT NOT BE WELL RECEIVED BY THE HUMAN STANDARTS, making her a sexy pinup babe who is generally appealing and is ostracized only because "why she uorple" is counterintuitive, it's kai'sa but older. In a fantasy world where you can portray MANY types of prejudice and characters that battle those prejudices in many many ways, doing it like that is kinda lazy and on the nose. All that paired with the fact that she is A FUCKING WARRIOR DRAGON LIKE... DOES THAT NOT SOUND LIKE A BIG AND MUSCULAR INDIVIDUAL????
me too, literally holding myself to not start telling every single ppl on this very comment section defending skinny sexy shyv or attacking bucky woman to fuck off!
Here’s the thing, BUFF SHYVANA IS SEXY! There’s a ton of people already thirsting over the big, muscled, scarred feral dragon lady! She’s just not THE MOST GENERIC IDEA OF SEXINESS IMAGINABLE.
There is something especially entitled about people insulting a design because it does not appeal to THEIR veiw of what is sexy. There are thousands of conventionally attractive characters but they can't keep there mouths shut when one isn't? Character design is so much more then boring basic sex appeal for the sake of sex appeal.
I absolutely adore the Shyvana piece made throughout this video, loved seeing the process. And i fully agree, our mommy dragon needs more muscles on those bones.
I'm happy to hear that those kind of comments aren't getting you down. I love your VGU concepts and like you I'm a big fan of Shyvana, and I also want her to be as Shyvana-like as she can for her update. To me, that's an imposing, beefy Shyv that turns into an imposing, beefy dragon. Keep up the great work!
The anemic look could work if they changed the lore a bit. Due to Demacia's hate of magic and anything related to it, shyvana is forced to wear magic suppressant cuffs. However dragons need their magic to flow to be healthy giving her that anemic human form. Then freeing her self from the cuffs allows her to be a strong healthy dragon. (Edit) I just realized that this premise could lead to a good story where she is a physical representation for Demacia. They fear magic so they suppress it in hopes of making them safe but in reality they are only making themselves weaker by doing so.
sorta, they are right now in a slow paced change, maybe the kingdom with jarvan as the lead is seeing mages with better eyes, but common citizens in demacia will not take the change freely, so probably the plot of demacia will might go as "we are not going to kill mages or jail them because who they are, thats barbaric, but they are dangerous so we still are gonna supress magic in the kingdom"@@luizhenriquedasilva1538
@@luizhenriquedasilva1538 Nah in mageseeker it's discussed that they're trying to stop it but the mageseekers are still too powerful and also because they're back by Kayle they've go some pretty big backing.
Smh my head, shyvana can't be strong and buff cause she's a woman, and everyone knows women have paper skin and glass bones. Every morning they break their legs, and every afternoon they break their arms. At night, they lie awake in agony until their heart attacks puts them to sleep. So making shyvana not look like she would topple from a breeze is going against her character if you really think about it.
I hate when peoples biggest complaints about a character is that they 'aren't sexy enough', especially when it comes to female characters. Why do they have to be sexy? Can't they just exist as a character with a body type we don't get to see often?
I really like muscular Shyvana, and I especially like concept C for the Shyvana ASU that Riot is doing. I think my main issue with your newest Shyvana redesign is that she looks like a tank, not like the berserker type character that both me and many other people seem to prefer as the direction for Shyvana. This is mainly due to the armor, it just makes her look *too* stout and bulky, again, like a tank.
Well it wasn’t that long ago that she was being built as a tank, even now it isn’t unheard of. She’s a soldier after all I would hope her armor looks bulky enough to actually take a hit
@@shmooters5599 Yes, tank Shyvana can work thematically speaking. It's just that me and many others don't think that it should be the direction she goes in. I agree that she should be wearing armor that looks bulky to some degree, but the armor in the second subjectively redesign of her was overly bulky, mainly the pauldrons.
I’m sorry but if you think bulky women are “ugly as sin”, I have zero respect for you 💀 I don’t follow League at all, but I really love the designs you did for her! It’d be so cool if they went in that direction
I'm just confused as to why people would take issue with the DRAGON champ being absolutely jacked. Life dude, are we not on the same page about what dragons look like? Even within runeterra, barring a select few, they're all MASSIVE and JACKED. Sure, she could be made a really slender fast-moving dragon waifu, but there's nothing wrong with wanting her to look like she can tear a petricite golem in half with her bare hands.
I really appreciate the impromptu video! This is definitely a topic to discuss. And I think this is exactly why we need more diversity in character body types. We’ve been so bombarded with the same body types over and over (not just females) that characters like Illaoi and Vi stand out so much because they’re different, but we should be exploring this as artists and creatives! Another reason we can get hyped about Ambessa Medarda!
The people complaining about her being too bulky, is a symptom of a larger problem, the higher-ups at riot and there whales (gotcha game slang for someone who pours insane amounts of money for something, like prestige skins) Riot gets a lot of their money from characters and skins of sexy characters, they see this and so prioritize in order to continue the flow of money, it’s the unfortunate situation of both sides perpetuating each other so a lot of the more interesting ideas are left to the wayside unless it’s a character most people don’t care about or their model is so old it needs to be completely revamped. I always love listening to you and TB skyen’s ideas for character redesigns and new lore, but it also shows the absolute wasted potential of these characters
They want her to be nimble and agile, but then you see Volibear, Udyr, Warwick, and SION blistering down the lane or through the jungle at the speed of a moving train, being both intimidating and powerful but not the dragon-hybrid lady. They want her to be skinny and hot because the other 60 or however many chicks in the game aren’t enough, even though her lore SAYS she’s supposed to be imposing and very “other”. I’m so tired of people thinking characters need to be tailored toward them when they’re not even the ones championing for her to get updated. They’re not playing her. They’re not searching for content on her. It’s not about them, yet it’s offensive that it isn’t FOR them. I really hope she becomes everything we want, and everything they wish she wasn’t
They've already confirmed that Shyvana's rework will be an Udyr-style VGU, which is already great news from the perspective of narrative progression. Plus this kind of "character progression" VGU has been better known for taking a character's best qualities and pushing them to the forefront. Pantheon may still read as a Spartan, but now he's clearly a TARGONIAN Spartan.
Acceptable Male characters: Scrawny, puny, meathead, roid rage freak, actual skeleton, actual bear, lank, lean, 5 year old, 500 year old, reformed sludge pile, unformed sludge pile, riddled with disability, an angel, a biblically accurate angel, a suave demon, a bestial demon, Frankenstein's monster, a bowl of spaghetti. Acceptable Female characters: 21 year old human that's skinny except the T&A.
I didn't play much League when I had time, but when I did, and Shyvana was available, I always looked past her because she never read as the heavy hitting dragon that she was supposed to be. I hope that with her VGU she gets the strength to back those punches. Or fireballs.
Buff Dragon Lady Supremacy In a year and a half we will be able to have over a half a tram comprised of mega buff women: Illaoi, Ambessa Medarda and Shyv
I dislike the need for all game characters to fit into basically one body type. It just feels so boring and limiting for designs and visual storytelling. Like idk why people essentially want one model with a thousand different skins over it...
Muscular woman scare people and that’s okay. That’s what I personally think makes them hot and cool, but to each their own ig. My vote obviously goes towards seeing her bulky seeing as she is a soldier, but we will have to wait and see what Riot thinks
I understand why someone wouldn't want her to go full buff (as she still has some humanity in her) but a lot of these complaints are very, VERY yikes. It feels less "I want a character with both human and dragon traits" and more "how dare Riot make One woman in this game that doesn't turn me on!"
jesus, how many same-face, generic, hourglass figures in unfitting outfits do people need? It makes up like 90% of all females in league INCLUDING the ones where it just doesn't make sense like Kai'sa, Shyvana, Zyra, Caitlin, Vi, Katarina, Nidalee, Leona, Cass, LeBlanc, Ashe, Soraka, Kayle, Camille to a degree, hell even Orianna leans far too heavily into a hour glass feminine figure rather than a younger girl like you'd expect her father to create. Meanwhile we have 1 large muscular woman, 1 visibly tone/athletic woman, 1 woman that actually appears older than their 20s, and maybe what Jinx, Qiyana, and Briar for notably different body types? Feels like they could bare to have a wee bit more diversity than another character that may as well be Miss Fortune in cosplay.
"OOOOooouuuughgh youre just making another ilaoi, we already have a muscle lady" Cut to the like 25 convencionally sexy same face women already in the game
I think New Shyvana should look like a cross fit woman with a few scars which are also hot now that's sexy but also incredibly feminine, and it's not exactly accepted as an objective "sexy" look for women, but most importantly i think it fits the idea of Shyvana imo she should be like abnormally tall seeing how she a hybrid humanoid in form mostly with strong accents of her draconic heritage @6:09 I think it's incredibly comical people that aren't artiest and more than likely couldn't draw to save there life have such strong opinions on what a redesigned should look like that's fucking priceless. XD To each their own but I for one think your redesign was well expressed and worked. I agree with breaking "beauty" social norms and people swooning over fictional characters they probable want to fantasize about sleep with......shocker XD
I love the “We don’t need another illaoi!! We already have one buff woman we don’t need more” …. So we need 50 other big breasted skinny anime women? I completely agree that making her buff will be a visual indicator of her past and her story. Sex appeal can be a first but it makes a damn lousy character if it doesn’t fit their story. I rally for buff shyvana ✊
Bro who ever thinks that muscle mommies aren't hot have issues. I still think we should have 5 women (and men) for each body type. AT THE VERY LEAST where my chubby waifus at? Where's my... Uh... hmm... Tentacle husbandos? Idk men actually have more variety in league than I thought. But yea if memory serves me right we actually have 0 chubby women in league. Edit: p.s.: please don't let this be the last video about shyvana.
I love the middle image of the 3 early concepts they show, has the muscles and the fiery passion, an awesome pose, dope hair, muscles, everything but petricite armor
I too was upset about her getting second for so many years in the VGU polls. I am glad that it is finally happening and I share in your joy when first hearing about her finally getting a VGU, I got so pumped up and excited that I had just started to shake from pure excitement. I honestly really like your videos on a Shyvana rework where you explore her being a muscle mommy similar to Illaoi and I really like them overall. Keep up the amazing work you do and here's to our favorite champs finally getting a VGU. Also are you an AD Shyvana enjoyer or are you an AP Shyvana enjoyer? (Personally I love her AD power fantasy version more, more satisfying imo)
I personally am one who thinks she shouldnt look like illaoi, but i do think she should be fairly bulky. I am hoping they make her look more wild especially since her departure from demacia.
I like how "Another Illaoi" is the only thing they'll say, because Illaoi is the only Woman in league (off the top of my head) with that body type. WE NEED MORE!! MUSCLE MOMMY FTW
Shyvana definitely needs an update, visually at the least. And I do absolutely hope that Riot makes her jacked, girl needs to be able to deadlift cars imo. My big thing is that I just really hope they don't smother her in armor. She's a juggernaut, not a tank, there's a reason that the majority of the champions in that class are unarmored. Honestly it's the biggest issue I have with all of your potential design paths for her, it just feels like it holds her back, especially given she's supposed to be a shifter that turns into a giant dragon. Glad that the Riot sketches seem to be trending simultaneously less armored and less wiry, though.
It does seem like interest into the whole bulky body type on women is a rather niche thing. Which is fine, but unfortunately there are some out there who see a bulky woman as being "overweight" or "masculine," which is so dumb. Can't remember their name, but I remember seeing similar responses towards characters like the one in Across the Spider-verse (Haven't seen it yet, but will eventually), and Rory in My Adventures with Superman. It's pretty crazy. Though most of it is on Twitter and you know how that place is... My interest in League is mostly through the art and watching Arcane, but I've been getting curious about the lore as of late, and your League videos has definitely helped. You're very passionate about Shyvana and I do like how open-minded you are about the possible results, not caring too much about sex appeal. That being said, I do hope Shyvana gets the Muscle Mommy look. We need more buff women. We got one dragon that's massive, but skinny-ish, and another that's tiny and cute, so why not a buff one, right? Who knows? Maybe an artist or few working with Riot have seen your videos about Shyvana. It's possible. We'll see what happens!
to let everyone know if you don't know. but Riot did say that this is more udyr style vgu then scarner. so while yes she will probably get some muscle her entire build will not change. as Riot stated that this will be a continuation of her story from the mageseeker game. so she wont turn into illoai but be more like vi lilth and sexy but extremlly strong and muscluar
Baldurs Gate III showed us all that muscle mommys are also quite liked by a lot of people. Karlack is literally a BUFFED Thiefling and people find her hot AF(pun intended)
@@joshuagonzalez4183 yes. compare Karlach to this guy's Shyvana redesign and the difference is night and day. Karlach is actually a great example of how to make a muscular character look good instead of overly bulky
Pay no mind to the tunnel vision weirdos with their fantasy of dom effing a fantasy lizard girl, which falls apart the moment she doesn't look like her arms will break apart like spaghetti. It's ridiculous that that's the only complaint they can figure out. "She's supposed to be agile" that in no way implies not bulky, one can be bulky and fast/agile at the same time. Besides, the only agility that ever came through in her design is her flight as a dragon, which is stupid because her wings barely look like wings at all, more like malformed arms with weird flaps attached. She's not giving Rathalos, she's giving Tigrex.
it does make me sad that we're probably never got like. a straight up fat female league champion, or even slightly chubby female champion because of the loud minority of games who still want 2009 style miss fortune designs. it's annoying.
the visual update aside, from what they said her gameplay/abilities will be changed more like udyr and less like skarner, so i don't have my hopes up regarding drastic changes onto her skills, but i do think they will keep the choice to play her as ap and bruiser/tank alike, so that's a nice thing to look into to see what they'll change. We can't forget that her story won't be changed, but advanced instead into the post sylas game state that demacia was left, with her coming back to jarvan in a more magic accepting kingdom. I love to research and talk about the history and design of riot characters, and watching your videos about them makes me very happy to watch and learn from them, as i just graduated in design myself, so thank you for all your videos and i'm hoping to see even more of them as they come
Shyvana NEEDS to be buff. The B and C variations shown in the concept art are FANTASTIC - alongside Subjectively's brilliant redesigns. And yet I've seen people, especially on the Shyvana reddit, saying C and especially B are bad and shouldn't be the final product. Shyvana is not a seductress, she's not meant to be enticing in that sense; she's a soldier and a DRAGON, she needs to be buff, strong and damaged. And as someone else has said saying that Shyvana needs to be "sexy" not only misses the point of her entire character, but it disregards buff women has being attractive or beautiful which they certainly are. It denotes sexyness as a concept to just Evelynn or Ahri type of characters which when stretched across to other characters makes it so boring and uninteresting, fanservice is important to a degree but it seems the only fanservice these people want are the type made for cishet reddit men to ogle at. I really hope riot gives her the body type and the design she deserves, Shyvana is my favourite champion and has so much potential.
Buff Shyv with a body covered in scars in armor standing a foot taller than Jarvan is my ideal. If they go skinny/waif I hope they give her a wild eyed gaze. The look of a woman who is pushed to the brink and will do what she needs to in order to accomplish a goal. If they want her to be a waifu/sexy that...fine I guess. I think they could do that with buff Shyv but if I had my choice I would take strides to show that just beneath that pleasing veneer there is a a volatile draconic powder keg that will incinerate you. Smoldering eyes/mouth, talons.
Not only do I not follow league, I actively do my best to leap over it's path, so as to not even tread upon the same ground as it's traveled. But I still watched the whole video, loved hearing your thoughts.
Champion redesigns are a huge part of why I love playing Legends of Runeterra so much. Have you seen what they did to Shyvana? She looks way better than in League. They freaking gave Illaoi _armpit hair,_ they did outstanding an outstanding rework of Seraphine and what they did to Janna blows me away. They have full representation of all kinds of bodies in other cards as well, and it's chef's kiss.
There are probably only three champions whose sex appeal matters to their identities: Evelynn, Ahri and Elise. Shyvana's characterization and lore give zero indication that sex appeal is important to her or the story that is being told with her. The designs you came up with for your fan VGUs were all perfect for selling the identity of the character Shyvana is SUPPOSED to be. As much as I myself love stereotypically sexy character designs, there's a time and place for that sort of character and I think League has used it to death. I enjoy watching your videos because they challenge my aesthetic sensibilities; you put out content I never would've considered, and that's so much more engaging as an artist than just seeing what I want to see all the time. Can't wait to see what you do next.
@@spartanscv That's a good point. It was vaguely justified before the vastaya lore update changed her backstory, but modern Ahri and launch Ahri are basically two entirely different characters.
I don’t want to be sexually enticed by a video game. I want to feel cool and have fun playing a character I enjoy. A huge muscular dragon lady is going to do that for me, and your designs have always dripped with intrinsic passion for the character.
Loathe gamers and I seethe at the mere IDEA of being so invested in a game whose community can only associate sex appeal with one super specific body type and weighs literally all fictional characters against it. I should be able to psychically harm people who have NEVER seen actual female throwers or weight lifters or body builders and yet have the GALL to say she should be lithe with a wasp waist rAAAAAGH
the funny thing is they didn't even make her THAT bulky. people are so used to The One Body Type for women in media that any amount of muscle or bulkiness becomes too much.
5:45 based on their concepts, I like the rightmost one, with the leftmost being a close second. This is from a thematic-narrative perspective. Frankly, I think a build similar to a middle-weight in MMA would be ideal: athletic, lean, and shows semblances of a fighter (kinda like Arcane Vi). My main concern is the Dragon Form; it's still early, but I think something like Smolder's mom would be a good frame of reference.
I actually love the middle one, gives her a more wild and unhinges side, like a berrserker Gives us a new flavour of muscle mommy differentiating her from Illaoi, not that that is needed but we don’t really have a wild woman in LoL
@@Breadcutter my problem with the middle one is that it doesn't really fit her lore; it would be an over-dramatization. If anything, her more berserk side should be her draconic form (when she can let loose), with her human side being more cordial (like the majesty of a dragon). Pretty much: human = draconic majesty; dragon = draconic ferocity.
@@patrickcarter2829 In what ways doens't it fit her lore? Wasn't she wild before she joined Jarvan, maybe I'm misremembering, still that side I think could shine through, even in her human form, majesty and ferocity aren't mutually exclusive
I'll be honest, when the Illaoi sticker began to pop up i fully expected you to cut to the Ambessa anouncment. She's also going to be the buff muscle-girl archetype. At least if they are true to Arcane's portrayal.
I've never played, to be honest, but I've never played most games, I'm afraid. ^^' Still, it's awesome to hear you talk about the character; it's downright infectious and I'm super happy for you, that your main is finally getting some much needed attention. To each their own, but as you said, rather than sex appeal, I prefer the focus of a character to be - you know - CHARACTER. Fingers crossed that this will be an awesome experience and we'll get to enjoy Shyvana's unlocked potential.
I'm honestly unreasonable irritated by these kinds of comments. I know that there's always going to be people like that but I just cannot get the mindset. Like, if you do a cursory scroll through leagues champions so many of the more obviously feminine ones are exactly the body type people are mourning the loss of with some of these redesign ideas. One less traditionally attractive overtly sexy champion in the roster is not going to hurt you. People really get so upset the second something doesn't immediately cater to them, even when they have so many other things which ARE catering to them
no matter what direction she ends up going, she's definitely needed this. was a fan of your rework, and while i'd personally prefer someone more on the lithe side, maybe the medium would be a sett-esque build--brawly, but still agile enough to perform leaps and dashes. then, perhaps, she'd actually gain the bulk she so deserves on her dragon transformation
I like a good muscle mommy but I too would like to say, I wouldn't like her to be like Illaio. First, it's not easy to pull off a look like Illaoi has, two, her human form is the weaker side compared to her dragon form so visuals must represent them. So going with examples, I would like her Sylas level muscular rather than Garen level.
Im going go go against the grain a little bit here, but i dont really like Shyvannas shownredesigns. Not because they made her buff- i like buff shyvana! But because... The still look kind of... Fanservicey. Not that theres anything wrong with being fanservicey, i just dont think that makes sense for Shyvana. None of them look like the reserved but quietly rageful solider of demacia that Shyvanna us to me. They all just look like buff sexy muscle woman as opposed to sexy skinny supermodel. And thats mainly the costuming i have a problem with really.
The one way i can describe a lack for a better term "middle ground", for shyvana having the body type of She-hulk in the comics. Not the over muscular body type, but the iconic build where she's buffed or "super toned" in the right places. Maybe that can satisfy both parties.
"the last video I do about shyvana" would be cool to have a video talking about her design once she does actually get released!
Maybe with a drawing of Subjectively Shyvana, VGU Shyvana and old (maybe classic dounds better?) Shyvana together for comparison.
Thank you for changing the thumbnail, I do in fact definitely own copyright to the “lets f***ing go” meme
And I know you’re litigious as hell too (let’s fucking lawyer up)
As a Sona/Shyvana main, I can understand where people are coming from... Still, Shyvana isn't a floating musician. She's a soldier, one who could easily pick up Sett and hurl him halfway to Noxus. I don’t think she should be Udyr's size, but she should at least be bulky enough to make Jarvan cry. You may interpret how you want. I just hope she gets to keep the flexibility to be an unkillable tank or a walking fireball dispensary.
Thats just your stupid fantasy of having a couple where the female is bigger and bulkier than the male. You literally used it as an argument, I hate how this stupid game is doing stupid changes for the sake of weird people with weird taste. SHYVANA DOESNT NEED TO BE GIANT, SINCE SHE CAN LITERALLY TRANSFORM INTO A DRAGON, SHE DOESNT NEED TO BE GIANT, FEMALE WARRIORS IN HISTORY WERE NOT BIGGER THAN MALES, THEY WERE SKILLED WOMEN.
I think her slenderness works for her. She doesn’t need to be bulky BECAUSE she’s a dragon. She’s not defined by human standards, those muscles can be lean and still pack more punch illaoi and that’s one beefy chica. That said, this someone’s interpretation of her and her concept so it’s not that big of a deal to begin with
@@VortexTalon there are frankly too many slender women in League already. There's plenty of room for a bulky, muscular, feral female dragon lady. Slender egirls are overdone and would be an insult to her concept.
@@liamcostello8314 not in the slightest. You’d be better off arguing that for Leona than shyv. Even riven would be a better one to argue that it does her more of a disservice. Shyv is a dragon, even in human form. It’s more her armor that does her a disservice than anything. Please listen carefully, she doesn’t NEED to be bulky but she CAN be if the designers so decide. Just because you run into a slender dragon doesn’t suddenly make it less threatening. It will still overpower you in every way. Besides, it’s not like she’s got no definition or anything she’s still got muscle shes just slim, which is not a crime for her
@@VortexTalonlet’s be real here, riot isn’t the best at implying muscle on a slender figure. Sure she’s a dragon but she’s also a soldier, it makes sense for her to be built. Of course they could make her super toned but I really can’t see them going that direction when the body types are either “slender model who is fasting” and “buff”
I've never had much interest in League, but your love for Shyvanna has always kept me invested. Congrats!!
when I read the word "waifuable" in the fucking hate mail my blood boiled so much I alone increased the world temperature 1 degree celsius
those who do not want buff women to be their wife are cowards
Lowkey cant believe the idea of a stronger buff shyvana is a debated one? Like its obvious..
I don’t care if they go buff skinny or anything in between, as long as they make her look intense I’ll be happy. Her whole deal in game is slamming down on an enemy in dragon form and smacking them to death, she should look brutal / scary.
@@FrankieWilliams-kx9gp exactly, more emotion, they got plenty more sexy womans, we want someone that can express the felling of power of a dragon
@@FrankieWilliams-kx9gpi see noone read her lore I guess, she's supposed to be someone restricting who they want to be, because they want to be accepted.
Her whole deal is a critism to how demacian's one world view just prevents varity of heroes in their own ranks, resulting in way less powerful individuals to become those heroes.
Shyvana wants to be accepted but misunderstands who she should look to be accepted by.
So skyen's own take is the best for her as character keeping her Dragon and human leigange as dragons are beefy and as a frontline warrior she should be one.
But one thing che shouldn't be at all is vicious, that would get her whole goal in the first place.
She isn't some pathetic monster walking mindlessy attacking whatever she can find or angsty teenager.
She's a person who wants to be loved just sadly that love is conditional for who she finds.
Thats what makes her unique as a character, being a suversion of the muscular monster sterotype.
They instead should leave that idea for primal shyvana who's skin is about becoming more animalastic or the Tiger based skins.
There the idea is actually fitting and enhances that fantasy.
@@alexcat6685 why can’t she be badass though? All I’d want is for her to look like the power trip she feels like when playing her in the game.
@@alexcat6685you can have all that with her looking buff. Her looking clearly animalistic would be even better bc its something that no matter how much she tries, she can't hide that "otherness". Her looking like every other female character would be frankly boring
As a main shyvana and since she appeared in this game a long time ago, I understand why the community may want one thing or the other in terms of her physique.
Personally, the important thing is that her aesthetics, body, skills and lore are coherent and striking, that it is unique.
Of course, being a dragon and a trained warrior... I think her physique should represent her in the best way possible, as well as her skill kit, I'm not a fan of the Shyvana AP, I would prefer a melee warrior and keep the W almost intact. Thats because i love your designs!!!!
There are very few characters that I think should look like “mess around and find out”. On the female character roster Shyvana is one, along with Illoai and Vi. Give us build Shyv, whether that be built up or absolute unit, make her Muscle Mommy!
Same with Sejuani, for me personally
On God. VI’s my main and that’s the only gripe I have with her design. Just bulk her up and that’s it
@@Deltastream7567 I loved the design for Arcane, fits a bit better for what she is meant to be. I’m happy they gave her the design as a skin but I think it would have been a great opportunity to overhaul her design. Same with Caitlyn.
@@ariesoginaro1062 they both look wayyyyyyy better in arcane, i know league have to deal with the curse of top down games by having to have INSANE proportions for every character to be instantly recognisable. But Corset skinny Vi and at-the-edge-of-breaking-her-own-legs stock Caitlyn are not the best design choices for those characters :c
Maybe a personal opinion here, but I want this with Riven too, like they did a little with her in LoR.
"We want sexy anime girl, if not we gonna boycott" . Dudes, sexy anime characters is what we've been getting for the past 5 years, not mentioning every skin line for the past 6 years. I like anime, but cmon, you can't tell me you don't like playing with a world ending, all consuming avengers level threat as Cho'gath or the literal incarnation of nightmares that Nocture could and should be but we don't talk about that.
True. The problem also stems from Riot saying that monster champions aren't profitable (when they give them the most niche kits imaginable).
@@patrickcarter2829 What are these "extreme niche kits" everyone keeps talking about? Hwei, a human champion with a very weird kit for League standards, is one of the most popular champions in the game right now whereas Naafiri, a monster champion with a very straightforward assassin kit, has 1/7th the play rate and is one of the least popular champions in the game.
Also, it completely ignores the simple fact that if Riot gave those exact same "extreme niche kits" to a human champion their playrate would be 10 times higher. Humans like humans, it's as simple as that.
@@leetri perhaps the more apt term is "unconventional"? My personal reference is to the likes of Rek'Sai and old ASol; kits that require an almost Specialist mindset that leads to very few players utilizing them.
This is a nitpick, but Naafiri is more of a creature design than a monster (like Lilia or Smolder): designs that are familiar enough that they don't feel monstrous. Pretty much, my interpretation of a "monster champion" are champions like Fiddlesticks, Vel'Koz, Cho'Gath, etc.: designs that lean more towards the abstract, looking alien from the wildlife of Runeterra; Naafiri's design (from my perspective) is too simplistic. I kinda wished it played more into body horror.
People will really see a character design from Riot, go "Wtf is this? I can't fuck this!" and proceed to dislike that character as their one personality trait
kaisa stans whenever someone thinks "hey she could look better" :
Dude power to you for ignoring the people with the brain dead sex sells takes. We love a thick lady, a muscle lady, scars, everything has beauty in being. And as someone who enjoys all the fantastic directions you take your art and stories, thank you for keeping people engaged and creative. Been watching a long time, thanks for making it worth it
When did we as a society turn our backs on muscle mommies
anyone who says "I don't want buff shyvanna I want sexy shyvanna" has automatically lost the plot because BUFF WOMEN ARE SEXY
both pls and pls not get this as a evil message to you but pls say not shyvana noob champ i think people who write her with 2 n never played more then 1 game with her and then say noob champ etc. sorry that needet out , she is out since nearly beginning and nearlly 80% of the community not know how to write her name ^^
@@onepiecechecker What?
@@thatguyoverthere8823 i just made a joke post , on shyvana buf i wish a buf, vgu and kit rework and sexy . Ahri is ugly and have a massive fan base kindred just furry but too a monster fan base lets give her too one maybe less armor more boobs idk xD or people just fear dragons too in fantasy and pref demons who knows x)
@@onepiecechecker Brother is english your third language?
@@thatguyoverthere8823 yes xD
I know I most probably agree with you because I have leaned a significant amount from you and as an artist I value that but I can not imagine a world where I would prefer her to stay the way she is now or turns into a generically appealing design with nothing to differentiate her from all the rest
So many years and 2nd place runs, she finally is get the update
in chinashe was 1th place bevor every other bevor voli and fiddle i have the orginal pic here on my computer.
Everyone complaining about your Shyvanna rework being too bulky are cowards of the highest degree. It's not the Shyvanna they deserve, but it's the one they need to finally appreciate some good design
shyvana can be muscular without being too bulky, she needs to be half dragon half quinn of demacia, thats it
@@torok8974 Bulky is good though
@@torok8974 she is a DRAGON dragon people are BUFF
I prefer the bulk, but if someone prefers the slender Shyvana, that's fine. Having an epic warrior with a "traditionally feminine" look is neat in it's own way. But I think that's already pretty represented tbh
@@torok8974 yes the half dragon needs to be looking like.... Quinn???? are you high on crack?
I love a Muscle Mommy. Illoai is one of my favourite champs, and your Shyvana design was rad as hell. With this VGU I guess I'd appreciate a different flavour of Muscle Mommy. More of a UFC build than a StrongMan.
Muscular women are a severely underrepresented body type in league. It'd be good to get some more in.
@joshjo9405 exactly. Personally if I was involved in this VGU I'd be pushing for a top heavy 'dorito' look. Big, broad shoulders. Like a swimmer's physique. Definition as opposed to Illoai's bulky hourglass.
@@adambescos7387 It'd make sense for her to have broad shoulders cause of her wings
on the scale from sejuani to illaoi, i would love if she was like 65% on the way to illaoi. i want her to look like she could choke a man with her elbow. this could be little lesbian brain infatuation with women who can hurl me halfway back in time to the roman empire, but shyv is like… strength trapped in a repressed shell that’s begging to come out. if she just has ahri body and sejuani face, i might stampede riot and delete yasuo or one of their favorite champs. but you’re right, she should have a less udyr/illaoi flavor and moreso a sejuani on roids flavor. i’m excited!
"We wan't sexy Shyvana not buff Shyvana"
That's an oxymoron
EXACTLY
everyone needs a muscle mommy or two in their virtual life at some point-
It really isn't; if the choice is between sexy but not buff Shyvana and buff but not sexy Shyvana, some people want the former. And yes, despite your personal preferences, there is such a thing as buff but not sexy. Generally, such a person is buff, but not in a proportional or balanced way so their mix of hypertrophic and unmuscular body parts creates a visually displeasing appearance.
@@pokinfunatcartman The buff concept they showed is also sexy.
@@ridori7376I meant more in the abstract.
@@pokinfunatcartman hey buddy have you ever considered that a literal half dragon woman wouldn't ever have a lean build? would make more sense to make her built more like Ilaoi
I honestly love buff Shyvana over anime girl Shyvana.
There are people who already love shyvana, wich are imo more important in the decission than some random people that dont even care what the champion was before the rework.
@@bloodworkdc2106 I've seen a fuckton of Shyvana mains who like her being buff. People have been drawing her buff for the longest time.
@@bloodworkdc2106i just don’t think league has to pander to that demographic so hard it completely undermines shyvana’s design. she is improved by being buff from a design standpoint, it expresses her character. people liked vi before arcane, does this mean in a vi asu she should keep looking the way she does without any influence from the design that better explains her character (arcane)? besides, bringing in new audiences to understand and appreciate shyv is an upgrade.
@@bloodworkdc2106idiotic take, when people who do love her, want her to be buff dragon lady. also if you just look at her story, it makes no sense if she isn't a "fuck around and find out" buff lady.
Besides we have 2933843 skinny sexy girls already.
@@sleepyrose69 Why cant you make a single valid or logic argument? What of being buff expresses her character? That makes no sense, what character are you talking about btw? Her being half dragon? Her personality? Being buff isnt needed to reflect she is half dragon when she literally have more traits of dragon than human even in her HUMAN FORM. She has dragon scales, purple skin, dragon eyes, dragon feets. Tell me a single HUMAN TRAIT in her dragon form my friend.... Not a single one.
You telling that being buff, bulky or whatever expresses her character is just your fucking opinion and its objectively stupid. From the huge amount of hybrids we have in league (vastayan or not) she is the female one that expreses her beast nature the better. Just compare Shyvana human form to fking nidalee or Xayah.
Shyvana doesnt need to be bigger to express anything about her nature, that is just how you would like her and priorizing your opinion over the people who for years have played her and liked her design. And for some reason, treating your subjective opinion as an argument.
the part where u showed the negative feedback to your design made me unreasonably mad and i am not proud of it. i don't exactly know how people see the highlight of Shyvana, an elemental dragon who found her way into society and is making a change in a heavily against magic nation by showing them that she is as "human" as they are (even though i don't enjoy the part where she kills her mother trying to "rescue" her), being a "sexy dragon"... i always thought there was a consensus that her being model slim and sexy acted as a detriment to her character, what is wrong with these people?
the comment that said "Removing shyvana's sexiness loses a bit of her" enraged me so deeply and i don't fucking care BECAUSE WHERE IN THE ACTUAL FUCK IS IT EVER ACKNOWLEDGED OR EVEN HINTED THAT HER SEXINESS IS AN IMPORTANT ASPECT TO HER CHARACTER. HER APPEARANCE IS LITERALLY MEANT TO BE MORE MONSTER-ISH BECAUSE SHE'S A MAGICAL MONSTER TRYING TO MAKE HERSELF FIT INTO A COUNTRY THAT'S RACIST AGAINST ANYTHING MAGICAL. Like just tell me you don't read the lore without telling me you don't read the lore.
@@Lolamy RIGHT??????????????? HER LORE ACTUALLY INDICATES THAT SHE WOULD IN FACT NOT BE WELL RECEIVED BY THE HUMAN STANDARTS, making her a sexy pinup babe who is generally appealing and is ostracized only because "why she uorple" is counterintuitive, it's kai'sa but older. In a fantasy world where you can portray MANY types of prejudice and characters that battle those prejudices in many many ways, doing it like that is kinda lazy and on the nose. All that paired with the fact that she is A FUCKING WARRIOR DRAGON LIKE... DOES THAT NOT SOUND LIKE A BIG AND MUSCULAR INDIVIDUAL????
@@LolamyDid that commenter get her and Evelynn mixed up or something?? Such a hilariously BAD take
me too, literally holding myself to not start telling every single ppl on this very comment section defending skinny sexy shyv or attacking bucky woman to fuck off!
Here’s the thing, BUFF SHYVANA IS SEXY! There’s a ton of people already thirsting over the big, muscled, scarred feral dragon lady! She’s just not THE MOST GENERIC IDEA OF SEXINESS IMAGINABLE.
There is something especially entitled about people insulting a design because it does not appeal to THEIR veiw of what is sexy. There are thousands of conventionally attractive characters but they can't keep there mouths shut when one isn't? Character design is so much more then boring basic sex appeal for the sake of sex appeal.
same
I absolutely adore the Shyvana piece made throughout this video, loved seeing the process. And i fully agree, our mommy dragon needs more muscles on those bones.
As long as her dragon form doesn't look malnourished I'll be happy
The instant I saw Shyvanna I knew I’d be watching a Subjectively video after lol
hello i am a lesbian and YESSSS I WANT A MUSCLE MOMMY DRAGON OH MY GOD WHY DO PEOPLE NOT SEE DIVERSE BODY TYPES AS HOT
Based lesbian
same here!
You speak the language of the gods
I'm happy to hear that those kind of comments aren't getting you down. I love your VGU concepts and like you I'm a big fan of Shyvana, and I also want her to be as Shyvana-like as she can for her update. To me, that's an imposing, beefy Shyv that turns into an imposing, beefy dragon. Keep up the great work!
The anemic look could work if they changed the lore a bit. Due to Demacia's hate of magic and anything related to it, shyvana is forced to wear magic suppressant cuffs. However dragons need their magic to flow to be healthy giving her that anemic human form. Then freeing her self from the cuffs allows her to be a strong healthy dragon. (Edit) I just realized that this premise could lead to a good story where she is a physical representation for Demacia. They fear magic so they suppress it in hopes of making them safe but in reality they are only making themselves weaker by doing so.
But they stopped the anti Magic Thing
sorta, they are right now in a slow paced change, maybe the kingdom with jarvan as the lead is seeing mages with better eyes, but common citizens in demacia will not take the change freely, so probably the plot of demacia will might go as "we are not going to kill mages or jail them because who they are, thats barbaric, but they are dangerous so we still are gonna supress magic in the kingdom"@@luizhenriquedasilva1538
@@luizhenriquedasilva1538 they did? When? Honest question
@@luizhenriquedasilva1538 Nah in mageseeker it's discussed that they're trying to stop it but the mageseekers are still too powerful and also because they're back by Kayle they've go some pretty big backing.
Smh my head, shyvana can't be strong and buff cause she's a woman, and everyone knows women have paper skin and glass bones. Every morning they break their legs, and every afternoon they break their arms. At night, they lie awake in agony until their heart attacks puts them to sleep. So making shyvana not look like she would topple from a breeze is going against her character if you really think about it.
yeah, basically riot when designing women in an nutshell XD(shivers)
I hate when peoples biggest complaints about a character is that they 'aren't sexy enough', especially when it comes to female characters. Why do they have to be sexy? Can't they just exist as a character with a body type we don't get to see often?
I really like muscular Shyvana, and I especially like concept C for the Shyvana ASU that Riot is doing. I think my main issue with your newest Shyvana redesign is that she looks like a tank, not like the berserker type character that both me and many other people seem to prefer as the direction for Shyvana. This is mainly due to the armor, it just makes her look *too* stout and bulky, again, like a tank.
Well it wasn’t that long ago that she was being built as a tank, even now it isn’t unheard of. She’s a soldier after all I would hope her armor looks bulky enough to actually take a hit
@@shmooters5599 Yes, tank Shyvana can work thematically speaking. It's just that me and many others don't think that it should be the direction she goes in. I agree that she should be wearing armor that looks bulky to some degree, but the armor in the second subjectively redesign of her was overly bulky, mainly the pauldrons.
PERFECT EXAMPLE KARLACH FRIM BG3
She is the perfect balance of strong and sexy like illaoi I think we need more variety body types in league
I’m sorry but if you think bulky women are “ugly as sin”, I have zero respect for you 💀
I don’t follow League at all, but I really love the designs you did for her! It’d be so cool if they went in that direction
It's an anime weeb. What do we expect?
I'm just confused as to why people would take issue with the DRAGON champ being absolutely jacked. Life dude, are we not on the same page about what dragons look like? Even within runeterra, barring a select few, they're all MASSIVE and JACKED. Sure, she could be made a really slender fast-moving dragon waifu, but there's nothing wrong with wanting her to look like she can tear a petricite golem in half with her bare hands.
I really appreciate the impromptu video! This is definitely a topic to discuss. And I think this is exactly why we need more diversity in character body types. We’ve been so bombarded with the same body types over and over (not just females) that characters like Illaoi and Vi stand out so much because they’re different, but we should be exploring this as artists and creatives! Another reason we can get hyped about Ambessa Medarda!
It made me happy knowing how happy you would be about this
The people complaining about her being too bulky, is a symptom of a larger problem, the higher-ups at riot and there whales (gotcha game slang for someone who pours insane amounts of money for something, like prestige skins)
Riot gets a lot of their money from characters and skins of sexy characters, they see this and so prioritize in order to continue the flow of money, it’s the unfortunate situation of both sides perpetuating each other so a lot of the more interesting ideas are left to the wayside unless it’s a character most people don’t care about or their model is so old it needs to be completely revamped.
I always love listening to you and TB skyen’s ideas for character redesigns and new lore, but it also shows the absolute wasted potential of these characters
same,smh
i also want more buffed female characters
They want her to be nimble and agile, but then you see Volibear, Udyr, Warwick, and SION blistering down the lane or through the jungle at the speed of a moving train, being both intimidating and powerful but not the dragon-hybrid lady. They want her to be skinny and hot because the other 60 or however many chicks in the game aren’t enough, even though her lore SAYS she’s supposed to be imposing and very “other”.
I’m so tired of people thinking characters need to be tailored toward them when they’re not even the ones championing for her to get updated. They’re not playing her. They’re not searching for content on her. It’s not about them, yet it’s offensive that it isn’t FOR them. I really hope she becomes everything we want, and everything they wish she wasn’t
They've already confirmed that Shyvana's rework will be an Udyr-style VGU, which is already great news from the perspective of narrative progression. Plus this kind of "character progression" VGU has been better known for taking a character's best qualities and pushing them to the forefront. Pantheon may still read as a Spartan, but now he's clearly a TARGONIAN Spartan.
Acceptable Male characters: Scrawny, puny, meathead, roid rage freak, actual skeleton, actual bear, lank, lean, 5 year old, 500 year old, reformed sludge pile, unformed sludge pile, riddled with disability, an angel, a biblically accurate angel, a suave demon, a bestial demon, Frankenstein's monster, a bowl of spaghetti.
Acceptable Female characters: 21 year old human that's skinny except the T&A.
I didn't play much League when I had time, but when I did, and Shyvana was available, I always looked past her because she never read as the heavy hitting dragon that she was supposed to be. I hope that with her VGU she gets the strength to back those punches. Or fireballs.
Buff Dragon Lady Supremacy
In a year and a half we will be able to have over a half a tram comprised of mega buff women: Illaoi, Ambessa Medarda and Shyv
So, if we have another buff woman then it's just Illaoi 2, well, can we then talk about the other 30 Katarinas?
I dislike the need for all game characters to fit into basically one body type. It just feels so boring and limiting for designs and visual storytelling. Like idk why people essentially want one model with a thousand different skins over it...
yeah..😞
As someone who doesn't play Leage of Leagues, it's pretty cool to see you get what you wanted
Detection that they are about to go with, really makes me obsessed with this muscle mommy
8:22 I'm glad you understand what Shyvana's all about! It seems that her mains have a very skewed perception of her character, it's a shame :(
Muscular woman scare people and that’s okay. That’s what I personally think makes them hot and cool, but to each their own ig. My vote obviously goes towards seeing her bulky seeing as she is a soldier, but we will have to wait and see what Riot thinks
I understand why someone wouldn't want her to go full buff (as she still has some humanity in her) but a lot of these complaints are very, VERY yikes. It feels less "I want a character with both human and dragon traits" and more "how dare Riot make One woman in this game that doesn't turn me on!"
How does making her buff detract from her humanity.
jesus, how many same-face, generic, hourglass figures in unfitting outfits do people need? It makes up like 90% of all females in league INCLUDING the ones where it just doesn't make sense like Kai'sa, Shyvana, Zyra, Caitlin, Vi, Katarina, Nidalee, Leona, Cass, LeBlanc, Ashe, Soraka, Kayle, Camille to a degree, hell even Orianna leans far too heavily into a hour glass feminine figure rather than a younger girl like you'd expect her father to create.
Meanwhile we have 1 large muscular woman, 1 visibly tone/athletic woman, 1 woman that actually appears older than their 20s, and maybe what Jinx, Qiyana, and Briar for notably different body types? Feels like they could bare to have a wee bit more diversity than another character that may as well be Miss Fortune in cosplay.
"OOOOooouuuughgh youre just making another ilaoi, we already have a muscle lady"
Cut to the like 25 convencionally sexy same face women already in the game
I think New Shyvana should look like a cross fit woman with a few scars which are also hot now that's sexy but also incredibly feminine, and it's not exactly accepted as an objective "sexy" look for women, but most importantly i think it fits the idea of Shyvana imo she should be like abnormally tall seeing how she a hybrid humanoid in form mostly with strong accents of her draconic heritage
@6:09 I think it's incredibly comical people that aren't artiest and more than likely couldn't draw to save there life have such strong opinions on what a redesigned should look like that's fucking priceless. XD
To each their own but I for one think your redesign was well expressed and worked. I agree with breaking "beauty" social norms and people swooning over fictional characters they probable want to fantasize about sleep with......shocker XD
I love the “We don’t need another illaoi!! We already have one buff woman we don’t need more” …. So we need 50 other big breasted skinny anime women?
I completely agree that making her buff will be a visual indicator of her past and her story. Sex appeal can be a first but it makes a damn lousy character if it doesn’t fit their story. I rally for buff shyvana ✊
Bro who ever thinks that muscle mommies aren't hot have issues.
I still think we should have 5 women (and men) for each body type. AT THE VERY LEAST
where my chubby waifus at?
Where's my... Uh... hmm... Tentacle husbandos? Idk men actually have more variety in league than I thought.
But yea if memory serves me right we actually have 0 chubby women in league.
Edit: p.s.: please don't let this be the last video about shyvana.
that Shyvana portrait looks awesome! the rough edges suit her so well❤
I love the middle image of the 3 early concepts they show, has the muscles and the fiery passion, an awesome pose, dope hair, muscles, everything but petricite armor
I too was upset about her getting second for so many years in the VGU polls. I am glad that it is finally happening and I share in your joy when first hearing about her finally getting a VGU, I got so pumped up and excited that I had just started to shake from pure excitement. I honestly really like your videos on a Shyvana rework where you explore her being a muscle mommy similar to Illaoi and I really like them overall. Keep up the amazing work you do and here's to our favorite champs finally getting a VGU. Also are you an AD Shyvana enjoyer or are you an AP Shyvana enjoyer?
(Personally I love her AD power fantasy version more, more satisfying imo)
I personally am one who thinks she shouldnt look like illaoi, but i do think she should be fairly bulky. I am hoping they make her look more wild especially since her departure from demacia.
I like how "Another Illaoi" is the only thing they'll say, because Illaoi is the only Woman in league (off the top of my head) with that body type. WE NEED MORE!! MUSCLE MOMMY FTW
I love how they "another illaoi" like we haven't had 30 ahri face champs and basically every other female champ having the same body type
i'm loving your passion for this and i must say i would love to hear you talk about more things you love with zero structure again xD
Shyvana definitely needs an update, visually at the least. And I do absolutely hope that Riot makes her jacked, girl needs to be able to deadlift cars imo.
My big thing is that I just really hope they don't smother her in armor. She's a juggernaut, not a tank, there's a reason that the majority of the champions in that class are unarmored. Honestly it's the biggest issue I have with all of your potential design paths for her, it just feels like it holds her back, especially given she's supposed to be a shifter that turns into a giant dragon. Glad that the Riot sketches seem to be trending simultaneously less armored and less wiry, though.
the SASS is on point and i'm here for it
let the dragon have big muscles!!!
It does seem like interest into the whole bulky body type on women is a rather niche thing. Which is fine, but unfortunately there are some out there who see a bulky woman as being "overweight" or "masculine," which is so dumb. Can't remember their name, but I remember seeing similar responses towards characters like the one in Across the Spider-verse (Haven't seen it yet, but will eventually), and Rory in My Adventures with Superman. It's pretty crazy. Though most of it is on Twitter and you know how that place is...
My interest in League is mostly through the art and watching Arcane, but I've been getting curious about the lore as of late, and your League videos has definitely helped. You're very passionate about Shyvana and I do like how open-minded you are about the possible results, not caring too much about sex appeal. That being said, I do hope Shyvana gets the Muscle Mommy look. We need more buff women. We got one dragon that's massive, but skinny-ish, and another that's tiny and cute, so why not a buff one, right?
Who knows? Maybe an artist or few working with Riot have seen your videos about Shyvana. It's possible. We'll see what happens!
👍🏻
to let everyone know if you don't know. but Riot did say that this is more udyr style vgu then scarner. so while yes she will probably get some muscle her entire build will not change. as Riot stated that this will be a continuation of her story from the mageseeker game. so she wont turn into illoai but be more like vi lilth and sexy but extremlly strong and muscluar
Baldurs Gate III showed us all that muscle mommys are also quite liked by a lot of people. Karlack is literally a BUFFED Thiefling and people find her hot AF(pun intended)
the difference is that Karlach has a good design, this guy's redesign is ugly and bulky
@@redmage5251 that's subjective
@@redmage5251bro are you fr rn?,lol
@@joshuagonzalez4183 yes. compare Karlach to this guy's Shyvana redesign and the difference is night and day. Karlach is actually a great example of how to make a muscular character look good instead of overly bulky
Pay no mind to the tunnel vision weirdos with their fantasy of dom effing a fantasy lizard girl, which falls apart the moment she doesn't look like her arms will break apart like spaghetti. It's ridiculous that that's the only complaint they can figure out.
"She's supposed to be agile" that in no way implies not bulky, one can be bulky and fast/agile at the same time. Besides, the only agility that ever came through in her design is her flight as a dragon, which is stupid because her wings barely look like wings at all, more like malformed arms with weird flaps attached. She's not giving Rathalos, she's giving Tigrex.
The last one ? Am I to believe you wont do a video about her developpement when we get news about it and no video about her release ? :o
Yeah there's no way this is our last Shyvana video idk why I even said that 🤣🤣
@Subjectively I mean technically it's your last video on a hypothetical vgu so you're not entirely wrong
Damn people dont want her to be another illaoi? But another Kaisa/Ahri/Ashe/basically most any female league character thats ok I guess
it does make me sad that we're probably never got like. a straight up fat female league champion, or even slightly chubby female champion because of the loud minority of games who still want 2009 style miss fortune designs. it's annoying.
same
the visual update aside, from what they said her gameplay/abilities will be changed more like udyr and less like skarner, so i don't have my hopes up regarding drastic changes onto her skills, but i do think they will keep the choice to play her as ap and bruiser/tank alike, so that's a nice thing to look into to see what they'll change. We can't forget that her story won't be changed, but advanced instead into the post sylas game state that demacia was left, with her coming back to jarvan in a more magic accepting kingdom. I love to research and talk about the history and design of riot characters, and watching your videos about them makes me very happy to watch and learn from them, as i just graduated in design myself, so thank you for all your videos and i'm hoping to see even more of them as they come
Shyvana NEEDS to be buff. The B and C variations shown in the concept art are FANTASTIC - alongside Subjectively's brilliant redesigns. And yet I've seen people, especially on the Shyvana reddit, saying C and especially B are bad and shouldn't be the final product. Shyvana is not a seductress, she's not meant to be enticing in that sense; she's a soldier and a DRAGON, she needs to be buff, strong and damaged. And as someone else has said saying that Shyvana needs to be "sexy" not only misses the point of her entire character, but it disregards buff women has being attractive or beautiful which they certainly are. It denotes sexyness as a concept to just Evelynn or Ahri type of characters which when stretched across to other characters makes it so boring and uninteresting, fanservice is important to a degree but it seems the only fanservice these people want are the type made for cishet reddit men to ogle at.
I really hope riot gives her the body type and the design she deserves, Shyvana is my favourite champion and has so much potential.
FINALY A DRAGON FORM. FIRE CHICKEN FORM NOT MORE!!!!!!!!
"colorful and exiting world of modern league of legends"
*shows Fiddlesticks*
Buff Shyv with a body covered in scars in armor standing a foot taller than Jarvan is my ideal.
If they go skinny/waif I hope they give her a wild eyed gaze. The look of a woman who is pushed to the brink and will do what she needs to in order to accomplish a goal.
If they want her to be a waifu/sexy that...fine I guess. I think they could do that with buff Shyv but if I had my choice I would take strides to show that just beneath that pleasing veneer there is a a volatile draconic powder keg that will incinerate you. Smoldering eyes/mouth, talons.
Not only do I not follow league, I actively do my best to leap over it's path, so as to not even tread upon the same ground as it's traveled.
But I still watched the whole video, loved hearing your thoughts.
Champion redesigns are a huge part of why I love playing Legends of Runeterra so much.
Have you seen what they did to Shyvana? She looks way better than in League.
They freaking gave Illaoi _armpit hair,_ they did outstanding an outstanding rework of Seraphine and what they did to Janna blows me away.
They have full representation of all kinds of bodies in other cards as well, and it's chef's kiss.
there can never be too much ripped women
You know what the worst part is? Muscley Shyvana is way more sexy than Illaoi and people still will cry about it
There are probably only three champions whose sex appeal matters to their identities: Evelynn, Ahri and Elise.
Shyvana's characterization and lore give zero indication that sex appeal is important to her or the story that is being told with her. The designs you came up with for your fan VGUs were all perfect for selling the identity of the character Shyvana is SUPPOSED to be.
As much as I myself love stereotypically sexy character designs, there's a time and place for that sort of character and I think League has used it to death. I enjoy watching your videos because they challenge my aesthetic sensibilities; you put out content I never would've considered, and that's so much more engaging as an artist than just seeing what I want to see all the time. Can't wait to see what you do next.
Ahri looks doesnt even matter anymore because she just uses Magic, she doesnt seduce you, she minds control you to whatever she wants
@@spartanscv That's a good point. It was vaguely justified before the vastaya lore update changed her backstory, but modern Ahri and launch Ahri are basically two entirely different characters.
I think we can thank Karlach for all this
We can thank Karlach just for existing
I don’t want to be sexually enticed by a video game. I want to feel cool and have fun playing a character I enjoy. A huge muscular dragon lady is going to do that for me, and your designs have always dripped with intrinsic passion for the character.
Loathe gamers and I seethe at the mere IDEA of being so invested in a game whose community can only associate sex appeal with one super specific body type and weighs literally all fictional characters against it.
I should be able to psychically harm people who have NEVER seen actual female throwers or weight lifters or body builders and yet have the GALL to say she should be lithe with a wasp waist rAAAAAGH
Gamers when you tell them women can have a variety of body shapes instead of generic barbie super model #140375
I love your redesigns
The shivanna one inspired me tô draw my DnD character whit the visual i use until now ❤
the funny thing is they didn't even make her THAT bulky. people are so used to The One Body Type for women in media that any amount of muscle or bulkiness becomes too much.
5:45 based on their concepts, I like the rightmost one, with the leftmost being a close second. This is from a thematic-narrative perspective.
Frankly, I think a build similar to a middle-weight in MMA would be ideal: athletic, lean, and shows semblances of a fighter (kinda like Arcane Vi).
My main concern is the Dragon Form; it's still early, but I think something like Smolder's mom would be a good frame of reference.
I actually love the middle one, gives her a more wild and unhinges side, like a berrserker
Gives us a new flavour of muscle mommy differentiating her from Illaoi, not that that is needed but we don’t really have a wild woman in LoL
@@Breadcutter my problem with the middle one is that it doesn't really fit her lore; it would be an over-dramatization.
If anything, her more berserk side should be her draconic form (when she can let loose), with her human side being more cordial (like the majesty of a dragon). Pretty much: human = draconic majesty; dragon = draconic ferocity.
@@patrickcarter2829 In what ways doens't it fit her lore? Wasn't she wild before she joined Jarvan, maybe I'm misremembering, still that side I think could shine through, even in her human form, majesty and ferocity aren't mutually exclusive
I'll be honest, when the Illaoi sticker began to pop up i fully expected you to cut to the Ambessa anouncment. She's also going to be the buff muscle-girl archetype. At least if they are true to Arcane's portrayal.
Ewwww the way some people just take interest in characters for the sexual appeal 🤮🤮🤮 I didn't think they were so upfront about it too. puaj
I couldn't bark more for muscle concept art shyvana
I've never played, to be honest, but I've never played most games, I'm afraid. ^^' Still, it's awesome to hear you talk about the character; it's downright infectious and I'm super happy for you, that your main is finally getting some much needed attention. To each their own, but as you said, rather than sex appeal, I prefer the focus of a character to be - you know - CHARACTER. Fingers crossed that this will be an awesome experience and we'll get to enjoy Shyvana's unlocked potential.
I'm honestly unreasonable irritated by these kinds of comments. I know that there's always going to be people like that but I just cannot get the mindset. Like, if you do a cursory scroll through leagues champions so many of the more obviously feminine ones are exactly the body type people are mourning the loss of with some of these redesign ideas. One less traditionally attractive overtly sexy champion in the roster is not going to hurt you.
People really get so upset the second something doesn't immediately cater to them, even when they have so many other things which ARE catering to them
no matter what direction she ends up going, she's definitely needed this. was a fan of your rework, and while i'd personally prefer someone more on the lithe side, maybe the medium would be a sett-esque build--brawly, but still agile enough to perform leaps and dashes. then, perhaps, she'd actually gain the bulk she so deserves on her dragon transformation
imagine thinking women with muscles are not hot couldnt be me
I luv the bulkier shy is most accurate concept to a dragon soldier that she is, leona would be more bulk too
I like a good muscle mommy but I too would like to say, I wouldn't like her to be like Illaio. First, it's not easy to pull off a look like Illaoi has, two, her human form is the weaker side compared to her dragon form so visuals must represent them. So going with examples, I would like her Sylas level muscular rather than Garen level.
“WE CANT HAVE ANOTHER BUFF WOMEN” we have at least 10 or more skinny women and 1 buff women, Why are they mad about having another buff women?
Im going go go against the grain a little bit here, but i dont really like Shyvannas shownredesigns. Not because they made her buff- i like buff shyvana! But because... The still look kind of... Fanservicey. Not that theres anything wrong with being fanservicey, i just dont think that makes sense for Shyvana. None of them look like the reserved but quietly rageful solider of demacia that Shyvanna us to me. They all just look like buff sexy muscle woman as opposed to sexy skinny supermodel. And thats mainly the costuming i have a problem with really.
The one way i can describe a lack for a better term "middle ground", for shyvana having the body type of She-hulk in the comics. Not the over muscular body type, but the iconic build where she's buffed or "super toned" in the right places. Maybe that can satisfy both parties.
Every passing second I respect less and less the weeb community, to levels not even I knew were possible
I love kind of shyvanna that will actually just kill me