Ableism: The One Accusation Vegans Can’t Ignore?
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- Опубликовано: 19 май 2024
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TODAY'S VIDEO:
In today’s video, I address the claim that veganism is ableist and respond to this argument by analysing what being vegan means and how, if anything, the argument being made is actually what is really ableist.
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I am surprised by your claim that veganism 'protects' non-human animals. that's simply not true, such a claim makes you non-vegan
👋
I am vegan for the tyranny
SHARED
@@yogaofhealth1800 obviously not true. that's not the reason 800 million people are experiencing chronic starvation. the reason for their starvation is extreme poverty and harsh living conditions. you're engaging in speculations. no bueno.
Wheelchair user, fibromyalgia, autistic, adhd, cpstd and dyslexic. And I've been vegan for over three years.
don't worry, veganism is curable.
cool🌱
Also disabled and vegan for three years. I'm so happy about my decision to be vegan, but apparently "ableists" need to protect me from my own decisions? I hate when people choose to represent me like that. I'm a unique person. I'm not a disability.
Detox from heavy metals
Detox from heavy metals
This whole trope of veganism being racist or ableist is absolutely vile.
I don't like to generalise, but I suspect that the average ethical vegan is more committed to combating racism and ableism than the average meat-eater, because, logically-speaking, people who are compassionate to one group tend to be compassionate to others.
Absolutely!@@GregOrCreg
@@GregOrCregYep, you’re spot on. Injustice in all forms should be fought. Humans fall under the animal kingdom too. It baffles me when some of my more progressively active friends don’t even want to talk about veganism and the atrocities of animal farming.
@@GregOrCreg BitesizeVegan has a video on data saying vegans were less prejudice towards people, such as with racism, etc. I'm not saying that's true or not, but people can check out the video and data.
I'm not trying to generalize, but I've noticed nonvegans talk about hierarchy a lot. Such as saying animals are inferior so therefore it's ok to exploit them and said that humans were the top of the food chain. I've noticed people who obsess with hierarchy made more comments of discrimination against people and said how some people were superior and some inferior.
I'm not saying if their is true or not, but just something to think about and research on.
I've also seen psychotic comments from some nonvegans.
Example: Lifting Vegan Logic has a video on I think a yt-er named Justthefacts saying it was ok to organ harvest mentally disabled people to try to remain logically consistent. Especially when vegans bring up the argument that if some nonvegans think it's ok to exploit animals because they're dumber then what about mentally disabled people, children, and dogs?
Strangely, I couldn't find the video when I typed in Justthefacts but I found it by searching disabled on Lifting Vegan Logic.
Some vegans also like to use how racism and slavery were wrong to explain how animal agriculture is terrible.
You just hate black pipo
Disabled from birth. I'm vegan.
I genuinly cant tell if this is a troll post or not.
Sounds like something a Keto person would write under a vegan post to be cheeky.
that's ableist
Good on you 🙂👍
Be a man and eat some steak.@@patrickbaklava7297
@@patrickbaklava7297wat
People often forget or omit the crucial *“as far as is possible and practicable”* part of veganism’s definition.
Exactly! I don't think that, for example, taking a medication that contains gelatin means that I'm not vegan.
Yeah, people seem to not understand that it's about doing minimal harm. Like if you need a life saving surgery, a certain medicine, etc. But part of it for me is just asking, is that medication vegan and is there a medication that I could take that is vegan instead if not. Your doctor can find out. It's also about making mistakes is okay. I will admit I have been vegan for years and I have accidentally taken a drink or a bite of non-vegan foods. I have accidentally bought clothing or items that aren't vegan. It's about not making the same mistake twice, it's about double checking, it's about doing your best. I know I have heard many many people say stuff along the lines of, "well that battery isn't vegan" just to be assholes, not knowing that it's not about that. It's about only buying the amount of batteries I need. rather than bulk. It's about choosing the better of two option even if both are bad.
I know by your comment that it's not you specifically saying this, but I think it is good to break comments like this down a bit more because it helps people understand.
@@howlsaur There's no alternative for the medication?
@@draconicdust3435 That's actually pretty much what I'm saying ;)
"Cows milk is in everything, yet you don't hear people complaining that the dairy industry is ableist" -- So damn true. Great video Ed!
It is out of control. Milk is now being added to salted peanuts in Canada. Read the labels!
@@HuplesCat At this point I wouldn't be surprised if I turned over my chair and read "Contains milk".
Lol! Sad but true@@TheAndyVegan
I highly agree. I suffered brutally from a mental disorder called Tourette Syndrome when I was a kid. Today I only have OCD. Which is still bad, but not as much. I have been vegan for 36 years! There is no excuse for animal abuse!
I have OCD and Anxiety Disorder. I've been a vegetarian for 32 years, and a *proper* vegan for about 13 years (I tried to cut out dairy before that, but I was still occasionally eating foods with honey and eventually realised that I wasn't being as strict in cutting out vegetarian ready-meals that occasionally contained eggs/milk).
In any case, veganism and disability rights are two of the things that matter the most to me. Like animals, disabled people are often disregarded and treated as if they're worth less than others.
The book "A Liberated Mind: The essential guide to ACT" got me out of a bad place with OCD. Might be helpful for others reading the comments.
You don't have to abuse animals to eat meat. They sell it all cut up and ready to cook at the grocery store.
@@MasterMoron are you trolling? Or you are not aware of cause and effect?
@@MasterMoron Did you concoct that fantastically brilliant bit of wittiness all by your little ole lonesome?
My wife had an acquired Brain injury 10 years ago. She can no longer eat conventional food as she is peg fed. You could say that she's 'pescatarian' as the medicated food that is literally her only option has omega 3 from fish, eggs and dairy. However, she still identifies herself as vegan and will only buy and use vegan products in every other aspect of her life. She still cooks exclusively vegan food for me and our son (even though she can't eat it herself). Everyone just has to do the best they can, wherever that line is 🌱
As far as I'm concerned, she's 100% vegan 💚
I don’t care what she eats she is doing her best and is 100% a vegan 🌱
100% agreed
There's plants with omega 3.
Yeah, if the food she needs doesn't come in a Vegan version, there's nothing she can do about it. It's really admirable that she maintains her philosophy in every other aspect of her life. She's Vegan in my book.
I’m blind and vegan and I approve this message
Asa! Your rap is amazing
🐰
@@SunduswI love you
@@leedulithank you buddy
12 year vegan with disabling genetic and chronic illnesses - of course, it sucks that almost all meds/vaccinations/medical treatments are tested on animals and contain animal products, drastic and quick advances are needed in that field and that's part of our vegan activism. But very honestly veganism has actually helped me tremendously, mentally and physical so I now use the least amount meds I've ever taken. Of course it is not the same for everyone but for me whole food plant based foods have made a huge difference, so has the love I feel so deeply for all animals. It makes me get up in the morning (or afternoon!) and keep pushing against my disabilities. Vegan for the animals forever. ❤
This is wonderfully inspiring ❤️ Thank you for sharing your experience.
Go carnivore
@@Shamrock299do u mean cancer and heart attack diet?
@@5fr4ewq what?
@@Shamrock299 u read that right
I have got a form of muscular dystrophy. Going vegan was the best thing I have ever done for my health. I initially went vegan for ethical reasons but since then there has been an improvement in my heart function. Who would have thought that less saturated Fat and cholesterol would have been healthy.
It's like saying "Well, some people can't go to the supermarket so we shouldn't build more"
When it's the opposite. Making the world more vegan would be a big help for people who can't yet go vegan!
Indeed
Won't happen ,over 8 billion people are not interested in vegans
Right I always find this argument so silly. Just because something or someone can’t do something that means we shouldn’t, makes no sense. Not to mention it’s the government and ag industry that are the biggest culprit of food deserts. Being vegan and promoting it would promote better access to food not worsen it.
@caseyvenable7701
No it wouldn't
@@rondarkman. K
I wish people would stop using us disabled as props for their arguments. We're people too dammit
They do it with " black people " also
@@rondarkman. I think the OP is referring to the power structure, which is neither disabled nor POC, using disabled people for an argument contra veganism. So unless the "they" in your comment refers to white people of privilege, and based on your comments in these threads I assume it doesn't, step off, kid.
I know. Unless you have a very specific disease/disorder where it really restricts your diet as it is (like diabetes or chrones) or some other fairly specific thing *most* people can manage a vegan diet just fine regardless of ability.
I’m autistic, ADHD, and have APD (auditory processing disorder) and Vegan since 2020!
I don't want to cause pain, suffering and death to animals. i want them to live their lives.
Label as you wish, I don't want to cause harm. Ahimsa.
After debating meat eaters for years using NTT, I cant tell you how many of them have said they’d be okay with stripping away negative rights from severely mentally disabled people rendering it acceptable to kill and eat them.
as a vegan fascist, sometimes its ok
Woooow
Lifting Vegan Logic has a video on I think a yt-er named Justthefacts saying it was ok to organ harvest mentally disabled people to try to remain logically consistent. Especially when vegans bring up the argument that if some nonvegans think it's ok to exploit animals because they're dumber then what about mentally disabled people, children, and dogs?
Strangely, I couldn't find the video when I typed in Justthefacts but I found it by searching disabled on Lifting Vegan Logic.
@@Nuaex Were you saying exploiting people is ok? Then that's messed up and hypocritical.
@@user-gu9yq5sj7c protect the animals over humans yea
I'm my experience it's never people with disabilities arguing that veganism is ableist
Agreed.
It strikes me as insulting to POC and disabled people (and as someone with a few mental illnesses, I arguably fall into the latter category) to argue that we intrinsically have an issue with veganism.
exactly that. In veganism you want to protect all animals and people are also included. So veganism is not ableist, sexist or racist some activists are, which is not an argument for animal exploitation. I am firmly convinced that people who cannot be vegan due to restrictions will be able to be vegan in the future. And we will live in a world that will be free from any exploitation of animals and people. Thank you ed ❤
Very well said.
I thought I heard every argument against veganism, but this one is completely new to me
Me to!
Same here. The mental gymnastics people do to justify their bad habits... just astounding.
Oh there are a bunch like this one! They make my blood boil. I hope he'll cover them all in his upcoming videos where he dissects left & right wing arguments towards veganism.
Hi Ed, the problem is that many aids like catheters and medication are not vegan, or it's excrutiatingly hard to find out whether they use animal based ingredients. The coating on catheters i.e. often contain gelatine for some strange reason. I was able to find vegan ostomy supplies, so tt's been a huge relief that those work for me. Medication is usually tested on animals, which is sad. For everything I can control, I am fully vegan.
No. You are vegan. It is choosing not to use animals when you have the choice. It never has been about using no animals if you have no choice. Be a proud vegan because you are. Write to the manufacturers. Might have an effect eventually.
Yes that's the point that he made in the video.
I became vegan when I was 14. I grew up in human sex trafficking until I was 19 because I was born into it and I was abused but I was still vegan. I have schizophrenia and autism and I’ve been vegan for the last 14 years.
❤thank you for loving the animals when you were suffering so much yourself..animals helped me so much in my life through the sad parts especially ...sending you love
Thanks for standing for veganism.
I respect you so much for coming from such a background with a sense of power, and using it for the benefit of other vulnerable beings. Blessings to you!
I'm sorry you had to experience that. May healing and recovery anoint you.
Thank you all! 💕🌿
My sons autistic and vegan 🖤
were they raised vegan from birth?
@@v.a.n.e. were you raised vegan from birth ?
@@nananinanana656 short answer: no. long answer: noooooo nananinanana, noooooo!!
So glad you made this video, Ed! I am an ethical Vegan. Every choice I can make to be cruelty free, I have made and do make on a daily basis. I am also disabled and some of my medications that I depend on to survive have lactose in them. I don't have a choice about this. But in some Vegans eyes that makes me not Vegan. We need to dispel the myth that only perfection can be Vegan. For most of us, if you follow the supply chain where we live back to the beginning, you will find a link that isn't considered Vegan. The focus should be on making as many ethical choices that you are able to and to applaud those choices! Unfortunately there are some people in the Vegan community who don't agree with this and they give ammunition to the "ablest" label.
I really like this comment. I do the same, also takes meds I don’t have a choice on, but we do our best and advocate for the rest
That's nonsense. You are a vegan my friend ❤️
Veganism is an ethical stance to avoid animal abuse and expoloitation *as far as practicable and possible*. If it's not possible to use vegan medication or medical aids, because they don't yet exist, you're still a vegan if you make the effort everywhere else.
I have a stoma and was able to find vegan bags that work for me. But most brands use gelatine in their adhesives.
Eating them is not abuse or exploitation, but a biological function.@@MSchipper
@@pacmanmcgavin7034 We CAN eat animals, sure. Animal products have nutritional value, yes. But most people can do just fine on an entirely plant based diet, and it’s the ethical thing to do.
I found this to be interesting, I’m disabled AND I’m vegan ❤️
I can’t control what’s in my medicine but I’m doing all I can
your not
Ignore Tyler he's dead weight.
There's always been an exemption for medicine and severe disabilities in this movement. 🧡
It is actually interesting how much gelatine is used in medications. You are aware but I bet many watching this video have no idea,
Mental and physical disabilities here , vegan for 5 years .
I've had multiple discussions with people accusing veganism in itself as being ableist, but after breaking down their arguments it was clear they were just using the disabled community as an excuse for them not to go vegan. Same excuse people make by referencing isolated indigenous cultures that they are not a part of, as a reason for them not to go vegan, despite them having access to diverse food resources.
You don't need an excuse not to go vegan. Vegans themselves convince me to never go vegan.
These people believe that indigenous people are savages who aren't smart enough to have morals, or to learn how to do anything but hunt. It's them who are racist.
I am legally physically and cognitively disabled and I've been vegan four years. This is actually offensive to me that ppl would think being vegan was ableist lol.....
Autistic and adhd here, vegan for almost 10 years. So glad you brought up the "veganism is ableist" argument coming from nondisabled folks. Just like the "but food deserts" coming from people in downtown LA.
Which actually does cross over between disabled and low income communities, as disabled people are much more likely to live in poverty - thus not having access to affordable produce, vegan alternatives, etc. It's not entirely a matter of needing to consume animal products for specific health reasons, but also a disproportionate lack of resources.
I’m chronically ill/disabled (JIA) and been vegan for 4 years. 💚🌱
Chronic Depression, anxiety, autism. Add Sensitive stomach issues hay-fever. And Vegan for 19 years since 12
Vegans are as varied as any other group. We agree on one thing; it doesn't mean we agree on everything else. We're not a monolith. This isn't a social club, it's a justice movement.
A "just us" movement.
😆 its a diet for pretentious douches, nothing more
It's about your ego.
@@pacmanmcgavin7034sure. Actually giving a shit is all about their ego 🙄 you wouldn't say that about any other entire group of people trying to do something for the benefit of others, like nurses or charity workers etc. I'm sure some vegans are egotistical, but randomly commenting to a stranger on the internet saying they're vegan to fuel their ego is unkind, and suggests you think this of all vegans, which is absurd.
@@pacmanmcgavin7034also hilarious given your RUclips tagline is 'I'm so good it's scary!' 😂
As a disabled vegan for the animals, thank you so much for this video from the deep of my heart! 💚🐾🌱
what do you mean 'disabled vegan' for the animals? is it just figurative?
@@v.a.n.e. wtf are you going on about? (rhetorical question, I don't need a reply from *you!* )
I apologize if my comment upset you, as that was certainly not my intention. your original post sounds as if your condition was caused by becoming a vegan, that is, because of/for the animals.
Love my friend!
@v.a.i.n. You specialize in disingenuously and deliberately misinterpreting what people are trying to communicate. You simply insist on torturing folks fairly clear intent. There is no way that your meaning makes sense.
How does "vegan for the animals" end up meaning "disabled due to veganism" in your warped mind? That makes no sense whatsoever. The most rational reading is that they attribute their veganism to their concern for animals, literally "for the animals".
The post may have benefited from another comma or so, but I'll bet the only ones who were confused were you anti-vegan troll types, trying to find confusion and manufacturing it when it can't be found.
I suffer from bipolar disorder, with phases of severe depressions, anxiety, had period with severe eating disorder in the past etc. I’m disabled since 7 years already and I’m not going to lie it can be hard to be vegan when suffering a mental disorder. Not in the sense of having a vegan lifestyle in itself at all, that’s in fact the easiest part, especially nowadays with all the alternatives. But the lucidity about the non human animals suffering can be tremendously hard to overcome when being severely depressed. It’s like adding more pain in an already extremely painful situation. Also diet restriction can trigger bad habits about eating disorder. I’m still vegan and won’t go back, but it can be really challenging when I’m not feeling well. When it happens I usually delete all social apps for a while so I don’t need to think about or witness anything related to animal exploitation.
Hi I’m Dallas I have schizophrenia and you explained that so well, I’m already sad and depressed so when I think about veganism as a whole it can make it worse cus it’s such a sad situation being around all your friends and family , it can make it worse, you see the world for what it really is.
Feel free to disconnect if you're not contributing to the problem. 💚
same here
Diagnosed CFS/fibro at 15, life-long dyslexic and recently discovered I'm gluten intolerant...
Vegan from 23 (now 30). My health has vastly improved from it, and going gluten free was WAY more challenging than being vegan.
The "ableist" thing is such a null argument. Thank you Ed for putting it so eloquently
We can't be perfect, but we can always try to avoid increasing suffering. It's someone's life on the line and shouldn't be taken lightly.
#leviahimsa
"Do as much good as you can, as often as you can, for as many as you can."
- Adlai Stevenson.
😌
My steaks I cook are perfect
@@rondarkman.
Shame we can hardly say the same about your English.
Nur hUr hur staYke taYste guDe
😶
@@PercivalBlakeney
It's youtube princess cope
@@rondarkman.
Nah "princessita"… there's no excuse for poor arguments or poor English… and little darlin', ya' gots both in shovel-loads.
Y'dig?
Long before I was a vegan I was a humanist. I've always believed in the rights of all to live the best life possible, but it was before I understood how cows suffer in giving milk. So I was a vegetarian for many decades. I grew up watching the cruelty of war every night on the 7 o'clock news (Vietnam), and with my family I spent many a day protesting for peace, that is, for the rights of the Vietnamese to live how they chose. I protested for the Palestinians, East Timorese, the Iraqis, then the rights of whales and other sentient creatures, against plastics, microoplastics and other environmental destructiveness and so on. Through my early teens I spent every Saturday morning with a First Nations woman (who was deemed a National Treasure before her death) collecting signatures for the referendum which would make Australia's extraordinary indigenous people citizens for the first time in Australia's history. I mention these details of my life because my humanism has never been 'academic' - it has always been an active philosophy of life which easily accommodated veganism many years later. I stopped eating animals when I was twelve, but sadly it took me way too long before I became a vegan. This is all to say that humanism is a significant moral philosophy which veganism can fit within very comfortably. One of the most shocking things I've ever heard was a vegan say she, and all vegans, were morally superior to other people. This is a very fascistic notion and one, along with other prejudices, we must stay mindful about rejecting as absolutely unacceptable. Veganism is well and truly on the right side of history. We are making moral choices about how we live every moment of our lives, hence my little journey through my own life. We choose this, not that, or that not this at every moment and it adds up to something significant as time goes on. Now more than ever our choices count for something significant when they join with the choices of others to change how humans occupy this planet and determine its future
My god your over inflated self importance is hilarious, I I I I 😆 🤣
You'd be the person at the party waiting foe someone to say something you don't agree with so you could start an argument.
me too vegetarian from birth then realized fifteen years ago it was pointless and became vegan ..
i think the moral position to not exploit animals is morally superior to the immoral position to exploit animals but to judge a person, not a position, as superior or inferior is inaccurate and divisive.
The world view of human supremacy, the position that humans are superior to other species of non human animals and therefore those other species can be forced to suffer and be killed with moral impunity... that is fascist!
Man here I thought veganism was all about the animals and apparently it is just about everyone and everything else other than the animals themselves
Veganism is about animals, but it's not bad in of itself to talk about people's struggles to be vegan, for vegans to be made aware or that, and for vegans to help about that. Especially to get militant or bullying vegans to have more compassion and practicality. A example is Miyoko making cheese from different plants for people who are allergic to nuts. You also do the same that if people told you to do something good, like to care for the environment more, you probably would state your struggles too. People can't be perfect.
You also can't use "caring for the animals" or a good cause to dictate at people, lack compassion for people who struggle, or lack practicality.
@@user-gu9yq5sj7c How is nut free cheese relevant to veganism? I would happily live on potatoes or rice to avoid supporting animal cruelty. If a person cannot be vegan due to a lack of suitable cheese substitute then they are not really committed and veganism is better without them.
And the animals lose in that situation which is what veganism claims to be about, and is therefore diminished. People are never going to be perfect. We need systemic changes. There are people in this world dragging us backwards in many ways and they will do the same with animals, we have to fight for progress so otherwise apathetic people see food that doesn't exploit animals as the default, and to be vegan as simply normal and expected. @@OM617a
@OM617a
I'm better off without veganism, no way would I sacrifice my taste for delicious prawns, oysters, barramundi, kangaroo, camel, Emu, baby pig, goat ect.
My taste is far to important
@@rondarkman. Yes, you are like a broken record. We know you will not care about anyone but yourself, you are not unique in that trait.
Spot on, great video Ed. Hope everyone has a wonderful weekend.🌱🌅🍀
You are my favourite animal rights advocate in the whole world, Mr. Winters :3
Strange, eating our species specific food group is not a rights violation.
@@pacmanmcgavin7034 Wow, you're still at it in vegan spaces, eh? What a sight to see...
You're right, it isn't a rights violation to eat a species-appropriate diet, considering that we are primates & primates eat a predominantly plant-based diet. Then there is also the difference between necessity & choice, but do keep going off about how you think vegans are so wrong in your sad lil eyes, after invading our spaces for as long as you have :3
Vegan & disabled here. I’ve heard the “where practicable” part of the vegan philosophy described as “do your best, and advocate for the rest”. I like that perspective.
i have paranoid schizophrenia and ive been vegan for a bit over 4 years now 🤍🤍🤍
I love these constant uploads.
Great series Ed, keep it up. It's like an updated version of your "30 Excuses in 30 Days" series...
I trust everything Ed has to say because his fiddle leaf fig is THRIVING. Impressive.
She!! Ed is trans
@@rondarkman. his bio on his own page says “he”
Hellllla food allergies & vegan af! 🌱💗✨
100% disabled guy here, spinal cord injury, multiple head injuries, due to my head injuries I have the worst form of migraine one can have, severe hearing loss, knee replacement and degenerative disk disease and PTSD. Up until I went vegan I was also suffering from cardiovascular desires, was on 7 different medications and scheduled for stent surgery. 17th of November 2023 was my 6 year anniversary of going vegan and I can say without a doubt, it was one of the best thing I have ever done, everything about my life has improved. Nine months after going vegan I became 100% Rx free, I had reversed my cardiovascular decease and greatly reduced my whole body inflammation. Today not only do I not consume any animal products, I consume zero processed and refined foods. I've learned to cook without added oil, salt and sugar and when possible only eat non-GMO and organic produce. And before anyone goes there, my grocery bill was cut in half after going vegan. Becoming vegan saved my life and there is no one who could possibly change my mind. Spoken like so many vegans before me, my only regret is that I didn't do it sooner.
Nice one. What's "Rx" by the way?
Excellent logic yet again. All the arguments against veganism tend to be vague and generalised. No one can argue against the reduction and elimination of suffering and exploitation even for the greater good. If they do they are excepting that nothing can change and all is inevitable.
I have a disability and I think one of the reasons I became vegan was because of what I've gone through. Going through rough times probably makes people more empathetic to other's suffering as well, hence increases the chances of them going vegan.
That veganism is somehow ableist is the stupidest claim I've ever heard. Talk about trying to find any reason to keep telling yourself your a good person while continue to pay for animal abuse, killing and exploitation. Oh, the irony.
personally being autistic and adhd, veganism makes so much sense for me in a lot of ways. i think a lot of disabled people are attracted to veganism because we can have a strong sense of justice due to the oppression and lack of appropriate care in the disabled community. i started pondering veganism and went plant based at 14 because of it. i'm now i think 8 or 9 years vegetarian / plant based as well as 5 years full vegan. it also means i don't need to worry about getting sick after eating. i have a senstive stomach so i don't miss being sick after eating meat as a child. i also don't need to worry about food bourne illnesses anymore. i think veganism can help my executive functioning because of that. i still consider myself vegan even if i need medication to function. it wouldn't make sense not to because i'm vegan in every other way aside from medicine.
hi im also AUDHD! hate it when people say vegansm is ableist!
@@straberryshinigami15g97 yes! saying 'veganism is ableist' is so ableist! i think specism & ableism are so often hand in hand. expecially with the way specific meat eaters try to justify why killing animals is okay because i could sometimes fit into what they're describing in terms of not contributing to society & not sometimes not understanding what's going on around me etc
My son is autistic, epileptic and has a learning disability, he used to have preference for certain foods. I tried meat free nuggets... He loved them, he tried oat milk in his cereal, he loves it. He used to say "mummy doesn't eat animals" now he feels comfortable saying "😕 I don't like to eat animals, I don't think it's kind and I love animals, I love my cat and he's not that different from a farm animal" he is disabled and he is a great example of a teenager making his own choices.
Really great video, thanks. I'm a vegan with a diagnosis of Myalgic Encephalomyelitis . I've been bed-bound and in need of a wheelchair.
Never found that my diet was putting extra stress in my life.
I'm a "legally" disabled person and while I acknowledge that every person is different and every situation is different too, and I acknowledge that some people's choices might be limited by their circumstances , I fail to see why "veganism" as a philosophy is inherently "ableist".
It's kind of funny to me when abled people say that this or that is "ableist" without even asking a disabled person how they feel about this particular "this" or "that".
I have heard of people who use feeding tubes mention that there is only one supplier of the food the use and there is NO vegan option.. I think that is ableist because it is robbing people who have certain disabilities of the right to choose. I personally struggled for 20 YEARS trying to go vegan over and over, but I kept getting sick and my disabilities severely worsened and caused me a great deal of chronic pain.. this turned out to be due to a histamine intolerance that was making my symptoms act up so badly. Typical vegan diets usually consist of high histamine foods like legumes and nuts, so now I just stick to low histamine vegan foods. All of the information I found online and through friends came from able-bodied/neurotypical people who don’t have chronic health problems. Health is important for all people who go vegan, but it is much more important for people with certain disabilities and it can be very very risky and even land people in the hospital. Veganism isn’t ableist, but the vegan community is because it’s not inclusive for everyone with different health needs.
I'm not clear. You start by describing a problem with the medical supply industry and end by accusing the vegan community of not being inclusive. Is there a connection between the two or in what way have you determined that the community lacks inclusivity with respect to health needs?
I'm humbled by your dedication due to the extra care you must take in order to maintain your health on a vegan diet. All I had to do was forego my love of cheese and take a couple daily supplements.
Im disabled and vegan. My sensory issues do not justify making someones worse. Do you have an example of how veganism leads people to the hospital?
@R.I.P.truelove I have never seen "the vegan community" recommend that somebody eats vegan food to which they are intolerant/allergic. You went through a learning curve which is great but don't blame your lack of knowledge on "the vegan community". There are vegan channels dedicated to special areas of interest, like type I diabetes, gluten intolerance etc. If there isn't a channel for people with the 'disability' of being unable to eat high histamine foods, then perhaps you shoud start one? I also am pretty certain that there are many people who use feeding tubes who do not consider themselves 'disabled', but I do agree that no vegan options being available is outrageous.
I love your content Ed. I have a suggestion to make that is offered in support of you and of your fantastic videos. Please slow down the pace. A second or two pause after the completion of a point / thought can go a really long way. I understand your delivery is quick, as well it should be, to fit with the nature and the significance/urgency of your topic. I'm suggesting that you offer the viewer a moment or two to digest your point before moving on to another. My experience with these last few videos has been a bit jarring in the pacing. My suggestion is made with love & support of what you're doing. Your work has made such a huge and significant impact on my life and others. Thank you.
I have ordered my book - it says signed copy. I am in a little town in Australia and will give it to someone who is maybe on the cusp of becoming a full fledge Vegan. Ed, I will buy everything you write - if only to put it out there for someone to benefit! I have also ordered it from my local library - another way of getting your book out there into the mainstream for other people to have a chance to change.
I'm autistic, ADHD, and dyspraxic with anxiety.
Also vegan! 😊
I suppose a criticism I could hear is “who decides what is and isn’t necessary and how is that enforced?”
However, I would hope that vegans, especially disabled vegans, are able to build good answers to that. After all, questions of practicability and justice have been being solved and will be solved in every other movement, and will be going forward.
Me too! I was born with several autoimmune diseases, mental health issues, neurodivergent issues, etc. I’m mostly house-bound from chronic pain and exhaustion. Ive been vegan for about 14 years and it’s helped a LOT. I wish there were ways around medications I have to take being tested on animals; as soon as there’s an option there, I’ll take it! I ate a standard carnivore/omnivore diet for most of my life until going vegan and I can’t tell you how much better I felt when I switched, both physically and mentally. Don’t make me and other disabled people an excuse to not go vegan 💚
This nutty line of argument reminds me of the "discriminating against indigeous people" anti-vegan argument. Just because the Inuit might have had an entirely animal based diet at some time in their history is no excuse for people living in supposedly highly developed countries to eat meat unnecessarily.
You don't need an excuse to eat meat.
@@MasterMoron You need to watch some of these Earthling Ed videos. Almost every possible argument for eating meat is shot down. Ethically, nutritionally, and environmentally, eating a plant-based diet beats a meat-based diet. If you feel your 15 minutes of meat-eating pleasure is worth the suffering and killing of a sentient animal, you are not an ethical person. If you feel eating meat will make you a healthier person, you are setting yourself up for chronic illness and a shorter lifespan. If you don't care about the toll the meat & dairy industry takes on the global environment, then you are probably just a troll.
@@prieten49I've watched many of his videos. His main argument is that eating meat isn't necessary therefore it is immoral to eat meat. Yet, he admits in this video that eating meat is necessary for some people. He claims that people eat meat only for taste but we know that is a lie based on his admissions in this video.
@@MasterMoron Ed Winters has said time and again that some people have to eat meat. He always acknowledges the killing of animals for NECESSITY. But the vast majority of people living in developed or developing countries eat meat for the taste and tradition alone. They eat meat for 15 minutes of pleasure while putting animals through a lifetime of agony by proxy. That is immoral. If you are an Inuit or a Masai, that is one thing. But you are not.
My wife has epilepsy - wouldn’t wish it on anyone. She can’t consume much soy because it will make her brain glitch pretty bad. So what did we do about it? She eats pumfu instead of tofu (made of pumpkin seeds), and eats more of other plant proteins. She’s a great example of someone who powered through a challenge & didn’t allow it to push her off course. She’s also very active & I couldn’t be more proud of her.
Try carnivorous diet for a month she’ll be shocked with the results
Thank you so much for this video. Having a child with autism and having serious food aversions (which I’m trying to get help for) has been so difficult. I’ve always wanted to know the views on this particular subject so I’m glad you’ve addressed it 💚
Just ordered the audio edition !
I have adhd and am autistic, as well as some mental health issues and I have been vegan since 2013.
5:12 thank you!!!!
Thank you for the last half!
Which dissabilities makes it hard (or impossible) for some people to be vegan and why? I've never heared about that?
I imagine it’s a hangover from the days when commercial vegan options were limited, and we generally had to cook everything from scratch. You could argue that in those circumstances, many people with mobility issues/pain conditions/etc. couldn’t do that.But these days there are vegan versions of almost everything available ready to eat, and so it’s become accessible to far more people.
Many disabilities.
Some people with autism cannot eat vegan diets because they taste things so differently that almost all the neccisary parts of a vegan diet taste like shit to them. Also many are mentally unable to even understand what veganism is. In combinationan like my borther has it he only eat like 8 products if even that of which many are not vegan.
Someone who is neurodivergent with a set of safe foods can have a much harder time transitioning.
People who are neurodivergent may often have a suite of other complications and allergies restricting choices. And then ready made vegan solutions may be prohibitively expensive.
So it isn't a problem with not being able to survive on plants so much as an accessibility issue. That is we live in a non-vegan and ableist society and there will be people who live on that intersection experiencing more hardship than others.
im neurodivergent and vegan. my sensory issues do not justify making someone elses sensories worse@@suchawolfy
Ed ..you are just on a different level...I ve no words.. Each time i listen to the way you argue my jaw drops.. You knowledge is absolute. Each argument is a logically constructed masterpiece. Sometimes I worry about you. Because you are too good in what you do and some big bosses out there may not like it. Just look after yourself, please. ❤
❤ love to all of you vegans out there!
And we love you ❤
That diagonal book is set up perfect for me.
Wow. Just wow. I'm humbled and grateful to you for refining your defense of veganism and your advocacy for respect for non-human animals. I'm vegan but I never discuss it unless someone asks me about it. I never discuss any of my ethics or values unless asked. I don't have an opinion on how others live and I assume they don't have one on me. Noone's ever questioned my veganism. However, there are ethics and morals involved that need to be discussed. Your career of advocacy is very impressive. Heading for a kinder world.......
People will say anything to avoid questioning and improving their own behavior. Sad reality for a world full of people who claim to be compassionate and rational.
like you?
Ugh! I know it happens and fortunately I've never seen monkeys picking coconuts when I'm in Thailand. I will be in Thailand soon for a couple of months helping at dog rescues. Hope to do some activism too. Nice live this morning.
Asexual, Autistic, PCOS and chronic anemia due to medical condition(can’t be treated without surgery). I have been vegan since 2017. Almost 7 years now
Thanks Ed. I'm in Australia, and that discount code actually worked! (discount codes and shipping here is usually a stumbling block). 😊
Literally, literally was once laying in a hospital bed after losing my leg, having to listen to the "dietitian" reacting to my vegan dinner order with the usual claims of "blackouts on the third day I tried to go vegan" ... and it was almost terminally annoying.
The most interesting part of this argument is that although cis-white Western men are always most visible on platforms like YT, IG, etc., most other vegans (and activists) I know IRL are non-white, queer, and neurodivergent. Similarly, when I have done activism, the people who are most open minded and interested in the outreach are non-white, usually not-male people. And Black Americans are the largest growing demographic of Americans going vegan. When you have experienced some kind of marginalization, it’s easier to empathize with others who are being oppressed (in this case, the animals).
Thank you for making this video Ed, someone who I know is an animal lover but unfortunately they sufferer from an eating disorder, meaning restricting their diet could cause a relapse and potentially hospitalisation. Its difficult in those situations to weigh up eating animals morally, so thank you for clearing it up. Much love
Nothing restrictive about a plant based diet.
@@jonjonwp While I wholeheartedly agree with your sentiment, veganism is technically restrictive of animal products in one's diet. Simply switching from decades of being vegetarian from birth to vegan required that I restrict dairy and eggs from my diet. This is not to say that a person with an eating disorder would necessarily find such a restriction to be problematic.
I didn't realize just how much I loved cheese until I found myself highly motivated to give it up. Unfortunately, for me, vegan cheese mostly doesn't quite cut it yet.
@@jonjonwpyou're cutting out two entire food groups from your diet. I would never torture myself like that.
@@MasterMoron "Mommy, I did a poo poo all by myself!" is what I hear when I read your performative comment sin these threads. Sad.
@@tamcon72you know how you tell that you've won an argument? When the other party has no counter argument and starts insulting you instead.
Thanks for your videos, I love them
This is one of the most reasonable, intelligent and nuanced speach out there, what a brilliant way to expose this atrocious argument. Love the part where you point out the coward behaviour of using other's disabilities to try justifying your own immoral and selfish actions.
All of we vegans with disabilities - shout out! Lets show this comment section we exist and veganism is not ablesit.
Everything would be so much easier if medication and other related things were vegan. Even things like eye drops are tested on animals. It’s just awful
I asked a doctor why so many types of medication contain lactose whilst such a large part of society are (at least intolerant) to it. He had no answer.
As someone born with a disability, this video hits home. With the reduction of inflammation associated with the WFPB diet. I’m ABLE to run a 5k every second day, with no medication. Whereas, my doctor said I’d be on medication for the rest of my life.
Great video!! Really well spoken and clear
BitesizeVegan has a video on saying she's ok with vegans taking medicine with animal products if that's all that was available. Such as some gel caps of pills being nonvegan. So some vegans are compassionate to people and practical. Just because people can't be perfect vegans doesn't mean they should be excluded and can't try their best. I wouldn't want to be excluded. That is patronizing like Ed said.
Like Ed said, we can and should make more vegan products of everything.
4:47 Yes, it's double standards how some nonvegans omit lactose intolerance being huge and how animal products are harmful.
Google AI "There are an estimated 20,000 to 300,000 edible plant species on Earth. However, humans only eat about 200 of them."
It's not like people with allergies and disabled people can't and don't eat any plants at all. That wouldn't be healthy either.
Miyoko made vegan cheeses of different plants for people who were allergic to nuts. So some vegans do cater to people with common allergies.
Many years ago, I said to someone under a BSV video who lamented that their specialized diabetes meds weren't vegan and for which there wasn't an alternative, that nobody expected them to die of diabetes for veganism so to just do the best they could with things they had control over. It's disheartening that maybe this isn't considered pragmatic advice by social media vegans now . . .
I'm autistic and also disabled. I have been 90% bedbound for eight years due to a rare genetic condition. I have also been vegan for 20 years and raised three kids vegan.
Was so awesome seeing you at the Australian vegan campout Ed. What a man!
I have tourettes syndrome, probable autism, ADHD, OCD anxiety. And a bunch of commorbitities associated with being neurodivergent. I also have type 2 diabetes, survived a widow maker heart attack. Veganism got me off insulin eliminating my heart failure. I can go on and on. I also work 2 jobs and some side hustles. The ablist argument is rubbish as far as I am concerned.
Another disabled vegan of 3 years here 🤚
Yes Ed!!! Love this video. Im a blind vegan and the argument that veganism is ableist has always irked me because it just comes down to the person not understanding what veganism is yet. Keep up the good work, looking forward to the 6th of Jan 👨🦯🌱
Could not have said this any better myself!
I am semi-mentally disabled from OCPD, yet I AM vegan for the animals easilly & purposefully!
Superb response, Ed! 👍👍
Thanks!
The deodorant looks cool 😯
Disabled and vegan here! Love you Ed ♥️♥️♥️♥️
I have MS and sometimes use a wheelchair. (Does that count?) I’ve been a full vegan for three years, having worked my way through to it over a few years. It can be done guys.
Great video!
Cool video. I enjoyed watching it.
Disabled vegan here. There is nothing ableist about beeing vegan. But there are ableist positions within some ethical theories behind veganism like Peter Singers concepts of personhood and speciesism. Fortunately there are more and more vegans who distance themselves from Peter Singers and others similar Ideas and Antispeciesism. Those are not necessary to be vegan and there are better non-ableist ethical theories for animal rights anyway.
Is there a problem with antispeciesism?
Peter Singer isn't vegan though is he?
@@bengilkes7676 as vegan as a utilitarian purist can be
@@suchawolfy I'm just watching Lifting Vegan Logic's video on Peter Singer. He is definitely not vegan.
As a physically disabled, low-income senior white vegan (well, 95% plant based, long story, but I support and defend ethical veganism), I find that calling veganism ableist is itself inherently ableist. I also find from many of these discussions (on Tumblr mostly, but also FB), the real issue is income disparity, corporate greed, government dysfunction due to right-wing tyranny/ignorance and not at all about the dietary choices of an individual being vegan. I want EVERYONE to have access to the kinds of foods I build my diet on. If you need to strike out at disparities, go for the real villains. If you dislike the passion of someone who is ethically vegan, move along. It's genuinely unhealthy to feel like you have to dissect and criticize everyone and everything you personally disagree with. That's a lesson for all of us.
I made my first comment before hearing you say the same thing.
Huh, yeah had never looked into it but all of my epilepsy drugs have none vegan ingredients.