Why Marvel is Always Ahead of DC
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- Опубликовано: 18 дек 2021
- #comicbooks #marvel #dc
In this video we talk about why Marvel is always ahead of DC in terms of market share, popularity and sales as well. Yes, DC has surpassed Marvel many times, but they never maintain their lead for long. Enjoy!
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Very interesting discussion Dante. You know, during my 13+ years managing a local comic shop here in NYC I never played favorites and went by what I liked from book to book. I generally thought DC always had stronger writing and distinct/stylized art but MARVEL always knew how to market their books with amazing covers and always rotating popular characters back into their storylines.
Very good point. Yes some amazing stories have come out of DC. Marvel does market better though. I think it would be so cool to manage a comic shop! Thanks Ben!
@@Dante19883 I made tons of friends there and heared all the wild "who would win", "you don't know anything, i know everything" debates first hand. LoL Comic fans are very much like SW fans in that they're highly opinionated and extremely passionate.
I never thought about it in the way you have explained in this video, but I think your're right. Postmodern age+postmodern heroes= success over DC. I really enjoyed this
Thanks Ellis!
Another amazing discussion D. I'm really enjoying this new podcast format. I think I already told you this, but I have really been enjoying the podcast versions of these videos. I really agree with what you have said here. Marvel will always be ahead
Thanks Vince!
We live in a cynical, post modern age. No wonder Marvel characters do better. Awesome discussion D!
Isn't Batman the most cynical hero of all? Not to mention Damien Wayne, who was raised by assassins, that's bound to make someone cynical
I think that’s why Batman is the only DC character that dominates… for that reason there! Thanks for commenting!
@@Dante19883 Used to dominate. Batman had its heyday in the 1990s and early 2000s, which was an area in which cynisism was pretty much a way of life. But now...we are living in a world which falls apart around us. What people really want is a little bit distraction and a little bit of hope. Consequently, Marvel speaks to the general audience more than DC.
I actually saw a list one time of top 10 comic book stories of all time and if I remember right, I don't even think there was a marvel story on it. If there was, it was like one story. DC has all these legendary stories. Dark Knight returns watchmen Batman year one death of Superman Grant Morrison's Justice League run. They just have so many historic comic book runs whereas marvel just for some reason knows how to market their characters and market their stuff better. Marvel is unabashedly about the sales and they know how to market it to get people to buy that stuff with all the restarts and the read numbering of number ones. I know DC has done that somewhat but never to the level marvel does
Yup better stories from DC for sure!
I think a lot of great marvel stories were single issues and honestly idk I like a lot more of there stuff tbh
You’re right there is a lot of single issue marvel comics that are historic and memorable like Spider-Man no more and the first appearance of galactose and silver surfer these are great one shot comics but DC just has such a plethora of just great runs pretty much Grant Morrison every time he’s on a major character rides a historic run there’s a great marble run Grant Morrison‘s X-Men run probably the best X-Men run other than Claremont and byrne
What I say this about the punisher in about wolverine and the X-Men not being known to people that didn't buy comic books. This was before the movies I forgot to put that in because of course when the movies came out. Yeah, then regular people started to know who they was but still not to the level that people would know who Superman and Batman and the Justice League were because everybody remembers the super Friends cartoon with the Justice League. So people just knew who these characters were more than the marvel characters. The marvel characters mainly everybody knew who Spider-Man was and then it's a drop off after that when I was a kid for their other characters if you went into the mainstream because Spider-Man was on like electric company which was like a sesame Street type show lol and he was just at his own TV show. At one point he was just involved in everything
I think Marvel always be ahead of Dc. I too think DC characters are dated
DC Comics original Harlequin originated in Green Lantern she also married Alan Scott the first Green Lantern. Star Saphire originated in Flash comic.
You may be speaking in terms of sales being ahead of DC, but as a reader myself I find Marvel much harder to get into because of how confusing all the different titles are, with all the spin-offs of different X-Men, avengers, New mutants, X-Force, etc. So many stories that really don't go anywhere it's hard to find a good jumping on point, where is at least with DC there's a few strong anchors that I can see where the story is going and I can jump in
Superman- I must wear the most obvious pair of glasses and hat to hide my secret identity!
Tony Stark- I'm Iron Man.
🤣
Back in my day DC books were for kids and Marvel for teens and young adults. That changed in the 80s I think. The maturity content nowadays is similar, however I think DC still fights a stereotype that their characters are more like the Adam West Batman. Great video!
You're right about the name of DC. It actually stands for detective comics lol so it is Batman comics
I feel the movies also have effected these two companies such as when marvel was almost bankrupt but decided to make an Iron Man movie and now the entire mcu is here and it has been building on itself for years but then you can also come as a normal viewer and enjoy the movies. But the dceu I feel is missing that experience for the average viewer. Such as when I watched Captain America civil war I loved it and went to watch all the other movies and I also went and read the comics all because of one movie. Although the dc movies I remember watching I think the justice league (not the new one) and just feeling lost in the storyline and it wasn't until I started reading Batman and when I played Injustice that I just started looking into the dc universe. I think if those dc movies where better I would be a much bigger fan of the entire universe.
Yes, I can understand the struggle. DC continuity can be a mess sometimes. Try reading Crisis on Infinite Earths.. I’m a long time comic fan but because the only character I really follow in DC is Batman, I was so lost lol
As a longtime Marvel fan I'll sum it up easily:
- Stan Lee & Marvel creators have always been cheerleaders for their own product which trickles down to the fans. The synergy is unreal (see MCU for visual confirmation if you don't read comics). Where do you think the original terminology of Marvel Zombies came from (hint: 'twasn't the comics series, kids!).
- Out of the gate, Marvel characters were cool and complex and would mix it up with anyone including their allies! All were tragic in their own ways and could lose just as easily as win.
- Marvel's characters are largely about their journey and not a destination in a soap opera of the most epic kind. DC characters succumb to their own iconography and character-defining stories and DC tries to alleviate this by an overreliance on alternate versions of stories and characters which creates it's own problems.
- Marvel doesn't need the kind of routine line-wide reboots (Crisis/Nu52,etc.) that DC does to draw traffic to their product - which keeps business running as usual even when things get rough.
You can witness these things on both the comics and film sides and it reverberates throughout the nation. Their diversity - as was mentioned in the video - is oftentimes overlooked by DC fans too focused on certain initiatives Marvel has put out in the past to see that the things you are deriding are exactly some of the things that always keeps Marvel ahead of DC.
Excellent points, I couldn’t agree more!
Marvel has had a surge of becoming big and relevant in media. While we have Batman, Superman and Wonder Woman as icons, Marvels been able to snatch attention in other ways. For example, Marvels relationship with Capcom to create the 20+ year Marvel vs Capcom versus games is one such example; also its Universal Studios attractions, and lets not even get into the movies. DC has always made great, fantastic stories, but when kids wanna dress up as our fave wall crawler, or Fortnight has Spidey as DLC, its hard to ignore Marvel overshadows much of what DC has in IP- outside of Batman.
Exactly! Batman is everything to that company!
I started reading comics as a kid, and without the benefit of internet, social or political awareness, or any other outside influences, I was just drawn to the Marvel characters because I thought they were "cooler" and more relatable. In the purest sense, your discussion explains the reasons (though I arrived at them subconsciously) for my choices. I like Batman, Superman, Wonderwoman, Flash, Green Lantern, etc... but I didn't buy those comics growing up. I bought Iron Man, Thor, Avengers, and X-men. I *loved* those characters. It's not a matter of liking one company over another for me, I simply preferred the Marvel characters. Now that I'm older and my perspectives have widened, I find I'm often dismayed at the pervasive political and social commentary being delivered by both companies, at the expense of, and in place of, compelling stories with interesting characters. Now, I find from a character behavior standpoint, I can find very little different with how the characters are portrayed. I no longer relate to the characters I once did (they are written in some cases with drastically different ideals and mannerisms) to the point they are no longer recognizable as the characters I once fell in love with. Iron Man is still my favorite character, but when I say that, what I'm really saying is the Iron Man I grew up reading is my favorite character. The one that exists today doesn't seem to be the same character to me. Despite Tony Stark being my favorite hero, I haven't actually enjoyed an Iron Man comic since the 1990's. I get excited every time a new creative team is announced, buy the first issue or two, but am always disappointed to find a stranger in the place of my favorite character yet again. I say all of this to say that while my preferences were formed as a kid, and have been with me for decades, if I were to approach these characters today as they currently exist (for both companies), I would not feel compelled to buy or read any of them. That's a very sad realization for me, and I wonder what that bodes for the health of the comic business in general. Thanks, Dante, for another thought-provoking video and topic.
Thank you my friend! I really enjoyed reading your comment and I very much agree! I think comic book fandom nowadays is split in two groups unfortunately… 1) people who actually like what’s going on in comics today, and 2) those who do not. Those who do like it are buying up all the new stuff. But for those of us who are not agreeable to new trends we are getting out fixes through epic collections and omnibuses. I have every back issue I could ever want and/or afford so now I’m buying up omnis and epic collections of the classics from the 60s, 70s and 80s. This is the only way I can keep the memory of those classic characters front and centre in my brain. A pleasure as always my friend!
...social commentary was always part of the parcel, ESPECIALLY at Marvel.
@@Dante19883 I have a few omnibuses. May decide to go more that route as well.
You take stories like dark Knight returns. Sandman some of the great elseworld stories like Kingdom come and All Star Superman and Grant Morrison's animal Man and Alan Moore's swamp thing. I just can't think of Marvel's stories that have that kind of impact on comics. So DC has the better stuff, but I used to really love marvel too. But for some reason marvel just always wins in the sales. You're exactly right, but DC has the more famous characters. The better stories
Yup! Can’t argue with you there
Plus Dante Marvel's sales sometimes are inflated to make it seem like they're outselling DC which they are when it comes to orders. But I've asked a lot of comic shop owners and they say in the store DC out sells marvel even though they've ordered more marvel because marvel pushes those variant covers through the roof lol. Where for the longest time they was forcing you to buy all these variant covers so you had to order so many to get those variant covers that was increasing their sales like when rocket raccoon would be the number one selling comic only because of the variant covers when the first issue would come out
Ah good point I never thought of that! You’re right marvel does a lot of gimmicking to inflate sales
eh I agree on xmen and spiderman not sold ppl are heavily invested in avengers even with the mcu hype especially under jason aaron and historically avengers was mostly 2nd fiddle to the x books and spiderman.
DC is short for Detective Comics which Batman first appeared in.
Death of Superman and Tim Drake. DC has the most iconic characters of all time (Superman, Batman, Wonder Woman) but every other character outside of maybe the Flash and Green Lantern, feel really generic and uninteresting. Marvel has countless interesting characters. One area where I do think DC wins is the graphic novel space. Tons of interesting stories and one shots that work well in trade form.
Exactly! You can’t even touch DC’s graphic novels. So good!
Yeah you're right. DC was ahead around the time of infinite crisis. DC was ahead at that point. I think that's what led to marvel doing civil war and then marvel took the lead again lol and then with the new 52, yeah DC dominated completely there for close to a year where they was way ahead. At one point there was a point where Aquaman was out selling every marvel comic and then when DC rebirth happened. Which by the way was my favorite thing that DC has done and should have kept with that version of the DC universe, but then they decided to go to the social justice route instead of sticking. With that, that was awesome. DC rebirth but they jumped ahead in sales for that. But other than that you're right. Marvel always jumps right back ahead. The new 52 was about a year they was ahead and then marvel came out with their avengers versus X-Men and then did marvel you the first version of it where they had the uncanny avengers and all that. That's what I was still reading marvel. I did love that stuff! That was an awesome series. Uncanny avengers that was pre -social bullshit marvel lol
Yes! Those were the days. I was reading a lot of newer books during that time. I bought a lot of new 52 and Marvel Now. I think things took a turn for the worse when Kamala Khan Ms Marvel came out… it was a steady social justice climb at that point..
I have always liked Marvel more than DC but it seems like the only thing Marvel is doing better at is with their movies.
I'm not a fan of how the topic is framed in terms of, who is on top or who's beating who. To me I look in terms of quality of story, and what the characters do for me as a person and how they make me feel. I feel inspired when I read DC, and I love where those stories take me in my imagination, always have since I was a kid. Marvel is cool but I've never resonated with anything really that Marvel offers, And I don't think the conversation should be framed as far as who's beating who. That's just my opinion
What I got into comic books in the '80s when I was a kid take. For example, everybody knew who Batman Superman Wonder woman was. You could ask somebody that's never read a comic book in America or Canada and they would know who those characters are. And then marvel had the X-Men and wolverine and the punisher as these mega stars in the comic book world. But if I was to have asked my mom who knew nothing about comic books, who wolverine is she wouldn't have had a clue or the punisher lol yet those characters were out selling DC all the way through lol. It's marvel knows how to market their stuff again. I could have asked a regular person that's never read a comic book who are the X-Men and they probably wouldn't have known, but I can better $1,000. They would have known who the Justice League was yet the X-Men outsold the Justice League. Go figure lol
I've always wondered that too, because when you look up the greatest stories and comic book history, they're almost all DC stories. DC has the great stories they have. The longer tradition they have, the more famous characters yet. Marvel for the most part is usually a head and sales. Not at all times but for a lot of times they are. There is times when DC is ahead but I quit buying marvel back in 2014 because of this social justice bullshit and ask me about my feminist agenda that pretty much sent me over the edge lol. And DC. I haven't bought a book in a year and a half now. Almost because of them going the same route. They saw that it didn't work for marvel but they said watch this lol
Yup I’m with you. I haven’t bought a new comic since 2016. I still read a lot of trades and omnis though. But now recent stuff lol
Hopefully I can collaborate with you but DC is choosing to lose they Have Batman Beyond, Static Shock, wild Storm, John Constantine Doctor Fate and the whole wild force DC is choosing to lose cuz they're so horrifically mismanaged
I buy about ten to twelve comics monthly. About 9 are Marvel, one or two are independent and Batman. I’ve looked at the other D.C. stuff cuz I’ll buy the older collected volumes but all their new sh*t looks like sh*t. Also Wonder Woman is pretty grey, she killed Max Lord, but she’s so often just horribly written.
DC should cut down Batman a bit, he is becoming the only character that is holding the company up.
Exactly! Couldn’t agree more
@@Dante19883 How would you fix DC Comics?