MOLD ON SCHLUTER KERDI ??? This can't be good. 1 year test.
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- Опубликовано: 20 фев 2024
- I have been using Kerdi Board for a long time and have noticed that mold grows on it if it is left outside in the rain and elements. But I wanted to prove it in a test so I put a sample in a bucket underwater for over a year. Watch the video for the results.
The Scientific Method:
1.) Make an observation: I tore out a Kerdi shower in Jan. 2023 and saw that the kerdi board was falling apart.
2.) Ask a question: Will Kerdi Board fall apart when it is submerged in water for prolonged periods of time?
3.) Form a hypothesis: I believe if Kerdi Board is submerged in a bucket for a year it will start to fall apart in layers.
4.) Test the prediction: See video.
5.) Iterate and use the results to make a new hypothesis or predictions: Use the same testing method on other brands of wall board to see if they have the same problem or if this is unique to Kerdi Board.
If you need help on your DIY shower project, I offer 1 on 1 tile coaching consultations. We use zoom or Facetime so I can see your project and offer you good advise on what methods and products are best suited for your job.
Click the link to find out more: www.tilecoach.com/book-online
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Here is the video link for the video in Arroyo Grande:
• SCHLUTER KERDI SHOWER ...
Here is the video on the Kerdi Board vs Hydroban Board testing:
• Schluter Kerdi-Board v... 
Развлечения
I have also seen the mold on Kerdi fabric when taking apart a repair from a sub from tile designers tile error and seen dark looking stains around the curb area and tray and also when I have left Kerdi membrane on a roll in the back of the truck exposed it has definitely shown mold to the point of have to cut the diameter of that off the roll wasting two feet by 39 1/2”… I don’t use the board I have but it’s way to expensive. I durock ALL my showers and walls, wet with sponge and apply the membrane. Sometimes trays sometimes mud pans. I also Kerdi over the tray like I do the mud I don’t like the stupid doughnut ring. If it ain’t broke don’t fix it. Never got whey they would want another potential water seam right at the drain body! Thanks for the tests I always follow your vids. I’m 34 years in lol but I still learn. The company that trained me in the late 80’s tested everything they did like your doing in the shop. Submerged water tests etc… ✌️
Yes, "puzzle piece" systems do have their drawback with the potential failure points.
@@TileCoachHey have you ever installed a Hydro Blok system? I have installed hundreds of kerdi kits, but just installed my first Hydro Blok system, they have their own sealant to bond all the panels and joints together which I'm not crazy about but just wanted to know what your take was on the product if you have installed it. Thanks!
Im a general contractor in Pennsylvania and i have done custom showers with custom shower pans. What i use and will always use is the Oatey rubber shower membrane and float a custom shower pan by hand with a 3 stage drain......all i can say is in the 18 years ive been in business ive never had a call back on any of the showers ive done. Im not saying im this great contractor , what im saying is sometimes old school ways of doing things isnt always a bad idea. New tech that comes up doesnt always work out , these schluter , kerdi , foam , fiber cloth style materials just dont seem to cut it. People are paying their hard earned money to have work done , i just think its wise to use a product that works and works over time........as long as its installed properly. Thanks for the content you rock and roll.
Shluter: "We've had enough, we're sending a hitman".
😂😂😂
Lmao
Thanks for the videos man. I would be interested to see you test go board. Ive switched to using it for the most part. Yes, ive seen some mold/black stuff on kerdi before.
The mold is innocuous because it is behind the thinset and the tile, the bigger issue is if that board is embedded into the pan mortar as most people like to do, it will wick up water and ruin not just the curb but potentially the vertical studs, I see that time and time and again with porous cement board and now you are showing it with a foam board, that sucks.
I'm sure kerdi is excellent if installed 100% properly. Personally I only use cement board and a quality liquid membrane. Works every time.
Ya but we can do better can't we?
@@TileCoach i’ve been watching your videos for years off and on and have gotten into Remodeling helping with bathrooms and now I do fall on bathroom remodels down to the frame I mean everything you know complete gut moving the toilet chipping up the floor moving shower drains at work all by myself one man team. Where I am in South Florida never seen Kurti. I’m sure it’s around. No one‘s ever taught me. I’ve only learned that cement board was code and was I’d say 95% of the showers. I open up just sheet rock behind them down here very shitty builders built this part of South Florida from what I’ve learned but I came from up north Massachusetts but I’m seeing your amazing work for years and I know you make much more than I do and I’m wondering how I can learn about Curti. It must be easier and simpler than the heavy cement boards in the dust and then the coats of the red guard to me your videos. It looks like your sheet rocking you’re putting on tape on seams, and rubbing some sort of stealing over it, but I’d like to know the right way and if it’s easier and quicker it would just I’m getting up in years and anything the light in the load and make it easier. You know any suggestions on how I could learn about in South Florida
Thank you!
Hi Issac. Ive watched a bunch of your videos and they are extremely helpful. Thanks for those. I'm just about to set my Schluter shower pan. Looking for a good video I came across some videos saying how the Kerdi system isnt that reliable for not leaking. Ive installed the wall membrane already. Are there some extra measures I could take to ensure a waterproof install? Kinda nervous to proceed now after what Ive seen. Thanks for all the help!
I am so thankful you conduct these experiments and candidly share the results with all of us Isaac. You are truly one of a kind compared to other tile experts here on RUclips. I have used Kerdi and Schluter for many showers and I’m just about ready to never use those products again. I love your videos on Tile Redi pans and I can see myself using them from here on out. Other tile backer boards with some type of liquid waterproofing product like red-guard seems like a much more predictable tile substrate. Keep up the great work!
I'm glad you appreciate it. You're very kind...and yes Tile Redi rocks!
Organic compounds will deposit on the board as dust gets kicked up and settles on the surface of the water. When the level drops as it evaporates, more and more organics are left directly on the board and fed as you add more water to the bucket. You need to have a control and create multiple test samples in the event of contamination but more so, you should create an assembly where there is wood, grout tile etc. to wick and trap moisture between layers to feed on organic compounds suspended within the material layers which makeup shower assemblies. Buckets need lids but also, showers are humid environments daily which heat and cool in cycles as well. I know some people have used mastic in showers which is a big fail and also adds fuel to the generation of mold. At any rate, water can have high levels of organics or nutrients as another mentioned which would also add fuel but it’s likely that grout could be mixed in a contaminated bucket and give a start to the sub-tile Petri dish. I know the home centers always had a piece of siding in a clear box of water that was sealed to prove something. You almost need an aquarium that is half filled and sealed to prevent evaporation and loss of the test liquids which would keep it controlled in a cycle.
But the bucket itself has no mold on it. Thats what I don't get.
@@TileCoachThe bucket itself is make of plastic that is largely made to be in water, buckets have special linear on them that prevent mold growth. That being side I have seen buckets with black mold on the lid or bottum of a bucket, the mold just dose not affect the bucket in any way and the results would be more clear if the bucket was sealed so air and particles from the air can't continually be going into said bucket that would be a great detail next time around. I would like to also see cement board and Redgard or AquaDefense for a base reference.
Science!
@@TileCoach - We've all see mold on items such as glass, stainless steel, etc. It's not the item per se, but the outside contaminants that are attracted and fall onto the item. Mold grows from mold spores, period. They are microscopic and in the air we breath. The only thing all mold spores need is water/moisture. Your Kerdi was wet and will draw/wick moisture into it's surface coating which is a perfect breeding ground for mold. spores. A plastic bucket generally will not, unless it has something stuck to it's sides that will allow that to happen.
@@TileCoach the surface of the Kerdi board is porous while the bucket is not. I am not going to go all out and say Kerdi has a layer of organic material on the product itself, that is where research ahead of science becomes increasingly important for testing. 👍🏻
The waterproofing plastic layer is bonded to a paper which is bonded to the foam. This is why all edges of the board have to be covered with the banding. If it gets wet it will delaminate.
It will eventually get wet then as thinset and grout are not waterproof and it will wick it into the board.
@@EricNeilson_ no he is saving the edges can’t get wet. Which is consistent with Keri’s documentation. The product has to be installed correctly to prevent that.
So Issac, what is your preferred shower install approach thee days ? Mud pan , hydroban membrane on Kerri thin set (2x on pan, 1 -2 x on walls ?_and preformed Corners .,then liquid hydroban over that, epoxy grout ?
This is what I do but 5 coats of membrane normally 2.5 gallons of membrane over sheet membrane fa grout or prism with sealer choice gold color match silicone corners never had any issues
Kerdi isn't meant to be submerged for 12 months straight. Of course it failed, not the intended use.
I agree. But what do you think about the video of the actual shower that gave me the idea for this test? The link is in the description. Check it out and let me know what you think.
That shower was done incorrectly and was soaking in water that couldn't escape. I've done many and never have had issues. I also insist on using epoxy grout for shower bases. Helps me sleep at night
We used Hardibacker for years. Just started using DensShield and we like it
I'm a union Carpenter' From Boston area And a Part time G.C .Il never Do any Tile work at my 7-3 job But Because of your videos Im banging out showers on my Side jobs!
If you're a union carpenter doing tile work, then you also know that you are doing work that belongs to the Bricklayers & Allied Craftworkers union trade. And that you are also a RAT!
I redid my master bathroom a year ago. I had a corner shower with a fiberglass base, glass doors, and plastic walls. All put in 30 years ago when the house was built. I watched a lot of your videos and Bob’s videos and also a few other channels and was ready to pour the mortar for the base for tile, even had a bucket of red guard. After watching more of the water, wicking videos and wood damage, I returned everything that had to do with tile and bought a 4 x 3 base and the plastic walls to install and be done with it. I ripped out a 30-year-old shower and didn’t find any wood damage at all so I went back with the same type of unit. What really convinced me was seeing a friend’s custom tile job in his expensive house and I looked at some of the dirty, grout lines And thought I don’t wanna have to deal with dirty grout or cleaning it all the time. In my case, I squeegee all the walls after every shower. I am happy to know that my floor will never rot out for another 30 years.
Thanks Isaac, I continue to watch your videos but learned to stay away from tile and to use a single seamless enclosure, if I want to be worry free.
While certainly more work you can avoid worrying about grout discoloring or getting funky by using epoxy grouts, they are also basically waterproof.So you'd have your base layer of waterproofing, and then if you got a porcelain tile and used an epoxy based grout a second layer of waterproofing. It's just a bit more to install.
I've been having the same thoughts as I approach redoing a bathroom or two. Love the way tile looks when it's done but I don't think anything beats the waterproofing and ease of cleaning in a shower than a solid, one-piece base with solid surface walls. Tile is still the way to go for a bathroom floor, though.
I would like to see Go board and other products along with cement board try all types and see how they hold up. I have left pieces of cement boards out side on garbage piles and over time they break down some.
I've just finished "waterproofing" all my Kerdi boards, pan, and curb (with Kerdi fabric and All Set, according to the Schluter instructions and your videos!). After watching this (and the inserted video clips of the failed Kerdi shower system), I'm not feeling so good about the time and money I've spent so far. Should I paint everything (or at least the pan, curb, and several inches up the wall) with RedGard now to help insure the shower's integrity -- no leaks in the future?
You should do a review on the new flow fx waterproofing no one’s done a video yet
Nice! I still use it but maybe I should red guard the bottom of the shower for extra anti mold. Also, you should do this the same experiment to hydro ban boards, I'm curious about those.
provided that mold can grow on the Kerdi , would you recomend giving it a redguard coat in the base and curb ? , thank you for the great content , much love
Why not just follow the OEM instructions? I don't get it.
What system or method do you recommend for showers? I'm a handyman and being asked if I do tile. I'm going to ctf class in July.
So, are you going to stop using Kerdi Board now? And if so, what is your recommendation for a best practice alternative?
Just what I was thinking after watching the video.
Issac, have you done this with the Widi,ARDEX or RSS?
It was great meeting you at the Tile Lite table in Vegas!
In all my years of tiling, I have mostly seen mold at the base of the shower. It leads me to believe that since the water pools at the base and cannot drain out, it turns into mold eventually. I'd like to see a product that does let the water drain. Maybe a trim edge with drip holes would work.
So what is your conclusion and what is the purpose of this test what will happen to duraroc if you set that in water for a year
Nothing
I’m a little concerned. In the middle of a project with Kerdi board. Walls are in with tile next step. Is there anything I can do as extra protection? Thanks for the videos.
I wonder if GOboard, which they sell at Lowes will have the same issues...
Kind of a response to the video referenced in the description, but I absolutely never use the schluter preform curbs. I use the 2 inch board and cover the whole thing in Kerdi fabric. The thing to keep in mind about Kerdi boards is that they are made of polystyrene. The polyethylene/propylene fleece fabric in the banding and other kerdi membranes is not meant to be submerged for extended periods of time. It's meant to dry out between usage, and protect the polystyrene shower structure. Polystyrene is waterproof, but acids and organic matter can (very slowly) degrade polystyrene. Water is a breeding ground for bacteria, and a byproduct of bacteria can be acids that eat away at polystyrene. The Kerdi curbs are relatively flimsy and thin in places, when compared to just solid 2 inch boards bonded together with thinset. Thin Kerdi boards can much more easily be worn down and compromised by bacteria. If you want a bomb-proof shower pan, you should use 2 inch Kerdi board for the curb, and coat the entire bottom 1.5 feet of the shower (including the pan, curb, and the entirety of a bench) with two coats of Hydroban. Hydroban is, in my experience, far and away the best waterproofing finishing solution on the market.
I wonder if it makes a difference that the foam was exposed? Could you put seam tape around the edges and try again?
100% it makes a difference
Aw man, I wish you had done Hydro Ban too. Just finishing my DIY bathroom with it.
It's hard to find in my area.
i've got lots of scrap hydroban board ill send you some@@TileCoach
@@TileCoach I'll put a piece in a bucket for you... Set a calendar reminder for a year from now. 🤣
I prefer go board because I believe the fleece on Hyder Ban and kerdi boards just creates another failure point. I used to buy Hydro ban by the pallet and I’ve had a number of them delaminate after they’ve been stored indoors. That’s scary. I’ve also gone through a couple pallets of go board and have had no issues. I can tell it’s a different type of foam. The exposed edges of go board will become flaky if stored in the sun. But I don’t think any of the materials should be stored in the sun. Just my observations They make you a little itchy but I’m glad there’s fiberglass in it. Lol.
I believe all contractors should perform experiments like this.
Way to bring your view on it. If we all brought our experiences and we actually strived to build the best we can the industry would be way different.
What if you perform the same thing but put the board vertical and have a stream of water hitting just the fleece layer. Also maybe could tile a section and replicate an actual shower wall.
I wonder if this will happen with cement board coated completely with aqua defense
I’d like to see This test with the kerdi fabric as well as go board
I have a piece of GoBoard I’ve been using on my tile table for at least a year. It gets a wet every week and still damp when it goes back in the truck. Other than cut lines, still looks new.
I left a piece of Kerdi board outside for a few weeks, it was rained on a couple of times and started to mold pretty bad. Haven’t tiles the shower yet and don’t know if proceeding with Kerdi board is a good idea.
Trust your gut buddy
There are less expensive, better alternatives.
I mentioned Tile Coach to a Shluter Rep and he acted like i cussed him out. 😂. Keep doing the good work
𝗤𝗨𝗘𝗦𝗧𝗜𝗢𝗡? - I live in Canada, Quebec and will DIY my Shower this summer. Are you still using the Kerdi Backer Board (seems to be not so good...)? - I have access to these Backer Panels -> Prova, Wedi, Laticrete, DensShield, Toolway and Kerdi, any preferences?
Problem is how was the Kerdi originally installed? Was it done correctly? Was the proper mastic and grout used? Was everything sealed properly? Did the homeowner follow through on using a fan to disperse the moisture?
And Kerdi is not designed to be under water 24/7/365.
You should bond tile and drill holes through it and soak it. Try to immiate real word conditions. Maybe even dry it out periodically
It's because of the fleece, any fleece material when kept wet will grow mold, all it takes to feed it is a bit of dust. Mold will even grow on paint in a bathroom with high humidity or in the gulf coast region, mildew will grow on your car paint if you don't wash it for a month or two.
You the man
Yeah I'm thinking that that material itself is just to hold the thinset or whatever, and that the thinset is actually whats water proofing
The whole problem Issac is that waterproof board can not absorb the water like the old water in, water out 1/2 cement screed. So the water has no place to go and MUST by nature engender mold. I really like your idea about some sort of anti-microbial type coating to stop it ~ you could be onto something BIG man.
I would love a consumer product video with a practical "study" on these issues such as mold. Scientific research had developed a tremendous amount recently in this category alluding to modern products and chemicals killing mold that have a negative effect if not dealt with correctly. Major health concerns that allocated over 400 million dollars in military to research issues.
Cutting edge research this is and highly concerning on the impacts it could have. I'm not the professional to have a conversation with rather a low tier messager boy so to speak. It's on my radar and think it should be on yours ad well. I'm more than happy to share where I've come to learn these things if you want to talk and also integrate them into your way of building these beautiful showers
Woulda been awesome if you woulda done all the different boards
I worry that the membrane is failing because water is getting in behind it through the edges. I suspect you'd have different results if you kept the water only touching one plane of the board.
Your take on “science “ seems to be spot on. Awesome test. Will be remodeling my bathroom ( in a new house only built in 2021) to a walk in shower. Leaning towards Kerdi. Was anyways.
It appears that the de-lamination occurs when water enters the board's core. The water will eventually migrate throughout the entire panel, and ultimately - and not surprisingly - cause it to fail.
Perhaps I'm missing something, but a properly installed Kerdi shower system is completely sealed and should prevent this from happening. It seems the take-away from this is the edges of the Kerdi board should never be exposed to moisture.
Or remain submerged, schluter says this in their manual. It’s designed to get wet and air dry. This is like testing the towing capacity of a Honda civic with a boat attached and being shocked when it doesn’t pull it…
Seems like some Schluter hate going on here. Isaac do you still use their products?.
Only thing with the mold is it’s stagnant water and normally it’s a dry out system if I’m thinking right so that’s normal to me
Yes but the plastic bucket itself has no mold on it. I don't get that. But I will be trying several other boards to see what happens. The mold wasn't even the point of the test, it was the layers coming apart. The mold was a surprise.
So what do you recommend?
I gotta tell ya I don’t trust kerdi fully. I’ll usually switch the customer if they are wanting foam. I would rather use mud and a liner with a mud curb. I install any foam product if the job specifically calls for it. Personally I prefer the traditional methods
For professionals that is a good way to go (if you got the skills). I'm about to do a shower like that next week except we float the walls too. Stay tuned Jason. Thanks brother.
@@TileCoach awesome can’t wait. Keep mud work alive! I do mud float walls here when I can charge for it. Some jobs allow for it and some do not. Thanks for the kerdi video. Very cool of you to spread your knowledge. I know it’s time consuming what you do.
I have seen the curbs also fall apart in a year I just demolish one it was still somewhat solid but was leaking bad not my work !cause it takes a lot for me to trust! I went back to brick or rapping the 2” foam board in sheet membrane then going crazy with roll on membrane 4 to 5 coats on top. I did a demo aqua defense shower last year it was 12 years old no leaks it was a absolute nightmare it was like ripping seat belts all day cause it was cotton cloth and probably a full 5of membrane end of the day the sheet membrane is my second line of defense
Do the same test with cement board and a liquid membrane like redguard or aquadefense and i bet it doesn't fail like this.
Knowing this, what are we supposed to use instead? Kerdi board is expensive , anything that is comparable?
Back to the basic classic and supposed "never fail" HOT MOP 😁🤣
Yes I have seen mold on this material before.
As a biologist, I guarantee you that anything you put in that bucket will grow mold in a year, and most things will grow it much quicker. Kerdi is a good product. They're not selling panels that haven't been tested. I prefer hardi, but the panels are appealing because they're light and easy to cut.
The bucket itself didn’t have any mold on it. I think the Kerdi has a glue or paper (something organic) that is food for the mold. But like I said, I’m going to put a few different types of boards in there for another good soak and I will keep you posted so hopefully you’re subscribed so you see the updates. Thanks for watching and your input.
I thought shower materials aren't supposed to be submerged for yrs at a time?
@@KMORRICE1985 shower pans that get used frequently can maintain moisture constantly under the tiles
If it is install correctly, you shouldn’t have water trapped in a tight space in between tile, thinset and substrate. If you have a sloppy tile or grout install, or movement in tile, and water gets in with no way of air to dry out that space, and that shower is used every day for a year. Allowing that small space to never completely dry, and ta-da you get mold.
@@TileCoach Hello my friend the mold can come from tiny invisible spores flying around in the air, or previously on the bucket, which then get into the water, which is a damp environment making it habitable to mold. a real mold test would involve a controlled environment preventing spore growth
I've wondered why you're supposed to adhere the kerdi band, which seals the gaps in between the waterproof surfaces, with a non-waterproof adhesive (thinset). Makes no sense. If the adhesive is letting some water in, then mold/material breakdown isn't a surprise. GoBoard's system makes more sense. Seal all those gaps with a silicone caulk. Liquid membranes (properly applied) over cement board would also seem to be a superior solution. Disclaimer: I don't build showers for a living; just done it a couple of times. Thanks Isaac for another informative video. NCal Strong!
When cement crystals grow they penetrate into Shluter and then it won't fall apart! Cover it with cement and tile properly, then put into water!
Should make mini pans with all the different boards and tiles. Make them all small but scale then fill woth water, no drain. Like little tile shower birdbaths. Then take them apart. Would be a good experiment... but to original vid. Think it was most likely due to improper install, maybe, hopefully.
What foam board / Brand do your recommend using?
Wedi
My issue with this is the fact that iff water is getting into the kerdi isn’t there a bigger issue?.keep up the good videos
I understand you do these experiments and testing, but just as a curiosity, do you talk to the company about the results and see what they have to say about them?
He just does it for engagement. Every one of these comments is a few cents for him.;
Wondering if wedi is the best. Can see it separating and collecting mold
I think so. People complain it's expensive. Sometimes you get what you pay for.
So is Kerdi bad now? I feel like over the last couple weeks as I add a small bathroom to my house, it went from the product to use...to now being torn apart in a few of your videos.
So what's the deal?
It was only "the product to use" because they priced it at a premium and paid a bunch of youtubers to push it
@@idahodiy I'm sad because right after I put some Kerdi board up, I started finding the videos of the installations failing. I am compensating by making sure I use sealer on every seam and using plenty of the membrane. It's just for the walls as it is a tub, not just a shower, so hopefully in the end I am fine. Would be a lot more worried if my pan was kerdi board too.
Dude it's so shocking what you are exposing. I'm sure schluter has some reason why user error is causing the failures, but I always thought their brand was supposed to be synonymous with simplicity and ease of use. Seems like you have to nail their process 100% or your shower will fail.
I love how much foresight and dedication you have! A year-long test! It would have been great to see a control group: maybe a dry Kerdi board, or a plain bucket of water in the same space, or a piece of alternative shower board/drywall/cement board. There are other factors that could have contributed to the mold.
I'm on it! Stay tuned. Hopefully you are subscribed with your notifications on.
He’s not really exposing anything. Schluter can easily and fairly say their product isn’t meant to be submerged 24 hours a day for weeks on end. Taking any product, and stress testing it way beyond its intended and documented use, is a fools errand.
This is a terrible test lol....
Use separate buckets to prevent cross contamination
I agree that mold will grow on a surface left in the air. In the air, there is organic material, dust, dirt, and mold spores floating around. More or less depending on local factors (farming, industry). But it still is concerning. Thank you.
Here in the PNW we find mold will grow on practically anything. Plastic, metal, fiberglass, glass, composite material, you name it.
It grows outside and inside even better because of the warmth.
I will wait to see if anyone posts anything in this thread on which mold will not grow.
Isn’t the degradation simply from the edges being exposed to the water?
Pretty sure you said on a previous video that the kerdi stuff was designed to get wet and dry out in cycles and not remain in a wet condition. Not fair assessment?
Can’t wait for you to test the other manufacturers stuff too. Love the info.
Thank you!
I'm not sure Kerdi board is designed for being submerged for 12 months. This kind of test would be for a swimming pool or hot tub...kerdi isn't for that application, is it?
I do Cement Board and Waterproofing membrane, did one about 2 years ago and then remodeled the shower on the other side of the wall, and when I looked at the back of the board it was dry as a bone. I figured that's proof enough to me that the system works and is far cheaper than this stuff. if I had to guess the paper coating on the outside of the plastic will soak up a small amount of water and hold it long enough to grow mold. mold will grow on anything if it's given enough time in a wet environment and I think that outer paper is doing just that while CB doesn't hold the water long enough for the mold to grow but I would bet if you folded that board as well it would grow something as well.
I would build just a pan with the kerdi base and curbs ,tile it grout it then put a shower head or sprinkler on a timer for 20 min every day come back after 6 months tear it apart then see the results
Can’t you just water proof over the Kerdi with hydro ban or Mapei waterproofing as an extra layer of protection?
I do
@@TileCoach can you put it on the Kerdi shower pan as well?
Now throw laticrete board in, wedi, goboard, hardi backer, hardi coated with redgaurd or another paint on membrane
Probably not much to over think here, Kerdi is a water preventative product, and in their "mold" section a rep sent me said it is meant to dry out between uses but results may differ and are not gauranteed. It is a polyethylene/polypropylene fleece material and most likely the adhesion they use which is hard to find info on, is whats molding. Definitely not made to stay submerged, but they should improve their product and be more transparent. Also, maybe conduct a real life test? I make actual showers in my shop and we use them daily and run the plumbing out the side of the wall lol. That being said it is used as recommended with heavily abused testing. Also I have a way i have been incorporating the oatey liner, the oatey drain mixed with the flo fx drain, floating my pan and curb, and a cheapo sheet membrane which i won't share here, but the results in the shop with 3 different stages of its mockup, to the real life in use mockup are impressive so far lol
It’s known as “delamination”
The really bad thing about mold, besides health concerns, is that when it grows? It has to displace something ELSE in order to grow (cracking grout)…which set everything else up to fail.
Красавчик
👍
Tile coach pls try go board
I better test would be building a small box out of wood and use curdy board kerdi-board to water proof it then fill with water and let it sit for a month to see what happens 😅
What scares more than anything is that Kerdi Board has broken Dow and the layers appear to have delaminated- I use xps based products like Wedi, Hydro Blok - love them, and have amazing success with them - I will do XPS test for you and pass on the results to you
Wedi for me!
Not really a fan of Schluter products, but if installed correctly, Kerdi board shouldn't have any exposed edges for water to seep in and de-laminate the layers. To test the product fairly, the edges should be wrapped with kerdi band. Regarding the mold, is there any surface mold wont grow on? While the experiment is interesting, im not sure it proves anything.
Try DensGlass
I think the problem with the test is this. If water has a high nutrient level it can grow mold. Now with your test the water was sitting still and no movement will promote mold growth regardless. With that said also you are in a shop and I guarantee a lot of dust is now in that bucket over the course of the year no matter how well kept the shop is. All of these are contributing factors. Just to confirm if you had a bucket with kerdi and a bucket with only water if you took a water sample from the non kerdi bucket after a year I guarantee you would have the same mold spores present. Always enjoy your videos and I do like seeing different scenarios to show what showers can fail to give us all better knowledge.
You were able to type what my brain was trying to think...🙇♂
Yeah scientific method requires a control group!
Mold will grow on nearly anything unless it has mold inhibitors. If you have mold spores and the right conditions, you'll get mold. Kerdi cannot control either of those. They might be able to add mold inhibitors, but that would raise prices. Do any of the competitors advertise anti-mold? Also, are there any competitor products you've tested that don't grow mold or don't fall apart when subjected to the same test. That's a big part of the scientific method: Controls and different variables (variables being different products here). Not that I don't like to see people trying things like that, but give comparisons.
I see what you’re saying but there was no mold on the bucket itself. But I am going to be doing other boards so stay tuned! Also, read the other comments about mold on the Kerdi from being left in the rain in the bed of a truck. Not sure but there will be more to come. Stay tuned and thanks for your feedback.
@@jeffreyjbyron The bucket kind of is the control group. No mold on the inside of the bucket, only on the Kerdi, so there must be something about the board that facilitates mold growth. . But please stay tuned I will be doing more of this! Please subscribe and turn on your notifications if you already haven't. Peace.
Huge if true.
what’s up brother bathroom bling LLC shouting out. Hope to see you at covering tile show in Atlanta in April. But to the point not to hate but Kerdi sucks. Hydro band board, and go board are my top 2. Combined with Laticrete band which is far superior to kerdi. I don’t believe in using too much to ensure a waterproof product. We are as good as our last job.
Bro, why don’t you make this test in the bottom of the ocean or the moon or Mars, I really don’t know. Where are you trying to go with this, it doesn’t make sense at all, I don’t get it.
When it used to be called waterproofing system & then called water management system & is Bonded by thinset. That should have raised concerns! Also, the deitra was only installed by non modified thinset. Then yrs later it's ok to apply modified thinset to install deitra. Just because the major vendors in the industry say use our products. Doesn't mean they're following NTCA & ANSI SPECS. My opinion is that they are all in bed with each other. Just like calling clip systems and leveling systems. Not! It's not a plumb or leveling system but an anti-lippage system. The clips definitely help with the crazy over the top SIZE tiles because of the warping. Now the manufacturers are making porcelain tile as big as a sheet of plywood....WTF! KOKO!
The edges of the board are not sealed. That is not how it is installed.
Impossible if installed correctly on the walls… but the flooring… I’ll never use it.
That bucket will probably get moldy with just water, so conclusion would be not to make swimming pool out of kirdi board, that’s good to know
Schluter would say the same. It’s not meant to be submerged or constantly wet
I bet shluter dreads every time you post a video.
Sacramento is central California, not northern.
Mold on Schluter Kerdi with it sitting in an environment that is perfect for growing mold? I'd say the more concerning aspect here is how the layers peel apart, not that it grew mold.
The bucket didn't have any mold on it, only the kerdi. So the Kerdi must have something on it to make it a happy place for mold. But you are correct, the mold was only a side note to my original hypothesis of the board coming apart in layers when wet. .
I wonder what other products out there will survive being submerged underwater for 1 year? Obviously, kerdi was never designed for that, I'm pretty sure any membrane product would do it. But I'm not even sure this test is in any way relevant to shower installation, actually I'm convinced it is absolutely irrelevant! )) I can't imagine any real-life scenario when the board or membrane is surrounded by water from both sides for any long period of time... unless the whole house is under freaking water after a huge tsunami or something!!! ))) In that case, you can shower anywhere inside or outside of the house! So It is just a fun observation but not really alarming or discouraging from using Schluter at all (just in my personal humble opinion))). However, I do have some concerns regarding the black mold on kerdi products (it would be nice to have some scientific explanation, even from some schluter reps). I also saw it before, usually when people store it outside or leave it in the truck for a long time. Again, not very concerned about it... I saw the mold on top of the glass surface before!!! It just needs the right conditions, it can grow anywhere! I think builders should be focused on the bigger picture though, in the case of the bathroom on the whole design of the space. Controlled and conditioned space won't have any mold issues. But everything is important in that case (air movement, heating and cooling sources, ventilation, humidity control, amount of uv light etc.) And when it comes to waterproofing and tiling you need to consider the whole package, membranes, adhesives, grout, sealants, actual tiles and so on. But I love what you doing on the channel, constantly questioning, experimenting, trying to challenge things, finding better solutions and improving for yourself and your customers as well! I love it and I'm glad more people are doing it because of you and this channel!
You get mold on a piece of glass, it has nothing to do with kerdi.
Also mold only forms if it is exposed to air. Good idea to have 100% coverage.
I wish he wouldn't do these clickbait videos. It's kind of beneath him.
@@radman999 It's not click bait if it's a true statement. You might not like it, but it's not beneath me. If other boards do the same, I will report the same. Thanks for watching and please stay tuned for updates.
@@TileCoach Anything will mold when left in a bucket for months. Have you never seen a petri dish before?
@@TileCoach Hi Issac I’m getting ready to redo my bathroom and will use flofx drain with flofx membrane. What is my best option for the walls? Can I use backer board with hydro ban? Also what is the best brand for backer board? Thanks