Schluter has the Holy Grail for Bathroom Remodeling
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- Опубликовано: 18 янв 2024
- How did we waterproof this bathroom? Check out this full system walk through on this Schluter tile system. Waterproofing, setting, and brand new Schluter products - stay tuned on this awesome remodel.
Thanks to Schluter for sponsoring this video! Learn more about them here: www.schluter.com/schluter-us/...
Products referenced:
DITRA-HEAT-PS
KERDI-BOARD-SNLT
KERDI-LINE-VARIO
KERDI-SHOWER-LTS
KERDI-DRAIN-F
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I've been following bathroom renovation projects and appreciate the insights you share. I recently conducted a detailed exploration into the safety and installation practices concerning foam core backer boards, specifically focusing on the critical role of wood blocking for secure grab bar installations. Our findings highlight the potential risks and structural integrity issues that can arise from omitting wood blocking, even with the most reliable materials and techniques.
Given the importance of safety and durability in renovations, I thought this information could be beneficial to your projects and audience. Incorporating wood blocking can significantly enhance the strength and safety of grab bar installations, a detail that's often overlooked.
I'd be happy to share our findings and discuss further. Keep up the great work, and thank you for sharing your knowledge with the community!
Had to demo a bathroom for cast Iron pipe replace, I did it in Schluter 13 years ago. Was perfect, no water leakage at all. Went back with Schluter, foam board. There is nothing that compares. I took a free contractor class 13 years put on by Schluter, well worth the 2 days,
I used Schluter in my basement bathroom remodel for the shower. I love it and will use it for the master bathroom remodel planning later this year or next....I will only use Schluter from now on 🙂
superb results and hope millions of subscribers see this
I like using that smaller size bathroom as an example … tiling gets easier in bigger floorplans, so a smaller sqft is a real challenge, especially with a 20 inch or 24x48" (!) tile … I really like to see that tile and that finished floor and wall! : )
Keep up the good work!
we used Schluter the first time, then went for a cut rate manufacturer the second time -- never again. Schluter is worth the money !!
Love all of your videos Matt!
Hi Matt,
I've already used kerdi-line-vario on a build. It was a great solution, and it certainly makes plumbing easier. A few observations that might help your viewers:
1: When using ditra-heat over a foam pan and using the vario drain flange, the foam support of the pan should be set on a small piece of ditra heat, so the top of the flange flushes out with the ditra heat. In your video it is installed recessed. It may not be a problem, but Schluter wants it installed flush.
2: The ends of the kerdi-line-vario channel are open. It is my opinion that the drain end of the shower pan will stay more damp than a traditional linear drain, as much more of the water can flow straight onto the waterproofing layer. Kerdi relies on thinset to resist capillary action, and Schluter has been very vocal in the past about not exposing their products to prolonged submersion. Hopefully this combination doesn't lead to moisture intrusion over time into the structure.
3: A standard 2" test plug doesn't fit into the vario drain because of the way it necks down. I recommend using one of the 1.25-2" combination test plugs, as their unexpanded state is narrow enough to easily fit into the drain.
4: The drain body is made of polypropylene. This is the same material that kerdi itself is made out of. I assume that means the bond between the drain and attached the kerdi fabric is really well attached. However it is a softer plastic. So be careful if you ever need to snake it.
I'd love to see a collaboration between you and The Tile Coach! He's been doing experiments and showing how Kerdi gets wet, crumbles, molds and has to be torn out. Schluter has a lot of explaining to do, IMO.
The best system ever
1. More details about the "new" niche light
2. Wood in wet area? Going to eventually need redone. Consider tiling up to the window.
3. Vario system can help immensely when trying to coordinate the drain detail.
@mattrisinger I think one key piece of information that was missing is you CAN NOT use floor tile less than 2x2 with a foam pan. If you choose to, dry pack your pan put Kerdi fleece on then set your walls and Kerdi band the walls to floor. Also if you need a custom size shower get in contact with Rodkat who makes pans whatever size you need
I was once in a hotel with a timer light and a legit fryer/ lizard lamp lol best way to warm the bathroom and keep the tile and floor dry
I would love to see how to make a older house more efficient especially with outside insulation.
What is so great about system ,is its clean lightweight.
12:30 Great microphone!
Good thing theres a light on the shelf for when im showering in the dark.
Best water proof shower system?
For me, hands down a one piece acrylic tub and shower!
Just busting chops 😅
Can you do a video on LVP / LVT products? They are much cheaper than wood and tile, but I hardly hear anyone talk about the details of installing it with products like Schluter.
The Laticrete system is a lot more bomber, worth looking into.
Would you prefer to lay down the membrane prior to the window install? What are you recommendations for using the schluter system if you have a window sill and are going to tile it up to the window?
I think I saw something like that new drain in a pool somewhere then instead of the curb the curb is the drain and you can walk on it
Can you show a curbless shower and cost of materials
I did a insanely expensive bathroom with a 7×8 slab of blue stone on the shower back wall i did both a membrane with keridi over the top just to be sure 😂
There’s a lot of different systems these days. The tileredi system appeals to me.
Redi tile is the way to go, I’m a fan of this stuff too but the linear drains aren’t great. You can screw through the butt joints of the board , this used less screws, time and is easier to band as per manufacturer specifications.
Exactly, there have been a few RUclips guys show the drain fails. And it was a unit failure not an installer failure.
Is this for stick homes?
I’d prefer a board that’s waterproof to the core. The market is saturated with many options, wedi, hydroblock, sentinel, Provo & go-board. Most of these are cheaper than Kerdi and more rigid. I prefer go board because it’s $22 a piece compared to $70. I also don’t have to worry about puncturing the fleece since the whole boards waterproof instead of just the 1/16 fleece on the surface. Of coarse Kerdi has the best marketing hence why it’s so popular but most tile guys have started switching to other better boards.
Thanks for the heads-up on that. The Schluter system is really nice, but it's really expensive. It's good to have alternatives like you mentioned for those of us who aren't millionaires.
GoBoard all the way! I would not use anything else!
Would like to see Matt Risinger review RSG-3D and similar wall panel systems. They literally reference "perfect wall" by building sciences so that might ring some ears.
If they don't pay him any sponsorship money, or they are in conflict with Schleuter who pays him tons of sponsorship money, you'll never hear about it on this channel. The age of honest review videos are long since gone now that we have ad revenue pouring in.
Hey Matt, I prefer Wedi because there are fewer steps so less labor. Everyone has their preference...
Any idea what the floor options for large showers are? I'm building a house with a 4' wide by 8' long shower that will essentially be a steam shower and I've heard the horror stories about steam showers and am quite worried about moisture control. I think I will be installing an in-wall dehumidifier as well.
If you decide to do a foam pan get in contact with Rodkat. He was a tile installer for many years and saw the need for custom foam pans. He can make whatever you want and your installer can put whatever membrane on top including schluter. He can also cut the pans to whatever drain manufacturer you choose
Why is the pan put in after the walls?
The only call backs I have ever had was with Schluter Kerdi
Cause it's crap
@@DrBooruexpensive crap
What is the best system money can buy?
@michaelvonfeldt9629 best for the money or best overall? Because Kerdi is neither.
@@MikeHoncho1775 best performance. Any future leaks I see as a worthless system.
My only issue is you waterproof using thinset to set the kurdy band the corners is the thinset itself waterproof?
It is not but the amount of water through capillary action isn’t enough to create problems
As I was just thinking about ripping out our jet tub and making a grown up shower
Best products ever and super sikple
I need myself a Javier
After 20 years of remodeling bathrooms I have settled on a mud pan, FloFX drain, Kerdi waterproof membraine over the mud pan and Hydroban waterproofing. Often times I sister up the studs with LSL's to make the walls dead flat. I use Permabase on the walls and I waterproof with Hydroban.
Shluter linear drains have issues and I wouldn't touch their shower pans because they can flex causing cracks in the grout joints. Having said that.... Shluter makes many great products and I use them regularly.
That is exactly where I'm at RJ! Ditra, All-set, Kerdifix, the bonding flange point drains, and kerdi-band are awesome products. But I just don't see the value in the prefabricated foams unless you are doing the most basic of showers with perfect framing. Learning a good mud pan and how to float a wall is still a hugely relevant skill!
Have you guys ever done a comparison between Schluter vs Wedi?
Schluter pays him too much money to do a head to head. Wedi, go board, hydro ban, etc are all substantially cheaper than Kerdi. The ad revenue has to keep up with the sales pitches.
I have a couple of questions, how is the wall insulated with the niche in the exterior wall? And also, when you install the niche before the tile, how are you sure the top and bottom of the niche line up with grout joints?
By using a tape measure.
Depending where it is it still might have enough r-value , especially if there is exterior insulation. Can’t do it up here in Canada. If you are new to tiling just take the time to measure and map out your layout. Trace it to the wall if you have too.
Took me to end of video to notice that his microphone is taped to a hammer...
Agreed with the negative comments about Schluter. I never believed cementitious sealing would work long term. And indeed long term installs are showing it doesn't.
Welcome to your "every bathroom built in 2023 looks like this" bathroom!!
I want to finish a concrete floor and encase pvc pipes in beams and line the floor with ply wood and flash it like a flat roof
The hammer mic is here to stay
This huge tile fad is gonna look so dated in 5yrs. Schluter isn't a fad though, finally something better than what was out before. 29:20 lol, he was NOT in the loop on how to close out. Left ya hangin.
The only thing I like about schluter is the metal edges they are great ….
Im surprised that niche cutout is on an exterior wall. What insulation is between it and Mother Nature?
large format porcelain tile on shower floor is dangerous and slippery when soapy water on surface.
I just don't understand why this system would be better than cement board and painted over with Red Guard or equivalent? It would seem that painted over waterproofing with a thick rubberized material would be just as effective than boards and screws with mortar. Is it worth all the extra expense and work to mortar in this system versus painting?
Time! These systems no mater manufacture are designed to cut days off installation. Like everything else must be done correctly, in an area like mine you can’t jump from job to job, because of travel you must be in and out.
@@kennethharman2779 how can it be less time when you have to screw, tape and mud similar to drywall? With the cement board you just screw in the board, paint and you're done.
They’re not, realistically they’re all the same time regardless of the method outside of true mud floated walls.
@@nealholden3324 When I remodeled my shower it was a lot cheaper and faster to use the red guard.
@@rockys7726 yeah but if it were to fail red guard would come out and check in random spots to make sure you met the MIL requirements for their warranty
I have seen tile pulled off of this product and it was moldy as hell
You guys are always drinking the Schluter Kool Aid. The must pay you well.
There’s a whole thing about the Schluter line drains failing. The membrane delaminates from the metal drain and causes a leak. Don’t use the line drains.
Link? Video?
This is actually one of the things I think is fantastic about the kerdi-line-vario system. The failures I've seen on the stainless drain is the adhesive holding the fleece to the stainless body releasing. Kerdi fleece is polypropylene which is a hard material to bond to (for example most caulk and sealants don't want to bond to it, even the expensive ones).
The kerdi-line vario drain is also polypropylene, which means they are able to essentially weld the two together. Having handled one, I can't imagine these failing in the same way.
Yep, stick with the Center drains.
All of the waterproofing rests upon the properties of the thinset.
Schluter system is interesting but far too expensive in my opinion, especially for walls. My local supply carries some of their products for $500+ dollars each. Compared to Hardibacker at $11-13/sheet, I just can't justify it.
Some of these videos I watch stress me out. I'm not criticizing but I would like to point out this is not ( Do It Yourself ) work. I personally I think if you're gonna waterproof something on the interior of your home you need to be licensed for that trade. (Honestly every trade should be licensed) just like plumbers and electricians. Also investigate the product fully. Schluter just went through a massive issue with there Detra heat sensors that where bad from the manufacturer. You MUST register the install to make sure you have warranty coverage on that floor heat if it stops working. Everyone needs to read the directions and the small print.
He mentioned that towards the end (first day?) that this isn't a "How To" but a how we did it (synopsis), which I inferred to mean "not DIY).
Not having a single piece waterproof pan seems like it is destined to fail. You're relying on a lot of individual joints and corners that are set with thinset. If you miss one little detail, the shower will fail. And still surprised they set the kerdi band with thinset and not some type of silicone or 100% waterproof product. Thinset isn't waterproof.
The only stuff i use
The camera person not paying attention to what Matt's trying to point out on the floor
The linear drains are failing horribly, unless they changed the bonding system. Look no further than Iaasac the tile coach.
Does he have videos showing failure of product or failure of the install? Because i have watched a lot of his videos and it seems he always finds through his demolition/investigations that the Schluter install was indeed done incorrectly and the installer error caused the failure. Maybe he has some others i have not seen yet, but if that is true, why does Isaac continue installing with Schluter himself?
Im editing this because i just found the video i think you are referring to and now i think i must watch before i continue my bathroom remodel.
@dustinkoehn6890 he does have videos on the failure and he no longer will use the linear drains. He seems to have switched to another product, Shower Solutions as he can use the Flowfx drain. Being a fairly seasoned remodeler, I would have reservations using any system that relies on overlapping bands of felt and thinset to waterproof. True, if done properly, can be a good system. Always a flipside to every conversation.
@dustinkoehn6890
Please post link here
@@dzaino1986please post link to videos here
Exactly. I have seen the adhesive fail.
you know what sucks about these products? No one around me knows anything about em. Of course I can do the demo, but me laying tile isnt going to happen. I been working on a house, on and off for while, you know Covid and extra funds, and the bathroom has been gutted for over a year. In the next couple months I hope I can find someone that can do more than just a half ass job at laying the tile floor.
They didnt let Javier speak after asking him a question 😢😢
The electric underfloor heating is incredibly expensive to run, would much rather have warmboard underneath the kerdi and use a heat pump to heat the water that is flowing under the floor.
I have it in a 325 sq ft sunroom addition and it's actually not that expensive (to install or operate). In the dead of winter it costs about $1.50 a day and is more efficient then running space heaters or cranking up the HVAC just to keep that space warm. So in the end, it actually saves money.
Putting in a heat pump and water lines for a bathroom floor is overkill and you'll never get the payback on that vs keeping it simple with something like DitraHeat. You program it to come on early in the morning, it runs for 1-2 hours, but will stay warm for a couple more hours as the floor releases that heat. It'd cost maybe $0.20 / day in that application
Sorry, I'm sticking with float and set. My installs have been through strong earthquakes and none have ever leaked. I'm at 38 years of old school tiling.
Do you drive a car or truck, or still using a horse and wagon?
@@albertlewis You think the newest thing is better? I've been around long enough to see the process in which manufacturers have changed the trade to be more DIY and the DIY became the "Pro" way to do things. Watched them lobby to change codes too. Sorry, but my installs will last a lifetime.
Kerdi Banding
Kerdi Membrane
Kerdi Board
Ditra
Ditra XL
Ditra Heat
javier and burritos... pretty funny.... and how javier is basically the slave on the site.....
Anyone else yelling at the cameraman to get a close up of the drain??
So I can't even really watch this video all I can do speak from experience. I've owned and operated my own construction company for about fifteen years now. I haven't really started running in to schluter systems until about seven years ago, In that time i've ripped out over If a dozen of the shower systems do the failure. As long as I've been doing construction, I've only ripped out 2 showers due to failure that were laid and built traditionally. And by this I mean shower pans or wet pan and cement board and tile.
Traditional work cost unless truthfully has more room for error And well I guess that's really it
The schluder system is essentially expensive and your installer's. Mark up the material even more than it already is. And it's c***The entire system is based on layering product in a way that water can't penetrate. But it's also a Foam board And if they're not using the phone board, then it's just a thin paper, thick membrane. I've removed the bunch of these. That have just had holes punched through the phone. How I cannot say, but that created the deterioration of the product. It just took seven or eight years to show itself. But by the time it did all of the phone board was much. I seen this at least eight or nine times.
This is the best way to boil it down to do a shower. Traditionally, it requires a skill set a skill set that people to. Day. Don't want to invest the time to learn because it's not quick money. It's heavy material which means you can't be a little bitch, And because it's a bathroom or shower things like that. The only way to learn it is by doing it.
This schluter crap You can go to a 2 day class to learn how to install it. Get a certification and a deal with a supplier. All while in the meantime, having no history at all in construction plumbing tiling. Nothing. but in 2 days. You can be a professional, so you get a lot of little dipshits that go and do with this. And then think they can run into people's houses and install showers. Then on the other side of it, you have these contractors that have been in the game a long time Who see a new easy way to install something that they can upcharge their customers for and it's new and fancy, so they can tell their customers that it's a better product. Because look at all this s***You see online because we all know everything onlines the truth. And then they found an easier way to do a job less efficiently. But make more money on so why wouldn't they do it.
At the end of the day you get idiots, installing a c***** product. You get professionals installing the crappy product and you end up having nobody learning how to install shit the right way.
If you know how to pour a wet bed, good for you, that's as good as it gets realistically, and you can customize it to any space that you want. If done correctly not only is a wet bed waterproof but it's protected when two or three different levels. Even if the wet bed cracks, your liner should still contain the water. Now same with your walls, I've seen plenty of guys. Use rockboard, tape their seams and tile straight over that and have no issues with the shower. Whatsoever this is how it's been done for hundreds of red guard aqua guard, Great products finish your walls the same way and then roll over them with one of these products. To add a waterproofing membrane. Now you tie all over that like normal. There is virtually nothing that could happen to this wall to generate a leak. Even if done improperly, you're still pretty secure as long as you went through the steps. Every idiot who uses the schluterr board and system. Every one of them all they ever say is oh well If installed properly, it works great, yeah but if it's not totally fails And they're not gonna tell you. They installed it properly and it's not gonna show the failure for years. But by the time it does your shower's done. , why take that risk with the pretend contractor.
If it isn't broke, don't fix it. There hasn't been anything wrong with how we've laid stone in tile for hundreds and thousands of years. Stop letting people think stuff like this is acceptable and the quality of work will only go up. Start letting people think this is the new standard and the quality of work. And the people doing it from this point forward will continue to go down.
I'm mid 50s and I live in the South. I have paid 4 different contractors to put in 5 different showers, all done the old fashioned way, none of which are pitched enough to actually drain. All puddle. 1 was so bad I insisted they tear it out and do it again, so now the floor is pitched except for along the walls where it is pitched opposite keeping water against the wall. I have 1 more to do, but just can't bear going thru this again. None of the laborers who actually do the work are anything more than mid 20s caffeinated illegals who have no knowledge, no skills, no experience, but they have young strong backs.
Homeowners can learn to do dry pack shower slope by practicing on a piece of plywood at waist level. Learn standing up straight.
I don't know why I even start these videos.....I'm a real tile mechanic and there's nothing for me in this sales pitch
I’ve learned that with the right product anyone can be a tile mechanic.
@@graememackenzie8795 does owning a scalpel make me a surgeon? Doing a crappy job on your powder room does not make you a tile mechanic
That’s called a slitting saw in the machine tool world
I dunno.... I'll be mr negative here..... but from what I have seen online, these _paper-maché_ shower systems typically fail after several years. I had my showers floated with concrete & lathe, just like in the old days.
Wedi is better
It's equally as good, I've used both. Both will give you many many years of trouble free wet walls. Wedi is often used in commercial shower rooms
I still enjoy cutting schluter better, and since they are pretty much the same price, schluter wins for me, unless someone asks for wedi specifically
@@wags99999yes there is a reason wedi is specs on commercial!!
Please tell your cameraman to focus on what you’re gesturing at, rather than you guys, so we can see what you’re talking about.
Trump would deport all future Javier's, then you will have to do your own work Matt
He's in Texas. Javier could be 8th generation Tejano. Same applies all over the US SW.
No such thing as a waterproof system. Schluter won't even allow or recommend you use the system the way it's done in America.
Schluter is such a scam.
Great company for making money but products are time consuming and unnecessary (rip off)
Compared to what? How do you do showers?
I know the "system" products can be more expensive. I don't know that they're more time-consuming, plus you want a 10 year warranty on the heated floor.
What I like about what I saw in this video is large tiles that flat and not all slightly different reflections. Though I would have made the lines continue from the wall to the floor, so I wonder why they made that shift. This bath looks like it would be great in a shade of white rather than that drab grey.
I used a vapor barrier and float or vapor and cement board. Better adhesion and 1/3 the cost.
Shower pan pvc and float $ 50 schluter $600?
I float and set pan in a few hours completely.
These systems save so much time on install it's good for me and the customer. By the time they pay for your labor in a traditional shower it ends up being more expensive and it takes about 3-5x longer to finish. Another great point is working on second and up floors, I would much rather carry foam than 50lb sacks of dry pack and cement board. And as stated, it's not a saturation system, it's a waterproof membrane. When done correctly, installed to manufacture standards, this system is amazing. I've ripped out a few that were done wrong, and you really gotta try to mess this system up and put it in wrong.
Wayyyy less time and labor to build a Schluter shower than the old mud pan and cement board process
Video title made me lose all confidence in this channel. Either he’s clueless about the alternatives or more likely this is paid advertising for Schluter
Dude, he literally says it's a sponsored video. Multiple times.
Would love to hear from awesome Javier him self in regard to this install. Also how is his compensation, health insurance and possible 401k?! I am certain that is also kick-ass as his work is. Does Javi get mid week golf putting invites as well? 🫵