Question i am a complete NOOB, when it comes to such things but how long does 3D scanning a miniature take? Vs taking a good picture of a model and editing it to look the way it does? It might be a question on timing, if it takes several hours to do a scan of the same quality as on their website, they might not have the time to scan them.
@@Erikjust Doing photogrammetry would take some time. What we're talking about (or at least I am) is putting the miniature on a turntable, and then taking 6-10 pictures of it from different angles. This would let you "spin" the model. See the GW online store for reference. They even do 2-3 angles on some of their figures so you can see the model from above as you spin it as well.
I think one of the main problems is the time saved by having someone else do insane amounts of work conceptualizing an idea and crafting it to give you a piece no one else has access to. People saying all minis are sculped by someone else forget those minis are also available for everyone to use.
Agreed. The whole model has an almost Disney aesthetic, but the moon particularly looks like it wouldn't be out of place in something from the Steamboat Willie era.
Like you said, between the two highest single models, the technical skill is equally close to perfect. So, you have to introduce some kind of way to make a bias, and the ork model was a true homage to GW art in a few ways.
This actually really annoyed me after looking at the Squad entries and then seeing something from an employee that is nowhere near the level of the other two.l
One thing to jot about the pictures is that they are done on the day the winners are announced so don’t have that much time with each model to get the best setup or shots. Would be great if they kept them for a while and spent more time giving a dedicated section to see close ups and all angles. Always enjoy these breakdown videos, gives a good incite to the top level painting
true. but still, how many seconds does it take to get a couple more photos of each model? :P i'm sure the photographers are experienced enough to get a few more photos in before they have to move on to the next model
I'm pretty sure that all the gold's stayed at GW for a while, so you can visit and see it by yourself. So, yup, they can put more angles if they want, but will probably not gonna happen.
@@ecMonify No time at all, you get one shot you spend maybe a minute setting up your camera, if you stay mostly still and turn the model in place it takes like >2s a photo after that
While I still think GW could strive to spend a better amount of time to get a better set of photos but the very least they could do is take a very high-definition photo so you can at least zoom into the single one they give you.
There's one flaw with the golden demon which it has always had since day one that really bugs me, although it's not something they have any need to change.... The judges are incredibly biased towards a specific style of painting. If you compare golden demon winners to the top entries at Crystal brush or Monte San Savino , the golden demon entries still feel very rooted in that tabletop working style while the others really lean a lot more into it looking and feeling like a three-dimensional piece of art
The goblin is nice because it tells more of a charming story.. with the alchemy he’s doing and the cute and compact things around his feet.. Golden Demon has always been biased to a smaller single model executed well.
Albert Moreto Fonts smoothness looks like photoshoped. Such an inspiration! When it comes to his Single Miniature-Gold, it could also be possible that he wanted it to look that way instead of the limitation by using Acryl paints. Have fun with your offspring. ☺☺☺
@@DW_R Pigments. Acryl paint pigments. You are limited of what you can achieve with Acryl paints. Well, your skills need to be *very good* to reach that sealing but this does not change the fact that it exists.
Ah, finally! :) I was hoping for you to make a video regarding the GD UK and here it is! :D Sharing most of your views, especially pleased to see a small move towards a more creative, open-minded approach this time again... There indeed were some extremely hard decisions to be made... Backdrops and Water Effects seem to be on the rise, which is great! Regarding Chris fantastic water base, I would have made a donut shaped clay sculpture that includes the waves, mold and cast it in clear resin, then glue it on the wood, put the painted foot in, then pour in the gaps and cover the transition with several water effects (Gel Denso, maybe some microballs, doll filling, nylon string, etc.)... Loving how perfect and clean Chris is about every single element of his projects... Not surprised to hear he has spent that many hours painting, figure he spent a similar amount into building all in all as well... :)
Considering the amount of time painters are putting into the event, you would think that GW would up their game and be willing to accomodate all the people wanting to enter, participate and also the art itself. It just kinda seems like they're falling short on all fronts in regards to the event besides the event itself, such as the pictures, number of tickets, venue size etc etc, I think it would make more sense to host the event in a conference hall or small stadium or something at this point and hire a team of photographers to really out-do themselves.
To be fair, that's most likely because they would require at least an extra 5 experts and 1 week to look at everything, then ship them (or have pros sleep in hotels nearby and wait). It all has to be rushed on the day/weekend to get all of it done. And, the event itself, etc. already costs a lot of money -- but we can assume they can easily afford this, yeah. My guess is, the major reason they don't up their game is to ensure it all gets done in 1 day. They could maybe hire a world-class camera guy or something, though. And, if they upped this to stadium-level or something, it would most likely cost too much money, even with ticket prices already quite high for people? Best they can do -- and something they should do -- is hire a better camera and cameraman to really take great, high rez shots quickly! It wouldn't hurt to add many pics to the website, too, instead of just one. Or, at least find the best angle and pic of the shot. The other problem with the entire event is simply the judging process and how it's all dealt with -- but, that's GW's choice, so I don't have much problem with it, and I don't even disagree with all of their choices. But, this is a problem for many painters, for sure. It would be best to host more than one style of GW event each year per country. That would be really amazing, but really require a lot of time and money. Still, it's the best route to do, if they were to completely up their game in some way.
I heard the question asked repeatedly by Trovarion and the chat: "Should we count or reward a model that was sculpted by one person, but painted by another?" The answer is yes. Every time we paint a model made by a manufacturer, that is exactly the same thing. You paint GW's model? They sculpted it, you painted it, you get the award for the painting competition.
I mostly agree, but the issue is the entry is gaining a leg up based upon originality and creativity that was uniquely available to the painter. Normal figures that aren't custom are sculpted by someone else, but they are also broadly available. I have a feeling that all else being equal, a custom sculpted piece would always win. It's sculpted by a (probably) superior artist to GWs official sculptors. It doesn't have to work in a plastic mold. It doesn't have to be at all practical as a gaming piece.
What you say right at the start interests me a lot: there still is a strong temptation towards finishing it 'smoothly'. As both a canvas-painter/muralist and - recently - 40k starter, I really see a lot of opportunity in exploring a grittier, more textured look that also actually includes brushmarks: think of painters like Lucian Freud and Jenny Saville, who create realistic human portraits by building them from very on-point single brushmarks. Consciously making a brushmark and leaving it alone, instead of smoothing it in like we all tend to do. Maybe there are some model-painters who have already suceeded in this approach, if so: curious to know their names. Imagine painting an army of Orcs in Simon Bisley-esque textures, that'd be amazing! I'm going to be brutally honest and say: I quite dislike the 'finished', 'airbrushed' approach that makes it all seem factory-like or too cartoonish (the single miniature 2nd and 3rd places are examples of that). No, it should not be sloppy, but an approach similar to alla-prima painting could be very interesting.. When it becomes too 'plastic', or 'high fantasy', it actually destroys the illusion for me. And don't get me wrong: that style requires huge amounts of skill and patience, but it does become very predictable. I like the first place one for that, though it is still too slick for an 'Orc Blessed by Nurgle'.
This was a great Video @Trovarion! Really enjoyed your commentary on all the pieces, I hope next year there will be better photos which you can show! As for the photos, as someone who photographed the winning pieces at SMC and WME I can tell you that we have around 6 to 8 hours without public in the evening where we can photograph the entries. We usually photograph them on the tables (maybe move stuff around so it's less busy, where possible) so in that sense the GW photos are a great step up as they have a coherent background and lighting. What surprises me is that when they photograph the pieces in a dedicated spot why they don't turn them around three times to get every angle, and maybe photograph with a 2nd camera details? I guess the answer will be time, which is limited - no idea how much time they have to photograph the Top 3 after they have been chosen, could be pretty limited.
So what is the difference between regular layering and stippling? They use same blending methods (blend colours at the wet palette, but difference is how the paint is applied to the model?
My favorite entry is Dave Perryman's Squiqs. Two reasons: very much in love with the paintjob itself and the base looks more realistic (has more depth) than the gold and bronze entry.
I think that MESBG is a weird abnormality in Games WOrkshops' portfolio. IIRC - the contracts say something funky about using the same miniatures in advertising, so, GW probably can't show people building hobbits with chainswords or ringwraiths on squigs ... so I guess they just have a GD category out of obligation, but, aren't super jazzed about the subject since they can't show off stuff if people start slipping Nighthaunt into the army of the dead ... right?
as a noob looking at these it feels like the winners were able to make their mini not look like a painted mini, but pulled from a cartoon or something. If that even makes sense.
Open category is just that...OPEN.does it really matter who sculpted what? Because no matter how great a sculpture is, the finish is everything. It's literally a figure show and the figures need to be painted to a high standard what drives me nuts is the diorama category. Almost all of the models are vignettes, not dioramas. But. The vast majority are beautiful.
Personally I can’t stand all of these super smooth and oversaturated paint jobs, everything looks soulless and as though it’s been taken from an ad for a mobile game. I appreciate the technical skill but the results lack character.
"kitbashes are more expensive so obviously they won" is one of the most simple minded and narrow/ personal (to the one making such a statement) art crippling points of view I have ever heard.
I’m noticing a lot of these seem to blend in with their bases almost too well? I would have thought there would be a lot more contrast between the model and the landscape but it almost seems like it was an intentional theme with all of these; to have an almost “camouflage” look IDK 🤷🏻♀️
They should probably have seperate categories for entries that sculpted and painted vs ones who just did one or the other. Or sculptor and painter should enter as a team.
So if they have a team for this, then why not add a few photos and allow people to slide between them. This is some of their best advertising and all they have to do is take pics and pay some royalties
@@jordivermeulen2519 that’s true about the refraction but the skull on either side are T noticeably larger in the same way. Idk maybe he’ll talk about the process at some point
The Spike Magazine entry highlights what I dislike about most of these entries. All of them look flat. Like they're painted to look like a piece of 2D art, rather than taking advantage of their three dimensionality. Like if you cropped out the white background, you'd never even know these were 3D models at all. Yes, they have good highlights and shadows, but the placement of them doesn't create depth in 3D space. And let's be clear, I'm not dogging on anyone's skill. These are all exceptionally well done, far better than where I'm at in my journey. It's the general flat comic book style being applauded that I take issue with.
"Open Category Silver" is just madness. Pure Madness. As for the Sculpting of unique pieces.... nah - you should not be accounted for that - it´s first and foremost a painting competition and 99.9% (well - a guess) of all painters are not professional sculpors.
In appreciate that you’re humble enough to admit that you can’t paint at the level of some of these winners. Its clear your critique isn’t coming from a space of “I can do better” but rather just being open about what stands out to you.
I agree on needing more pictures. The second place (second one you looked at) didn't even look real to me. It looked like a cartoon drawing. Having more pictures would have given a much better perspective of what it looks like in real life.
for the squads i think they should have individual bases like the pox walker setup ...... those orcs were more of a diorama because they were built onto one scenic base ......
The single miniature silver. I would assume the chest and the sword are what got it second. The sword reflections are abit static looking adn the chest is abit flat. very little color blending so it looks fake. Im amazed it didnt get bronze honestly
If you listen back to Chris Clayton's interview with Cult, I'm sure he says he had no prior experience working with resin,, which would make his piece even more amazing if so. With Tom's Tau bust, I really wish GW would sell stuff like that!
I was lucky enough to be with Albert Moreto font today and was lucky enough to hold the two demon winners they photos do either of them justice. The texture differences on the 40k was superb. I think the pictures are washed out
Hey Trova, there is a challenge i alway wanted to see you trying if you feel like so. What about a basic ultramarine squad painted as they were on a night opération. The light of the lenses, the glow of a moon on the armor and the « darker » blue should make the scheme of color very wide. Are you up to ?
It was a great event this year, my first-time entering and the standard was excellent across all categories. The Warhammer 40000 and AoS single miniatures had around 7-8 crazily good entries per category and many below were very good indeed. Richard Gray's entry was into AoS single, and the Goblin Loonboss was tiny, and beautifully painted. The judging must have been extremely tough this year. I heard many GW staff and incredible painters saying the standard this year had been completely lifted and many were just generally excited by that. It was so awesome to be a part of and has given me a lot of ideas and inspiration for next year. I'd really love to see GW bring back the Staff category as well as having the open. There were some incredible entries from the Staff, including Darren's that took bronze, but many felt a little lost next to the busts and sculpts. Great coverage and highly respectful opinions of the entries Trovarion, for anyone contemplating entering in future please do, the experience you get from being around other painters a lone is worth all the effort.
The problem with GD, is they do not have a matrix or codex or listed standards to judge on. It is abstract, whatever they feel is good. As long as it fits a theme and is pretty (in their eyes)
One thing I really liked with this GD was that there were so few pro-painters who won it. This is not a play on the video title, but an honest take. Of the winners I think Chris is the only one full time painting? This really show that the hobbyists can do wonders if they focus on a single project for hundreds of hours, a luxury I think many pros do not have? When I compare this to Monte or WME, it is the reverse. I do not know if that is because they value different things, or something else? For example, we saw some of the super-painters like Arnau here at GD, but not placing. At the podium for platinum and gold at Monte, it is basically only pros plus Mike Blank and Albert Moreto Font.
@@studiosuperchroma8600 sorry, I should have clarified. I meant, full-time miniature painters. Maxime is an arts teacher Albert works an office job full time Thibaut also works another job full time,
Personally I think teamwork is fine, especially in the open category (but even in others). Even if a model was painted by a team if one was better at picking colour schemes and composition, another at painting textures and another at lighting or whatever. It's fine. At the end of the day we'll have artworks I like more and that's better for me as an audience member.
Agreed. At the end of the day it's a painting competition that is being judged and what should be the distinguisher. The open silver winner may not have sculpted it, but they produced the phenomenal paint job for it (I see open category as much as items that don't fit into one of the other categories). By the same logic, anyone who painted a GW miniature didn't create it either.
@@scottwallbank4794 well that's not quite the same because if everyone paints gw stuff, theoretically everyone starts on the same footing, whereas David Arroba (the silver open category winner) had access to the talent of Alejandro Muñoz and the rest didn't. I get that. But at the end of the day if you win an Oscar nobody cares how many people worked on the movie, and I see this more like the Oscars than like the Olympics, as in the jury judges the end result more than the competitor or the act of painting.
That base that looks a bit too smooth, in silver place, I think would benefit from very subtle use of pigment powder blending the terrain into the cactus. I think the smooth matt blends would work well with the dry matt look of pigment powders but it will create enough visual interest to move the eye through the model without the attention being pulled in an inorganic way, by that I mean we imediately recocnise ground as being kinda dusty so although it will contrast with the figure we naturally accept the dynamic and concentrate on the figure first where as with a paint effect or sculted piece, the result may serve as more of a distraction than a compliment.
Custom sculpts have no place in Golden Demon. Paint the models the company provides. I liked the older days of Golden Demon, back when they were inspiring. I know a Bronze place winner that painted his entry in a weekend lol.
Didnt watch you live, but great stream, it's nice to get a pro break down what we're looking at and how things go with these things, at least from your perspective... awesome stuff man, love your stuff.. keep on keepin 🤘🏼 Edit: and don't forget to stipple lol!! 🤘🏼🤘🏼
Could you perhaps make a video about the smooth stippling style? I never manage to get it so smooth. Ofc I don't spend 400 hours on it, but I don't have the feeling that I will get it any smoother with more hours.
with most who is the best minature is subjective, unless it is the vehicle one and the one getting gold clearly diserves it, but the bronze one I think is better then silver
I disagree on that one. The gold one is extremely boring. It looks like some basic airbrushing with some edge highlighting, though the picture might be deceptive. The whole category looks like it would be dominated by any entry from the other category winners though.
Question anyone know GWs stance on 3d Printed parts? How much of the mini can be 3d printed? can you lets say print an arm, a head, a leg or other bits? Or is it green stuff and other gw minis or go home? Also out of curiosity how would a Golden demon judge be able to tell the difference? Between "classic" conversion and 3D printed bits?
I entered a mini in the 2022 US GD at Adepticon and they DQ'd me via a phone call for having 1 very small 3d printed part. They let my model sit in the case but it was basically refused by the judges.
I have to say it definitely felt fairer to the hobbyist when homemade sculpts were not allowed, kitbashing is fine but it's a painting/warhammer competition, it should not just be for pros and content creators
@@trovarion no its not, its literally saying it should be based off how well you can paint a gw miniature not how well you can sculpt or how much free time you have. Content creators and pros can paint gw minis and kitbash, that’s not prohibitive and wouldn’t stop anyone competing it would just even the field for people with 9-5s and familys a degree more. We still have crystal brush and loads of other competitions that are not gw
@@MrConna6 you are aware that these "pros and content creators" would just invest more time into painting if they were not allowed to convert or sculpt? With the same result. I hear this since 20 years and all it comes down to is people telling me that it should not be the best, most innovative, most awesome that win so "everyone can have a chance". Everyone does have a chance, but you got to put in the work. What people are saying is "I want to win with as little time investment as possible". But that's not how any competition works, is it?
@@trovarion firstly I don’t think thats a bad thing, if the painting is pushed further for lack of sculpting that is, at the end of the day it is a painting competition not a general miniature competition, and thus should focus on painting. Obviously the easiest way to make a competition fair is, similar to an experiment, to control the variables; if everyone has to pick a gw sculpt and are judged purely on painting then any victory can be chalked up to better painting. Of course as I said kitbashing and reposing are fine its just not really a level playing field when your bust is ten times the size or has miles nicer details because you can sculpt. I don’t think they should be removed entirely but belong in their own category. Its the same reason we have a junior category, its not fair to put a child against an adult in the same way I don’t think its fair to put everyday people with the crowd who spend all day painting and modelling for their job, anyone I think that is honest with themselves can see how thats a huge advantage thats not necessarily fair in time, material, or education. Or maybe it would be better to open a new side of the competition for this rather than alter the existing categories, but I remember when anyone could win even with a single skaven clanrat and those are the days I miss!
Should they look the same though? The bones on the figure are part of his clothing/armor. They wouldn't be the same age, nor weathered the same as skulls that have been sitting outside for who knows how long.
sincere question, not a criticism, but to your first point, what do you see is the difference btwn commissioning a sculptor for you to paint vs. buying a piece that was sculpted by a GW employee? in both cases it's not your own sculpt. Is your concern that your painting will look better on a model made by a 'more interesting' sculptor than one made by employees confined to the standards set by GW? Couldn't this just serve to make GW push for better sculpts? a win for everyone?
Yeah, i said in the livestream "is there really a difference?" Maybe I edited it out in this version. Like I said, I don't think I mind, but some others definitely feel stronger about it - mainly because it gives you a competitive advantage.
The difference would be that if it’s a commercial sculpt by GW, the sculpt won’t be taken into account, whereas if it is an original model it will (even if they claim it is a painting competition). If it truly was only a painting competition Yohan wouldn’t have placed gold with his Orion, for example, as the paintjob was pretty flat (way more than it appears in the overexposed pictures) but the conversion work was amazing.
If I had to make an argument for why it’s different, the ‘gimmick’ of a new sculpt can be quite appealing and some might argue that biases the judges and viewers, but I still don’t think that’s enough of a justification for not having new custom made sculpts in GD.
@@trovarion I think it would be as easy as to allow original sculpts, but not tandem entries. If you want to enter an original sculpt, that’s ok, but you have to make it yourself. No joint entries.
I agree with you about scratch/sculpt miniatures can be tricky as they are two people involved. However, Spanish team, back in days met some days before of a competition and the best guy doinig freehands painted freehands on miniatures of their teammates or fixing some troubles with them, also for another parts they combined their skills to get better entries. Is this ethical?
not here to answer what's ethical. Not here to answer anything about what SHOULD happen on a GD, because I am not GW, I am just someone that participates in one way or the other. In the end, it's a marketing event by a company and they don't care about any of that. I am just mentioning things for people to make up their own mind - for me I made the decission that if I can accept that it's just that, a marketing event and I adjust my expectations to that I can enter. If not then I won't. I don't care that much, because to me winning a GD or not is nothing that defines me as a painter.
@@trovarion Yes, you're right but I mean, if sculptor should be known because his work is part of the first impact you see, should minis painted by more than one person be accepted as a single author?
Matt y sus cosas, that’s not true though. Maybe some people in the ST forum like Diego did that, but the Spanish Team members worked on their entries with utmost secrecy. They didn’t show them to their peers to maximise the “wow effect” on the day, and definitely did not have parts painted by others… here in France it was the same.
@@mattysuscosas an interview with who? If you mean Diego, who said it, he wasn’t a Spanish Team member. The Spanish Team most definitely didn’t do it, and I know because I’m friends with most of them…
41:20 I would have not have gone with a snow base, but a muted, dark, desaturated one instead. Snow is so bright and "busy's" the piece even more than it already is. That being said, I am still in love his work.
I'm picking up the hobby again. 2 years from now you'll have a new Golden Demon winner. Never let a manic depressive person at a hobby that gives you flow state. Last time it was music and now it's minis.
Yeah diorama gold is way too busy but maybe in person it isn't so bad. I didn't even notice the green animal underneath the cloak because this photo angle is a visual cacophony. But in person its 3d shape would likely make it very noticeable.
dude. the amount of just randos that where in this year is just sad. -_- i get that it should be for everyone. but to limit tickets like that just fucked the whole thing.
I am not a good painter. Every single entrant in golden demon is infinitely more talented than me. All that said, if I had to come up with a word to describe a lot of the minis on show here it would be... "bland". I wonder if I'm going nuts but to me so many look like those immaculate but plasticky and soulless 3D renders you see advertising the latest mobile strategy game. I *want* to see texture and brush strokes, no-one criticises a painting for having brush strokes, they help give a sense of motion and power and even draw the eye to focal points. I see more minis I like on the WH40K subreddit than in golden demon.
Yeah it causes there to be a loss of composition. Maybe it's just the pictures, but I see something like the Slaan and it's completely unreadable to me. Everything is hyper-detailed. This is a great demonstration of technical skill, but not a very good example of design. Things in the background or in shadows lose detail, but Golden Demon entries are always the opposite, lacking strong shadows and texture. I think this may also be a result of GW minis being really busy with a lot of greebles over the last few years. Stuff like Space Marines back in the 1990s and early 2000s were pretty simple models with a lot of flat surfaces. Current day Space Marines (like Phobos armor/Reivers/Incursors) have three helmets, five pistol holsters, antennae, grenades strapped everywhere, purity seals, skull emblems, eagle motifs, scoped bolters with bayonets....it just goes on. Large models and AoS models in particular are guilty of doing this.
The judging in u.s golden daemon has turned me off golden daemon. Im 46 years old now ive been playing warhammer since 2nd edition. Ive always wanted to win a golden daemon but never imagined id be good enough. Now that i am good enough i dont wanna spend 500-600 hours working on an entry just to lose to something far inferior or even worse i win and beat someone whos work was far better than mine. I paint full armies for people i really enjoy seeing how proud clients are way then bring out their 3,000 pt army on the table and tell me how everyone at the tournament was so jealous of their army. I never spend that much time on one model. I spend more time on squad leaders and hq choices and always do a centerpiece for each army but the most ill spend on one model is generally 20 hours. That includes everything not just paint.
It's the same shit every year nothing looks codex relevant or like box art it's waxy looking over realistic in a none realistic setting done with other brands of paint and usually fantasy setting and always the same bullshitty pealy wahlly turquoise paint jobs 😂
I painted the youngbloods bronze! thank you for the kind words, I have lots to improve with execution :) everyones entries were so amazing
Congrats!
They should just 3d scan them or do photogrammetry with a camera so that we could see it from any angle in detail
just a 360 photo that we could zoom in would already be so much better than this.
@@DarkLolification Yep, especially since they already do that for the online catalog. They have the technology....
Question i am a complete NOOB, when it comes to such things but how long does 3D scanning a miniature take?
Vs taking a good picture of a model and editing it to look the way it does?
It might be a question on timing, if it takes several hours to do a scan of the same quality as on their website, they might not have the time to scan them.
@@Erikjust Doing photogrammetry would take some time. What we're talking about (or at least I am) is putting the miniature on a turntable, and then taking 6-10 pictures of it from different angles. This would let you "spin" the model. See the GW online store for reference. They even do 2-3 angles on some of their figures so you can see the model from above as you spin it as well.
That’s a great idea.
I think one of the main problems is the time saved by having someone else do insane amounts of work conceptualizing an idea and crafting it to give you a piece no one else has access to.
People saying all minis are sculped by someone else forget those minis are also available for everyone to use.
The albert moreto single looks like a drawing rather than a figure, amazing.
Agreed. The whole model has an almost Disney aesthetic, but the moon particularly looks like it wouldn't be out of place in something from the Steamboat Willie era.
Timestamp?
Yeah, that's what stood out to me too.
Like you said, between the two highest single models, the technical skill is equally close to perfect. So, you have to introduce some kind of way to make a bias, and the ork model was a true homage to GW art in a few ways.
lathams entry is lame, it has no place being put next to the other two.
This actually really annoyed me after looking at the Squad entries and then seeing something from an employee that is nowhere near the level of the other two.l
One thing to jot about the pictures is that they are done on the day the winners are announced so don’t have that much time with each model to get the best setup or shots. Would be great if they kept them for a while and spent more time giving a dedicated section to see close ups and all angles. Always enjoy these breakdown videos, gives a good incite to the top level painting
true. but still, how many seconds does it take to get a couple more photos of each model? :P i'm sure the photographers are experienced enough to get a few more photos in before they have to move on to the next model
I'm pretty sure that all the gold's stayed at GW for a while, so you can visit and see it by yourself. So, yup, they can put more angles if they want, but will probably not gonna happen.
@@ecMonify No time at all, you get one shot you spend maybe a minute setting up your camera, if you stay mostly still and turn the model in place it takes like >2s a photo after that
While I still think GW could strive to spend a better amount of time to get a better set of photos but the very least they could do is take a very high-definition photo so you can at least zoom into the single one they give you.
That Tau sculpt is wild.
There's one flaw with the golden demon which it has always had since day one that really bugs me, although it's not something they have any need to change.... The judges are incredibly biased towards a specific style of painting. If you compare golden demon winners to the top entries at Crystal brush or Monte San Savino , the golden demon entries still feel very rooted in that tabletop working style while the others really lean a lot more into it looking and feeling like a three-dimensional piece of art
That Flaw... is the reason why GW Golden Daemon exists. Its based on their IP and style. Crystal brush etc is a painting competition
@@zakgregory7015 Yes but GD is sold to the community as a high end painting competition.... but it's really not. it's a GW centred showcase.
This comment could not be more wrong, especially if you look at the winners from this year...
@@Nokimam k. Go look at the crystal brush winners, or Monte San Savino entries.
The goblin is nice because it tells more of a charming story.. with the alchemy he’s doing and the cute and compact things around his feet.. Golden Demon has always been biased to a smaller single model executed well.
Albert Moreto Fonts smoothness looks like photoshoped. Such an inspiration! When it comes to his Single Miniature-Gold, it could also be possible that he wanted it to look that way instead of the limitation by using Acryl paints. Have fun with your offspring. ☺☺☺
It's probably because that mini is frickin tiny too :)
What do you mean by the limitation of using Acryl paints? thanks for any response
@@DW_R Pigments. Acryl paint pigments. You are limited of what you can achieve with Acryl paints. Well, your skills need to be *very good* to reach that sealing but this does not change the fact that it exists.
Ah, finally! :) I was hoping for you to make a video regarding the GD UK and here it is! :D Sharing most of your views, especially pleased to see a small move towards a more creative, open-minded approach this time again... There indeed were some extremely hard decisions to be made... Backdrops and Water Effects seem to be on the rise, which is great! Regarding Chris fantastic water base, I would have made a donut shaped clay sculpture that includes the waves, mold and cast it in clear resin, then glue it on the wood, put the painted foot in, then pour in the gaps and cover the transition with several water effects (Gel Denso, maybe some microballs, doll filling, nylon string, etc.)... Loving how perfect and clean Chris is about every single element of his projects... Not surprised to hear he has spent that many hours painting, figure he spent a similar amount into building all in all as well... :)
Considering the amount of time painters are putting into the event, you would think that GW would up their game and be willing to accomodate all the people wanting to enter, participate and also the art itself. It just kinda seems like they're falling short on all fronts in regards to the event besides the event itself, such as the pictures, number of tickets, venue size etc etc, I think it would make more sense to host the event in a conference hall or small stadium or something at this point and hire a team of photographers to really out-do themselves.
To be fair, that's most likely because they would require at least an extra 5 experts and 1 week to look at everything, then ship them (or have pros sleep in hotels nearby and wait). It all has to be rushed on the day/weekend to get all of it done. And, the event itself, etc. already costs a lot of money -- but we can assume they can easily afford this, yeah. My guess is, the major reason they don't up their game is to ensure it all gets done in 1 day. They could maybe hire a world-class camera guy or something, though. And, if they upped this to stadium-level or something, it would most likely cost too much money, even with ticket prices already quite high for people?
Best they can do -- and something they should do -- is hire a better camera and cameraman to really take great, high rez shots quickly! It wouldn't hurt to add many pics to the website, too, instead of just one. Or, at least find the best angle and pic of the shot.
The other problem with the entire event is simply the judging process and how it's all dealt with -- but, that's GW's choice, so I don't have much problem with it, and I don't even disagree with all of their choices. But, this is a problem for many painters, for sure. It would be best to host more than one style of GW event each year per country. That would be really amazing, but really require a lot of time and money. Still, it's the best route to do, if they were to completely up their game in some way.
30:26
You should i think just put little magnets in the feet, and the diorama base, so you can put them on normal bases and the diorama as you want.
I heard the question asked repeatedly by Trovarion and the chat: "Should we count or reward a model that was sculpted by one person, but painted by another?"
The answer is yes. Every time we paint a model made by a manufacturer, that is exactly the same thing. You paint GW's model? They sculpted it, you painted it, you get the award for the painting competition.
I mostly agree, but the issue is the entry is gaining a leg up based upon originality and creativity that was uniquely available to the painter. Normal figures that aren't custom are sculpted by someone else, but they are also broadly available.
I have a feeling that all else being equal, a custom sculpted piece would always win. It's sculpted by a (probably) superior artist to GWs official sculptors. It doesn't have to work in a plastic mold. It doesn't have to be at all practical as a gaming piece.
11:30 - Gonna hazard a guess. They're supposed to form an ensemble piece with the units clustered in a group, but in a way you can still see them.
What you say right at the start interests me a lot: there still is a strong temptation towards finishing it 'smoothly'. As both a canvas-painter/muralist and - recently - 40k starter, I really see a lot of opportunity in exploring a grittier, more textured look that also actually includes brushmarks: think of painters like Lucian Freud and Jenny Saville, who create realistic human portraits by building them from very on-point single brushmarks. Consciously making a brushmark and leaving it alone, instead of smoothing it in like we all tend to do.
Maybe there are some model-painters who have already suceeded in this approach, if so: curious to know their names. Imagine painting an army of Orcs in Simon Bisley-esque textures, that'd be amazing! I'm going to be brutally honest and say: I quite dislike the 'finished', 'airbrushed' approach that makes it all seem factory-like or too cartoonish (the single miniature 2nd and 3rd places are examples of that). No, it should not be sloppy, but an approach similar to alla-prima painting could be very interesting.. When it becomes too 'plastic', or 'high fantasy', it actually destroys the illusion for me. And don't get me wrong: that style requires huge amounts of skill and patience, but it does become very predictable. I like the first place one for that, though it is still too slick for an 'Orc Blessed by Nurgle'.
I hope to see an entry from you in next years!
And that GW publish better pictures xD
This was a great Video @Trovarion! Really enjoyed your commentary on all the pieces, I hope next year there will be better photos which you can show!
As for the photos, as someone who photographed the winning pieces at SMC and WME I can tell you that we have around 6 to 8 hours without public in the evening where we can photograph the entries. We usually photograph them on the tables (maybe move stuff around so it's less busy, where possible) so in that sense the GW photos are a great step up as they have a coherent background and lighting. What surprises me is that when they photograph the pieces in a dedicated spot why they don't turn them around three times to get every angle, and maybe photograph with a 2nd camera details? I guess the answer will be time, which is limited - no idea how much time they have to photograph the Top 3 after they have been chosen, could be pretty limited.
What a brilliantly informative video. It would be awesome if you could make one of these for all the major competitions. Such good insights!
Had you right-clicked to open the images in a new window you'd get to see a lot of the entries as a larger image
So what is the difference between regular layering and stippling? They use same blending methods (blend colours at the wet palette, but difference is how the paint is applied to the model?
Your discount for Epic Basing doesnt work ;(
My favorite entry is Dave Perryman's Squiqs. Two reasons: very much in love with the paintjob itself and the base looks more realistic (has more depth) than the gold and bronze entry.
@@zogwort1522 can't explain why, but for me it does
That Nurgle orc is so fuckin' cool. Both the model and the paintjob. Most meticulous or not, it is for shure what appeals to me the most.
Re. The open category 3rd place.. they like to reward a model uncoverted, well painted. They like simplicity.
I think that MESBG is a weird abnormality in Games WOrkshops' portfolio. IIRC - the contracts say something funky about using the same miniatures in advertising, so, GW probably can't show people building hobbits with chainswords or ringwraiths on squigs ... so I guess they just have a GD category out of obligation, but, aren't super jazzed about the subject since they can't show off stuff if people start slipping Nighthaunt into the army of the dead ... right?
as a noob looking at these it feels like the winners were able to make their mini not look like a painted mini, but pulled from a cartoon or something. If that even makes sense.
Open category is just that...OPEN.does it really matter who sculpted what? Because no matter how great a sculpture is, the finish is everything. It's literally a figure show and the figures need to be painted to a high standard what drives me nuts is the diorama category. Almost all of the models are vignettes, not dioramas. But. The vast majority are beautiful.
Personally I can’t stand all of these super smooth and oversaturated paint jobs, everything looks soulless and as though it’s been taken from an ad for a mobile game. I appreciate the technical skill but the results lack character.
"kitbashes are more expensive so obviously they won" is one of the most simple minded and narrow/ personal (to the one making such a statement) art crippling points of view I have ever heard.
I’m noticing a lot of these seem to blend in with their bases almost too well? I would have thought there would be a lot more contrast between the model and the landscape but it almost seems like it was an intentional theme with all of these; to have an almost “camouflage” look IDK 🤷🏻♀️
i dont get why they dont do the mini 360* photo slide that they do for their stuff on GW's home page?
20:26 For me, that bronze and silver need to be switched.
I guess it now depends if the color your skin matches the paintbrush
Great review mate. Quite fair comments that someone who did never enter this comp but has interest in art can understand.
Where do you stop? ,3 artist 4 on one piece. Maybe have open single creator category and a open combined artist category
They should probably have seperate categories for entries that sculpted and painted vs ones who just did one or the other.
Or sculptor and painter should enter as a team.
So if they have a team for this, then why not add a few photos and allow people to slide between them. This is some of their best advertising and all they have to do is take pics and pay some royalties
The fact you get one low res photo of the winning entries on the website has always annoyed me. GW really need to up their game for posterity.
Are there also authentic contests for people who aren't clearly professionals?
For Chris Clayton’s duel I think he made the foot bigger so it looks like the water is refracting it and that’s WILD. Wow
I've been trying to figure out for a couple days now if he did exactly that, it looks too good with the refraction enlargement!
Epoxy resin has a higher refractive index than water, so it's likely just the resin creating the effect.
@@jordivermeulen2519 that’s true about the refraction but the skull on either side are T noticeably larger in the same way. Idk maybe he’ll talk about the process at some point
Loved watching this in the back ground while painting. So inspiring.
I love how many Golden Demon level painters are in the chat.
Please no OTT key frames for the video. We’re not watching “pro gamer reacts” videos 😢
I cut out the uhms and ahms, trust me you dont want them in.
Really interesting hearing your thoughts thanks for posting
The Spike Magazine entry highlights what I dislike about most of these entries. All of them look flat. Like they're painted to look like a piece of 2D art, rather than taking advantage of their three dimensionality. Like if you cropped out the white background, you'd never even know these were 3D models at all.
Yes, they have good highlights and shadows, but the placement of them doesn't create depth in 3D space. And let's be clear, I'm not dogging on anyone's skill. These are all exceptionally well done, far better than where I'm at in my journey. It's the general flat comic book style being applauded that I take issue with.
I can't help thinking if actors were given marks out of 10 for playing shakespeare what kind of hammy overblown performances would you get
"Open Category Silver" is just madness. Pure Madness. As for the Sculpting of unique pieces.... nah - you should not be accounted for that - it´s first and foremost a painting competition and 99.9% (well - a guess) of all painters are not professional sculpors.
In appreciate that you’re humble enough to admit that you can’t paint at the level of some of these winners. Its clear your critique isn’t coming from a space of “I can do better” but rather just being open about what stands out to you.
I agree on needing more pictures. The second place (second one you looked at) didn't even look real to me. It looked like a cartoon drawing. Having more pictures would have given a much better perspective of what it looks like in real life.
for the squads i think they should have individual bases like the pox walker setup ...... those orcs were more of a diorama because they were built onto one scenic base ......
The single miniature silver. I would assume the chest and the sword are what got it second. The sword reflections are abit static looking adn the chest is abit flat. very little color blending so it looks fake. Im amazed it didnt get bronze honestly
I'd like to see 360 degree views and interactive pictures that you can spin and zoom. that would be awesomeness
Such a shame no one with goblin green and flock bases wins :P, all of the winners painted far better than I do really should level up my skill someday
If you listen back to Chris Clayton's interview with Cult, I'm sure he says he had no prior experience working with resin,, which would make his piece even more amazing if so. With Tom's Tau bust, I really wish GW would sell stuff like that!
So was Maxime pissed that he got scammed out of the Everchosen win, or did he know it was rigged all along?
Great video man.
thanks!
Great review Trov, real GD insight from a professional!
U bring up a good point, maybe Golden Demon should have a twin category for painter & sculpture being lone & duel...👺
In regards to the open category, I think it’s fine as an “open category.” GW can just open up another category.
I was lucky enough to be with Albert Moreto font today and was lucky enough to hold the two demon winners they photos do either of them justice. The texture differences on the 40k was superb. I think the pictures are washed out
Hey Trova, there is a challenge i alway wanted to see you trying if you feel like so. What about a basic ultramarine squad painted as they were on a night opération. The light of the lenses, the glow of a moon on the armor and the « darker » blue should make the scheme of color very wide. Are you up to ?
40k large model bronze looks like theres mold lines on the talons...yikes
It was a great event this year, my first-time entering and the standard was excellent across all categories. The Warhammer 40000 and AoS single miniatures had around 7-8 crazily good entries per category and many below were very good indeed. Richard Gray's entry was into AoS single, and the Goblin Loonboss was tiny, and beautifully painted. The judging must have been extremely tough this year.
I heard many GW staff and incredible painters saying the standard this year had been completely lifted and many were just generally excited by that. It was so awesome to be a part of and has given me a lot of ideas and inspiration for next year. I'd really love to see GW bring back the Staff category as well as having the open.
There were some incredible entries from the Staff, including Darren's that took bronze, but many felt a little lost next to the busts and sculpts.
Great coverage and highly respectful opinions of the entries Trovarion, for anyone contemplating entering in future please do, the experience you get from being around other painters a lone is worth all the effort.
The problem with GD, is they do not have a matrix or codex or listed standards to judge on. It is abstract, whatever they feel is good. As long as it fits a theme and is pretty (in their eyes)
Yeah that's why I say it's also a lottery to a certain extend.
One thing I really liked with this GD was that there were so few pro-painters who won it. This is not a play on the video title, but an honest take. Of the winners I think Chris is the only one full time painting? This really show that the hobbyists can do wonders if they focus on a single project for hundreds of hours, a luxury I think many pros do not have?
When I compare this to Monte or WME, it is the reverse. I do not know if that is because they value different things, or something else? For example, we saw some of the super-painters like Arnau here at GD, but not placing. At the podium for platinum and gold at Monte, it is basically only pros plus Mike Blank and Albert Moreto Font.
Just in the single entry 40k the three winners are pro-painters
And most of winners here were at Monte and WME also taking medals
@@studiosuperchroma8600 sorry, I should have clarified. I meant, full-time miniature painters.
Maxime is an arts teacher
Albert works an office job full time
Thibaut also works another job full time,
@@Hurtone yes you are right on this. They are not full time commission painters (well armies commission painters would be more accurate in this case)
The Open it's another planet!
Albert Moreto, Diamond
Personally I think teamwork is fine, especially in the open category (but even in others). Even if a model was painted by a team if one was better at picking colour schemes and composition, another at painting textures and another at lighting or whatever. It's fine. At the end of the day we'll have artworks I like more and that's better for me as an audience member.
Agreed. At the end of the day it's a painting competition that is being judged and what should be the distinguisher. The open silver winner may not have sculpted it, but they produced the phenomenal paint job for it (I see open category as much as items that don't fit into one of the other categories).
By the same logic, anyone who painted a GW miniature didn't create it either.
@@scottwallbank4794 well that's not quite the same because if everyone paints gw stuff, theoretically everyone starts on the same footing, whereas David Arroba (the silver open category winner) had access to the talent of Alejandro Muñoz and the rest didn't. I get that.
But at the end of the day if you win an Oscar nobody cares how many people worked on the movie, and I see this more like the Oscars than like the Olympics, as in the jury judges the end result more than the competitor or the act of painting.
That base that looks a bit too smooth, in silver place, I think would benefit from very subtle use of pigment powder blending the terrain into the cactus. I think the smooth matt blends would work well with the dry matt look of pigment powders but it will create enough visual interest to move the eye through the model without the attention being pulled in an inorganic way, by that I mean we imediately recocnise ground as being kinda dusty so although it will contrast with the figure we naturally accept the dynamic and concentrate on the figure first where as with a paint effect or sculted piece, the result may serve as more of a distraction than a compliment.
Custom sculpts have no place in Golden Demon. Paint the models the company provides.
I liked the older days of Golden Demon, back when they were inspiring.
I know a Bronze place winner that painted his entry in a weekend lol.
What are you on about? Custom sculpts have been winning at Golden Demon for decades.
Didnt watch you live, but great stream, it's nice to get a pro break down what we're looking at and how things go with these things, at least from your perspective... awesome stuff man, love your stuff.. keep on keepin 🤘🏼
Edit: and don't forget to stipple lol!! 🤘🏼🤘🏼
Could you perhaps make a video about the smooth stippling style? I never manage to get it so smooth. Ofc I don't spend 400 hours on it, but I don't have the feeling that I will get it any smoother with more hours.
I have a video on patreon/youtube members how to use this.
The look on that Tau's face is frickin great! Would make a good pirate too.
Looks like a mix of the two newest autarchs and the head from one of the new corsairs. Realy nicely made and painted aeldari model
with most who is the best minature is subjective, unless it is the vehicle one and the one getting gold clearly diserves it, but the bronze one I think is better then silver
I disagree on that one. The gold one is extremely boring. It looks like some basic airbrushing with some edge highlighting, though the picture might be deceptive.
The whole category looks like it would be dominated by any entry from the other category winners though.
gotta sell those votanns
For the open category.. they have to judge what the entrant actually DID.
That’s what I think.
So if you made it all yourself, you get bonus points!
That's asking for people to lie
Question anyone know GWs stance on 3d Printed parts?
How much of the mini can be 3d printed?
can you lets say print an arm, a head, a leg or other bits?
Or is it green stuff and other gw minis or go home?
Also out of curiosity how would a Golden demon judge be able to tell the difference?
Between "classic" conversion and 3D printed bits?
I entered a mini in the 2022 US GD at Adepticon and they DQ'd me via a phone call for having 1 very small 3d printed part. They let my model sit in the case but it was basically refused by the judges.
@@humanstewminiatures130 really? How would they know vs a hand sculpted part?
are the entries anonymized or do the judges see who created the individual pieces?
Anonymous, but people post on instagram, judges recognise styles, etc. So it can never be completely anonymous.
Really great to hear your analysis. Thank you
Entertaining video man. Keep it up!
I have to say it definitely felt fairer to the hobbyist when homemade sculpts were not allowed, kitbashing is fine but it's a painting/warhammer competition, it should not just be for pros and content creators
That's like saying the olympic 100m should not be won by the fastest person.
@@trovarion no its not, its literally saying it should be based off how well you can paint a gw miniature not how well you can sculpt or how much free time you have. Content creators and pros can paint gw minis and kitbash, that’s not prohibitive and wouldn’t stop anyone competing it would just even the field for people with 9-5s and familys a degree more. We still have crystal brush and loads of other competitions that are not gw
@@MrConna6 you are aware that these "pros and content creators" would just invest more time into painting if they were not allowed to convert or sculpt? With the same result. I hear this since 20 years and all it comes down to is people telling me that it should not be the best, most innovative, most awesome that win so "everyone can have a chance". Everyone does have a chance, but you got to put in the work. What people are saying is "I want to win with as little time investment as possible". But that's not how any competition works, is it?
@@trovarion firstly I don’t think thats a bad thing, if the painting is pushed further for lack of sculpting that is, at the end of the day it is a painting competition not a general miniature competition, and thus should focus on painting. Obviously the easiest way to make a competition fair is, similar to an experiment, to control the variables; if everyone has to pick a gw sculpt and are judged purely on painting then any victory can be chalked up to better painting. Of course as I said kitbashing and reposing are fine its just not really a level playing field when your bust is ten times the size or has miles nicer details because you can sculpt. I don’t think they should be removed entirely but belong in their own category. Its the same reason we have a junior category, its not fair to put a child against an adult in the same way I don’t think its fair to put everyday people with the crowd who spend all day painting and modelling for their job, anyone I think that is honest with themselves can see how thats a huge advantage thats not necessarily fair in time, material, or education. Or maybe it would be better to open a new side of the competition for this rather than alter the existing categories, but I remember when anyone could win even with a single skaven clanrat and those are the days I miss!
Great Video !
22:55 I think they took points off because the bones in the base are not painted like the bones o the figure. They look like a last minute addition
Should they look the same though? The bones on the figure are part of his clothing/armor. They wouldn't be the same age, nor weathered the same as skulls that have been sitting outside for who knows how long.
@@JorenMathews true, but I think the clean off white is drawing the eye away
sincere question, not a criticism, but to your first point, what do you see is the difference btwn commissioning a sculptor for you to paint vs. buying a piece that was sculpted by a GW employee? in both cases it's not your own sculpt. Is your concern that your painting will look better on a model made by a 'more interesting' sculptor than one made by employees confined to the standards set by GW? Couldn't this just serve to make GW push for better sculpts? a win for everyone?
Yeah, i said in the livestream "is there really a difference?" Maybe I edited it out in this version. Like I said, I don't think I mind, but some others definitely feel stronger about it - mainly because it gives you a competitive advantage.
The difference would be that if it’s a commercial sculpt by GW, the sculpt won’t be taken into account, whereas if it is an original model it will (even if they claim it is a painting competition). If it truly was only a painting competition Yohan wouldn’t have placed gold with his Orion, for example, as the paintjob was pretty flat (way more than it appears in the overexposed pictures) but the conversion work was amazing.
@@Heimdall1987 yes, that's what I mean with competitive advantage. If you have someone else sculpt your entry you also save massively on time.
If I had to make an argument for why it’s different, the ‘gimmick’ of a new sculpt can be quite appealing and some might argue that biases the judges and viewers, but I still don’t think that’s enough of a justification for not having new custom made sculpts in GD.
@@trovarion I think it would be as easy as to allow original sculpts, but not tandem entries. If you want to enter an original sculpt, that’s ok, but you have to make it yourself. No joint entries.
I agree with you about scratch/sculpt miniatures can be tricky as they are two people involved. However, Spanish team, back in days met some days before of a competition and the best guy doinig freehands painted freehands on miniatures of their teammates or fixing some troubles with them, also for another parts they combined their skills to get better entries.
Is this ethical?
not here to answer what's ethical. Not here to answer anything about what SHOULD happen on a GD, because I am not GW, I am just someone that participates in one way or the other. In the end, it's a marketing event by a company and they don't care about any of that. I am just mentioning things for people to make up their own mind - for me I made the decission that if I can accept that it's just that, a marketing event and I adjust my expectations to that I can enter. If not then I won't. I don't care that much, because to me winning a GD or not is nothing that defines me as a painter.
@@trovarion Yes, you're right but I mean, if sculptor should be known because his work is part of the first impact you see, should minis painted by more than one person be accepted as a single author?
Matt y sus cosas, that’s not true though. Maybe some people in the ST forum like Diego did that, but the Spanish Team members worked on their entries with utmost secrecy. They didn’t show them to their peers to maximise the “wow effect” on the day, and definitely did not have parts painted by others… here in France it was the same.
@@Heimdall1987 Few days ago I saw an interview where one admitted that they did it. I don't know if it was general or if everybody did it.
@@mattysuscosas an interview with who? If you mean Diego, who said it, he wasn’t a Spanish Team member. The Spanish Team most definitely didn’t do it, and I know because I’m friends with most of them…
41:20 I would have not have gone with a snow base, but a muted, dark, desaturated one instead. Snow is so bright and "busy's" the piece even more than it already is. That being said, I am still in love his work.
I'm picking up the hobby again.
2 years from now you'll have a new Golden Demon winner.
Never let a manic depressive person at a hobby that gives you flow state.
Last time it was music and now it's minis.
Yeah diorama gold is way too busy but maybe in person it isn't so bad. I didn't even notice the green animal underneath the cloak because this photo angle is a visual cacophony. But in person its 3d shape would likely make it very noticeable.
dude. the amount of just randos that where in this year is just sad. -_- i get that it should be for everyone. but to limit tickets like that just fucked the whole thing.
I am not a good painter. Every single entrant in golden demon is infinitely more talented than me. All that said, if I had to come up with a word to describe a lot of the minis on show here it would be... "bland". I wonder if I'm going nuts but to me so many look like those immaculate but plasticky and soulless 3D renders you see advertising the latest mobile strategy game.
I *want* to see texture and brush strokes, no-one criticises a painting for having brush strokes, they help give a sense of motion and power and even draw the eye to focal points. I see more minis I like on the WH40K subreddit than in golden demon.
Yeah it causes there to be a loss of composition. Maybe it's just the pictures, but I see something like the Slaan and it's completely unreadable to me. Everything is hyper-detailed. This is a great demonstration of technical skill, but not a very good example of design. Things in the background or in shadows lose detail, but Golden Demon entries are always the opposite, lacking strong shadows and texture.
I think this may also be a result of GW minis being really busy with a lot of greebles over the last few years. Stuff like Space Marines back in the 1990s and early 2000s were pretty simple models with a lot of flat surfaces. Current day Space Marines (like Phobos armor/Reivers/Incursors) have three helmets, five pistol holsters, antennae, grenades strapped everywhere, purity seals, skull emblems, eagle motifs, scoped bolters with bayonets....it just goes on. Large models and AoS models in particular are guilty of doing this.
it just about more time put into 1 piece and just think details be there on it.
to the judges eyes this was the best one. get over it.
What are you on about? You have not watched the video, right?
it absolutly disgust me how biased and corrupted that competition is. There were so many better pieces that should place/win.
I think the word you are looking for is 'subjective'
Have you watched the video? Because it seems that you didn't
I did, went through every entry, it blew my mind how off results were. But it's gw so no wonder.
Biased towards who?
@@Explosivo1118 The Bronze for Open Competition really is not competition medal worthy. (Happens to be painted by a GW employee),
The judging in u.s golden daemon has turned me off golden daemon. Im 46 years old now ive been playing warhammer since 2nd edition. Ive always wanted to win a golden daemon but never imagined id be good enough. Now that i am good enough i dont wanna spend 500-600 hours working on an entry just to lose to something far inferior or even worse i win and beat someone whos work was far better than mine. I paint full armies for people i really enjoy seeing how proud clients are way then bring out their 3,000 pt army on the table and tell me how everyone at the tournament was so jealous of their army. I never spend that much time on one model. I spend more time on squad leaders and hq choices and always do a centerpiece for each army but the most ill spend on one model is generally 20 hours. That includes everything not just paint.
It's the same shit every year nothing looks codex relevant or like box art it's waxy looking over realistic in a none realistic setting done with other brands of paint and usually fantasy setting and always the same bullshitty pealy wahlly turquoise paint jobs 😂
Let's see your models