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The Marshall JCM900: Is The Hate Justified?
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- Опубликовано: 13 авг 2024
- I dive into the reasons behind the hate for the Marshall JCM900. It's not a JCM800 or a Marshall Plexi but are the criticisms are justified? Let's dive into the tones of this 50 Watt High Gain Dual Reverb Model 4500.
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The Marshall JCM900 High Gain Dual Reverb amp is one of a number of Marshall amps in the 900 series. Produced as a response to guitar players wanting more gain it offered new features not seen in the Marshall JCM 800, Plexi and other classic Marshall Amps. The JCM 900 gets a lot of hate, but is it really deserved? We'll discuss the reasons behind the hate and whether or not you should keep it in your collection. Is the Marshall JCM 800 or the Plexi a better option? And why is the JCM900 not popular among metal players? In this video I discuss the reasons and share a bunch of guitar tones.
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Index
00:00 - Start
00:49 - Why the hate for the JCM900
02:16 - 90s Tone Example In a Mix
03:37 - Cab IR Choices
04:09 - 90s Tone in solo
04:27 - How to showcase a guitar amp?
05:55 - JCM900 Range of Tones
08:37 - Isolated Tones
10:01 - High Gain Channel / Boosted Clean Channel Comparison
10:47 - Final Thoughts
11:57 - Please Subscribe
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I have a wall full of amps and my JCM900 is and always has been my favorite. I've had mine since about 95 and it absolutely has some special sauce to it. As with many things on the internet these days, 90% of the people who trash them online have never actually plugged one in.
I’m just so surprised by the negativity. And many people are reacting to the title and not listening to the amp in the video. Thanks for weighing in!
@@LonelyRocker that's how it always is. I listened all the way through and I think your amp sounds great. Quite a bit different tone than I get with mine, but that could definitely be down to settings.
Also mine is modded...plus I do have my way of recording....That's the point I was trying to make in the video. That amp is a tool that serves a session well when paired with the right cab and treated properly in a mix....The isolated amp reviews with hacky playing bore me. We can make music with these amps and that's why I have them!! :)
@@LonelyRocker I agree. It's all about how it sounds in a mix. I add isolated guitar tracks to my videos, but only because so many people seem to want to hear them.
I like to write songs, not just lonely guitar riffs in a bedroom. 😁
I lean to showcasing amps in the mix. They are not solo instruments! 😅
A criminally underrated amplifier. Is it the best for most things? Definitely not? Is it a bad amp? Absolutely not. Sounds great in your samples as well!
Thanks for weighing in! It’s absolutely not for everything. My goal was to try and showcase what it’s good at it. Appreciate your insight. You’ve had your hands on an amp or two 😂
Good video. I own a 4100 and have no intention of getting rid of it. I own about 10 other amps and I still love the 4100. Slight but important correction - yes the diode clipping doesn’t produce the distortion, yes it has 3 12ax7s but the preamplification uses only one half of one of the 12ax7s and the rest of the preamp is opamps. Which I personally have zero issue with. But it isn’t cascading tube gain stages like an 800, the remainder of the 12ax7s are used to drive the effects loop and for reverb recovery.
Do I own better amps or ones I like more? Yes but who cares. It isn’t a shit amp at all. Tons of artists use them or have, to your point it defined the 90s pop punk and a lot of alternative sounds. Trey from Morbid Angel has used them forever.
One big complaint is it has no low end. That’s kind of true if you can’t crank it up. On my 4100 it really gets some thump going on channel B with the master at 1-2 o’clock but it’s insanely loud there so you have to attenuate or be able to let it rip. Or just use an EQ in the loop for lower volumes.
That amp sounds pretty great to me! :) Would be cool to have those clipping diodes as a switchable option...
That would be a cool mod!!!
Exactly. More options are better than just doing away with the feature as for some people in some cases, they’re not bad.
That’s what the Jubilee was, basically … an 800 with an optional diode clipping mode …
@@kierenmoore3236 Right? What's that a push pull pot I think to engage the internal diode clipping. I don't mind if you can turn it off, so I prefer a all tube (minus rectifier) amp and my diodes and transistors up front so I can turn them off and have exactly what I want. And with a pedal if you don't like say a transistor cascade based drive like BD2 you can go with a diode clipping based TS for instance. Once it's built in and not switchable that limits it. Because their's diode clipping that can sound gorgeous and is on so many famous records and some sounds aweful depending on your application, taste and equipment.
So if they go for built in distortion pedal a few options would be cool. Now JCM900 is pretty old but same idea and you can select nothing, screamer, Rat, etc... I think people would buy that.
Used you can find a JCM900 super cheap but new they're twice the cost of a DSL100 which in my opinion is a superior sounding amp and the 20 bucks for a TS or Rat clone or whatever you like is not a factor. Brand new: 1987x 1400€... JCM900 1400€... what?? Lol... Who would buy that when you can get a JVM or Plexi for the same an 800 used for the same or a DSL for bit over half? If you want channels and switchy stuff, DSL. More gain? More everything? JVM. Less of everything but much nicer sounding? Plexi or 800... it's very awkwardly placed. And the 20 Watt studio versions are cheaper than all those, so if you only play medium sized gigs not stadiums 1400 buys a 20 W Plexi, 800 or Jubilee with 2x12 cab.
@@user-lv7ph7hs7l Yes, it was a push-pull pot on the og Jubilees and the old 2555SL (so you can switch the diode clipping in or completely out of the circuit) … I assume the reissue Jubilees are the same?!
JCM900 slightly crunched and a Tube Screamer as a booster is heaven 👍
Sounds sweeeeet!!!
A week ago, bought a 2100 (900 bucks). Modify the preamp in a couple of hours and now I own a JMP working in 50W.
Sweeeet!!!
I have the 100 watt 4100 dual reverb and I love it. It also sounds amazing using the IR-X into the effects loop.
Nice! I'd love to play around with the 100 Watt version next....
I have the 900 and the 800 and love them both. 900 is a different flavour but that might be just what you need. I did a few mods on the tonestack but not the diode clipping (if I remember correctly since it's been around 5 years ago). There is a difference in the tone being a little smoother and natural sounding, but the utmost important difference was to replace the stock G12T75 for different ones. This is such a big difference and does the amp justice. The stock speakers scoop way to much mids, which in my opinion totally ruins the amp's tone. IR loaders will do the same if you use those.
Great perspective. Two very different amps....and cab choice is critical. Thanks for sharing!!
I'm not a major Marshall fan but I always liked those jcm 900s and that clean clean sounded nice ! , I like JVM Marshalls if I were to invest
I live the clean channel too. JVM is also high on my list.
I have this amp and I love it... to me the 50 watt sounds warmer than the 100w , and you also get pentode/triode switching on the back panel (technically triode/tetrode!) which I've found gives a choice between harder rock tones and rounder bluesy sound.
these amps do get a lot of hate - I guess people were looking for a hotter JCM800 when these came out... which isn't really what this amp is about.... but the 900 SL-X I would say pretty much has the tube purists and "chuggers" covered.
Very much agree that you need to listen to these in a mix, not just solo!!! - ironic that people say these sound thin... then they go and record with a boogie or something.... once the bass guitar is in the mix, they end up cutting the low end of the guitar anyway!!!! lol
Trust your ears. play what sounds good! :)
Excellent points my friend! An amp was never meant for solo performances. The 900 kills in a mix. And you’re so right about the Boogie 😂
4500+patched loop+tubescreamer+my1980 Custom LP=Hell on Earth✊🤘
There you go!
Is your 900 an EL34 version? Many guys don't know that they were originally equipped with EL34's and then very shortly afterwards switched to 5881s because of an EL34 shortage at the time. IMHO, the EL34 versions sounded better and was Marshall's original intent for the sound. Most guys have only played the 5881 versions and I think that is why they get a bad rap.
My amp was re-tubed last year. So yes. That’s also when I did the mod.
Agreed. Mine was a 5881, but I like them and like I said above, the loop needs to be patched or used.
I had a 4500. I loved that amp. It had amazing cleans, and a brutal hi gain tone when used with a distortion pedal and an EQ in the loop. From what I have heard, all 900's need to have the EFX loop in use or at least patched. I use all my amps with a distortion pedal in front.
Same amp as this one. I find it does a great job in the studio.
Great video! Another thing people forget about the 800 is that in order for it to sound good you had to put a boost in front of it, add an attenuator, and then apologize to the people in the rehearsal space next to you because it was so loud. The 900 doesn't have the same amount of gain as a Mesa or a 5150, but it has more than enough overdrive for the vast majority of musicians playing heavy music. I think some internet guitar players forget how much thicker a guitar sounds in the mix.
Thanks! Yes, great points there. It delivered what players asked for at the time and was very popular. I still think it's a great amp...thanks for checking this out!
900 DR lack TONE. Why, because it's gain is pure Solid State. NOT Tube.
I own a 4500 one and also a jcm800 but i love both but the big differents was the price i got my jcm 900 for €375
Those 900s can be had for a steal. But the price is creeping up a little now. It’s a great amp!
Great video Dan, the depth you go into (all your videos) is fantastic
Thanks so much my friend! :)
These aren’t factory mods right? I want am thinking about buying a 900 for use in pop punk band. So, one off the shelf would sound pretty different?
The mod was after market but I wouldn't worry about that. This is the perfect amp for that type of music even without the mod. And the mod is pretty cheap so you could consider getting that done at a later date. Good luck on your hunt!
Sounds phenomenal! I have both 900 and 800, but most of the time like the 800 more. Not that it is better, it depends on the song. I never loved the G12T75 the Marshall cabs and combo's come with. They definatly don't do the 900 justice in my opinion. With the right speaker they sound really good.
That’s the key for sure. People are so quick to judge. But that 900 has mojo and with right cab you can get some great tones. Plus it does its own thing. It’s not an 800 but it’s a fun amp in its own right.
You hit the nail on the head, the 900 sounds good in a mix. Too bright on its own for me unless you add a eq pedal in the effects loop. Some people like that kinda thing though.
For me an amp is meant to be in a mix. I show it in solo because people ask but an amp was never intended to play alone! 🤣🤣
I have come to this video to enjoy nice tones. I have come to a conclusion that often when an amp has bad rep its by ppl who cant use it right.. like the 5150 iconic.. so much hate based on the promo video.. and yet it is such a great amp :)
Funny...I have that map too..as long as you know how to use them they both sound great!
I encourage you to try the 900 SLX which is a completely different based with no diode clipping, but another tube instead
Yes, I have that one on my list. Been keeping my eyes open....would love to try it...
btw.. whats wrong with op amps? ... ive been watching a lot of pedal building videos.. and daaaaym... some of the clipping of the op amps themselves is surprisingly warm and sweet...
Nothing is wrong...some people think they know too much and criticize...we need to judge sound with our ears and not our eyes looking at schematics ;)
It's not necessarily to remove anything from a 900 all that needs to be done is Snip one lead of the Diode and bend it back, you can also have a switch placed in the Break in the Circuit and then you have Both Circuits at your disposal. I don't know of many Techs who Remove Anything when they do the Diode Mod. It's a matter of Economics and Time. Bench Time is Money. There are a few other Very inexpensive mods that will bring a 900 to Excellent Sonic Sweetness.
You're right..when I said "removed" technically it was simply bypassed. I can shape a tone but I'm electrically illiterate.... :)
Cranked w/Gibson Korina Flying V is pretty amazing if u ask me! :)
I bet that sounds awesome!!!
If it’s good enough for Trey Azagthoth of Morbid Angel, then I’m not one to complain.
Sounds like a good reason! 😎🤟🏼🎸
I loved my JCM900, it and the Sovtek mig 100 were my favorite 2 amps I’ve owned, and im an idiot for letting both of them go.
Damn. Letting the good ones go. But 900s are pretty reasonable on the used market.
I have several amps and Marshalls. Recently i fired up my 900 100w, it takes some tweaking but it sounds amazing, probably a sleeper in the used market but dont be fooled, its real Marshall dna!
Bang on!!
Nice to see the Howard Roberts...awesome guitar. I had a black one too!
Nice! That’s my number 1. Love that guitar. I did a whole feature on it here on my channel a few years ago.
@@LonelyRocker I’ll have to check that out. Love ES guitars. Currently I have a 335 and a 355, amongst a few Les Paul Customs and an EDS1275. Recently got my first PRS, a 509…I like it but it’s a very different playing experience.
Hahaha.
if you want one who gets even more hate, do the marshall modefour. I have one, and its GREAT.
I never even heard of that one. That might say a lot 😂😂😂😂
Ditto- love the 900s
Nice to hear!!
I had an SLX, and it was a brilliant amp!
I’d like to try that one. Keeping an eye out…..
The slx is a completely different beast entirely it’s an all tube amp., I have one and I love it!
If you own this amp PUT an EQ in the LOOP!!!!
I record the amp so I EQ it in the box. But good advice.
@@LonelyRocker it’s a game changer for the 900 imo
I have 2 eq pedals. I’ll test it out.
900-1200 bucks? I can find a DSL100 for 500€. 799€ new. Why would you pay that much for a JCM900 that's JCM800/SLP1959 used prices for reissues... 1987x is 1400 new.
Last time I saw a JCM900 for sale it was the 100 W dual reverb (so same one I think) for 800€ INCLUDING a 20 year old Gibson Les Paul Studio in good condition. Now granted that was heck of a deal and I was too broke to snag it before it was gone (about a day later...). But 1200 for a used JCM900 is steep, they're 1400 new, which is quite expensive for a Marshall, you can get a 20 W JCM800 or Plexi for 800 bucks new.
I was talking Canadian dollars....Euros are 1.5 to Canadian dollars...
i got a 900 4100 head and i slam the return jack w a boss mt2 pedal(w eq) and i get great 80s metal tones
That’s the way to do it!
Sounds like all that is good about a Marshall to me.
I agree! 😎🤘🏽🎸
No matter what anyone says BOTH channels are screened by diodes so you CANNOT boost the clean on this amp like you can a fender or other with tube in the pre (most dont have the diodes in front of the tubes..this one does...)..THE ONLY way to access a tube for drive on THIS amp is through the EFFECTS LOOP on BOTH CHANNELS !!! DRIVES WORK THERE!!!!>>NOT IN FRONT>>>>and this ams does drive very well...even with just an eq pedal in the loop!!!!
How can you drive the preamp tubes from the send? That comes after the preamp. That makes no sense.
YOU DRIVE IT FROM THE RETURN ARE YOU RETARDED ASSHOLE!!!Most loops are solid state or blocked with diodes ...not this one...(remember..the diodes are in front on this amp).they used a tube to buffer the power section and keep it safe from overload...THAT IS THE TUBE YOU DRIVE ON THIS AMP!!!) it is RIGHT after the RETURN LINE IDIOT@@LonelyRocker
I assume with ignorance like yours you don't have much going on in your life. Hang in there. Life gets better if you try a little harder :)
THE ONLY ignorant comments are being put forth by you and you are a GIRL>>>YOU GOT one of my comments blocked you little woman!!!YUOP dont know enough about amps to give tips to ANYONE>>>>>>AND LESSONS>>>PLEASE>>>>PATHETIC PASSIVE AGGRESSIVE LTTLE PUNK@@LonelyRocker
You are spewing out misinformation dude. The 900 DR gets its pre-amp Gain from Op-Amps (both channels), NOT tubes. Op-Amps are SOLID STATE. the diodes are in addition to the Op-Amps., Other tube Marshall's get their gain from pre-amp Tubes. Huge difference. This is why many hate the 900. The cleans don't compare to the JCM 2000. It lacks low end. The distortion tone is very solid state sounding compared to the other Marshalls. I had it last year bought from G.C was an EL34 version and wanted to love it but ended up returning it before the 45 days return policy ended. Also your demoing I.R's. Play it though a real cabinet and you will hear it's just sounds fair.
I'm not spreading anything...I'm not an engineer. I'm sharing the tones of this amp...in the end that's all that really matters. There are tubes in there...I shared what they are. I didn't claim to understand how the amp was built. That's out of my jurisdiction....thanks for the clarification....
@@LonelyRocker Ok, sounds good. Enjoyed the video.
Gary Moore liked 'em. Good enough for me.
Good for me too!
He used JCM 2000's dude.
If it’s good enough for Trey Azagtoth it’s good enough for me.
Sounds good to me :)
I swear by mine I think channel A is the best kept secret ever!
You might be right!!
Well then you haven't played other Marshall's. I've had them all , it's a fair sounding amp & was an EL34 version. Solid state gain is NOT the same as pure Tube gain.
Demoing a substantially modified amp that remedies one of its mostly criticized design decisions is a flawed defense of "what this amp is."
Fair argument...but this is what I have. So I did a video about what "this" amp is....
Wait a minute wait a minute so what you're saying is that all of those apparent annoying frequencies that guys are always trying to get rid of our actually there for a reason to help somebody sound good in a mix and actually play with other people interesting concept because guys just go around and complain that every Amp sounds terrible, but they never ever play with anybody else And they have walls of useless amps that just collect dust and all sound terrible apparently but maybe just maybe the guys who design these Amp know what they're doing and all of those little bedroom warrior problems would actually go away if these dip shits would actually utilize the amplifiers for their intended purposethey should probably stick with battery powered 3 W amps
You nailed it! I’m not afraid to say it! Amps are not built for solo performances and bedroom noodling. They are for playing with a band. No shit! 😂😂😂
Nah - 900s are indeed metalzzz amps …
They do more than metal...I can assure you :)
@@LonelyRocker Maybe if you mod them 🤷🏻♂️
Great clean channel that boosts well into overdrive. Lots of styles! 😎🤟🏼🎸
@@LonelyRocker Great clean channel?! * Tastes may vary.
The only reason people think it’s decent is because they can’t afford anything better. This is a shit amp compared to the 2555 that came out before it.
Dude. You just offended a shit ton of people with your ignorance. 👎🏼👎🏼👎🏼👎🏼
@@LonelyRockermy comment is accurate and on point, sounds like you don’t know any better.
I concur 100%. I bought one last year from G.C an EL34. Mint cond. I have 3 other Marshall's. 2000 dsl, SL-X & and 800 2204. The 900 sounded sterile. The cleans weren't that good. It sounded ok. I ended up returning it before the 45 days were up. I really wanted to love it but couldn't.
Who cares...modelers are a thing.
No amps…no modelers…I like both. That’s a thing. 😎
@LonelyRocker just sayin, to those that dont like that amp...sell it and get a modeler and shut up.
If you dig it, thats what matters.
Im not passing judgement, i play on a vypyr x2 that i recently put a greenback into. Is it my dream rig? Hell no, does it do the thing well enough for what i use it for, yes.
Frankly, i think id invest in some nice monitors and just run plugins/modelers, if i could re-invest past purchases.
Was hard to guage your intent with your brief comment. I cover both amps and modelers on my channel and they both serve the needs of different players. In my case they work great together! :)
@LonelyRocker ive been watchin your channel for a while...under many different screen names lol
I guessed youd purchase the sls elite.
Nice! And my channel has only had two names! I started as a”I Don’t Have a Band” but switched to Lonely Rocker maybe a year after. Been that ever since! Thanks for hanging around!
JCM 900 is iconic, but it's not for me, too much bright mids.....I prefer the DSL due to better cleans and modern distortion, better Lows and Highs.
It’s definitely not for everyone but I will say, in a recording context, you can easily overcome characteristics you don’t like.