The old Wagoneer is like your grandma’s house. Yeah it’s old, very little tech, and covered in wood paneling. Yet it’s familiar, comfortable, functional, and a place you want to spend time in.
Great interview, Roman - I always love hearing directly from designers and engineers on their work and inspiration for their newest models; the evolution of the Grand Wagoneer looks great - and honestly catches my eye more than its competitors.
Just a few corrections. The Wagoneer was made from 63-91. The Grand was only made from 84-91. And while the sheet metal shared the same basic look, there were significant changes through the years. Entirely different drive trains, frame, axles, suspension, etc. And the little knob next to the fog light switch is the fresh air cowl vent. It allows air from outside in without opening windows.
At the same time some things did not change. The radiator shroud panel did not change throughout the run, even though there were major changes in the look of the grill and headlights. The AMC guys were brilliant at changing the look of things substantially without making structural changes.
The "Grand" moniker was added to distinguish this from the new smaller Cherokee AMC (under Renault ownership) released in 1984. This Cherokee had a high-trim "Wagoneer" variant, thus the need for the name change. Clearly the "Grand" was not originally intended to continue another 8 model years, but gas prices moderated from the levels that prompted introduction of the smaller 4x4s (Bronco II, S-10 Blazer, and so on), and people were still readily buying the now "Grand" Wagoneer despite atrocious fuel economy.
Am I the only one that thinks Jeep missed the mark here? The old one had a unique profile, for better or worse. The new one seems to be unsure if it wants to be a Durango or a Grand Cherokee or a Suburban, or all three. It looks so busy, that I'm pretty sure it wouldn't age well. As much as I dislike the Land Rover brand, I think they knocked the new Range Rover out of the park. Subtle, elegant, and timeless. Hecc, even the Rivian R1S felt more like the Grand Wagoneer of old than the new Grand Wagoneer.
I think it’s hard to make something the size of the suburban. Look completely not like a suburban since the suburban has been around for so many years with so many different designs
You are not off the mark. If you took the branding off it, no one would identify it as a Grand Wagoneer. Its design seems uninspired. Chrysler has done well with retro designs but I think this was a lost opportunity. If this had a Chevy logo on it, people would think it was a new Suburban. It's really too bad because a modern Wagoneer with retro styling could have been very cool.
4:23 That is the ir receiver for the key fob. You had to have line-of-sight through the glass to lock/unlock the doors. It was also present in, at least, the first year Grand Cherokee.
Wow! The new one is very nice. I owned a 1963 model, then later, was employed by a company that used Wagoneers as “company cars”. (We had 12 of them). Thank you for the review. 👍🏻👍🏻
Terrific video. I like the focus from talking to the interior product designer and his sharing of the design thought process as well as detailing the function and appearance. Great job Roman.
Amazing when you actually get to see the designers and developers introduce and explain the vehicles they spent years developing! I wish even more of the development team can be included in future videos. They deserve to introduce their efforts! As always, awesome video and great work!
I almost bought a Wagoneer,wood paneling and all, for my first car back when they were plentiful and cheap. I wish I had one now. Think I would go back to an slightly earlier version though. Great interview, Jeep designer was well versed and easy to converse with, bring him back.
We chose a Wagoneer over the Grand, it's a metallic grey with a much lighter interior. We often have people in parking lots ask about it and want to look at the interior, which is beautiful. However, if you're a passenger on a road trip and you enjoy the sights you might not want to get this. Everyone in the back rows keep falling asleep. It's that comfortable of a ride.
@@GMan56M A lot of our decision had to do with availability with in the time frame of what we wanted. Also, the additional dealer mark up for available Grand Wagoner's were ridiculous , were as there wasn't a mark up for the Wagoner at the dealership we purchased it. We did look at the Tahoe and the Expedition as well. My wife didn't care for the seats in the Ford and the Tahoe's at the time had and additional 10K markup attached to them. Ordering a Tahoe was nothing but a guessing game. No one knew when they would even ship, yet arrive. Out of all the large SUV's, my wife really preferred the Wagoner over the rest of the pack, so it worked out perfectly.
Beautiful interior design,all a family needs on a road trip plus some. I hope these vehicles are on the road in 60 years like the 1963s are. I love the dark interiors because they don’t show wear stains and dirt like the whites and tan colors do. Thanks Jeep and TFL for sharing.
I'm not willing to spend that kind of money on a vehicle but his team definitely did an amazing job designing that interior. It's a great combination of old school design cues with a modern touch
My only real criticism is the lack of chrome and wood paneling. I realize that it would be difficult to execute fully with newer design sensibilities, but a wood accent line would be fantastic.
The old wagoner interior still presents very well. The rich deep red interior color is very sharp and pleasing looking. I myself would like to see that color interior offered on the new one. The exterior style has aged extremely well. It still looks excellent and pleasing from every angle. Jeep got the old one very very right. We will see how well the style of the new one hold up.
I want the wagoneer to live but oh man when I see all the new features and realize there’s so much stuff that will stop working in 5-10 years… I’m sticking with my XJ.
The original Wagoneer did use parts bin for certain components...the steering column is a GM Saginaw product. The knob to the right of the fog light switch is a push/pull lever to open and close the footwell air vents. The HVAC system wasn't totally integrated given it's 1963 design. A very enjoyable interview and I always enjoy hearing how designers talk about vehicle heritage and how design elements are chosen in new models.
I would love to meet Mr. Jackson, for sure. Maybe even before the end of this year. In your team you have an engineer that works on Grand Wagoneers that is a cousin of my best friend. We come from the province of Quebec (Canada) . All the best ! One for all, all for one !!!
I own an OG first year Grand. 1984. It now sports a modern motor under the hood and love every aspect of the combination of new and old. I love the vintage feel and looks over modern, but having the ability to put down 20mpg on the highway with a 38 year old ride is awesome. The looks it gets kinda becomes the norm once you get used to it. Makes it hard to be an introvert due to the conversations it starts. The 'squid' knob is known in Jeep/AMC circles as the "squid launchers". They are fresh air vent cables. One for each fresh air vent in the kick panels. C'mon Roman, you should remember that! That bulb is most likely a RF antenna for the keyless entry. And the stalk would have been GM as the columns were sourced from them.
yeea Roman seemed pretty dumb in this interview.. he didnt even know what the RF bulb on the console headliner was... its for electric locks. The 89-91 grand wagoneers only had that.. Thats another reason 89-91 is more popular and more expensive than the other years, among many other improvements chrysler did
I actually hate modern over-sized center consoles. They destroy leg room and hip space. I want cup-holders and a place to store my phone, but I don't want it in my way. The original Wagoneer looks far more comfortable for the driver.
The new Wagoneer looks real fancy, but I’d worry about the electronics going out. If I wanted one, I would go for the original, it’s simple, does not suffer from bloated dashes or bloated exterior that seem to be hallmark of modern cars. I have yet to sit in a Wagoneer. But I have a first gen XJ Cherokee that feels roomy despite being a small vehicle.
XJ is tiny AF man, its why i got a ZJ when i was shopping for my first car like 15 years ago, i have an original wagoneer and its extremely roomy much much much more so than a ZJ or XJ
Nicely done video and interior on the Wagoneer. Jeep missed the boat completely on this vehicle though. People are very nostalgic and they would have been drawn to the dealership more had they given the exterior a shape and look closer to the vintage wagoneer. Bad mistake unfortunately and will likely show on the sales numbers.
yea my 90 grand wagoneer looks small compared to todays suvs. But it isnt.. the inside is 95 cubic feet of cargo room.. Thats bigger than almost all suvs today.. The reason its body looks smaller is because todays suvs have massive bubbles inside the body panels which act as crumple zones. This thing also weighs upwards of 4500lbs which is a lot. Mine weighs 5300lbs with the mods i have on it
The Grand Wagoneer wasn't introduced in 1963. It was just the Wagoneer, which replaced the Wagon. The first luxury Wagoneer was the Super Wagoneer of the 1960's. The Grand Wagoneer name didn't come out until the 1980's. The switch on the fly 4wd is a 1980's thing. Before that, you needed to switch the front hubs from freewheeling to engaged. Not a big deal when it was a "Wagoneer", but apparently an issue when the 1980's luxury demanded the "Grand Wagoneer". The Brooks Stevens design of 1963 aged very well. It's a shame you couldn't compare the new Wagoneer to the original 1963 version, since that interior design was the epitome of "minimalism".
the reason it has the 2-4wd switch is not because they really "demanded" that.. its because the transfercase used uses a viscous coupler. it no longer needs locking hubs. Just like the quadra trac from the 1970s that they used.. they didnt have locking hubs.,. it was 4wd all the time that used a viscous coupler. If you put locking hubs on those it would blow up the drive train
The new wagoneer looks so fat and unrefined from the back. The front looks okay, and the interior doesn’t look bad. Your average six year old could have drawn a better rear exterior design.
It's good to see where it all begins for the Wagoneer. I appreciate the history of this icon vehicle. However, the old one is in the past and I'm all about the future! I'm always thinking forward and not backwards. Technology doesn't intimidate me at all. So, I will choose the new Wagoneer over the old one.
How I miss my SJs. Had 3 of them. The '84 model year changed the interior to the one shown. the '83 I had had round gauges and was much better looking. And the round little black bubble on the headliner was for the keyless entry
4:35 that turn signal was on every gm since 69 but thats ok i love that part. the over head compartments got shared with the dodge dakota and the head light switch was in 84-96 gm oldsmobile ciera buick century,chevy celebrity, pontiac 6000. the old grand wagoneer looks much cleaner and sorted inside very geometrically organized 6:47 OH GOD THAT CHIME IS HORRENDOUS
Really like this guy being in charge of the interiors for jeep an wagoneer. The grand wagoneer and the summit reserve grand cherokee are insanely nice.
Interested to see the sales number. I’m a time when dealer lots are kinda empty, my local Jeep dealer has a ton of wagoneers and has had them for months 😅
Yeah there's a Chrysler dealership near my house and while they have over 700 vehicles on the lot they sell Rams, Chargers, Challengers and Caravans way more than they move their 30+ Wagoneers and Grand Wagoneers.
The old truck's AMC parts-sharing heritage is obvious even in this example, because AMC never had the resources of Ford, GM, or Chrysler, and desperately needed to make every development dollar count. The headlight switch, turn signal stalk, steering column, and ignition are all GM parts. The steering wheel, HVAC controls, and radio are straight out of the '80s Cherokee line. The 2WD-4WD switch was in every 4WD AMC vehicle in the '80s except the Jeep CJ7/Wrangler. The lower cowl vent placement dated from when the Wagoneer had separate heat/defrost and A/C systems (much like the Vintage Air units sold to classic car owners today). While the V8 engine is an AMC unit, the distributor was from Ford. The transmission was a 3-speed Chrysler Torque-Flite unit, well before Chrysler bought AMC. Speaking of Chrysler, that overhead console is straight out of a Dodge Caravan, complete with the light sensor for the automatic headlights.
not a light sensor.. its for remote locks, as for the hvac and stuff being from the cherokee line.. i think you have it backwords.. the cherokee line got them from this
neither did the "Car guy" doing the interview.. which kinda blew my mind actually.. honestly i own a 90 GW, i dont see much if anything taken from the older one, besides a few things here and there... it looks like any other car to me
What happens to these cars in 10 years? When the screens break and they're on their third owner. All these expensive screens with no redundant actual gauges makes these cars disposable.
@@foch3 I know from first hand experience how expensive they are. I have a Transit with the 8-in screen it got broken (due to heat cycling on a sunny day) Ford covered it but the part alone costed $900. It would have been between 1,000 and 1200 to repair.
I actually thing the wagoner is the better one or just placed and priced in a much better place and just think the price fits what you can get for example some cars that want to charge a lot and just don’t make sense because they’re not as good as the comp for example the Jeep Grand Cherokee upper trims just start getting stupid expensive imo and it’s just dumb to get that instead of the actually luxury comp. Or even in the case the grand wagoner although I think it’s nice and great I just think for the price and what it is i personally think you should just get an Escalade because it’s just on another level and not that the grand wagoner is bad but the other is just better. Just my thoughts but either way if this what you like then awesome get it and enjoy it. ✌️
i think too much technology ruins a vehicle. perhaps it should be available as a base model, which has all of the "basic modern features" but no driving aids, perhaps a manual transmission, and not over the top touch screens. i bought a subaru crosstrek, i bought the premium with the manual. it doesnt have all the do-dads, but it has everything i wanted including the manual. no one needs "push to start", "stop start", driving aids..... these things should be all optional.
The wagoner was vastly outdated in 1990. The air conditioning vents look like an add on feature from the sears catalog. I believe the MSRP was around $26k which was high for an outdated vehicle. It’s overall quality was poor. The new one is very impressive.
I agree, the vents look like aftermarket addon, they kept the old design for too long, but really 90 bronco doesn't exactly stand out better, 95 is nice however
why would you spent millions to redesign an A.C system that works.. youd have to completetly change the entire dash, the tooling. fit and everything... i have a 90.. the a.c system works great and its fine..
That is not a $100k interior. The new Volvo’s have a better interior than this. Which is kind of sad to be honest, and can be had for less. This is yet another vehicle for suburban house wives to traverse to target in.
I respect the designer and his team, but I feel like Jeep is moving away from it's off-road roots. Don't get me wrong, this is a really nice vehicle, but when I hear Jeep, I think off-roader, not a luxury vehicle. Then again, I guess the general public is moving away from off-roading and camping, so Jeep is hitting their new target audience correctly. Either way it is a nice vehicle and I do appreciate hearing from someone on the design team.
how do you figure when the wagoneer was from 1963 and always a luxury soccer mom vehicle.. watch the old commercials from it, all they did was advertise its luxury, auto matic transmission which was new for Jeeps, and yes they did have great off-roading capability.. but that wasnt its main selling point.. You have the CJ aka wranglers for that.
That’s the point lol it’s a lot bigger though. It’s made to have familiarity. If they wanted it to be completely different it’d likely cost more than it does now. Most manufacturers use certain things across models to make it easier and cheaper to produce
This screen icon and non-mechanical button business sucks. Not just this, but all the vehicles are playing with this unsafe idea. When I’m focused on the road or whatever, I need a real button I can quickly use without looking or hunting.
I don't know about a Rav, but yeah if I could afford this I still probably wouldn't own it. I don't like driving land yachts for the sake of it, I don't have anything to prove to anyone by driving a vehicle that barely fits on the road or in standard parking spaces. I'd probably have a Wrangler or Gladiator, I don't even really want anything as big as the Gladiator but I can't deny the utility/fun combo of a convertible with a short bed.
My Bible is so Big and well used, there is no room for a gun in the car or in life! Try reading it and living it , then it becomes your life and not a prop.
@@MJorgy5 I didn't say they weren't important. I said listening to them is a waste of time. They always talk about things like design language. They never say much that concrete. And remember if designers had their way, we would all have beautiful cars. But you wouldn't be able to get inside one. It wouldn't be able to carry anything.
Its changed for the worse sure better initial parts but after while they will break much worse than that old grand wagoneer and I guarantee the old one will still be around where the new one will be in a scrap yard because its a Chrysler and fiat junk.
The new Grand Wagoneer is so ugly and in no way has ANYTHING to do with the original. Nice BS talking about “vertical” design elements, oh you mean a dash goes from left to right WOW what a great legacy to carry on. You know how the Bronco and mustang actually shows a design lineage from the originals this thing doesn’t. The new Wagoneer is such let down to long time Jeep fans and how much time did the designer talk about how the original influence this one. He was just a car salesman. This unreliable, overpriced eyesore will be gone in 3 years. A Jeep over 100,000? Whatever and congratulations team Stellantis or Fiat or whatever it is now. Certainly not a Jeep.
i could see the 3 way design of the old and new incorporated and the wood from the interior.. but i dont see much else it looks like any other fancy grand cherokee or modern suv... The main thing that really bothers me though on the new one is the way the rear end looks.. it looks extremely bloated and like a mini van.. it has no design features at all
"WAGONEER" the Grand Wagoneer was introduced in 1984 dude, that squid thing is for the floor vents... Man get a real car guy to do these videos those knobs were litterally on every older vehicle... That mystery thing on the console up top is for the electric door locks... smh... have you never seen an IF sensor before ? TBH i dont see many takes from the old one to the new one... The new one is also a bloated corpse.. the rear of the vehicle.. looks like a mini van.. it looks terrible
The old one… SPACE! The dashboard is not trying to envelop you. The glass.. old one wins! Positively claustrophobic new one. I hate trend followers! You can take your focus groups!
Tell jeep those screens are to small and of you're going to luxury put messaging second and 3rd row step your game up and bring the track wagon to battle the the Escalade ESV
The old Wagoneer is like your grandma’s house. Yeah it’s old, very little tech, and covered in wood paneling. Yet it’s familiar, comfortable, functional, and a place you want to spend time in.
Great interview, Roman - I always love hearing directly from designers and engineers on their work and inspiration for their newest models; the evolution of the Grand Wagoneer looks great - and honestly catches my eye more than its competitors.
Just a few corrections. The Wagoneer was made from 63-91. The Grand was only made from 84-91. And while the sheet metal shared the same basic look, there were significant changes through the years. Entirely different drive trains, frame, axles, suspension, etc. And the little knob next to the fog light switch is the fresh air cowl vent. It allows air from outside in without opening windows.
At the same time some things did not change. The radiator shroud panel did not change throughout the run, even though there were major changes in the look of the grill and headlights. The AMC guys were brilliant at changing the look of things substantially without making structural changes.
@@1guyin10 Oh yeah, tons of parts that swap across the entire range of years. But they were not all the exact same as insinuated in the video.
The "Grand" moniker was added to distinguish this from the new smaller Cherokee AMC (under Renault ownership) released in 1984. This Cherokee had a high-trim "Wagoneer" variant, thus the need for the name change. Clearly the "Grand" was not originally intended to continue another 8 model years, but gas prices moderated from the levels that prompted introduction of the smaller 4x4s (Bronco II, S-10 Blazer, and so on), and people were still readily buying the now "Grand" Wagoneer despite atrocious fuel economy.
Am I the only one that thinks Jeep missed the mark here? The old one had a unique profile, for better or worse. The new one seems to be unsure if it wants to be a Durango or a Grand Cherokee or a Suburban, or all three. It looks so busy, that I'm pretty sure it wouldn't age well.
As much as I dislike the Land Rover brand, I think they knocked the new Range Rover out of the park. Subtle, elegant, and timeless. Hecc, even the Rivian R1S felt more like the Grand Wagoneer of old than the new Grand Wagoneer.
I think it’s hard to make something the size of the suburban. Look completely not like a suburban since the suburban has been around for so many years with so many different designs
You are not off the mark. If you took the branding off it, no one would identify it as a Grand Wagoneer. Its design seems uninspired. Chrysler has done well with retro designs but I think this was a lost opportunity. If this had a Chevy logo on it, people would think it was a new Suburban. It's really too bad because a modern Wagoneer with retro styling could have been very cool.
@@Rickmakes The new Grand Cherokee should've been the retro wagoneer; because of that D pillar. Just give it the Durango's length.
4:23 That is the ir receiver for the key fob. You had to have line-of-sight through the glass to lock/unlock the doors. It was also present in, at least, the first year Grand Cherokee.
I did not know that, VERY cool. I always wondered what that was, my mother had a wagoneer when I was a kid.
Wow! The new one is very nice. I owned a 1963 model, then later, was employed by a company that used Wagoneers as “company cars”. (We had 12 of them). Thank you for the review. 👍🏻👍🏻
Terrific video. I like the focus from talking to the interior product designer and his sharing of the design thought process as well as detailing the function and appearance. Great job Roman.
Amazing when you actually get to see the designers and developers introduce and explain the vehicles they spent years developing! I wish even more of the development team can be included in future videos. They deserve to introduce their efforts! As always, awesome video and great work!
I almost bought a Wagoneer,wood paneling and all, for my first car back when they were plentiful and cheap. I wish I had one now. Think I would go back to an slightly earlier version though. Great interview, Jeep designer was well versed and easy to converse with, bring him back.
My dad has a ‘91 Grand Wagoneer and recently got a ‘22. Amazing how much has changed in 31 years.
We chose a Wagoneer over the Grand, it's a metallic grey with a much lighter interior. We often have people in parking lots ask about it and want to look at the interior, which is beautiful. However, if you're a passenger on a road trip and you enjoy the sights you might not want to get this. Everyone in the back rows keep falling asleep. It's that comfortable of a ride.
Any reason in particular you went with the Wagoneer over the Grand? We’re weighing both options but haven’t had the chance to test drive either yet.
@@GMan56M A lot of our decision had to do with availability with in the time frame of what we wanted. Also, the additional dealer mark up for available Grand Wagoner's were ridiculous , were as there wasn't a mark up for the Wagoner at the dealership we purchased it.
We did look at the Tahoe and the Expedition as well. My wife didn't care for the seats in the Ford and the Tahoe's at the time had and additional 10K markup attached to them. Ordering a Tahoe was nothing but a guessing game. No one knew when they would even ship, yet arrive.
Out of all the large SUV's, my wife really preferred the Wagoner over the rest of the pack, so it worked out perfectly.
Beautiful interior design,all a family needs on a road trip plus some. I hope these vehicles are on the road in 60 years like the 1963s are. I love the dark interiors because they don’t show wear stains and dirt like the whites and tan colors do. Thanks Jeep and TFL for sharing.
I'm not willing to spend that kind of money on a vehicle but his team definitely did an amazing job designing that interior. It's a great combination of old school design cues with a modern touch
I'd believe how much it changed, nothing is the same
My only real criticism is the lack of chrome and wood paneling. I realize that it would be difficult to execute fully with newer design sensibilities, but a wood accent line would be fantastic.
The old wagoner interior still presents very well. The rich deep red interior color is very sharp and pleasing looking. I myself would like to see that color interior offered on the new one. The exterior style has aged extremely well. It still looks excellent and pleasing from every angle. Jeep got the old one very very right. We will see how well the style of the new one hold up.
I want the wagoneer to live but oh man when I see all the new features and realize there’s so much stuff that will stop working in 5-10 years… I’m sticking with my XJ.
The original Wagoneer did use parts bin for certain components...the steering column is a GM Saginaw product. The knob to the right of the fog light switch is a push/pull lever to open and close the footwell air vents. The HVAC system wasn't totally integrated given it's 1963 design.
A very enjoyable interview and I always enjoy hearing how designers talk about vehicle heritage and how design elements are chosen in new models.
I also noticed the steering wheel from an 80's Chevy Caprice Classic.
The Grand Wagoneer sign reminds me of the 80s Audis where the quattro sign was written. Its a nice touch.
I would love to meet Mr. Jackson, for sure. Maybe even before the end of this year. In your team you have an engineer that works on Grand Wagoneers that is a cousin of my best friend. We come from the province of Quebec (Canada) . All the best ! One for all, all for one !!!
I own an OG first year Grand. 1984. It now sports a modern motor under the hood and love every aspect of the combination of new and old. I love the vintage feel and looks over modern, but having the ability to put down 20mpg on the highway with a 38 year old ride is awesome. The looks it gets kinda becomes the norm once you get used to it. Makes it hard to be an introvert due to the conversations it starts. The 'squid' knob is known in Jeep/AMC circles as the "squid launchers". They are fresh air vent cables. One for each fresh air vent in the kick panels. C'mon Roman, you should remember that! That bulb is most likely a RF antenna for the keyless entry. And the stalk would have been GM as the columns were sourced from them.
yeea Roman seemed pretty dumb in this interview.. he didnt even know what the RF bulb on the console headliner was... its for electric locks. The 89-91 grand wagoneers only had that.. Thats another reason 89-91 is more popular and more expensive than the other years, among many other improvements chrysler did
I actually hate modern over-sized center consoles. They destroy leg room and hip space. I want cup-holders and a place to store my phone, but I don't want it in my way. The original Wagoneer looks far more comfortable for the driver.
The new Wagoneer looks real fancy, but I’d worry about the electronics going out. If I wanted one, I would go for the original, it’s simple, does not suffer from bloated dashes or bloated exterior that seem to be hallmark of modern cars. I have yet to sit in a Wagoneer. But I have a first gen XJ Cherokee that feels roomy despite being a small vehicle.
XJ is tiny AF man, its why i got a ZJ when i was shopping for my first car like 15 years ago, i have an original wagoneer and its extremely roomy much much much more so than a ZJ or XJ
Nicely done video and interior on the Wagoneer. Jeep missed the boat completely on this vehicle though. People are very nostalgic and they would have been drawn to the dealership more had they given the exterior a shape and look closer to the vintage wagoneer. Bad mistake unfortunately and will likely show on the sales numbers.
Kinda stunned to see old GW ( which was a land Yacht back in its day ) look so ....well , so small !!!
yea my 90 grand wagoneer looks small compared to todays suvs. But it isnt.. the inside is 95 cubic feet of cargo room.. Thats bigger than almost all suvs today.. The reason its body looks smaller is because todays suvs have massive bubbles inside the body panels which act as crumple zones. This thing also weighs upwards of 4500lbs which is a lot. Mine weighs 5300lbs with the mods i have on it
Jeep should bring that burgundy color back out of the original
This was a great video! Loved hearing from the actual designer about what went into and inspired the design!
The Grand Wagoneer wasn't introduced in 1963. It was just the Wagoneer, which replaced the Wagon. The first luxury Wagoneer was the Super Wagoneer of the 1960's. The Grand Wagoneer name didn't come out until the 1980's. The switch on the fly 4wd is a 1980's thing. Before that, you needed to switch the front hubs from freewheeling to engaged. Not a big deal when it was a "Wagoneer", but apparently an issue when the 1980's luxury demanded the "Grand Wagoneer".
The Brooks Stevens design of 1963 aged very well. It's a shame you couldn't compare the new Wagoneer to the original 1963 version, since that interior design was the epitome of "minimalism".
the reason it has the 2-4wd switch is not because they really "demanded" that.. its because the transfercase used uses a viscous coupler. it no longer needs locking hubs. Just like the quadra trac from the 1970s that they used.. they didnt have locking hubs.,. it was 4wd all the time that used a viscous coupler. If you put locking hubs on those it would blow up the drive train
The new wagoneer looks so fat and unrefined from the back. The front looks okay, and the interior doesn’t look bad. Your average six year old could have drawn a better rear exterior design.
It's good to see where it all begins for the Wagoneer. I appreciate the history of this icon vehicle. However, the old one is in the past and I'm all about the future! I'm always thinking forward and not backwards. Technology doesn't intimidate me at all. So, I will choose the new Wagoneer over the old one.
No thanks, the original will blow the doors off this new "wagoneer" on the trails, any day. Also no woodgrain is a big F 👎.
They really did a nice job on that interior. It is very much the selling point of the Grand Wagoneer.
I hope if they ever resurrect the XJ they don’t imagine all this stuff in it.
Hoping these hold up reliability-wise to Ford & GMC.
How I miss my SJs. Had 3 of them. The '84 model year changed the interior to the one shown. the '83 I had had round gauges and was much better looking. And the round little black bubble on the headliner was for the keyless entry
Roman, I expected to see the 1990 Grand Wagoneer fit inside the new one. I suppose we have to wait for the upcoming L 😁
Would rather have the original.
The new one looks nice, too fancy & pricy for me. Prefer the older one. Keep’m coming because everyone has different taste
I mean the company that restores the old ones cost 100k so the new one is cheaper technically.
I have no need or reason to buy an SUV this big. But I like the look of this new Grand Wagoneer so much that I actually think I want it.
The old one actually looks like an SUV. The new one is a bloated mess.
It needs wood paneling
Old one is prettier
4:35 that turn signal was on every gm since 69 but thats ok i love that part.
the over head compartments got shared with the dodge dakota and the head light switch was in 84-96 gm oldsmobile ciera buick century,chevy celebrity, pontiac 6000.
the old grand wagoneer looks much cleaner and sorted inside very geometrically organized
6:47 OH GOD THAT CHIME IS HORRENDOUS
Really like this guy being in charge of the interiors for jeep an wagoneer. The grand wagoneer and the summit reserve grand cherokee are insanely nice.
I’m guessing that 360degree protruding balck plastic is the IR reader as is is on my 1993 Jeep Cherokee Sport XJ.
Interested to see the sales number. I’m a time when dealer lots are kinda empty, my local Jeep dealer has a ton of wagoneers and has had them for months 😅
My guess is high purchase price and cost of fuel today.
Yeah there's a Chrysler dealership near my house and while they have over 700 vehicles on the lot they sell Rams, Chargers, Challengers and Caravans way more than they move their 30+ Wagoneers and Grand Wagoneers.
Tell those engineers alot of us aren't happy .
Constant glitches in every electronic system.
Buy em back and save face.
I love the way this pro talks to Roman about car design. He's obviously a true expert, but he kept it relevant AND interesting.
How many people have $90 to $100k to drop on a depreciating asset. The industry is pricing themselves into the ground.
That old one is Mint!
I'd take the old one anyday
The old truck's AMC parts-sharing heritage is obvious even in this example, because AMC never had the resources of Ford, GM, or Chrysler, and desperately needed to make every development dollar count. The headlight switch, turn signal stalk, steering column, and ignition are all GM parts. The steering wheel, HVAC controls, and radio are straight out of the '80s Cherokee line. The 2WD-4WD switch was in every 4WD AMC vehicle in the '80s except the Jeep CJ7/Wrangler. The lower cowl vent placement dated from when the Wagoneer had separate heat/defrost and A/C systems (much like the Vintage Air units sold to classic car owners today).
While the V8 engine is an AMC unit, the distributor was from Ford. The transmission was a 3-speed Chrysler Torque-Flite unit, well before Chrysler bought AMC. Speaking of Chrysler, that overhead console is straight out of a Dodge Caravan, complete with the light sensor for the automatic headlights.
not a light sensor.. its for remote locks, as for the hvac and stuff being from the cherokee line.. i think you have it backwords.. the cherokee line got them from this
That’s the button to release the Kraken. You can only do that on an FSJ Jeep. J/K it’s the air vent button.
The most patriotic, partially Italian behemoth that money can buy.
The squid pull is a fresh air vent control or that is what I remember.
I’d prefer the classic Grand Wagoneer over the new one.
The old Jeep Grand Wagoneer is better
These look terrible from behind and the side. Why does the window line jut upwards on the rear glass? that's a terrible discount SUV look.
I like how the interior designer didn’t even know about some of the features in the old wagoneer lmfao
neither did the "Car guy" doing the interview.. which kinda blew my mind actually.. honestly i own a 90 GW, i dont see much if anything taken from the older one, besides a few things here and there... it looks like any other car to me
Choke?? Its the squid launcher! Actually that is a vent lever. Pull to open floor vent for air circulation.
Rear windows by the hatch, are hideous
wish i could own both!
For me I take the old school Jeep Grand Wagoneer over the new Overpriced plastic Wagoneer anyday.
Dealers in these parts are asking way North of $100,000 for them.
What happens to these cars in 10 years? When the screens break and they're on their third owner. All these expensive screens with no redundant actual gauges makes these cars disposable.
I agree, the screens will be the first thing to date all these vehicles.
@@foch3 I know from first hand experience how expensive they are. I have a Transit with the 8-in screen it got broken (due to heat cycling on a sunny day) Ford covered it but the part alone costed $900. It would have been between 1,000 and 1200 to repair.
Awesome video Roman !! Great job!! I like the older one myself. Steering wheel looks like out of an 80s Chev Caprice. Thanks Roman!!
it also looks like the steering wheel from a 1980 chevy citation i bought for $50 a couple of decades ago LOL
I actually thing the wagoner is the better one or just placed and priced in a much better place and just think the price fits what you can get for example some cars that want to charge a lot and just don’t make sense because they’re not as good as the comp for example the Jeep Grand Cherokee upper trims just start getting stupid expensive imo and it’s just dumb to get that instead of the actually luxury comp. Or even in the case the grand wagoner although I think it’s nice and great I just think for the price and what it is i personally think you should just get an Escalade because it’s just on another level and not that the grand wagoner is bad but the other is just better. Just my thoughts but either way if this what you like then awesome get it and enjoy it. ✌️
i think too much technology ruins a vehicle. perhaps it should be available as a base model, which has all of the "basic modern features" but no driving aids, perhaps a manual transmission, and not over the top touch screens. i bought a subaru crosstrek, i bought the premium with the manual. it doesnt have all the do-dads, but it has everything i wanted including the manual. no one needs "push to start", "stop start", driving aids..... these things should be all optional.
That's the same exact steering wheel the Chevy celebrity had. It's the same 2 spoke design
Looks like the blinker lever is from my 90 Silverado too.
Gm parts bin
The wagoner was vastly outdated in 1990. The air conditioning vents look like an add on feature from the sears catalog. I believe the MSRP was around $26k which was high for an outdated vehicle. It’s overall quality was poor. The new one is very impressive.
I agree, the vents look like aftermarket addon, they kept the old design for too long, but really 90 bronco doesn't exactly stand out better, 95 is nice however
Remember in 1990, there were two luxury SUV’s for sale in the U.S: this and the Range Rover. There was no reason for Jeep to improve.
why would you spent millions to redesign an A.C system that works.. youd have to completetly change the entire dash, the tooling. fit and everything... i have a 90.. the a.c system works great and its fine..
Wonder if any of the new ones will see the age the older ones did
haha i doubt it
Love this vehicle
The original will last another 40 years. The new one yeeeaaaahhh not so much.
Just clicked here to tell you the car has so many problems. My wife calls it the family curse. Buyer beware
That is not a $100k interior. The new Volvo’s have a better interior than this. Which is kind of sad to be honest, and can be had for less. This is yet another vehicle for suburban house wives to traverse to target in.
One of the last completely new vehicles powered by gasoline. From here on out most R&D is going to be spent on electric.
Let him answer you Roman! Jeez. You asked him a question then talk over him
The original was 1946.
I respect the designer and his team, but I feel like Jeep is moving away from it's off-road roots. Don't get me wrong, this is a really nice vehicle, but when I hear Jeep, I think off-roader, not a luxury vehicle. Then again, I guess the general public is moving away from off-roading and camping, so Jeep is hitting their new target audience correctly. Either way it is a nice vehicle and I do appreciate hearing from someone on the design team.
how do you figure when the wagoneer was from 1963 and always a luxury soccer mom vehicle.. watch the old commercials from it, all they did was advertise its luxury, auto matic transmission which was new for Jeeps, and yes they did have great off-roading capability.. but that wasnt its main selling point.. You have the CJ aka wranglers for that.
Blah, looks too similar to the regular Grand Cherokee..such a disappointment. 🤦🏻♀🤦🏼♂
That’s the point lol it’s a lot bigger though. It’s made to have familiarity. If they wanted it to be completely different it’d likely cost more than it does now. Most manufacturers use certain things across models to make it easier and cheaper to produce
This screen icon and non-mechanical button business sucks. Not just this, but all the vehicles are playing with this unsafe idea. When I’m focused on the road or whatever, I need a real button I can quickly use without looking or hunting.
Was this interview a little awkward, or is it just me? Lol
The new grand wagoneer is a grand wagoneer in name only. May as well have no relation to the old and good one. Wouldnt touch a new one.
even if i could afford this, i would prob just drive a rav4
A Rav4?...Interesting.
I don't know about a Rav, but yeah if I could afford this I still probably wouldn't own it. I don't like driving land yachts for the sake of it, I don't have anything to prove to anyone by driving a vehicle that barely fits on the road or in standard parking spaces. I'd probably have a Wrangler or Gladiator, I don't even really want anything as big as the Gladiator but I can't deny the utility/fun combo of a convertible with a short bed.
My Bible is so Big and well used, there is no room for a gun in the car or in life! Try reading it and living it , then it becomes your life and not a prop.
Did you ask him why its so ugly?
😂😂😂😂
Talking to designers is invariably a waste of time
Why is that?
They create the car in many aspects. Your opinion seems a bit close-minded.
@@MJorgy5 I didn't say they weren't important. I said listening to them is a waste of time. They always talk about things like design language. They never say much that concrete. And remember if designers had their way, we would all have beautiful cars. But you wouldn't be able to get inside one. It wouldn't be able to carry anything.
@@kevinbarry71 THEY ARE DESIGNERS! WHAT DO YOU EXPECT HIM TO SAY? I AGREE, YOUR COMMENT IS CLOSE-MINDED!
@@jraheemjefcoat429 really? Because I don't want to hear what a designer has to say? You're an idiot.
Its changed for the worse sure better initial parts but after while they will break much worse than that old grand wagoneer and I guarantee the old one will still be around where the new one will be in a scrap yard because its a Chrysler and fiat junk.
The new Grand Wagoneer is so ugly and in no way has ANYTHING to do with the original. Nice BS talking about “vertical” design elements, oh you mean a dash goes from left to right WOW what a great legacy to carry on. You know how the Bronco and mustang actually shows a design lineage from the originals this thing doesn’t. The new Wagoneer is such let down to long time Jeep fans and how much time did the designer talk about how the original influence this one. He was just a car salesman. This unreliable, overpriced eyesore will be gone in 3 years. A Jeep over 100,000? Whatever and congratulations team Stellantis or Fiat or whatever it is now. Certainly not a Jeep.
i could see the 3 way design of the old and new incorporated and the wood from the interior.. but i dont see much else it looks like any other fancy grand cherokee or modern suv... The main thing that really bothers me though on the new one is the way the rear end looks.. it looks extremely bloated and like a mini van.. it has no design features at all
Never listen to a guy that works for fiat
"WAGONEER" the Grand Wagoneer was introduced in 1984 dude, that squid thing is for the floor vents... Man get a real car guy to do these videos those knobs were litterally on every older vehicle... That mystery thing on the console up top is for the electric door locks... smh... have you never seen an IF sensor before ? TBH i dont see many takes from the old one to the new one... The new one is also a bloated corpse.. the rear of the vehicle.. looks like a mini van.. it looks terrible
Why isn't Tommy, doing this? Roman is just awkward
Roman says fair enough as he feels the same way about your comment. Just so awkward and trolly.
@@TFLcar is Roman typing? 😂. Sorry bro... You just a dork. Your son is much less so and asks better questions. Pass the Torch 🔥
When is the L coming?
The old one… SPACE!
The dashboard is not trying to envelop you.
The glass.. old one wins! Positively claustrophobic new one.
I hate trend followers!
You can take your focus groups!
Wish they just put the new engine in the old body. Cars thee sus just don’t look or have any character. 😢
Burn the new one cuz it's a waste of resources.
Tell jeep those screens are to small and of you're going to luxury put messaging second and 3rd row step your game up and bring the track wagon to battle the the Escalade ESV