Hey guys, i have a great golden oldie for you today, much requested! The Fw 190 A-5, a true workhorse for the Luftwaffe, and considered by their pilots as reliable, well performing planes. In War Thunder It's quite unforgiving, but still good. Hope you enjoy, and do like, comment and Subscribe for more! Have a great day :)
Jengar another great video m8 a quick question for I'm finally gonna finish off the German plane tech tree but I've tried playing my FW-D13 premium and the plane its just a disgrace what they have done to it so I'm looking for a replacement to grind the rest of the tree with any suggestions? I've been thinking of the Tempest MK 5 would u rate that plane?
Welp Fw 190 was NOT really described positively by its german pilots for the strict TURN. Even American Mustang pilots said they were more scared of 109 because it was almost as maneuverable as Mustang, but 190 being less maneuverable even at high speeds. Still it was stable, little airplane, and most importantly, it was so nice because it did not suffer from 109’s terrible engine reliability issues while using a lot of throttle. And it was nicest rolling aircraft in the WW2. Spitfire wise tho.... they are still one of the best aircraft in terms of all-around maneuver, esp the ‘clipped wing’ ver. Just in case if you’d wonder, clipped wing LF. Mk Vb was almost as turn-able in low altitudes than normal wing span Spitfire, basically had the same roll rate as a Fw 190, and that Spitfire trademark-Climb!!!! So it was capable of knocking out an A6M3 Zeros in the Austrailian field. Anyway that might be my request #2. Spitfire F. Mk XVI pls...!!!! Nice turn at mid to high spd, one of the best climb rate at altitude below 2400~3000m, extremely nice roll rate even at stall speed, and that Spitfire controllability. Damn noice. I like even more than the LF. Mk IX. Anyway thats it for me :).. Always thnx for noice flying, videos, and, yup. Cheery Ho!
@@left_ventricle You gotta be joking. Spit MKXVI is the worst spit i got to so far. 190s just get away from you whenever they feel like it and 109s you never see except when they reenter the earths atmosphere. MkIX i love and can use. But MkXVI doesnt climb as well doesnt turn as well. And isnt much faster. Anyway thats just my experience.
John Smith That’s because you use it like a Mk IX. It’s the worst Spit for someone cause it shouldn’t turnfight at most times. It’s the best Spit for me cause it can E fight at higher speeds than any other Spit below 6.3. And I commented 11 months ago, when the Mk XVI still had an engine. So whatever your experience was, doesn’t represent my commentary as a joke. Hope you can one day use Mk XVI fluidly, and this requires a lot, a lot of experience regardless of the pilot’s skillbase. Enjoy then, and you can check out my channel as well. I have two matches in Tempest Mk V where I got to use its advantage: MER. Mk XVI shouldn’t turn cause its ‘dis’advantage is MER. Check out Adam514’s channel if you want to know ‘bout MER.
dont know if you guys cares but if you are bored like me atm then you can stream pretty much all the new movies on InstaFlixxer. Been binge watching with my gf for the last couple of weeks :)
Jengar, you missed the biggest problem of this plane, or at least you didn't quite understand it. At high speed, like you said it maintains roll and pitch authority quite well, but you didn't seem to mention yaw. It *has no freaking rudder* above 600kph, and begins locking at 500, to the point where it almost yaws the opposite direction at high speed. The instructor does a TERRIBLE job of compensating, which results in some weird high speed behavior and struggling to point the nose. 7:31 is a perfect example. As you make a small adjustment to the right, it yaws a tiny bit, then stops. No more yaw happens, but then you pull up and the plane suddenly matches it/hits your reticle. That's because you/the instructor can use roll angle and pitch (especially with takeoff flaps) to compensate for the lack of yaw. Then when you were lining up your shot, again you couldn't yaw. You pulled the reticle to the right, and in most planes, you'd apply some rudder and line up a perfect shot. But the FW has no rudder when it's going that fast. It is able to divert the nose a couple degrees, then hits a wall. So the instructor started to roll and hit the elevator to compensate (but didn't have quite enough pitch either), especially as you pulled hard right, but you were already losing your gun solution. By the time you got the nose where you wanted it, the P-51 was long gone. Any other decent BnZ plane, that would be an easy kill. With the 190, you essentially need to make movements like that using roll and pitch because of the dogshit rudder. (EDIT: Notice how much controllability improves at ~8:10, as your rudder control returns with the decrease in speed.) Here, you should have angled to the right and pulled up. However, that's not natural, and also *drastically* reduces your time on target, and because you need to use the keyboard, needs perfect timing to attain the right lead, and you only have that for a split second. You only have two vectors of control, instead of three, but the instructor acts like you still have all three. That is the problem with this plane. You just can't get guns on target at high speed, and it's infuriating. It's no coincidence that at ~500kph and below, your guns shredded anything in front of you. Those 4 20mm cannons with mineshells eat airframes for breakfast, but only if they actually hit their target. Go ahead, put this thing in a dive. As you approach 500kph, hit full rudder with Q or E, and take notice of how stiff it gets. Then keep doing this as you pass through 600, where it becomes incredibly difficult and you have to start using ailerons and elevator. As you hit 700, it becomes unusuable. You effectively have no rudder. The elevators are weaker than they were IRL, like you mentioned, and the rudder is just bullshit. Pilots, both German and test pilots with adversary planes, mention excellent control and light control forces at high speeds, especially when compared with the 109. They don't mention a weak or difficult rudder, but the 109 can kick the tail exponentially better at high speeds. This thing is a BnZ plane, but somehow doesn't have control at high speeds? I don't believe it.
AMEN!!! hit the nail right on the head with that post, its suppose to have amazing high speed and dive characteristics but it really doesn't, the sweet spot is right around 480-500, which is fast no doubt, but i wouldn't say fast enough to be regarded as the amazing Boom and Zoomer its suppose to be. Crossing my fingers one day it'll get fixed but not likely. Until then I'll just be rolling to set up my shots.
Thank you, THANK YOU for mentioning it. I noticed that the instructor problems with the rudder got an awful lot worse since 1.77. Yet you're the first one who says something. The whole 190 line (including both Ta's) is almost unflyable. The Butcher Bird irl was well, well liked by its pilots, and a fearsome adversary for pretty much any allied plane. But in WT its a joke. Probably not even that, since jokes are something that you laugh about. But i cannot laugh here.
Also top tip about the flaps. Don't deploy them above about 470km/h. Yes they may stay on but at that speed you'll start to find that the flaps divert airflow away from the elevators and you will actually turn worse than with flaps in. Also landing flaps rip at just above 300km/h IAS.
@@alexanderthegreat1356 I've been getting out-climbed by P47s for a few RB matches now and I just am not seeing where this plane shines. I know it's a B/Z, but what the hell can I do when I'm at 15000FT and still have guys over me. Not to mention it takes the entire map to get there because of how terribly this thing climbs. I'm supposed to be B/Z but I can't get above the guys I'm trying to kill and they end up B/Z on me. I can't even get my speed up because all my energy goes to evading, and before I know it they're off a mile above me again and proceed to come dive from an angle I can't even pitch to because of slow I am. Even if I tried to dive away, they're higher and will be faster than me. There's just no way out.
Sorry, Jengar, but I'm afraid you're mistaken when you said the FW 190 had good turning ability in real life. Well, it did, but only in a very specific envelope - that being high speeds. At low speeds it was as much of a brick as it is in game. When pilots said it had good maneuverability they were specifically talking about two things: 1. A great roll rate, which it has in game 2. Light and harmonized controls at high speeds. This is distinct from being a good low-speed turner. Having "light" control means that the pilot was able to maintain control surface authority at high speeds when the air flowing over the wing was enough to severely limit the amount of control surface deflection on other planes. The Bf 109 was a great example of this. It's not very well modeled in War Thunder but you can see this very clearly in IL-2. The 109 in IL-2 looses almost all elevator and aileron authority at high speeds, which limits its functional maximum speed to much below its true structural integrity limit. If you dive beyond a certain speed you have almost no control over your aircraft. The 190, however, is a complete different story. At high speeds, your ailerons and elevator remain very responsive. The reason why the 190 had light controls at high speeds and the 109 had heavy controls at high speeds was in the design of the elevator. The 190 has relatively small elevators for its size. Smaller elevators require less force to deflect than larger elevators. At slow speed, it isn't an issue for the pilot to apply this force to a large elevator. However, at high speeds, the air flowing over the ailerons or elevator means that a larger control surface requires much more force to deflect. (One of) The very things that made the 190 have such poor pitch authority at slow speed is what gave it great pitch authority at high speed. It was able to maintain its elevator authority at those speeds. The pilots describing the attributes of the 190 in WW2 had a different definition of "maneuverability" than people in War Thunder do (especially since they were limited to 6Gs whereas in War Thunder we can pull much more than that for extended periods of time). You will never see a pilot report describing the 190 as having a good turn rate/turn radius at low speed. There is no way an aircraft with such a high wingloading (the highest of any single-engined fighter in WW2 - higher than the P-47) would have good low-speed turning ability. The high wingloading of the FW 190 not only limits the amount of lift it has to convert into a turn, but it also means that it looses more speed in a turn than a lower-wingloading aircraft. This is reflected very well in-game. You can find historical documents online of tests that the Germans, British, US, and USSR did comparing turning performance of several planes including the FW 190. Here is just one, but there are many others. Report on Comparative Combat Evaluation of Focke-Wulf 190-A/4 Airplane: www.wwiiaircraftperformance.org/fw190/ptr-1107.pdf Pay special attention to sections d, e, and f, and g, which talk about control at varying speeds. Here are some quotes from this document that I think sum them up and their fighting style beautifully: "the best solution in offense is for the F4U-1 and F6F-3 to get the FW-190 to close with them so that advantage can be taken of their superior maneuverability, provided, of course, that any initial advantage in altitude is not sacrificed merely for the sake of closing." "If attacked by the FW-190, the F4U-1 and F6F-3 can evade by the use of tight turns. When followed by the FW-190 the F4U and F6F-3 can evade by the use of tight loops. If the FW-190 attempts to follow the other airplanes in tight loops it stalls out." "In general, whenever the hit-and-run technique cannot be employed, the F4U and F6F should make every effort to close with the FW-190, in both offense and defence."
dogeness Sure, that's fair, but it bricks up at high speeds too, *especially* the rudder(and to an extent the elevator). It should have the advantage over many planes there, and it doesn't. It simply loses all yaw authority above 550-600kph, and pitch suffers too. You can see this on full display in game, in diving attacks it simply cannot get its nose where you want it to get guns on target. For a BnZ plane famed for it's controllability and maneuverability at high speed, it's kinda crap. It's a brick when you try to use it how it was designed, which just seems wrong.
The rudder issue was present on ALL planes in WW2. So, really, it is realistic that the FW 190 has it in War Thunder. The problem is that Gaijin have only selectively applied this rudder stiffening to certain planes like the P-51, P-47, and FW 190 (among others) while neglecting it on most other planes. Really, all planes should have severe rudder lockup at high speeds. In real life (and in sim mode w/o instructor) pilots used ailerons and elevator to aim at high speeds. Rudder was rarely used. But In War Thunder we are used to hyper-accuracy from the instructor so people are suprised when a certain plane can't use its rudder at high speed. If War Thunder were more realistic then moving your mouse cursor to the side when traveling at high speed simply wouldn't induce any change, because there would be no yaw control. But in War Thunder the instructor will try to yaw the plane when it can't and thus does a wierd rolling-off-axis behavior which I don't fully understand. The rudder as a control surface is not designed for high-speed use. It is really intended for yaw control at low speed during landing and takeoff. This is why you can use it to hammerhead over when in a stall climb, whereas your ailerons are completely useless at such a slow speed. Rudders are useable below stall speed, whereas ailerons are not (by definition, really, since ailerons basically work by increasing/decreasing lift on one wing).
I have never experienced this problem with the P47s before, I don't play them very often either but they seem responsive all the way up to 700+kph, if not even faster than that.
P47's are one of the easiest and most straight forward planes to use in game. Judging from your profile pic, youre probably an american pilot who wants to keep getting easy kills on us fw190 fans hence all this shit youre talking.
fw190 struggles against p47s in terms of energy advantage, acceleration and rolling out of 50 cals is still a challenge because the thunderbolt can keep up in every way. Great video review on the fw190 anton and pointing out the stiff elevator (for climb rate) and the turn time definitely doesn't seem as realistic aand the lockup at high speeds really makes the top speed obsolete to boast about. (the i185 doesn't have lockup issues at high speed) One more important thing is to remember the role of the fw190 as an interceptor and to fly it as such, in which about every german fighters (even the bf109) is an bomber and fighter interceptor because they aren't as maneuverable as the spitfire and requires speed to gain separation after a pass. Fw190 excels in sim and arcade battles unfortunately, struggles alot in RB even to keep up against the perfomance of allies of the same and higher BR bracket.
Isaac Lee that's because it used to have a far more maneuverable flight model, which then got nerfed into the ground, but the BR wasn't changed. Then the elevator authority was improved somewhat a few patches ago, but it really still is quite subpar, especially for its BR.
I prefer the A8 instead of the A5 now. You face the same planes pretty much, and you get an air start. You still won’t be higher than the Spitfires and P47s but, at least you don’t have to side climb as long. The F8 seems like a better option also, but I love taking out the A5!
docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1hgHbWlSjefFhCqOUeGpoKQntdQDPG32X7XQo9EqDF00/edit#gid=809931065 That's a community MEC and climb speed chart (because the stat cards lie :P), but it includes top speeds at altitude, and I also made a copy for just the Antons, with a nice colorful graph. docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1sKsKWIERKAnQT4bQHYcikWuIG1xltaz6troBLR1wpnA/edit?usp=sharing It all boils down to this. F-8 is the fastest Anton between 3 and 5k, but outside of that the A-5/U2 is best. The A5(not even the U2) is comparable or better at most altitudes. At no point is the A-8 more than 4kph faster than the A-5, and under 3k, it is *always* slower. The F-8 when compared to the U2 is just kinda terrible in terms of speed, it has ~2kph on it for 2000m, then loses again. And the A-5/U2 is a full 1.0BR lower, it sits at the same BR as the A-4.
David Borgmeyer thanks for the information! I like to fly out the A5/U2 often! I have mine spaded and I find that the 4.3 BR is fair for it. I don’t see too many people fly it out. It only has two cannons but it seems to be more nimble than the other Antons, but maybe it’s just me.
Nope not just you, the A5U2 quickly became my 2nd favorite anton to fly, it lacks the 2 worthless mgs so it's lighter, performs better. Also 2 German 151 cannons is plenty of firepower, 4 is useful when bomber hunting but over kill for fighters
"Another One!" Yayyyuhhh~ I always pre-check the 'like' button even before your vid' starts because i will forget when its finished, and I know ima enjoy your vid' anyways. Achtung Jengarian Canidate!
Great video! I consider Fw 190 Antons, to be the prettiest propeller planes ever (mainly because they don't have any air intakes excluding main one in the nose, aesthetically pleasing proportions, and radial engine). Unfortunately i can't enjoy playing them as i enjoy flying in planes like c.205 serie 3 or A7M2. It's because i have to spend a lot of time climbing to even have a chance engaging enemies like p 47, which is boring. It's also caused by the issue with rolling off the center of axis even at lower speeds (i tried it with different fuel loads but that doesn't fix this). This very very often makes attacking enemies that evades you, impossible because the nose points in different direction than where you try to aim when you roll towards towards enemy, and the turn. It seems like you don't experience the issue with your nose not aiming where you aim in medium speeds, and i'm confused a bit. I'll try flying in Fw again.
Unfortunately the aircraft was great, but war thunder gives it an imaginary flight model. The A-1 through the A-5 all had climb rates of over 18 m/s, but in war thunder they dont come close to that. Also, test flights showed control stiffening was not significant at high speeds, but in war thunder it compresses significantly.
They really need to fix the elevator and the rudder already. Maybe give it an airspawn, too. A plane praised by both Allied and Axis pilots for its control harmony irl can barely dogfight in this game. -_-
Nice video. And nice patience too :-) Usuali I do not have nerves for "new" FM of Fw but when I do it is fun and rewarding. Why did they nerf all Fw line I still can't understan? To OP???
Moxie I guess the 190's were clubbing the shit out of cocky P-47 pilots, so they dumped its Flight Model into a dumpster fire, making it unable to use its rudder past 500 Kph, giving you the urge to rip out your very hair as the disfonctional rudder keeps you from perfectly lining up shots. I enjoy playing my A-5, its always great fun to use but this one thing infuriates me beyond comprehension, leading me to vent my frustration in my 109 F-4 (rip seals)
I just unlocked the A-5 and, at least stock, it feels terrible to fly to me. I unlocked it using the D-13 so of course it'll likely perform a bit worse, but I didn't expect it to be THIS much worse than what I was used to.
@@jengar6258 Ah that makes sense. Surprised that you replied, especially since the video is a year old! Hope you're having a good time with you're mother in law!
"DECENT MANEUVERABILITY" on a 190?! You what mate?! (BTW I am not annoyed, triggered, or salty, at least yet, I am just sorta of joking, but now I will get serious on the following) I spaded this overweight obese deathtrap bick, and this planes struggles SO much with BOTH the BR compression, AND the undertiered USA and UK fighters. BTW, before you call me a wheraboo, I am more of a "russian bias" guy, BUT, since the 50 cals buff I had to defect to NATO, and join the club fest with P-51's, F4U's, F6F's, P-47's, F-82, and EVEN P-38s! (But P-38's I don't have enough eperience with, they are strong planes from what I saw, but I can't yet say for sure if they are OP or not) And I also got some decent feel for the spitfires, and up to the F. Mk 9, they are hands down OP, on top of that, their performance continues to increase significantly at tier 4, with little draw backs, while the Yak's, for example have worse turn when equiped with VK-107 engines, than similar ones equiped with VK-105PF. Also note that even with this improvement in engine, the 5.7 Yak 9UT is worse in the vertical than the griffons. And I can say for certain that 50 cals are superior to NEARLY ALL the 20mm cannons, dealing similar damage to 3-4 cannons if the plane has at least 6x 50 cals, that on top of having more ammo per gun, AND being BY FAR easier to aim. And guess what? Nearly every USA fighter has 6x M2 50 cals, with exceptions being the first bearcat, with only 4, and lower tier ones, but most of those that have only 4x 50 cals have other armament in the form of cannon(S). Not to mention how STUPIDLY WELL P-51's, P-47's, F6F's, and F4U's are turning right now. This leaves very little weaknesses to be exploited, so they either need to be upped by BR, or to have their turns tweaked TO BE WORSE, don't confuse worse with better, Gaijilla, PLEASE
Rick Van Veluw why do you think that youtubers are Better than any other players we all have lags or mouse suddenly not working I once played and killed Slick bee and Oxy in tank rb
I know how to play FW 190 but I only play A-4 and D-9 other ones don't work for me and I think this plane is bad, you need to make it good and even after that it is still bad
![Dont get in front of this Plane! Fw 190 A-8 [War Thunder Realistic Review!]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/WqhPPyzshRE/mqdefault.jpg)
![Dont get in front of this Plane! Fw 190 A-8 [War Thunder Realistic Review!]](/img/tr.png)
![War Thunder Realistic: Bf 109 E-4 [The Beast Inside!]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/3-_iS0h9I78/mqdefault.jpg)
![Summer Walker - Heart Of A Woman [Official Lyric Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/SFddctbZzw8/mqdefault.jpg)
Hey guys, i have a great golden oldie for you today, much requested! The Fw 190 A-5, a true workhorse for the Luftwaffe, and considered by their pilots as reliable, well performing planes. In War Thunder It's quite unforgiving, but still good. Hope you enjoy, and do like, comment and Subscribe for more! Have a great day :)
Jengar another great video m8 a quick question for I'm finally gonna finish off the German plane tech tree but I've tried playing my FW-D13 premium and the plane its just a disgrace what they have done to it so I'm looking for a replacement to grind the rest of the tree with any suggestions? I've been thinking of the Tempest MK 5 would u rate that plane?
Welp Fw 190 was NOT really described positively by its german pilots for the strict TURN. Even American Mustang pilots said they were more scared of 109 because it was almost as maneuverable as Mustang, but 190 being less maneuverable even at high speeds. Still it was stable, little airplane, and most importantly, it was so nice because it did not suffer from 109’s terrible engine reliability issues while using a lot of throttle. And it was nicest rolling aircraft in the WW2.
Spitfire wise tho.... they are still one of the best aircraft in terms of all-around maneuver, esp the ‘clipped wing’ ver. Just in case if you’d wonder, clipped wing LF. Mk Vb was almost as turn-able in low altitudes than normal wing span Spitfire, basically had the same roll rate as a Fw 190, and that Spitfire trademark-Climb!!!! So it was capable of knocking out an A6M3 Zeros in the Austrailian field.
Anyway that might be my request #2.
Spitfire F. Mk XVI pls...!!!!
Nice turn at mid to high spd, one of the best climb rate at altitude below 2400~3000m, extremely nice roll rate even at stall speed, and that Spitfire controllability.
Damn noice. I like even more than the LF. Mk IX. Anyway thats it for me :)..
Always thnx for noice flying, videos, and, yup.
Cheery Ho!
@@left_ventricle You gotta be joking. Spit MKXVI is the worst spit i got to so far. 190s just get away from you whenever they feel like it and 109s you never see except when they reenter the earths atmosphere. MkIX i love and can use. But MkXVI doesnt climb as well doesnt turn as well. And isnt much faster. Anyway thats just my experience.
John Smith That’s because you use it like a Mk IX. It’s the worst Spit for someone cause it shouldn’t turnfight at most times. It’s the best Spit for me cause it can E fight at higher speeds than any other Spit below 6.3. And I commented 11 months ago, when the Mk XVI still had an engine.
So whatever your experience was, doesn’t represent my commentary as a joke. Hope you can one day use Mk XVI fluidly, and this requires a lot, a lot of experience regardless of the pilot’s skillbase.
Enjoy then, and you can check out my channel as well. I have two matches in Tempest Mk V where I got to use its advantage: MER. Mk XVI shouldn’t turn cause its ‘dis’advantage is MER. Check out Adam514’s channel if you want to know ‘bout MER.
dont know if you guys cares but if you are bored like me atm then you can stream pretty much all the new movies on InstaFlixxer. Been binge watching with my gf for the last couple of weeks :)
Jengar, you missed the biggest problem of this plane, or at least you didn't quite understand it.
At high speed, like you said it maintains roll and pitch authority quite well, but you didn't seem to mention yaw.
It *has no freaking rudder* above 600kph, and begins locking at 500, to the point where it almost yaws the opposite direction at high speed. The instructor does a TERRIBLE job of compensating, which results in some weird high speed behavior and struggling to point the nose.
7:31 is a perfect example. As you make a small adjustment to the right, it yaws a tiny bit, then stops. No more yaw happens, but then you pull up and the plane suddenly matches it/hits your reticle. That's because you/the instructor can use roll angle and pitch (especially with takeoff flaps) to compensate for the lack of yaw.
Then when you were lining up your shot, again you couldn't yaw. You pulled the reticle to the right, and in most planes, you'd apply some rudder and line up a perfect shot. But the FW has no rudder when it's going that fast. It is able to divert the nose a couple degrees, then hits a wall. So the instructor started to roll and hit the elevator to compensate (but didn't have quite enough pitch either), especially as you pulled hard right, but you were already losing your gun solution. By the time you got the nose where you wanted it, the P-51 was long gone. Any other decent BnZ plane, that would be an easy kill. With the 190, you essentially need to make movements like that using roll and pitch because of the dogshit rudder. (EDIT: Notice how much controllability improves at ~8:10, as your rudder control returns with the decrease in speed.)
Here, you should have angled to the right and pulled up. However, that's not natural, and also *drastically* reduces your time on target, and because you need to use the keyboard, needs perfect timing to attain the right lead, and you only have that for a split second. You only have two vectors of control, instead of three, but the instructor acts like you still have all three. That is the problem with this plane. You just can't get guns on target at high speed, and it's infuriating. It's no coincidence that at ~500kph and below, your guns shredded anything in front of you. Those 4 20mm cannons with mineshells eat airframes for breakfast, but only if they actually hit their target.
Go ahead, put this thing in a dive. As you approach 500kph, hit full rudder with Q or E, and take notice of how stiff it gets. Then keep doing this as you pass through 600, where it becomes incredibly difficult and you have to start using ailerons and elevator. As you hit 700, it becomes unusuable. You effectively have no rudder.
The elevators are weaker than they were IRL, like you mentioned, and the rudder is just bullshit. Pilots, both German and test pilots with adversary planes, mention excellent control and light control forces at high speeds, especially when compared with the 109. They don't mention a weak or difficult rudder, but the 109 can kick the tail exponentially better at high speeds. This thing is a BnZ plane, but somehow doesn't have control at high speeds? I don't believe it.
AMEN!!! hit the nail right on the head with that post, its suppose to have amazing high speed and dive characteristics but it really doesn't, the sweet spot is right around 480-500, which is fast no doubt, but i wouldn't say fast enough to be regarded as the amazing Boom and Zoomer its suppose to be. Crossing my fingers one day it'll get fixed but not likely. Until then I'll just be rolling to set up my shots.
Thank you, THANK YOU for mentioning it. I noticed that the instructor problems with the rudder got an awful lot worse since 1.77. Yet you're the first one who says something. The whole 190 line (including both Ta's) is almost unflyable. The Butcher Bird irl was well, well liked by its pilots, and a fearsome adversary for pretty much any allied plane. But in WT its a joke. Probably not even that, since jokes are something that you laugh about. But i cannot laugh here.
thank you and take by sub
How is it now? Did the fix the elevator authority?
@@asiftalpur3758 no, it still has no rudder at high speeds
Also top tip about the flaps. Don't deploy them above about 470km/h. Yes they may stay on but at that speed you'll start to find that the flaps divert airflow away from the elevators and you will actually turn worse than with flaps in. Also landing flaps rip at just above 300km/h IAS.
UKoctane yeah I have noticed that too.
Did they not fix fw-s compression problem when taking min fuel?
Have not played the game for a while
Is this tip still true?
One of the hardest planes to fly in WT imho
Nah man, not really, unless you're not patient and disciplined. My K/D is ridiculously good in this plane.
[] Arlkaj [] Do-335 says hi, I honestly can't make it work.
It also turns horribly.
[] Arlkaj [] really? I have a good k/d with it.
@@alexanderthegreat1356 I've been getting out-climbed by P47s for a few RB matches now and I just am not seeing where this plane shines. I know it's a B/Z, but what the hell can I do when I'm at 15000FT and still have guys over me. Not to mention it takes the entire map to get there because of how terribly this thing climbs. I'm supposed to be B/Z but I can't get above the guys I'm trying to kill and they end up B/Z on me. I can't even get my speed up because all my energy goes to evading, and before I know it they're off a mile above me again and proceed to come dive from an angle I can't even pitch to because of slow I am. Even if I tried to dive away, they're higher and will be faster than me. There's just no way out.
omg, finaly! My fav of the Focke Wulf tree
spitfire tried to headon me, spitfire is no more
Sorry, Jengar, but I'm afraid you're mistaken when you said the FW 190 had good turning ability in real life. Well, it did, but only in a very specific envelope - that being high speeds. At low speeds it was as much of a brick as it is in game.
When pilots said it had good maneuverability they were specifically talking about two things:
1. A great roll rate, which it has in game
2. Light and harmonized controls at high speeds. This is distinct from being a good low-speed turner. Having "light" control means that the pilot was able to maintain control surface authority at high speeds when the air flowing over the wing was enough to severely limit the amount of control surface deflection on other planes. The Bf 109 was a great example of this. It's not very well modeled in War Thunder but you can see this very clearly in IL-2. The 109 in IL-2 looses almost all elevator and aileron authority at high speeds, which limits its functional maximum speed to much below its true structural integrity limit. If you dive beyond a certain speed you have almost no control over your aircraft. The 190, however, is a complete different story. At high speeds, your ailerons and elevator remain very responsive.
The reason why the 190 had light controls at high speeds and the 109 had heavy controls at high speeds was in the design of the elevator. The 190 has relatively small elevators for its size. Smaller elevators require less force to deflect than larger elevators. At slow speed, it isn't an issue for the pilot to apply this force to a large elevator. However, at high speeds, the air flowing over the ailerons or elevator means that a larger control surface requires much more force to deflect. (One of) The very things that made the 190 have such poor pitch authority at slow speed is what gave it great pitch authority at high speed. It was able to maintain its elevator authority at those speeds.
The pilots describing the attributes of the 190 in WW2 had a different definition of "maneuverability" than people in War Thunder do (especially since they were limited to 6Gs whereas in War Thunder we can pull much more than that for extended periods of time). You will never see a pilot report describing the 190 as having a good turn rate/turn radius at low speed. There is no way an aircraft with such a high wingloading (the highest of any single-engined fighter in WW2 - higher than the P-47) would have good low-speed turning ability. The high wingloading of the FW 190 not only limits the amount of lift it has to convert into a turn, but it also means that it looses more speed in a turn than a lower-wingloading aircraft. This is reflected very well in-game.
You can find historical documents online of tests that the Germans, British, US, and USSR did comparing turning performance of several planes including the FW 190. Here is just one, but there are many others.
Report on Comparative Combat Evaluation of Focke-Wulf 190-A/4 Airplane: www.wwiiaircraftperformance.org/fw190/ptr-1107.pdf
Pay special attention to sections d, e, and f, and g, which talk about control at varying speeds.
Here are some quotes from this document that I think sum them up and their fighting style beautifully:
"the best solution in offense is for the F4U-1 and F6F-3 to get the FW-190 to close with them so that advantage can be taken of their superior maneuverability, provided, of course, that any initial advantage in altitude is not sacrificed merely for the sake of closing."
"If attacked by the FW-190, the F4U-1 and F6F-3 can evade by the use of tight turns. When followed by the FW-190 the F4U and F6F-3 can evade by the use of tight loops. If the FW-190 attempts to follow the other airplanes in tight loops it stalls out."
"In general, whenever the hit-and-run technique cannot be employed, the F4U and F6F should make every effort to close with the FW-190, in both offense and defence."
dogeness Sure, that's fair, but it bricks up at high speeds too, *especially* the rudder(and to an extent the elevator). It should have the advantage over many planes there, and it doesn't. It simply loses all yaw authority above 550-600kph, and pitch suffers too. You can see this on full display in game, in diving attacks it simply cannot get its nose where you want it to get guns on target. For a BnZ plane famed for it's controllability and maneuverability at high speed, it's kinda crap. It's a brick when you try to use it how it was designed, which just seems wrong.
The rudder issue was present on ALL planes in WW2. So, really, it is realistic that the FW 190 has it in War Thunder. The problem is that Gaijin have only selectively applied this rudder stiffening to certain planes like the P-51, P-47, and FW 190 (among others) while neglecting it on most other planes. Really, all planes should have severe rudder lockup at high speeds. In real life (and in sim mode w/o instructor) pilots used ailerons and elevator to aim at high speeds. Rudder was rarely used. But In War Thunder we are used to hyper-accuracy from the instructor so people are suprised when a certain plane can't use its rudder at high speed. If War Thunder were more realistic then moving your mouse cursor to the side when traveling at high speed simply wouldn't induce any change, because there would be no yaw control. But in War Thunder the instructor will try to yaw the plane when it can't and thus does a wierd rolling-off-axis behavior which I don't fully understand.
The rudder as a control surface is not designed for high-speed use. It is really intended for yaw control at low speed during landing and takeoff. This is why you can use it to hammerhead over when in a stall climb, whereas your ailerons are completely useless at such a slow speed. Rudders are useable below stall speed, whereas ailerons are not (by definition, really, since ailerons basically work by increasing/decreasing lift on one wing).
I have never experienced this problem with the P47s before, I don't play them very often either but they seem responsive all the way up to 700+kph, if not even faster than that.
P-47s have no such problem, and it's minimal on the P-51. Admittedly it's kinda nasty on the F4U, but it just *cripples* the FW 190.
P47's are one of the easiest and most straight forward planes to use in game. Judging from your profile pic, youre probably an american pilot who wants to keep getting easy kills on us fw190 fans hence all this shit youre talking.
fw190 struggles against p47s in terms of energy advantage, acceleration and rolling out of 50 cals is still a challenge because the thunderbolt can keep up in every way. Great video review on the fw190 anton and pointing out the stiff elevator (for climb rate) and the turn time definitely doesn't seem as realistic aand the lockup at high speeds really makes the top speed obsolete to boast about. (the i185 doesn't have lockup issues at high speed) One more important thing is to remember the role of the fw190 as an interceptor and to fly it as such, in which about every german fighters (even the bf109) is an bomber and fighter interceptor because they aren't as maneuverable as the spitfire and requires speed to gain separation after a pass. Fw190 excels in sim and arcade battles unfortunately, struggles alot in RB even to keep up against the perfomance of allies of the same and higher BR bracket.
Isaac Lee that's because it used to have a far more maneuverable flight model, which then got nerfed into the ground, but the BR wasn't changed. Then the elevator authority was improved somewhat a few patches ago, but it really still is quite subpar, especially for its BR.
I prefer the A8 instead of the A5 now. You face the same planes pretty much, and you get an air start. You still won’t be higher than the Spitfires and P47s but, at least you don’t have to side climb as long. The F8 seems like a better option also, but I love taking out the A5!
docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1hgHbWlSjefFhCqOUeGpoKQntdQDPG32X7XQo9EqDF00/edit#gid=809931065
That's a community MEC and climb speed chart (because the stat cards lie :P), but it includes top speeds at altitude, and I also made a copy for just the Antons, with a nice colorful graph. docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1sKsKWIERKAnQT4bQHYcikWuIG1xltaz6troBLR1wpnA/edit?usp=sharing
It all boils down to this. F-8 is the fastest Anton between 3 and 5k, but outside of that the A-5/U2 is best. The A5(not even the U2) is comparable or better at most altitudes. At no point is the A-8 more than 4kph faster than the A-5, and under 3k, it is *always* slower. The F-8 when compared to the U2 is just kinda terrible in terms of speed, it has ~2kph on it for 2000m, then loses again. And the A-5/U2 is a full 1.0BR lower, it sits at the same BR as the A-4.
David Borgmeyer thanks for the information! I like to fly out the A5/U2 often! I have mine spaded and I find that the 4.3 BR is fair for it. I don’t see too many people fly it out. It only has two cannons but it seems to be more nimble than the other Antons, but maybe it’s just me.
Nope not just you, the A5U2 quickly became my 2nd favorite anton to fly, it lacks the 2 worthless mgs so it's lighter, performs better. Also 2 German 151 cannons is plenty of firepower, 4 is useful when bomber hunting but over kill for fighters
shaggydog 47 I think the U12 and the F8 would be better at 4.3 BR and move the German p47 up to 4.7 or 5.0.
"Another One!" Yayyyuhhh~ I always pre-check the 'like' button even before your vid' starts because i will forget when its finished, and I know ima enjoy your vid' anyways. Achtung Jengarian Canidate!
Now this plane is quite nice , especially in defensive flying
F O K K E H W U L F
UKoctane THE BIAS THATS INSIDE
Been really trying to get into the 190 lately, this really helps
@ Not really. I haven't played it enough yet to be satisfied in giving anyone advice.
@ I can confidently say that it performs in the BnZ role well, yes.
I love the 190, although I have suspected WT has tweeted down certain aspects of the plane, the firepower is ruthless!
indeed!
Shreds anything in front
War thunder literally made german planes terrible compared to reality.
But how do you deal withe the P47's group of space ships? I have noticed a huge influx of P 47 seal clubbing lately.
And they still are a year later.
The destroyer of...
Well basically anything that fucks up against it
Great video!
I consider Fw 190 Antons, to be the prettiest propeller planes ever (mainly because they don't have any air intakes excluding main one in the nose, aesthetically pleasing proportions, and radial engine).
Unfortunately i can't enjoy playing them as i enjoy flying in planes like c.205 serie 3 or A7M2. It's because i have to spend a lot of time climbing to even have a chance engaging enemies like p 47, which is boring.
It's also caused by the issue with rolling off the center of axis even at lower speeds (i tried it with different fuel loads but that doesn't fix this).
This very very often makes attacking enemies that evades you, impossible because the nose points in different direction than where you try to aim when you roll towards towards enemy, and the turn.
It seems like you don't experience the issue with your nose not aiming where you aim in medium speeds, and i'm confused a bit.
I'll try flying in Fw again.
The Fw 190A-8, or D-9 with that humongous V inline, are superior, but this model of the Walger still kicks arse
Awesome video and awesome plane!
Exellent video gotta say: was about time, I had issues with the A-5 from some time
Well, it is definitely a plane you have to learn. No hopping in and going
it got that *petite* elevator
What should I get the fw 190 series' of Bf 109 series'
Unfortunately the aircraft was great, but war thunder gives it an imaginary flight model. The A-1 through the A-5 all had climb rates of over 18 m/s, but in war thunder they dont come close to that. Also, test flights showed control stiffening was not significant at high speeds, but in war thunder it compresses significantly.
My favourite plane :D
she's a beast ;)
i saw the 190 thumb nail and was like Ayyy :D
They really need to fix the elevator and the rudder already. Maybe give it an airspawn, too. A plane praised by both Allied and Axis pilots for its control harmony irl can barely dogfight in this game. -_-
try fw190 F8 without payload, is pretty nice.
on my list :)
I love the doras. So good
This plane is a god of heads on's
Literally in this I have never lost a head on lol
Damn, I wish I could fly as well as you can...
Although I'm not a big fan of the FW190A's, I can't really argue with the guns.
Hey Jengar, I find since patch 1.77 its flight model has improved ..do you agree?
The A4 is much better in Air RB. It has a 4.3 and it differs with almost nothing
A4 has a weaker engine compared to the a5
Much better now
Haha that was funny how that spitfire just kinda landed
May I recommend a video about either the F-86F-30 or the MiG-17?
All you haters out there talking down about the a 5 I play on PS4 and the thing is bad ass I do just fine with it
a-5 is a great plane :)
Love the massive firepower! 4 x 20 mm can rip off anything, even those OP russian bombers!
OP is exactly right
Nice video.
And nice patience too :-)
Usuali I do not have nerves for "new" FM of Fw but when I do it is fun and rewarding.
Why did they nerf all Fw line I still can't understan? To OP???
Moxie I guess the 190's were clubbing the shit out of cocky P-47 pilots, so they dumped its Flight Model into a dumpster fire, making it unable to use its rudder past 500 Kph, giving you the urge to rip out your very hair as the disfonctional rudder keeps you from perfectly lining up shots. I enjoy playing my A-5, its always great fun to use but this one thing infuriates me beyond comprehension, leading me to vent my frustration in my 109 F-4 (rip seals)
I just unlocked the A-5 and, at least stock, it feels terrible to fly to me. I unlocked it using the D-13 so of course it'll likely perform a bit worse, but I didn't expect it to be THIS much worse than what I was used to.
the fw's stock are quite terrible indeed. One needs to persevere ;)
Dude in the A-4 at a 4.7 br I have no trouble on head ons and turn fights but with the A-5 I had terrible luck and it's 1/4 maxed
Yeah, my fully upgraded A-4 actually flies better than my nearly stock A-5
Love that skin, is it a reward skin or custom? (if so link pls)
for the turn with the help of elevator is abit stiff and it cannot turn tightly
I could never get the fw line to work for me. Compared to the 109s, this is pretty difficult to fly.
I used to be really good with this plane, but I can't do good in it anymore. I don't know what happened.
when were you good in it last? and if you took a break, how long was it?
@@jengar6258 probably about a year or a year and a half ago was the last time I was good.
Is difficult because you have to be pacient.
And some people in WT don't like that
true that.
What is the difference between this and an A4?
Rezistor87 here, hello :)
Why was there a F4F in the beginning of the match?
someone uptiered it by flying with a mate with a higher br.
@@jengar6258 Ah that makes sense. Surprised that you replied, especially since the video is a year old! Hope you're having a good time with you're mother in law!
Whats up with German elevators being so horrible, literally the do 271 turns better XD
Take 45 mins in the 190
MixedChannel Game Productions the D series is even worse I m suffering in the Brick 190 d9
MixedChannel Game Productions listen thoams guy
Not really, In my case was easy, bf109 g2 was more difficult to learn to use, at the end my ratio of K/D in fw is 2/1 but in bf109 is 0-1/2
@@edgaralexander1998 g2 trop is brain dead easy mate what are you on about
A TRUE Bruiser! The German answer to the US Muscle Car!!
Btw jengar where you from I'm from Finland
no . 4 era combat is aerio. Nerf max . Aerio death.
who what where?
Hi, alt cobat plis.
how about english?
"DECENT MANEUVERABILITY" on a 190?! You what mate?!
(BTW I am not annoyed, triggered, or salty, at least yet, I am just sorta of joking, but now I will get serious on the following)
I spaded this overweight obese deathtrap bick, and this planes struggles SO much with BOTH the BR compression, AND the undertiered USA and UK fighters.
BTW, before you call me a wheraboo, I am more of a "russian bias" guy, BUT, since the 50 cals buff I had to defect to NATO, and join the club fest with P-51's, F4U's, F6F's, P-47's, F-82, and EVEN P-38s! (But P-38's I don't have enough eperience with, they are strong planes from what I saw, but I can't yet say for sure if they are OP or not)
And I also got some decent feel for the spitfires, and up to the F. Mk 9, they are hands down OP, on top of that, their performance continues to increase significantly at tier 4, with little draw backs, while the Yak's, for example have worse turn when equiped with VK-107 engines, than similar ones equiped with VK-105PF. Also note that even with this improvement in engine, the 5.7 Yak 9UT is worse in the vertical than the griffons.
And I can say for certain that 50 cals are superior to NEARLY ALL the 20mm cannons, dealing similar damage to 3-4 cannons if the plane has at least 6x 50 cals, that on top of having more ammo per gun, AND being BY FAR easier to aim. And guess what? Nearly every USA fighter has 6x M2 50 cals, with exceptions being the first bearcat, with only 4, and lower tier ones, but most of those that have only 4x 50 cals have other armament in the form of cannon(S).
Not to mention how STUPIDLY WELL P-51's, P-47's, F6F's, and F4U's are turning right now.
This leaves very little weaknesses to be exploited, so they either need to be upped by BR, or to have their turns tweaked TO BE WORSE, don't confuse worse with better, Gaijilla, PLEASE
Is this a real plane in real life or made up plane ?
a real one.
ruclips.net/video/PviNlOwihIw/видео.html
A real one and it was deadly
Jengar next time dont crash Into the ground when you try to chase me while i am in a spitfire
Rick Van Veluw why do you think that youtubers are Better than any other players we all have lags or mouse suddenly not working I once played and killed Slick bee and Oxy in tank rb
The Fw190 could out turn the Bf109 at any speed :,(
not really no.
Oh well... Still my favorate plane in the world :P
FIRST!!!!!
6 Th like
That plane is bad
George George, It takes time to master. Green Fury has some interesting tutorials for 190. With practice, It can lure Spits to bad situation and win.
FW190 is an incredible aircraft it just has a very different playstyle.
I know how to play FW 190 but I only play A-4 and D-9 other ones don't work for me and I think this plane is bad, you need to make it good and even after that it is still bad
UKoctane I like your content btw
jovaan romans by that logic nothing is bad just stuff that are harder to fly, we are saying the same thing but in a different way