The Shroud of Rahmon • S02E08 • TPN’s Angel Guide
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- Опубликовано: 30 дек 2020
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Music Credits:
Opening Theme
Wil Hughes
www.wilhughes.com/
Clips from
Buffy the Vampire Slayer
Angel the Series
The Twilight Zone
Who's Afraid of Virginia Wolf?
The Good Place
Passion of the Nerd reviews The Shroud of Rahmon. From Angel, Season 2, Episode 8. Written by Jim Kouf. Directed by David Grossman. Starring David Boreanaz as Angel. Charisma Carpenter as Cordelia Chase. Alexis Denisof as Wesley Wyndam-Pryce. And J. August Richards as Charles Gunn. And Julie Benz as Darla.
#angeltheseries #davidboreanaz #charismacarpenter 
Развлечения
"How do you know that the new year is any better than this?"
"Because it has to be."
Last video of 2020. Cheers, Ian. 🥂
That was beautiful
*smashes crystal on table
I had that exact conversation with my wife.
And joss whedon is a pervert freak bully who got kicked off his pedestal and now POTN is probably working his 2021 arse off on some response.
@@Laroling That was so necessary. Truly you are a great person for saying so.
Wesley: The shroud was woven by the head priest said to have been driven mad by the demon himself. Once Rahmon was defeated the priest dyed the shroud with the blood of 7 virgin women sacrificed on the first full moon then laid it upon Rahmon's body in order to prevent his resurrection.
Cordelia: Why is it always virgin women who have to do the sacrificing?
Wesley: For purity, I suppose.
Cordelia: This has nothing to do with purity. This is all about dominance, buddy. You can bet if someone ordered a male body part for religious sacrifice the world would be atheist *snaps fingers* like that.
I did always wonder that Cordelia had never heard of circumcision.
Love her
@@menachemsalomon Ah yes. A little bit of skin is definitely comparable to female lives.
@@menachemsalomon those things are simply not comparable. a bit of skin vs a life?
@@trollingmermaids I'm not suggesting they are. But Cordelia says, "male body part" so she's technically wrong.
“Kate does her Kate thing” is just a perfect description of Kates character
Kate added absolutely nothing
Episode is happening. It's great. Kate is also there.
@@oliviamackenzie9725 that's how i feel about literally all the times I've watched except the first time because I just thought she was bada*s and cheered for her.
...my parents were just looking at me so strangely
Her thing being blaming Angel for all her problems and acting like he's responsible for supernatural creatures being in LA.
Rip Cordy's hair - the most tragic thing about Season 2
I had gigs on a few episodes and felt the same but it is better than the blonde streaks.
Spoilers, but it gets worse.
Cordelia's haircut is worse than when Buffy got bangs
Charisma's hair...baby no. Though her "My teeth are so big" line never fails to make me smile.
Speaking of, "You're a girl" is my favorite running gag. I like to think you throw those in for me.
I love David’s extremely broad characters like Jaydon and Herb Saunders. It accents Angel’s flair for being dramatic (explored recently already with the fake Swami in Guise Will Be Guise) and lets the actor have some fun too. It’s really out of character while being really *in character* too. I think it works but I could see how some would find it irritating.
Oooh! I never made that connection between Angel feeding off Buffy, leaving and going it alone, then feeding off Kate and his later s2 arc. Bravo, Ian 👏👏👏 Even when you're not really into an episode, you pull out something awesome
Oh my gosh yes!! I didn't either!
I'm getting aggressively more excited for you to get to the 'darla and drusilla have a deeply sapphic little holiday' portion of Angel s2, I *hope* you keep in that clip of dru stroking lilah's face in episode ten because it's one of my all-time favourites
I love David's broad comedy - it's SO anti-Angel but it always works for me in a very particular way. His deadpan, "I'm a funny guy" moments are exactly what we expect Angel's humour to be. Did this episode work perfectly? No. Is Kate's shtick getting old? Yes. Will I always like Guise, and other S2 breathers/one-offs better? Also yes. But see, I was like, 12-16 when Angel first aired; 90% of the show's darkness, themes and ambitions were lost on me, so I appreciate all the breather episodes more every time I rewatch. Even the clunky ones.
Happy New Year, Ian!
Ngl I completely and totally forgot this episode existed
This version of Kate isn't "a little tedious", she's a LOT tedious, and downright obnoxious. I think one of the show's big failures is how it took a promising character in Kate Lockley and totally ran her into the ground and made her absolutely unlikeable.
Yeah, she was actually my favorite secondary character and I really loved her, i think they could've done a lot better with her character arc
And what's horrifying is they could have ruined her even more than this. Originally, they were going to have her be *SPOILER ALERT* Holtz's apprentice in Season 3, but Elisabeth Röhm was unavailable so the character of Justine was created. Good thing, since as obnoxious and unlikable Kate got, I still think she at least departed on a good note, and so this plot line would have just made her worse, and it would have been downright creepy.
@@fiction5559 Didn't know that. That being said, thank God she got the role in Law and Order and left the show
And I shipped them so hard too
I don’t think she ever worked especially well. Kate was a growing pain that thankfully the show eventually shed.
What?!?! This is the episode that shows how even Gunn trusts Angel to do what's right. How can you say it's not an important episode?
I actually like Kate, she had potential, I got sad when she just vanished
I love David in this episode... and no... I will not apologize for it.
(Also I kinda got sick of Kate at this point)
I love him in this one too!
I don't see what is wrong with filler episodes. This episode is a lot of fun!
Thank you!!! I love this episode not for the quality but for the simple fun it brings!
Slippin’ it in under the wire, huh? Here’s to more vids in 2021!
I actually really like that haircut, though charisma looks great in any style
I agree; she was cute. I didn't like her hair in some later season, though. When she got beamed up.
The S5 Angel ep about "The Immortal" is maybe the funniest single episode in the Buffyverse.
Smile Time would like a word.
I like the new... style of writing. You seem more confident with your opinions, and I love the wry humor. Great work. Meh episode, but great work, Ian.
I hope it brings you joy like it does when I see your notifications pop up.
Why am I a yellow nerd now? Also: bad YT, I left a comment before watching.
i agree. there's something different and i like it! also, the flair next to ur name changes the longer you are a member :))))
2021 New Year Philosophy: If nothing we do matters, then all that matters is what we do.
I suppose that it is implied in a later episode that Angel knew the Rat Pack, so he might draw on his old friends when he picks on a character to go undercover as.
Yeah, Angel's J Don sucks. But I love Herb Saunders, Baltimore.
Because none of the characters buy it.
"It was the hat, wasn't it? The hat was too much."
I...THINK I like Herb Saunders? I don't know. I go back and forth. My problem is less the performance not being funny (it IS funny) but 'broad' just feeling bizarre on Angel. Might be why Pratt Fall Wes drives me nuts. I'm trying to think of the times Buffy felt too broad and the one that comes specifically to mind is the poofy electric shock hair gag in Buffy Season 4 when they were turning off Spike's tracking chip. That feels very Herb Saunders'y to me too.
@@PassionoftheNerd I lump all those in with the show not taking itself too seriously. Like Spike taking that brick to the face in The Gift. "No, it's not clear."
The last 10 seconds of this video blew my mind. I never put two and two together like that. I laughed and gasped. Excellent pacing in your delivery!
I completely forgot The Shroud of Rahmon ever happened until watching this video I know I've watched it multiple times but I just can't remember it
it's sort of funny how in this episode, Angel sets fire to something that is making him go crazy and turn bad, and in Redefinition he does the same thing to Darla and Dru who are also making him crazy and turning him bad
That last line just completely did it for me
I discovered Angel in season 2, this was I think the first episode I ever saw. I kind of love it, even if it's not actually that good.
Speaking of Candyman. What happens if a vampire looks in a mirror and says “Candyman” five times?
He gets stabbed by his brother Worf.
He sees the daughter of the Family of Blood?
This leads to Candyman crashing full speed with the mirror and getting knocked out
Kate's not afraid of Angel at this point, she just doesn't like him and sees that he might have an edge to him. It's like Giles holding the crossbow on him in Amends.
Giles is pretty damn afraid of angel I would think at that point too...Tortured him for hours and killed his gf. Seems to be a fair point of fear.
@@userasdf I don't think he's afraid (otherwise he wouldn't invite him in at all). Angry? Yes. Cautious? yes, but those aren't the same things.
@@user-do2ev2hr7h why do you assume fear means you wouldn't take any risks at all? You can be afraid and still function. Him just "not liking him" seems like a level of petty we don't see from giles.
@@userasdf Considering Angel murdered Giles' girlfriend, staged the body in his apartment for added cruelty and tortured him for hours, I don't think Giles being angry over that is anything close to petty, He knew that he wasn't in any actual danger from Angel at that point, he was just making a point that things weren't all good between them, exactly as Kate was here. He's clearly perfectly comfortable around Angel in subsequent episodes, so I really don't get a "fear" vibe.
That better not be a future slight against The Girl in Question because I love that ep
It's a great episode, but poorly placed in the lineup.
@@spangelicious837 TGiQ could've been a handful of episodes earlier and would have better served the arc.
As a side note, I just finished watching Angel for the first time a couple of days ago and the acting by you-know-who opposite Wesley in that episode was legitimately jaw-dropping.
it’s been a few months since your last upload so i hope you know you still have people here excited for the next one
this is one of my candy episodes :)
I have always had a hard time with the trope of the criminals who plan an elaborate heist/crime without any of the people ever meeting each other. Apparently not a single member of the gang has ever seen another member of the gang in person. Did they plan the entire heist over email?
Seems like a good way to leave a trail of evidence behind that will get you caught if you ask me.
I kind of love this episode. It's campy and full of it, but that's half the fun for me. Also seeing Angel's acting, which is notably better than his singing!
Ian, i just finished my first ever watch of angel. i was watching your guides after each ep until i ran out and missed them greatly afterwards. i am deep in my feelings after the finale and so excited to have your guides help me slowly process. thanks for getting me through the start of the show, watching it has made me a better person. happy 2021!
3:24 oh god if you're going to say in four years that you don't like Girl in Question I don't even know what I'll do with myself, that episode is AMAZING
BtVS S6 SPOILERS
I prefer the 'how we got here' trope when the opening scene jumps back in the middle of the climax.
Angel acting is always entertaining.
I don't think Kate is afraid of him so much as showing another side to her prejudice nature she has already shown with Gunn, which is why the character comes of as tedious. I love how it is described that her character is that way because without screen time dedicated to her issues while away from the group, that is how she could come across to people. I feel the same way even with the main character of Xander. Without screen time dedicated to his family (until S6's _Hell's Bells_ or Jesse's death), his anger and jealousy issues come across very much in the same vein as Kate's dead father issues (Xander should take his own advice on the clip of him from 9:26-9:28). You understand, but it is not quite enough to sympathize the way you want to.
I 100% agree that with the Buffyverse, episodes can become more entertaining upon rewatches.
I always assumed the guard was just assuming he felt the shroud's power and his paranoia and/or hype were playing into what he assumed was supposed to be happening. Cordelia, to me was just acting like her BtVS S1 self when there is no one around to bully and if that version of her was loopy.
I love Cordelia's diatribe about women also.
I always liked the fact that they worked the disaster of a haircut Charisma had into the script by having Angel and Wesley not know what to say.
They do make it seem like it has been a long time since Angel has drank blood from a living human, but BtVS's _Graduation Day Part 2_ was only a year and a half earlier. I don't think Angel drinking from Buffy was the reason he left for LA though. I think The Mayor just told him what he had been trying to ignore and over the course of that season, it was becoming harder to do.
I agree with your take about Angel in Buffy season 3. I always felt that he was planning to leave even before the events of Graduation Day. Maybe he felt that he could finally leave, now that Faith and the Mayor were gone?
I love these episode guide videos. I always stop what I'm doing to watch them as soon as I see they're out. Thank you for doing them :)
Excellent commentary as usual. Thanks for doing what you do. Love your work and look forward to seeing more Buffy and Angel verse in the coming, well, this year. Thanks again.
I can not wait for episode 10's guide. that is my favorite episode of season 2
The connection that you made at the end was amazing!
so here's like lol
The episode isn't fantastic but I could never call it skippable. I can't lie, it's just so much FUN, it's definitely one of my top candy episodes of Angel
One thing about this episode is that once again at the end of the episode, Cordy & Wes discuss Angel biting Kate & that the shenanigans leading up to it may have awaken Angel's bloodlust. Angel drinking human blood again has been teased since the first season leading into season two ultimately going nowhere every time & never mentioned again.
''The Succubus Club - David Fury & Tim Minear Interview''. This was an interesting interview after season 4 on youtube. One question was would Lilah be back in season 5 and they assured the interviewer she would.
Yaay! Thank you Ian, Happy New year!!
So glad you're back
Ian, TELL ME YOU DIDN'T JUST DISS THE GIRL IN QUESTION
THAT WAS MY REACTION, GIRL IN QUESTION ABSOLUTELY ROCKS
@@EmoBearRights TAKE IT BACK
it’s a fine episode out of sequence but it COMPLETELY DERAILS THE FLOW OF THE ARC LEADING UP TO THE FINALE 😭 a lot more could and should have been done with that time
@@EmoBearRights u are
@@EmoBearRights I think it has some comedic moments and the flashbacks are kind of funny but yeah, as a whole, it sucked due to Angel's and Spike's sudden character regression and Andrew the creep, who I hate with a passion.
The pt when angel and Gunn on the hitting was🤣😂 ridiculous and when punched😖😂lol!!!
Ah, yes, the episode that marks the beginning of the end of Cordie's hair. 😂 (Until You're Welcome, when it comes back with a vengeance.)
I actually like that Kate didn't join Team Angel. It made things more interesting (if sometimes infuriating).
I LOVE all your videos!!! Happy new year!!!
Loved your lighthearted take on this episode of which I completely forgot about.
Always worth the wait
Oh, what a great New Years Surprise
I enjoy this episode I know it's not everyone's fav but I love the play off of angel and gunns characters
Thank you so much for making my NYE better.
"The last time Angel drank human blood......OOOOHHHHH!!!?" 🤣😂🤣😂
Lovely as usual.
love the videos Ian
Love ya Ian!!! Keep up with your amazing self dude!! 🌿✨
Have a great New Years, Peach.
@@PassionoftheNerd Ty very much!!! You too!! Watching your videos, I showed my mum your channel as I've gotten her into Buffy recently, I find watching you and Jess spending time also very enjoyable!! 🌿😊🍀✨ Much love to ya dude!!
A little late but have to add I see this episode as kind of tease/foreshadowing of what will happen in episode 10-12 (and maybe even a little later): an outside force inducing death & madness on Angel and his enemies/friends (the Shroud & Darla), Angel himself convinced he knows alone how to destroy & needs to do it alone, the burning of the shroud = burning of Darla & Dru, Kate’s takeout death = Lindsey & Lilah’s fakeout deaths/reveal, etc. Obviously it just might be coincidental and maybe I’m acting like a Swiftee and seeing Easter eggs everywhere, but when I watch it now I see hints at what will happen in the next half dozen episodes.
I don't know that I would entirely agree with your "core cast gets the screentime" argument being always true in the Buffyverse. There are a ton of characters across both shows that get large amounts of screentime despite not being officially credited full time cast members (Angel himself fell into that catagory at one point). If they wanted to do more with Kate, I think they probably would have, guest star or not.
You know this is kind of a late comment, I like rewatching your videos often, but Angel drinking from Kate is the second time since buffy. The first time was when he bite darla earlier in the season. Though you could make a case that, he “tasted” Rebecca in the episode “Eternity “ from season one.
Can't wait for the next episode review.
Happy new year, Ian
Cordy looks like karen with that hair lol
I love this episode!!! Happy fuckin new year!!!
Woo, new years gift!
Happy New Year Ian!
"Arcus Interruptus" brilliant
Unpopular opinion: I'm currently watching Season 2 for the first time ever. I've just finished this episode and it's my favourite of the season so far :)
I liked this episode for the caper stuff, Gunn taking charge and Angel falling off the wagon and struggling.
And I liked Kate subverting the previous season's Commissioner Gordon role and being more of a goodwilled antagonist, making Angel in conflict with one of the good guys, foreshadowing his eventual heel turn through his dark vigilantism.
I liked Kate at first, but in the Buffyverse, so much depends on interesting characters + their development. Whenever she popped in like this I thought “ugh she’s still here?? And she’s exactly the same as she was before???”
The audience has known for a long time that good/evil isn’t black and white, and I got bored waiting for her to catch up
Are you going to do Buffy seasons 6&7 after the Angel arc catches up to the crossovers?
I’ve only seen this once & remember liking it but thinking back, yes it IS a lightweight & I know I was over Kate by this point in the show.
Ian, your guides of the lesser episodes are such good value; you balance being critical and respectful so adeptly and the humour is always on point.
Also ANY excuse to see “You’re a GIRL” is a bonus.
Awesome video.
I actually like this episode. I love getting to see David playing characters like Jay-Don - a lot of funny moments. Charisma's hair bothers me more than anything else in this episode (though not nearly as much as Buffy's bothers me in Amends).
To me this is always "that one episode between "Darla" and "the Trial." Enjoyable enough standalone that has indeed faded on subsequent rewatches.
Insightful as always, Ian.
A museum for muggles 🤣
Love this episode
squeezed this one out of the last year, haha
Perhaps proximity to the Shroud with ill intent (the heist itself) made them more susceptible to its effects than tourists walking around a museum with no more mental investment in it than saying "ohh ahh".
Looking forward to the Trial.
Guess I'm in the unpopular group but Cordy's hair is fine as shit.
Watch ball drop for 1 min 30 seconds. Ok, enough of that, Ian put up a new video.
True
Wait, the first time he drank human blood in the series? Didn’t he bite that actress in season 1?
Oh yeah, as drug time Angelus.
I double checked while writing this and it was really just a nibble, as opposed to Kate's full-on pale case of iron deficiency or what he did to Buffy in Becoming Part 2
@@PassionoftheNerd I see your point, but seems like a bit of semantics. Also, I think you mean Graduation Day pt 2. Angelus didn’t bite Buffy in Becoming.
8:59 subconsciously, you picked up on Angel's joker outfit....
And I just completely forgot it existed
So..here's something to ponder. What do you think the Shroud represents to the writers?? I think that if you don't see that of course your not going to ever figure out the point of the episode. What exactly was the _intended_ journey that the writers were trying to take you on? Sometimes we are blinded by own personal demons that disallow something that may be perfectly clear to others. Ponderize that one...
This is a realy good question. It made me go check in all my Buffy Lore Encyclopedias I own (only 3 but I try to expand) and first thing I noticed not much about Angel the Series makes it on those and second was, that Rahmon and his Shroud are shredded in mystery. Everything we know is what Wesley explains. I would love to hear your take on your own questions. This makes for an engaging conversation. 😊
I love your voice! And your videos ☺️👍
Honestly don't think it even would have mattered if this episode was better, it always would have been known for being directly before the episode where AtS finally hits its stride
I have rewatched the bit about the shroud's etymology like three times and I'm clearly missing something in connecting Turin->Jesus->Hesus->Ra[h]mon. Can anyone help me out with this??
Yah, not a huge fan of this Angel episode but love the commentary! Happy New Year everyone!
A museum for muggles... lol
Hey, that's Bobby from The Sopranos!
Thank you
i cant believe i never picked up what you are OH'ing about at the end of the video after multiple watch's of the show
FINALY SOME SWEET TAR FOR MY VEINS
That's the problem with Whedon. Even the bad episodes have deep and important stuff. Appreciated the "Ohhhhh."
3:25 YES!!! 😅
6:45 My... PRECIOUS!!!!! All I hear this episode. And not nearly as compelling or funny.
Yeah I get the point of Kate but you're right, it didn't work and makes me sad, because I shipped them.
Happy New Year 🎊
Ah, Cordelia's Rachel (from _Friends_ ) haircut.