I like this movie. It's not without its flaws, but the flaws don't outweigh the stuff I enjoy. Seems like nowadays, everything has to be spectacular or garbage. Like there's no room in between.
Dark Phoenix should've been another Days of Future Past. Honestly sometimes I wonder what the film would've been like with a director who could've realized the story's potential; like Matthew Vaughn, they should've brought him back.
Matthew Vaughn originally pitched a Trilogy that started with First Class and concluded with Days Of Future Past. With The 2nd film focusing on Wolverine's Introduction, and Logan possibly played by Tom Hardy (which makes ZERO sense but whatever) but FOX where very excited about the idea of doing The Days Of Future past storyline, so instead of going for a Trilogy like Vaughn had proposed, they just made X-Men Days Of Future Past.
And the fact that the Original 3rd Act was completly cut out is a crime against humanity. Jean Gray sacrificing herself to save the earth and her family from the Skrulls invasion, was a way more emotional ending. I want to see the 1st cut so badly
I don't understand why they kept attempting this when even on paper it wouldn't work One thing on both occasions we barely knew jean as a character apart from her superficial love story with both Scott and Wolverine , I don't feel anything when she loses it turns against the x men.
You’d think if they really saw this story as important enough to try to adapt twice (even though neither version is an actual adaptation) they would set it up by making Jean a significant character on her own leading into it. But somehow they rip out all the development that led into it being a successful telling jn the comics and cartoon and just jump to a crap version. Twice.
The Dark Phoenix Saga is not about Jean turning against the X-Men. She was only Dark Phoenix for two issues and the destruction of the D'Bari planet was an accident. The main antagonist were Hellfire Club and the Shi'ar, not the Dark Phoenix.
@@mattf5935 I mean no offense, but did you actually read the comics? Because the Dark Phoenix Saga is NOT about Jean turning on the X-Men. Contrary to popular belief, the destruction of the D'Bari planet was an ACCIDENT. She was never truly the villain/antagonist of the saga, the Hellfire Club and Shi'ar were. Also, Jean in the comics didn't become a significant character until she become the Phoenix. She was very minor character in the X-Men comics before that.
The fact that you put this movie down and came back to sing its praises shows you have found the truth that I have: when Implicitly Pretentious makes a video about a movie, it gets much better.
I just discovered your channel and I like how your channel is called “implicitly pretentious”. A lot of other youtubers that do analysis on movies and shows are just pretentious and I can’t watch them when they title their videos “this show is for smart people”.
I liked this movie a lot but it also frustrated me. Story and plot aside, the displays of power and cool factor should have been as robust as the train scene was throughout the entire movie. Magneto getting trounced after simply trying to stab Jean with the railing was wack. It was a complete step down from his strength in Apocalypse and trivialized his pain for me. Storm having trouble with some guy who can whip his hair back and forth while she's the MISTRESS OF THE ELEMENTS took me out. The X-Men are arguably the coolest team of superheroes and I wanted to feel that for the entire runtime while watching this movie.
I love the scene where Jean makes Charles walk up the stairs and he’s like “No please Jean please stop, oh the muscle atrophy” and I just laugh my ass off. Funniest shit I’ve ever seen
Sort of the reverse from a hilariously awesome panel from Ultimate X-Men when Xavier is confronted by Sinister. Sinister quips that he's taking him in his wheelchair "to the one true enemy of the great Charles Xavier...stairs." and he pushes him down the stairs in the institute. Glorious.
Maybe they would've said that after that, the X-Men reached out to Shia Empire to help find them Jean and bring her back and fix her, after Scott and Charles heard her voice in their heads. I don't know, something like that.
Wow, the algorithm really doesn't want to pick up this video. Hoping this comment (engagement) helps. BTW, saw Dark Phoenix at a screening at LA Film School and Kinberg was there for a Q&A and I was so embarrassed for him that I left before he even started talking with the audience.
Main problems with this movie: One,Charles doesn't explain why he takes any position. Every choice he makes is with the fear of the future he saw 20 years ago. Second and main problem, The Phoenix Saga is not about Jean not being able to control her new powers, it's about she using that immense power to save the universe, and after being corrupted by the villains trying to control her she recognizes the evil things she has done and lastly chooses to take her own life instead of become a danger to everyone. As i said, not understanding the point of the story is why this same writer has failed twice at adapting it.
I wished 20th Century Fox had Sony's guts and just not give af about Disney. Like just go ahead and make part 1 and if it was pretty damn good and people loved it, Disney would had to honor it and make a part 2 (kinda like with Deadpool).
Original Timeline = X-Men: First Class X-Men Origins: Wolverine X-Men X2 X-Men: The Last Stand The Wolverine X-Men: Days of Future Past New Timeline = X-Men: First Class X-Men: Days of Future Past X-Men: Apocalypse Dark Phoenix X-Men Deadpool Logan Third Timeline = Deadpool 2 The New Mutants Logan Deadpool 3
And Fassbender’s performance is wasted since they have him do the same arc for the third or fourth time. Why can’t they figure out something else to do with him?
There's nothing complex or nuanced about Mystique's perspective, She's just a sexist. Completely ignoring Nightcrawler and Quicksilver's contributions to the mission and putting her sisters on a pedastal. Then gets murdered by one.... The way she berates Charles is ridiculous. Would she prefer space missions, photo ops and a direct line to the president OR having her entire race hunted down by purple robots and mercilessly killed? Because that's where they just came from and Mystique seems to prefer that over progress of any kind.
I really don't think it's the garbage fire people make it out to be. If Kinberg was allowed to make it his way, it'd be pretty great imo. I honestly think Disney purposefully sabotaged this film. We all know there were huge mandated reshoots... In certain ways this film feels the most Claremont.
@@Wico90YT why not? We had Quicksilver in 2 franchises. We can have Skrulls too. And are you really defending Disney purposefully tanking this film for such a stupid reason?
@@fowldz I'd respond but what you said doesn't make any sense. Emoticons are by far the lowest form of communication right under repetitive chants like "silence is violence". 2 month old children make more sense. Don't feel bad though. The world is full of simple people, you'll fit right in.
The movie that was meant to be a two-part four hours long film with Jean Grey stirring up World War III against herself before engaging into a galaxy-spanning Secret War, all Star Wars style against the Skrull Empire. Then Disney intervened and tried to screw everything by first stealing the script and making it into Captain Marvel, Avengers Infinity War and Avengers Endgame.
I tried to like it but I can't, it's boring and characters don't act like people, it's like everyone was on autopilot, even James and Michael....Xmen 3 managed to make me care about Jean and the others even when the script was flawed, can't say the same here
Trust me, X3 did not make you care about Jean as a character. The previous movies made you care about Logan and he wanted Jean, you wanted to see him succeed. That is why you cared. X3 doesn't stand on its own at all. Because Jean had zero character development in that movie and actress was given almost nothing to do. Btw, what do you mean by the characters not acting like people in Dark Phoenix?
@@agentofchaos7456 well I'll give you the first part, but to answer your second, everyone acts like they're on autopilot mode or phoning in performances, look at the other 3 prequel movies before and see the difference in the tone and acting, add the fact that characters just move about whenever the plot needs them to without planning anything as a team X3 managed to at least have characters in conflict and doubting each other and when it was time, they stood together working as offense to stop the Brotherhood, if Scott was allowed to be a character in the prequels as well as the main movies, then he could've had more stake for people to care about Jean through him As it is Jean is a boring character in these movies and nothing is earned, you're right, it is through Logan and older Xavier that I care at all, but I got the sense that Jean's actions effected the team emotionally not just Logan, Dark Phoenix didn't give that at all
@@ninjanibba4259 That is partly because Simon Kinberg directed the actors differently according to the behind the scenes features. He even says that he wanted Fassbender to give a weaker performance because it was stronger to him. However, I think Sophie Turner was much better here than she was in Apocalypse. Because there were points in that movie where she was just straight up bad like in the scene with Wolverine. I understand where you're coming from. But to be fair, Dark Phoenix isn't meant to be about the X-Men team like X3 was. It's origin story about Jean becoming the Phoenix/Dark Phoenix. Hence why X-Men wasn't in the title originally. Mystique's death is really just a plot device to advance Jean's arc. A similar thing happened in the comics.
"The acting is way more subtle than usual; Jennifer Lawrence actually looks like she cares," took me out.
I got the impression that she was just exhausted with the franchise and was phoning it in. Or perhaps that was just the poor makeup attempt.
I like this movie. It's not without its flaws, but the flaws don't outweigh the stuff I enjoy. Seems like nowadays, everything has to be spectacular or garbage. Like there's no room in between.
Dark Phoenix should've been another Days of Future Past. Honestly sometimes I wonder what the film would've been like with a director who could've realized the story's potential; like Matthew Vaughn, they should've brought him back.
They should've brought him back to do X-Men: Apocalypse before doing Dark Phoenix.
Matthew Vaughn originally pitched a Trilogy that started with First Class and concluded with Days Of Future Past. With The 2nd film focusing on Wolverine's Introduction, and Logan possibly played by Tom Hardy (which makes ZERO sense but whatever) but FOX where very excited about the idea of doing The Days Of Future past storyline, so instead of going for a Trilogy like Vaughn had proposed, they just made X-Men Days Of Future Past.
💯😩
And the fact that the Original 3rd Act was completly cut out is a crime against humanity. Jean Gray sacrificing herself to save the earth and her family from the Skrulls invasion, was a way more emotional ending.
I want to see the 1st cut so badly
I don't understand why they kept attempting this when even on paper it wouldn't work
One thing on both occasions we barely knew jean as a character apart from her superficial love story with both Scott and Wolverine , I don't feel anything when she loses it turns against the x men.
You’d think if they really saw this story as important enough to try to adapt twice (even though neither version is an actual adaptation) they would set it up by making Jean a significant character on her own leading into it. But somehow they rip out all the development that led into it being a successful telling jn the comics and cartoon and just jump to a crap version. Twice.
The Dark Phoenix Saga is not about Jean turning against the X-Men. She was only Dark Phoenix for two issues and the destruction of the D'Bari planet was an accident. The main antagonist were Hellfire Club and the Shi'ar, not the Dark Phoenix.
@@mattf5935 I mean no offense, but did you actually read the comics? Because the Dark Phoenix Saga is NOT about Jean turning on the X-Men. Contrary to popular belief, the destruction of the D'Bari planet was an ACCIDENT. She was never truly the villain/antagonist of the saga, the Hellfire Club and Shi'ar were.
Also, Jean in the comics didn't become a significant character until she become the Phoenix. She was very minor character in the X-Men comics before that.
I still can't get over the fact that all the characters are literally supposed to be nearly 60 in this movie.
The fact that you put this movie down and came back to sing its praises shows you have found the truth that I have: when Implicitly Pretentious makes a video about a movie, it gets much better.
Jonathan Hickman’s X-Men, Avengers/New Avengers, F4 stories are incredible. It would be awesome to hear your analysis of those.
I liked this movie when I watched it in the theater three years ago. I never got why people hated it that much.
I thought the final battle on the train was pretty good, all things considered.
I like it too
I just discovered your channel and I like how your channel is called “implicitly pretentious”. A lot of other youtubers that do analysis on movies and shows are just pretentious and I can’t watch them when they title their videos “this show is for smart people”.
I also file under that heading youtubers that habitually use titling like "x is garbage and here's why" or " the fall of x".
Snooty and off-putting
8:53 The concept art is amazing
I liked this movie a lot but it also frustrated me. Story and plot aside, the displays of power and cool factor should have been as robust as the train scene was throughout the entire movie.
Magneto getting trounced after simply trying to stab Jean with the railing was wack. It was a complete step down from his strength in Apocalypse and trivialized his pain for me.
Storm having trouble with some guy who can whip his hair back and forth while she's the MISTRESS OF THE ELEMENTS took me out.
The X-Men are arguably the coolest team of superheroes and I wanted to feel that for the entire runtime while watching this movie.
I love the scene where Jean makes Charles walk up the stairs and he’s like “No please Jean please stop, oh the muscle atrophy” and I just laugh my ass off. Funniest shit I’ve ever seen
Sort of the reverse from a hilariously awesome panel from Ultimate X-Men when Xavier is confronted by Sinister. Sinister quips that he's taking him in his wheelchair "to the one true enemy of the great Charles Xavier...stairs." and he pushes him down the stairs in the institute. Glorious.
I literally couldn’t stop laughing lmaoooo i thought i was the only one
Just love the way you find the positive side of everything!
Damn that 2nd part movie sounds great
I'm just upset that we never got an end to Quicksilver and Magneto. That would of been so cool
The two part script sorta messes with the continuity because at the end of Days of Futer Past Jean is shown to be OK and alive
Maybe they would've said that after that, the X-Men reached out to Shia Empire to help find them Jean and bring her back and fix her, after Scott and Charles heard her voice in their heads. I don't know, something like that.
The timeline split at some point
Wow, the algorithm really doesn't want to pick up this video. Hoping this comment (engagement) helps.
BTW, saw Dark Phoenix at a screening at LA Film School and Kinberg was there for a Q&A and I was so embarrassed for him that I left before he even started talking with the audience.
So what are your exact thoughts about the movie?
I love this channel ❤
I still really dislike the film, but a great video and I appreciate hearing a positive perspective on it
The alternate cut of Dark Phoenixis so good
Eagerly awaiting your agents of shield videos 🙂
Jean making professor X walk up the stairs made this movie top 5 comic book movie for me honestly lol
Gives me more appreciation for the film, thanks 😄 Can't wait for Alita!!
Main problems with this movie:
One,Charles doesn't explain why he takes any position. Every choice he makes is with the fear of the future he saw 20 years ago.
Second and main problem, The Phoenix Saga is not about Jean not being able to control her new powers, it's about she using that immense power to save the universe, and after being corrupted by the villains trying to control her she recognizes the evil things she has done and lastly chooses to take her own life instead of become a danger to everyone.
As i said, not understanding the point of the story is why this same writer has failed twice at adapting it.
At least we have the 90s cartoon that did the storyline right.
Thank you! You’re videos are amazing!
🙏💯
Also MCU phase four is so bad that it makes Dark Phoenix look good.
I wished 20th Century Fox had Sony's guts and just not give af about Disney. Like just go ahead and make part 1 and if it was pretty damn good and people loved it, Disney would had to honor it and make a part 2 (kinda like with Deadpool).
Love your videos man :)
Still waiting on that Carter vid...
I am in the minority on this film, I really enjoyed it
ReleaseDarkPhoenixUNCut (Unreleased Scenes)
DARK PHOENIX DIRECTOR'S CUT
DARK PHOENIX 2 DIRECTOR'S CUT
Wait. What. The original twopart movie plan sounds like actually ok movies... Goddamnit fox
RIP Dark Phoenix.
Nice
Jeez, dude do you ever sleep between releasing videos?
I got a ad about having x 1 vision.
Here’s hoping Deadpool 3 somehow provides closure.
Reporting from the future. Glad to inform you that DP&W provided great closure!
I thought you’d be talking about the comic instead for a sec. Good vid tho
The aliens where part of the dark Phoenix saga in the comics and cartoons
They didn't appear in the cartoons.
This one is way better than Apocalypse and New Mutants. Release the Kinberg Cut lol
Ratio + yb better + nobody cares + this u 🤓🤓👶🏽👨🏼💻👨🏼💻
Original Timeline =
X-Men: First Class
X-Men Origins: Wolverine
X-Men
X2
X-Men: The Last Stand
The Wolverine
X-Men: Days of Future Past
New Timeline =
X-Men: First Class
X-Men: Days of Future Past
X-Men: Apocalypse
Dark Phoenix
X-Men
Deadpool
Logan
Third Timeline =
Deadpool 2
The New Mutants
Logan
Deadpool 3
I actually like this movie quite a bit
Some videos do need to be taken down or hidden. Much better review than your original.
Yeah , I m not touching dark phoenix with a 10 foot pole. Only thing good about it is fasscbender's performance
And Fassbender’s performance is wasted since they have him do the same arc for the third or fourth time. Why can’t they figure out something else to do with him?
Loved X-Men First Class. Days of future was okay. Apocalypse was too small in scope. Dark Phoenix was studio meddled garbage.
This movie is better than everything in phase four of Marvel so far
Ratio + yb better + nobody cares + this u 🤓🤓👶🏽👨🏼💻👨🏼💻
I think it was a cash grab feature
I just wish this movie managed to get me to care about anyone in it.
Weren't most of the characters established and developed in the previous three prequel films though?
There's nothing complex or nuanced about Mystique's perspective, She's just a sexist. Completely ignoring Nightcrawler and Quicksilver's contributions to the mission and putting her sisters on a pedastal. Then gets murdered by one....
The way she berates Charles is ridiculous. Would she prefer space missions, photo ops and a direct line to the president OR having her entire race hunted down by purple robots and mercilessly killed? Because that's where they just came from and Mystique seems to prefer that over progress of any kind.
I really don't think it's the garbage fire people make it out to be. If Kinberg was allowed to make it his way, it'd be pretty great imo. I honestly think Disney purposefully sabotaged this film.
We all know there were huge mandated reshoots...
In certain ways this film feels the most Claremont.
Can't have Skrulls in CM and here. They're lucky they released the movie (and New Mutants) at all. They easily could have been scrapped.
@@Wico90YT why not? We had Quicksilver in 2 franchises. We can have Skrulls too.
And are you really defending Disney purposefully tanking this film for such a stupid reason?
Whoa, that original long two-part story sounded bad and convoluted.
I found it utterly unwatchable.
@@fowldz I'd respond but what you said doesn't make any sense. Emoticons are by far the lowest form of communication right under repetitive chants like "silence is violence". 2 month old children make more sense. Don't feel bad though. The world is full of simple people, you'll fit right in.
The movie that was meant to be a two-part four hours long film with Jean Grey stirring up World War III against herself before engaging into a galaxy-spanning Secret War, all Star Wars style against the Skrull Empire.
Then Disney intervened and tried to screw everything by first stealing the script and making it into Captain Marvel, Avengers Infinity War and Avengers Endgame.
I tried to like it but I can't, it's boring and characters don't act like people, it's like everyone was on autopilot, even James and Michael....Xmen 3 managed to make me care about Jean and the others even when the script was flawed, can't say the same here
He is definitely giving this movie waaayy too much grace.
Trust me, X3 did not make you care about Jean as a character. The previous movies made you care about Logan and he wanted Jean, you wanted to see him succeed. That is why you cared. X3 doesn't stand on its own at all. Because Jean had zero character development in that movie and actress was given almost nothing to do.
Btw, what do you mean by the characters not acting like people in Dark Phoenix?
@@arkeshn729 How so? Because he doesn't have the same opinion?
@@agentofchaos7456 well I'll give you the first part, but to answer your second, everyone acts like they're on autopilot mode or phoning in performances, look at the other 3 prequel movies before and see the difference in the tone and acting, add the fact that characters just move about whenever the plot needs them to without planning anything as a team
X3 managed to at least have characters in conflict and doubting each other and when it was time, they stood together working as offense to stop the Brotherhood, if Scott was allowed to be a character in the prequels as well as the main movies, then he could've had more stake for people to care about Jean through him
As it is Jean is a boring character in these movies and nothing is earned, you're right, it is through Logan and older Xavier that I care at all, but I got the sense that Jean's actions effected the team emotionally not just Logan, Dark Phoenix didn't give that at all
@@ninjanibba4259 That is partly because Simon Kinberg directed the actors differently according to the behind the scenes features. He even says that he wanted Fassbender to give a weaker performance because it was stronger to him. However, I think Sophie Turner was much better here than she was in Apocalypse. Because there were points in that movie where she was just straight up bad like in the scene with Wolverine.
I understand where you're coming from. But to be fair, Dark Phoenix isn't meant to be about the X-Men team like X3 was. It's origin story about Jean becoming the Phoenix/Dark Phoenix. Hence why X-Men wasn't in the title originally. Mystique's death is really just a plot device to advance Jean's arc. A similar thing happened in the comics.