Overwatch is now out on Switch and sadly it's another disappointment when it comes to gyro controls, but it's not all bad. There are some nice new options I've not seen in other gyro games for console. You can individually control pitch, yaw, and roll sensitivity. Not sure why all 3 are used at once by default, but whatever. Seems to me like you'd only want 2 of the 3. As for the range of sensitivity it seems good. I think at the very least max sensitivity should allow you to do a full 360 by twisting your arms as much as you can while remaining comfortable and the sensitivity range in Overwatch accomplishes that. They also added an option to disable gyro while using the stick. Not quite a disable gyro button, but it's close. I tried reducing vertical stick sensitivity to 0 thinking I could tilt the stick up to simulate a gyro disable button, but apparently 0 sensitivity isn't really 0 sensitivity, but at 0 it is a slower turn speed so it still sort of works. Interestingly enough there's a camera reset button. Doesn't work like Splatoon's. Well it does it just doesn't have the extra benefit of serving as a quick turn when used in conjunction with the movement stick. Although I'd prefer this simply be a disable gyro button when held. As for the gyro itself I think it feels close to Splatoon. There's a minimum movement threshold applied when turning left/right. You'll notice this when very slowly turning the controller. For whatever reason (like Splatoon) I don't seem to notice it when doing vertical movements. I'm not really sure if there's smoothing applied as well, but I'm guessing there is. Aiming feels a bit delayed. Maybe it could be related to the FPS, but I don't think so. Unless I'm remembering wrong I think I've tried capping my FPS to 30fps on PC to see how that effects gryo and I remember it still felt very responsive. I think I even limited the resolution and it still felt responsive. I mean do developers not see what's possible with gyro or something? I don't get how they still haven't figured it out when there are examples out there of what you can do with Steam or Joyshockmapper. We need them to take notice. I find it really annoying when I see someone try gyro on console. Struggle with the unresponsive controls and then claim gyro sucks.
Thanks for the breakdown! This seems like a good analysis. I haven't gotten the Switch version, but from what I've seen of their options, it seems like they've put in a lot of work and not a lot of research? I wonder if developers see games like Splatoon as a "gold standard" for gyro controls, and don't realise that on PC we've been doing so much better for ages
@@JibbSmartGD Yeah, I have a feeling they just took what Nintendo did and made a few modifications. Although developers and controls have been annoying me for years. I've always preferred flipping sticks (feeling I"m better at aiming with the left stick), but developers always mess that up. They let you flip the sticks, but don't also let you flip the buttons with the dpad (essentially mirroring the controller). And in Overwatch why is your score button the minus button? It should be the start button so you can move while quickly checking the score. Little update on Overwatch for Switch. I have a feeling gyro control aim assist will be getting nerfed. Right now the aim assist used for sticks is the same amount used for gyro. If you go Solider, gyro + aim assist is basically like a constant aimbot.
@@ThomasDailey The start button is my voice chat button, which I felt was more important to have quick access to. They both need to be held, so they couldn't share one button. You can hear my voice chat a bit in the extended gameplay video. They have aim assist with gyro aiming? That's real bad! D: I imagine it's like having mouse with aim assist -- the controls feel worse, but too powerful, too. Regarding flipping the controller: are you a lefty? It'd be great to have better conventions on control customisation. Games should make flipping controls across painless as far as players are concerned.
When i first heard about Overwatch coming to Switch i didn’t really care because why would i play a fps with a controller. But now thanks to you im actually kinda hyped
That's a big compliment! Thank you! We can only hope for the best :) If I get my hands on the Switch version I'd like to do a comparison to playing with Switch controllers on PC.
I think my dream game for officially using this kind of control scheme would be a Switch port of Quake 3 Arena. Imagine just whipping out a 1 on 1 split-screen match at any time in tabletop mode. For now, I think the closest we've come are Voxel Shot and Voxel Sword. Instead of having a button for disabling gyro it just lets you turn with the west and east face buttons similar to how the Splatoon games handle right analog inputs, but otherwise it's basically the same idea.
Ooh yeah, Quake 3 on Switch would be cool! 60fps, split-screen, gyro aiming. I'll have to check out Voxel Shot and Voxel Sword. That sounds like a sensible way to do things if you have the buttons to spare.
Your videos are inspiring, i just bought overwatch on switch and strugglig on it coming from a pc gamer. Im looking for gyro aiming guides and you have the best content out there. I hope we can see gyro aiming guide/tips&tricks on Switch soon with dual joycon. This is nice! Im subscribing!
Thank you for the kind words and for subscribing! That's a good idea -- helping players get comfortable with gyro controls. Whether moving from mouse and keyboard or upgrading from just using thumbsticks, there is a learning curve. I haven't gotten my hands on the Switch version of Overwatch yet, but I'd like to. I've seen the options they have available, and they're better than some, but not amazing. The real test is gonna be how the controls feel, and I'm keen to check it out!
@@JibbSmartGD im looking forward for your guide bro, by just watching you play on a single joycon i learned new things.like disabling gyro to get back on default position.tips like this would help a learning person like me on gyro controls.i played splatoon about more than a year ago and i was okayish with gyros. I have no talent with thumbsticks, and i know gyro is the future of shooter games that's why i want to skip with thumbsticks. With OW, i tried doing some workshop training maps but out of the blue i just had a simulation sickness,LOL guess i should stuck to some basics first. I'll willingly help on sharing your vids to gain more audience and open others mind on gyro aiming.
Sharing is such a huge help :) You're right, I think, that gyro is the future of games like these! So much potential. Just so you know, I probably have a couple of other videos to do before I come back to Overwatch. I never really know for sure what's going to be next until I'm editing the video, and each video can take weeks to make.
@@JibbSmartGD no problem bro, even on other games, we still appreciate your vids bigtime.although some might not apply like 'flick sticks' which is none existent on Overwatch, but gyro aiming techniques is still aiming techniques, you can still apply it on any games, its just a matter on how you can adjust it to deal with the lacking features.
@@JibbSmartGD the IR is really good to 'calibrate' the gyro on the fly, i only know about that because Nerrel made a video about motion controls in his channel. His example: The legend of zelda skyward sword uses the wii motion plus and it was the last zelda game to launch on wii so it benefits from the experience of other games like Wii Sports Resort, if you swing your controller too much it will start to drift, but if your pointer detects the IR it will automatically fix the drift, it's not a 100% calibration because i remember having to stop playing just to calibrate, unfortunately the IR pointer died with the wii so we don't have one more feature to enhance the gyro
I play Fortnite on switch like this. Wii mote style. Nice vid 👍 and in the switch version of overwatch they have an option where you can continuously turn the camera with the gyro. Can’t wait to try it out
Nice! I think there's so much Fortnite's gyro aiming could do better, but I'm so glad the option is there :) Let me know how you think Overwatch compares
I have a not so unique situation that I am surprised that no matter what, I keep running into a couple tiny problems that prevent me from utilizing a solution such as joyshockmapper. I am, however, convinced JSM IS the solution, I just need some advice... I have gamed my whole life from Atari, NES, SNES, to early day PC games like wolfenstein 3D and Warcraft... I am now disabled and no longer can utilize a full sized controller. i am limited to my right hand, so think about my necessity to swap the left and right sticks when using a single right half of a joycon, and I also cant hold the controller sideways but must implement Roll vs Yaw (I could be wrong here) when gyro aiming. The joycon was the firstr thing I bought after my accident as it intuitively made sense, but I can't seem to get where I am trying to go with it :( I know there are so many other disabled individuals that must have the same need, and I am not quite ready to give up and drop $200 on an Azeron just yet. Gyro controls are what I want/need and I cant express enough the happiness it would bring me if someone could help :)
Hi Curtis! I think JSM and/or something like it could indeed be just what you need. You can map movement to any stick, you can make the controls change at the press of a button, and you can fully customise how gyro maps to mouse. Most of my videos have a link in the description to the gyro gaming discord server, where there are lots of people (including me) who'd be up for discussing and helping you figure something out that works for you. Or you can ask here and I'll try to help you when I can :)
Hey Jibb, love your in depth look into gyro, found your vids thanks to nerrel regarding motion controllers. have a few questions. Currently using the ds4 on steams overlay to play Overwatch with gyro but I'm having hard time finding the best output or style for gaming, do you have any tips or references I could go to? thanks!
Hi Vincent! Thank you :) I used to play Overwatch with Steam, too, before I made JoyShockMapper. Overwatch is a game with lots of movement, so it can be harder to find a sensitivity that works well for every situation. I've found that having some acceleration helps with my range of movement at the cost of some precision. I also think it's super important to have a button to disable the gyro so you can reposition the controller without moving the camera. The gyro gaming discord is a great place to talk about different settings people prefer, whether using Steam, JSM, DS4Windows, reWASD, or anything else. There's an invitation link in the description of most of my videos if you'd like to join :)
There's a few games coming to Switch that I'd really like to see good gyro for, and those are Spellbreak and Rogue Company. In the case of Rogue Company I'm slightly worried because it's Hi-Rez, and when Realm Royale added gyro they just copied the garbage gyro from Paladins that drifts around. I'll see if I can bring the attention of the Spellbreak devs to this wiki, it seems like just the resource needed.
@@JibbSmartGD No kidding! It took months of asking and pretty much a whole Switch-community uprising until we got an option to *disable aim assist* if you can believe that.
Oof! I was trying to disable acceleration by turning it down to 0, but 0 doesn't mean 0, apparently (on PC with a DualShock 4, anyway). I don't mind acceleration with the right settings, but let me turn it off, and why does 0 not mean 0?
@@JibbSmartGD From what I understand, the acceleration is only for the stick controls, you can't even turn off the acceleration for the motion (unless they changed something in the last 4 months, when I stopped playing). I had a much funner time with the game when I switched to the PC version and used the Steam Input to map the gyro to the mouse. I personally prefer to have absolutely no acceleration, but sometimes a little is needed for when I need to both look around quickly and aim long distances. That being said though, the flick stick thing I've seen in your videos looks like the perfect tool to where I wouldn't need acceleration, so I'll definitely be seeing if I can get that to work!
Oh, that might explain it. Real shame it can't be disabled. Yeah, Steam does a much better job. Credit where credit's due, I'm really glad Hi-Rez is doing gyro on Switch AND PS4. I just wish they'd do a better job of it. Bad implementations make people think gyro's no good. If you hit any snags with flick stick, let me know, or check out the gyro gaming Discord -- there are lots of helpful people there, for anything from JSM, Steam, reWASD, and anything else, really.
hey, i've found your channel recently with solarlight, and it got me curious, and i want to play in an even wierder way: switch only the mouse for the controller (i mean i do wanna play with that wierd new way of aiming, but i have an Azeron, which is already a wierd thing in itself, it did cost me a lost so i don't really wanna ditch the thing cuz "controller's looks fun lol") so i thought "why not use a one handed controller, aka a joycon or a wiimote, instead of my mouse, and keep my azeron, thing is i don't really know how to change the gyro in the txt, because it would use the tilting of the joycon, as i'm holding it vertically and not horizontally, is there a way of doing it like that, and if so, what do i need to modify? i thank anyone that took the time to read me and help me
@@JibbSmartGD gotcha, I’ve recently wanted to get into streaming apex with joycons and this animated display looks incredible. I hope it’s available in the future.
Would it be possible to use one joycon to aim and the other joycon to do other motion controls, like for example, doing a punching motion with it to melee
Sort of. By default only the right Joy-Con is used for aiming and the left can be used for other motion controls (though this can be changed). Can't do shakes yet, but tilts and leans can be bound like any button input
Thank you i use The Tool to Play with the Titan one Device with joycon as mouse… can you make a Version where you program this not for mouse for Virtual Xbox 360 Controler Gyro
@@teddymixes it is necessary to program the emulation of the stick, it will not have as good aim as a mouse. I've been doing this for your controller. Just have to make the settings for each game.
Ah. I probably won't do this any time soon. It's a much bigger task to make it work as a virtual XInput device than as a virtual keyboard and mouse. While more features are coming, and I'm no longer the only programmer working on JSM, I do want to keep it light and simple.
I did not use a grip :) It's definitely harder than using a full-size controller, even if the full-size controller had the same number of buttons and sticks as a single Joy-Con. I wouldn't recommend it without good reason (local multiplayer on the go, for example, which currently can't be done with JSM)
Very interesting video. Question: Why don't you use L/ZL for toogle actions, things less dependant on timing or "UI stuff"? i mean by using taps/holds there are least for inputs you could add there: Stuff like Switching Hero, Stats, Menu, Voice or the ultimate. My next question is if you have access to accelerometer data? You could detect stuff like a quick shake to trigger a reload and acceleration in a given axis to toogle a crouch for example. This gestures are both intuitive and safe enough to map to a waggle. i think there's quite a lot of improvement to make in that control scheme to make more intuitive and less convulted even with the limited inputs of a single joycon.
You could try mapping some actions to L/ZL. I find it cumbersome to press while playing, or easy to press accidentally. But I think you have the right idea with using it for non-combat actions. I do have access to the accelerometer data, but it's not currently exposed by JoyShockMapper. It seems to me that anything one can do with a shake of the controller is even better done with the press of a button. Reload is a time-critical action in the heat of battle, and already works well with a button press. And I wouldn't want sudden controller movements to mess with aiming. Having said that, it's probably worth experimenting with :)
@@JibbSmartGD "It seems to me that anything one can do with a shake of the controller is even better done with the press of a button. " Believe or not "waggle" has its place when it's complementary to a well tought out button scheme. In the case of reloading, this action is sort of mutually exclusive to aiming/shooting, that is, you can't shoot while reloading and even if the shake messed your aiming you still have time to refocus on the target while the loading animation is playing. "Waggle" gestures can have their place when they make the interface more intuitive, when they make the button mapping less convoluted (like Overwatch single Joycon), when they minimize finger repositioning or when the gestures corresponds better to the ingame action thus giving a better "feelback".
I get what you mean with the mutually exclusive actions. It's not a bad choice for a shake or waggle input, but I prefer the responsiveness of a button, as well as still being able to watch a target or my environment without shaking my view. You make a good point about these options making button mapping less convoluted. Having said that, waggles can easily be triggered accidentally or not triggered when they're meant to. Gestures need to be super simple to be responsive, but the quicker the game responds to a gesture, the less sure it can be that it was really an intentional gesture as opposed to an unintended bump. Since responsiveness is often so important, it's usually easier to have just one more complicated button mapping than to use a gesture. Of course, "one more complicated button mapping" can only go so far. I do want to explore this further. The plan is to eventually add shakes and leans as inputs in JoyShockMapper to make it easier for others to try this stuff out while I experiment further.
@@JibbSmartGD"waggles can easily be triggered accidentally or not triggered when they're meant to". Well sure, but that's basically agreing with the people that think there's no space for Gyro Aim in gaming. After all, the more motion that is needed to trigger an action the more room for error that opens. But like i said, this is easily overcome with smart implementation. Let me give you an example: In Pikmin there's a side to side shake of the Nunchuck that splits all following Pikmin into colored groups. In 100s of playing hours the action didn't fail or accidentally trigger. There's also the context of this video, the reason gestures are considered for certain actions is due to the limited available inputs. With that said there's a lot of value in these 1 Joycon videos you are making because it opens the floor for consideration of more thoughtful implementation of control schemes. Developers tend to be too comformist most of the time with them.
Thanks for your kind words. I appreciate you pushing for more thorough exploration of the possibilities. "Well sure, but that's basically agreing with the people that think there's no space for Gyro Aim in gaming. After all, the more motion that is needed to trigger an action the more room for error that opens." Good gyro controls are mouse-like. It's not about moving too much to trigger an action or too little and accidentally not triggering an action. I mean, sometimes it is -- sometimes games have a minimum movement threshold, for example. These are bad implementations. But good gyro controls give you a directness of control that is totally different from having specific gestures trigger specific actions, so I have to disagree with you here. However, it only just occurred to me that I was imagining having to use a shake gesture with the same hand that I'm aiming with. But from your Pikmin example -- you're talking about a shake gesture with the non-aiming Joy-Con, right? I think I was getting mixed up between the single-Joy-Con stuff and the split-Joy-Con stuff. I see the usefulness there, sure.
There's a "charging grip" that connects the controllers so you can hold them like one controller and also charges them when connected by USB-C. Or you can get a charging station that will charge up to 4 Joy-Cons at the same time
@@JibbSmartGD I would only wanna use one, so maybe the charging dock would work best. I'd like to borrow a buddies joycon to try this soon, but the software is a little confusing. Is there a GUI I'm missing or is there a "quick-start" page I could learn from? TIA, this looks awesome!
Thanks :) There's no GUI, I'm afraid. The JoyShockMapper guide on GyroWiki looks long, but it starts with the essentials and gets gradually more in-depth, so you can just do sections 1 & 2 if you just want to get started as quickly as possible: gyrowiki.jibbsmart.com/blog:joyshockmapper-guide
@@JibbSmartGD I might try to grab one tomorrow, but how do I connect the joycon to the PC? Bluetooth? Or do I HAVE to get a grip/case with a usb connection?
Not trying to fool anyone. JSM is a PC tool, and I make it clear in the video... But I realise it's confusing since the Switch version is coming out soon. I'll update the video title. I don't normally worry too much about specifying platform because all my videos are on PC, but I see how this is different :)
Overwatch is now out on Switch and sadly it's another disappointment when it comes to gyro controls, but it's not all bad.
There are some nice new options I've not seen in other gyro games for console. You can individually control pitch, yaw, and roll sensitivity. Not sure why all 3 are used at once by default, but whatever. Seems to me like you'd only want 2 of the 3. As for the range of sensitivity it seems good. I think at the very least max sensitivity should allow you to do a full 360 by twisting your arms as much as you can while remaining comfortable and the sensitivity range in Overwatch accomplishes that.
They also added an option to disable gyro while using the stick. Not quite a disable gyro button, but it's close. I tried reducing vertical stick sensitivity to 0 thinking I could tilt the stick up to simulate a gyro disable button, but apparently 0 sensitivity isn't really 0 sensitivity, but at 0 it is a slower turn speed so it still sort of works.
Interestingly enough there's a camera reset button. Doesn't work like Splatoon's. Well it does it just doesn't have the extra benefit of serving as a quick turn when used in conjunction with the movement stick. Although I'd prefer this simply be a disable gyro button when held.
As for the gyro itself I think it feels close to Splatoon. There's a minimum movement threshold applied when turning left/right. You'll notice this when very slowly turning the controller. For whatever reason (like Splatoon) I don't seem to notice it when doing vertical movements.
I'm not really sure if there's smoothing applied as well, but I'm guessing there is. Aiming feels a bit delayed. Maybe it could be related to the FPS, but I don't think so. Unless I'm remembering wrong I think I've tried capping my FPS to 30fps on PC to see how that effects gryo and I remember it still felt very responsive. I think I even limited the resolution and it still felt responsive.
I mean do developers not see what's possible with gyro or something? I don't get how they still haven't figured it out when there are examples out there of what you can do with Steam or Joyshockmapper. We need them to take notice. I find it really annoying when I see someone try gyro on console. Struggle with the unresponsive controls and then claim gyro sucks.
Thanks for the breakdown! This seems like a good analysis. I haven't gotten the Switch version, but from what I've seen of their options, it seems like they've put in a lot of work and not a lot of research?
I wonder if developers see games like Splatoon as a "gold standard" for gyro controls, and don't realise that on PC we've been doing so much better for ages
@@JibbSmartGD Yeah, I have a feeling they just took what Nintendo did and made a few modifications.
Although developers and controls have been annoying me for years. I've always preferred flipping sticks (feeling I"m better at aiming with the left stick), but developers always mess that up. They let you flip the sticks, but don't also let you flip the buttons with the dpad (essentially mirroring the controller).
And in Overwatch why is your score button the minus button? It should be the start button so you can move while quickly checking the score.
Little update on Overwatch for Switch. I have a feeling gyro control aim assist will be getting nerfed. Right now the aim assist used for sticks is the same amount used for gyro. If you go Solider, gyro + aim assist is basically like a constant aimbot.
@@ThomasDailey The start button is my voice chat button, which I felt was more important to have quick access to. They both need to be held, so they couldn't share one button.
You can hear my voice chat a bit in the extended gameplay video.
They have aim assist with gyro aiming? That's real bad! D: I imagine it's like having mouse with aim assist -- the controls feel worse, but too powerful, too.
Regarding flipping the controller: are you a lefty? It'd be great to have better conventions on control customisation. Games should make flipping controls across painless as far as players are concerned.
i find it hilarious that a normal controller would get completely annhilated by a single joycon.
Gyro was made for aiming.
For sure! It's perfect for the job
Love the real time animated controller on the side!
When i first heard about Overwatch coming to Switch i didn’t really care because why would i play a fps with a controller. But now thanks to you im actually kinda hyped
That's a big compliment! Thank you! We can only hope for the best :)
If I get my hands on the Switch version I'd like to do a comparison to playing with Switch controllers on PC.
Gyro Gaming thats a great idea. Would be interesting to see the difference
Overwatch on Switch will still suffer from 30 fps lock, but hopefully it won't be that bad as I imagine.
I think my dream game for officially using this kind of control scheme would be a Switch port of Quake 3 Arena. Imagine just whipping out a 1 on 1 split-screen match at any time in tabletop mode. For now, I think the closest we've come are Voxel Shot and Voxel Sword. Instead of having a button for disabling gyro it just lets you turn with the west and east face buttons similar to how the Splatoon games handle right analog inputs, but otherwise it's basically the same idea.
Ooh yeah, Quake 3 on Switch would be cool! 60fps, split-screen, gyro aiming. I'll have to check out Voxel Shot and Voxel Sword. That sounds like a sensible way to do things if you have the buttons to spare.
Great content bud. All the best
😳 Thanks a bunch! Really appreciate it!
You are insanely low on subs you are doing more innovating then most the industry I can't wait to see more of your videos.
Thanks so much :)
@@JibbSmartGD my pleasure about to give that software a try
Your videos are inspiring, i just bought overwatch on switch and strugglig on it coming from a pc gamer. Im looking for gyro aiming guides and you have the best content out there. I hope we can see gyro aiming guide/tips&tricks on Switch soon with dual joycon. This is nice! Im subscribing!
Thank you for the kind words and for subscribing! That's a good idea -- helping players get comfortable with gyro controls. Whether moving from mouse and keyboard or upgrading from just using thumbsticks, there is a learning curve.
I haven't gotten my hands on the Switch version of Overwatch yet, but I'd like to. I've seen the options they have available, and they're better than some, but not amazing. The real test is gonna be how the controls feel, and I'm keen to check it out!
@@JibbSmartGD im looking forward for your guide bro, by just watching you play on a single joycon i learned new things.like disabling gyro to get back on default position.tips like this would help a learning person like me on gyro controls.i played splatoon about more than a year ago and i was okayish with gyros. I have no talent with thumbsticks, and i know gyro is the future of shooter games that's why i want to skip with thumbsticks. With OW, i tried doing some workshop training maps but out of the blue i just had a simulation sickness,LOL guess i should stuck to some basics first. I'll willingly help on sharing your vids to gain more audience and open others mind on gyro aiming.
Sharing is such a huge help :) You're right, I think, that gyro is the future of games like these! So much potential.
Just so you know, I probably have a couple of other videos to do before I come back to Overwatch. I never really know for sure what's going to be next until I'm editing the video, and each video can take weeks to make.
@@JibbSmartGD no problem bro, even on other games, we still appreciate your vids bigtime.although some might not apply like 'flick sticks' which is none existent on Overwatch, but gyro aiming techniques is still aiming techniques, you can still apply it on any games, its just a matter on how you can adjust it to deal with the lacking features.
i still dream about using my wii remote in fps games, specially with the motion plus, since it's their obligatory complement to the controller
I mostly missed out on those, I'm afraid. But I'm sure we can see something like that again if games embrace gyro controls!
@@JibbSmartGD the IR is really good to 'calibrate' the gyro on the fly, i only know about that because Nerrel made a video about motion controls in his channel. His example: The legend of zelda skyward sword uses the wii motion plus and it was the last zelda game to launch on wii so it benefits from the experience of other games like Wii Sports Resort, if you swing your controller too much it will start to drift, but if your pointer detects the IR it will automatically fix the drift, it's not a 100% calibration because i remember having to stop playing just to calibrate, unfortunately the IR pointer died with the wii so we don't have one more feature to enhance the gyro
That makes sense :)
I play Fortnite on switch like this. Wii mote style. Nice vid 👍 and in the switch version of overwatch they have an option where you can continuously turn the camera with the gyro. Can’t wait to try it out
Nice! I think there's so much Fortnite's gyro aiming could do better, but I'm so glad the option is there :) Let me know how you think Overwatch compares
@@JibbSmartGD 👍
@@JibbSmartGD ps4 need gyro too
Good work and exactly what I was looking for
Thank you :)
this is really neat!
Thanks!
Really cool stuff!
Thanks very much :)
I have a not so unique situation that I am surprised that no matter what, I keep running into a couple tiny problems that prevent me from utilizing a solution such as joyshockmapper. I am, however, convinced JSM IS the solution, I just need some advice... I have gamed my whole life from Atari, NES, SNES, to early day PC games like wolfenstein 3D and Warcraft... I am now disabled and no longer can utilize a full sized controller. i am limited to my right hand, so think about my necessity to swap the left and right sticks when using a single right half of a joycon, and I also cant hold the controller sideways but must implement Roll vs Yaw (I could be wrong here) when gyro aiming. The joycon was the firstr thing I bought after my accident as it intuitively made sense, but I can't seem to get where I am trying to go with it :( I know there are so many other disabled individuals that must have the same need, and I am not quite ready to give up and drop $200 on an Azeron just yet. Gyro controls are what I want/need and I cant express enough the happiness it would bring me if someone could help :)
Hi Curtis! I think JSM and/or something like it could indeed be just what you need. You can map movement to any stick, you can make the controls change at the press of a button, and you can fully customise how gyro maps to mouse. Most of my videos have a link in the description to the gyro gaming discord server, where there are lots of people (including me) who'd be up for discussing and helping you figure something out that works for you.
Or you can ask here and I'll try to help you when I can :)
Hey Jibb, love your in depth look into gyro, found your vids thanks to nerrel regarding motion controllers. have a few questions. Currently using the ds4 on steams overlay to play Overwatch with gyro but I'm having hard time finding the best output or style for gaming, do you have any tips or references I could go to? thanks!
Hi Vincent! Thank you :) I used to play Overwatch with Steam, too, before I made JoyShockMapper. Overwatch is a game with lots of movement, so it can be harder to find a sensitivity that works well for every situation. I've found that having some acceleration helps with my range of movement at the cost of some precision. I also think it's super important to have a button to disable the gyro so you can reposition the controller without moving the camera.
The gyro gaming discord is a great place to talk about different settings people prefer, whether using Steam, JSM, DS4Windows, reWASD, or anything else. There's an invitation link in the description of most of my videos if you'd like to join :)
There's a few games coming to Switch that I'd really like to see good gyro for, and those are Spellbreak and Rogue Company. In the case of Rogue Company I'm slightly worried because it's Hi-Rez, and when Realm Royale added gyro they just copied the garbage gyro from Paladins that drifts around.
I'll see if I can bring the attention of the Spellbreak devs to this wiki, it seems like just the resource needed.
That'd be great! I was disappointed with Paladins' gyro controls -- both the settings available and their instability
@@JibbSmartGD No kidding! It took months of asking and pretty much a whole Switch-community uprising until we got an option to *disable aim assist* if you can believe that.
Oof! I was trying to disable acceleration by turning it down to 0, but 0 doesn't mean 0, apparently (on PC with a DualShock 4, anyway). I don't mind acceleration with the right settings, but let me turn it off, and why does 0 not mean 0?
@@JibbSmartGD From what I understand, the acceleration is only for the stick controls, you can't even turn off the acceleration for the motion (unless they changed something in the last 4 months, when I stopped playing). I had a much funner time with the game when I switched to the PC version and used the Steam Input to map the gyro to the mouse.
I personally prefer to have absolutely no acceleration, but sometimes a little is needed for when I need to both look around quickly and aim long distances. That being said though, the flick stick thing I've seen in your videos looks like the perfect tool to where I wouldn't need acceleration, so I'll definitely be seeing if I can get that to work!
Oh, that might explain it. Real shame it can't be disabled. Yeah, Steam does a much better job. Credit where credit's due, I'm really glad Hi-Rez is doing gyro on Switch AND PS4. I just wish they'd do a better job of it. Bad implementations make people think gyro's no good.
If you hit any snags with flick stick, let me know, or check out the gyro gaming Discord -- there are lots of helpful people there, for anything from JSM, Steam, reWASD, and anything else, really.
hey, i've found your channel recently with solarlight, and it got me curious, and i want to play in an even wierder way: switch only the mouse for the controller (i mean i do wanna play with that wierd new way of aiming, but i have an Azeron, which is already a wierd thing in itself, it did cost me a lost so i don't really wanna ditch the thing cuz "controller's looks fun lol") so i thought "why not use a one handed controller, aka a joycon or a wiimote, instead of my mouse, and keep my azeron, thing is i don't really know how to change the gyro in the txt, because it would use the tilting of the joycon, as i'm holding it vertically and not horizontally, is there a way of doing it like that, and if so, what do i need to modify? i thank anyone that took the time to read me and help me
sorry i'm an absolute dumbass i just had to take the classic script and not the one joycon script...
I'm glad you got it working :)
I’m curious how you got that animated joycon on the left side?
Hi! It's a program I made called JoyShockMapper. It's not publicly available yet, I'm afraid
@@JibbSmartGD gotcha, I’ve recently wanted to get into streaming apex with joycons and this animated display looks incredible. I hope it’s available in the future.
@@Flubbb Thanks! I do hope to finish it before much longer
Would it be possible to use one joycon to aim and the other joycon to do other motion controls, like for example, doing a punching motion with it to melee
Sort of. By default only the right Joy-Con is used for aiming and the left can be used for other motion controls (though this can be changed). Can't do shakes yet, but tilts and leans can be bound like any button input
Thank you i use The Tool to Play with the Titan one Device with joycon as mouse… can you make a Version where you program this not for mouse for Virtual Xbox 360 Controler Gyro
Virtual Xbox 360? Do you mean sending fake stick inputs instead of fake mouse inputs?
@@JibbSmartGD yes Like this Programm for the wiimote you can emulate Xbox 360 Controller touchmote.net/
@@teddymixes it is necessary to program the emulation of the stick, it will not have as good aim as a mouse. I've been doing this for your controller. Just have to make the settings for each game.
Ah. I probably won't do this any time soon. It's a much bigger task to make it work as a virtual XInput device than as a virtual keyboard and mouse. While more features are coming, and I'm no longer the only programmer working on JSM, I do want to keep it light and simple.
@@JibbSmartGD You can take it github.com/nefarius/ScpToolkit
I can’t imagine playing a game like that on such a small controller lol. Would you happen to be using a joy con grip.
I did not use a grip :) It's definitely harder than using a full-size controller, even if the full-size controller had the same number of buttons and sticks as a single Joy-Con. I wouldn't recommend it without good reason (local multiplayer on the go, for example, which currently can't be done with JSM)
you crazy for trying this lol
Very interesting video. Question: Why don't you use L/ZL for toogle actions, things less dependant on timing or "UI stuff"? i mean by using taps/holds there are least for inputs you could add there: Stuff like Switching Hero, Stats, Menu, Voice or the ultimate.
My next question is if you have access to accelerometer data? You could detect stuff like a quick shake to trigger a reload and acceleration in a given axis to toogle a crouch for example. This gestures are both intuitive and safe enough to map to a waggle. i think there's quite a lot of improvement to make in that control scheme to make more intuitive and less convulted even with the limited inputs of a single joycon.
You could try mapping some actions to L/ZL. I find it cumbersome to press while playing, or easy to press accidentally. But I think you have the right idea with using it for non-combat actions.
I do have access to the accelerometer data, but it's not currently exposed by JoyShockMapper. It seems to me that anything one can do with a shake of the controller is even better done with the press of a button. Reload is a time-critical action in the heat of battle, and already works well with a button press. And I wouldn't want sudden controller movements to mess with aiming.
Having said that, it's probably worth experimenting with :)
@@JibbSmartGD "It seems to me that anything one can do with a shake of the controller is even better done with the press of a button. "
Believe or not "waggle" has its place when it's complementary to a well tought out button scheme. In the case of reloading, this action is sort of mutually exclusive to aiming/shooting, that is, you can't shoot while reloading and even if the shake messed your aiming you still have time to refocus on the target while the loading animation is playing.
"Waggle" gestures can have their place when they make the interface more intuitive, when they make the button mapping less convoluted (like Overwatch single Joycon), when they minimize finger repositioning or when the gestures corresponds better to the ingame action thus giving a better "feelback".
I get what you mean with the mutually exclusive actions. It's not a bad choice for a shake or waggle input, but I prefer the responsiveness of a button, as well as still being able to watch a target or my environment without shaking my view.
You make a good point about these options making button mapping less convoluted. Having said that, waggles can easily be triggered accidentally or not triggered when they're meant to. Gestures need to be super simple to be responsive, but the quicker the game responds to a gesture, the less sure it can be that it was really an intentional gesture as opposed to an unintended bump. Since responsiveness is often so important, it's usually easier to have just one more complicated button mapping than to use a gesture. Of course, "one more complicated button mapping" can only go so far.
I do want to explore this further. The plan is to eventually add shakes and leans as inputs in JoyShockMapper to make it easier for others to try this stuff out while I experiment further.
@@JibbSmartGD"waggles can easily be triggered accidentally or not triggered when they're meant to". Well sure, but that's basically agreing with the people that think there's no space for Gyro Aim in gaming. After all, the more motion that is needed to trigger an action the more room for error that opens. But like i said, this is easily overcome with smart implementation. Let me give you an example: In Pikmin there's a side to side shake of the Nunchuck that splits all following Pikmin into colored groups. In 100s of playing hours the action didn't fail or accidentally trigger. There's also the context of this video, the reason gestures are considered for certain actions is due to the limited available inputs.
With that said there's a lot of value in these 1 Joycon videos you are making because it opens the floor for consideration of more thoughtful implementation of control schemes. Developers tend to be too comformist most of the time with them.
Thanks for your kind words. I appreciate you pushing for more thorough exploration of the possibilities.
"Well sure, but that's basically agreing with the people that think there's no space for Gyro Aim in gaming. After all, the more motion that is needed to trigger an action the more room for error that opens." Good gyro controls are mouse-like. It's not about moving too much to trigger an action or too little and accidentally not triggering an action. I mean, sometimes it is -- sometimes games have a minimum movement threshold, for example. These are bad implementations. But good gyro controls give you a directness of control that is totally different from having specific gestures trigger specific actions, so I have to disagree with you here.
However, it only just occurred to me that I was imagining having to use a shake gesture with the same hand that I'm aiming with. But from your Pikmin example -- you're talking about a shake gesture with the non-aiming Joy-Con, right? I think I was getting mixed up between the single-Joy-Con stuff and the split-Joy-Con stuff. I see the usefulness there, sure.
stupid question... can you use Two joycons? and if yes.. is there a fatter joycons with gyro?
Sure can! I don't know about fatter Joy-Cons, though
Joy-cons and Mouse on PC thoughts ps I have bad hands and can't use a keyboard
when using the program is the movement 8 direction or a regular thumbstick?
8 direction, for now
I'm using tilt controls!
Truly the crackhead way to play
Thanks?
the wii motion plus is different to the technology of ps4 or switch?
I think the Wii Motion Plus is the same tech -- the Wiimote just used an accelerometer (as far as I know), but Motion Plus added gyro
@@JibbSmartGD so the wii motion plus could be compatible with this project?
In theory, but I wouldn't be able to add it myself since I don't have one
@@JibbSmartGD great
I dont know if you masochist or genies
How do you charge the controller without the console? Would that work?
There's a "charging grip" that connects the controllers so you can hold them like one controller and also charges them when connected by USB-C. Or you can get a charging station that will charge up to 4 Joy-Cons at the same time
@@JibbSmartGD I would only wanna use one, so maybe the charging dock would work best. I'd like to borrow a buddies joycon to try this soon, but the software is a little confusing. Is there a GUI I'm missing or is there a "quick-start" page I could learn from? TIA, this looks awesome!
Thanks :) There's no GUI, I'm afraid. The JoyShockMapper guide on GyroWiki looks long, but it starts with the essentials and gets gradually more in-depth, so you can just do sections 1 & 2 if you just want to get started as quickly as possible:
gyrowiki.jibbsmart.com/blog:joyshockmapper-guide
@@JibbSmartGD I might try to grab one tomorrow, but how do I connect the joycon to the PC? Bluetooth? Or do I HAVE to get a grip/case with a usb connection?
@@JibbSmartGD Nevermind its bluetooth
Who does this guy think he’s fooling? Overwatch switch servers aren’t live yet till 11 am pdt, nyc 2pm edt. It’s clearly pc gameplay.
Not trying to fool anyone. JSM is a PC tool, and I make it clear in the video...
But I realise it's confusing since the Switch version is coming out soon. I'll update the video title. I don't normally worry too much about specifying platform because all my videos are on PC, but I see how this is different :)
He only said he is playing with a switch joy-con, not that he is playing on the switch
Oh, you might be right D: Umm... Mine was, like, counter-satire?
HAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHA