Great video presentation and use of oddities to see them perform in an all in one video. Thank you for all you do. Stay safe and healthy in these difficult times.
Excellent test! 👍 Every *responsible* shooter MUST test their projectiles, & you made a perfect (educated) guess at the depth required! We are blessed with bullet technology now.
Love the detailed video! Thank you so much for putting this test together. The .357 is one of my all time classic favirite handgun rounds. There is, as you demonstrated so well, such a wide variety of rounds for various applications.
Until the 44 and the 10mm became popular the 357 was considered the handgun to use for bears. I think it all depends on which ammo you load the gun with.
Thanks for the great comparison. The .357 round has the best overall performance of my collection. I can fire them from my Taurus Tracker with a 4" barrel or my Rossi M92 with a 20". Results are formidable.
This review reminds of way back, in another time, when you could find .357 available. I just waited a full 3 months for (1) box of 50. My local gun shop charged me $58.00 for it. I had to buy it because they ordered & held it for me. I can only dream of having a variety of .357 like what's in your video. Ammo times are a bi#ch! Thanks & keep em' coming!
Thanks for a much needed test. I know Cops loved this round and some carry a snub nose .357 Magnum as back up as they have not swallowed the 9mm Kool Aide.
Sam, Appreciate your emphasis on safety for this 'extreme' testing. Too many shooters still become injured from underestimating the risk of ricochet by not setting up to minimize the potential of direct bullet rebound .
Thanks, that was a lot more practical than ballistic gel. At least for me, I hope to never be in the situation to shoot a person. But hunting and blowing stuff up for fun and sport makes this a very informative video
Speaking as a reloader, .357 magnum is probably the most versatile pistol round available. Different bullets, powders, and charges make it customizable to almost any purpose. It's major (only?) weakness is that its a rimmed cartridge, so it doesn't function well in an autoloader.
I agree. And within what can be loaded, I personally feel like the .38 Special is the most versatile in a lot of ways, mostly as most people can shoot that ammo easily and there's no wear and tear on your gun especially with 158 gr bullets. I have loaded as high as 213 gr in .38 Special and went as low as the ARX in .38 Special, I think 77 gr or something like that. I mean you can do whatever, I have loaded .38 Short Colt at 500 FPS and while my hand loaded .357 Mag ammo is typically low end, I have shot ammo up to 800 ft lbs energy in this revolver. Just lots to work with.
@@GunSam Agreed. I consider .38 Special to be a part of the .357 "spectrum". For those (rare) occasions I carry a revolver in town, it's probably loaded to .38 +P specs.
Maybe. Not sure about as good as hollow points, I guess I need more comparisons as the ones I have done don't show them as that great, however water jugs might not be the medium to show much of anything.
@@GunSam I wouldnt say as good as premium JHP's. But compared to stuff like Remington, Winchester, and the likes... they certainly perform on par or at least consistently compared to them. It also depends on if you go with the Xtreme Penetrator or Xtreme Defender. There is a noticeable difference in the Defender with broader wound tracts and less penetration. The Penetrator though, people get sold on the name thinking it's going to do something special. In reality, it performs about on par wth FMJ but at least has better wounding characteristics. So it seems to be ideal for those who need what FMJ brings to the table but would like a hollow point when they hit the target. There've been several people who have tested these rounds fortunately though and that seems to be the general conclusion. That and the Lehigh's in general seem to benefit short barrel firearms and small caliber guns like .32's, .380's, and the likes.
I am now in the unusual position of owning a .357 Magnum S&W 686 revolver (7 inch barrel 3-5-7 series) and I have yet to shoot it. I'll get to the range in a week or so. In the mean time I'm trying to learn about it and related things like the best ammo. So this was really helpful, thanks! Perhaps I don't need the deepest penetrator but it's still good to know about them and fun to watch a video that showcases the sheer power of the round. Thanks again!
Thanks for watching. A 7" .357 is rather an odd length, so finding ballistic info on it might be difficult. I'd probably say look for data on 6" barrels and add a conservative 5% velocity to it. Like 1,500 FPS= 1,575 FPS etc. I could be wrong on the numbers but that sounds about right to me.
I have a 686-6 /seven shot and love it. It absorbs recoil very well with anything you shoot. The trigger on the other hand needs to be broken in lol. After about 50 rounds it will smooth out. It’s also a nail driver to. You can’t go wrong with mr smith and Wesson.
I was surprised at how far that civil defense bullet went, those super lightweight bullets usually don't penetrate as much as heavier bullets. I have a speedloader with those for raccoons or possums & they work for small animals.
Those ARX rounds are kind of a goofy material but I will say, the 357 mag ARX being very little recoil was what I really liked about it for 38 spl. If they were a fancy self defense round and therefore more expensive, I'd be buying a lot of them for my J-Frame snubby. Shooting them were like a pleasant break from the 158gr stuff I was shooting prior.
Thanks! I been thinking of doing something similar but different with some 9mm ammo, like 18 gauge steel/1.5" white wood, and THEN my normal ballistic bologna pack with the denim/meat/MDF board/water. I just haven't decided yet since I only have the ammo I want to test in 9mm, and all are 124+P, Win PDX1(ranger), Rem Golden Saber Bonded, Speer Gold Dot and Federal HST. I just want to see how those do before I get into like the Xtreme stuff.
The Barnes vortex 140 grain copper hollow point Is a very accurate round out of my S&W 19-6 with a 6 inch barrel, I saw it at my local Cabela’s and I was like I’ll give it a try.
I've tried a few of these in my smith 686 and taurus 605. Good tests nice to see how some of these reacted , I've used and taken hard cast to use for self defense out in bear country
Great comparison video Gun Sam! Your channel has a great balance of entertainment and experiential education. I'm always interested in seeing how different amunition performs out of your "standard" tests but the variety is awesome too.👌
Very interesting test. I don't remember the respective muzzle velocities of those loads. I'm trying to work out if energy or momentum are more important on hard barriers since they do compress a little in this case. Against water, I would say momentum is your big factor. Of course bullet deformation eats energy and you need that too.
In this 4" revolver; Civil Defense 50 gr@2,005 FPS/446 FPE. Barnes VorTX 140 gr@1,255 FPS/490 FPE. Underwood Xtreme Penetrator 140 gr@1,315 FPS/537 FPE. Fort Scott TUI 125 gr@1,391 FPS/537 FPE. Federal Hydrashok 158 gr@ 1,287 FPS/581 FPE. Underwood Hard Cast 180 gr@1,221 FPS/596 FPE. Barnes 110 gr never tested in 4", in 2" 110 gr@1,269 FPS/393 FPE (estimated 1,400 FPS in 4" 479 FPE). Inceptor ARX 86 gr never tested in 4", in 2" 86 gr@1,404 FPS/376 FPE(estimated 1,600 FPS/489 FPE in 4"). I know the estimates for the two never actually ran in the 4" barrel kind of sucks but judging by energy increase with these type of rounds I feel like they are probably close.
When I want to have higher precision from my .357 rifle I use the Barnes Vor-TX 140 grain rounds. Still not moa due to .357 bad ballistic coefficient, but the groups go from 6"-10" to 2"- 3".
interesting, but surprising result with the liberty defense round. i had seen another video where a short barreled 9mm was used firing a 50 gr liberty defense round. at a claimed 2000 fps muzzle velocity, it was able to penetrate things that a 115 gr fmj wasn't.
Yeah I think I got over 2,000 FPS with the 9mm version, yet the .357 version is less powerful. It's messed up. How can anyone load a 9mm 1/3 more powerful than a .357 Magnum? That's exactly what they did. I will say that this ".357 Magnum" is actually a .38 Special for exterior ballistics.
Thanks for the great demonstration. It looked to me like the 180 and 140 g Barnes performed similarly. Did you measure the expanded diameters? Looks like the Barns 140 would be a great hunting round. I currently have the Underwood 180, and the Barnes 140. I have tried the 140 penetrator in two 357 mag revolvers and they did not group well for me.
Thank you. I did not measure them, but it looks like the hard cast and Hydrashok are just shy of half an inch, just from my guess. The others looked maybe .38 to .42 or about in there.
👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏another great video Sam, .357 mag is no joke , thanks Sam for all those videos , I want to see how far regular 9mm or 9mm +p will do ? Great video man
Thanks. I actually attempted that this week and literally everything went wrong, I did used this exact setup but all the bullets passed through, my camera tripod broke and I was off screen the whole vid etc. So I decided to do .357 Mag as I used up all the uncommon 9mm ammo I had with that test.
Gun Sam thank you so much. I can just imagine the effort it took to do this video, and believe me it helps out a lot. I like the hard cast 180s in my own 686+, what is your general impression of the Fort Scott and Extreme Penetrator and do you think all copper bullets offer advantages over traditional lead bullets in terms of bullet performance at high velocities? I would love to see you do some 10MM tests, as I think that round has tremendous potential. The 45 ACP is great and yes as you've shown in test after test it has great momentum, but I think 10MM loaded heavy but not as hot, not the "holy grail" of the old 44/40 round of 200 grain bullet at 1200fps out of a carbine that Elmer Keith and Bill Jordan wanted for the .41 Magnum nor the classic Norma load that Col. Cooper developed for the 10 mm but the same bullet at 1000 fps has advantages over the .45 ACP: greater ballistic coefficient, flatter trajectory, better hard barrier penetration, better recoil control. And in an autoloader more rounds (generally 1-2 more) and fits your concept of a 40 caliber revolver cartridge. Given that both Smith and Ruger offer 10mm revolvers. Anyway thanks for what must have been a tremendous amount of money and work to produce this video. I am giving serious consideration to the extreme penetrators.
Thanks, this video actually wasn't too difficult, I had this stuff lying around to shoot at. As far as TUI and the Xtreme bullets, I am not really sold on them. In fact I suspect that they might have lower velocity than jacketed bullets despite a jacketed being copper because I always felt like a jacketed will deform in the bore and exit the muzzle easier, but solid copper might not deform at all and the bore takes on all of that friction, but that's just a theory. I have noticed though that with solid copper I have got less velocity than jacketed, but they are all different factory loads so again no way to know. As far as 10mm, I been debating getting a 10mm barrel for my Glock 41 as all i'd need to do is get a stronger spring and a Glock 20 magazine to be able to run 10mm, but currently I can't get the barrel I want as none in stock.
LeHigh really named their Extreme Penetrator bullet incorrectly. (They make the underwood bullet) It is named that because it can penetrate barriers like an FMJ, but gives a good wound channel. FMJs penetrate more in ballistics gel tests, but have no wound channel. Extreme pentrators are not stopped by clothes, bone, etc., but also have a good wound channel because they do not have to expand like hollow points. Therefore the name 'Extreme'. I carry them in my pocket 380 for this very reason. Good penetration PLUS wound channel out of a light (95 grain) bullet traveling not so fast out of a short barrel. Tests have been awesome with them. Better than any hollow point of any manufacturer.
I will have to look into them further. On a different note referencing revolvers, it does seem like full copper bullets even in low end .357 Mag essentially eliminate most cylinder gap gas loss. Makes sense as the less density always makes them longer, keeping them over the cylinder gap just long enough to seal it during burn. Of course this would have other factors in the mix like powder and or low weight for caliber bullets, but traditional weights seem to work better for less gas loss than jacketed.
Would there be any significant difference in using either a longer barrel revolver such as 6 inch or 8 inch and even compare to a rifle with 16 -18 inch barrel. Food for thought. Have a great day and a better tomorrow.
@@GunSam I had a friend handled me reversed hollowbase wadcutters to shoot armadillo . we chrno them at about 700 fps in a 686 with 6 inch barrel they were pretty accurate to about 20 yards. I still have a few . I bought a box of the HST but have not tried them yet. Thanks again for the info have a great day and a better tomorrow
Excellent test, Sam. On an unrelated note: Which ammo would you expect to have more recoil on a dual cylinder snub revolver, 9mm or 38sp (standard load similar bullet weights)?
Thanks. If you were to compare lets say 125 gr+P .38 Special to 124 gr standard pressure 9mm, the actual recoil force would be about the same but the 9mm might be just a little snappier but in ft lbs recoil, no more than .38 Special+P. Now with .38 Special standard pressure, you would probably have a tad less but not a lot less recoil.
@@GunSam thanks! I rather bother you w questions to save time doing trial and error at the range w my daughter. Will search your videos to find penetration on 38 (short) in case 38sp is still too much for her... A recent video on .32 shows great penetration, so I would imagine .38 shouldn't be much less... 😎👌
@@mitubogoogle The precision one 380 xtp 80 grain rds. are meeting FBI standards for penetration. Consistent 13.5 inches of penetration in ballistic gel with denim. Might be a good option.
Yes, I'm late to this party. First off, you showed common sense when shooting at steel by maintaining a safe distance AND wearing eye protection. You may want to stress that in future videos for newer shooters. It can't hurt. Perhaps the Federal round can be considered a surprise "winner" if you factor in cost and its ready availability. It did everything one could ask of it and had great expansion. Really thought the hard cast round would have the most penetration.
I'm glad and sad .357 is gaining fans... Ammo Manufacturers Need to Dedicate & Expand Production Capacity to Meet Demand of .38 & .357 Mag.... This round is obviously Never getting Old... Ramp up production if you're smart. I want to see price per round drop...Lever guns,5,6,7, and 8 shot wheel guns in this caliber flying off shelves... Just Need Semi-Auto Carbine/Rifle platform offerings to seal the deal... (Kel-Tec has .22 Mag Rimmed Semi-Auto magazine they could upscale!!! , Coonan Mags, Desert Eagle .357 mags...) I want a M1 .357 Carbine Woodstock rifle dag nabbit with 10 & 20rnd Mags for $600 or less, and a AR pistol variation with a 12" Barrel for $500ish... Lol. If you build it, they will come...( i only expect 15% Royalty payment if yall steal my ideas! I will even help operate CNC machining lol)
I been wondering for a long time why not make a .357 Mag HST the way the .38 Special HST is made. Sure the energy would be about at a 9mm level, but that's perfect for a short barrel load.
What about Grizzly Cartridge ammunition? It's the only 357 magnum ammo I found that's rated 1700 ft/s, with a 200 grain bullet. I haven't bought any, though.
@@GunSam I'd love to see it in action, and how it compares to the normal rounds. It's a perfect round for those impressive hand-tanks people keep talking about - the Rugers.
200 gr. @1700 fps! That's sizzling ! Were he here , that round would catch Elmer Keith's attention. IMHO, reserve that cartridge for testing from a large frame heavy duty gun such as a Model 28 or 27 S&W.
I have considered it many times, but because I don't know how it is really going to compare to any auto, I haven't done it. I would love to get a .32 ACP pistol with like a 3" pistol this would be great to compare.
Why would you want something that penetrates through a target? I would want a round to expand on impact, and create a large wound cavity and not cause any collateral damage behind the target.
It's good to know what does or does not penetrate through a hard barrier. There's probably not a lot of use for hard barrier penetration in .357 Mag as cops don't carry them, but in something like 9mm they often want hard barrier penetration to shoot through car doors etc.
Please check out Lead Bullets 4 Life, he's a good guy! ruclips.net/video/xnHUZw_2H3U/видео.html
Sorry, Sam you set the bar too high for him... Watched it, didn't even "get it" ...🙃 staying here...😬
@@mitubogoogle 8
I use 158G flat nose full metal jacket for self defense rounds. Then 180G Buffalo Bore hard cast flat nose for bear protection.
357 is a bad A&s round out of a hand cannon!
You are well served by ANY of these rounds for barrier penetration. Gotta love the .357!
interesting test. I like how you think!
That was cool. Thank you for the time and work you put into this video.
Thank you.
I concur. Thank you for the time and effort.
Well done ,that liberty shoved that disk in deep,those Barnes were surprising, Ft Scott must have bored straight with no tumbling .
Fort Scott Munitions TUI ammo tumbles once it hits soft tissue.
Great video presentation and use of oddities to see them perform in an all in one video. Thank you for all you do. Stay safe and healthy in these difficult times.
Thanks!
I just bought some of that Underwood 180 hardcast for woods carry
Excellent test! 👍
Every *responsible* shooter MUST test their projectiles, & you made a perfect (educated) guess at the depth required!
We are blessed with bullet technology now.
Thank you.
Thanks to Sam, we don't have to through the ordeal
Love the detailed video! Thank you so much for putting this test together. The .357 is one of my all time classic favirite handgun rounds. There is, as you demonstrated so well, such a wide variety of rounds for various applications.
Until the 44 and the 10mm became popular the 357 was considered the handgun to use for bears. I think it all depends on which ammo you load the gun with.
Thanks for the great comparison. The .357 round has the best overall performance of my collection. I can fire them from my Taurus Tracker with a 4" barrel or my Rossi M92 with a 20". Results are formidable.
This is the Best Test I've ever seen.
This review reminds of way back, in another time, when you could find .357 available. I just waited a full 3 months for (1) box of 50. My local gun shop charged me $58.00 for it. I had to buy it because they ordered & held it for me. I can only dream of having a variety of .357 like what's in your video. Ammo times are a bi#ch! Thanks & keep em' coming!
That was educational and fun all at the same time. Awesome channel and fun
Very nice demonstration. I like your style of presentation.
Thank you.
I will always keep my 357 Awesome 👌
I found it funny that as you were shooting left to right, you were "scooting" left to right. Found the new test satisfying
Just trying to make as straight on shot as possible.
@@GunSam 👍
Great video and analysis
A great comparison video .
Thanks!
Thanks for a much needed test. I know Cops loved this round and some carry a snub nose .357 Magnum as back up as they have not swallowed the 9mm Kool Aide.
You willing to take a hit from a 9mm.... I didn’t think so
@@evanmarks7912 more so rather than 357 magnum lol
Enjoyable video and nice comparison Sam!
And no baloney!
Thank you. Yes, one of my first in awhile without any bologna!
Well the liberty can go thru 3a vest I like the liberty. Great video as always.
Thanks. The Fort Scott can too.
Sam, Appreciate your emphasis on safety for this 'extreme' testing. Too many shooters still become injured from underestimating the risk of ricochet by not setting up to minimize the potential of direct bullet rebound .
Thanks, that was a lot more practical than ballistic gel. At least for me, I hope to never be in the situation to shoot a person. But hunting and blowing stuff up for fun and sport makes this a very informative video
Speaking as a reloader, .357 magnum is probably the most versatile pistol round available. Different bullets, powders, and charges make it customizable to almost any purpose. It's major (only?) weakness is that its a rimmed cartridge, so it doesn't function well in an autoloader.
I agree. And within what can be loaded, I personally feel like the .38 Special is the most versatile in a lot of ways, mostly as most people can shoot that ammo easily and there's no wear and tear on your gun especially with 158 gr bullets. I have loaded as high as 213 gr in .38 Special and went as low as the ARX in .38 Special, I think 77 gr or something like that. I mean you can do whatever, I have loaded .38 Short Colt at 500 FPS and while my hand loaded .357 Mag ammo is typically low end, I have shot ammo up to 800 ft lbs energy in this revolver. Just lots to work with.
@@GunSam Agreed. I consider .38 Special to be a part of the .357 "spectrum". For those (rare) occasions I carry a revolver in town, it's probably loaded to .38 +P specs.
wow great video! thank you the 140 grain extreme penetrator is my small bear defense round for out in the woods. its good to see it perform so well
Yes excellent 👏 review. . I really thought the 180 hard cast would win and the Liberty is for attackers wearing a vest
Thanks. That Fort Scott TUI would go through one too.
I always enjoy your videos. Especially anything to do with .38 Spc or ..357 Mag.
Nice comparison
Thanks!
👍 good review I remember when you shot the Buffalo Bore 180grain Outdoorsman completely thru..... 7...... 2x4's and stuck in the backstop.
Excellent review and comparison !🇺🇸🗽👍
Thank you.
Lehigh projectiles work very well. In spite the penetration, when going through fluid substances they act equal or better than hollow points.
Maybe. Not sure about as good as hollow points, I guess I need more comparisons as the ones I have done don't show them as that great, however water jugs might not be the medium to show much of anything.
Tim did quite a bit of testing on the stuff.
ruclips.net/video/ClJcJ8LQFbQ/видео.html
@@GunSam I wouldnt say as good as premium JHP's. But compared to stuff like Remington, Winchester, and the likes... they certainly perform on par or at least consistently compared to them. It also depends on if you go with the Xtreme Penetrator or Xtreme Defender. There is a noticeable difference in the Defender with broader wound tracts and less penetration. The Penetrator though, people get sold on the name thinking it's going to do something special. In reality, it performs about on par wth FMJ but at least has better wounding characteristics. So it seems to be ideal for those who need what FMJ brings to the table but would like a hollow point when they hit the target.
There've been several people who have tested these rounds fortunately though and that seems to be the general conclusion. That and the Lehigh's in general seem to benefit short barrel firearms and small caliber guns like .32's, .380's, and the likes.
thanks! great video. well done!
Gun Sam is becoming the new TNoutdoors9, another great video.
Good information
I am now in the unusual position of owning a .357 Magnum S&W 686 revolver (7 inch barrel 3-5-7 series) and I have yet to shoot it. I'll get to the range in a week or so. In the mean time I'm trying to learn about it and related things like the best ammo. So this was really helpful, thanks! Perhaps I don't need the deepest penetrator but it's still good to know about them and fun to watch a video that showcases the sheer power of the round. Thanks again!
Thanks for watching. A 7" .357 is rather an odd length, so finding ballistic info on it might be difficult. I'd probably say look for data on 6" barrels and add a conservative 5% velocity to it. Like 1,500 FPS= 1,575 FPS etc. I could be wrong on the numbers but that sounds about right to me.
I have a 686-6 /seven shot and love it. It absorbs recoil very well with anything you shoot. The trigger on the other hand needs to be broken in lol. After about 50 rounds it will smooth out. It’s also a nail driver to. You can’t go wrong with mr smith and Wesson.
Nice .357 focus of various ammunition.
Dude just has a million dollars worth of ammo 🤣
Another great video. You are the go to for revolver rounds like 38/357. Thanks for the revolver love you throw out.
Thanks!
This is an excellent pernertation test big time. It beats those jell blocks hands down.
Looking forward to more penetration test.
Thank you.
@@GunSam do you think you could do a test for 9 mm.
I was surprised at how far that civil defense bullet went, those super lightweight bullets usually don't penetrate as much as heavier bullets. I have a speedloader with those for raccoons or possums & they work for small animals.
Those ARX rounds are kind of a goofy material but I will say, the 357 mag ARX being very little recoil was what I really liked about it for 38 spl. If they were a fancy self defense round and therefore more expensive, I'd be buying a lot of them for my J-Frame snubby. Shooting them were like a pleasant break from the 158gr stuff I was shooting prior.
Very nice video brother. I'm a big fan of a nice hqrd cast piece of lead for the 357mag , seem to always get good expansion and penetration.
Thank you.
I love these type of videos Sam!! I've tested the extreme penetrator and it perform like it says 👍👍
Thanks! I been thinking of doing something similar but different with some 9mm ammo, like 18 gauge steel/1.5" white wood, and THEN my normal ballistic bologna pack with the denim/meat/MDF board/water. I just haven't decided yet since I only have the ammo I want to test in 9mm, and all are 124+P, Win PDX1(ranger), Rem Golden Saber Bonded, Speer Gold Dot and Federal HST. I just want to see how those do before I get into like the Xtreme stuff.
Very interesting test. Thanks for sharing. Take care.
Thank you, you too.
The Barnes vortex 140 grain copper hollow point Is a very accurate round out of my S&W 19-6 with a 6 inch barrel, I saw it at my local Cabela’s and I was like I’ll give it a try.
Love you’re videos
Thanks for posting. Great content.
Thank you, thanks for watching!
Good video as usual, the extreme penetrator must be made of a really dense material!
Thanks. Just pure copper from what I know.
@@GunSam ok thanks
@@GunSam , Is the copper construction responsible for its greater resistance to deformation and the penetration it demonstrated?
Recently watched a video and was pleasantly surprised that the Liberty Civil Defense ammo penitrated level 3A body armor
I've tried a few of these in my smith 686 and taurus 605. Good tests nice to see how some of these reacted , I've used and taken hard cast to use for self defense out in bear country
Great comparison video Gun Sam!
Your channel has a great balance of entertainment and experiential education. I'm always interested in seeing how different amunition performs out of your "standard" tests but the variety is awesome too.👌
Thanks!
Should have edited this so it looked like you have a nine shooter. Would have been fun to see those comments 😂
Not bad. Interesting for sure
Kentucky ballistics uses blocks of clay, it shows how powerful the impact is
Very interesting test. I don't remember the respective muzzle velocities of those loads. I'm trying to work out if energy or momentum are more important on hard barriers since they do compress a little in this case. Against water, I would say momentum is your big factor. Of course bullet deformation eats energy and you need that too.
I was going to list energy, but then it just became confusing. I might look them up and check back.
In this 4" revolver; Civil Defense 50 gr@2,005 FPS/446 FPE. Barnes VorTX 140 gr@1,255 FPS/490 FPE. Underwood Xtreme Penetrator 140 gr@1,315 FPS/537 FPE. Fort Scott TUI 125 gr@1,391 FPS/537 FPE. Federal Hydrashok 158 gr@ 1,287 FPS/581 FPE. Underwood Hard Cast 180 gr@1,221 FPS/596 FPE. Barnes 110 gr never tested in 4", in 2" 110 gr@1,269 FPS/393 FPE (estimated 1,400 FPS in 4" 479 FPE). Inceptor ARX 86 gr never tested in 4", in 2" 86 gr@1,404 FPS/376 FPE(estimated 1,600 FPS/489 FPE in 4"). I know the estimates for the two never actually ran in the 4" barrel kind of sucks but judging by energy increase with these type of rounds I feel like they are probably close.
First thing when I heard no pass through was that I had my money on the 180 grain hard cast lol
Nice work bud. Those civil defense look like good varmint rounds lol. I thought the polys would turn to dust for sure. Thanks.
Thanks for watching!
When I want to have higher precision from my .357 rifle I use the Barnes Vor-TX 140 grain rounds. Still not moa due to .357 bad ballistic coefficient, but the groups go from 6"-10" to 2"- 3".
interesting, but surprising result with the liberty defense round. i had seen another video where a short barreled 9mm was used firing a 50 gr liberty defense round. at a claimed 2000 fps muzzle velocity, it was able to penetrate things that a 115 gr fmj wasn't.
Yeah I think I got over 2,000 FPS with the 9mm version, yet the .357 version is less powerful. It's messed up. How can anyone load a 9mm 1/3 more powerful than a .357 Magnum? That's exactly what they did. I will say that this ".357 Magnum" is actually a .38 Special for exterior ballistics.
Thanks for the great demonstration. It looked to me like the 180 and 140 g Barnes performed similarly. Did you measure the expanded diameters? Looks like the Barns 140 would be a great hunting round. I currently have the Underwood 180, and the Barnes 140. I have tried the 140 penetrator in two 357 mag revolvers and they did not group well for me.
Thank you. I did not measure them, but it looks like the hard cast and Hydrashok are just shy of half an inch, just from my guess. The others looked maybe .38 to .42 or about in there.
Great video!!!
Great video -- Did you pay attention to the Fort Scott Ammo? Even in the daylight the looks like it would set something on fire wow
I didn't notice anything in particular.
👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏another great video Sam, .357 mag is no joke , thanks Sam for all those videos , I want to see how far regular 9mm or 9mm +p will do ?
Great video man
Thanks. I actually attempted that this week and literally everything went wrong, I did used this exact setup but all the bullets passed through, my camera tripod broke and I was off screen the whole vid etc. So I decided to do .357 Mag as I used up all the uncommon 9mm ammo I had with that test.
Good job
I don't like shooting the jugs in board box :)
Gun Sam thank you so much. I can just imagine the effort it took to do this video, and believe me it helps out a lot. I like the hard cast 180s in my own 686+, what is your general impression of the Fort Scott and Extreme Penetrator and do you think all copper bullets offer advantages over traditional lead bullets in terms of bullet performance at high velocities?
I would love to see you do some 10MM tests, as I think that round has tremendous potential. The 45 ACP is great and yes as you've shown in test after test it has great momentum, but I think 10MM loaded heavy but not as hot, not the "holy grail" of the old 44/40 round of 200 grain bullet at 1200fps out of a carbine that Elmer Keith and Bill Jordan wanted for the .41 Magnum nor the classic Norma load that Col. Cooper developed for the 10 mm but the same bullet at 1000 fps has advantages over the .45 ACP: greater ballistic coefficient, flatter trajectory, better hard barrier penetration, better recoil control. And in an autoloader more rounds (generally 1-2 more) and fits your concept of a 40 caliber revolver cartridge. Given that both Smith and Ruger offer 10mm revolvers.
Anyway thanks for what must have been a tremendous amount of money and work to produce this video. I am giving serious consideration to the extreme penetrators.
Thanks, this video actually wasn't too difficult, I had this stuff lying around to shoot at. As far as TUI and the Xtreme bullets, I am not really sold on them. In fact I suspect that they might have lower velocity than jacketed bullets despite a jacketed being copper because I always felt like a jacketed will deform in the bore and exit the muzzle easier, but solid copper might not deform at all and the bore takes on all of that friction, but that's just a theory. I have noticed though that with solid copper I have got less velocity than jacketed, but they are all different factory loads so again no way to know. As far as 10mm, I been debating getting a 10mm barrel for my Glock 41 as all i'd need to do is get a stronger spring and a Glock 20 magazine to be able to run 10mm, but currently I can't get the barrel I want as none in stock.
LeHigh really named their Extreme Penetrator bullet incorrectly. (They make the underwood bullet) It is named that because it can penetrate barriers like an FMJ, but gives a good wound channel. FMJs penetrate more in ballistics gel tests, but have no wound channel. Extreme pentrators are not stopped by clothes, bone, etc., but also have a good wound channel because they do not have to expand like hollow points. Therefore the name 'Extreme'. I carry them in my pocket 380 for this very reason. Good penetration PLUS wound channel out of a light (95 grain) bullet traveling not so fast out of a short barrel. Tests have been awesome with them. Better than any hollow point of any manufacturer.
I will have to look into them further. On a different note referencing revolvers, it does seem like full copper bullets even in low end .357 Mag essentially eliminate most cylinder gap gas loss. Makes sense as the less density always makes them longer, keeping them over the cylinder gap just long enough to seal it during burn. Of course this would have other factors in the mix like powder and or low weight for caliber bullets, but traditional weights seem to work better for less gas loss than jacketed.
This comparison met your usual high standards of information and entertainment. Good of you to give some odd duck rounds their day in the spotlight.
Thanks!
Love 357 mag
Would there be any significant difference in using either a longer barrel revolver such as 6 inch or 8 inch and even compare to a rifle with 16 -18 inch barrel. Food for thought. Have a great day and a better tomorrow.
4" to 6" adds a little velocity, maybe 5%. I don't know anything about 8" ballistics but 18"+ does add a LOT more velocity over handguns.
@@GunSam I had a friend handled me reversed hollowbase wadcutters to shoot armadillo . we chrno them at about 700 fps in a 686 with 6 inch barrel they were pretty accurate to about 20 yards. I still have a few . I bought a box of the HST but have not tried them yet. Thanks again for the info have a great day and a better tomorrow
👍👍great content, Thanks!!
Good ol hard cast 🤠 is good enough for me
I carry the barnes vortex in my ruger lcr
Would you be willing to retest the same ammunition from a lever action? I’m curious about how much more penetration you would get.
After thinking it thru I believe the Liberty Civil Defense is way too expensive for the preformance you get
Would you ever test 45 long colt???
It depends really. If I did, I would probably be using a 5" single action as I like to do as common as possible for what's out there.
Gun Sam _Revolver Aficionado_ that would be really nice to see
Excellent test, Sam. On an unrelated note: Which ammo would you expect to have more recoil on a dual cylinder snub revolver, 9mm or 38sp (standard load similar bullet weights)?
Thanks. If you were to compare lets say 125 gr+P .38 Special to 124 gr standard pressure 9mm, the actual recoil force would be about the same but the 9mm might be just a little snappier but in ft lbs recoil, no more than .38 Special+P. Now with .38 Special standard pressure, you would probably have a tad less but not a lot less recoil.
@@GunSam thanks! I rather bother you w questions to save time doing trial and error at the range w my daughter. Will search your videos to find penetration on 38 (short) in case 38sp is still too much for her... A recent video on .32 shows great penetration, so I would imagine .38 shouldn't be much less... 😎👌
@@mitubogoogle The precision one 380 xtp 80 grain rds. are meeting FBI standards for penetration. Consistent 13.5 inches of penetration in ballistic gel with denim. Might be a good option.
They need to be going slower . Faster more shock , slower bullets drive deaper. Copper solids used in Africa are loaded down for pass through.
I was wondering about those Vortex bullets, specifically the Could you do a separate video in the Jug or Not with these? Thank you.
If I have ammo here, I probably already tested them in the box.
Yes, I'm late to this party. First off, you showed common sense when shooting at steel by maintaining a safe distance AND wearing eye protection. You may want to stress that in future videos for newer shooters. It can't hurt. Perhaps the Federal round can be considered a surprise "winner" if you factor in cost and its ready availability. It did everything one could ask of it and had great expansion. Really thought the hard cast round would have the most penetration.
I'm glad and sad .357 is gaining fans... Ammo Manufacturers Need to Dedicate & Expand Production Capacity to Meet Demand of .38 & .357 Mag.... This round is obviously Never getting Old... Ramp up production if you're smart. I want to see price per round drop...Lever guns,5,6,7, and 8 shot wheel guns in this caliber flying off shelves... Just Need Semi-Auto Carbine/Rifle platform offerings to seal the deal... (Kel-Tec has .22 Mag Rimmed Semi-Auto magazine they could upscale!!! , Coonan Mags, Desert Eagle .357 mags...) I want a M1 .357 Carbine Woodstock rifle dag nabbit with 10 & 20rnd Mags for $600 or less, and a AR pistol variation with a 12" Barrel for $500ish... Lol. If you build it, they will come...( i only expect 15% Royalty payment if yall steal my ideas! I will even help operate CNC machining lol)
I been wondering for a long time why not make a .357 Mag HST the way the .38 Special HST is made. Sure the energy would be about at a 9mm level, but that's perfect for a short barrel load.
It’s so hard to find 357 ammo in California. I never see em in stock. Everything else, but that.
Funny they named a bullet after me
‘Xtreme penetrator’
man where do you find this stuff I cannot find any 357. Mag ammo anywhere in my area !!
This video is 8 months old, plus even then a lot of this ammo I had for awhile.
What about Grizzly Cartridge ammunition? It's the only 357 magnum ammo I found that's rated 1700 ft/s, with a 200 grain bullet. I haven't bought any, though.
Sounds a bit hot for normal needs.
@@GunSam I'd love to see it in action, and how it compares to the normal rounds. It's a perfect round for those impressive hand-tanks people keep talking about - the Rugers.
200 gr. @1700 fps! That's sizzling ! Were he here , that round would catch Elmer Keith's attention. IMHO, reserve that cartridge for testing from a large frame heavy duty gun such as a Model 28 or 27 S&W.
Have you considered testing 32 acp out the 327 magnum, just once . If you dont wanna I would understand as well .I was just curious.
I have considered it many times, but because I don't know how it is really going to compare to any auto, I haven't done it. I would love to get a .32 ACP pistol with like a 3" pistol this would be great to compare.
That first box must belong to me it has my name on it and the first letter of my last name lol
Why would you want something that penetrates through a target? I would want a round to expand on impact, and create a large wound cavity and not cause any collateral damage behind the target.
It's good to know what does or does not penetrate through a hard barrier. There's probably not a lot of use for hard barrier penetration in .357 Mag as cops don't carry them, but in something like 9mm they often want hard barrier penetration to shoot through car doors etc.
How can you afford this 2x4 they run 10.34 at my Home Depot now days , not a joke. Thanks to JB ! and Cumholea
they were like $2.60
How do u think 10mm would have done?
Expanded diameters?
No Buffalo Bore?
Chip board = osb
🇦🇺😎👍Nice
👍😃✌️
Barely see the bullets