Any idea if a bad Comfort Alert module will prevent the AC from starting? Mine has power going to it, but no lights. Inside AC fan starts up, outside one won't.
Wattmaster/Aaon integrated that controller and the digital compressor Copeland comfort alert version into their boards of course with authorization from Emerson. As you've mentioned Aaon is far ahead of the game on a lot of different levels. But even really good techs are afraid of Aaon systems.
It is a Rawals device. www.rawal.com/dehumidification-energy-efficient-air-conditioning If the suction pressure drops and temperature rises (high superheat and low pressure) it will start injecting liquid and hot gas into the suction. Essentially being a partial bypass which will lower the capacity of the compressor. Supposedly it can make a 5 ton unit run more like a 3 ton when under low load conditions, etc.
The compressor protection module? You just cycle the power off then back on. The other add on stuff is a work around for the system being improperly matched to the varying load in the pump equipment room.
Do those have a phase monitor in them? I can’t remember. I know most Tranes come with phase protection from the factory. Have a customer that I had to add some ICM phase monitors to last year. They lost 2 compressors in 3 days. They had a storm mess up a transformer outside the building and mess it up and they had no phase protection. They were R22 chillers too. Bunch of $$ for freon!
It does via that current sensing. If you look at the video at 2:59 you can see T1, T2 and T3 on the compressor protector module where the three wires run through so it can detect if the current is missing from a phase. If you pause at 0:37 in the video you can see the fault codes and fault 4 is Locked Rotor and fault 6 is missing phase.
There is one that just blinks if it has not been long enough since power up or previous cycle. That will clear automatically. The one that gets people is a Y1 signal for too short of a duration (under 3 minutes). 4th time is a lock out. It is to protect the compressor for short run times that cause poor oil return.
If your up to it can you show a wiring diagram for this or go more in-depth on it. Or perhaps I could reach out to you through phone or email. I’m an hvac tech up and coming in the trade. I’d like to install this same setup at one of my sites
This was too long ago to remember exactly how I did that. One simple first step you can do if you are in the situation where the unit is oversized and runs too short of cool run cycles (mechanical room with various load etc like this was) is to go to the thermostat cooling settings and change the Cycles Per Hour settings down to 1. It makes the thermostat slower to respond to the temp change. As a result it will overcool slightly but perhaps keep the compressor on for the minimum time to satisfy the Emerson compressor protection module. And a step beyond that would be to add an enclosure around the thermostat. Like one of those lock boxes. Those slow down the thermostat response time as well. Again. More overcooling (space temp swing) but that is what you need to do when the unit was over sized. Something else is a RAWALS capacity control valve that will start to bypass if the suction pressure drops from low load.
Thank you for your response. Unfortunately the building is running off an after market ddc system that is not easily programmed. The application is for growing weed so sometimes the demand is really high when the lights are on. Sometimes hardly on. I’m trying to find the right part to install to do what you did. Would you call that a minimum run timer?
@@andrewnoble3072 Oh yeah I have seen that happen in that exact application. And one of the times I had to mod one was in a Surgical Room where it was ran by controls so I was stuck adding the minimum run timer. Search my older videos (like 4 years ago maybe). I might have posted enough details in a video of my mod.
I bought it an United Refrigeration. It is an electronic timer/relay module that can be set up to do a variety of timer methods. You switch a rotary knob for the use and then adjust the time. I am using it to keep the output on for a minimum of 4 minutes whenever it receives the input. This prevented the short cycle nuisance calls on these units.
Any idea if a bad Comfort Alert module will prevent the AC from starting? Mine has power going to it, but no lights. Inside AC fan starts up, outside one won't.
Wattmaster/Aaon integrated that controller and the digital compressor Copeland comfort alert version into their boards of course with authorization from Emerson. As you've mentioned Aaon is far ahead of the game on a lot of different levels. But even really good techs are afraid of Aaon systems.
Thank you so much for this info.very big help for us...
That timer is a great idea.. I'll remember that for future issues.
couldn't you do that with the 8 pin rte control ? looks like the 11 pin control How did you wire to make it work ?
You should go over that capacity control system. Never seen one. Good vid.
It is a Rawals device. www.rawal.com/dehumidification-energy-efficient-air-conditioning
If the suction pressure drops and temperature rises (high superheat and low pressure) it will start injecting liquid and hot gas into the suction.
Essentially being a partial bypass which will lower the capacity of the compressor.
Supposedly it can make a 5 ton unit run more like a 3 ton when under low load conditions, etc.
Good DEVICE to have, all the the protection the better.
Okay. So go into more detail on how to reset the thing, test it and show us that it really works and solved the problem then . Ty
The compressor protection module?
You just cycle the power off then back on.
The other add on stuff is a work around for the system being improperly matched to the varying load in the pump equipment room.
Do those have a phase monitor in them? I can’t remember. I know most Tranes come with phase protection from the factory. Have a customer that I had to add some ICM phase monitors to last year. They lost 2 compressors in 3 days. They had a storm mess up a transformer outside the building and mess it up and they had no phase protection. They were R22 chillers too. Bunch of $$ for freon!
It does via that current sensing.
If you look at the video at 2:59 you can see T1, T2 and T3 on the compressor protector module where the three wires run through so it can detect if the current is missing from a phase.
If you pause at 0:37 in the video you can see the fault codes and fault 4 is Locked Rotor and fault 6 is missing phase.
What if its the anti short constant blink?
There is one that just blinks if it has not been long enough since power up or previous cycle. That will clear automatically.
The one that gets people is a Y1 signal for too short of a duration (under 3 minutes).
4th time is a lock out.
It is to protect the compressor for short run times that cause poor oil return.
If your up to it can you show a wiring diagram for this or go more in-depth on it. Or perhaps I could reach out to you through phone or email. I’m an hvac tech up and coming in the trade. I’d like to install this same setup at one of my sites
This was too long ago to remember exactly how I did that. One simple first step you can do if you are in the situation where the unit is oversized and runs too short of cool run cycles (mechanical room with various load etc like this was) is to go to the thermostat cooling settings and change the Cycles Per Hour settings down to 1. It makes the thermostat slower to respond to the temp change. As a result it will overcool slightly but perhaps keep the compressor on for the minimum time to satisfy the Emerson compressor protection module.
And a step beyond that would be to add an enclosure around the thermostat. Like one of those lock boxes. Those slow down the thermostat response time as well. Again. More overcooling (space temp swing) but that is what you need to do when the unit was over sized.
Something else is a RAWALS capacity control valve that will start to bypass if the suction pressure drops from low load.
Thank you for your response. Unfortunately the building is running off an after market ddc system that is not easily programmed. The application is for growing weed so sometimes the demand is really high when the lights are on. Sometimes hardly on. I’m trying to find the right part to install to do what you did. Would you call that a minimum run timer?
@@andrewnoble3072 Oh yeah I have seen that happen in that exact application. And one of the times I had to mod one was in a Surgical Room where it was ran by controls so I was stuck adding the minimum run timer.
Search my older videos (like 4 years ago maybe). I might have posted enough details in a video of my mod.
Good intell. 👍👍
Where did you get that min on timer?
I bought it an United Refrigeration.
It is an electronic timer/relay module that can be set up to do a variety of timer methods. You switch a rotary knob for the use and then adjust the time.
I am using it to keep the output on for a minimum of 4 minutes whenever it receives the input.
This prevented the short cycle nuisance calls on these units.