That AR balance recoil system is SO AWESOME! The problem with the AK-107 is that the system made the gun way to complicated to manufacture, clean, and field strip for a service rifle, and even commercial versions of the gun are way to expensive. However, thanks to the modularity of the AR platform, using this counter weight system within an AR buffer tube makes it affordable, easy to produce, simple to install, and does not complicate the cleaning or field stripping of the gun. I'm curious to see how effective this product is in-person.
"Recoil" does not exist in my 20in heavy barrel AR in 5.56. But that is one genius, interesting buffer system ! Great run down on things I didn't know existed... But can't live without..
Jim Sullivan (guy who helped design the AR-15 from the AR-10, Created the constant recoil Ultimax machine gun, and plenty of other notable work) Designed a Ultimax style AR/M4 recoil system, I think both open and closed bolt versions? 🤔 That's actually partially why he had developed what is now the surefire 60 and 100rd magazines (they purchased his design)... Basically a magazine fed M4 SAW, although that design wasn't a counter balance system so it only is effective in full-auto... Gun Jesus (forgotten weapons) has an episode featuring it during his visits with Jim Sullivan. I'll be interested to see how this counterbalance system performs and if it's durable, could be a good thing for large frame AR-10 pattern rifles in full rifle calibers. 👍
Short barrel ars and ar 10s is what this will be good for. I dont trust my life on brand new tech but once its had a run with the plinkers who shoot lots for fun, we will get to sss if its built to last and reliable or if its a gimmick. I think for long barrel ar its a gimmick but for sbr and ar 10 it could make a difference
@@highspeed9518 There's only so much you can do with a muzzle break and/or properly adjusting the gas block to reduce the kick of .308. I'll take some extra reduction from a buffer system, thank you very much.
The counterweight system will probably be in competition rifles in the future. Cus for duty use, the recoil on a normal ar15 is perfectly ok, there's not much recoil to begin with, and more parts in the buffer gives u more chance of malfunctioning But if someone wants to get the best performance out of a gun for competition, this could be very useful.
@@thefifthbelfry92 it could be useful, but a normal ar in full auto is controllable enough for what it needs to do. So I don't think it's gonna be in duty use.
@@ryth-2401 If it's cheap enough, then there is no way some sort of counterbalance system doesn't get put on duty SAWs. You basically have a lazer pointer for suppressive fire; and your effective range going full auto is ridiculously extended.
Cool that they finally adapted balanced recoil to the AR-15. Now you can have a balanced recoil SBR which wasn't possible with the AK-107 system. Would be nice if it didn't require such a long buffer tube though. I wonder if they could make an AR-10 version, if they do that it would come in really handy if 6.8 actually takes off.
With such a small counter weight I doubt it will considerably reduce recoil honestly. Take the Kalashnikov SR-1, without the muzzle break it still had a considerable amount of recoil. And that was with a larger counter recoil system weight wise.
Thanks! We were watching reports from Shot show and noticed that 80% of the videos is just boring talking and irelevant info. So that's why we wanted to make it short and to the point. Full IWA coverage is coming soon
Thanks We watched a lot of videos reporting from Shot and we were annoyed that 80% of that was just irrelevant talking. That's why we try to do our own comments instead of letting the official reps speak about the products. Hopefully the full video report will be even better once we release it
FYI this sort of system does not eliminate recoil. Newton's third law is still in effect - to accelerate the counterweight forwards, force must be directed rearwards through the gear axle pins. However, it may result in a more even application of momentum transfer from the moving parts and advantageously reduce the impulse felt when the buffer reaches the end of its travel.
Thank god someone had already written this. I was about to. As you said, one can't cheat physics. The momentum of the bullet flying out of the barrel has to be balanced by the momentum of the rifle flying in the other direction. Systems like these can only change the impulse from lets say multiple jerks to one longer less intensr jerk - but the total energy absorbed by your shoulder will still be the same.
I have a feeling you're going to see very little practical difference in handling and felt recoil compared to reducing the gas or using a muzzle brake. And it bet it creates more resistance against the bolt carrier since it needs to overcome more mass meaning you will need MORE gas to drive the system, which also means your bolt, bolt carrier, gas rings, gas port etc are going to wear faster most likely
@@rodiculous9464 yeah, but comps have a lot of draw backs. If it can match a compensator I think it is definitely a good innovation, let’s you use a suppressor and not worry about throwing gas around you. Probably has limited applications in 556, but in higher calibers or ar10’s it could be really cool, especially if it makes suppressors practical.
Be better for the caliber/cartridges other than 5.56/.223 that the AR platform can fire, maybe .300blk or 7.62x39 or some of the straight wall cartridges.
I wanna see someone rock that Fitelite with a belt in IPSC Rifle in Open division, no need to worry about stage planning reloads when you don't need to reload!
when I saw the tiny plastic gears my scepticism waved at me. Now if it was pneumatic or hydraulic (and for the 300blk or ar-10's) it might be quite reliable. All things considered I do admire innovation and maybe we need to see if and how they break to make the next best thing?
Recoil on AR-15's are already low enough with muzzle brakes and properly tuned gas blocks. I can see this new system being much more effective on blowback 9mm carbines.
That buffer is interesting but if the shit hit the fan and I had to choose which rifle to take it would be the one with the mil spec buffer. The simpler the better IMO and it just works.
There is no way that would be effective at all. I would avoid it. The counter moment produced by the counterweight would basically have very little effect at all. Just introduces more moving components. Therefore, more failure points to your system. You are better off with a muzzle break.
That buffer tube seems cool. I would like to see a buffet that allows for constant recoil so that we don't have the buffer slamming into the back of the receiver extension.
_"Constant recoil system"_ only has real benefits with sustained/full auto fire. There is no real benefits using a CRS with semi-auto. A few channels go into it, but Ian at forgotten weapons is a good take on it if interested.
@@sowhats.6100 I know. I've seen a lot of those videos. I think it would still be great for people that shoot very fast and with binary and frt triggers.
I agree with you. I have spoken with Ian about the CRS and we disagree on it. I personally think it makes a noticable difference even on semi-autos and i compete with my rifles. For most ARs it probably doesnt matter but for example on an AK it makes a big difference if you reduce or eliminate the impact of the bolt slamming into the end of the receiver
@@PolenarTactical European optics manufactures! Zeiss, Hensoldt, Leica, Kahles, S&B, element optics, minox, armament technologies(they are canadian now but from what I understand the optics design team if mostly from optronika, there are rumors of a 1-8 LPVO in the works under the brand SAI but nothing confirmed yet) and so on. I understand that this probably is not the focus of this channel lol but would be really cool to see!
Extremely cool mechanism, but I bet it adds a lot of bolt cycling noise. Everything is a tradeoff so I suppose if someone is specializing a rifle for absolute minimal recoil, that's a tradeoff they're willing to make.
Perfect content and presentation. Other channels would have split all this into individual videos and padded the run time to justify it, all of which is super annoying. You are raising the bar PT, way to go.
Thank you! This is great feedback as we actually thought a lot about the format and how to present the interesting products. We decided to get info about the products from the reps and then only include the important/interesting information in our presentation.
I hope the counter balance buffer comes to the US. It might end up being a pretty good upgrade from my Omni Robusta magnetic buffer in my competition rifle.
My concern is whether the forward moving piece has enough mass to equal and offset the rearward moving mass of the combined buffer/BCG. Otherwise it isn't "canceling" anything but itself.
I said it before and I'll say it again: Someone whom I do not know, in the Turkish arms expo, has made a .308 MCR type belt fed upper. I saw a picture of it, but it is not available for sale anywhere I can find, including the United States.
![I.N "HALLUCINATION" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/n5B5q1Hwt_U/mqdefault.jpg)
I didn't think it was possible to lower the recoil on an AR 15 any further but here we are
It is time to pony up, get the tube and a hellfire trigger.
Well, you'd be wrong.
Physics says we can & often do.
You’re better off doing a continuous recall system too
Might be good for the KS47 if it fits.
Well tuned gas system with a lightened bowl carrier and a compensator a d you will barely feel any recoil.
I appreciate a no BS video with quick transitions between different items!
That AR balance recoil system is SO AWESOME! The problem with the AK-107 is that the system made the gun way to complicated to manufacture, clean, and field strip for a service rifle, and even commercial versions of the gun are way to expensive. However, thanks to the modularity of the AR platform, using this counter weight system within an AR buffer tube makes it affordable, easy to produce, simple to install, and does not complicate the cleaning or field stripping of the gun. I'm curious to see how effective this product is in-person.
Even if something goes wrong, replacing the buffer tube with a standard one should take less than a minute.
Wild
@@Seth9809 You can stake a castle nut in less than a minute?
@TheUnknownKnows I'm hoping he meant buffer spring & weight.
@@nickloven6728 hey, if I could swap buffer tubes in 60 seconds, I'd see if Aero was hiring...
First a system for the AK now the AR-15. Well, you know what they say: Upgrades, people, upgrades.
Ptr need to do it to there rifles lol
People should consider upgrade themselves before upgrading their guns .
@@zhangyifan9545 That's why they're selling those short shorts....
@@That-Dude but when will that mustache be coming to market?
@@moosemaimer haha IDK when it's coming to market, but word on the street is they were giving out free rides to anyone who asked.
For your bolt carrier's enjoyment!
🤣
It has serrations "for her pleasure".
*pleasure
I really appreciate how short and sharp your commentary is.
"Recoil" does not exist in my 20in heavy barrel AR in 5.56.
But that is one genius, interesting buffer system !
Great run down on things I didn't know existed...
But can't live without..
Could be great for an AR pistol or SBR
shoot your ar off an egg and lets see what happens.
Jim Sullivan (guy who helped design the AR-15 from the AR-10, Created the constant recoil Ultimax machine gun, and plenty of other notable work) Designed a Ultimax style AR/M4 recoil system, I think both open and closed bolt versions? 🤔 That's actually partially why he had developed what is now the surefire 60 and 100rd magazines (they purchased his design)... Basically a magazine fed M4 SAW, although that design wasn't a counter balance system so it only is effective in full-auto... Gun Jesus (forgotten weapons) has an episode featuring it during his visits with Jim Sullivan. I'll be interested to see how this counterbalance system performs and if it's durable, could be a good thing for large frame AR-10 pattern rifles in full rifle calibers. 👍
Lol ikr
The type of recoil that the ultimax uses only works in open bolt full auto configurations and requires a long reciever.
I'd be interested in a recoil reducing buffer system like that for my AR-10.
I hadn't thought about this but this seems to be the best fit for this recoil buffer
This^
Short barrel ars and ar 10s is what this will be good for. I dont trust my life on brand new tech but once its had a run with the plinkers who shoot lots for fun, we will get to sss if its built to last and reliable or if its a gimmick. I think for long barrel ar its a gimmick but for sbr and ar 10 it could make a difference
They are called quality muzzle brakes and adjustable gas blocks
@@highspeed9518 There's only so much you can do with a muzzle break and/or properly adjusting the gas block to reduce the kick of .308. I'll take some extra reduction from a buffer system, thank you very much.
Best ShotShow nutshell that I have seen to date!
The counterweight system will probably be in competition rifles in the future. Cus for duty use, the recoil on a normal ar15 is perfectly ok, there's not much recoil to begin with, and more parts in the buffer gives u more chance of malfunctioning
But if someone wants to get the best performance out of a gun for competition, this could be very useful.
I'd love to see it used for an AR-10 build. Even further reduce full rifle round recoil.
Idk could be useful on full auto
@@thefifthbelfry92 it could be useful, but a normal ar in full auto is controllable enough for what it needs to do. So I don't think it's gonna be in duty use.
@@ryth-2401 If it's cheap enough, then there is no way some sort of counterbalance system doesn't get put on duty SAWs. You basically have a lazer pointer for suppressive fire; and your effective range going full auto is ridiculously extended.
I can see balance recoil to be useful for semi marksman system.
Cool that they finally adapted balanced recoil to the AR-15. Now you can have a balanced recoil SBR which wasn't possible with the AK-107 system. Would be nice if it didn't require such a long buffer tube though. I wonder if they could make an AR-10 version, if they do that it would come in really handy if 6.8 actually takes off.
With such a small counter weight I doubt it will considerably reduce recoil honestly. Take the Kalashnikov SR-1, without the muzzle break it still had a considerable amount of recoil. And that was with a larger counter recoil system weight wise.
It looks like a fantastic show. I look forward to watching your review videos on all those new products. Thank you!
SUPER interested in the Holosun, I havent seen a view through it before so that was wild!
I loved the thermal sight and pretty much all you showed. I love your channel keep up the great work
Thanks man!
Full video about all the interesting stuff from IWA is coming in the next week or so
@@PolenarTactical looking forward to it!!
@@PolenarTactical 0:25 That's what she said
Very cool guys. Thanks for sharing for us across the pond. I just wish we could all enjoy each others kit and gear.
AK-107 at home:
Literally 😭
Fight Lite Raider to satisfy your space cowboy itch aka Cowboy Bepop and Firefly.
Awesome rundown of some of the highlights! 👍
That Rhodesian brushstroke kit gave me a raging Broner! 😎
#need that Armanov buffer
I'm excited for Helicon Tex line up.
This is easily the best trade show summary video I've ever seen.
Thanks!
We were watching reports from Shot show and noticed that 80% of the videos is just boring talking and irelevant info. So that's why we wanted to make it short and to the point. Full IWA coverage is coming soon
@Polenar Tactical well. Mission accomplished! Also if I ever end up working for CSA, we'll have to do a collab.
What a show, and so well covered guys...that was freaking awesome!
Thank you!
This is just a quick video, the whole coverange is coming soon
You brushed so much in short time, feels like being there...... This format is an innovation
Thanks
We watched a lot of videos reporting from Shot and we were annoyed that 80% of that was just irrelevant talking. That's why we try to do our own comments instead of letting the official reps speak about the products.
Hopefully the full video report will be even better once we release it
You had my interest with Rhodesian Brushstroke... you had my attention at "short shorts"
Dude this is absolutely awesome, they just checkmate'd the ak107 haha
I can't wait to get ahold of one of thease things!
Imagine being in a ditch under fire and you grab your last mag, stick it in the rifle and see "80% charge remaining"
This is the battery pack for ArcLabs' Gauss Rifle and CoilGun
🤣
Plasma rifle in 40 watt range. 😃👍
FYI this sort of system does not eliminate recoil. Newton's third law is still in effect - to accelerate the counterweight forwards, force must be directed rearwards through the gear axle pins. However, it may result in a more even application of momentum transfer from the moving parts and advantageously reduce the impulse felt when the buffer reaches the end of its travel.
now calculate the friction loss in a ball bearing and you got what is left of the recoil
Thank god someone had already written this. I was about to. As you said, one can't cheat physics. The momentum of the bullet flying out of the barrel has to be balanced by the momentum of the rifle flying in the other direction. Systems like these can only change the impulse from lets say multiple jerks to one longer less intensr jerk - but the total energy absorbed by your shoulder will still be the same.
I have a feeling you're going to see very little practical difference in handling and felt recoil compared to reducing the gas or using a muzzle brake. And it bet it creates more resistance against the bolt carrier since it needs to overcome more mass meaning you will need MORE gas to drive the system, which also means your bolt, bolt carrier, gas rings, gas port etc are going to wear faster most likely
@@rodiculous9464 yeah, but comps have a lot of draw backs. If it can match a compensator I think it is definitely a good innovation, let’s you use a suppressor and not worry about throwing gas around you. Probably has limited applications in 556, but in higher calibers or ar10’s it could be really cool, especially if it makes suppressors practical.
I don't know how much use that recoil system is for an AR-15, but I'd probably give one a shot for my AR-10. Pretty neat.
Be better for the caliber/cartridges other than 5.56/.223 that the AR platform can fire, maybe .300blk or 7.62x39 or some of the straight wall cartridges.
That belt fed AR looks interesting
Super interesting but also quite expensive
I'd love that Recoil System for an LR308
YES !!!THIS !!!
Thanks for that reportage, there a lot of intresting weapons and accessories ;)
I love my MCR. Shoots like a dream. I put a sure fire muzzle break on it.
I love you guys!
This is amazing, thank you for sharing the video
The AR buffer system reminds me of the Counter Poise system I bought two decades ago.
I wanna see someone rock that Fitelite with a belt in IPSC Rifle in Open division, no need to worry about stage planning reloads when you don't need to reload!
the short shorts are the most important, you can be tacticool if you arent showing everything off
Yes on every single item. Just... wow.
I just like the new buffer system for AR-15.
huh. finally a use for the long ass buffer tube
Interesting buffer system for the AR. Under heavy duty field use I think I would prefer the simple one spring and regular buffer.
That's not gonna break. 100% reliable.
when I saw the tiny plastic gears my scepticism waved at me.
Now if it was pneumatic or hydraulic (and for the 300blk or ar-10's) it might be quite reliable.
All things considered I do admire innovation and maybe we need to see if and how they break to make the next best thing?
Got to get some Rhodesian short shorts 🍻😸
DOPE AF! Can't wait to try it out
I wonder how that Recoil Counter works for Larger than 5.56 ARs
Indeed. Need it for 308 more than 556.
Endlich die Hardshell, danke
4:37 casually aiming for headshot
beautiful tho is there a version of the balanced recoil buffer for AR-10´s cause this could make a light weight high caliber AR system viable
Proto type has exited since the 1950's.
Recoil on AR-15's are already low enough with muzzle brakes and properly tuned gas blocks. I can see this new system being much more effective on blowback 9mm carbines.
So 9mm carbines and .308 battle rifles
Okay, gotta check if beltfed is legal here XD
That suppressor looks really nice, would love to get my hands on it.
The tactical short shorts love em
Omg these guns are amazing! The future!
That buffer is interesting but if the shit hit the fan and I had to choose which rifle to take it would be the one with the mil spec buffer. The simpler the better IMO and it just works.
This much cool information so fast and well edited is like shooting up information and excitement straight into your veins.
It's great!
Interesting counterweight system, definitely interested.
Now that buffer system is interesting
wow they really need to make that counterwieght system for ar-10's and put that on the market YESTERDAY!
Are these balanced recoil systems for sale anywhere yet? I'd considering trying one.
There is no way that would be effective at all. I would avoid it. The counter moment produced by the counterweight would basically have very little effect at all. Just introduces more moving components. Therefore, more failure points to your system. You are better off with a muzzle break.
@@ck-db4un a muzzle break isn't legal where i am. So you do what you can.
That’s fucking sick
I dont know why but i really want a fightlite scr, despite normal ARs are legal where i live 😅
It's a super cool machine gun - light, ergonomic and very controlable.
We tested it a couple of years back at Shot Show and it was like a laser
@@PolenarTactical scr is the california compliant ar15…. Wouldnt mind a MCR beltfed aswell 😂
@@manganvbg90 ah, my bad 😅
@@PolenarTactical that SCR raider pistol could be fun 🤩
Holy.. the last one thermal sights. The target definition was pretty good
A thermal holosun AND short shorts?!?
Polenar tactical delivers again. 😄👍🔥💪🦅🗽🇺🇸 This and vss vintorez previously.
would like to see the difference in felt recoil with that buffer vs the JP silent spring I have
I need one of those cans for my 104.
AR mag powerbank?
"Hey guys my phone's about to die.
Here you go.
WTF, I don't need a mag.
Grab the cable end man." 😅
Liked just for the Rhodesian camo and short shorts.
James Reeves is going to be buying those Rhodesian Camo Short Shorts.
Hmmmmm that recoil buffer makes a lot of sense for full auto
Nice. I haven’t seen that 3x from holosun.
It's a new prototype that wasn't shown on SHOT show
They need to work on scaling and tuning this for use in AR10 applications. Basically has no purpose in AR15 cartridges short of 458 or 50BEO.
That buffer tube seems cool. I would like to see a buffet that allows for constant recoil so that we don't have the buffer slamming into the back of the receiver extension.
_"Constant recoil system"_ only has real benefits with sustained/full auto fire. There is no real benefits using a CRS with semi-auto. A few channels go into it, but Ian at forgotten weapons is a good take on it if interested.
@@sowhats.6100 I know. I've seen a lot of those videos. I think it would still be great for people that shoot very fast and with binary and frt triggers.
@@shawnwillis7561 Ok, just didn't think you seen any of them. All good, have a great one friend
I agree with you. I have spoken with Ian about the CRS and we disagree on it.
I personally think it makes a noticable difference even on semi-autos and i compete with my rifles. For most ARs it probably doesnt matter but for example on an AK it makes a big difference if you reduce or eliminate the impact of the bolt slamming into the end of the receiver
Just in case you see this comment, possible to cover some new optics? The most interesting I have seen on IWA is the new prism from element optics.
YES!
We will try to check it out tomorrow - any other tips?
@@PolenarTactical European optics manufactures! Zeiss, Hensoldt, Leica, Kahles, S&B, element optics, minox, armament technologies(they are canadian now but from what I understand the optics design team if mostly from optronika, there are rumors of a 1-8 LPVO in the works under the brand SAI but nothing confirmed yet) and so on. I understand that this probably is not the focus of this channel lol but would be really cool to see!
Extremely cool mechanism, but I bet it adds a lot of bolt cycling noise. Everything is a tradeoff so I suppose if someone is specializing a rifle for absolute minimal recoil, that's a tradeoff they're willing to make.
You are like a kid in the candy store! 🎈🍬🎈
Cool stuff!
KEEP IT UO
Perfect content and presentation.
Other channels would have split all this into individual videos and padded the run time to justify it, all of which is super annoying.
You are raising the bar PT, way to go.
Thank you!
This is great feedback as we actually thought a lot about the format and how to present the interesting products.
We decided to get info about the products from the reps and then only include the important/interesting information in our presentation.
Those thermals are wicked.
If they did this in the AR 10 platform it would make sense. I don’t know why you need this in an ar 15. It’s like putting a muzzle break on a 10/22.
Its cool, albeit not entirely necessary on such a low recoil impulse. Would like to see a sustained fore test.
Could be useful for say .458 Socom.
I hope the counter balance buffer comes to the US. It might end up being a pretty good upgrade from my Omni Robusta magnetic buffer in my competition rifle.
I must have this!
you had me at short shorts.
My concern is whether the forward moving piece has enough mass to equal and offset the rearward moving mass of the combined buffer/BCG. Otherwise it isn't "canceling" anything but itself.
Imagine going to the range and seeing dude in his finest tacticool gear with his Lieutenant Dangle camo shorts on.
Anyone have details on that buffer?
I want to try that buffer.
So, with a good muzzle brake, the rifle's gonna pull itself forward every time I pull the trigger. Will it bump fire itself?
I hope those springs are sold in packs of 10s because people are going to switch out their whole arsenal
The .223 ammunition and its brutal recoil. :D
Dude on a 20in rifle length AR there already is zero recoil.
I said it before and I'll say it again: Someone whom I do not know, in the Turkish arms expo, has made a .308 MCR type belt fed upper. I saw a picture of it, but it is not available for sale anywhere I can find, including the United States.
It's probably KALE groups rifle.
That MCR upper is cool, I wonder if echo or reset triggers are available in EU?
that's alot of moving parts but I'd love to test it tbh.
That AR pistol gives me serious flintlock vibes. There isn't a wood furniture version, is there? I need that.
i make wood furniture so if you want when i open my website you can buy some
that power bank is awesome. now we need a cell case shaped like a mag and we'll be able to sneak our phone into field problems with impunity.