The athletes whose testosterone is 'too high' - BBC Africa
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- Опубликовано: 24 июл 2024
- According to the World Athletics rules published in 2018, female athletes with differences of sexual development (DSD) cannot run any event between 400m and one mile - unless they lower their high testosterone levels, which the athletics global body claims give the runners an unfair advantage.
Namibian athletes Christine Mboma and Beatrice Masilingi are the most recent athletes to be unable to compete in the Olympics due to their testosterone levels. But it's not the first time female African athletes have been barred from competing due to their anatomy, and Caster Semenya is one of the high profile athletes battling the sport's governing bodies.
BBC Sport Africa spoke with Kenya’s Margaret Wambui and Uganda’s Annet Negesa, who've had their own struggles due to the rules for athletes with DSD.
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Sad part for me .. is that they haven't done anything illegal.. nature has given a headstart.. not their fault
Do you think the same of gay and transgender people? Because they too face oppression from the laws man create
@@kevina3372 if you were born a man you shouldnt be able to complete in female sports.
@@kevina3372 thats not even the issue here, these are biological women
Soon they will try to stop African=DNA athletes saying that people with a darker hue has an unfair advantage 🤔
The way this is going hmm one can only wonder. A man born with penis can lower his testosterone levels and compete as a woman but a woman born naturally a woman cannot compete with other women because her testosterone levels is too high.
No no no.. are we on planet earth.
This does not sound logical to me. What next is man kind going to do. In the cycle of life there must be boundaries.
It will always be a lucrative move for males born males bodies to identify as women because of lowered testosterone levels and surgeries to compete against natural born women and win.
@@delmarsimpson8117 technically none of those people were born women. They are intersex. So check ur bias
Its like saying taller athletes to lower their height. 🤔
Wrong. He has XY (male) chromosomes and wants to compete against females. Nobody is stopping him from competing against other men.
No it is not. Tall has no comparison to being a broad with testicles.
@@ozjohn8657 these are WOMEN. cut that ish out
It’s not though. Women’s sports are specifically designated for biological women, because of the disadvantage that they have against male athletes. There is no such thing as “men’s sports”. Women are free to try out for the NFL and the NBA. It just so happens that all of the top talent in the world in these sports, happen to be men. Not a single woman has managed to qualify. If women’s sports are not protected on a genetic basis, biologically normal women (something like 99%) are fucked in the only place structured for them to compete. That’s not right. Why harm the vast majority, just to include a few. High tester one and transgendered athletes should try out for standard male dominated leagues, or do something different with their lives.
@@Gsoup83 These are biological men with XY (male) chromosomes and testicles. They don’t have female reproductive organs. Caster (the 800m Olympic champion) fathered two kids with his wife. Wake up.
So if athletes with higher testosterone level decreased. Will athletes with lower testosterone level be increased so that everyone can be equal?
Inquiring minds would like to know 🤔
Hahaha...it doesn't work that way. The high testosterone level are basically men and low are natural women. This story is on genetically born women with naturally have high testosterone level similar to men that are allegedly disqualified by international sporting body, IAAF and IOC.
@@teekay3983 but the lowness is not equal thats my piont here
@@teekay3983I know that i did life science in my high school days, even amongst woman the level of testosterone produced differs and this thing in such athletes is natural. Im against this rule cause its more like discrimination they didnt modify themselves
@@teekay3983 There are women with very low testosterone and women with high testosterone who fall under the Olympic limits. Would it be illegal for those women with very low testosterone under this never ending quest to be "fair" to take testosterone that still keeps them within the Olympic limits but increases it just enough to match other women with higher but still legal testosterone levels?
They allow a man (with much higher testosterone than this) identifying as a woman to compete but not this amazing woman!?! Very talented and with god-given gifts for athleticism 🙌 wish her success
They both have XY chromosomes (male). They should compete against other men.
@@ozjohn8657 really? The video did not mention that. I am very surprised. Do you have any sources of this, because i would actually agree with you 100% if that were the case. Biologically they would have all other male-associated physical advantages as well.
@@Eringobragh2024 At 2:02 the video says he had an operation to have the internal testicles removed. After the operation he talks about how he wasn’t able perform like he use to. That’s because he lost his testosterone advantages. He still has all the other physical advantages that growing up as a man have.
I know right. It's absolutely ridiculous
@@ozjohn8657 that's a different person
These people are born this way, but a man who claims to be a woman can compete in the women’s weightlifting competition this year.. very strange
You see hypocrisy at its highest level
They're not women. They have inner testes, making them men. It's a deformity.
I was about to write the same thing
Next they tell people who are naturally taller to shorten their limbs due to unfair advantage?
If you cant use drugs to enhance performance, you shouldn't have to use drugs to inhibit it.
Well said! It is really unfair what they are doing to these women
100% true !
These are bio men not women
That last part!!! 💯
@@mssha1980 no they are women. Some women have higher testosterone like some men have higher oestrogen but have their actual genitals. And transgender isn’t even accepted in most African countries.
....I remember as a young boy my 100 year old Grandma looked very tough and in her old age I can see how people thought she looked like a "man". But at that time if you asked my Grandpa and her 11 children (my Uncle and Aunts), our neighbors will surely say my Grandma was all women. Yes my Grandma looked different, had skin like leather, the face of pure indigenous beautiful lady - and Faith that could move mountains. That's my Grandma now in Heaven. In the old days we glorified ladies that were tough like men, smoked cigars, cussed like men, and went to work in the fields. No test needed to prove their womanhood.
Yes they do need to be tested.
You can't use the nature of someone's nature to end her career, it's ain't there choice but he who created them had a purpose to why they are the way they are. I love you and do your thing regardless what people say about you
yes, you can use nature. everyday the military say you must be 5 7" tall to join the military. you can not cry and say I was created a short man. so before you post ignorance please think zombie
@@benardkipsang8090 - What Military is this?
@@benardkipsang8090 wtf are you talking about?
Once you're black n looking prominent or winning you become a problem they find all sorts of excuse, if she was finishing last with d same level of testosterone it wouldn't be a problem so u see winning is their problem, sad
If you're black the rules are different
If you can't beat them, change the rules.
😂 accurate 🙌
Bravo, spot on!
True❤
This rule is concerned with women’s testosterone levels. Is the new rule going to be applied on men whose testosterone levels are higher than normal? They some how suspect it is an African issue ? When Black athletes start to dominate In swimming it is the cap, in running it is the testosterone level. If you have no chance of winning change the rules of the game?
@mad rascal... do you know if the "woman" who holds the 800m record ever had her testosterone level checked?
@@junior2404 please tell me when you get a response to this question
@mad rascal Name one.
@mad rascal Point taken, but the reality is that Dutee Chand has/had no potential for winning a medal. So let them compete.
@mad rascal Name one individual gold medalist from India...in history.
This is like saying that shaq can't play in the NBA because his height gives him and advantage!
Many athletes have talents that give them an advantage over the lot and no one saysit's not fair , but I guess when you are black and talented then it becomes a problem
Shaq is black too
No its not
@@lastcolnew4520 u missed the whoooole point !! 🤦♂️
Shaq is Black too. Wtf r u talking about?
No. She literally had to get testes removed because she is intersex. So she has a biological advantages for a reason.
This is so sad to watch. I cant begin to imagine how she must have felt. 😥😔😟
It felt like having her testicles removed.
Honestly, this is heart breaking. New Zealand just sent their first transgender member to the Olympics after she failed to Compete with the men she now says she is a woman and competes with the women. While these women who are born like this are told to do something about it. Their advantage is they were born this way and God made them like this and should not be punished for it. Ok, let's also tell Husain Bolt he has an added advantage he is fast but also taller than his counter parts.
He*
he
Height is not an automatic advantage in the sprints
If you have XY chromosomes (male) you should compete against other men. This is a biological man with XY chromosomes and testicles. He should not compete against women.
Ussain Bolt competes at the highest level with other men. Also being 6'5" is not an advantage in track. Most men that tall are not well coordinated and not fast runners.
There is no competition so they just change the rules to fit their needs
Exactly they can’t compete so change the rules.
Let there space be created for the people of the same kind
If they have not broken multiple world records and their times are within the same range as other women, what's the harm in allowing them to compete?
@@vcb1023 why let men who identify as women compete against women? Are you serious? These men won the top 3 spots in the women’s 800 in Rio. If you have XY chromosomes (male) you should compete against other men.
Racism is all this is. Nothing has changed but the year. They let a white transgender woman compete with no issue's. Yet they have a problem with this woman's NATURAL body.
This is so unfair and it just breaks my heart that they have to go through this when it something they were born with and the fact that’s she’s being prohibited from participating in the Olympics yet she still working so hard just breaks my heart.
She should compete against men
they are intersex, barely female.
I’m sure there are sooo many women with high testosterone that have no interest in the olympics… these women worked hard to reach where they are on top of their naturally high levels of testosterone and they deserve to compete because of the effort they’ve put in on top of their natural endowments…. After all you can’t tell me that all the men competeting have the same levels of testosterone or that they SHOULD to compete against each other… this is simply not fair!
And how do we know that their testosterone levels haven’t increased over their lifetimes because they have participated in sports for so long, our bodies and brains adjust to fit our lifestyles
No, Jalika. DSD athletes have internal testes. They are intersex, biologically male with some female secondary characteristics, that's why their testosterone level is so high. One of the women in the video had her testes surgically removed and was never able to compete at the elite level again. Other DSD athlete (Caster Semenya) has two sons with her wife. We know that as a fact.
Now this is a genuine problem that needs to be addressed.
However, I do not believe that as a man weighing 98kg, 6'3 and very fit, I should be allowed to "identify as a woman" and then compete against women in anything. That is BS but this one is genuine and one in which we wish can be resolved soon.
FACTS!!!
Well said , they need there own category otherwise they cant compete with fellow women, its unfair, the playing field should be leveled
Thats not whats happening here. Cis women can have PCOS too and it's actually very common. They have babies, periods, whatever and 'abnormally' high testosterone... whats the problem? And what is the line drawn at "biological advantage"?!
So cis biological women cant even compete with each other even if their natural hormone levels are dissimilar? Are they testing all the women or just the ones who win?
It's bullshit.
You weirdly made this abt trans women when thats not even what the issue is about. Non sequitur.
@@user-mk9hv8sl5p - The Olympics allowed a Trans to take estrogen to lower their estrogen so they can compete in the deadlift in the Olympics against other women. The Trans was born a man, he was a man but now get to compete against women. Now do you understand.
He is too much of a MAN for them!!!!!!
Africa has the greatest amount of genetic variety of any other place on Earth. The more Africans compete at the highest levels in global sports the more you will keep finding exceptional people. Instead of just understanding that what you have is a genetically rich area of the world that just so happens to be where the skin is darkest, the world will chose racisim.
FACTS!!! Exactly Africa has the most genetic diversity, it is the home of humanity. Hormones are part of genetic diversity!!
We are Superior! That is why we are hated!
These ladies train hard. They don't sit around ordering pizzas. Thus giving them the body structure they have. They exercise and many of them have been doing heavy household chores from a very early age. They must leave us alone
@@johnshipandeni47 Exactly!
@@wendyhestick8514 Yes, totally. And being exploited.
That is what the Living God want for us he created us that way we are a unique people and that is not to be tampered with by white people
Again #
when something is not understood properly, it must be banned, to force any to take medication is wrong,
the Olympic games were created that everyone not matter how different you are, can take part without taking anything to increase your performance.
@@fenniemwetudhana4311 they want to force heavy hormones on ppl who are not sick but won’t let a woman who took a natural herb (weed) to compete. It is unjust.
They are intersex stop talking about this case like it applies to all black women! You are dragging us down as outcasts!!!
@@e.k.o5412 they are naturally born women, you as a WOMAN should support your fellow woman in standing up to this tyranny
Lest they start reducing the testosterone of men and you will be forced to compete against us and we will take all your records and achievements
And you will not compete at the olympics as a woman
And sexism will return in full force and effect
Oh wait... that’s already happening with transsexual athletes in female sport
I wonder why there are no transsexual women in male sports?!?
Oh crap, there goes that sexism again...
@fright car I also wonder why she would smoke so close to the Olympics. I will never understand why she would risk all she had worked for a damn joint. It doesn’t make too much sense to me.
BBC Africa.. how could your editors pass such a typo error on the description??
Are men with higher testosterone levels disqualified also?...because people will always be different
Dude, they have internal testes and XY chromosomes.
@@chris5909 they do not
@@chris5909 Why do people keep posting this everywhere? No where has even stated this. Differences in sexual development doesn’t mean intersex.
@@Laurap01 DSD and intersex are the same thing
@@Laurap01 watch the video more closely. The surgery they talk about are on his testicles. He has internal testicles. This is a man.
The Base in this is why is it limited to those races 🙄 when it would clearly benefit those at the lower distance like 100m 200m where muscle mass plays a role and other sports codes like swimming, tennis,weight lifting , wrestling, boxing ....
I swear I don’t understand this. How does one set the level? Like what’s the baseline?
It’s simple. He has XY (male) chromosomes and testicles. That is why he has naturally elevated testosterone compared to a woman.
Having testes means she is not a female. It's unfair to have other female compete against her.
This is sad I cried watching this 😭😭
This is not fair at all, they should change their rules to create equality
They have the equal chance to compete with men. They are sore losers. They want to win but they cannot beat other men. They have rights. They are MALES
They have Adam’s apples. Testicles. Micro penis. XY chromosomes. They are male. They need to compete with men.
I'm in agreement with this person that it needs to be a special category for them like Paralympics. Personally it would make the games more interesting, the greatest of everyone would be represented (like the Olympics are) and eliminate the stereotypes all in one. People can't help the way they are born and should not be punished for it.
A special category would be a punishment? Anything natural related to your body should not stop you from being able to compete? It's like saying someone is too tall for high jump.
The BBC piece never mentions that Margaret, Carter have 46, XY disorder of sex development (DSD). This confers upon them the athletic advantages of being phenotypically male (having Y Chromosome), which includes high testosterone as well as many other benefits.
Wish the best for them!:)
🥱🥱🥱 East Germany female athletes in the 80s thats all im going to say. The 400m world record will never be broken...
u beat me to it lmbo
exactly
American athletes since forever, zzzzz
You are right. They were women too and they had artificially high male level testosterone
F the Tokyo Olympics BOYCOTT, they doing too much... from swim cap ban (whose 'natural head shape is the model, 👀 archaic BS) to testosterone, etc... it's fn BS!!!! KEEP GOING ATHLETES!!!!
Ok im completely done this is to far, I won't stop fighting against that madness
I wonder what they are saying about "miss" nevada. Isn't her testosterone too high for a "miss" usa competition.
Telling Them to reduce their testosterone levels that is natural is Hypocritical
But a biological man can lower his testosterone levels and compete as a woman! Help! This makes no sense to me!
@@cindychristian1700 the main question here is...Are they doing it WILLingly or They're COMPELled to.
@@adeogunaderemi314 Exactly!
It's natural because the testosterone is coming from internal testicles instead of ovaries. They were offered to take birth control pills but they refused.
@@kujichaguliaself-determina7388 They don't want to alter themselves biologically even if it's temporary!
They need to give these women there own games, then it will be a fair race for everyone.
Why? Because they are too good?
@@damanredarnishu5509
Well they have all been given there own games, like l said they would.
She should take it to a proper court and have the case scrutinized by proper medics,lawyers and judges !!
Are some athletes not naturally taller or physically stronger than their counterparts. How often do they cut their legs before any competition?
I truly believe he shouldn't be allowed to participate even if he lowers his levels of testosterone.
The female category is for women, not for men in suppressants.
...
I guess that now that Semenya had a child, he might risk stop producing sperm and try to participate in female sports again.
THIS is what I believe is the ONLY FAIR solution to this issue, the IOC and IAAF need to create a THIRD category for these athletes because it is UNFAIR for them to compete against females that do not produce such high levels of testosterone but it is also UNFAIR for them not to be able to perform either. THEY TOO also have TALENT, DREAMS and GOALS!
They are XY males. They already have a category.
What are you talking about? They are biological women. They are born with it so it, so you are saying just because they are born stronger than other women they should not compete? They are not taking any supplements!! No third category, they should compete women because in atheltics height, weight, bone density and etc matter so are we gonna have forth and fifth and sixth categories?
And yet people want to include transgender women in women competition. Isn't it a paradox?
Yes it is hella weird! If they want to ban these athletes they should ban transgenders too.
If they allow transgenders they should then also allow these athletes!
Because she born a man.
This is not fair, that’s how they were born. If anything it’s a gift
They are XY intersex males taking advantage of a lack of public knowledge to exploit their condition and steal places from women. They experienced male puberty and now have enormous advantages over women.
0.7% of people is 7 in every thousand. It is ridiculous to imply that These people should be ignored or banned from competition. 0.7% is not nobody.
Androgen insensitivity syndrome (AIS) is when a person who is genetically male (who has one X and one Y chromosome) is resistant to male hormones (called androgens). As a result, the person has some of the physical traits of a woman, but the genetic makeup of a man.
Ok. So? What does your comment have to do with the story?
Does she have that?
If they have XY chromosomes they need to compete against XY athletes.
what nonsense is this?
@@mscardioqueen cause all athletes mentioned in the story have this syndrome .
Then I am SERIOUSLY not understanding why grown men who "identify as a woman" are allowed to compete in ANY shape, form or fashion in WOMENS' sports. Create a transsexual category and leave womens sports alone.
True, except in this case these athletes, including Caster Semenya are intersex which is why their testosterone levels are much higher. If they allow transgender athletes ( who are fully Male but identify as female) to compete, why ban intersex athletes?. I don't believe they should compete with women or men, but trans and intersex athletes should have their own categories; especially intersex, since they were born that way
The above person was born with externally female body and internal male sex organ . They are intersex.
I agree with Wambui...
A third category is needed for DSD athletes
A third category would have been the fairest choice. Too bad they wont make one
I doubt if they would do the same to white female athletes. Very scared of competition!
Jerry Unamba Why are you as a black turn this in to a racial issue? How disappointing and effing predictable, there is not a a single white woman affected by this problem.
@@marcellogenesi6390 truth hurts but it has to be said.
@@everythingcomes9025 Your type of truth does not hurt, because it doesn't exist. Sadly you just race baiting.
@@marcellogenesi6390 it is a racial and a racist issue
@@gerhardschulzy Why are you here then? White people care about dominating everything. It's just that you are so far behind Black athletes in terms of dominance, charisma and impact!
Giving her anti testosterone drugs.. It is like giving a beauty queen some drugs to become ugly, because she is too beautiful.A female with more male hormones than others is a talent not a defect.
they have testies dude. can even have kids with a women. they are not female, they are INTERSEX.
Well the question is is how do we classify who is male and who is female and what class of athletics or scholastics can they compete because would not that be unfair to those that have not that edge.
She did not get a call, HE the man got a call
Activists always talk about prioritizing the "lived experience" of marginalized groups. But here, Margaret Wambui, one of the most high-profile DSD athletes, advocates for a third category, why aren't more people listening?
Exactly, it seems to be the logical solution
Male, Female, High DSD
But now that I say this, I am also questioning where men with very low testosterone will be placed
@@marzadky4934 Should high DSD also be categorised? Makes more sense if it was. Besides, we need to test every athlete, male and female and not just Africans.
@J K perhaps it will shock you that this is not new in woman’s track and field, it's been going on since 1930s....From Foekje Dillema , Irena Press, Tamara Press, Stanislawa Walasiewicz, Ewa Klobukowska, Dora Ratjen, Dutee Chand , Maria Jose Martinez Patino amongst others were subjected to this situation. It's not just Africans.
@@Sagalands thanks for pointing that out. It's a complicated and delicate situation, but also very disingenuous of the woke brigade to be turning this into an identity politics issue. These women have enough on their plates not to be turned into pawns in the culture wars.
PS: this VOX mini-doc (12mins) is a lot more informative and gives the historical context you mentioned...
ruclips.net/video/MiCftTLUzCI/видео.html
@@marzadky4934 My same thout on males with low testesterone.
they have xy kromosones... thats the critical factor making them get an unfair advantage
where was it mention that she have Y chromosome?
46XY means MALE.
@@sakurakou2009 In this video? Nowhere. It wouldnt fit their narrative.
Heres an article about it
www.nytimes.com/2019/05/08/sports/semenya-xy-chromosomes.html
We know that, but the solution cannot be asking people to change themselves. Many athletes have different biological advantages that help them in different areas, that's what makes sports interesting. The issue here is that the IOC is afraid to simply class them effectively, if the xy chromosomes class them as men, they should participate in men's sports, if it classes them as intersex, then an intersex category should be formed, if they are women, they should participate in the women's games as they have in the past. That's the call the IOC's should be looking at, not to tell them to change themselves
Yeah it's weird how these news stories wont spell it out. They did literally say one of the athletes had "internal testes" removed. That's testicles, which needs XY, and it means there's no womb or female reproductive organs. So the readers who are saying this is very different from the case of the transgender woman may not be motivated by correct facts (but are motivated by transphobia). It would be more philosophically coherent to be for or against both types of competitors. We dont know the situations - did they only learn their condition recently, hence it would be understandable they might not change their view of themselves? I think it's interesting to consider that under different social circumstances, the same person, once they understood their condition, might say "Something didn't feel right, and now I know I'm a man." There's plenty of stories about people whose parents made choices they thought were best for intersex kids, but eventually when they learn their condition, they may disagree with their assignment on the basis of genital appearance, or in some cases disagree with surgeries they may have received as babies to try and make them look right. Does the absence of a sizeable penis make one a girl/woman?
Something was very shady about the Tokyo Olympics... can't put my finger on it.
Sounds like you have to be put in a specific box to be accepted in Olympic which makes it complicated for people who are not built the same.
Males and females. Yea. Not rocket science. Those people in the video are males
I stand by these ladies, the system is making way for trans athletes, yet these ladies get treated like criminals or freaks. What hurts even more are derogatory comments regarding their gender and the equal rights groups are being dead silent in their defense yet they far more deserving candidates for inclusion above everyone else.
Racism, thats all
@@JohnJohn-xs5ru Ladies and racism, good one. These are men and robbed African women of their chances.
These are XY athletes with an intersex condition. They are male and benefited from male puberty. They should not be competing with women.
@@april-tui3524 Doubt that Caster went through male puberty as you suggest. At her fastest 1:54:25 in the 800m she would be ranked 2964 in the world today among the men. And that's only fast enough for national record let alone the area or African record. Athing Mu is going to run faster than that time very soon.
If wanted to know the difference with kids who have through male puberty just follow the story of the trans kids in America smashing through the girls records.
@@leedza With the condition Caster has, they experienced male puberty, 100% sure of that. They are male with a condition that means the testes did not develop properly, but their body can still use the testosterone produced. The condition still means they are male. You are correct, that as a male runner Caster is not exceptional. That is why it is so incredibly unfair that Caster enjoys a success in a sport they aren’t good at in their actual category.
I can’t compete with sprinters as they have more fast twitch fibres than me !!
LOL 🤣🤣 maybe because you have short legs.
@@KallusGarnet 🤣🤣🤣
This is ridiculous! Let them compete. They are naturally gifted. They don't have a 'condition.'
exactly, the motivation for them testing all of this in the first place is become some poor performing idiot was losing.
How am I just now realising that the 3 DSD athletes were on the podium 😳 No wonder they.... Its sad 😞
They fear what God has given her! Let her compete!!!
Nope. It is unfair to allow a biological male to compete against biological females. He should compete against other men.
From a former athlete - Stand your ground. What has been given naturally to you is yours, don't let anyone mess your body.
Unfortunately we're living in an imperfect world where what is right is wrong and vice versus.
Keep training , keep running, your day will come when you can represent your country and win. God bless you.
She has XY chromosomes, she is a man
The olympics: We don’t want athletes taking drugs.
Also the olympics: Take these drugs if you want to compete in the Olympics
This so sad and stupid. How do you ban someone for something natural?!
Black people are unique. Powerful race ever. We have to fight those rules.
We should create our own and not keep trying to compete and be a part of the racist organizations. Also olympics was initally created by greeks to worship their gods it is a religious festival. We really need our own.
Shes intersex and it wouldnt be fair to other black female competitors
Not shocked 😒 if it quacks like a duck and looks like a duck, it’s a duck.
meaning
@@OfoeNelson just what I said!
What you said makes no sense that's why I asked for clarity.
@@OfoeNelson it makes plenty of sense. It’s you without the understanding!
@@OfoeNelson did you see any persons that looked like women in that video? If you’re a heterosexual man, would you be sexually attracted to anyone of them in this video? Scientifically, if you have testes you are a male. Their testes are inside of them, therefore undeveloped males. This video trying to play on those who don’t know that, and that is the reason they would need to take pills to lower testosterone levels just like a transgender woman.
So how come they can compete in100 and 200m and it’s all good?
I can understand creating a third category for intersex atheletes (i.e. atheletes who naturally have aspects of both male and female reproductive systems), but if the athlete is a woman who merely has a naturally high testoterone level then she should be allowed to compete as the woman that she is with no interference. This documentary really didn't make clear to me what the parameters are that World Athletics has. BBC could have done better with this to make it clear what exactly it is that we are talking about.
This is not fair at all.
All the top three athletes who won at Rio were impacted by this, including Caster Semenya from my country South Africa 🇿🇦
Honestly these authorities who come up with these rules have lost the plot.
These top three athletes all have XY (male) chromosomes and testicles. They have normal levels of testosterone for a man. It’s a disgrace that they ran against women in the Olympics.
The fact that the top 3 were all DSD validates the rule.
This is unacceptable bullying and discrimination of a person's natural ability, shame on them they make me sick!
biology doesn't care about your feelings.
They have to create a third category
Call it what you want but if their skin was a 'lighter' or maybe Caucasian in colour, lol, that category would've been created. This is found more commonly in people of colour. Just another way to nicely set some back. Create a transgender category and this one too! No one should really be setback from what they love. So much for diversity and inclusion..
It’s just not Africans: Foekje Dillema , Irena Press, Tamara Press, Stanislawa Walasiewicz, Ewa Klobukowska, Dora Ratjen, Dutee Chand , Maria Jose Martinez Patino amongst others were subjected to this situation.
I'm a South African and 2016 they accused our own Caster SEMENYA of being a man and asked her to do some test for the whole world to see which so inappropriate because I mean she has a "Virgina,,they don't even seat down and reason , I mean we do not eat the same food neither do we grow the same way😨😨😨this is very unfair and stupid of them, they want to deny Africans a chance to win because Africans are good in athletics!!!
I agree... fast forward to 2021 where they did it to two Namibian ladies!
Well she , he caster is married and he / she is the man in that relationship what a bomb , she literally ended others careers,
Caster IS a man. Caster has testes, XY chromosomes, and produces testosterone. Caster also doesn't have ovaries or a uterus. That is a man by every definition in the textbook.
@@lotxnna She's still a woman but that powerlifter from New Zealand is a whole man with a penis and everything
Amanda, please do more research on the subject and you'll discover that you are over-simplifying this issue. DSD is a real condition that gives Caster an edge over a 'normal' woman.
so it has become an achievement to "not" take drugs ?
What the hell is that world as come to ?
It’s not an unfair advantage, it is God-given! Their advantage is their birthright!! Every dominant athlete has something that genetically sets them apart, it’s the only way to win on the world’s most intensely competitive stage with other elite athletes who train obsessively. Why is this advantage barring athletes from competing when other natural advantages are accepted? The bottom line is, if you as an athlete lose to someone with a natural gift… too bad! That’s the nature of athletics that’s how it goes and we have known + accepted this fact since time immemorial! These women should be allowed to compete with other women as they are.
This person was born with testes which is male organ. It's very unfair to other female athletes who don't have testes. However they should allow this woman with balls to compete with men. That's fair.
Why do you hate women ?
We support them whether in or out of the olympics ❤️🇰🇪
Ni rangi tuu. Why then would a transsexual be allowed to compete....unfair
I don’t support cheaters or cheating countries
@@deee3950 😅 I’m sure your opinion is valid. I just don’t think anyone should modify their genetic makeup for the sake of olympics regulations.
@@Hypocricy_rules_supreme double standards 💯
Semenya. Nyariera. Negesa. Mboma. Masilingi.
All have this in common:
1. Testosterone levels significantly lower than those of trans women (y'know, natural-born men who "become" women)
2. Athletes that: are disciplined, have no record of doping and would have obliterated the competition
3. Black
We see you, IAAF/IOC etc. We. see. you.
IAAF found that an advantage would be seen with hyperandrogenism in Pole Vault & Hammer Throw, yet they decided not to put restrictions on those events. Instead they added 1500m based on no evidence.
One can only deduce that they were worried about Semenya dominating events, not about having a level playing field: they only cared because Semenya was too fast. If it was just Niyonsaba and Wambuii, nothing would have happened because other girls like Mu, Wilson & Almanza can beat them.
@q sultana where's the source? they are NATURALLY born female and they are barred from competing. Yet that New Zealand weightlifter is a male and they let him compete in women category.
@@nakanik8375 They are biological males with XY (male) chromosomes and testicles. They should compete against other men.
You forgot to include three Indian athletes.
Man this was confusing
this is outrageous
DSD women have a rare genetic disorder that gives them an advantage. They might be intersex too. So for them to be included it might not make it fair to developmentally normal women. DSD is a developmental sex disorder. It’s not just “naturally high testosterone.”
That's why she said that there should be different events conducted for intersex players
Wow how do you tell someone to lower their testosterone because you are afraid of loosing, they fear us ✊🏾.
To DEATH🤴🏾👸🏾
Fear of men in female sport . You are right .
They need to create a dam category. What do they have to lose?
Being over 6 feet tall gives one an advantage at Basketball, volleyball and high jumping. Should we exclude them from competing because some of us don't have that natural advantage.
And 2 questions to ponder, how come only black athletes are being disadvantaged? And what is the barred range (400m-1600m) exactly where Caster was excelling?
Oops I think I may have answered my own question!
This really saddens me and I really hope Mboma has enough people stand up for her to prevent this cruelty from happening to her . This is cruel . Have they checked the testosterone levels of all athletes? Nope just those who seem to be a threat to medal counts . People’s lives are being destroyed . I really pray that they do not destroy young Mboma . She will go along with whatever her so called trainers say because she is naive . My heart aches . This is an injustice which must be stopped .
This athlete is XY with an intersex condition, meaning they are male and experienced male puberty. Yes they do test testosterone regularly for all athletes.
They have absolutely checked the levels of all athletes. I don't disagree that it is somewhat unfair to these athletes but the advantage is so significant than in a couple of years runners who aren't intersex would be rare in an Olympic or world final.
It’s frustrating media are withholding crucial information that explains the rules & the situation clearly. They are XY male athletes.
Why only the 400m, 800m and 1500m? Seems like the rule was written specifically for Caster Semenya. Either they have an advantage over all women in all events or they don't.
Insane times we are living
If a women can't perform well in the field she is in then they say obviously girls are weak., if a women Excells in whatever Field she is in then they say something is wrong with her.. How can she achieve that timing.
In other words.. Some people out there are just jealous of these amazing athletes. I wish more power to you girls. Keep the fighting sprit on
That's a MAN.
They are biological men. They have said it from their mouths. They are males. Move on. Stop pretending you don’t get it.
They are intersex
That doesnt mean being a man
Athlete by definition is someone who is endowed with and performs feats of athleticism. That's what we've always admired about the great heroes.
If the person is a woman, then let them compete. What else? Cut off Lebron's ankles because he jumps too high and dunks over the heads of other athletes?
It's not a woman, though. It's a biological man. Why do you want to see women lose their sports? Maybe because the ones who lose it are often Europeans and fellow Africans?
?????
@@SilencedButNotForgotten I'm not sure what you're getting at. My objecting is to the notion that because a woman has high levels of a certain hormone, it becomes illegal to compete. Being a biological male is a different subject entirely.
I'm saying because Yao Ming is so tall and like twice the height of a fellow basketball player, it shouldn't be illegal for him to compete. The same goes for incredibly strong women. If they're a woman, then they should compete. Afterall height muscle strength and a range of physiological factors all have a hormonal basis to them.
This athlete has XY (male) chromosomes and testicles. His endowments are testicles and XY chromosomes that give him an advantage against women. He is welcome to compete against other men.
This is messed up.
I for the last week have heard numerous defenses for Sha'Carri positive test of THC and for me it was mainly driven by the fact that she is from a well known country. The WA body doesn't do anything because these women are from your South Africa, Uganda and Kenya and who cares about the people in these countries anyway. the human rights of these athletes should be protected all the time it doesn't make sense that we ague that THC shouldn't ban athletes from Olympics but testosterone does which no one can control.
Having natural high testosterone levels is not a condition but a gift. They intentionally barred her from competing. Her gift was strength it’s not her fault if it’s naturally occurring.
Actually, their gift is being born biologically male (they have internal testes and XY chromosomes).
Men have high test because of their testicles.
That's why Caster looks like a man, he is one.
But a Man can choose to identify as a woman and be allowed to participate in all female sporting activities? What do you call that? Fair advantage?
WOW
This is soooo unfair 🤔
Laurel Hubbard originally a man chooses to identify as a female then competes against women in the weightlifting..but these athletes are born like this and banned this smells and looks like some serious inequality going on here
The ban should be for all distances and all sports or not at all.
By limiting ton2 or 3 track events it is obvious that it is a targetted attack on certain athletes.
If it were for all track distances and all sports then it would be fair. It would also limit trans athletes that naturally have a higher testosterone level but it would level the playing field and protect XX (female) sport.
I agree. I wonder why it's not for all sports & distances.
the is flat out discrimination. they dont care about testosterone in swimming or diving or volleyball. i wonder why?
Why my African people, are facing this issue 😭!!!
But white people everything it’s so smooth!!! Why I don’t understand why 🤷🏽♀️!!
Only just racism...Fuck the Olympic organization..
Because only sporting bodies in those countries are deliberately exploiting intersex conditions to enter males in women’s sports. These are XY males with intersex conditions. You need to educate yourself before you bring race into it. This is an issue of SEX, and the physical advantages of the male sex. MEN are destroying women’s athletics and people like you are making it about race. Women of all colours will miss out on medals and success because these MEN are exploiting their conditions and lack of public understanding to steal from women. That is the truth.
Africa must do their own things
Go ahead let’s see it end in corruption like everything else. Nonsense
@@real8551 u are an African?
@@real8551 and funny if Africans don't participate,no one will be willing to watch Olympics or IAAF🤣🤣
Since we are in the era of equality, we should only have one open race. Then everyone can compete as they are. The benefit is you only need to plan one race, can up the price money and nobody can complain they are treated differently. Problem solved.
Kijana mpole😊
There needs to be two categories, 1) Womens, open to women that can pass scientific test showing they are fully female. 2) Open, open to all, which would include men, women who chose to compete in the open division, transgender, DSD, intersex.
Testosterone has nothing to do with performance, so many woman have beaten the likes of Wambui and more
You are dead wrong
@@mikelynch-zeroviewz2507 You can have any high level of testosterone in your DNA but if you don't work on your craft or train hard you will never win anything... Give credit where it's due... Wich Female with a high level of testosterone ever broke a world record the past 8 years? The record holders are normal women which only tells you, all women have the ability to be great let's not use this testosterone excuse it's embarrassing and very disrespectful to Africans.
@@mongezimahlangu4544 sorry but it's genetics .. having XY chromosomes leads to testosterone production which is why XY athletes (males, cis or trans gendered) are stronger than XX chromosomal female athletes .. I object to this because it's unfair to XX female athletes.. not because of race or where someone comes from
@@mikelynch-zeroviewz2507 Mike it's been 10 to 15 years, no women with high level of testosterone broke a world record or dominated athletics until one lady came and it has affected them all....
Sadly it affects Africans only, ask yourself why.... Thats just how they are but it should not deny them a chance to compete
@@mongezimahlangu4544 the fact all 3 medalists in the women's 800m at Rio have XY chromosomes is all you need to know about this unfairness
Isn’t that the real definition of prejudice!! And racism.
I'm sure we'll find something different in the lactic acid build up of distance runners that allows them to run much further and faster that the average person. I'm sure training helps but biology has to be in there somewhere. Sometimes biology is the difference that small .001% between good and great.