Prior to WW2 Germany started on a massive naval armament project. Azur Lane routinely dips into this plan to fill Iron Blood's ranks. So how much is here and how much is left?
These are assessments of the Plan Z ships by naval historians H39 "they're still designed for close brawling and relatively inefficient for what they bring to the table, but in terms of pure punching power, the H39s and their possible derivatives are otherwise pretty solid ships assuming that the Bismarck's Achilles heel is remedied, they'd be fairly effective ships against all comers at least until everyone starts building replies to the Yamato." O-Class “To a degree, these make sense in context with what was known in 1939, but assuming war holds off long enough for them to be built, they’ll be in an environment where various super cruisers like the Alaska, Stalingrad, B-65 and possibly even Churchill’s 9.2-inch cruisers all exist at which point, their fewer shells and thin belt are going to mean they’re not going to have much choice but to run away, even the Hood and Renowns are in a position of relative superiority thanks to better armour.” Mainz-Class (M-class) "These are only a bit bigger and are more analogous to the Leander Class Cruisers, now sure they are never going to win a fight with a Town Class or a Brooklyn Class but as commerce raiders and scouts, they're far more effective than the scout cruisers and unlikely to cost all that much more unlike their smaller relatives they could actually fight destroyers and in pairs would have had a decent advantage over most convoy escorting cruisers." Prinz Adalbert-Class (P-class) "Raeder was very, definitely right to cancel these, compared to the Deutschlands, you're paying for a vastly larger ship that's actually going to do worse in a gunfight with cruiser squadrons owing to it being a much, much larger target that can only focus on a single ship at a time thanks to the reduced secondary battery and it still isn't going to be able to get away from a Renown, a Hood or any other truly fast capital ship." 1938 Scout Cruiser "Now honestly i can't see much practical use for these, sure they're designed for a very specific purpose but effectively, they're just very big targets for the kind of ship they are, they can't fight cruisers and with their lack of armour and size, they might even lose a fight to a single well-commanded destroyer, anything bigger is just going to erase them from existence, the minute they get the range accurate." Destroyers "These were very oversized, the Naviks already had issues with seakeeping due to being overly armed and while the 1st batch of z-plan destroyers might have dodged this, the later ships probably would have run into similar issuesadditionally despite and to be honest partially because of their size and armament and thus cost, they would be at serious risk of being overrun, outnumbered and outgunned by swarms of smaller and cheaper destroyers that could still wield useful rapid-fire main batteries, ships like the Tribals, the j through m and the sumners and gearing all come to mind." Torpedo Boats "The Torpedo boats were relatively practical, effectively being mid-size destroyers by any other name, so I wouldn't forsee them suffering any major operational difficulties other than being thoroughly mocked for being a wolf in sheep's clothing."
Mainz is based on the Hipper-Class. Magdeburg and Regensburg are M-Class. Also Heinrich is technically the lead ship of the P-Class because she was in the game first.
Prinz Heinrich and her sisters are the P class heavy cruisers, Regensburg & Magdeburg are the M class light cruisers, and Brunhilde, Alvitr, and Agir (She's an O class hull but the 15 inch guns in twin turrets from Bismarck are replaced with 12 inch guns in triple turrets) the O class battlecruisers. What I would love to see is either the D class heavy cruisers, which were proposed improved Deutschland class panzerschiffe/heavy cruisers. Or the aircraft carrier II, which was a proposed CV conversion of the captured French heavy cruiser De Grasse.
O class ship are included, Odin (she have triple 305mm instead twin 381mm like her sister), Brunhilde, and Alvitr, and Agir is basically same with Odin
A submarine idea which isn't part of Plan Z but I still think would be interesting if AL ever added them is the Type XXVI U-Boat. Which were a planned class of 100 high-seas U-Boats near the end of the war that were planned to have 10 torpedo tubes (4 in the bow, 6 in the stern) and have no deck guns. Construction on some sections of U-4501 through U-4504 were started when the war ended and were supposedly scrapped, the other contracts had been cancelled before then.
6:02 the Royal Navy would build new heavy cruisers for 2 reasons - 1 to counter the German heavy cruisers and 2 the Hawkins class cruisers were due for replacement The Revenge class battleship would be retired and their guns and turrets would be used for more Vanguard class and out of the 3 Battlecruisers, Repulse will be retired with Hood and Renown being retained and modernized.
first, agir is a o class but became a cb because of wows second, spehkreuser, we actually had the alvensleben and the schultz(that thing, though called a kreuser(cruiser), is actually a dd) and for it to be realistic, i'd say the real plan had to be finished not until the late 1940s, at least, even with the downsize of the z plan in 1939, many designs weren't even laid down then, just look at the French, of course the French didn't have that much industrial capacity, but yet the same problem is there, building takes time and facilities are limited, much less the resource to build them all, while Britain might have just started sanctions for reasons like breaking the anglogerman naval treaties or something, and in the end, the brits probably would just gain the upper hand, like exchanging the r class with vanguards, of course the lion class or even restart the 457mm gun research, while there'd be Churchill's large cruisers and tons of town class cl, not to say that Britain in this timeline didn't suffer from u boats and the Luftwaffe, and yet France also got to build Clemenceau and Gascone, the Alsace class and the Joffre cvs, or if you really considered, the red navy was also on a build up with the Soyuzs, the Kroonstads and others, though probably not that effective even if finished, even if you add up the regia marina, it's just total sea control, in the end, the Nazis were just wrong at choosing enemies, even without the soviets, it's just a secured loose for them, how long and how will they fall is the only question
Sorry, I late for comment and share my greatest knowledge about World War Naval. So, that's true when AvP isn't part of Graf Zeppelin class because it's WoWs part. But in reality, she was true part on Graf Zeppelin class because of her hull and design same like her sister. And also, Erich Loewenhardt is part of them too. So, I hope they release her as a PR or DR like her sister or other else naming and we have Graf Zeppelin sister soon (Graf Zeppelin class: Graf Zeppelin, Erich Loewenhardt, August von Parseval and Peter Strasser as like a Flugzeugtrager A, B, C, D.) H39's naming ship before get changing is Friedrich der Grosse, Grossdeutsch or Hindenburg (and I'm still don't know why Yostar choose Hindenburg CA version than BB version😂😂) and after change is Ulrich von Hutten and Berlischingen. Plus, you forgot about 1 project of H class. They have double plan like H40A and H40 B. You can read in Wikipedia JP version Link: ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/H%E7%B4%9A%E6%88%A6%E8%89%A6 H41, H42, H43, H44 was development and got cancelled as you know, but interesting fact is H44 have 4-5 more battleship (I don't know it's real because I read this in Wikipedia Russia version too) Link: ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%9B%D0%B8%D0%BD%D0%B5%D0%B9%D0%BD%D1%8B%D0%B5_%D0%BA%D0%BE%D1%80%D0%B0%D0%B1%D0%BB%D0%B8_%D1%82%D0%B8%D0%BF%D0%B0_H-44 In WoWs, they have H class conversion (this ship is not real or development by Nazi Germany after they focus in war.) like Manfred von Richtoven and Max Immelmann. Werner Voss and Otto Lilienthal still under development by WoWs dev. Agir and Odin case...? Well, you know it because they're comment this. That's correct. Torpedo boat never come as a DD cause of it's too small like Suicide Boat n shipbuilding mass product and her duty as like coastal defense, support warfare, and each other. But Spahkreuzer would coming as like a DL (means Large Desrtoyer) (Spahkreuzer means Medium-Small Destroyer or Large Destroyer) France version (Mogador class, Le Fantasque, Kersaint, Vauquelin class.) For U-Boat project, well it's too much and I'm too lazy for write this You can read in here en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uncompleted_U-boat_projects
Well no naval treaty, Japan goes bankrupt and the Americans and British Empire probably do a deal to avoid an arms race that both sides really do not want
The Z plan's fatal flaw is that no matter what the Germans do, the British Empire has the industrial capacity to counter the z plan and they will respond because it is too great a threat to ignore and JKway it would work the same way in Azur Lane the Royal Navy would counter it with every design including PR designs
The H-class was absolutely a thing. The first 2 had been laid down with contracts put out for the remaining 4 before the war even broke out. Maybe 1 or 2 of the later ships in the pipeline would have been built to the revised specs warranting a different class but that assumes that those revisions, built on wartime experience, would even happen which is not necessarily the case especially if the war doesn’t start until years later.
These are assessments of the Plan Z ships by naval historians
H39
"they're still designed for close brawling and relatively inefficient for what they bring to the table, but in terms of pure punching power, the H39s and their possible derivatives are otherwise pretty solid ships assuming that the Bismarck's Achilles heel is remedied, they'd be fairly effective ships against all comers at least until everyone starts building replies to the Yamato."
O-Class
“To a degree, these make sense in context with what was known in 1939, but assuming war holds off long enough for them to be built, they’ll be in an environment where various super cruisers like the Alaska, Stalingrad, B-65 and possibly even Churchill’s 9.2-inch cruisers all exist at which point, their fewer shells and thin belt are going to mean they’re not going to have much choice but to run away, even the Hood and Renowns are in a position of relative superiority thanks to better armour.”
Mainz-Class (M-class)
"These are only a bit bigger and are more analogous to the Leander Class Cruisers, now sure they are never going to win a fight with a Town Class or a Brooklyn Class but as commerce raiders and scouts, they're far more effective than the scout cruisers and unlikely to cost all that much more unlike their smaller relatives they could actually fight destroyers and in pairs would have had a decent advantage over most convoy escorting cruisers."
Prinz Adalbert-Class (P-class)
"Raeder was very, definitely right to cancel these, compared to the Deutschlands, you're paying for a vastly larger ship that's actually going to do worse in a gunfight with cruiser squadrons owing to it being a much, much larger target that can only focus on a single ship at a time thanks to the reduced secondary battery and it still isn't going to be able to get away from a Renown, a Hood or any other truly fast capital ship."
1938 Scout Cruiser
"Now honestly i can't see much practical use for these, sure they're designed for a very specific purpose but effectively, they're just very big targets for the kind of ship they are, they can't fight cruisers and with their lack of armour and size, they might even lose a fight to a single well-commanded destroyer, anything bigger is just going to erase them from existence, the minute they get the range accurate."
Destroyers
"These were very oversized, the Naviks already had issues with seakeeping due to being overly armed and while the 1st batch of z-plan destroyers might have dodged this, the later ships probably would have run into similar issuesadditionally despite and to be honest partially because of their size and armament and thus cost, they would be at serious risk of being overrun, outnumbered and outgunned by swarms of smaller and cheaper destroyers that could still wield useful rapid-fire main batteries, ships like the Tribals, the j through m and the sumners and gearing all come to mind."
Torpedo Boats
"The Torpedo boats were relatively practical, effectively being mid-size destroyers by any other name, so I wouldn't forsee them suffering any major operational difficulties other than being thoroughly mocked for being a wolf in sheep's clothing."
Good old drach
Mainz is based on the Hipper-Class. Magdeburg and Regensburg are M-Class. Also Heinrich is technically the lead ship of the P-Class because she was in the game first.
Prinz Heinrich and her sisters are the P class heavy cruisers, Regensburg & Magdeburg are the M class light cruisers, and Brunhilde, Alvitr, and Agir (She's an O class hull but the 15 inch guns in twin turrets from Bismarck are replaced with 12 inch guns in triple turrets) the O class battlecruisers.
What I would love to see is either the D class heavy cruisers, which were proposed improved Deutschland class panzerschiffe/heavy cruisers. Or the aircraft carrier II, which was a proposed CV conversion of the captured French heavy cruiser De Grasse.
I feel like CV II/De Grasse would come to either Iris Libre/Vichya Dominion as her original heavy cruiser design.
O class ship are included, Odin (she have triple 305mm instead twin 381mm like her sister), Brunhilde, and Alvitr, and Agir is basically same with Odin
@@cringe_lord5762 Odin is supposed to be an early design of the Scharnhorst class.
@@Iron_Blood_Enjoyer1933You do know that De Grasse was supposed to be a light cruiser right? An improvement on the La Galissonniere design.
A submarine idea which isn't part of Plan Z but I still think would be interesting if AL ever added them is the Type XXVI U-Boat. Which were a planned class of 100 high-seas U-Boats near the end of the war that were planned to have 10 torpedo tubes (4 in the bow, 6 in the stern) and have no deck guns. Construction on some sections of U-4501 through U-4504 were started when the war ended and were supposedly scrapped, the other contracts had been cancelled before then.
I'd be down for that, I've never heard of them until now.
The Type 21 submarine was to have a planned run of 1,170 units
10:17 sorry but you are wrong Jkway its 7/12 as KMS Emden is not in the game as Emden is the 2 ships built before her from WW1
Actually, it's an interesting and different video about Azur Lane and some historical factors. Great work. I hope you make more in the future.
Ulrich!!!!
Drachinifel does a fantastic job analyzing Plan Z; I think his take on what would've been the most optimal build makes the most sense.
A wise man on YT mentioned… Naval strategy is built strategy. Plan Z was bound to fail regardless.
6:02 the Royal Navy would build new heavy cruisers for 2 reasons - 1 to counter the German heavy cruisers and 2 the Hawkins class cruisers were due for replacement
The Revenge class battleship would be retired and their guns and turrets would be used for more Vanguard class and out of the 3 Battlecruisers, Repulse will be retired with Hood and Renown being retained and modernized.
first, agir is a o class but became a cb because of wows
second, spehkreuser, we actually had the alvensleben and the schultz(that thing, though called a kreuser(cruiser), is actually a dd)
and for it to be realistic, i'd say the real plan had to be finished not until the late 1940s, at least, even with the downsize of the z plan in 1939, many designs weren't even laid down then, just look at the French, of course the French didn't have that much industrial capacity, but yet the same problem is there, building takes time and facilities are limited, much less the resource to build them all, while Britain might have just started sanctions for reasons like breaking the anglogerman naval treaties or something, and in the end, the brits probably would just gain the upper hand, like exchanging the r class with vanguards, of course the lion class or even restart the 457mm gun research, while there'd be Churchill's large cruisers and tons of town class cl, not to say that Britain in this timeline didn't suffer from u boats and the Luftwaffe, and yet France also got to build Clemenceau and Gascone, the Alsace class and the Joffre cvs, or if you really considered, the red navy was also on a build up with the Soyuzs, the Kroonstads and others, though probably not that effective even if finished, even if you add up the regia marina, it's just total sea control, in the end, the Nazis were just wrong at choosing enemies, even without the soviets, it's just a secured loose for them, how long and how will they fall is the only question
1942 is when the British Empire was expecting a war to break out with Japan
Drachinfel has done an entire video on how the Royal Navy would have responded to plan Z
Sorry, I late for comment and share my greatest knowledge about World War Naval.
So, that's true when AvP isn't part of Graf Zeppelin class because it's WoWs part. But in reality, she was true part on Graf Zeppelin class because of her hull and design same like her sister. And also, Erich Loewenhardt is part of them too. So, I hope they release her as a PR or DR like her sister or other else naming and we have Graf Zeppelin sister soon (Graf Zeppelin class: Graf Zeppelin, Erich Loewenhardt, August von Parseval and Peter Strasser as like a Flugzeugtrager A, B, C, D.)
H39's naming ship before get changing is Friedrich der Grosse, Grossdeutsch or Hindenburg (and I'm still don't know why Yostar choose Hindenburg CA version than BB version😂😂) and after change is Ulrich von Hutten and Berlischingen. Plus, you forgot about 1 project of H class. They have double plan like H40A and H40 B. You can read in Wikipedia JP version
Link: ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/H%E7%B4%9A%E6%88%A6%E8%89%A6
H41, H42, H43, H44 was development and got cancelled as you know, but interesting fact is H44 have 4-5 more battleship (I don't know it's real because I read this in Wikipedia Russia version too)
Link: ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%9B%D0%B8%D0%BD%D0%B5%D0%B9%D0%BD%D1%8B%D0%B5_%D0%BA%D0%BE%D1%80%D0%B0%D0%B1%D0%BB%D0%B8_%D1%82%D0%B8%D0%BF%D0%B0_H-44
In WoWs, they have H class conversion (this ship is not real or development by Nazi Germany after they focus in war.) like Manfred von Richtoven and Max Immelmann. Werner Voss and Otto Lilienthal still under development by WoWs dev. Agir and Odin case...? Well, you know it because they're comment this. That's correct.
Torpedo boat never come as a DD cause of it's too small like Suicide Boat n shipbuilding mass product and her duty as like coastal defense, support warfare, and each other. But Spahkreuzer would coming as like a DL (means Large Desrtoyer) (Spahkreuzer means Medium-Small Destroyer or Large Destroyer) France version (Mogador class, Le Fantasque, Kersaint, Vauquelin class.)
For U-Boat project, well it's too much and I'm too lazy for write this
You can read in here
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uncompleted_U-boat_projects
What if the Dreadnought arms race did not stop after world war 1
Well no naval treaty, Japan goes bankrupt and the Americans and British Empire probably do a deal to avoid an arms race that both sides really do not want
The Z plan's fatal flaw is that no matter what the Germans do, the British Empire has the industrial capacity to counter the z plan and they will respond because it is too great a threat to ignore and JKway it would work the same way in Azur Lane the Royal Navy would counter it with every design including PR designs
Yeah building up the Uboat fleet would not work either as the Royal Navy was preparing for the 2nd Battle of the Atlantic
Technically different Emden Cruiser
There's no such thing as «H clsaa» H-39 through 41 are different battleship classes.
The H-class was absolutely a thing. The first 2 had been laid down with contracts put out for the remaining 4 before the war even broke out. Maybe 1 or 2 of the later ships in the pipeline would have been built to the revised specs warranting a different class but that assumes that those revisions, built on wartime experience, would even happen which is not necessarily the case especially if the war doesn’t start until years later.
HAIL IRON BLOOD!!!!
It's kinda sad how weak RN is in game
Seems like a forgotten faction. Even the french are in a better position now