great vid. instead of simmering for 3 hours, i think u can just put hot water + ur mushroom into a thermos bottle. the heat should be enough for 3 hours
Lionsmane is one of the easiest extracts to make. I don't see why some get hung up on the math. I just make any equal ammount of decoction to add to the tincture. Finished alcohol content is half the original tincture. Yeah? I don't filter the finished product either. I like those polysacharides in suspension.
50/50 alcohol and water works fine, some people just don't like it tasting that strong. I also always end up with more water decoction than alcohol so 30% works well for me. And good point on not filtering the finished product after mixing, definitely don't want to remove the polysaccharides. I only filter each extraction individually because the polys are still in solution at that point.
@@camsurbanfarm I used to use everclear and that did make a pretty "hot" extract. It's expensive too so I switched to 100 proof vodka. Ends up with 25 % dual x
Hey thank you so much for sharing! Especially the math!! Love it thank you. I do a powder of about 18 different mushys. From Agarocon-Lions Mane. I make Chaga I am from MN so I harvest. (Very little for personal use, I started sharing with friends) I don’t know how to start a business so I’m looking into that. But this helps a lot!! I appreciate your knowledge sharing!
That’s way more water than I’ve been using but I SUCK at math so maybe I need to switch up my technique to match your instructions. Thanks for the info and video. 👍🏻
Making my tincture for the 1st time, I mixed 100gr of fully powdered (I used coffee grinder) lions mane with 500ml 50% alc, I thinking to wait about 3weeks then either use 333ml for 30% or 500ml for 25% solution, I'll decide that when I see how much will evaporate but I'll probably aim at 30% like you. Fantastic explanation, thanks a lot for the video!
Thank you for your service in making this video. Good content. This specified how long I need to soak the alcohol, and how long and temp to boil at. Good tips, can’t wait till mine is done and get to use daily
Really great video. Clear and concise. Thank you. In future, would you consider to also provide temperatures in Celcius also, as most of the world uses metric? Thanks again
Hey! How do you store your final solution (fridge, dry dark room?) and what is approximate shelf life? I’m asking this because I noticed you only used 60g of dry LM. I’m currently sitting on 1.8kg. Thank you for your knowledge!
You could definitely make a lot with 1.8 kg! You can just store it in normal room conditions, though cool and dark is better. It should last at least 1 year and as many as 5 or more if you have the proper abv (>20%). If you want to be extra sure it’ll last years I’d do 25-30% abv.
Some of the compounds in lion's mane are better extracted with alcohol and some are better extracted with water. By doing both you can get all the benefits. The alcohol alone won't pull out the fungal beta glucans, which are highly medicinal.
Thanks for this!! However, if I want to add an extraction of the mycelium to this for a tincture as well, I take it I would just do the same again then combine both?
Doing the hot water first is actually preferable in some cases, but for a homemade tincture there are three main issues with it. Firstly, some of the more delicate alcohol soluble compounds in mushrooms can degrade with heat, so simmering your mushrooms at 180 F can destroy some of those before you get the chance to extract them with the alcohol. That said, if you're able to control the temperature enough (which can be difficult using a pot on a stovetop) and keep it below 165, this might not be as much of a concern. The second issue is that the mushrooms coming out of the water extraction will be waterlogged, which would dilute your alcohol in the alcohol extraction unless you dry them out afterwards. If you have a dehydrator, you can dehydrate the mushroom material post water extraction to get around this. Finally, there's the issue of storing the water extraction while you wait for the alcohol extraction to finish. Freezing it is an option, but this just creates an extra step and I've had a bunch of containers crack on me doing this since the water will expand. The benefit of doing water first is that it will break down the cell walls of the mushrooms, and there's evidence that this leads to a more effective alcohol extraction. So water first can be good if you don't mind the extra steps and have the means, but for most beginners it's more practical to do alcohol first.
I plan on making a tincture blend using three species. They are in alcohol now, in separate jars. Is it okay to combine the alcohols now as well as all the mushroom species together for the water bath?
It's best to strain out the alcohol before using the mushrooms for the water decoction because the temperatures can degrade the alcohol extract. The alcohol also causes the beta glucans in the water extract to come out of solution and be strained out.
Since the alcohol content is around 30%, you don't really have to worry about these tinctures going bad! I'd say they'll last up to 5 years, and can be stored at room temperature. For super long term storage, keeping them a little cooler might be a good idea :)
I'm a musician who plays at farmers markets, and I traded one of my neighbors a T-shirt for a big bag of lions mane. It's dehydrated now, and I'm gonna go ahead and work on making this tincture. One question I have is the tincture that I bought online is clear not cloudy and I was just wondering what the difference might be? Thank you.
If the tincture you bought is alcohol-based, the fact that it's clear is an indication of low beta-glucan content (one of the primary medicinal compounds in mushrooms), since beta glucans aren't soluble in alcohol so cause the cloudiness. A lot of tinctures sold commercially aren't very good quality and don't have much value tbh. They probably strain it after mixing to make it look nicer, but they're straining out the good stuff 😂
I used vodka, but I'm keeping it in the refrigerator. I'm afraid it might go bad some how.. 40% alcohol. Should I keep it steeped for a longer time as it's not as strong?
No need to keep it in the fridge, 40% alcohol will preserve it just fine! I would recommend steeping a little longer, around 4-6 weeks. Make sure to factor the alcohol strength into the amount of water decoction you use (using the dilution equation). You should be using much less water decoction to reach the 25-30% final abv required.
@@camsurbanfarm thank you for the quick reply! I forgot to mention I blended it up in Vitamix , you are right it should be ok. I'll steep it for a month. Thanks!
Great video! I need some help , I think i messed up , i put freeze-dried Lion’s Mane in 80 proof vodka (thats all i had), i just did this yesterday. Should i strain and put in higher alcohol content? What would be the minimum proof of alcohol i could get away with for a dual extraction?
80 proof will work fine! Anything 40% abv and above will work, just make sure to account for that in your calculations for how much water decoction to add (you'll be adding less than if you used a higher proof). Good luck!
There's not necessarily a set time it's done, most of the beta glucans are extracted in the first hour or so but I'd recommend letting it run for 2-6 hours.
Thank you for the video dude! very heplful. most websites recommend at least 500mg per day, so lion's mane tincture bottles sometimes mention a 500mg/ml concentration. In this video yours would be 60000/800=75mg/ml, right? I can't find any official data on a standard appropriate daily dose to maximize benefits. Would you have any ? What's your point of view about this please?
While concentrations like 500mg/ml are technically possible for a tincture, they require a lot more post processing besides the tincturing process and become significantly thicker. Tbh I’m skeptical of some of the claims tincture companies make regarding their potency since (having tried this myself) the two ways of theoretically achieving them is 1) only using 1 ml of alcohol and water combined per 500 mg (for example) of dried mushrooms, which would barely even get the mushrooms wet because of how much moisture they can absorb, or 2) evaporating off the excess solvent to concentrate the solution. This second method is more feasible, but distilling down past ~200-400 results in a liquid too thick to even use a dropper bottle with. The beta glucans you extract with the water start to come out of solution when there’s not enough water left, so, provided your extract was thorough, there’s a limit on how concentrated you can go in liquid form. All this to say that sometimes companies will inflate the number by using the wet weight of the mushrooms (before they’re dried) and make it seem stronger than it is. In my experience, homemade tinctures still produce positive effects, though certainly if you have the equipment for some post processing concentration that can help. Not that they’re bad, but any tincture you buy that has a similar viscosity to water is probably not any stronger than what you could make. There are some, like the ones on my website, that are close to the most concentrated you can get them in liquid form, but the consistency is thicker than a normal tincture. I usually recommend 600 mg/day, which is 2ml of the ones I make, but I definitely still noticed positive effects from taking 2-4mL of the homemade style of tincture in this video.
Thanks for the vid! You mentioned 2-6 weeks for the alcohol extraction and 2-6 hours for the water extraction. Is there something specific you're looking for to determine the amount of time? Seems like a decently wide range.
Yeah, there's definitely pros and cons to shorter or longer times for both, and more research and testing needs to be done to determine the absolute optimal times. Shorter times might not result in a full extraction, while longer times might degrade the medicinal compounds. That said, if you stay within the ranges I mentioned, you should be getting most of the compounds out without too much degradation.
@@mariusbontas5421 Originally from Christopher Hobbs’ book Medicinal Mushrooms, the Essential guide. But I’ve been researching this topic pretty thoroughly for a few years now.
The alcohol extraction is strained and set aside before the water extraction, so there won't be any alcohol to evaporate off besides the residual alcohol left in the mushrooms.
Without lab analysis you can't know for certain, but the amount of cloudiness in the final product gives some indication of the beta-glucan level. For at home tincture making the potency is generally just measured in terms of the dry weight of mushrooms used.
You need something to preserve it, and alcohol is the easiest for most. You can alternatively use vegetable glycerin, but it’s not as good of an extractor as alcohol.
As long as the alcohol content is above 20% the shelf life will be at least a year at normal room temperature. Cool, dark conditions would extend this even further.
It's preferable to use dry because fresh lion's mane contains 80-90% water, so that would significantly dilute the alcohol extraction. I'd definitely recommend using 95% grain alcohol for the alcohol soak if you're using fresh because the water in the lion's mane would lower the abv a lot. Ideally you'd dry the lion's mane out yourself by tearing it into small pieces and throwing it either in a dehydrator or in the oven at it's lowest setting until dry. This'll probably take 6-10 hours depending on how much you're using and the temp.
So first thank you! Second, when using water as part of making the extract..will it lower the shelf life or it’ll be about the same vs just using alcohol?
As long as the abv is above 20% the shelf life should be pretty much unlimited, especially if stored in a cool, dark place. I usually do 25-30% to play it safe. Theoretically the higher the alcohol % the longer the shelf life, but past 20% it lasts forever anyway so there's not really an advantage to using only alcohol. Make sure to use the dilution equation and plug in the abv of the alcohol you're using to make sure the final abv is high enough :)
I think that could work fine, provided your able to have water in the bag with the mushrooms. The only problem I could foresee is that it might be tough to vacuum seal with water in there, but I'm not too well versed in sous-vide methods so I'm not sure if that's even necessary. Otherwise, I think it's a great idea, and would make it a lot easier to control the temperature. Evaporation is also not necessary - if anything, you're probably better off having it contained to prevent the loss of lower molecular weight compounds.
@@camsurbanfarm Thanks I gave it a go and seems to have worked well. I put water and mushroom in a big zip lock baggie and just lowered all but the top slowly into the water, forcing most of the air out, so it was easy to keep submerged and the contents inside had good contact with the bag/bath. I gave it 3 hours at 160 F, pulling it out to squish around a couple times.
I made my first batch yesterday. I got so excited when it was time to add the water part and it being finished that I forgot to measure the water and I think I didn't put enough water in, is that a problem or is there a way I can fix it. The amount I put in was close but I was still missing some.
The amounts don't have to be exact, so if it's close I wouldn't worry about it! Not enough water is also better than too much, as long as the abv ends up above ~20% you're good to go. The only downside to not enough water is that it might taste bad :)
I would't recommend that, fats have a different profile of compounds they extract and might not be as effective for mushrooms. The final product also wouldn't be shelf stable in that case. I'd look into glycerin extractions if you can't find alcohol :)
You should dilute it to 70% abv by mixing in water. For example, add 400 mL of water to 1000 mL of rubbing alcohol, or 0.4 cups of water to 1 cup of alcohol.
great video i appreciate it. I suck at math, i dont understand how do i get 30% alcohol. Please make it simple for me. Ididnt measure the alcohol at first... i put 50 gram lions Maine powder, and coverd it with vodka. Now what? Thanks🙏🙏
If you're using vodka, assuming it's around 40% abv, you'd need to use 3 parts alcohol extraction to 1 part water extraction to get 30% abv. Since this isn't much water extraction I'd recommend doing 1 part alcohol to 1 part water, which will give you a 20% abv tincture. This will still be enough to keep it shelf stable and will give you a more balanced effect. Measure your volumes after straining each extraction.
Mushrooms are between 80-90% water, so if you were to tincture them fresh the water in them would dilute the alcohol and make it less effective. You could theoretically do the water extraction first with fresh mushrooms, but you'd want to dehydrate them before the alcohol extraction anyway or else the residual water would dilute the alcohol.
Yes I’d recommend it, it’s common for the polysaccharides you extracted to settle to the bottom once mixed with alcohol, so shaking each time before use ensures they’re distributed evenly.
You definitely can and it will still work, but there's some evidence that the heat will degrade the more delicate compounds in your tincture to some extent. This is probably not a huge issue for shorter periods of exposure like in a hot beverage, but I still like to drop it under my tongue and wash it down with water for maximum effects.
Most of the medicinal compounds that we are after with this extraction are maintained just fine when heat drying in a dehydrator as long as you keep the temperature below 140 F. You can definitely dehydrate at a lower temperature like 100 F if you're concerned, this might just take longer (possibly up to 24 hours depending on qty). I wouldn't recommend drying mushrooms in the sun or outside since it would likely take too long and they would never get fully dehydrated since air carries moisture. You can also just skip the dehydrating and make this tincture with fresh mushrooms as long as you factor the ~80-90% water content by weight into your dilution equation calculation :)
@@camsurbanfarm thank you so much for your detailed answer! Do you know if by doing a double extraction you also remove some % of the mushroom toxicity levels?
No problem! Lion's mane mushrooms are non toxic and can even be eaten without extraction after cooking. The goal with extraction is simply to get past the cell walls of the mushroom and extract the alcohol and water soluble compounds within since humans can't absorb these as well if the mushroom is just cooked and eaten. @@BorneoCicada
@@camsurbanfarm thank you so much! My mom works with natural medicine and has been creating doubts in my world in regards to Mushrooms 🥲I want to create tinctures of lots of mushrooms and she just talks and talks about their toxicity and that I can harm someone and yada yada yada ☹️ Do you know where can I find details about toxicity in Medicinal / edible mushrooms?
It's understandable to be hesitant about using mushrooms since there are species that contain dangerous toxins. The gourmet and medicinal mushrooms I work with are all non toxic however, and there is ever expanding research confirming their benefits. There are of course exceptions where people react differently to certain compounds, but for well known species like lion's mane, this is rare and no one has yet identified a dangerous toxin in it. I always suggest doing your own research regardless, mushroomreferences.com/ is a great resource with tons of recent studies on various topics. @@BorneoCicada
You definitely can, but if you only want to do one and your goal is the most well rounded product, I'd recommend doing just the water decoction. This is when most of the primary medicinal compounds are extracted. The alcohol extraction needs to be left macerating in the jar for at least 2 weeks, so if you're tight on time, just doing the water decoction is a good route to go.
Yes you can totally throw a lid on there! You'll still probably get some evaporation but definitely less. You can also use a crock pot if you have one.
Yes! Vegetable glycerin can be used to replace alcohol as the preserving ingredient in the tincture. Alcohol is the most effective solvent for triterpenes, so the best method would be to make the alcohol tincture as described in this video, then evaporate all the alcohol out in an oven or dehydrator and mix the resulting powder residue with vegetable glycerin. If you do this you want to shoot for around 75% glycerin in your final product to make it shelf stable (at least 2 parts glycerin mixed with alcohol extract powder for every 1 part water decoction). Glycerin has some extracting properties so it might be possible to just use it instead of the alcohol for that part of the extraction, but I think that would be somewhat less effective.
@@camsurbanfarmso do I dehydrate both the sludge and the liquid alcohol given from the extraction, then mix the evaporated liquid of that with 75% glycerin and the evaporated sludge with 25% water?
@@pdwtv5350 You'll still want to strain out the leftover mushroom material after the water extraction. Once you have two strained liquids, one alcohol and one water, you can evaporate the alcohol one down as much as you want, then mix in the water liquid extract. Then you'll want to measure how much liquid you have and mix in 3 times that amount of vegetable glycerin to result in around a 75% vegetable glycerin concentration.
Any alcohol above 40% abv could technically work, but I've never heard of cooking wine having an abv that high. In general, I would recommend using vodka or grain alcohol because they make the cleanest tasting result and store well.
I do! I’m launching my website soon where I’ll have this and more up for sale, but in the meantime you can direct message me on instagram (@camsurbanfarm) if you’re interested in purchasing!
It doesn't matter too much because the alcohol will make it shelf stable in pretty much any conditions, but ideally you'd store it in a cool, dark place. I just leave mine in a closet and it's all good.
Nope, fresh works too! You just have to be mindful that the the water from the fresh lion's mane will dilute the alcohol, which will effect the amount of water decoction you'll want to use. You'll also have to use a larger weight of fresh mushrooms, keeping in mind that they're around 90% water.
Do you mean you added water the the alcohol extraction after straining and then heated that? If so, there's not really a benefit to doing that since the heat is meant to help the compounds come out of the mushrooms into the solution, so with no mushrooms it's not going to do anything and might degrade some of the alcohol extracted compounds. But if you mean you added more mushrooms to the alcohol extraction mixed with water then that would probably work to some degree. Either way, you should at least have some benefits from just your alcohol extraction.
@@pyrotec4577 Gotcha, did you heat it before or after combining with the water? For an alcohol-free tincture, I recommend evaporating down the alcohol extraction before mixing with the water until you're left with an oil, then add that oil to the water extraction and add vegetable glycerin to make it shelf stable. You'll want to add at least 60% vegetable glycerin, for example if you have 1000 mL of water decoction, add 1500 mL of vegetable glycerin. Otherwise, the tincture will go bad without the alcohol.
@@pyrotec4577 I wouldn't say that, might be less potent than it would have been otherwise but still should be beneficial. I would try to use it within a week or two though if you're not going to add vegetable glycerin, and store it in the fridge.
Critiques like this are the reason I never could bring myself to make YT vids. It's gotten so much better in recent years, but obviously not gone. I like your "vocal fry" BTW lol
Great video! Gratitude for taking the time to teach the correct way to do both extractions! 😊
My pleasure, thanks for watching!
finally a helpful video ..clear and to the point..added to my browsers favorite...dont delete please lol,thanks!!!
Glad you found it helpful, thanks for watching!
great vid. instead of simmering for 3 hours, i think u can just put hot water + ur mushroom into a thermos bottle.
the heat should be enough for 3 hours
Yep, I think that should work!
Lionsmane is one of the easiest extracts to make. I don't see why some get hung up on the math. I just make any equal ammount of decoction to add to the tincture. Finished alcohol content is half the original tincture. Yeah? I don't filter the finished product either. I like those polysacharides in suspension.
50/50 alcohol and water works fine, some people just don't like it tasting that strong. I also always end up with more water decoction than alcohol so 30% works well for me. And good point on not filtering the finished product after mixing, definitely don't want to remove the polysaccharides. I only filter each extraction individually because the polys are still in solution at that point.
@@camsurbanfarm I used to use everclear and that did make a pretty "hot" extract. It's expensive too so I switched to 100 proof vodka. Ends up with 25 % dual x
Thank you! Today I finished making my first tincture/ extract using this video! Very helpful!
Glad I could help!
Hey thank you so much for sharing! Especially the math!! Love it thank you. I do a powder of about 18 different mushys. From Agarocon-Lions Mane. I make Chaga I am from MN so I harvest. (Very little for personal use, I started sharing with friends) I don’t know how to start a business so I’m looking into that. But this helps a lot!! I appreciate your knowledge sharing!
Love to hear it, good luck in your endeavors!
Can you let it sit in alcohol for several months before doing the water extraction?
That’s way more water than I’ve been using but I SUCK at math so maybe I need to switch up my technique to match your instructions. Thanks for the info and video. 👍🏻
Maybe you’re using an alcohol with a lower abv, in which case you’d want to use less water to get the 30% final abv. Thanks for the comment!
Great video! Content is spot on for what I was looking for. I would just suggest keeping the background music lower volume.
Thanks for the feedback!
Thank u. This i can do. Some explanations r very complicated. Not this one.
Thanks for watching!
Making my tincture for the 1st time, I mixed 100gr of fully powdered (I used coffee grinder) lions mane with 500ml 50% alc, I thinking to wait about 3weeks then either use 333ml for 30% or 500ml for 25% solution, I'll decide that when I see how much will evaporate but I'll probably aim at 30% like you. Fantastic explanation, thanks a lot for the video!
Good luck with your tincture!
If i close my eyes and just listen, i swear its Hamilton Morrison im listening too 😂
You're too kind! 😀
@@camsurbanfarmWhere are the Lion's Mane Mushroom fungal spores and how to extract the fungal spore species value?
Thank you for your service in making this video. Good content. This specified how long I need to soak the alcohol, and how long and temp to boil at. Good tips, can’t wait till mine is done and get to use daily
Glad you found it helpful, thanks for watching! Good luck with your tincture
Hi do the mushrooms have to be dried?
@@warrenwakefield7353 They shouldn't have to be, but it may make the alcohol extraction more efficient to begin with.
Really great video. Clear and concise. Thank you.
In future, would you consider to also provide temperatures in Celcius also, as most of the world uses metric? Thanks again
Thanks for the recommendation, I'll definitely include metric in the future 🙏
Hey! How do you store your final solution (fridge, dry dark room?) and what is approximate shelf life?
I’m asking this because I noticed you only used 60g of dry LM. I’m currently sitting on 1.8kg.
Thank you for your knowledge!
You could definitely make a lot with 1.8 kg! You can just store it in normal room conditions, though cool and dark is better. It should last at least 1 year and as many as 5 or more if you have the proper abv (>20%). If you want to be extra sure it’ll last years I’d do 25-30% abv.
Love this
Thank you. Wonderful video and clearly explained. Subscribed!
Appreciate it 🙏
Great video but why do you mixing these two together? Cant we just use the first one with alcohol?
Some of the compounds in lion's mane are better extracted with alcohol and some are better extracted with water. By doing both you can get all the benefits. The alcohol alone won't pull out the fungal beta glucans, which are highly medicinal.
Thanks for this!! However, if I want to add an extraction of the mycelium to this for a tincture as well, I take it I would just do the same again then combine both?
Yes you can, or you could just mix up the dried mycelium with the dried mushrooms and do them at the same time!
Why not do the hot water first?
Doing the hot water first is actually preferable in some cases, but for a homemade tincture there are three main issues with it. Firstly, some of the more delicate alcohol soluble compounds in mushrooms can degrade with heat, so simmering your mushrooms at 180 F can destroy some of those before you get the chance to extract them with the alcohol. That said, if you're able to control the temperature enough (which can be difficult using a pot on a stovetop) and keep it below 165, this might not be as much of a concern. The second issue is that the mushrooms coming out of the water extraction will be waterlogged, which would dilute your alcohol in the alcohol extraction unless you dry them out afterwards. If you have a dehydrator, you can dehydrate the mushroom material post water extraction to get around this. Finally, there's the issue of storing the water extraction while you wait for the alcohol extraction to finish. Freezing it is an option, but this just creates an extra step and I've had a bunch of containers crack on me doing this since the water will expand. The benefit of doing water first is that it will break down the cell walls of the mushrooms, and there's evidence that this leads to a more effective alcohol extraction. So water first can be good if you don't mind the extra steps and have the means, but for most beginners it's more practical to do alcohol first.
How much mushroom?
Generally, for every gram of mushrooms you want to use 1 mL of alcohol, but in practice you can just fill the jar up to an inch above the mushrooms.
Finally making our first batch after 4.5 weeks of shaking it daily! Can’t wait.
Me too, today 🤗
Awesome! All that hard work is about to pay off :)
Thanks..great content!!
Thanks for tuning in!
Is there a way to print the directions? Just in case the computer stops working. I appreciate your assistance with this
I have a writeup of this process on my website: camsurbanfarm.com/basic-tincture/. You can totally print it from there!
Use a pen and paper... How braindead are you?
You blew my mind with the math 😬
🤯
I plan on making a tincture blend using three species. They are in alcohol now, in separate jars. Is it okay to combine the alcohols now as well as all the mushroom species together for the water bath?
It's best to strain out the alcohol before using the mushrooms for the water decoction because the temperatures can degrade the alcohol extract. The alcohol also causes the beta glucans in the water extract to come out of solution and be strained out.
I think I will use my oven for water extraction, as I can set temperature there more accurate.
Good idea!
Great video...as water is present, do you just store the rest in the fridge...how long will it keep if that is the method? Thnak you
The alcohol in it can preserve it for a few years in most cases. I store mine in a cool, dark place, but no need for the fridge.
@@camsurbanfarm Thank you so much!
How long does your batch of it last for and where do you store it?
Since the alcohol content is around 30%, you don't really have to worry about these tinctures going bad! I'd say they'll last up to 5 years, and can be stored at room temperature. For super long term storage, keeping them a little cooler might be a good idea :)
I'm a musician who plays at farmers markets, and I traded one of my neighbors a T-shirt for a big bag of lions mane. It's dehydrated now, and I'm gonna go ahead and work on making this tincture. One question I have is the tincture that I bought online is clear not cloudy and I was just wondering what the difference might be? Thank you.
If the tincture you bought is alcohol-based, the fact that it's clear is an indication of low beta-glucan content (one of the primary medicinal compounds in mushrooms), since beta glucans aren't soluble in alcohol so cause the cloudiness. A lot of tinctures sold commercially aren't very good quality and don't have much value tbh. They probably strain it after mixing to make it look nicer, but they're straining out the good stuff 😂
@@camsurbanfarm thanks! Got mine soaking away….
@@camsurbanfarm I’d love to know where you get your facts from.
I used vodka, but I'm keeping it in the refrigerator. I'm afraid it might go bad some how.. 40% alcohol. Should I keep it steeped for a longer time as it's not as strong?
No need to keep it in the fridge, 40% alcohol will preserve it just fine! I would recommend steeping a little longer, around 4-6 weeks. Make sure to factor the alcohol strength into the amount of water decoction you use (using the dilution equation). You should be using much less water decoction to reach the 25-30% final abv required.
@@camsurbanfarm thank you for the quick reply! I forgot to mention I blended it up in Vitamix , you are right it should be ok. I'll steep it for a month. Thanks!
alcohol can never go bad
Finally a straight to the point video. Thanks 😊
Great video! I need some help , I think i messed up , i put freeze-dried Lion’s Mane in 80 proof vodka (thats all i had), i just did this yesterday. Should i strain and put in higher alcohol content? What would be the minimum proof of alcohol i could get away with for a dual extraction?
80 proof will work fine! Anything 40% abv and above will work, just make sure to account for that in your calculations for how much water decoction to add (you'll be adding less than if you used a higher proof). Good luck!
How do we know the decoction is done? I must have missed that
There's not necessarily a set time it's done, most of the beta glucans are extracted in the first hour or so but I'd recommend letting it run for 2-6 hours.
Cool brah, love your vid
Thanks for stopping by!
Would it be OK if I start with lions mane that is currently frozen and then dehydrate?
Absolutely 👍
Thank you for the video dude! very heplful. most websites recommend at least 500mg per day, so lion's mane tincture bottles sometimes mention a 500mg/ml concentration. In this video yours would be 60000/800=75mg/ml, right? I can't find any official data on a standard appropriate daily dose to maximize benefits. Would you have any ? What's your point of view about this please?
While concentrations like 500mg/ml are technically possible for a tincture, they require a lot more post processing besides the tincturing process and become significantly thicker. Tbh I’m skeptical of some of the claims tincture companies make regarding their potency since (having tried this myself) the two ways of theoretically achieving them is 1) only using 1 ml of alcohol and water combined per 500 mg (for example) of dried mushrooms, which would barely even get the mushrooms wet because of how much moisture they can absorb, or 2) evaporating off the excess solvent to concentrate the solution. This second method is more feasible, but distilling down past ~200-400 results in a liquid too thick to even use a dropper bottle with.
The beta glucans you extract with the water start to come out of solution when there’s not enough water left, so, provided your extract was thorough, there’s a limit on how concentrated you can go in liquid form.
All this to say that sometimes companies will inflate the number by using the wet weight of the mushrooms (before they’re dried) and make it seem stronger than it is.
In my experience, homemade tinctures still produce positive effects, though certainly if you have the equipment for some post processing concentration that can help.
Not that they’re bad, but any tincture you buy that has a similar viscosity to water is probably not any stronger than what you could make.
There are some, like the ones on my website, that are close to the most concentrated you can get them in liquid form, but the consistency is thicker than a normal tincture.
I usually recommend 600 mg/day, which is 2ml of the ones I make, but I definitely still noticed positive effects from taking 2-4mL of the homemade style of tincture in this video.
thank you for your generous answer, that's so insightful and clarifies a lot for me!! 🙏🙏🙏
Happy to help!
Thanks for the vid! You mentioned 2-6 weeks for the alcohol extraction and 2-6 hours for the water extraction. Is there something specific you're looking for to determine the amount of time? Seems like a decently wide range.
Yeah, there's definitely pros and cons to shorter or longer times for both, and more research and testing needs to be done to determine the absolute optimal times. Shorter times might not result in a full extraction, while longer times might degrade the medicinal compounds. That said, if you stay within the ranges I mentioned, you should be getting most of the compounds out without too much degradation.
@@camsurbanfarm awesome, appreciate the explanation
@@camsurbanfarmWhere did you learn this technique?
@@mariusbontas5421 Originally from Christopher Hobbs’ book Medicinal Mushrooms, the Essential guide. But I’ve been researching this topic pretty thoroughly for a few years now.
Aren't you evaporating the alcohol off during the water extraction part of the process.
The alcohol extraction is strained and set aside before the water extraction, so there won't be any alcohol to evaporate off besides the residual alcohol left in the mushrooms.
Is it better to use fresh non dried lions mane or should you always dry it?
It's best to dry it because the fresh lion's mane is mostly water, which would dilute your alcohol extraction.
@@camsurbanfarmthank you!
How do you know the potency of the final product?
Without lab analysis you can't know for certain, but the amount of cloudiness in the final product gives some indication of the beta-glucan level. For at home tincture making the potency is generally just measured in terms of the dry weight of mushrooms used.
Do we really need alcohol for this? Or is there another way?
You need something to preserve it, and alcohol is the easiest for most. You can alternatively use vegetable glycerin, but it’s not as good of an extractor as alcohol.
Where do I store the finished product for the longest shelf life. Fridge? Dark closet?
As long as the alcohol content is above 20% the shelf life will be at least a year at normal room temperature. Cool, dark conditions would extend this even further.
Can the tincture be stored in food grade HDPE bottles?
I think that would probably be fine, though I always favor glass
Thanks! OK to use fresh (not dry) mane?
It's preferable to use dry because fresh lion's mane contains 80-90% water, so that would significantly dilute the alcohol extraction. I'd definitely recommend using 95% grain alcohol for the alcohol soak if you're using fresh because the water in the lion's mane would lower the abv a lot. Ideally you'd dry the lion's mane out yourself by tearing it into small pieces and throwing it either in a dehydrator or in the oven at it's lowest setting until dry. This'll probably take 6-10 hours depending on how much you're using and the temp.
@@camsurbanfarm Nice Dude! Thank You again!!
So first thank you! Second, when using water as part of making the extract..will it lower the shelf life or it’ll be about the same vs just using alcohol?
As long as the abv is above 20% the shelf life should be pretty much unlimited, especially if stored in a cool, dark place. I usually do 25-30% to play it safe. Theoretically the higher the alcohol % the longer the shelf life, but past 20% it lasts forever anyway so there's not really an advantage to using only alcohol. Make sure to use the dilution equation and plug in the abv of the alcohol you're using to make sure the final abv is high enough :)
Do you see any problem with using a sous-vide immersion circulator for the hot-water decoction? Is there anything in there that needs to evaporate?
I think that could work fine, provided your able to have water in the bag with the mushrooms. The only problem I could foresee is that it might be tough to vacuum seal with water in there, but I'm not too well versed in sous-vide methods so I'm not sure if that's even necessary. Otherwise, I think it's a great idea, and would make it a lot easier to control the temperature. Evaporation is also not necessary - if anything, you're probably better off having it contained to prevent the loss of lower molecular weight compounds.
@@camsurbanfarm Thanks I gave it a go and seems to have worked well. I put water and mushroom in a big zip lock baggie and just lowered all but the top slowly into the water, forcing most of the air out, so it was easy to keep submerged and the contents inside had good contact with the bag/bath. I gave it 3 hours at 160 F, pulling it out to squish around a couple times.
@@jasonweston9522 Awesome! Seems like a great process!
I made my first batch yesterday. I got so excited when it was time to add the water part and it being finished that I forgot to measure the water and I think I didn't put enough water in, is that a problem or is there a way I can fix it. The amount I put in was close but I was still missing some.
The amounts don't have to be exact, so if it's close I wouldn't worry about it! Not enough water is also better than too much, as long as the abv ends up above ~20% you're good to go. The only downside to not enough water is that it might taste bad :)
Can i replace alcohol extraction with vinger or any type of fat, cause i can't find alcohol where I live
I would't recommend that, fats have a different profile of compounds they extract and might not be as effective for mushrooms. The final product also wouldn't be shelf stable in that case. I'd look into glycerin extractions if you can't find alcohol :)
Thanks for the info @@camsurbanfarm
Can you use 98%Rabin alcohol
You should dilute it to 70% abv by mixing in water. For example, add 400 mL of water to 1000 mL of rubbing alcohol, or 0.4 cups of water to 1 cup of alcohol.
This is so it doesn't evaporate before it has time to sterilize.
great video i appreciate it.
I suck at math, i dont understand how do i get 30% alcohol. Please make it simple for me.
Ididnt measure the alcohol at first... i put 50 gram lions Maine powder, and coverd it with vodka.
Now what? Thanks🙏🙏
If you're using vodka, assuming it's around 40% abv, you'd need to use 3 parts alcohol extraction to 1 part water extraction to get 30% abv. Since this isn't much water extraction I'd recommend doing 1 part alcohol to 1 part water, which will give you a 20% abv tincture. This will still be enough to keep it shelf stable and will give you a more balanced effect. Measure your volumes after straining each extraction.
Why dry them rather than tincture them fresh??
Mushrooms are between 80-90% water, so if you were to tincture them fresh the water in them would dilute the alcohol and make it less effective. You could theoretically do the water extraction first with fresh mushrooms, but you'd want to dehydrate them before the alcohol extraction anyway or else the residual water would dilute the alcohol.
Do you have to shake your tincture (considering it's already in the 60ml glass) every time before taking?
Yes I’d recommend it, it’s common for the polysaccharides you extracted to settle to the bottom once mixed with alcohol, so shaking each time before use ensures they’re distributed evenly.
Can you put any tincture in a hot liquid? Such as tea?
You definitely can and it will still work, but there's some evidence that the heat will degrade the more delicate compounds in your tincture to some extent. This is probably not a huge issue for shorter periods of exposure like in a hot beverage, but I still like to drop it under my tongue and wash it down with water for maximum effects.
Would you say that using an electric dehydrator removes some of the medicinal properties instead of natural wind/ sun dehydration?
Most of the medicinal compounds that we are after with this extraction are maintained just fine when heat drying in a dehydrator as long as you keep the temperature below 140 F. You can definitely dehydrate at a lower temperature like 100 F if you're concerned, this might just take longer (possibly up to 24 hours depending on qty). I wouldn't recommend drying mushrooms in the sun or outside since it would likely take too long and they would never get fully dehydrated since air carries moisture. You can also just skip the dehydrating and make this tincture with fresh mushrooms as long as you factor the ~80-90% water content by weight into your dilution equation calculation :)
@@camsurbanfarm thank you so much for your detailed answer! Do you know if by doing a double extraction you also remove some % of the mushroom toxicity levels?
No problem! Lion's mane mushrooms are non toxic and can even be eaten without extraction after cooking. The goal with extraction is simply to get past the cell walls of the mushroom and extract the alcohol and water soluble compounds within since humans can't absorb these as well if the mushroom is just cooked and eaten. @@BorneoCicada
@@camsurbanfarm thank you so much! My mom works with natural medicine and has been creating doubts in my world in regards to Mushrooms 🥲I want to create tinctures of lots of mushrooms and she just talks and talks about their toxicity and that I can harm someone and yada yada yada ☹️ Do you know where can I find details about toxicity in Medicinal / edible mushrooms?
It's understandable to be hesitant about using mushrooms since there are species that contain dangerous toxins. The gourmet and medicinal mushrooms I work with are all non toxic however, and there is ever expanding research confirming their benefits. There are of course exceptions where people react differently to certain compounds, but for well known species like lion's mane, this is rare and no one has yet identified a dangerous toxin in it. I always suggest doing your own research regardless, mushroomreferences.com/ is a great resource with tons of recent studies on various topics. @@BorneoCicada
Can you just do the alcohol and skip the water ? Also how many hours you didn't specify
You definitely can, but if you only want to do one and your goal is the most well rounded product, I'd recommend doing just the water decoction. This is when most of the primary medicinal compounds are extracted. The alcohol extraction needs to be left macerating in the jar for at least 2 weeks, so if you're tight on time, just doing the water decoction is a good route to go.
@@camsurbanfarmhow many hours does it have to simmer ??
@@AceMaverickM 2-6 hours
Is it necessary to evaporate the water and refill? Can't one just use a lid and keep the water inside?
Yes you can totally throw a lid on there! You'll still probably get some evaporation but definitely less. You can also use a crock pot if you have one.
Is it possible to do it without alcohol?
Yes! Vegetable glycerin can be used to replace alcohol as the preserving ingredient in the tincture. Alcohol is the most effective solvent for triterpenes, so the best method would be to make the alcohol tincture as described in this video, then evaporate all the alcohol out in an oven or dehydrator and mix the resulting powder residue with vegetable glycerin. If you do this you want to shoot for around 75% glycerin in your final product to make it shelf stable (at least 2 parts glycerin mixed with alcohol extract powder for every 1 part water decoction). Glycerin has some extracting properties so it might be possible to just use it instead of the alcohol for that part of the extraction, but I think that would be somewhat less effective.
@@camsurbanfarm thank for replying and sharing the information i will be sending positive energies to u 🔥🗣️💪🏾
@@camsurbanfarmso do I dehydrate both the sludge and the liquid alcohol given from the extraction, then mix the evaporated liquid of that with 75% glycerin and the evaporated sludge with 25% water?
@@pdwtv5350 You'll still want to strain out the leftover mushroom material after the water extraction. Once you have two strained liquids, one alcohol and one water, you can evaporate the alcohol one down as much as you want, then mix in the water liquid extract. Then you'll want to measure how much liquid you have and mix in 3 times that amount of vegetable glycerin to result in around a 75% vegetable glycerin concentration.
Does 62% alcohol cooking wine work for alcohol extraction?
Any alcohol above 40% abv could technically work, but I've never heard of cooking wine having an abv that high. In general, I would recommend using vodka or grain alcohol because they make the cleanest tasting result and store well.
How long do you cook for?
Between 2-6 hours is fine, I usually do 3.
Great info. Thanks
Thanks for watching :)
Dude do u sell bottles of this if so let me know
I do! I’m launching my website soon where I’ll have this and more up for sale, but in the meantime you can direct message me on instagram (@camsurbanfarm) if you’re interested in purchasing!
How much tincture in ml do you consume per day?
I usually take 2-4 mL a day
How much did this make?
This batch was about 800 mL
Thank you!
Where do you store the mixture of alcohol and mushrooms while during that 2-6 week period? Dark? Light? Cold? Room temp?
Thanks so much
It doesn't matter too much because the alcohol will make it shelf stable in pretty much any conditions, but ideally you'd store it in a cool, dark place. I just leave mine in a closet and it's all good.
Do you have to use dried lions mane?
Nope, fresh works too! You just have to be mindful that the the water from the fresh lion's mane will dilute the alcohol, which will effect the amount of water decoction you'll want to use. You'll also have to use a larger weight of fresh mushrooms, keeping in mind that they're around 90% water.
@@camsurbanfarm Makes sense. Thanks! Can't wait to try it
I forgot to use the left over mushrooms! So I took mushrooms alcohol and water and heated it for 4 hours.. Still some benefits I hope!? 😅
Do you mean you added water the the alcohol extraction after straining and then heated that? If so, there's not really a benefit to doing that since the heat is meant to help the compounds come out of the mushrooms into the solution, so with no mushrooms it's not going to do anything and might degrade some of the alcohol extracted compounds. But if you mean you added more mushrooms to the alcohol extraction mixed with water then that would probably work to some degree. Either way, you should at least have some benefits from just your alcohol extraction.
@@camsurbanfarm I heated to get rid of the alcohol and there was no mushrooms when heated. There can't be any alcohol in it, due to alcoholism
@@pyrotec4577 Gotcha, did you heat it before or after combining with the water? For an alcohol-free tincture, I recommend evaporating down the alcohol extraction before mixing with the water until you're left with an oil, then add that oil to the water extraction and add vegetable glycerin to make it shelf stable. You'll want to add at least 60% vegetable glycerin, for example if you have 1000 mL of water decoction, add 1500 mL of vegetable glycerin. Otherwise, the tincture will go bad without the alcohol.
@@camsurbanfarm after, 170f for 3.5 hours and the turned off the heat. Is it useless? 😅 Thank for the alcohol free recipe 😊
@@pyrotec4577 I wouldn't say that, might be less potent than it would have been otherwise but still should be beneficial. I would try to use it within a week or two though if you're not going to add vegetable glycerin, and store it in the fridge.
Your hands are beautiful.
I think you have a nice voice just sayin
Thank you for the kind words!
Please apply some 3in1 oil to your vocal cords...😊
Why's bro sound like half robot?
beep beep boop boop 🤖
i think you went a little too hard on the vocal fry. good tutorial.
Yep, been working on that in more recent vids. Thanks for watching
@camsurbanfarm other than the fry i think your videos are really solid. I shall subscribe. Thanks for the content
Gotta work on the vocal fry but otherwise good vid
I had to mute it and use subtitles
Maybe needs to make a tincture for it!
Critiques like this are the reason I never could bring myself to make YT vids. It's gotten so much better in recent years, but obviously not gone. I like your "vocal fry" BTW lol
@@iamthewelcher vocal fry is a bad critique ? Lol