Star Trek Discovery SERIES FINALE Review
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- Опубликовано: 29 май 2024
- Life finds a way as Star Trek Discovery finally enters spacedock...
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Funnily enough the „famous actors from Enterprise that have never been on Enterprise“ list now has David Cronenberg and Idris Elba on it
I had to look up the Elba connection-never would have put together that if he was a MACO who fought the Xindi then he _must_ have served on the NX-01.
@@GSBarlev Exactly... and since the NX-02 was also still under construction, he could have only served on the NX-01 if he fought in the Xindi-wars... would have liked a Season 3 remaster where they would randomly insert him into the backgrund :-)
@@DerArvel honestly, the fact they called it "wars" rather than "war" (or even just "tensions" or "crisis" or something) made me confused about that. "Xindi wars" implies more than one, and a larger-scale conflict.
But then I was surprised by the Federation's apparent failures in just dumping him in the captain's chair. So if I analyse it as him being one of only a (half?) dozen of MACOs who'd survived, and had PTSD, his motivations certainly make a little more sense.
Archer probably even pulled some strings for him to try and help him, but didn't really understand it wasn't what he needed. He largely wasn't great about trauma or machismo. Especially when it came to his friends or his family, such as times he gave Trip the "man up!" talk.
@@kaitlyn__L I have to agree with Archer's machoism, though the exact quote was "We lost millions to the Xindi and Romulan Wars" so I would assume he'd use the plural here to describe both wars. Since the Earth-Romulan War was supposed to be some time after Season 4 of ENT, I would assume he would have come back from the NX-01 and was put on the USS Franklin when the war broke out (still sad we haven't seen this one already).
There is also the other notion of non-recognition since the entire MACO organization was basically disbanded some time later until it somehow dissolved into Starfleet and I fear that former members of MACO felt disillussioned about what they had been doing in the past and what their general contribution to those conflicts was.
Looking also at the numbering of the USS Franklin, they also must have ramped up production of those NX-class ships rapidly (NX-326) in order to compete against the romulan forces. That being said... Technically there could also be Prime-Krall still waiting in that Nebula to appear in Strange New Worlds...
It's been such a journey. I started watching you when discovery started and it reawakened my love of star trek. My best friend passed away in February and we used to watch every episode together. We literally watched all enterprise and ds9 and Voyager together and discovery really felt like damn we are back! It ushered in a whole new era for star trek and I'm really sad it's over especially since my bff Jesse never got to see it. Just wanted to thank you for these videos, they've meant alot to me ❤
So you watched Star Trek before. And you felt Star Trek was back with Discovery? Lol
@@chriswood1210 yes I did. It was nice to have any trek on the air that led to series I love like lower decks and S3 of Picard. Why did you feel the need to comment when I'm talking about grief? Did it make you feel better?
Sorry for your loss.
I, too, lost a best friend a couple of years ago that I bonded with through Star Trek. He brought me to Star Trek Fandom & I miss him a lot.
Take care.
@@NALurking thank you for that- sorry for your loss too. If there is one thing I've learned from being a trek fan is that it can really bring people together and can give us memories we will never forget ❤️
I’m sorry for your loss. I am sad Discovery ended and they ended on their terms. Star Trek Discovery helped me to be hopeful again. I was in a dark place and needed to believe again. This was a great ending.
Moll gave up and accepted the idea that L’ak can’t be brought back pretty quickly.
Runtime constraints but I would’ve really liked a few more seconds for like a “no no no, there has to be a way, there has to..!!” ; “Moll, he’s gone. I’m sorry… I promise I would help you if there was a way.” Then they look each other in the eyes for a few moments so Moll can tell she’s telling the truth
@@Cdr2002 Moll should have had a redemption by helping escape or something.
I agree. When it was revealed the progenitor tech couldn't do it, I really thought the Kwejian world root would (Checkov's Gun and whatnot).
That said, the _actual payoff_ of the world root was beautiful in its understatement.
@@kuro68000 I would’ve liked that
Gonna call it: They're gonna bring Moll on to the Starfleet Acadamy show.
While Discovery has ended I’ve appreciated being able to spend this voyage with you, Jessie. Your perspective and voice are so unique it enriched my time watching Discovery. Excited for your movie and whatever the future brings; both for Trek and you!
Time wars don't end, Jessie. Once you have the technology, someone has to manage the peace.
What I took from the Calypso tie-in is that Craft made it back home to do something really important and that Zora was recalled back to the Federation soon afterwards.
Zora, as a sentient being and Starfleet personal, shouldn't have been left 1000 years waiting. It's almost like sending a person to die... I wonder what she must be going through right now. The federation/Starfleet has abandoned her. I'm surprised that she's not even upset. I wonder what that 1000 yrs must of been like...I'm also surprised that no one tried to steal her too, especially the Breen seeing the power of transporting an entire dreadnought vessel at will...this tie in to the short trek episode was just fan service I think, which can be good and bad, and confusing for some...
@@andrewli1519 she was also part of the sphere for hundreds of thousands of years before joining with Discovery so perhaps the passage of time doesn’t mean the same thing to her as it does to us.
"How long was she alone?"
"Too long."
@@andrewli1519 it does seem cruel in many ways, but I also figure she can simply choose to make time "go faster" for her. There's a number of hard sci-fi stories which discuss simulated/robotic individuals lowering their sample rates of reality when they're bored, and want to skip to whenever the thing is done (computer program, plant growing, multiverse-crossing endeavour to the end of time...)
Leaving that door wide open for a future show ;)
I really like the modernized Progenitor makeup and how it separates them further visually from the Changelings
It also helps that it's not literally the same actress that played both the Progenitor and Female Changeling.
@@Bionickpunk holy shit how did I not notice that lmao
I’m so glad they never went the fanficy route and directly tied the two together (side-eyes the Borg/V’Ger crowd)
It's interesting, because when Burnham realizes that the progenitor tech could be used to raise (grow?) an army in a matter of days, my first thought was: Jem'Hadar?
Honestly, the progenitor tech doesn't seem particularly impressive given what already exists in _Trek_ canon, between the Genesis Device(s); the Dominion cloning tech; and Soong's golems.
@@GSBarlev while lacking the memory-encoding abilities of Dominion cloning, my assumption was that the Progenitor tech operated on a MUCH larger scale, able to create entire world populations from one location, rather than needing several smaller bases to make a few battalions of troops. I assume the tech has terraforming capabilities, and with better stability than the Genesis Device if I had to guess, but it’s not really delved into.
I agree, it’s all quite interesting
one issue I was dissapointed with in not just this episode but the past few episodes is how Detmer and Owosekun just dissapeared and weren't even mentioned. The only thing we got was that one ending scene. Which felt lacking. They should have been at Saru's wedding.
I've seen many point this out, but you have to remember they didn't know the show was going to be cancelled and one has to assume a 6th season would have include them more once again - and they may play a bigger part in the upcoming Starfleet Academy show along with Tilly. The actors may not have been available for filming, aka like Saru disappeared for like 5 episodes because Doug Jones was unavailable because he was promoting something else he was in (and filming Space Command etc.).
I KNOW!!! (FUMES)
Rayner said in one scene in the episode with the Mirror Enterprise that they were sent off to take that ship back to Starfleet, I guess they were occupied with that. Still sad though that they weren't present at the wedding. I'd guess the actors didn't have the time to film or didn't want to be in the show anymore.
I wanted to see the USS ENTERPRISE
@@elim_inator
Pretty sure they were there though they didn't get any lines.
Disappointing but pretty standard for this show.
And we still have no freaking clue if the Klingons even exist in the 32nd century.
I really enjoyed this series finale and this season as a whole, honestly my jaw was on the ground with the Daniels reveal.
Seeing Admiral Burnham, Book and her Son at the end just felt so right to end Discovery.
ICYMI-their son is named *Leto,* after his nephew. Which I thought was so sweet and perfect.
You forgot to mention Data, who got killed at Star Trek: Nemesis, who later gets resurrected and died later on Picard season one. Which later resurrected again at season three.
I'm disappointed that we never get see a face off between Rayner and Tahal. I hope future novels will finally find a resolution for that. And I have to agree without you, I'm disappointed that both Discovery and Zora will just be abandoned like that. I always assumed that Short Trek Calypso happened in an alternate timeline.
But, fortunately I'm happy to see the wedding of Saru and T'Rina. And the identity of Kovich, when he finally revealed his identity I was expecting "Trip" Tucker would pop-up unexpectedly.
The lack of a showdown between Rayner and Tahal is about the only part of this episode that really felt like they were expecting the show to continue, everything else felt very definitive and conclusive (much of this season has, really).
Moll's acceptance of La'ak not coming back almost worked for me, but I think she was too quick to just accept a simple "it won't work" from Burnam. Burnam saying something like "You can restore his body, but not his memories or his personality. It won't be him," but then offer to do it anyway if Moll wants, and then after a few sad moments, *then* Moll can accept he's gone.
That's how I would do it anyway.
This was my thought to. It doesn’t need to be drawn it, but Moll needed a few extra seconds to try to say it could still be done and then have to process and *then* it could’ve fully worked
Yeah, I had expected she would've been told *by* the Progenitor, but that obviously didn't happen, so her accepting things from Burnham the way she did needed either a beat more or lines along what you suggest.
You could have pulled a couple minutes off the Burnham home movie segment and padded this exchange a little more to make it more meaningful for her to break the promise she make to Moll but, nah, let's just skip all that.
There was also an issue with being unable to bring Wilson Cruz back for the reshoots. His character had a seasonal resolution. They managed to add him (visual effects??) to the bridge hug-out scene - but it may have been a factor in why he and Stamets didn’t have a final scene together.
I really liked Wilson Cruz's acting when he took on the alien persona in one of this seasons episodes. He is an endearing actor.
You can tell the "Culber" being hugged in that scene is a stand-in, and then its cut to his face is an obvious insert from something else, but it worked well enough. They did what they could with their circumstances.
I don't think this finale was better than ok but The Progenitor facility really did look beautiful.
You could definitely see where they spent the money this season.
I am still crying. I cried so much the characters from Dune started licking my face.
The ending even had a Leto II
Thank you for saying that Discovery’s emotionality is a strength. Very well said
I made the same "long road" joke while watching with fam. Imagine my surprise and shock when there was a tie-in to Daniels from Enterprise. Mans is the GOAT, and he canonically time travels to shop at Office Depot.
I'm still processing the feelings (mostly good ones) but I'm just gonna say I love how Kovich (real name redacted) ended up beign a Star Trek fan in his old days
Of all the legacy characters he could have been (I was momentarily worried from his office that he was a Picard golem), Daniels was the right choice.
I started watching Discovery when I first subscribed to Paramount+ about a week before I started my freshman year of high school, and now it’s ending about a week after the end of my senior year. It’s poetic in a way. This is the end of an era for me in more ways than one.
@@julianbashir8277
No. I simply didn’t subscribe to P+ until I started freshman year.
Also, why do you think my life must suck?
I liked it, although I could have done without the epilogue altogether. Knowing that Burnham was going off to have further adventures would have been enough, I didn't need the Calypso thing either.
The thing with Burnham having a secret clue Moll didn't felt very Last Crusade so I think we all kinda knew that Moll would "choose poorly."
I really liked this season ending. Really sad it also is the last discovery episode. I really felt like Discovery found itself the last 2 seasons. Sad that they did not get 2 more seasons now that characters and themes felt more settled.
All Star Trek shows from the original to now fundamentally wants to show how different people can work together in peace and by working together they create a family and friendship with respect. I believe it is this that people like and it draws people to watch and hope for a better future for the humanity. This season of Discovery show how working together as a crew and family can accomplish anything that is required . It was love for each other that helps the crew work together as one family. I loves this series finale because the characters have grown and they are better people . The title of this episode is what people should learn as a lesson .
18:57 i loved when Tilly called him cranky.
Michael is "the beating heart", hell she's the lungs, the bones, the muscle & the nervous system, the whole thing. Because other than her driving EVERYTHING, there has been no other character arc. 😅
I watched Discovery since about the time its third season came out, this crew and this show have been with me for the last four years. It was never my favorite show, but it has always felt like a special and safe place. I think this was its strongest season so far and I loved the themes it touched upon, I also think this was one of the better season finales of the show and it's a beautiful series finale, too. I'm really sad the show had to end, but if it did, this was probably the best way possible. I actually cried a bit when Discovery left for its final mission. It was such a beautiful shot. I'll miss this show.
My reaction to the wedding was genuinely “oh shit, big married!”
Truly I am a zoomer
I cried so much when I saw Michael and Book grown old and living a kind of mundane life. What an incredible privilege to get to grow old, to just get to live. So many of the people they love didn't get to have that. It made me feel so thankful for them and for my own life as long as I am privileged to have it.
I saw something recently from the actor who played Lok where he said that he was asked back but he was on vacation with his kids and had already been away from them for a while due to filming.
I feel like his character was killed off, with a plan to bring him back with the technology or some other way (Kovich for example) but as with Doug Jones, was not available for more filming and they had to make due with what they already filmed/wrote for the character.
Definitely makes sense that they might have been planning to circled back in S06. Also: mad respect to the man for prioritizing time with the fam.
THANKS for your work on this season!!! "All Good Things..." :)
You're smart--that puzzle wasn't easy for me!!! I'd still be there :)
For good and/or for ill, I think Disco's legacy is experimentation.
I thought that line from Kovich about Michael really summarized the whole series for me. Impressive in a way that is unparalleled, but with a unique quality to be incredibly aggravating. I also get what you were saying about the camera work, which I found to be a constant distraction. Now, I don't watch much newer television or film, so I don't know if this is just how they do it now and just accept it? It almost makes me dizzy, kind of like 3D video games.
That scene with Book and Moll definitely felt like a set-up for a continuation of their storyline rather than a resolution.
When he said he was agent Daniel......I was like "YES!", loved it, but was kind not surprised.....all the clues of things that belong to the past, showed me he had a relation to time travel.
Plus, I loved the ending in general; was crying in the ending hugs scene.
But, found it to be odd that Zora was left were she was as part of a plan, ad not an accident as I had immagiined before.
As someone who has been critical of the emotionality of Discovery (and speaking only for myself), it's not *that* Discovery has emotions, it's *how* it presents them. The existence of emotions has been portrayed as a positive in Trek since season 1 of TOS, and many shows have done well portraying characters reacting emotionally to events in subtle and gross ways. The problem with Discovery's portrayal of emotions has been that it is so over-the-top and melodramatic that it comes across as unrealistic and actually makes one take the commentary on emotion less seriously, not more. And this is coming from somebody who experiences emotions more intensely than most people.
I agree
"It's been a long road
Getting from there to here" 🎵🎶🖖
Discovery, thank you for taking us on this journey with you
My dad, whom was a long time Trekkie since the beginning with TOS. I sadly lost him to cancer back in late March. He loved every series, including Discovery.
Even in the stars, far away. I'm sure he would have enjoyed this too
Btw the Progenitors Tech, that is totally the TARDIS
I have so mamy feelings. I havent brought myself to watch it yet. Thank you for your work. Im grateful I found you through Trek and Disco
Yeah I was super surprised that the answer with the triangles was as simple as I imagined it. I thought it was at least going to be some geometry trick of some kind , not literally the first thing I would do playing with triangles 😂 I'm glad it didn't require cooperation with Moll and the Breen at least because that would go against all the other challenges Burnham faced.
I love they they named him Leto ❤
I wish they would have named him Spock.
@@TheWarrrenator if they had a second child I could see that but I think at that point in the series the name Leto was a more impactful reference to their history
They wanted the Culber moment to be something like Starbuck picks the jump coordinates from the music, but it didn't land. I was waiting for the punchline, and it just never came.
I mostly agree with your review. Overall I rate it as a neutral finale -- better than Enterprise or Voyager, but ultimately on par with TOS's lack of finale.
When Culber pulled that shit, I was like, "WOW he's literally pulling a Starbuck". The BSG trauma is real.
I have so many issues with Disco but I didn’t expect to ugly cry during the finale, yet here we are
I loved Discovery. I know there are haters.. but I've loved all of it. With the second half of Season 1 it became one of my favorite Star Trek shows.
I’m imagining Kovich still using time travel to do small things, like buy 21st century legal pads at an Office Depot.
Admiral Burnham's uniform reminds me of one of the STO choices you can take.
In the end when Zora is dropped off onto the cloud, i do believe who she's waiting for isn't the person who shows up in the short, Calypso. I'll need to watch that short again. I am a little disappointed with how they got to that point given that particular short is my favorite of all of them.
I didn't really care for the sereis when it first started. But, I got on board with it in it's third season when they traveled to the future putting the setting in new and unfamiliar territory.
I getting the feeling Paramount/CBS only want to go five seasons with all the Star Treks. I have nothing against that, but they should have given Discovery a heads up sooner than just telling them last minute like they did.
Really nice review, Jessie! I agree with all your criticisms of this episode. I loved the Kovich reveal! All in all, it was very sweet and moving end for the series.
The Progenitor mistery reminded me of Mass Effect's Citadel.
The Calypso thing looked fine to me: The idea that I got was that Zora and Craft would team up for some important events taking place after the Short Trek. It'd be forced if Kovich weren't known for playing with time travel. He probably knew that the 42th century Federation would need that element to survive and prosper.
43rd century, given the coda definitely takes place at least 30 or 40 years after 3191.
@@DLZ2000 good point
Yeah, kind of reverse reapers. I liked that.
With regards to the “creator and creations” thing. The Progenitors created humanoids, and humanoids created snyths. The cycle continues?
lol the "it been a long road" joke in first min had me i loled
Is it me, or did it sound like Kamin's song from the Inner Light in the background during the wedding scene?
I would have liked to see more of Rayner's own unique strengths and skills. We've seen plenty of his shortcomings, and we've seen his sort of generic strong leadership skills. I would have loved to see his unique strengths that got him through 30 years of starfleet captaining during starfleet's darkest days. Just as Burnham was able to teach Rayner, it would have been really satisfying to me to see Burnham use lessons she learned from Rayner during the season to succeed in the finale.
One quibble: there was no way they were going to leave Discovery in the pre-Kirk time period and walk to the later era. The whole reason to go to the later era was to put Discovery where Control couldn't get hold of the data that became Zora, so Control couldn't use that data to end all intelligent life..
After it all... there was a lot of stuff I liked about Enterprise, and a lot which was whelming. Not underwhelming, just whelming. The stakes are just about always full galactic, and I'd have loved more filler episodes--smaller scale ones here and there which give a lot more room to some of the other bridge crew--but all in all, a positive show. It tried new things with (mostly) new people, and helped bring back Star Trek. Even if it didn't always land, I don't think any Disco episodes would make a Top Ten Worst Episodes of All Trek list. If that's the legacy of Disco, I think it's a good one.
Also, glad for the Enterprise-heads that Daniels stayed relevant. I didn't really love the temporal cold war stuff there, but hey, if we all loved the same things, the universe would be boring.
It's not the strongest element of the franchise but it's canon and deserves a nod.
I love that we had the series finale in 2018. Short Treks. Season 1, episode 2.
It was mean to Zora, but I like to think that Daniels has calculated that Zora will be needed by the V'draysh to rebuild the Federation again, and she'll be more effective if there are certain things she doesn't know yet.
Honestly, I feel they could have gotten 3 more episodes out of the season if they had spent some time developing some side character moments. Exploring Kulber's spiritual journey more, giving Raynor more of an arc, stuff like that. Generally figuring out where all the OG bridge crew went.
I saw as much as I wanted of Rayner but otherwise I agree.
This being the Burnham show does tend to mean that other characters get short changed.
If this was The Orville Saru's wedding would have got its own episode.
Thank you Jesse for your thoughtful and insightful reviews of Discovery. Your channel was a place to go for me to escape all the unnecessary and unwarranted hate that Discovery was getting. I watched seasons 1-3 and much all of season 4 in a bubble. No spoilers, no preconceived notions on what the show was about and more importantly no hate. It was because of this my love for Star Trek was reignited and led me to watching SNW, LD, Picard and even watching clips of ENT a show I stopped watching around the 3rd season. So while I think DISCO should have gotten a sixth season I was satisfied with this ending.
Quite liked how the series ended. It doesn't beat The Undiscovered Country, All Good Things, or What You Leave Behind, but it's on the higher end of the rest of the Trek finales.
Wow
Ich bin absolut begeistert.
Diese Serie hat mich gefesselt von Anfang an.
Das Ende hat mir Tränen in die Augen getrieben.
Mir fehlen die Worte😢
It is kinda weird that there isn’t the expected-but-warranted Burnham and Moll team up to genuinely figure out the technology together. I think Moll could’ve been better handled overall; her problem for me is that she has a lot of character traits and character facets but only one emotional presentation that’s used to get her character across. Bitter/cocky/distrustful isn’t just her default mode, it’s her whole mode. For a series that I find to be full of such emotionally layered characters, I find it weird that they kept her to such a default state. She felt like a one-off character from the Berman era transplanted into a season-long arc and given a 21st century Euphoria/Billie Eilish coat of paint.
You're not wrong.
As an antagonist she was a bit lacking, and this was particularly true in the final episode which wouldn't have been different if she hadn't been there at all.
@@alanpennie I don’t agree entirely. The basic plot could have functioned the same without her sure, but you’d have to rewrite the season beforehand to not have the problem of Moll being a dropped plot thread. A lukewarm resolution still is one
Did they ever establish why Moll hates the federation so much?
@@kbj686 I don’t recall specifically, I always assumed she was a human that was essentially left behind after the Burn and bereft of that Federation security blanket ostensibly guaranteed to her. Although given the time frame you’d think her beef would be with United Earth, but maybe she distrusts the Federation for letting Earth back in. I have no idea. You can say she dislikes powerful institutions generally but she’s willing to become involved with Breen politics to get L’ak back and seemed to know she’d have to follow through with her promise of installing him on the throne upon resurrection him. At least for as long as until they could fly away somewhere. Very unclear, feels like they just wanted their “anti-authority snarky female antagonist” archetype
My first thought about Kovich, seeing all the ancient "relics" in his office and that he talked about having many lifetimes and many names, was that they implied he also is Methuselah and Daniels was just one of his lifetimes.
He says in _Enterprise_ that he's mostly human-I wonder if there's some El-Aurian or Lanthanite in his family tree.
The way Moll went from being super annoying in her distrust of EVERYBODY to suddenly being "Oh well" after Burnham says they can't do anything for Lok had my jaw on the floor.... It's crazy that she just accepted it with no questions.... Also what happened to Discovery's detached nacelles in the flash forward scenes? They seemed pretty attached on the last voyage.
I figured it was because she realized she was pregnant.
What happened to the sweet guy with the bird alarm clock?
I’ve enjoyed your reviews. I grew to appreciate Disco more over the years and it certainly brought Trek back in a big way. I’m sorry the writers were short changed because of the cancellation of the show after the fact. 🖖🏽
Find the one among the many isn't only part of the ethos of Star Trek, overall; but specifically also of the whole Progenitor's original mission.
I think this shows that Kovich is Star Trek's equivalent to Kang.
Honestly this is my third favorite Trek finale of the ones I’ve seen so far, behind What We Leave Behind and Undiscovered Country, but maybe I need to give All Good Things another watch. It just didn’t make me feel as much as I would’ve hoped, especially compared to the other finales I mentioned as well as “Life, Itself”
I'm wondering if the Section 31 movie will cover whatever the Calypso connection was about, and give that whole arc more meaning...
Now wouldn't that be cool!
@@angelasims7377 I was thinking too, now that Zora/Discovery's mission is complete, could she return to base again? And what has become of the Federation ANOTHER 1,000 years in the future, since Craft confirmed they still exist?
You could tell that if Discovery was allowed 1 more season, it probably would have been the last 30 minutes of the season made into a full season (in the future; connecting back to calypso).
When I figured out it was a Enterprise easter egg I thought about you instantly 😂
I thought the triangle riddle was a little too obvious at first as well, but on reflection, I think that the characters’ struggle to get it at first exemplifies their mindsets and priorities.
Moll is desperate to get L’ak back and is getting increasingly impatient, so goes with an immediately obvious wrong answer, failing to identify the deliberate wording of the riddle.
Whereas, Burnham is the complete opposite, overthinking it, and missing the simple answer because she’s so sure the 24th century archaeologists would have given a deeper riddle, which kind of ties into her arc this season of her tendency to let herself be blinded by “The Mission”. She says at one point “all the clues had cultural significance”; she’s so busy thinking about how the first clue tied to Romulan poetry and how the second clue tied to Trill symbiosis etc, and how Betazoid culture might tie into the riddle, that she forgets to think about the riddle itself.
I really liked the way this show ended. I liked that it tied it back into the Shirt Treks. I like that it did the classic trek thing and flash-forward 30-40 years after the final mission. But Michael's mindset at the end of the episode, not the coda, really made me want another season. I wanted to see her with these "eyes wide open," as it were. I also thought Kovich was going to be a Q and not Agent Daniels. I was pleasantly surprised I was wrong. However, I wish he had specified and said "NX-01 Enterprise" and not just "Enterprise".
He said “USS Enterprise”, which the NX technically never was as it was pre-Federation. I took it to mean after some thought that to him, the Enterprise-J was “his” ship, like the 1701 to Scotty or the Stargazer I to Picard. I thought it was a sweet nod to the ol’ Starbase with Nacelles and gave that ship more meaning.
I agree with you that I liked this finale :)
My head Canon is that she didn't kill the last progenitor. Instead that she let it transition to another universe.
Also! Book and Michael's son is named Leto, after Book's deceased nephew
Given the way the rest of the season played out, I would have preferred the triangles test benefit from Burnham and Moll collaborating, though not required. Additionally, I would have preferred the triangles, with their beveled edges, require a three-dimensional assembly, forming a dodecahedron.
I'm going to miss this show. I was hoping for more seasons. :(
I burned through it recently in preparation for this end and was hit with strong emotions from how much I resonated with it. I’m gonna miss this show to 🫂
I think the one thing that hampered Discovery and all of modern Trek is how its so limited in episodes. I felt that it didn't provide enough space to really flesh out the storylines in a way to give them the depth they deserved and bring the proper resolution to the character's storylines.
Slightly off topic: I hope that if they are considering a legacy show, they give it more episodes to work with and use the first one or two seasons to properly tie up the loose ends with all legacy characters so that we can actually move on in the series and tell new stories with new people. But still keep Captain Seven 😤😉
I definitely agree that they didn’t properly establish the space windows in the progenitor facility I spent a good minute trying to figure out what Burnham meant before we finally got a proper look (at first I was like “Are there meant to be windows between the vertical beams of light and they just forgot to put them in?”)
Oh was it meant to be Book when Michael talked about getting back someone she loved? I didn’t have subtitles on this week and the one pronoun was a bit mumbled so I didn’t get a gender tip off so I assume she meant her Mum.
I did have to laugh that the first thing Burnham did when she encountered life there was to rip the leaf right off it. I kept hoping for a progenitor to pop up and judge her for her biases about lesser life and its forms etc
The revelation that the progenitors found the facility really made the ep for me. It created a grander scope and gave it more depth (also reminded me of mass effect and the citadel )
I really hated how they got rid of the tech. Not that it happens but the steps. Something about the “yeah this has been looked over and protected by many races over billions of years but I think we have enough diversity so I’ll throw it into a black hole without talking to the progenitor again to let her know” it felt a waste of something precious like if they had been able to delete the spore data in season 2.
I felt the ep was strong but was let down by most of the season being so weak. If the other episodes had the same attention and care that this episode had it would've been a fantastic season.
The coda was well done, I wish there was more for the other characters tho. The old-age makeup was great and how SMG acted in old age admiral had aspects I wish had come in when she became a captain. There was always a light and fluffiness and lack of authority that was tuned way too high with Captain Burnham that could've been replaced with an easy-going but still serious take. I can't word it right but looking at how Admiral Burnham is acted I hope it's obvious what I mean.
And the very end. Never seen Calypso cos of how short treks were handled outside of North America so it felt super contrived to finally wrap it up as I had no attachment to it (when they did deem us worthy and randomly dumped all of them on Netflix mid-season 3 I think I had no rush to get around to binge-watching any)
I love you very much and your videos. Thank you very much. You are totally awesome. LLAP 🖖
I thought that find ine in the many was going to be a sun. The triangles touching corners in a close circle. ☀️
The portal into other worlds reminded me of the Iconians... will they turn out to be the pre-Progenitors?
What do you think about Discovery's running commentary on spirituality? I know you mentioned it, but I am curious about how you think they handled it across the series. I think they have always been rather clumsy with it. They manner it is approached in DS is in my opinion jarring in the context of the greater trek themes of leaning into naturalism and philosophy. It often approaches spiritualism more like other shows do. Assuming, you subscribe to the same idea, generally speaking, of spirituality. Making assumptions about spiritual feelings. It makes the messages they are try to convey confusing to me. DS9, I feel always was clearer about how the series perspective was on the matter. As in, spirituality was more a choice, and not a fact that just can't be accepted by naturalists. It would be one thing if DS managed to say something interesting, but really all I get is, a vague, hey even in the future some people have this spiritual feelings, and its mysterious and nobody understands it, but isn't kinda amazing, right? And that, is just not very profound to me.
I watched every single episode of this show out of sheer determination and stubborness.
And I still don't care about any character except Saru, Pike, Georgiou and Koivch.
I'm sorry but the whole thing was a mess, and I'm glad it's over.
The only good and worthwhile thing that came out of it is Pike and Strange New Worlds.
Kovich said He was from USS Enterprise but Archer’s Enterprise was NX-01 Enterprise.
Got around to watching this the other day. Although I haven't particularly enjoyed the series, I did feel it went from strength to strength from season 3 and this final season being my favourite. As for this series finale, my favourite scene was the reveal of agent Daniels! I loved that there was a reference to my favourite trek series there. It's like you said, there's been a lot of nods to enterprise in recent trek shows and now would be the perfect time to bring it back in some form. Give that story and characters the proper conclusion they deserve before it's too late. I do wonder what the future of star trek is though. Prodigy cancelled, lower decks cancelled, Picard ended, discovery ended, section 31 now a movie not a series... should we be concerned for strange new worlds?!
When I first started watching Star Trek my first impression was that the person who writes the scripts for this show is Jewish because of the live long and prosper hand signal given by Spock. Then my Rabi informed me that Leonard Nimoy was Jewish.
These short seasons, do seem to be rushed..... We really needed old style 22 episodes..
I thought the coda they added was very well done. I'm glad they set up the Calypso short trek which I really enjoyed. While I've always found Discovery to be a mixed bag, it's still important to give it it's credit. It proved the fan base was still passionate as ever, lead to great new shows like Lower Decks, Prodigy, & SNW. I thought this season made great use of the Breen. I was always intrigued by them. I watched the final two episodes back to back, glad I did. Cronenberg turning out to be Daniel's caught me by surprise and I liked it as well as seeing Sisko ball and the visor. I'm sorry that Kayla and Okoye couldn't appear for more then a cameo without lines, I hope the projects they've been doing are great and give them a chance to really shine.
10:30 I saw this as their way of going full Mustafar for the big final fight between these two. It definitely had that energy, at least in terms of the fighters’ determination to win since obviously the personal histories are radically different
Late to this video but feels like they ran out of time/money for vfx. No clear shot of the "windows", no shot of the telltale shadow to the hidden space and no shot of the saucer separation.
Perhaps Daniels is both Crewman Daniels and Future Guy
lol-truly go the _All You Zombies_ route.
@@GSBarlev
All you zombies hide your faces...
The way I FREAKED out over the Daniels reveal! As a huge Enterprise fan, I feel so seen lol
I appreciated Burnham having a happy ending, the Calypso tie-in because it shows them trying to tie things up even if it didn't really hit, Daniels and the extensive reconstructive surgery he must have had after how messed up he got in Enterprise. The "oh we just found this place" and chucking it into the black hole felt like a really pat send off for such a big thing in the universe though. In a weird way it was kind of an empty cop-out ending that reminded me somehow of Starfield and that disappointment. I was also sad that at almost no point this season did Moll ever behave rationally. And the puzzle being that dumb reminds me of every game where you just do the Tower of Hanoi or something similar. But I suppose it's like when you have to represent technology you can't have them do an actual math problem or come up with something meaningful about science that doesn't exist, you're just trying to create the illusion of it with no actual depth. That's why somehow all the solutions for problems they come up with in Discovery feel so unearned to me. When Geordi, Torres, or whoever was doing stuff there was enough consistency in the technobabble that even though it was nonsense it felt like it was part of a world, where in Discovery the writers don't have the same level of craft, and they try to cover it with jokey lines like the "I love math" thing from earlier seasons. Like with the bungled time travel plot of Season 2, the writers seem to constantly mistake murkiness for depth. I love what they're trying to do and many of the characters we have along the way but it just rarely feels like the achieve it.
The stupid religious shit they've done with Culber also feels forced to me too and I hate it. And in the end that it's a memory from, or purposely left, by Jinal is all you need to explain you have to work really hard to make it anything else. It strikes me as all the special pleading DS9 had to do to try to pretend the Bajoran religion wasn't just a cargo cult and has more like a concession to our own retrograde society than the hopeful world of the future.
On the whole, Discovery is far from the best Trek but I've enjoyed it and am glad for all it has accomplished, particularly in having so many more people be able to see themselves in that future.
I'm so confused about Culber's arc? Is the payoff to his whole spiritual journey just him suddenly remembering some resonance frequency from Jinal? Cause that's what I took away. Did I miss something?
This is what I said on TrekCulture about The' Last Episode, and I agree with you about Zora; "I definitely did not like the last few minutes of The' Final Episode, sure nice montage . I watched Short Treks Season 01 Episode 02 but even with the connection made I found it lacking. I hope there is a new connection where Zora actually gets into a new Star Trek Future. And, as for L'ak when we're told that his body can be re-created but his essence cannot be don't tell me Dr. Noonien Soong and his transfer technology was completely lost, after all he used it for his wife. Also, if you can borrow from many Sci-Fi tropes, Zora could make her own body. Well, I'll wait for a new series expecting Zora. That thousand year wait seems so empty."
The trouble with the title "Life Itself" is that I can't help but autocomplete with "You mean he's going to send us to another planet?". Even though that's not even accurate.
I think, on the whole, it fits into "All things considered, it does the job well enough". Which is sufficient, but it's a little frustrating to know that "They did such a seamless job of turning a pig's ear into a silk purse that you wouldn't even know what they were fighting to get this done, necessity truly is the mother of invention" can and sometimes does happen. You can see and feel every "Look, this isn't what they thought they were filming".
But some of the priorities were already weird. Burnham and Moll had a fight sequence comparable to Peter Griffin and the rooster, but there was only enough time for "Can't save L'ak. Sorry." "We can't? Well, shit."? Could have cut some of the fisticuffs to make space for a little bit of "No, I can't give up now, I've come this far, the things I did to get here can't have been for nothing-" "It wouldn't be him. He wouldn't even know who you were." type dialogue to make it believable that she was convinced.
My problem with "make one from the many" is that "The Chase" entirely depended on multiple Progenitor-seeded species working together. It is inconsistent with that that Burnham didn't need to gather up a representative of multiple species to operate the terminal. President Rillak would have done in a pinch, she counts as at least three. Or at least, as you said, work with Moll.
I thought Saru's subplot worked pretty well. It didn't actually jump out at me as a last minute addition, I feel a little sheepish for not picking up on that.
I literally gasped when I saw Sisko's baseball. The noise I made when Kovich introduced himself as Daniels was barely human.
A mentorship program for the Academy seems like it's tailor-made to shoehorn cameos into the next series.
Calypso was a godsend in the end, wasn't it? Sending _Discovery_ off to a known destination works really well in a pinch to create an ending that isn't just hanging loose.
May I just shout out the casting director who found the perfect son for Book and Michael?
He's a beautiful man, IJS...He'd be great for yet another spinoff or at a role in the upcoming series... 😊
Have you played Star Trek Online? Daniel’s has a big part in that, which shows a lot of his timeline shenanigans continuing after Enterprise.
I think you are too generous to the Discovery finale, but you are a magnificent reviewer. Smart, funny, know your stuff, and CUTE! Your review of Resurgence was spot-on, and convinced me to buy the game. I wish I was age appropriate to cosplay with you, but at least I can subscribe. You are my new favorite internet person. (fwiw, I'm senior,bi ,he/him)
I'm gonna miss this show😢
Screw Paramount. I want more Disco!
Ooh. Good reminder-I told myself I was going to cancel my P+ membership after _Disco_ finished (and doubled down on that once the _LDS_ cancelation was announced). Lemme do that now.
[SPOILERS] The connection of Kovich to Daniels implies that human male pattern baldness is canonically only solved in the 33rd century. I guess there was really was no hope for Picard.
Star Trek Strange New Worlds won't be filming until 2025 so it will be a long wait for that. At least Lower Decks will be out sooner, and perhaps Prodigy Season 2 might be out sooner than later. End of Discovery, however they hint Michael might appear as an admiral in Star Trek Academy maybe appearing occasionally, who knows? Or will Academy go back in time a little for when Tilly is younger as an instructor. Discovery final series episode I rate at 7/10. It was okay as a wrap up. Daniels tie in was good. I always liked Book as a character.
I think the Academy series will likely be set between the end of Discovery season 5’s main plot and the epilogue at the end of the show, so that they can keep bringing back all the characters without having to do old makeup or explain what they’ve been doing for the past few decades
@@Cdr2002 I agree with you, that would make the most sense. Discovery cast could drop in anytime as guest stars at Academy without being too much older in makeup.
@@adrianvanleeuwen a wealth of discovery character guest spots is my hope for the show. I don’t want it to be a complete stealth season 6, but something more do the vibe of the novels or the first two seasons of Picard in terms of pre-existing characters coming, going, and getting character bits here and there. Guest spots on Lower Decks would be another example of what I’m hoping for