VLF vs PI Metal Detector Saltwater Beach Minelab Manticore Deus 2 Garrett Axiom Equinox 900 GPX 6000
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- Опубликовано: 27 авг 2024
- Target comparisons at a Saltwater beach in Utah salt is 8 times greater than the ocean, between PI and VLF machines. Minelab Manticore, Minelab Equinox 900, XP Deus 2, Minelab GPX 4500, Minelab GPX 6000, Garrett Axiom.
Deus 2 settings
Beach sensitive, sensitivity 97, reactivity 1.5, salt sensitivity 6, bottle cap reject 0, silencer 0, disc 6.8, 3 tones with break at 50
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Thanks for the effort you put in on this test.
You're welcome, thanks for watching.
That was a nice clean test. Enjoyed. I do think the Fisher AQ would have had no issues getting any of those in All metal, once you switch to the disc mode you loose about a 1/3 of the depth. Impressive on the D2 at 16 inches, I think the Excalibur would have got to 14 inches (all metal) but after that very iffy and not a signal one would stop for.
Per Minelab Engineer Tom Dankowski who worked on the Equinox and Manticore - wrong beach mode was used on Manticore:
Beach Low Conductors Mode
Volume: 25
Ferrous Volume: 25
Recovery Speed: 4
Discrimination Pattern: All Metal
Ferrous Limits: Upper = 4, Lower = 0
Nothing Notched out. (Bring in the iron).
Audio Theme = Prospecting
Ground Balance the unit close to the edge of the saltwater
Run Sens on 24 or 25 or 26....... depending/dictated by the salt-content of your particular beach. (Start at 24..... and see how stable the unit is. Then bump-up Sens accordingly using LONG PRESS NOISE CANCEL PROCEDURE). IF IF IF you can run Sens 28...... you are going to find the results...interesting.
I do recommend making the hotkeys: Upper Left Button = Noise Cancel. Upper Right Button = Ground Balance. Sidebar button = Iron
((( P.S. = A Nickel is not even close to being a 'low conductor' to the Manticore! )))
So clearly this video is very controversial to some. I know Tom Dankowski verry well and have read his forum. What you don't realize is the great salt lake is 8 times saltier than the ocean. So everything he says that works on Florida beaches is out the window. I have used the Manticore enough to know what settings work best at this location. Have found plenty of deep stuff with as well. Sensitivity jacked up on the Manticore is actually counter productive in EMI, salt and high mineralization.
@@RelicsRings just curious if you tried the long press noise cancel procedure on the Manticore to see if you could run more sensitivity and Beach Low Conductors mode?
@Kevin Walenciak yes have done both. Have tried every combination of settings on Manticoresover over the 16"" nickel and the settings I show gave the best results and still allowed manageable hunting conditions. When the Manticore sensitivity is run up too far on the Manticore at this location you get a constant signal across the surface of the sand. It's totally unhuntable when it's like that.
@@RelicsRings took my Manticore to the GSL for the first time yesterday and that is exactly what I experienced. Not even trying to say I've learned the best settings on my first time there. But I ran Beach Deep with default ferrous limits, Recovery 4, 1 region all tones, no disc, all metal. Some spots I had to turn the sensitivity down to 20 to get away from the constant salt signal, other spots it could run as high as 24, doing a new long press and GB each time. That said, I recovered some deep non ferrous and felt pretty good about how the machine performed. GSL is not a spot I normally hit very often, but one thing for that high salt content, it stays thawed when everything else is frozen around here!
@Dave Affleck nice report! Yes some areas you can get up to 24. But usually not near the waters edge where we did the testing. I'm no expert either and with more use maybe can finds some settings that will get deeper. That being said I've tried about every combination of settings I can think of and settled on the ones I have in the video.
Great video after watching I tried two of my Vlf detectors and my ATX at 14 and 16 on my high salt beach with black sand at 5 inches plus. 1 Gauss MD 2 Aka Signum HM 3 ATX. Got a suprise using a silver quarter in the test. The Gauss MD had the edge then the ATX matched the Signum just. After cracking the ATX up to almost max it beat the Guass MD slightly. But the MD was set to L3 on 32 gain so had alot more to give. Interesting test to do. I'm going to try this on land now in med soil GB in around 78 and see how these do. :) Thanks for your effort guys enjoyed watching
Great demonstration! Thanks
Thanks for the video..
You're welcome
That was a very interesting test Andrew, thanks for taking the time to show us your results.
Glad you enjoyed it
I'd choose the manticore over any of them regardless, it's a better around machine IMO !! 😎
Enjoyed your videos on comparison of the different detectors, giving me a better idea of which one my buy.
Glad I could help
Excellent test, very straight forward and no nonsense. It would have been interesting to see how the Axiom reacted if you kept bumping up the sensitivity to max. Also might have had some merit in trying Fine mode.
I live in the West Coast and right now nothing can beat the Deus II on our ocean beaches.
Thanks glad you liked it. The Axiom with the sensitivity run too high starts falsing. Fine mode can be run but it's very unstable.
I have hunted Southern California with my Deus 2 and was very impressed with the depth it was getting.
I agree, the falsing at high sensitivity on the Axiom makes it unusable. PI's don't rule on depth at the beach anymore so I can't see much need to use them except maybe in heavy black sand or for microgold hunting on the dry.
I agree but it would be nice if the next daus model.had a pulse program you could just change the coil.for gold detecting in heavy mineralized ground
Would the 900 and manticore improve with increased sensitivity? How was their 21 compared to the sensitivity you were running on the D2?
21 sensitivity is pretty darn high for the manticore. I hunt underwater ocean at as low as 12 to 15 and im still digging crazy deep.
Why did you have the Equinox 900 sensitivity set at 22 and Manticore less than that at 21?? Did you try raising the sensitivity on the Manticore and do a long press noise cancel to see if you could increase the sensitivity? The Manticore should have easily matched the Deus with proper settings...
All detectors were setup so that they were running at actual huntable settings. The salt content is 8 times what it is at an ocean. The D2 with its salt sensitivity settings can clearly handle the salt better.
Still should have tried atleast 23 send so we could see the difference @@RelicsRings
Great Video. We appreciate these tests!
Glad you like them!
Interesting comparison, rarely see PI machines put up against vlf. All of those are nice detectors, I personally use the d2 with a 800 back up. In my area depth is not as important as separation.
Thanks for watching!
Wish you had the Fisher PI there
Thought about getting one. But didn't want to spend that much on a detector that may never make it to production.
The Whites Surf PI would've beat all of them if it were still available,i'd remembered digging 20 inches on a quarter and on a variety of rings,so sad they went under😢
get a Dual Field lots of them around.
Good video. Thank you.
Which one was the last one tested, it had a black coil?
Let me bring along my Whites TDi pro 😅
great job very fair and telling. maybe a few tweaks on the Manti might have helped like less FE limits. Can't help thinking that a DF, AQ or TDI would eat all of those though. These gold machines are just too sensitive for the viscostiy of salt sand.
Thanks. I've had several TDI's over the years out there and the GPX is easily 2" deeper.
@@RelicsRings
O tdi pulse cam .
E melhor que o gpx5000.?
Pra ouro ?
I chose the 900 over the Manticore for price reasons but the Deus is clearly the depth winner.
They are all good machines and have advantages in different areas. 900 is a good value for the money.
As a axiom user in salt mode if found with the dd you can use the sensitivity up alot higher then 3 or 4 and have machine run stable, picked target up on beach over 500mm diwn cleatly not fun digging when it's just rubbish
long press noise cancel on Manticore and you can run your sen higher. You had the numbers fairly equal but by doing that your cutting the power of the Manticore down below what the others are putting out. Bet you anything that manticore could hit that 14 and 16 inch the same the D2 did with the proper adjustments.
Yes if EMI is an issue. When I long press it settles on one channel immediately, indicating EMI is not very high in the area. Salt is what is limiting the sensitivity on the Manticore. It hits the 16" dime, just hard to hear without headphones on. Neither the D2 or Manticore give an ID, it's totally about audio at that point.
well said--especially with Dakowski's settings.
First thank you for another great video, and well done on your test. I was thinking of getting the D2 and think from what I have seen in other videos and now your tests it's going to be an easy choice. Would love to know your settings for the D2 on beach as well, thanks again from across the pond.
Thanks glad you liked it. I posted the settings in the video description.
@@RelicsRings Great and thank you again😊
I'm in the same boat as you Joe, looking hard at the D2 and this test doesn't disappoint. I'm thinking of going with the D2 Master but it doesn't have ground tracking. Most often I have tracking ON with my Nox 800.
This was the only test I was busting to see.
Being a beach guy, I really wanted to see the modern vlfs tested side by side with top PIs like garrets latest pi
I can't speak for other beaches but at mine I can pretty much ditch the PI's now.
@@RelicsRings
Not so fast.
Some beaches are quite noisy using a vlf,
Pi s run dead silent, something that's a real pleasure
@Urge38 I agree on a regular ocean beach and especially ones with black sand I will still us a PI. That comment just applies to my area, not in general.
Well Deus sens 97 compared to 21 on the manticore is not quite fair 😉 That's linke 98% against 60% if you'd count 35 as 100%, 70% if you take the normal range til 30 as a measure. For the Nox it has been ~79%.
Manticore will not run at anything higher than 22 while hunting that beach. These detectors were set at sensitivity levels that allow actual huntable settings. D2 clearly is able to handle the high salt levels better.
I'd try Surf&Seawater on the Manticore and Beach2 on the Nox. They're designed for such salty environments. How ever - no Minelab defender here 😊Both - the Minelab(s) and the Deus missed to tick some boxes for me at their pricepoint. The Deus shaft is hilarious wobbly, and that antenna is a pita for us waterhunters. On the Minelabs I want to be able to use my own wireless headphones - sadly they have not planned to release someting like the WM module. We'll see, what the aftermarket brings up. Would be interesting how much drag the Manticore coil produces under water, too. Too many spokes for my taste.
Did try seawater on the Manticore with similar results, although was able to run the sensitivity up to about 28. Beach 1 has always been better at this location, have owned an 800 since they came out. Yea I'm with you on the headphones, really don't like them and would prefer to use a module like I did on the 800.
Thanks for the video! Definitely some food for thought.
Thanks for watching!
Great test
Thanks
Great comparison, btw just order one of the Tshirts very nice.
Thanks I appreciate that.
You didn’t reduce the recovery speed on the MineLab products. That would definitely increase depth. On my old Equinox 800, you gained an inch per recovery speed number reduced. The Deus acts pretty much the same. Likewise, you didn’t increase their sensitivity. Finally, you didn’t say what your reactivity and sensitivity settings were on the Deus 2. By the way I’m a Deus 2 user, but want to see apples to apples tests.
That was an eye opener. I’m sure there will be updates to the Manticore and it will improve but the DEUS 2 is the wet salt winner at this point. I use my D2 for Gold Rush relic sites and couldn’t be happier at this point. Thank you for the comparison Andrew.
Thanks for your comments. D2 does handle salt well. I'll be further experimenting with the Manticore to see if I can squeeze a little more depth out of it.
I still will use the Manticore over my Deus for now, The 2D really makes it easy to move on and save time IMHO @@RelicsRings
Thanks for all the hard work. Would be curious to see what the gpx 4500 would do with the rx gain set above preset. It should preform a lot deeper and still handle the salty black sand with a higher rx gain. I am not doubting the new vlf machine's are good because your test show they are.
I've used the GPX's for years out there and the problem is when the gain is increased much past prest you get threshold drift which is nearly impossible to hear deep targets through.
Do you think the gpx will out perform on other beaches?
@7mm Saum yes on regular ocean beaches with heavy black sand the GPX will perform better.
Minelab gpx 5000 vs xp deus 2 .If you were after gold alone and digging high low tones with the gpx and beach low conductor in the xp. What in your opinion would give you the best odds? I realize you could get more ground covered with the xp but would the extra depth of a 5000 make a difference ?This is hunting beach wet sand only. Thanks
Minelab gpx 5000 vs xp deus 2 .If you were after gold alone and digging high low tones with the gpx and beach low conductor in the xp. What in your opinion would give you the best odds? I realize you could get more ground covered with the xp but would the extra depth of a 5000 make a difference ?This is hunting beach wet sand only. Thanks
Good stuff
Thanks
nice test.
Thanks for posting the test. Just curious, do you run ground tracking on or off on the D2?
Ground tracking off
@@RelicsRings Makes sense for the test but how about when you're out hunting the beach?
@P 1 still off. I only ground balance when the D2 gets erratic.
@@RelicsRings Cool, thanks bro.
Nice test
Thanks
From other tests on yt Equinox900 seemed more powerful than deus2, sensitivity-wise, this test proved the opposite
It should be possible to increase the sensitivity of Minelab ?
without false signals.
I have tried that and although you can do it on the test target, when you hunt there are too many false signals.
@@RelicsRings Ok, thanks for your tests and your very good channel.
I am French and I also hunt on the beach.
Which detector do you prefer for the beach?
@Launa86 Une nouvelle vie thanks I'm glad you like the channel. I like both the Manticore and D2 on the beach.
@@RelicsRings Best regards.
You never mentioned what sensitivity you were running the D2 on. I personally run my 900 at 26 on the beach. Something tells me you're a Deus kinda guy 😂
Yep, D2 definite winner under these conditions. I wonder how an old Garrett Sea Hunter MII with a 10x14 coil would fair?
Not sure on the Garrett sea hunter. Never owned one.
Do a test under water and it will be completely different
Yea it will.
gday from oz,just got the manticore its a very busy machine testing on a oz beach very mineralized can only get to 22 sens its about as deep as my ctx but chirpier,my 12 year old tdi pro kills both of them,problem with that its not waterproof so its limited but on a fine day with no chance of water its a killer.thanks for the vid.
Do you think that TDI beach hunter it goes to same deep as. The TDI pro?
Tri pro is deeper
Could not help notice that you said you were on beach 1 but notice the sand was wet which beach 2 is for wet sand and having the Manticore on sensitivity of 21 was like tie it hands while doing the test might want redo your test one more time.I do like your testing method but feel you might want to check it out.I have Nox 600 and on beach have found dime's and flip tap tabs at 14- 16 "often.
It's all in the setup .....you should of changed the settings as you tested
Thanks
Ty for sharing the comparison
Deus 2 seems stronger
You're welcome.
You have to consider the real-world environment; would you actually dig a target that chirps on a wet saltwater beach? I would have to be able to hear a difference when swinging and it has to be a clear signal. For those who hunt all the time, it has to be something I would consider a signal before I dug anything. When your testing these machines, you know that there is a target there and you know if you hear something going over it, but realistically when I hear chatter on the beach, I'm not digging anything that seems to be questionable because there is so many false signals on a wet salt beach.
How’s the Discrimination on those PI machines
Can they be used on the beach and rely on disc?
There really is no disc on a PI. It's all about how a target sounds that determines whether or not I dig.
@@RelicsRings thanks
I was thinkin of getting the fisher aq impulse that is similar to a tdi pro
But on a trashy beach not good
If you changed the audio theme to normal simple it would sound way better in deeper targets with manti
Mate, you cannot rebury targets. You have no halo effect anymore. Plus, no detector works properly in loose non compacted sand as well.
you do know that NOBODY walks that slow when metal detecting. when you know where something is you can always say you pick up a target, but reality is different. If I'm walking fast, I would never stop at a tick or squeak sound on a wet salt beach .. hahaha
I can see what is the real BEAST here!
Great comparison, stuff I like to see. My type of hunting
The comments people have are exactly what I was thinking also.
Can you do it at another saltwater beach and see what happens
Was wondering do you own all those detectors
Thanks. Yes, I was expecting to get the comments about the setup not being optimal for the Manticore. There are not any other beaches in the area. I would have to drive 10 hours to California to try another beach. That being said, those beaches have black sand, so it would be a whole new learning curve. I own all the VLF'S and GPX 6000. The other 2 were borrowed.
@@RelicsRings Do you only use the 6000 for prospecting? I took mine to the beach here in Ca and tried with the 14" coil. Tough going in the wet and black sand and of course you end up digging everything. So I bought a used 800 for the beach.
@@kenmorrill3774 I use my 6000 for relic hunting in VA and gold prospecting. I haven't had good results with it at the beaches.
Imho Andrew, Deus 2 hits the 16" Nickel hands down, but more 'importantly' D2 Signal would, (Stop' you in your tracks!).
What ever you had your Deus 2 Settings at…..She ran very good & Very Responsive…….Thanks for sharing
I'll add the settings to the video description.
For the price I expected a much better performance from the manticore .
I Love my Deus 2 I thought the Manticore would be impressive but it's not.
At other beaches the Manticore apparently does better from what I've seen on other videos. The high salt content on this beach allows the D2 to do slightly better.
Bruce Hall congratulations you are the winner of the t-shirt. email me usaasea@gmail.com your shirt size and short sleeve t-shirt design of your choice.
Where is part 2?
And you're not adjusting your gain or sens..... No 2 detectors should ever be tested with the same settings. You use each machine to its best depth and clarity sounds totally separate.
Don’t know what set up your doing on the multi frequency minlabe , EQN , Manticore , You dint need to ground balance on beach in saltwater surf , that being the manticore , secondly NOX should be run on beach mode 2 . I have got coins with a NOX 800 at 20 inches easily , found 916 gold rings , chain since owning the NOX 800 in 16 months . 100 plus none gold rings , hundreds of coins . Now the manticore is a different ball game , it’s super sensitive on small items of metal , found 3 gold 916 rings so fare with it , the 3rd ring was 1.2 grams of 916 gold , found at 8 inches , that’s remarkable with a 11 inch coil . My now has the 15 inch coil . I have been a pulse induction metal detector user since the 90s , seeing the PI performance there in this video , wow I am gob smacked , as pi detectors will comfortably punch down 20 inches on coins ans find gold rings 18 inches plus . I have used Eric Foster , Gold scan 2 and 4 , also a deep star 1 and 3.
Never have to ground balance a PI detectors on a beach , big mistake , you will kill the depth !.
Just saying
Beach 1 is deeper than beach 2, anyone that's used one will tell you the same.
Nice bunch of finds under your belt Congratulations. Salt on this lake is 8 times greater than the ocean so everything you have said has no bearing in that regard. I have hunted this lake for 30 years with every SMF VLF and most PI's and ground balancing is a must. A non ground balancing PI like the whites surfmaster will not even run on this beach. If you don't ground balance you will get a constant signal from the salt. In fact most places on this beach the GPX with a 14" coil will have constant threshold drift, even after ground balancing which severely cuts the depth. 20" is realistic on a regular ocean beach, not on this lake. Beach 2 on this lake on the 900 kills the depth, beach 1 is by far the best performer.
Not sure where you hunt but on the West Coast Beach 2 cannot beat Beach 1. Also, I have run the Axiom on several salt water beaches and you have to ground balance to account for the salt. I'm not sure how you can hunt without doing that.
thank you for the video, disappointing results on the pi, this is not normal, on beaches the pi should be higher
High salt content of 8 times greater than the ocean is killing the PI's. Probably be different at an ocean beach.
Annnndddd the winner is DEUS 2😁
Manticore settings seemed not optimized.... Sensitivity was too low!!!!
You can look at some of the other responses I've given to that question.
Actually, do the test agin on the minlabe manticore. This time do it on all terrain high conductors. I am picking up in wet sand coins at 20 plus inches easily !. Do try this 👍
YOU DONT NEED TO SPEND 5-6,000 DOLLARS...DEUS WENT THE DEEPEST...
21 is too low for Manticore Sensitivity at the beach. You should be able to get close to 30 at least.
Can't even get close to 30