WOW, you put a ton of work in to put this video together. I've been trying to publish videos myself about this drama since the Chess community doesn't output much RUclips content.
@@goot8065 😂 It's probably super easy to be a movie director right? You're just putting clips together. Same with writing songs. All you're doing is just putting musical notes together, not hard. Actually if you think about it everything is easy. I think I'm going to go become a surgeon because all you have to do is move your hands around a bunch.
@@l.d.t.6327 It doesn't seem, to me to be edited. To me it seemed he had prepared an answer if Alejandro was only going to softball the question. When he realised he wasn't then he brought out his real answer
The most impressive thing about this is Alejandro's interviewing technique; he has a manner that draws everything from everyone, it is really quite something. I love it, he's quiet, probing, and familiar, very powerful to get what's required.
Great compilation. This thing is spreading faster than a Californian forest fire. All suspicions so far. Everyone is waiting for proof that may never come. Damage is done. Niemann is already condemned. All his chess pieces will weigh a ton from now on. Hope he can still lift them.
@@matthewgarcia7654 ..after Han’ last interview I think the penny will drop for people and Magnus will be harshly judged for his withdrawal and his nasty tweet
@@cdunne1620 Magnus never mentioned cheating or even Niemann's name. All he did was quit and imply that he could not say why he quit. And your judgement of Magnus shows why he was smart for not saying why he quit.
Spot on regarding the consequences of very childish use of Mourinho's meme. "Proof" is impossible here unless there was some sort of treachery on the Magnus team. But Magnus, as a publuc figure, should have the magnanimity to clarify also in public the very damaging Mourinho meme. This could make be a field day for an analysis by Dr. Jordan Peterson and the principle of plainspeaking. Look at how such foolishness leads to mass character assassination or virtual lynching.
@@trezzadeng5839 Yes, but that was years ago and chesscom didn’t find any proof of recent online cheating. It’s like you drove your car 80mph here and got a ticket from the police 👮♀️ 3 years ago. And yesterday you didn’t speed, but the police officer pulls you over and said “you sped 3 years ago. Here’s another ticket for speeding (3 years ago)” Even though you obeyed the law this time, the police officer is living in the past and judges you by 3 years ago... Now you’re afraid to drive your car because everyday you might get another speeding ticket 🎫. Is that fair?
I think Magnus watched the botched interview with the live blunder and the "looking into the opening" and got extra suspicious. Since he evidently has not any evidence, he just "knows".
@@ndnd7614 ..which means NO EVIDENCE which means ‘Magnus keep your mouth shut and suck it up’. There is no gray here it’s either black or white. We are all assumed innocent until proven otherwise with actual evidence
@@ndnd7614 haha but come on its the same thing as if it had. Otherwise he would clarify and avoid the drama. If he really doesn't have any evidence at least he should tell his side of the story. Like be a man
Hans admitted to cheating when he was 12…. 4 years later he admitted to cheating again when he was 16 “to gain rating points”. Now 3 years later when he is 19 he has gained 200 rating points rather quickly. His analysis clearly isn’t at the level of his rating… the only question is how did he cheat this time?
Posting the video of Mourinho is what is causing all the hubbub: using the words of another to make a controversial statement that one lacks the courage to make directly in public seems cowardly, yet the bombshell effect is the same. I would have preferred "I am withdrawing from the tournament for reasons related to a breach of trust at some level about which I am not going to speak." Period. This still would have drawn speculation, but Carlsen would not need to hide behind Mourinho's highly charged words which conflate rigged soccer results with an accusation of cheating or some sort of betrayal in chess. One must realize that without concrete evidence, one either opts for silence or a simple statement of personal reasons. Magnus opted for a flawed indirect strategy (like a man who hires a killer but doesn't do the actual killing) that is having a very negative effect on GM Hans.
Hiding behind Mourinho? Mourinho isn't his lawyer, it's a meme. Magnus didn't conflate anything, that's literally what you are doing by not knowing how the internet works.
@@cardboardu6019 He used a meme or the words of others to make a statement he could have made himself: we all know how the internet works, thank you, And yes, IT IS conflating Mourinho's words with what Magnus feels happened to him personally in the tournament. The strategy speaks for itself and the damage is being done. We should assume responsability rather than use memes when our words will have such effects.
Yeah. I agree with that. That's a much more clear way to put it. It has no meaningful relation to soccer or Mourinho. I will add this: People need to keep their focus in my opinion. The pressure should indeed be on Magnus to say more. People are worrying about silencing content creators when the onus should be on Magnus now.
@@cardboardu6019 For sure, Timothy: neither Mourinho nor soccer has anything to do with this (but a general...vague sense of foul play, yes...who or whom are unknown however), but why would Magnus even post such a meme if it were not meant to convey some personal feeling he either could not articulate in a better way or was too timid to utter? Magnus said nothing and the meme everything: I found it a very juvenile form of dealing with a serious issue that damages another person (i.e. lack of thinking about the moves ahead). The meme ignited everything and it should be pointed out and as you say, Magnus should be called out.
@@robertoalexandre4250 I don't want to defend Magnus for this in any way when he hasn't come out and said more, which I believe is absolutely warranted, but those are not the only options. He is capable of just saying "Hans cheeated" if he wanted to. He is not known to be timid, but it's hard to guess what his reasons were at this point, so we will hopefully find out more about his motivation soon enough.
This is all bizarre. I'll admit, when this drama started I was inclined to think some sort of foul play seemed likely. Based on the reactions of various pros. I don't know what to think now. The main weird thing is that it seems very odd for Magnus to feel so uncomfortable about something that he leaves a tournament. He must be strongly convinced something is going on (cheating or leaked prep/ hacking etc), he's not the type to just think "someone beat me, they must have cheated". Reading between the lines, I think it's quite probable that he deliberately played a line he doesn't normally play to see what happened. A sting of sorts. Now, it could just be a wild coincidence that Hans prepped the exact lines he chose, leading to a perfect storm of suspicion. It just seems unlikely. Magnus getting too far inside his own head and therefore playing badly in a way that served to help confirm his suspicions seems plausible in this scenario. But overall it's still all unlikely. On the other hand, cheating otb seems hard to pull off and quite unlikely. Hans's explanations for his prep, and his interviews, are all at least plausible. Something unlikely has happened either way. I'm out of my depth 🤷♂️ just hope there's more clarity to come.
What’s really throwing me off is the interview after the Alireza game and the Queen H4 line, pretty sure I’m like you, idk but if it’s anything it’s probably leaked prep
that's a really good take, sadly we will probably never know. Its really hard either to prove or disprove something like this. So in the end they are both getting something bad out of this drama, because 50% think Magnus is arrogant and 50% think Hans cheated(in some way). I would of loved for this to be handled privately and for Magnus to continue playing in the tournament. And even though im more inclined to believe Magnus, i think he should be innocent until proven guilty.
Just put yourself into his place. He must've been very excited to have beaten magnus, he fires out variation after variation and no wonder he mixed up some lines. Even a 1600 rated player can see in this position that Qh4 is losing a peace. You don't need an engine here to see this so this i clearly a matter of mixing up something. In fact Hikaru calls this suspicious, but he'd shoud better shut up here.
@@thomasheimer3578 his chess against Andrea couple of months ago, he even keeps hanging pieces in a 5 min game against a 2k opponent. No super GM has this much inconsistincies. All super GMs come from young age, slowly improving, they do not suck for 20 years then be world champion in 6 months.
@@edyburkay He's 19, how can he suck for 20 years. In fact your arguments are ridiculous. If this would be a prove to be constantly cheating, a whole bunch of TOP GMs would.
At first when I heard about this situation I thought Hans seemed suspicious because so many GMs were saying "Oh he doesn't calculate well, he has a history of cheating, etc." but the more GMs I hear speak neutrally, in his defense, his former coaches responses, and Hans' own response the more I think he's innocent. You don't have to pick a side and stick to it. You don't have to rely completely on one or two sources you trust or like. Stay open minded and, to accidently paraphrase Hans, "Let the arguments speak for themselves." I thought Hans was incredibly suspicious based on what I heard and hoped he would definitively get caught cheating. Now I think he's getting completely screwed over and that Magnus or his team or whoever need to speak up soon to clarify this situation quick. Magnus might get in trouble for whatever he doesn't want to say but Hans is already paying the price for him not saying it.
The 9:14 thing that Hikaru does is SO MISLEADING. In the continuation of that interview, Hans says "Ok, maybe it was Qh4 on some other move". He sounds confused, yeah, sure, but from there to "he is cheating" it's a loooooong way.
How come he was so well prepared but can't go over the analysis? He said he prepared for that exact thing that fkn morning. "What does the engine say" Come on..
@@michaelmurray6577 I've seen many Magnus' interviews where he suggests a move, the engine declares it as a blunder and Magnus' does his hand sweep gesture and shakes his head like "ok whatever" and moves on.... does this mean Magnus is a cheater?
The actual questions: -How exactly would one cheat otb? -What precautions were taken by tournament officials to prevent cheating? -Is there really evidence of behaviour indicative of cheating? -How well did Magnus play? His accuracy? Opening and lines he chose... were they really so good that the only way to beat was cheating? -If Magnus' play was really that good, then wouldn't it require obvious engine lines to defeat? -What about Hans' lines appear to have been more likely to be cheating than solid play? I don't know answers to any of this. My initial impression is that it would be difficult to cheat OTB but not impossible, but still seems far-fetched. Magnus has been very off as of late, so him playing poorly enough to experience a truly stinging loss seems like an event bound to occur.
....the talk is that maybe someone in Carlsen's team leaked his prep to Hans and that's why he knew what opening moves Carlsen was going to use.....an opening he has never used before....
Some people tend to think that maybe a member from Magnus' team leaked his prep data to Hans so he could focus his own prep to counter it. Another option is to have some tiny vibrating device hidden somewhere and an accomplice with a computer observing the live feed and sending the winning move found by a chess engine.
Actually Magnus did not even claim cheating in any form. It might be something else entirely, like something gone awry with organizers or health issues he wants to keep private or Magnus just getting too frustrated to continue because of Hans previous taunting in tournament before or something else. The game itself did not seem that strange and endgames don't have that many chances so finding good / best moves is not that farfetched for GM-level players. So... Magnus puts out cryptic tweet and everyone goes nuts with all sorts of theories. We just don't know and won't know what it's about unless Magnus specifies it and with that video I'd guess he's unwilling to do so.
@@jarirepo1172 He explicitly said it was not health related. And the organizer interview shows good indication that he told them the reason, they accepted it as valid and they want to let him keep control of when and how he will communicate about it. So my opinion is that he has suspicions that someone from his own team was rigging matches, probably by leaking prep data to some of his opponents. He resigned from the tournament to remove the rigged results and restore fairness for all participants. And he stays silent until the internal investigation on his team is done.
@Ken Fullman they get checked for electronical devices, so unless it's a string and cups' phone, idk how that communication happens. Smoke signs? I honestly don't know how people can accuse so strongly with this premise
this guy is just extremely full of himself. if you put everything together, like staying in a room studying for 2 years and even losing your native accent, beating MAGNUS with black pieces and bragging about it on the interview, sacrificing everything for chess and bla bla bla. Paiting himself as a true hero, a modern bobby fischer... it is clearly pure ego.
My brother has lived in S Korea for 7 years. Doesn’t have many friends back home. I talk to him a couple times a year. He still talks like an American.
…so your point is that Hans has an ego, well that’s very observant. Wouldn’t it be accurate to say every person on the planet has an ego. Didn’t you notice his character was attacked by Magnus and Hikaru..
Geniuses must have some ego going, otherwise they wouldn't recognise themselves as geniuses, therefore, they wouldn't be. Not saying he's legit, but I'm saying the witch hunt is wrong.
There IS that nagging fact that he is a known cheater… but frankly i believe him. The arguments he gives are good and he strikes his points with a genuinely frustrated and punchy cadence. He doesnt seem like someone who got busted, he seems like someone who just did something amazing and no one believes him. Could be an elaborate act, but theres easier less alarm trippy ways to increase your rating than by beating Magnus Carlson. I totally had him pinned for a cheater until i saw his response to the accusations. Another thing is… if he was playing like an engine… shouldnt some of these grandmasters be able to at least demonstrate why his moves are super human?
Yes he is telling the truth. His body language and speech tell you this. If you know what to look for. At beast he might of had a heads up on the opening and that's it at best but unlikely. He just beat Magnus in a sloppy game.
I do partially agree with you but his response to accusations and coming up with points from Alireza match after a day still sparks up problems you know? So he wasn't able to demonstrate the lines properly after the match in an interview but he was able to do it 24 hours later.. i mean, that kinda hints he prepared what to say to deflect.. The thing is, becoming a GM means being able to play, think, live Chess. Even if you don't know language you know chess positions and chess pieces, that's a GM. If you can't properly explain lines in chess terms even, then it's bound to arouse suspicions.. not saying he is cheating myself, but just explaining why people are still onto him after his accusation interview. We can only wait and see what happens
@@asp2410 why would it even matter that he doesn't use chess terms? are you implying that ALL of his over the board games have been cheats and that he actually doesn't know chess? otherwise what's even the point of that argument? why would he even need to justify everything when accusations havent come up yet? why cant gms see that magnus has actually played that position before through a transposition? this is all bullshit lol
@@Chr15T he has lost against lesser rated opponents and came back to win tournaments. Something is definitely not right here but i still cannot accuse Hans without any solid proof.
Great video, thank you so much for putting this together. In the end it’s all speculation: he’s either cheating or he’s innocent and if he’s cheating they have to find proof. It’s certainly a fascinating saga though.
Until more evidence is on the table I am inclined to believe in Hans and I hope he gets through this on his feet. I think it would be very hard to cheat OTB in such a huge tournament... Hans does have this cocky attitude that is not to everybody's liking and so he should really work to get rid of it, the sooner the better. Nevertheless...forejudging Hans based solely on insinuations made by the WCC after a loss and subsequent withdrawal of a tournament is waaay to hasty... Also, Magnus has been known to handle losses in the past very very poorly, but throwing off suspicions / insinuations of cheating without publicly exposing a shred of evidence is a new low.... I do hope everything is fine with Magnus though, but his behavior lately has been somewhat erratic...?
Tell me , without telling me you haven't seen the full analysis video of Hans postgame ...... I'm not saying he's a cheater but to say something is wrong with magnus and other super GMs sussing him of cheating , bro who tf are you to say that...
Magnus did not accuse Hans at all!! Some other players suggest that his prep of the game had leaked out, others that Hans might play with help of technology. But Carlsen did not say anything.
Two possibilities exist. 1. That everyone is correctly interpreting Magnus's tweet as a statement that he believes Hans cheated. 2. Magnus *didn't* mean for his tweet to be interpreted that way, everyone is wrong, and Magnus is perfectly happy to see Hans' reputation get trashed, rather than just say "um, guys, that's not what I meant". Either way, unless he has actual evidence of cheating, Magnus has behaved poorly.
Some observations, really I'm not accusing him of cheating. But...in his big statement he said he decided to check all the possible transpositions...and I quote "it's not a miracle...it's actually me being extremely tedious" 23:45....but in his interview right after the Magnus game...he said...1:15 "it's such a ridiculous miracle..." and how he does not even remember why he checked it etc. His explanation of being extremely serious of course works out much better for him, as it's more plausible than stumbling randomly on that position.
He being a known cheater in online events and saying "it's actually me being extremely tedious" after 20+ moves in prepp in a opening line Magnus never played before make me not belive him.. had it been a opening line Magnus played before i could have bought it.
@@rimacidih9350 He actually said it was miraculous that he randomly studied that opening in the morning with no logical reason. And then a couple days later he pretends it was all logical. Also he was never able to give a correct recollection of that magical morning study. And conveniently the only things he remembered from that miraculous morning study were the winning move and an alternate queen move that should be almost equivalent except the engine says the complete opposite. That post game analysis is surreal.
@@christianbarnay2499 ..here’s a thought experiment, what would you think if Hans gave no interviews. He is innocent until there is actual hard evidence brought forward. All this talk of the post game analysis is irrelevant. In a court of law all that talk means very little if you don’t have real evidence, it really means nothing
yeah, Hans would win 4-0 all. Then you put them all in a perfectly isolated and insulated room, Hans would lose 4-0, all with decisive blunders with no endgame.
@@edyburkay Fun Fact: During the games, only players and Organizers are allowed to enter the game rooms. Fun Fact #2: Each player is checked before a game to make sure no cheating occurs.
@@isamirahmad fun fact #3, you can pass that super complicated mall security detector with well hidden, insulated recievers, even hide them like they are seen as part of your skin. What I am saying is, put him in a EMI shield room, No signals in, no signal out.
You know what! I like this guy!! I believe him. I know he's upset but his name is going to be WAY bigger now. And if he's winning like this already he'll be even bigger in the coming years
@@BadBrucey ..it’s irrelevant if the young lad is obnoxious, Magnus should have known his actions could potentially destroy Hans’ career. Is that the kind of legacy Magnus wants, Hans should sue Hikaru and Magnus for defamation
Wow, what a thorough report on this "scandal". Thank you for such a complete picture. Hans Niemann's defense and statements about Magnus Carlsen and Hikaru starting at 19:30 were powerfully moving and convincing. It appears there is no scandal at all. I can't believe Hans is only 19. He's courageous, and fearless in the face of this onslaught. He made a very strong argument that he is owed an apology from Carlsen, Hikaru, Chessdotcom, et al. We have a budding chess superstar.
There's a lot of video about cheating scandals in video games.They are always very confident and fearless when being accused. Todd Rogers cheated and was accused for 30 years until his record was proven impossible. He was even given positions of power regarding records. There's also Riolu who cheated tens or hundreds of world records over multiple years. He even publicly campaigned for fair play and tougher stance on tools pretending to be very fair gamer. He was accused of cheating and was very rude and confident, completely fearless. Undeniable proof was given and he disappeared overnight. I don't know if Hans cheated or not but I would put tighter eye on him still. Being fearless and courageous says nothing about not cheating.
Let's look at the game between Niemann and Carlsen. 13. Rfd1 instead of the correct Bxf6 21 c4 - sacrificing a pawn for very little compensation 28 g4?? 30 a4 instead of Bxc4 Niemann also didn't play the most accurate moves to bring home the point. Carlsen lost because he played badly in this game and not because of any computer-like brilliance from Niemann.
Hans most likely didn't cheat here, but some inaccurate moves does not proof lack of cheating. As a professional, you can play to a certain point and if you received only a few high level computer moves, at the most difficult points, you might be able to convert a game against anyone. But I think the real reason Magnus left is to protect his rating, he was stressed and knew his emotions might damage his up and coming games.
Also: how focused can you play, if you prepared to prove someones cheating and this player responded 20 moves as you've prepared this once in your lifetime?
poor hans, he deserves to play and speak with with or without an accent.. he lived in a suitcase and studied 12 hours a day and the result was variable pronunciation.
Hans cheated in the past, but ok, he was just a child. Magnus is very bad at losing, but ok, it doesn’t happed that often, so he lacks a bit of practice at it. And Hikaru makes a habit of speaking too much, but ok, it’s 2022 and that’s what people do if they become a “streamer”… So everyone’s just making mistakes and blunders like the imperfect human beings they are… Now let’s just, give the guys a break and let the storm pass over.
Thanks for compiling this into one once for us. Hans words seem to be coming from the heart. Magnus of course knows what he's done and hopefully it won't be in vain. Either way this will conclude we all have to just wait and see how it happens.
Nah dude, don't fall into emotion. his speech was very emotional but if you think about it logically it's riddled with contradictions. it isn't really evidence for anything but just don't fall into the honey trap.
Hans has this characteristic muffled smile, smug tonality and oddly placed face touches that say something about his egocentric motivations and lack of sincerity. You see him carefully navigating through the conversation, talking in a particular manner and focusing on aspects that fortify his perceived intellectual position, while using non rational, subtly derogative rhetoric and tonality to degrade Magnus', while being able to confidently bring forward explanations that prove to be wrong. His conversation is structured differently from someone being truly straight forward. You also see him, without being asked, defending his own perceived sincerity, which is a sign of lying or at least someone having lied in multiplicity before. A hint of psychopathy at least. This man is secretly trying to play character chess in real life.
If I were in his shoes, and I were innocent, I would just say "I don't cheat, you can monitor me and check me all you want" I wouldn't go off on a long explanation defending myself.
@@scoopbls ..I don’t think it’s odd, he’s addressing Hikaru’s jabs at him, as a young person he would be more self conscious and would feel the need to explain himself and he did, I think Hans explained himself very well and came across as believable and actually mature and intelligent despite his earlier interviews where he was being a d!ck
Well, since he was caught online cheating twice, and was removed from Eric Hansen's online tournaments, in the past, that would have fallen flat. And he did say that he hasn't cheated since, or even in otb, and that they can do any monitoring of him that they want. He did what he needed to do, I think...but I do agree that he should shut up going forward. Clearly they have no proof of anything, or the tournament would have booted him already.
He just talks that way. He speaks at 100kph and never stops. He's not you. But I agree in general. He's way too defensive for someone who wasn't even accused yet officially.
And what is interesting is, Magunus hasnt given a reason for withdrawing, so Hans is going very defensive and talking a lot about his innocence....although he hasnt been accused of anything yet....
13:56 MVL the first one to bite the bait and actually mention the term "cheating" himself. All the other players being interviewed are clearly amateur paralegals in their spare time 😂 Shak's comment was the funniest tho: at 13:38 - Shak asks the interviewer suggestively: "Do you know why Magnus is not playing...?" Interviewer deflects, says Magnus hasn't released a statement. Shak smiles. "Ok if you know, you can ask me, I will answer something, if not I don't know 😉" aka he obviously knew what it was all about but was making sure that he wasn't the one to make the "cheating" insinuation himself 😂
Didn´t Hans changed a little bit his story? At the interview after the game againt Magnus, he said he miraculously checked the opening. Later on, on the other interview, he said considering that opening was something pretty logical, rather then a miracle, as he said before. I might be miss interpretating something, though.
No he said that he predicted the opening, but in an other move order... People didnt understand it and thought he would have predicted this exact move order, but he obviusly didnt and now it makes total sense...
@@GAMTT His affirmation that he had studied the position that same morning would be believable if he was able to give a decent recollection of the morning study in the post game analysis. But instead he reminds there was also a queen move that was nearly as good and asks to see its score on the engine. And the engine says it's complete rubbish. So he rapidly hand brushes the issue and changes the subject. And a few days later in the long interview he focuses on his accent and explains that this is because he spent 2 full years studying chess. So he wants us to believe that a guy who spent 2 entire years cutting himself from the world to study and deeply understand chess is the same who is completely unable to give a consistent recollection of a study that he made in the morning and that helped him win a game against the current world champion. His own words don't add up.
@@christianbarnay2499 He said he wasnt sure if there is Queen move. So maybe there was a similar line where this Qh4 idea is a good move. I mean a lot of people including Wesley So are mixing up move orders or whole openings on that level. If they speak quickly in a post game analysis this could happen to everyone for sure...
The reason why I initially thought it is probable that Hans cheated is that Magnus by his actions wagered his whole reputation on the matter. If he doesn't provide any evidence against Hans he will lose all my respect and I think many think the same.
He did not accuse him precisely because he did not have evidence. He implicitly raised suspicions, which is fair. He's in a better position to feel how humans play vs how machines play. Everything about Hans is weird. I think it is not difficult to show that the probability that he cheated is extremely high.
@@hlkp333 I don't think it is fair to raise suspicions, and that's the entire reason people are lashing out against Magnus. No, suspicions aren't innocent just because you're not saying anything outright. I don't care if Hans cheated or not, but it's not cool if that's what Magnus did imply without evidence.
@@Ninterd2 You have a problem with democracy then. Presumption of innocence does not mean you cannot be suspicious, and make it known to others, that would be basically preventing people from expressing themselves honestly about a topic. Accusation on the other hand, is about providing factual evidence, and as far as I have seen, no-one has crossed that line. Otherwise, next time you watch a magic trick, how about you assume it's true magic as long as you cannot provide evidence to support the contrary?
12 years old in 2015 playing chess basically his whole life and he apparently didn't know what a chess engine is and what it means to use a chess engine in a tournament. Believable. From 12 to 16 he never cheated, not a single game, ranked or unranked, casual or tournament. Believable. At 16 he admits to cheating in random online ranked games to gain ELO to play stronger players, and that entire time parallel to that he's also playing online tournaments, and in not a single one of those tournaments he used an engine even for a single move. Believable. There are so many holes in the crap he spews and his behavior is so blatantly manipulative, that even if no definitive proof is ever found I will never trust him. Not to mention that Magnus, Hikaru, Eric Hansen, Yasser, Alireza and a lot of others didn't even see the moves that Hans played. But yes, let's just completely disregard their genius, expertise and experience and trust the 19 year old engine operator.
This. It's not even about his chess plays. His character is so sus. And he's extremely arrogant. "I'll do anything to win!" ...yea we saw that a couple of years ago already....
True but he could’ve not admitted to cheating ever or didn’t need to say certain details but was brave enough to come out with them (unless he felt others would’ve mentioned his past if he didn’t bring it up first idk). I feel like he’s stirring the pot on purpose to bring more drama and views to chess 🤷 He could’ve just said “I’ve never cheated in an OTB game ever.” Instead of mentioning about the online stuff at all maybe. Because just mentioning those extra details makes a lot of people suspect him more lol😝 It’s so hard though, if you were Hans and you cheated in the past do you think it’s a good strategy to bring it up? So he can show contrast that he’s hard working nowadays idk On the one hand I understand his feelings for wanting to play stronger players since he wouldn’t naturally get paired with someone a few hundred or several hundred points above his rating, and on the other It’s really unfair to the stronger players he forced his way through.. But he did suffer a lot already by having his account banned and living with the fact that he cheated seemed to make him suffer the past years too. Also being independent and living alone from 16 might’ve made him slightly unstable mentally and he made some bad choices. At least he’s over 18 now so he’s an adult and the punishment for cheating is more severe, I don’t think he’s going to risk his chess career as an adult now, but everything is uncertain.
Because it's near impossible to cheat over the board. Think about it. What evidence do you have he cheated other than insinuation. Until someone brings evidence Magnus has to apologize.
Yeah.. I thought a 2700 had a better understanding of the game! And his own game nonetheless.. "I don't need to show variations" - that was a weird thing to say!
@@JBugz777 Another surprisingly coincidence. Without knowing the true, at least we can say there are several suspicious factors on the table. But without real evidence we should give him the advantage of the doubt.
@@JBugz777 yeah that was highly suspect and as Hikaru pointed out, he apparently checked 20 moves into a variation that carlsen has never played in his life
9:33 Hikaru is being aggressively ignorant. "I am a super genius with perfect memory for chess positions and engine analysis scores therefore everyone else who is a chess pro must always be equally perfect." It's a bizarre and illogical thought process. Great at chess, subpar at other kinds of logic.
Magnus may not be able to talk right now, because the organisers may be involved in the cheating that may have happened. Or at least one other person in the room may be, based on the live coverage.
Indeed, Magnus just can't lose like a gentleman. There is no evidence the guy cheated and if there is he should lay it out, instead of pretending he can't say anything. Like what did he have 2030s technology contact lenses?
The point is, there are precedents, strange behavior, statistical oddities, etc... not to mention the fact that Magnus is not a child and would never do something like this without any base. On the othert hand we have the word of a known cheater. Don't blame people for siding with Magnus.
@@gajofre The problem is that people are too quick to jump the gun and come to a conclusion without concrete evidence. Even if he did cheat, at least wait until you know the full story. If he did cheat, then yeah sure you can say you were correct all along or something, but what if it's the opposite? It would ruin a reputation of a person. Everyone is so quick to take a side and just attack hans without full proof. Not taking side with hans here, just trying to make a point that unless we know everything, we shouldn't judge.
Everybody claiming Niemann might have cheated should take a look at this video, especially the end part. ruclips.net/video/BbEiW-60hf0/видео.html&ab_channel=Stokfish Stockfish analysis of the game and its moves and at the ending you can clearly see the accuracy percentage for both players. Niemann's was 93.4, which is normal for a 2700 GM. Carlsen's was 83.9, which is subpar for the highest rated player on the planet. His normal would be something like 95-97%. So Carlsen just played worse than he normally does, that's why he lost, end of story.
Most of Magnus’s main mistakes came toward the end of the game though… by that point he was already in his head thinking Hans had played against his unexpected opening perfectly. If your already thinking someone is cheating it affects your play… I agree Magnus played subpar that game though
They were lines that he had dismissed because he knew they weren't lines he wanted to go down. Those are also taken out of context. Watch the full post game analysis and you'll see that his analysis is normal. I've seen Magnus give bad post game analysis before.
Yoooooo in Hans's statement esp at 21:06, Hans absolutely BODIED all the GMs (cough maybe Hikaru?) and just the theories or "evidence" against him...... he's won me over 💀 no fing bs. I'm straight rooting for Hans now 😵
Of course, the memes will live on, forever. The memes have entered the Meme Hall of Fame. The Hans chapter is now embedded deep inside the annals of history. It's stuck way too far inwards and will not be able to be taken out. But I hope this is the beginning of a villain character arc in chess 😈
Talent is a mystery. I truly believe, it's possible that Hans Niemann is imaginative and intelligent enough, to perform as he did. Also, I believe, Niemann is left-handed. Sadly, we're largely unaware of the significance of, "handedness".
@@xeanthomas5231 incorrect. Hans made multiple obvious errors explaining lines, he claims to have studied beforehand. He was unable to identify a position as lost and said that white was winning, when it was -2.6 instead. He plays top engine sacrifices which Alireza could not find and says they were based on intuition?? He failed miserably at explaining the continuations of the sacrifice leading me to believe it was not him ho came up with that move
@@hannes8978 I know you're repeating exactly what Hikaru said but you have no idea why those ideas are important or what Hans's intentions were by using those lines. You're just on the "agree with Hikaru" bandwagon. Grow up.
hahaha, Whats the next script.. hahah, on the previous video regarding his game with firouza on the queen move, he said, he is completely winning. And now with the same move he said he just trick firouza... The more things you said, the more the dots be connected...
I admit that because of my respect for Magnus’s judgment, and because of Hans’s bizarre behavior in the early interviews, I suspected something dishonest was going on. After Hans’s interview after round 5, I am much less suspicious. He has shed the false accent and the obviously put on smug persona. He was finally himself in that last interview. He turns out to be an undeniably great player, though still immature, who can make mistakes (particularly in his analyses), perhaps because he’s trying to be cool or whatever. In my opinion, his obviously insincere and put on persona increased the level of suspicion. At this point, I’m more disappointed that Magnus has remained silent. I for one am sorry that I bought into all the hype so quickly. Wish I had remained neutral until concrete evidence was presented.
After watching all of Hans' comments on this scandal, i feel bad having thought that he might've been cheating. These accusations have gone outta hand and it has already negatively affected Hans' reputation.
Here is what happened, logically explained. First, Hikaru gave the fact that Hans cheated online, not because to put more fuel in the fire, but to give context to his viewers that why suddenly some GMs and people in the chess world thinks Hans cheated against Magnus. "Why suddenly someone thinks Hans cheated?" - " Because they know that Hans cheated online before and in a prized tournament" - This is a very logical response. But the problem comes next - not many people know that Hans cheated online and got banned, he even got banned on stream. So this causes a consequence, that it creates a shit tons more of people believing Hans cheated because he cheated before. ROFL. So what can we learn from this ? It's that the information that Hans cheated in the past online, really changes people's view on him.
And let's not forget the Carlsen angle : Magnus can't claim Hans cheated now otb, because he and everybody else have zero proof of it. Therefore Magnus making insinuations without proof makes Magnus himself look bad.
Without any prior knowledge the first seconds of the video are already interesting. He's directly giving his alibi as an introduction before being asked any question. It's so miraculous he randomly checked this exact opening right this morning. Then when they analyze the position with him he remembers an alternate move that he thinks should be pretty good too but the engine actually says it's rubbish. So the guy just luckily studied that exact opening and then forgot the entire analysis except for that one exact move without any understanding of why it was right and why another move that he thought was good too was actually wrong. This is completely illogical.
@@christianbarnay2499 ..whether it’s logical or not I don’t think it matters much. If you don’t have actual evidence of cheating you can’t destroy a persons life, that’s why we have courts and legal procedures to avoid witch hunting. Without evidence Magnus’ action is callous and casual and petulant all at the same time, I’m sure his father is proud of him after this
@@cdunne1620 And that's why nobody explicitly accused him of cheating. They simply raised suspicions to stay on the cautious side. And Magnus decision to withdraw from the tournament is completely understandable if he has suspicions that someone from his own team leaked prep data to other players. If the mole selects which opponents he helps and which he doesn't, staying in the tournament would be unfair to other players. So the best move is to remove himself to ensure fairness is restored.
It’s not courageous or noble to admit to cheating when you’ve already been caught. He was caught cheating twice, and most likely did it a lot more. I also thought his analysis was weak and his prep was “beyond lucky.” 99% confident he cheated
@@iakobkv271 How indeed but there are incriminating factors which paint an idea when combined: cheated before, unlikely/rare rise in rating, unable to/wrongly access position in interview as a 2700.
Good that you got all the ridiculous Hikaru accusations in this video. 9:52: Do your homework, and look at the game Magnus-So, Kolkata 2019. You would find out Magnus has played G3 before.
It feels like magnus told some people what openings he would choose in the game , and this information has reached Hans .. Because Hans was saying that he checked the opening suddenly and knew all the lines , I remember that a lot of people entered things to cheat in 2000 just in some exams , so in 2022 things got so much complicated.. if you only watch a documentary about spy cameras, they could put these things on a car key lol , so of course if he wants to cheat there’s many ways , even over the board
hikaru gives the exact proof. you dont predict which star will be visible in the sky and that star is visible . hans said he prepards that same exact line in the morning which magnus never played and that exact position happend over the board lol
It is true, because I live abroad: some people simply take over accents really easily. I'm not one of them, but I think the accent angle is very rediculous.
Magnus's attitude (even on his streams) is straight-up obnoxious -- not a fan of his. But this Hans kid is speaking on a script in the last interview. In the interview right after the game he said he "miraculously" checked that line right in the morning with no further explanation given. Then he tries to recount some of it and talks himself right into a blunder. Later, after given time to rehearse, he has it all memorized properly PLUS an explanation of why he happened to study that line. Sorry not buying it. They say the more you try to justify and rationalize, the more guilty you are.
100% cheater - high correlation with Stockfish, his body reactions, past cheater... this guy is scary as seems to believe his own lies... he just found a way to avoid tech signal detectors and is using something either in his hair or somewhere
@@jacoblacasse-young1495 that’s certainly a possibility but comp assistance more probable… look at the other game with Firouzja, It shows strong signs of assistance… easier to get double computer assistance than getting opening leaks from two different teams
Hans reminds me of Tal, more of an intuitive attacking player that will take calculated risks. Hikaru bashed on Tal saying that he wasn't impressed with Tal's play too, and Hikaru is judging based on most players at the 2700 level, Hans just reached that level, and he got a little lucky so it's kinda too strict of Hikaru but Hikaru is always strict with players he cares about. Like he bashes on Levy all the time. I don't really think Hikaru insinuated that Hans cheated, but it was misinterpreted by most viewers. A lot of people just like to accuse others of cheating in chess since that happens online often. Hans is a hard worker and gave up his whole life for chess, there's no way he's cheating in top OTB events period.
@@BrandingChangeYep Hikaru never said the word cheater once. He said suspicious when Hikaru didn’t understand why Hans would be at 2700 level with a lower level of analysis. That’s just about his analysis. Even Hikaru confirmed that Magnus didn’t play very accurate in the opening and didn’t understand what Magnus was doing either. Hikaru isn’t sure on anything lol A lot of it is Hikaru trying to have a sense of humor or exaggerate things, and Hikaru mentioned Hans was nervous 😬 before too. Just hearing a super GM call someone’s behavior suspicious doesn’t mean they are cheating for sure, it’s naive to assume anything without concrete evidence. If you can show me a moment where Hikaru says the word “cheater” in any part of the video about Hans then I’ll admit to being wrong.
@@BrandingChangeYep Also you could be like “you look sus and you probably have your head buried 6 ft under the sand” to me, but do I really have my head 6 feet under the sand literally? If I did would I be able to use my phone or computer to reply without suffocating to death? Idk 🤷♂️ We could take anything literally. It’s up to you how literally you wanna take how others behave or just completely accept what they say cuz you respect them. Take everything with a grain of sand (not enough to drown in)😂
i saw hikaru´s video as well and wasnt impressed at all by him. he was bashing on niemann´s assesment of a position, said it was totally winning for white. then hikaru started laughing and said it was totally winning for black, after a few moments the computer evaluated as -0.4 and thats almost equal. dont get why nobody is talking about that
Hans instantly comes across as completely genuine. Anyone with half a brain can see that. I was touched by Aronian's wise words. There's no reason a young player can't play well, this is a beautiful part of competition.
The way Hans’ personality is insulted on here is disgusting and clearly shows a mob mentality. I hope self-proclaimed detectives on the internet start to come up with better evidence than “he speaks suspiciously” and ignoring his points
It is really hard to accept his explanations though. Especially when you wax the world champion in a once in a lifetime game. Then you can't remember the lines you looked up that JUST HAPPENED to be the exact game plan Magnus was using and never has before? Occam's Razor concludes that Magnus' team leaked his game prep for whatever reason, and Magnus was not about to get schelacked unfairly by his contemporaries and ruin his back to back world titles.
He was caught cheating online three years ago and admits that he did. That is why people have their doubts now. If he didn't have a history of cheating he wouldn't be under the microscope. If he was some random guy without real aspirations to become one of the best GM's in the world, then fine he cheated move on. But that isn't the case, he just bested the best player in the world. He's innocent until proven guilty with evidence, but people feeling unsure of his validity is on him.
@@goot8065 it's always possible someone cheated. It's not like they're stripped naked and locked in a glass box. There's plenty of opportunities for someone to cheat it's just a matter of having the balls and preparation to do it.
If you play top level chess, good enough to beat magnus, then you simply can't get confused on the lines, else you won't reach even 2700. Beating magnus is a far cry for anyone who can't remember his lines played years ago, and this happened two days ago - the most important game of his life. His story involving his mother made this game central part of his childhood dream. And he couldn't even clearly remember the lines.
On the other hand his rise has been meteoric so you could also say that he is simply highly intelligent and like he says more an intuitive player that calulates each position without resorting to theory as much and therefore he not remembering a highly rehearsed move but something that came to him in the moment and he's likely exhausted. I don't know if I do stuff under stress I sometimes have trouble recalling what exactly I did (where the hell did I put my keys?? Happened 10 minutes ago yet they are gone). I'm not saying he didn't cheat but I'm saying it's first of all impossible to prove and second of all there is plenty of reasonable doubt. Even very reasonable doubt. There's a billion reasons he could be bad at describing a game after it happened. Some chess players know all the openings memorize every typical move and they can still loose to a more intelligent player who doesn't know the names of all the openings or has famous games memorised. Yes on average grand masters have remarkable memories but it's not needed if you are smart enough to calculate further than your opponent. There's 10`120 possible games of chess ods are that someone more adept at calculating would on average win somoene who knows all the classic moves by memory, because eventually you'll come across a game that you've never seen before, which is the case here. So TLDR I think there is plenty of reasonable doubt and if he did not cheat he is one of the brightest new players in chess and to ruin his reputation with that with a tweet is not the right thing to do. You tell the organisers I think he cheated, they implement additional security and then keep playing. If he wins under the higher security, well he's clearly very talented. If he's caught well that proves that he's a cheater and was capable of pulling it off. Magnus should have done this all privately. Because IF he is wrong he did a terrible thing.
Oh and Magnus playing an opening he never did before actually doesn't just put his opponent at a disadvantage but actually himself too. He now had to rely purely on his ability to calculate rather then his repertoire of thousands of games he can remember and his experience. If Hans is a natural at calculating that may have evened the ods. And he certainly wouldn't be the first young player with an extraordinary IQ.
But why Hans didn't said in the interview after beating Magnus the story that he made here about the catalan, transposition and so on, intead of saying "I check this line this morning miracously untill move 25 and I don't even know why".. haha come on, total cheater. Take a look at Hans game vs GM Sandro Mareco at the Capablanca Memorial a few months ago and tell me that this is not cheating.. You don't beat an experienced 2672 GM just like that.. and basically won almost all the games in a very strong tournament, this is absolutely cheating. You can tell that he would do anything to prove the world wrong about he being a cheater, even if that involves more cheating. I mean, get a job pal, go to college.. He needs to be banned or he never will stop cheating. (Sorry for having bad english)
But how can he cheat in physical chess? I doubt him at the start but in chess is too hard to hold the lie for too long. Thats why now I think he may actually be a really good player that got into Magnus head. Which is crazy because I had Magnus like a God of chess.
The technical side is not an issue. You only need to communicate a few bits. A tiny chip with a wifi connection anywhere under your clothing that gently vibrates in a binary signal is enough to do it. (And what does it mean "it's hard to lie for too long?" If he did lie, do you expect him to admit it and voluntarily end his career forever?)
@@siIverspawn ..no the point is that there IS NO EVIDENCE so game over, you can’t go around accusing people without evidence, actual evidence, not circumstantial evidence that is open to interpretation, that’s why we have court systems….otherwise it’s witch hunting like MVL said in an interview
he said he just happened to prep for the opening lines that Magnus played....an opening that Magnus has never used so how could Han's prep for it....unless someone on Magnus's team leaked the info to Hans
@@siIverspawn No way, if he has anything it's unlikely it's in his clothing, it would have to be bodily to get past the detection equipment, that's my opinion, hence why other GMs have said jokingly, it could be sex beads
Is Magnus becoming another Fischer? Gave up championship and now withdraws from this event. Is he having some internal turmoil that will propel him on a trajectory like Fischer?
yeah he says he and magnus have nothing to do with chesscoms decision to ban him, it's a private company and he also doesn't think hes guilty since he just laid out that he thinks magnus thinks hans is cheating, which literally everyone thinks so it's not an absurd comment but yeah
Ferdinand plebie here, a chessplayer, took up investigation course in 2020. I think there is no probable cause of accusing Gm heimann of cheating, a mere thought or suspicion of magnus is not enough. Its unfair for Gm heimann to be treated like that.
Hey Naka, he said he doesn't know exactly at what point the move qh4 is playable. That's why he asked what the engine says and followed by 'no not here'
wow Magnus has a lot of power over the Chess world. This young guy is really good and of course he works a lot harder than the world champions. He is way more hungry than Magnus. I hope he is successful suing the fk out of Magnus and all those who are accusing him with no evidence.
Some of the moves Hans made against Carlsen under the ticking clock are so inhuman and artificial that only Fritz 18 may find them. Carlsen was so shocked at these moves that he left the tournament in disgust.
Several GMs have already come forward and stated that as per how the game went, there was nothing really sus about it. A peculiar line? Yes, but luckily for us, that happens all the time in chess ! I am sticking with the simple solution...Magnus couldn't take the loss and the subsequent trashing...and made a complete scandal out of nothing...
great video but you missed quite a few things that hikaru said about Hans's analysis being bad. I want to know if other top players agree if any of them looks at it. Here's your idea for the next video I guess.
@@blank003 Magnus is destroying his legacy damn quick though. Withdrawing from a round robin is a huge dick move. He's on some bobby fischer trajectory, going insane faster rather than slower
OK, as far as I understand Hans has made bad moves, good moves and very good moves. But none of them looks like cheating. Also, everyone was interviewed, but NOT Magnus. If there's something to say, Magnus should say it. If he doesn't say anything, he simply lost the game against Hans and that was it.
According to lichess analysis, Hans made 2 mistakes and he also made them when he was winning so he was never on trouble. Lichess chat analyzed the game during the broadcast and Hans played like within the top 5 moves for majority of the game. Its suspicious but nothing concrete at this level. Meanwhile, Magnus made a blunder during the end game which cost him the game. My take is he played close to a perfect game which is kinda suspicious, but I wouldnt crucify him without definite proof.
@@detectivemarkseven It's not suspicious *at all* to play a close-to-perfect game once in a while, especially for a GM. "top 5 moves for majority of the game" is not even impressive, and not even "close-to-perfect". The dataset is very highly insufficient to make any claim, but his playing to this point is consistent with what we would expect from a highly skilled GM making a good tournament, nothing more. He also did a few blunders that allowed his opponent to draw when he was actually winning which is inconsistent with someone cheating. Not only he shouldn't be "crucified", but he should not even be accused without proofs the way he was.
@@Madinko12 Well from Lichess chat theres a chess master there that said he played near perfectly. And the consensus I got from there is that his play was suspicious but nothing concrete. So why dont you "chess experts" discuss together so we can know who's right or wrong?
Also.... Magnus is not just a decent chess player. He is GENIUS territory. So if he says something is fishy, then something is fishy. And Hikaru seems to agree.
..so by you’re ‘reasoning’ if Magnus says the earth is flat then it must be flat cuz he’s a genius right? We don’t need evidence because he is infallible and a genius. Do you really think like that, I’ll bet you got all of your shots and boosters
He literally didn't say anything and that's a problem because whole internet is attacking 19 year old kid. Hikaru is literally farming drama for content and money. Stop idolizing Magnus, everyone can make mistake.
@@cdunne1620 What in the fuck are you talking about, idiot? Magnus is an authority on chess, not the shape of the earth. Your argument is fucking idiotic
Honestly, didn't believe he cheated until I saw the interview. From my perspective it seems as if Hans is showing duping smile. Also it is rare for someone who is not guilty to defend themselves intensely. I would still say that without evidence he should not be punished in any way.
I dont watch chess often, but these accusations are a bit weird, in post analysis games everyone calls out some weird lanes, and then some are big ass blunders when engine instantly says it and they recognize it then, Hikaru does this too. Maybe the guy was very nervous in interview and his memory was a bit scrambled. I wonder if everyone had to call out lines and analyze games without engine as they are used to, how good they would do it then.
He had ALREADY ADMITTED TO and BEEN BANNED for cheating online. This is not an innocent guy. Sure, it MIGHT be possible in this game that he didn't cheat but, really, how can one be sure? I'm a good 600 pts. below Carlsen and I'm telling you Qh4 is NEVER a move to even mention. It just drops a piece. He's desperately trying to sound like he knows what he's talking about and he claims to have prepared a line against Carlsen that Carlsen has NEVER PLAYED IN HIS LIFE. If he didn't cheat he's doing everything to try and look like he did. Maybe it's next level trolling or something.
@@paulpena5040 You can't be sure, but it's not his job to prove he wasn't cheating. It's impossible to prove anyone wasn't cheating. You can't prove that Magnus hasn't been cheating his entire career. But that's not his job to disprove. If you make a claim someone cheated, YOU have to prove it.
@@user-zb8tq5pr4x Well technically Carlsen hasn't said ANYTHING other than that cheesy video. But of course you have to give the benefit of the doubt to Hans for now.
Jose Mourinho must be wondering why he's suddenly popular in the chess world of all places.
Mourinho is a highly competitive guy and loves chess.
😂😂😂😂😂😂
I have never heard his name so often mispronounced like in the last 2 days. Haha
Jose mourinho: i prefer not to speak.. respect
HAHAHAHHA
WOW, you put a ton of work in to put this video together. I've been trying to publish videos myself about this drama since the Chess community doesn't output much RUclips content.
appreciate it. good luck with your channel bro :)
subbed #25
Can you take the POLYGRAPH guy...? That's a question for you...?
sorry but how is this a lot of work he just downloaded and put clips in order
@@goot8065 😂 It's probably super easy to be a movie director right? You're just putting clips together. Same with writing songs. All you're doing is just putting musical notes together, not hard. Actually if you think about it everything is easy. I think I'm going to go become a surgeon because all you have to do is move your hands around a bunch.
I love how Levon went from "he is sick - I don't know" to "when young players ...." - cracked me up
It's true, young sick players don't know anything.
Those are 2 separate fragments in the interview, it looks odd because it's edited.
@@davidcopson5800 unlike the old and sick, they at least have their quickly fleeting wisdom
@@l.d.t.6327 It doesn't seem, to me to be edited. To me it seemed he had prepared an answer if Alejandro was only going to softball the question. When he realised he wasn't then he brought out his real answer
The most impressive thing about this is Alejandro's interviewing technique; he has a manner that draws everything from everyone, it is really quite something. I love it, he's quiet, probing, and familiar, very powerful to get what's required.
He’s great
Still impressed with his technique?😂
@Serg'e Merto yes. He's a good commentator regardless.
@@sergemerto256 you're not siding with the amber heards , are you?
Thanks so much for taking the time in putting this together, really helps not having to look for all these clips everywhere.
Aronian is nailing it. Common sense and human perceptions and reactions are at the core of this controversy.
Good thing that you put all of this together in one video!
Great compilation. This thing is spreading faster than a Californian forest fire. All suspicions so far. Everyone is waiting for proof that may never come. Damage is done. Niemann is already condemned. All his chess pieces will weigh a ton from now on. Hope he can still lift them.
Funny that online Magnus is free from criticism because all focus is on condemning Hans
@@matthewgarcia7654 Maybe that was his strategy to avoid criticism...
@@matthewgarcia7654
..after Han’ last interview I think the penny will drop for people and Magnus will be harshly judged for his withdrawal and his nasty tweet
@@cdunne1620 Magnus never mentioned cheating or even Niemann's name.
All he did was quit and imply that he could not say why he quit.
And your judgement of Magnus shows why he was smart for not saying why he quit.
Spot on regarding the consequences of very childish use of Mourinho's meme. "Proof" is impossible here unless there was some sort of treachery on the Magnus team. But Magnus, as a publuc figure, should have the magnanimity to clarify also in public the very damaging Mourinho meme. This could make be a field day for an analysis by Dr. Jordan Peterson and the principle of plainspeaking. Look at how such foolishness leads to mass character assassination or virtual lynching.
Hans having his account access removed is shameful. There has not even been a formal accusation.
In what world is that shameful? Are you a little retarded, maybe?
he has a history of cheating in online, he even admit to cheating in the past
@@trezzadeng5839 Yes, but that was years ago and chesscom didn’t find any proof of recent online cheating. It’s like you drove your car 80mph here and got a ticket from the police 👮♀️ 3 years ago. And yesterday you didn’t speed, but the police officer pulls you over and said “you sped 3 years ago. Here’s another ticket for speeding (3 years ago)”
Even though you obeyed the law this time, the police officer is living in the past and judges you by 3 years ago...
Now you’re afraid to drive your car because everyday you might get another speeding ticket 🎫.
Is that fair?
@@trezzadeng5839 That changes no facts. And shows your bias as you didn't even qualify it with any pertinent details.
@@phen-themoogle7651 Yeah, so i did murder 2 ppl years ago BUT NOW I DID NOT I SWEAR
You sound like a woman
I think Magnus watched the botched interview with the live blunder and the "looking into the opening" and got extra suspicious. Since he evidently has not any evidence, he just "knows".
circumstantial evidence probably. which means he cannot accuse hans directly
@@ndnd7614
..which means NO EVIDENCE which means ‘Magnus keep your mouth shut and suck it up’. There is no gray here it’s either black or white. We are all assumed innocent until proven otherwise with actual evidence
@@ndnd7614 haha but come on its the same thing as if it had. Otherwise he would clarify and avoid the drama. If he really doesn't have any evidence at least he should tell his side of the story. Like be a man
Hans admitted to cheating when he was 12…. 4 years later he admitted to cheating again when he was 16 “to gain rating points”. Now 3 years later when he is 19 he has gained 200 rating points rather quickly. His analysis clearly isn’t at the level of his rating… the only question is how did he cheat this time?
@@miguelferrigno Be a woman, Miguel.
Posting the video of Mourinho is what is causing all the hubbub: using the words of another to make a controversial statement that one lacks the courage to make directly in public seems cowardly, yet the bombshell effect is the same. I would have preferred "I am withdrawing from the tournament for reasons related to a breach of trust at some level about which I am not going to speak." Period. This still would have drawn speculation, but Carlsen would not need to hide behind Mourinho's highly charged words which conflate rigged soccer results with an accusation of cheating or some sort of betrayal in chess. One must realize that without concrete evidence, one either opts for silence or a simple statement of personal reasons. Magnus opted for a flawed indirect strategy (like a man who hires a killer but doesn't do the actual killing) that is having a very negative effect on GM Hans.
Hiding behind Mourinho? Mourinho isn't his lawyer, it's a meme. Magnus didn't conflate anything, that's literally what you are doing by not knowing how the internet works.
@@cardboardu6019 He used a meme or the words of others to make a statement he could have made himself: we all know how the internet works, thank you, And yes, IT IS conflating Mourinho's words with what Magnus feels happened to him personally in the tournament. The strategy speaks for itself and the damage is being done. We should assume responsability rather than use memes when our words will have such effects.
Yeah. I agree with that. That's a much more clear way to put it. It has no meaningful relation to soccer or Mourinho. I will add this: People need to keep their focus in my opinion. The pressure should indeed be on Magnus to say more. People are worrying about silencing content creators when the onus should be on Magnus now.
@@cardboardu6019 For sure, Timothy: neither Mourinho nor soccer has anything to do with this (but a general...vague sense of foul play, yes...who or whom are unknown however), but why would Magnus even post such a meme if it were not meant to convey some personal feeling he either could not articulate in a better way or was too timid to utter? Magnus said nothing and the meme everything: I found it a very juvenile form of dealing with a serious issue that damages another person (i.e. lack of thinking about the moves ahead). The meme ignited everything and it should be pointed out and as you say, Magnus should be called out.
@@robertoalexandre4250 I don't want to defend Magnus for this in any way when he hasn't come out and said more, which I believe is absolutely warranted, but those are not the only options. He is capable of just saying "Hans cheeated" if he wanted to. He is not known to be timid, but it's hard to guess what his reasons were at this point, so we will hopefully find out more about his motivation soon enough.
hans triggered magnus
he can probly trigger wc back to defend his title
This is all bizarre.
I'll admit, when this drama started I was inclined to think some sort of foul play seemed likely. Based on the reactions of various pros. I don't know what to think now.
The main weird thing is that it seems very odd for Magnus to feel so uncomfortable about something that he leaves a tournament. He must be strongly convinced something is going on (cheating or leaked prep/ hacking etc), he's not the type to just think "someone beat me, they must have cheated". Reading between the lines, I think it's quite probable that he deliberately played a line he doesn't normally play to see what happened. A sting of sorts. Now, it could just be a wild coincidence that Hans prepped the exact lines he chose, leading to a perfect storm of suspicion. It just seems unlikely. Magnus getting too far inside his own head and therefore playing badly in a way that served to help confirm his suspicions seems plausible in this scenario. But overall it's still all unlikely.
On the other hand, cheating otb seems hard to pull off and quite unlikely. Hans's explanations for his prep, and his interviews, are all at least plausible.
Something unlikely has happened either way.
I'm out of my depth 🤷♂️ just hope there's more clarity to come.
What’s really throwing me off is the interview after the Alireza game and the Queen H4 line, pretty sure I’m like you, idk but if it’s anything it’s probably leaked prep
too many coincidences and too many miracles along with incredibly weak post-game analyses
great speech
You don't just beat Magnus AND Alireza out lf the blue
that's a really good take, sadly we will probably never know. Its really hard either to prove or disprove something like this. So in the end they are both getting something bad out of this drama, because 50% think Magnus is arrogant and 50% think Hans cheated(in some way). I would of loved for this to be handled privately and for Magnus to continue playing in the tournament.
And even though im more inclined to believe Magnus, i think he should be innocent until proven guilty.
"Qh4 here, what does the engine say?"
"Well it says you hung a piece and this position is completely losing."
"Oh maybe Qh4 some other time then."
Just put yourself into his place. He must've been very excited to have beaten magnus, he fires out variation after variation and no wonder he mixed up some lines. Even a 1600 rated player can see in this position that Qh4 is losing a peace. You don't need an engine here to see this so this i clearly a matter of mixing up something. In fact Hikaru calls this suspicious, but he'd shoud better shut up here.
@@thomasheimer3578 it also happened in alireza game.
And his argument also ridiculous
@@thomasheimer3578 It's being consistently confused about lines across multiple games, if one wants to be blind, nobody can help them :P
@@thomasheimer3578 his chess against Andrea couple of months ago, he even keeps hanging pieces in a 5 min game against a 2k opponent. No super GM has this much inconsistincies. All super GMs come from young age, slowly improving, they do not suck for 20 years then be world champion in 6 months.
@@edyburkay He's 19, how can he suck for 20 years. In fact your arguments are ridiculous. If this would be a prove to be constantly cheating, a whole bunch of TOP GMs would.
At first when I heard about this situation I thought Hans seemed suspicious because so many GMs were saying "Oh he doesn't calculate well, he has a history of cheating, etc." but the more GMs I hear speak neutrally, in his defense, his former coaches responses, and Hans' own response the more I think he's innocent.
You don't have to pick a side and stick to it. You don't have to rely completely on one or two sources you trust or like. Stay open minded and, to accidently paraphrase Hans, "Let the arguments speak for themselves."
I thought Hans was incredibly suspicious based on what I heard and hoped he would definitively get caught cheating. Now I think he's getting completely screwed over and that Magnus or his team or whoever need to speak up soon to clarify this situation quick. Magnus might get in trouble for whatever he doesn't want to say but Hans is already paying the price for him not saying it.
..yes well said, I think you’re describing the truth of the situation, or as close as the information allows
Hans is more down to earth after this.. i wanted to knock his teeth out with those comments he made lol.. may he learn from what happen and do well
@@haominlunlhouvum5174 Agreed.
The 9:14 thing that Hikaru does is SO MISLEADING. In the continuation of that interview, Hans says "Ok, maybe it was Qh4 on some other move". He sounds confused, yeah, sure, but from there to "he is cheating" it's a loooooong way.
How come he was so well prepared but can't go over the analysis? He said he prepared for that exact thing that fkn morning. "What does the engine say" Come on..
Probably because Qh4 was not move on any move.
@@michaelmurray6577 I've seen many Magnus' interviews where he suggests a move, the engine declares it as a blunder and Magnus' does his hand sweep gesture and shakes his head like "ok whatever" and moves on.... does this mean Magnus is a cheater?
@@FrequentArtist Do you play chess?
@@michaelmurray6577 Do you follow how Hans is dominating now and proving y'all mofos wrong?
The actual questions:
-How exactly would one cheat otb?
-What precautions were taken by tournament officials to prevent cheating?
-Is there really evidence of behaviour indicative of cheating?
-How well did Magnus play? His accuracy? Opening and lines he chose... were they really so good that the only way to beat was cheating?
-If Magnus' play was really that good, then wouldn't it require obvious engine lines to defeat?
-What about Hans' lines appear to have been more likely to be cheating than solid play?
I don't know answers to any of this. My initial impression is that it would be difficult to cheat OTB but not impossible, but still seems far-fetched. Magnus has been very off as of late, so him playing poorly enough to experience a truly stinging loss seems like an event bound to occur.
....the talk is that maybe someone in Carlsen's team leaked his prep to Hans and that's why he knew what opening moves Carlsen was going to use.....an opening he has never used before....
Some people tend to think that maybe a member from Magnus' team leaked his prep data to Hans so he could focus his own prep to counter it.
Another option is to have some tiny vibrating device hidden somewhere and an accomplice with a computer observing the live feed and sending the winning move found by a chess engine.
Actually Magnus did not even claim cheating in any form. It might be something else entirely, like something gone awry with organizers or health issues he wants to keep private or Magnus just getting too frustrated to continue because of Hans previous taunting in tournament before or something else. The game itself did not seem that strange and endgames don't have that many chances so finding good / best moves is not that farfetched for GM-level players. So... Magnus puts out cryptic tweet and everyone goes nuts with all sorts of theories. We just don't know and won't know what it's about unless Magnus specifies it and with that video I'd guess he's unwilling to do so.
@@jarirepo1172 He explicitly said it was not health related. And the organizer interview shows good indication that he told them the reason, they accepted it as valid and they want to let him keep control of when and how he will communicate about it. So my opinion is that he has suspicions that someone from his own team was rigging matches, probably by leaking prep data to some of his opponents. He resigned from the tournament to remove the rigged results and restore fairness for all participants. And he stays silent until the internal investigation on his team is done.
@Ken Fullman they get checked for electronical devices, so unless it's a string and cups' phone, idk how that communication happens. Smoke signs? I honestly don't know how people can accuse so strongly with this premise
you missed the Firouzja interview and post analysis
this guy is just extremely full of himself. if you put everything together, like staying in a room studying for 2 years and even losing your native accent, beating MAGNUS with black pieces and bragging about it on the interview, sacrificing everything for chess and bla bla bla. Paiting himself as a true hero, a modern bobby fischer... it is clearly pure ego.
My brother has lived in S Korea for 7 years. Doesn’t have many friends back home. I talk to him a couple times a year. He still talks like an American.
…so your point is that Hans has an ego, well that’s very observant. Wouldn’t it be accurate to say every person on the planet has an ego. Didn’t you notice his character was attacked by Magnus and Hikaru..
@@cdunne1620 Magnus didn't attack him tho? Afaik, Magnus hasn't made any direct accusations
@@cdunne1620 Hikaru accused him because of the post-game analysis.. nothing to do with him being a young talent, crushing Magnus or anything related
Geniuses must have some ego going, otherwise they wouldn't recognise themselves as geniuses, therefore, they wouldn't be. Not saying he's legit, but I'm saying the witch hunt is wrong.
There IS that nagging fact that he is a known cheater… but frankly i believe him. The arguments he gives are good and he strikes his points with a genuinely frustrated and punchy cadence. He doesnt seem like someone who got busted, he seems like someone who just did something amazing and no one believes him. Could be an elaborate act, but theres easier less alarm trippy ways to increase your rating than by beating Magnus Carlson.
I totally had him pinned for a cheater until i saw his response to the accusations. Another thing is… if he was playing like an engine… shouldnt some of these grandmasters be able to at least demonstrate why his moves are super human?
Yes he is telling the truth. His body language and speech tell you this. If you know what to look for. At beast he might of had a heads up on the opening and that's it at best but unlikely. He just beat Magnus in a sloppy game.
I do partially agree with you but his response to accusations and coming up with points from Alireza match after a day still sparks up problems you know?
So he wasn't able to demonstrate the lines properly after the match in an interview but he was able to do it 24 hours later.. i mean, that kinda hints he prepared what to say to deflect..
The thing is, becoming a GM means being able to play, think, live Chess.
Even if you don't know language you know chess positions and chess pieces, that's a GM.
If you can't properly explain lines in chess terms even, then it's bound to arouse suspicions.. not saying he is cheating myself, but just explaining why people are still onto him after his accusation interview. We can only wait and see what happens
He cheated online when he was a child. That's very different from cheating as an adult, over the board, in the most viewed tournament of the year
"known cheater" is a bit of stretch
@@asp2410 why would it even matter that he doesn't use chess terms? are you implying that ALL of his over the board games have been cheats and that he actually doesn't know chess? otherwise what's even the point of that argument? why would he even need to justify everything when accusations havent come up yet? why cant gms see that magnus has actually played that position before through a transposition? this is all bullshit lol
The idea that Magnus withdrew just because he lost to a weaker player and freaked out is just silly.
Well, looks like exactly this happened.
@@Chr15T No, my friend try to read between the lines.
Yeah it is rather absurd.
@@Chr15T he has lost against lesser rated opponents and came back to win tournaments. Something is definitely not right here but i still cannot accuse Hans without any solid proof.
@@estyak8780 Yes, something is definitely not right here, but it does not look like that is on Hans' side.
Great video, thank you so much for putting this together. In the end it’s all speculation: he’s either cheating or he’s innocent and if he’s cheating they have to find proof. It’s certainly a fascinating saga though.
Until more evidence is on the table I am inclined to believe in Hans and I hope he gets through this on his feet. I think it would be very hard to cheat OTB in such a huge tournament...
Hans does have this cocky attitude that is not to everybody's liking and so he should really work to get rid of it, the sooner the better. Nevertheless...forejudging Hans based solely on insinuations made by the WCC after a loss and subsequent withdrawal of a tournament is waaay to hasty...
Also, Magnus has been known to handle losses in the past very very poorly, but throwing off suspicions / insinuations of cheating without publicly exposing a shred of evidence is a new low....
I do hope everything is fine with Magnus though, but his behavior lately has been somewhat erratic...?
Fully agree.
Based rational outlook.
Tell me , without telling me you haven't seen the full analysis video of Hans postgame ...... I'm not saying he's a cheater but to say something is wrong with magnus and other super GMs sussing him of cheating , bro who tf are you to say that...
Magnus did not accuse Hans at all!!
Some other players suggest that his prep of the game had leaked out, others that Hans might play with help of technology. But Carlsen did not say anything.
Two possibilities exist.
1. That everyone is correctly interpreting Magnus's tweet as a statement that he believes Hans cheated.
2. Magnus *didn't* mean for his tweet to be interpreted that way, everyone is wrong, and Magnus is perfectly happy to see Hans' reputation get trashed, rather than just say "um, guys, that's not what I meant".
Either way, unless he has actual evidence of cheating, Magnus has behaved poorly.
Some observations, really I'm not accusing him of cheating. But...in his big statement he said he decided to check all the possible transpositions...and I quote "it's not a miracle...it's actually me being extremely tedious" 23:45....but in his interview right after the Magnus game...he said...1:15 "it's such a ridiculous miracle..." and how he does not even remember why he checked it etc.
His explanation of being extremely serious of course works out much better for him, as it's more plausible than stumbling randomly on that position.
I think he said it’s a ridiculous miracle he won because it’s magnus
He being a known cheater in online events and saying "it's actually me being extremely tedious" after 20+ moves in prepp in a opening line Magnus never played before make me not belive him.. had it been a opening line Magnus played before i could have bought it.
@@rimacidih9350 he might have said that further into the interview, but not in the time stamp that I put in my comment.
@@rimacidih9350 He actually said it was miraculous that he randomly studied that opening in the morning with no logical reason. And then a couple days later he pretends it was all logical. Also he was never able to give a correct recollection of that magical morning study. And conveniently the only things he remembered from that miraculous morning study were the winning move and an alternate queen move that should be almost equivalent except the engine says the complete opposite. That post game analysis is surreal.
@@christianbarnay2499
..here’s a thought experiment, what would you think if Hans gave no interviews.
He is innocent until there is actual hard evidence brought forward. All this talk of the post game analysis is irrelevant. In a court of law all that talk means very little if you don’t have real evidence, it really means nothing
Hans should reply with a Mourinho quote of his own:
I am not feeling the pressure no, you can not put pressure on me.
😂😂
I hope that there would be a sponsor pitting Hans vs Magnus or Hans vs Hikaru in a 4 games classical games. I would be rooting for Hans all the way!
yeah, Hans would win 4-0 all. Then you put them all in a perfectly isolated and insulated room, Hans would lose 4-0, all with decisive blunders with no endgame.
@@edyburkay Fun Fact: During the games, only players and Organizers are allowed to enter the game rooms.
Fun Fact #2: Each player is checked before a game to make sure no cheating occurs.
@@isamirahmad fun fact #3, you can pass that super complicated mall security detector with well hidden, insulated recievers, even hide them like they are seen as part of your skin.
What I am saying is, put him in a EMI shield room, No signals in, no signal out.
Why rooting for a cheater?
You know what! I like this guy!! I believe him. I know he's upset but his name is going to be WAY bigger now. And if he's winning like this already he'll be even bigger in the coming years
Magnus shouldn't have insinuating he cheated but Hans and his fake accent are obnoxious.
@@BadBrucey
..it’s irrelevant if the young lad is obnoxious, Magnus should have known his actions could potentially destroy Hans’ career. Is that the kind of legacy Magnus wants, Hans should sue Hikaru and Magnus for defamation
@@softan he cheated online when he was 12, dont use that as a reason to make accusations thag heavy
I just cant stand his stupid hair
Who?
Wow, what a thorough report on this "scandal". Thank you for such a complete picture. Hans Niemann's defense and statements about Magnus Carlsen and Hikaru starting at 19:30 were powerfully moving and convincing. It appears there is no scandal at all. I can't believe Hans is only 19. He's courageous, and fearless in the face of this onslaught. He made a very strong argument that he is owed an apology from Carlsen, Hikaru, Chessdotcom, et al. We have a budding chess superstar.
There's a lot of video about cheating scandals in video games.They are always very confident and fearless when being accused. Todd Rogers cheated and was accused for 30 years until his record was proven impossible. He was even given positions of power regarding records.
There's also Riolu who cheated tens or hundreds of world records over multiple years. He even publicly campaigned for fair play and tougher stance on tools pretending to be very fair gamer. He was accused of cheating and was very rude and confident, completely fearless. Undeniable proof was given and he disappeared overnight.
I don't know if Hans cheated or not but I would put tighter eye on him still. Being fearless and courageous says nothing about not cheating.
Or he is really calm because it is expected and practiced. Someone who was innocent would be pretty angry wouldn't you think?
Let's look at the game between Niemann and Carlsen.
13. Rfd1 instead of the correct Bxf6
21 c4 - sacrificing a pawn for very little compensation
28 g4??
30 a4 instead of Bxc4
Niemann also didn't play the most accurate moves to bring home the point.
Carlsen lost because he played badly in this game and not because of any computer-like brilliance from Niemann.
Hans most likely didn't cheat here, but some inaccurate moves does not proof lack of cheating. As a professional, you can play to a certain point and if you received only a few high level computer moves, at the most difficult points, you might be able to convert a game against anyone. But I think the real reason Magnus left is to protect his rating, he was stressed and knew his emotions might damage his up and coming games.
Also: how focused can you play, if you prepared to prove someones cheating and this player responded 20 moves as you've prepared this once in your lifetime?
poor hans, he deserves to play and speak with with or without an accent.. he lived in a suitcase and studied 12 hours a day and the result was variable pronunciation.
thats pretty good
he studied how to cheat maybe 😆😆
Two faced
Hans cheated in the past, but ok, he was just a child. Magnus is very bad at losing, but ok, it doesn’t happed that often, so he lacks a bit of practice at it. And Hikaru makes a habit of speaking too much, but ok, it’s 2022 and that’s what people do if they become a “streamer”…
So everyone’s just making mistakes and blunders like the imperfect human beings they are… Now let’s just, give the guys a break and let the storm pass over.
Unfortunately my man hans will suffer the most from this since he might be boycotted from tournaments
Thanks for compiling this into one once for us. Hans words seem to be coming from the heart. Magnus of course knows what he's done and hopefully it won't be in vain. Either way this will conclude we all have to just wait and see how it happens.
Nah dude, don't fall into emotion. his speech was very emotional but if you think about it logically it's riddled with contradictions. it isn't really evidence for anything but just don't fall into the honey trap.
@@ghosthunter0950 Burden of proof is on the accuser.
@@ghosthunter0950 he is 19 u muppet.
Hans has this characteristic muffled smile, smug tonality and oddly placed face touches that say something about his egocentric motivations and lack of sincerity. You see him carefully navigating through the conversation, talking in a particular manner and focusing on aspects that fortify his perceived intellectual position, while using non rational, subtly derogative rhetoric and tonality to degrade Magnus', while being able to confidently bring forward explanations that prove to be wrong. His conversation is structured differently from someone being truly straight forward. You also see him, without being asked, defending his own perceived sincerity, which is a sign of lying or at least someone having lied in multiplicity before. A hint of psychopathy at least. This man is secretly trying to play character chess in real life.
If I were in his shoes, and I were innocent, I would just say "I don't cheat, you can monitor me and check me all you want" I wouldn't go off on a long explanation defending myself.
Exactly. The elaborate anger at the accusation is also odd.
@@scoopbls
..I don’t think it’s odd, he’s addressing Hikaru’s jabs at him, as a young person he would be more self conscious and would feel the need to explain himself and he did, I think Hans explained himself very well and came across as believable and actually mature and intelligent despite his earlier interviews where he was being a d!ck
Well, since he was caught online cheating twice, and was removed from Eric Hansen's online tournaments, in the past, that would have fallen flat. And he did say that he hasn't cheated since, or even in otb, and that they can do any monitoring of him that they want. He did what he needed to do, I think...but I do agree that he should shut up going forward. Clearly they have no proof of anything, or the tournament would have booted him already.
He just talks that way. He speaks at 100kph and never stops. He's not you.
But I agree in general. He's way too defensive for someone who wasn't even accused yet officially.
And what is interesting is, Magunus hasnt given a reason for withdrawing, so Hans is going very defensive and talking a lot about his innocence....although he hasnt been accused of anything yet....
13:56 MVL the first one to bite the bait and actually mention the term "cheating" himself. All the other players being interviewed are clearly amateur paralegals in their spare time 😂 Shak's comment was the funniest tho: at 13:38 - Shak asks the interviewer suggestively: "Do you know why Magnus is not playing...?" Interviewer deflects, says Magnus hasn't released a statement. Shak smiles. "Ok if you know, you can ask me, I will answer something, if not I don't know 😉" aka he obviously knew what it was all about but was making sure that he wasn't the one to make the "cheating" insinuation himself 😂
14:13 MVL giving the proper french "Hans" pronunciation with a mute "H" :D
Not sure it's in purpose haha
My name starts with an H, and my french teacher always called me with a mute "H". I think every french person does so subconsiously lol.
The North European of 'Hans' is the Hans of Christian Andersen...
MVL and Levon are good people. Nakamura is an arse
@@megselv6633 Yes, the french h is silent
Didn´t Hans changed a little bit his story? At the interview after the game againt Magnus, he said he miraculously checked the opening. Later on, on the other interview, he said considering that opening was something pretty logical, rather then a miracle, as he said before. I might be miss interpretating something, though.
No he said that he predicted the opening, but in an other move order... People didnt understand it and thought he would have predicted this exact move order, but he obviusly didnt and now it makes total sense...
it was a humble brag because people often talk about things they're proud about
@@GAMTT His affirmation that he had studied the position that same morning would be believable if he was able to give a decent recollection of the morning study in the post game analysis.
But instead he reminds there was also a queen move that was nearly as good and asks to see its score on the engine. And the engine says it's complete rubbish. So he rapidly hand brushes the issue and changes the subject. And a few days later in the long interview he focuses on his accent and explains that this is because he spent 2 full years studying chess. So he wants us to believe that a guy who spent 2 entire years cutting himself from the world to study and deeply understand chess is the same who is completely unable to give a consistent recollection of a study that he made in the morning and that helped him win a game against the current world champion.
His own words don't add up.
@@christianbarnay2499 He said he wasnt sure if there is Queen move. So maybe there was a similar line where this Qh4 idea is a good move. I mean a lot of people including Wesley So are mixing up move orders or whole openings on that level. If they speak quickly in a post game analysis this could happen to everyone for sure...
He didn’t want to admit it was his Catalan prep for Magnus but was forced to admit it because of controversy
Magnus started with a dubious opening just to check if the opp will make that 0.5 point out in some difficult position
The reason why I initially thought it is probable that Hans cheated is that Magnus by his actions wagered his whole reputation on the matter. If he doesn't provide any evidence against Hans he will lose all my respect and I think many think the same.
He did not accuse him precisely because he did not have evidence. He implicitly raised suspicions, which is fair. He's in a better position to feel how humans play vs how machines play. Everything about Hans is weird. I think it is not difficult to show that the probability that he cheated is extremely high.
@@hlkp333 I don't think it is fair to raise suspicions, and that's the entire reason people are lashing out against Magnus. No, suspicions aren't innocent just because you're not saying anything outright. I don't care if Hans cheated or not, but it's not cool if that's what Magnus did imply without evidence.
@@Ninterd2 You have a problem with democracy then. Presumption of innocence does not mean you cannot be suspicious, and make it known to others, that would be basically preventing people from expressing themselves honestly about a topic. Accusation on the other hand, is about providing factual evidence, and as far as I have seen, no-one has crossed that line. Otherwise, next time you watch a magic trick, how about you assume it's true magic as long as you cannot provide evidence to support the contrary?
@@hlkp333 Ok yeah, fair enough. I see your point. But this isn't a political debate, it's simply potentially defamation.
Bro, magnus doesn't care about reputation, magnus said he doesn't want to defend his title and that he was a better player 2-3 years ago
12 years old in 2015 playing chess basically his whole life and he apparently didn't know what a chess engine is and what it means to use a chess engine in a tournament. Believable.
From 12 to 16 he never cheated, not a single game, ranked or unranked, casual or tournament. Believable.
At 16 he admits to cheating in random online ranked games to gain ELO to play stronger players, and that entire time parallel to that he's also playing online tournaments, and in not a single one of those tournaments he used an engine even for a single move. Believable.
There are so many holes in the crap he spews and his behavior is so blatantly manipulative, that even if no definitive proof is ever found I will never trust him.
Not to mention that Magnus, Hikaru, Eric Hansen, Yasser, Alireza and a lot of others didn't even see the moves that Hans played. But yes, let's just completely disregard their genius, expertise and experience and trust the 19 year old engine operator.
This. It's not even about his chess plays. His character is so sus. And he's extremely arrogant. "I'll do anything to win!" ...yea we saw that a couple of years ago already....
I would like to see your "character" react when the whole world of everything you care about since you're 12 yo starts hating and accusing you.
True but he could’ve not admitted to cheating ever or didn’t need to say certain details but was brave enough to come out with them (unless he felt others would’ve mentioned his past if he didn’t bring it up first idk). I feel like he’s stirring the pot on purpose to bring more drama and views to chess 🤷
He could’ve just said “I’ve never cheated in an OTB game ever.” Instead of mentioning about the online stuff at all maybe. Because just mentioning those extra details makes a lot of people suspect him more lol😝
It’s so hard though, if you were Hans and you cheated in the past do you think it’s a good strategy to bring it up? So he can show contrast that he’s hard working nowadays idk
On the one hand I understand his feelings for wanting to play stronger players since he wouldn’t naturally get paired with someone a few hundred or several hundred points above his rating, and on the other It’s really unfair to the stronger players he forced his way through..
But he did suffer a lot already by having his account banned and living with the fact that he cheated seemed to make him suffer the past years too. Also being independent and living alone from 16 might’ve made him slightly unstable mentally and he made some bad choices. At least he’s over 18 now so he’s an adult and the punishment for cheating is more severe, I don’t think he’s going to risk his chess career as an adult now, but everything is uncertain.
@@phen-themoogle7651 He mentioned it in response to Hikaru and Eric Hansen bringing it up.
Because it's near impossible to cheat over the board. Think about it. What evidence do you have he cheated other than insinuation. Until someone brings evidence Magnus has to apologize.
Watching the post game analysis where he didn't even understand the position with his own moves is just suspicious as heck
Yeah.. I thought a 2700 had a better understanding of the game! And his own game nonetheless.. "I don't need to show variations" - that was a weird thing to say!
It's sus as soon as he starts explaining the miracle of him checking the opening that same day... look at the body language.
@@JBugz777 Another surprisingly coincidence. Without knowing the true, at least we can say there are several suspicious factors on the table. But without real evidence we should give him the advantage of the doubt.
@@JBugz777 yeah that was highly suspect and as Hikaru pointed out, he apparently checked 20 moves into a variation that carlsen has never played in his life
@@xaiano794 It's not that, It's the way he brings it up first thing in a sort of apologetic way.. like he's trying to get ahead of the question.
9:33
Hikaru is being aggressively ignorant.
"I am a super genius with perfect memory for chess positions and engine analysis scores therefore everyone else who is a chess pro must always be equally perfect."
It's a bizarre and illogical thought process. Great at chess, subpar at other kinds of logic.
Magnus may not be able to talk right now, because the organisers may be involved in the cheating that may have happened. Or at least one other person in the room may be, based on the live coverage.
If he speaks he ll be in big trouble
So basically no proof and just false accusations.
What's up with this guilty until proven innocent mentality people are having? 12 Year old Magnus/Hikaru fanboys probably but still frustrating.
This is true. But there is smoke and precedent, so it's not unreasonable to assume that there's something up here.
Indeed, Magnus just can't lose like a gentleman. There is no evidence the guy cheated and if there is he should lay it out, instead of pretending he can't say anything. Like what did he have 2030s technology contact lenses?
The point is, there are precedents, strange behavior, statistical oddities, etc... not to mention the fact that Magnus is not a child and would never do something like this without any base. On the othert hand we have the word of a known cheater. Don't blame people for siding with Magnus.
@@gajofre The problem is that people are too quick to jump the gun and come to a conclusion without concrete evidence. Even if he did cheat, at least wait until you know the full story. If he did cheat, then yeah sure you can say you were correct all along or something, but what if it's the opposite? It would ruin a reputation of a person. Everyone is so quick to take a side and just attack hans without full proof. Not taking side with hans here, just trying to make a point that unless we know everything, we shouldn't judge.
@@gajofre He should lay out the evidence then. The way he quit the event with what he posted is terrible sportsmanship.
Everybody claiming Niemann might have cheated should take a look at this video, especially the end part.
ruclips.net/video/BbEiW-60hf0/видео.html&ab_channel=Stokfish
Stockfish analysis of the game and its moves and at the ending you can clearly see the accuracy percentage for both players. Niemann's was 93.4, which is normal for a 2700 GM. Carlsen's was 83.9, which is subpar for the highest rated player on the planet. His normal would be something like 95-97%. So Carlsen just played worse than he normally does, that's why he lost, end of story.
Is it not expected for accuracy to take a hit when playing against cheater/engine?
do you have proof that he is cheating julian ? idiot, as if you are so sure he cheated.
@@julianw7097 yes, but Niemann's accuracy wasn't at 98+%
Most of Magnus’s main mistakes came toward the end of the game though… by that point he was already in his head thinking Hans had played against his unexpected opening perfectly. If your already thinking someone is cheating it affects your play… I agree Magnus played subpar that game though
But cheating is not especially picking the top engine line, so accuracy is even not relevant here...!
His interview giving random moves and asking what the engine says raises more suspects than the actual game.
If MVL says he doesn’t have enough evidence how can you?
They were lines that he had dismissed because he knew they weren't lines he wanted to go down. Those are also taken out of context. Watch the full post game analysis and you'll see that his analysis is normal. I've seen Magnus give bad post game analysis before.
@@AGHathaway but don’t you think the likes of MVL Aronian and So would know better than us,I mean they all have reached 2800
@@AGHathaway I’m waiting for the evidence to say his guilty. I hope Magnus talks
are you trying to say he did a bad job of cheating?
Does anyone else notice he got exponentially better at explaining the moves he played after he had 24 hours to think about it?
he says he was just tired
@@orionspur how is it disturbing?
@@nestorv7627 speculation Jon is a chess GM with rating of 2800, he knows what he is talking about
😂 It's so funny seeing him try to sound convincing.
That applies to anybody "exponentially"
Yoooooo in Hans's statement esp at 21:06, Hans absolutely BODIED all the GMs (cough maybe Hikaru?) and just the theories or "evidence" against him...... he's won me over 💀 no fing bs. I'm straight rooting for Hans now 😵
Of course, the memes will live on, forever. The memes have entered the Meme Hall of Fame. The Hans chapter is now embedded deep inside the annals of history. It's stuck way too far inwards and will not be able to be taken out. But I hope this is the beginning of a villain character arc in chess 😈
Where’s the super suspicious post game analyses from Hans?
Will nobody talk about the security measures in the tournament is basically as basic as a Mall security :D
The only certainty from this saga, is that over-the-board games with Hans will never ever be the same again.
Can you take the POLYGRAPH guy...? That's a question for you...?
Talent is a mystery. I truly believe, it's possible that Hans Niemann is imaginative and intelligent enough, to perform as he did. Also, I believe, Niemann is left-handed. Sadly, we're largely unaware of the significance of, "handedness".
I thought he was some European kid, really surprised by his accent, didn't know he is American.
And did you know england is in Europe also.
Hans is a Cosmopolitan kid
@@stevepayne2795 England is my city
@@NotQuiteFirst lol ok
fake accent he is from California born & raised...like Alec Baldwin's wife with her fake Spanish accent born & raised in Boston...dude totally cheated
Seems like chess needs some celebrity boxing matches
The only scandal I can see is that Magnus played poorly and had a hissy fit at Hans for beating his 53 classical unbeaten streak. 😭
Exactly. Zero evidence that Hans cheated, Hikaru should be ashamed for insinuating such things.
@@xeanthomas5231 incorrect. Hans made multiple obvious errors explaining lines, he claims to have studied beforehand. He was unable to identify a position as lost and said that white was winning, when it was -2.6 instead. He plays top engine sacrifices which Alireza could not find and says they were based on intuition?? He failed miserably at explaining the continuations of the sacrifice leading me to believe it was not him ho came up with that move
@@hannes8978 yeah plenty of circumstantial evidence.
@@hannes8978 I know you're repeating exactly what Hikaru said but you have no idea why those ideas are important or what Hans's intentions were by using those lines. You're just on the "agree with Hikaru" bandwagon. Grow up.
@@xeanthomas5231 Right. Without concrete evidence of cheating Hikaru is talking BS.
hahaha, Whats the next script.. hahah, on the previous video regarding his game with firouza on the queen move, he said, he is completely winning. And now with the same move he said he just trick firouza... The more things you said, the more the dots be connected...
I admit that because of my respect for Magnus’s judgment, and because of Hans’s bizarre behavior in the early interviews, I suspected something dishonest was going on. After Hans’s interview after round 5, I am much less suspicious. He has shed the false accent and the obviously put on smug persona. He was finally himself in that last interview. He turns out to be an undeniably great player, though still immature, who can make mistakes (particularly in his analyses), perhaps because he’s trying to be cool or whatever. In my opinion, his obviously insincere and put on persona increased the level of suspicion. At this point, I’m more disappointed that Magnus has remained silent. I for one am sorry that I bought into all the hype so quickly. Wish I had remained neutral until concrete evidence was presented.
After watching all of Hans' comments on this scandal, i feel bad having thought that he might've been cheating. These accusations have gone outta hand and it has already negatively affected Hans' reputation.
idk at the beginning the very first interview seemed like he had no idea what he was talking about with that position
..same here, Magnus and Hikaru have a lot to answer for, I won’t ever support hikaru’s channel again, not after this
@@HiImRawr Yeah that Qh4 - blundering the bishop, ~(-5.6) engine Eval was cringe af. But idk maybe his brain was fried and he was tired.
@@TheFenrirulfr ya but he said he studied it that day farther than they went lol
So you're buying the crocodile tears? Did he really prep the opening Magnus never plays? Bs
Here is what happened, logically explained.
First, Hikaru gave the fact that Hans cheated online, not because to put more fuel in the fire, but to give context to his viewers that why suddenly some GMs and people in the chess world thinks Hans cheated against Magnus. "Why suddenly someone thinks Hans cheated?" - " Because they know that Hans cheated online before and in a prized tournament" - This is a very logical response.
But the problem comes next - not many people know that Hans cheated online and got banned, he even got banned on stream. So this causes a consequence, that it creates a shit tons more of people believing Hans cheated because he cheated before. ROFL.
So what can we learn from this ? It's that the information that Hans cheated in the past online, really changes people's view on him.
And let's not forget the Carlsen angle : Magnus can't claim Hans cheated now otb, because he and everybody else have zero proof of it. Therefore Magnus making insinuations without proof makes Magnus himself look bad.
Without any prior knowledge the first seconds of the video are already interesting. He's directly giving his alibi as an introduction before being asked any question. It's so miraculous he randomly checked this exact opening right this morning. Then when they analyze the position with him he remembers an alternate move that he thinks should be pretty good too but the engine actually says it's rubbish. So the guy just luckily studied that exact opening and then forgot the entire analysis except for that one exact move without any understanding of why it was right and why another move that he thought was good too was actually wrong. This is completely illogical.
@@christianbarnay2499
..whether it’s logical or not I don’t think it matters much. If you don’t have actual evidence of cheating you can’t destroy a persons life, that’s why we have courts and legal procedures to avoid witch hunting. Without evidence Magnus’ action is callous and casual and petulant all at the same time, I’m sure his father is proud of him after this
@@cdunne1620 And that's why nobody explicitly accused him of cheating. They simply raised suspicions to stay on the cautious side.
And Magnus decision to withdraw from the tournament is completely understandable if he has suspicions that someone from his own team leaked prep data to other players. If the mole selects which opponents he helps and which he doesn't, staying in the tournament would be unfair to other players. So the best move is to remove himself to ensure fairness is restored.
@@christianbarnay2499 ...it is presumptious to call an explanation an excuse. Are you just one of those guys who love to hate?
It’s not courageous or noble to admit to cheating when you’ve already been caught. He was caught cheating twice, and most likely did it a lot more. I also thought his analysis was weak and his prep was “beyond lucky.” 99% confident he cheated
how could he have cheated?
@@iakobkv271 How indeed but there are incriminating factors which paint an idea when combined: cheated before, unlikely/rare rise in rating, unable to/wrongly access position in interview as a 2700.
Good that you got all the ridiculous Hikaru accusations in this video.
9:52: Do your homework, and look at the game Magnus-So, Kolkata 2019. You would find out Magnus has played G3 before.
I will subscribe just because the amount of work and the outcome is great 👍
Playing chess at this level is pretty much the worse choice of life .just look at them
Honest question; how does one cheat the best in the game on the board?
It feels like magnus told some people what openings he would choose in the game , and this information has reached Hans .. Because Hans was saying that he checked the opening suddenly and knew all the lines , I remember that a lot of people entered things to cheat in 2000 just in some exams , so in 2022 things got so much complicated.. if you only watch a documentary about spy cameras, they could put these things on a car key lol , so of course if he wants to cheat there’s many ways , even over the board
Punishing someone without proof is worse than someone getting away with cheating.
hikaru gives the exact proof. you dont predict which star will be visible in the sky and that star is visible . hans said he prepards that same exact line in the morning which magnus never played and that exact position happend over the board lol
@@aadibryn4405 The situation is sus, granted. lol But where is the proof, how did he do it exactly?
@@aadibryn4405
..”Hikaru gives exact proof”
What proof, his opinion is not proof, what are you smoking
It is true, because I live abroad: some people simply take over accents really easily. I'm not one of them, but I think the accent angle is very rediculous.
Magnus's attitude (even on his streams) is straight-up obnoxious -- not a fan of his. But this Hans kid is speaking on a script in the last interview. In the interview right after the game he said he "miraculously" checked that line right in the morning with no further explanation given. Then he tries to recount some of it and talks himself right into a blunder. Later, after given time to rehearse, he has it all memorized properly PLUS an explanation of why he happened to study that line. Sorry not buying it. They say the more you try to justify and rationalize, the more guilty you are.
100% cheater - high correlation with Stockfish, his body reactions, past cheater... this guy is scary as seems to believe his own lies... he just found a way to avoid tech signal detectors and is using something either in his hair or somewhere
doesnt have to be using computer assistance to cheat necessarily, if someone leaked Magnus's prep would be a much more reasonable example.
@@jacoblacasse-young1495 that’s certainly a possibility but comp assistance more probable… look at the other game with Firouzja, It shows strong signs of assistance… easier to get double computer assistance than getting opening leaks from two different teams
@@jacoblacasse-young1495 That's extremely unlikely.
Hans reminds me of Tal, more of an intuitive attacking player that will take calculated risks. Hikaru bashed on Tal saying that he wasn't impressed with Tal's play too, and Hikaru is judging based on most players at the 2700 level, Hans just reached that level, and he got a little lucky so it's kinda too strict of Hikaru but Hikaru is always strict with players he cares about. Like he bashes on Levy all the time. I don't really think Hikaru insinuated that Hans cheated, but it was misinterpreted by most viewers. A lot of people just like to accuse others of cheating in chess since that happens online often. Hans is a hard worker and gave up his whole life for chess, there's no way he's cheating in top OTB events period.
Exactly. Tal was Magician Hans is Magician and Nakamura is arsehole
He doesn't play like Tal. He plays like Komodo. Lmao. 😂
@@BrandingChangeYep Hikaru never said the word cheater once. He said suspicious when Hikaru didn’t understand why Hans would be at 2700 level with a lower level of analysis. That’s just about his analysis. Even Hikaru confirmed that Magnus didn’t play very accurate in the opening and didn’t understand what Magnus was doing either. Hikaru isn’t sure on anything lol
A lot of it is Hikaru trying to have a sense of humor or exaggerate things, and Hikaru mentioned Hans was nervous 😬 before too.
Just hearing a super GM call someone’s behavior suspicious doesn’t mean they are cheating for sure, it’s naive to assume anything without concrete evidence.
If you can show me a moment where Hikaru says the word “cheater” in any part of the video about Hans then I’ll admit to being wrong.
@@BrandingChangeYep Also you could be like “you look sus and you probably have your head buried 6 ft under the sand” to me, but do I really have my head 6 feet under the sand literally? If I did would I be able to use my phone or computer to reply without suffocating to death? Idk 🤷♂️
We could take anything literally. It’s up to you how literally you wanna take how others behave or just completely accept what they say cuz you respect them.
Take everything with a grain of sand (not enough to drown in)😂
i saw hikaru´s video as well and wasnt impressed at all by him. he was bashing on niemann´s assesment of a position, said it was totally winning for white. then hikaru started laughing and said it was totally winning for black, after a few moments the computer evaluated as -0.4 and thats almost equal. dont get why nobody is talking about that
Hans instantly comes across as completely genuine. Anyone with half a brain can see that.
I was touched by Aronian's wise words. There's no reason a young player can't play well, this is a beautiful part of competition.
The way Hans’ personality is insulted on here is disgusting and clearly shows a mob mentality. I hope self-proclaimed detectives on the internet start to come up with better evidence than “he speaks suspiciously” and ignoring his points
It is really hard to accept his explanations though. Especially when you wax the world champion in a once in a lifetime game. Then you can't remember the lines you looked up that JUST HAPPENED to be the exact game plan Magnus was using and never has before? Occam's Razor concludes that Magnus' team leaked his game prep for whatever reason, and Magnus was not about to get schelacked unfairly by his contemporaries and ruin his back to back world titles.
He was caught cheating online three years ago and admits that he did. That is why people have their doubts now. If he didn't have a history of cheating he wouldn't be under the microscope. If he was some random guy without real aspirations to become one of the best GM's in the world, then fine he cheated move on. But that isn't the case, he just bested the best player in the world. He's innocent until proven guilty with evidence, but people feeling unsure of his validity is on him.
@@templetonbob its literally impossible that he was cheating the only way he could have any unfair advantage is if the opening prep was leaked to him
@@goot8065 it's always possible someone cheated. It's not like they're stripped naked and locked in a glass box. There's plenty of opportunities for someone to cheat it's just a matter of having the balls and preparation to do it.
@@henrymccoy2306 give me one way he could have plausibly cheated
If you play top level chess, good enough to beat magnus, then you simply can't get confused on the lines, else you won't reach even 2700.
Beating magnus is a far cry for anyone who can't remember his lines played years ago, and this happened two days ago - the most important game of his life. His story involving his mother made this game central part of his childhood dream.
And he couldn't even clearly remember the lines.
Agreed, suspicious at least. And somehow hard to trust a guy, who cheated before multiple times.
On the other hand his rise has been meteoric so you could also say that he is simply highly intelligent and like he says more an intuitive player that calulates each position without resorting to theory as much and therefore he not remembering a highly rehearsed move but something that came to him in the moment and he's likely exhausted. I don't know if I do stuff under stress I sometimes have trouble recalling what exactly I did (where the hell did I put my keys?? Happened 10 minutes ago yet they are gone). I'm not saying he didn't cheat but I'm saying it's first of all impossible to prove and second of all there is plenty of reasonable doubt. Even very reasonable doubt. There's a billion reasons he could be bad at describing a game after it happened. Some chess players know all the openings memorize every typical move and they can still loose to a more intelligent player who doesn't know the names of all the openings or has famous games memorised. Yes on average grand masters have remarkable memories but it's not needed if you are smart enough to calculate further than your opponent. There's 10`120 possible games of chess ods are that someone more adept at calculating would on average win somoene who knows all the classic moves by memory, because eventually you'll come across a game that you've never seen before, which is the case here.
So TLDR I think there is plenty of reasonable doubt and if he did not cheat he is one of the brightest new players in chess and to ruin his reputation with that with a tweet is not the right thing to do. You tell the organisers I think he cheated, they implement additional security and then keep playing. If he wins under the higher security, well he's clearly very talented. If he's caught well that proves that he's a cheater and was capable of pulling it off. Magnus should have done this all privately. Because IF he is wrong he did a terrible thing.
Oh and Magnus playing an opening he never did before actually doesn't just put his opponent at a disadvantage but actually himself too. He now had to rely purely on his ability to calculate rather then his repertoire of thousands of games he can remember and his experience. If Hans is a natural at calculating that may have evened the ods. And he certainly wouldn't be the first young player with an extraordinary IQ.
But why Hans didn't said in the interview after beating Magnus the story that he made here about the catalan, transposition and so on, intead of saying "I check this line this morning miracously untill move 25 and I don't even know why".. haha come on, total cheater. Take a look at Hans game vs GM Sandro Mareco at the Capablanca Memorial a few months ago and tell me that this is not cheating.. You don't beat an experienced 2672 GM just like that.. and basically won almost all the games in a very strong tournament, this is absolutely cheating. You can tell that he would do anything to prove the world wrong about he being a cheater, even if that involves more cheating. I mean, get a job pal, go to college.. He needs to be banned or he never will stop cheating.
(Sorry for having bad english)
You're a 🤡 just like Hans
Up to now I do not see any Hans scandal, I see only Magnus scandal
Watching Hann's ramble in the last past reminds me of Andy Kaufmann. I think Carlsen is the one in the wrong here.
7:55 Interviewer decides to put on glasses and interview himself.
But how can he cheat in physical chess? I doubt him at the start but in chess is too hard to hold the lie for too long. Thats why now I think he may actually be a really good player that got into Magnus head. Which is crazy because I had Magnus like a God of chess.
The technical side is not an issue. You only need to communicate a few bits. A tiny chip with a wifi connection anywhere under your clothing that gently vibrates in a binary signal is enough to do it. (And what does it mean "it's hard to lie for too long?" If he did lie, do you expect him to admit it and voluntarily end his career forever?)
@@siIverspawn
..no the point is that there IS NO EVIDENCE so game over, you can’t go around accusing people without evidence, actual evidence, not circumstantial evidence that is open to interpretation, that’s why we have court systems….otherwise it’s witch hunting like MVL said in an interview
he said he just happened to prep for the opening lines that Magnus played....an opening that Magnus has never used so how could Han's prep for it....unless someone on Magnus's team leaked the info to Hans
@@siIverspawn No way, if he has anything it's unlikely it's in his clothing, it would have to be bodily to get past the detection equipment, that's my opinion, hence why other GMs have said jokingly, it could be sex beads
Is Magnus becoming another Fischer? Gave up championship and now withdraws from this event. Is he having some internal turmoil that will propel him on a trajectory like Fischer?
I doubt it. But we'll have to wait and see.
..yes probably. He will play less and less now you’ll see, especially with this rash move he made following him around
Hans was literally watching physical film for chess, studying magnus' mannerisms even
has hikaru reacted to hans final interview yet?
yep
@@colorwrld4867 He didn't
I'm sure drama queen will have some kind of comment.
yeah he says he and magnus have nothing to do with chesscoms decision to ban him, it's a private company and he also doesn't think hes guilty since he just laid out that he thinks magnus thinks hans is cheating, which literally everyone thinks so it's not an absurd comment but yeah
@@veni1 Hikaru strongly insinuated that he thought Hans was cheating
Ferdinand plebie here, a chessplayer, took up investigation course in 2020. I think there is no probable cause of accusing Gm heimann of cheating, a mere thought or suspicion of magnus is not enough. Its unfair for Gm heimann to be treated like that.
heimann huh
..yes I agree, Magnus needs to apologise quickly
Is there anywhere that a full, un-edited video of the match exists? Would love to see that if someone has a link. Thanks!
Hey Naka, he said he doesn't know exactly at what point the move qh4 is playable. That's why he asked what the engine says and followed by 'no not here'
Which chess player who beats a world champion doesn’t know that move by heart?
@@googooboyy All of them?
I never noticed hans was wearing a watch before.
You never had time.
He is too much nervous and too little happy after the win
wow Magnus has a lot of power over the Chess world. This young guy is really good and of course he works a lot harder than the world champions. He is way more hungry than Magnus. I hope he is successful suing the fk out of Magnus and all those who are accusing him with no evidence.
Some of the moves Hans made against Carlsen under the ticking clock are so inhuman and artificial that only Fritz 18 may find them. Carlsen was so shocked at these moves that he left the tournament in disgust.
If MVL says he doesn’t have enough evidence how can you?
I doubt you could tell the difference between a computer game and a grandmaster game.
Give it up dude. Just admit you were wrong.
Several GMs have already come forward and stated that as per how the game went, there was nothing really sus about it. A peculiar line? Yes, but luckily for us, that happens all the time in chess !
I am sticking with the simple solution...Magnus couldn't take the loss and the subsequent trashing...and made a complete scandal out of nothing...
cope, magnus is a sore loser
What an absolute chad of a thumbnail xD
great video but you missed quite a few things that hikaru said about Hans's analysis being bad. I want to know if other top players agree if any of them looks at it. Here's your idea for the next video I guess.
Thanks for making this. Whole thing is absolutely crazy. Am I the only one who thinks Hans is bit Arrogant here?
"He must be embarrassed to be beaten by an idiot like me"
"Atleast I got to beat him before he left"
What a Legend 🤣🔥
Innocent until proven guilty.
He will never reach the heights magnus has reached
How does being a dick make you a legend? Rather sad people in America.
@@blank003 Magnus is destroying his legacy damn quick though. Withdrawing from a round robin is a huge dick move. He's on some bobby fischer trajectory, going insane faster rather than slower
@@user-zb8tq5pr4x Hans is a known cheater , Magnus is not wrong to suspect him
@@blank003 You have to be proven of every crime bro.
Great compilation 👍
OK, as far as I understand Hans has made bad moves, good moves and very good moves. But none of them looks like cheating. Also, everyone was interviewed, but NOT Magnus. If there's something to say, Magnus should say it. If he doesn't say anything, he simply lost the game against Hans and that was it.
According to lichess analysis, Hans made 2 mistakes and he also made them when he was winning so he was never on trouble.
Lichess chat analyzed the game during the broadcast and Hans played like within the top 5 moves for majority of the game. Its suspicious but nothing concrete at this level.
Meanwhile, Magnus made a blunder during the end game which cost him the game.
My take is he played close to a perfect game which is kinda suspicious, but I wouldnt crucify him without definite proof.
@@detectivemarkseven It's not suspicious *at all* to play a close-to-perfect game once in a while, especially for a GM. "top 5 moves for majority of the game" is not even impressive, and not even "close-to-perfect". The dataset is very highly insufficient to make any claim, but his playing to this point is consistent with what we would expect from a highly skilled GM making a good tournament, nothing more. He also did a few blunders that allowed his opponent to draw when he was actually winning which is inconsistent with someone cheating. Not only he shouldn't be "crucified", but he should not even be accused without proofs the way he was.
@@Madinko12 Well from Lichess chat theres a chess master there that said he played near perfectly. And the consensus I got from there is that his play was suspicious but nothing concrete.
So why dont you "chess experts" discuss together so we can know who's right or wrong?
@@Madinko12 completely agree that playing the top five move is far from perfect.
@@detectivemarkseven I have definitely played top 5 moves for a majority of games so I must be quite good.
Nice, i saw every single video, but its cool to have it in one place and right order, thx!!👍😀
Also.... Magnus is not just a decent chess player. He is GENIUS territory. So if he says something is fishy, then something is fishy. And Hikaru seems to agree.
..so by you’re ‘reasoning’ if Magnus says the earth is flat then it must be flat cuz he’s a genius right? We don’t need evidence because he is infallible and a genius. Do you really think like that, I’ll bet you got all of your shots and boosters
He literally didn't say anything and that's a problem because whole internet is attacking 19 year old kid. Hikaru is literally farming drama for content and money. Stop idolizing Magnus, everyone can make mistake.
@@cdunne1620 Sorry to burst your bubble but when it comes to chess, yes
@@cdunne1620 What in the fuck are you talking about, idiot? Magnus is an authority on chess, not the shape of the earth. Your argument is fucking idiotic
How would someone cheat? Morse code from the bunghole?
Honestly, didn't believe he cheated until I saw the interview. From my perspective it seems as if Hans is showing duping smile. Also it is rare for someone who is not guilty to defend themselves intensely. I would still say that without evidence he should not be punished in any way.
I'm sure Hans is going to hang that score sheet on his wall like a great trophy.
They _both_ deserved it. :D
I dont watch chess often, but these accusations are a bit weird, in post analysis games everyone calls out some weird lanes, and then some are big ass blunders when engine instantly says it and they recognize it then, Hikaru does this too. Maybe the guy was very nervous in interview and his memory was a bit scrambled. I wonder if everyone had to call out lines and analyze games without engine as they are used to, how good they would do it then.
He had ALREADY ADMITTED TO and BEEN BANNED for cheating online. This is not an innocent guy. Sure, it MIGHT be possible in this game that he didn't cheat but, really, how can one be sure? I'm a good 600 pts. below Carlsen and I'm telling you Qh4 is NEVER a move to even mention. It just drops a piece. He's desperately trying to sound like he knows what he's talking about and he claims to have prepared a line against Carlsen that Carlsen has NEVER PLAYED IN HIS LIFE. If he didn't cheat he's doing everything to try and look like he did. Maybe it's next level trolling or something.
@@paulpena5040 solid 600 ey? 😂😂😂😂
@@paulpena5040 You can't be sure, but it's not his job to prove he wasn't cheating. It's impossible to prove anyone wasn't cheating. You can't prove that Magnus hasn't been cheating his entire career. But that's not his job to disprove. If you make a claim someone cheated, YOU have to prove it.
@@jameshunt6381 I said 600 pts below Carlsen around 2300 FIDE
@@user-zb8tq5pr4x Well technically Carlsen hasn't said ANYTHING other than that cheesy video. But of course you have to give the benefit of the doubt to Hans for now.
2:35 - 2:40 Doesnt that look like he's adjusting/removing some kind of earpiece?
and the mic picks up a clicking noise..
12:40 he tucks something under his collar no?
I beleive hans.I think that the world jumping on him was shameful.
..absolutely agree. Magnus and Hikaru should publicly apologise but I can’t see that happening. Hans probably even has grounds to sue them I’d say
@@cdunne1620 apology for what?
He was a cheater before so it’s obvious people will suspect him