Nope they're not that honest or heroic ... just look at the way they answer the first question of whether they think SA is guilty, he started by saying it does not matter whether he thinks if SA is guilty. That is the first indication that they're only in this out of trying to exploit the loopholes in how the investigation works in order to get SA off the hook regardless of whether they truely believe he's guilty. Sure, he said "probably innocent" but thats only after realising that it looks bad on him to say what he said earlier on ... Crooked lawyers in my opinions ...
Why did these 2 jokers not act on the pre-trial evidence that Pam sturm, the infamous RAV4 finder, stated the RAV4 she says she located in the avery salvage yard was a 2 DOOR ! And BLUE! Even Avery’s lawyer dude by name of LOY, asked pammy “ 2 door?” And she says yes.......for those late to the party....TH’s RAV4 was green and a 4 door! From that find by pammy, LE got a warrant against SA to check out his residence.. cute part, was that LE would say that the RAV4 matched vin number. Again, n pre-trial, the cop remicker stated under oath “ the vin looked tampered with”......
88feji completely agree, although it’s maybe harsh calling them “crooked lawyers”. They just do their job. However, I do agree they answer questions like politicians. If they were 100% honest, I think they’d admit there’s barely a cat in hell’s chance that Avery’s innocent! Actually, they’d even have to admit that “guilty” was the correct verdict!
Excellent interview with excellent lawyers. You do not find lawyers like Dean Strang in this world any longer. His morals and ethics are above reproach.
They neglected to do their job as well as they should/could, they lost and Avery gone for life... Fantastic... wonder if YOU would think the same if it was you who should sit and wait for a real pitbull with balls (Zellner) who can safe his ass.... They didnt present the case and evidence as they should... simple as that
Disagree. They had several opportunities to call for a mistrial. They were paid nearly 1/4 of a million dollars yet didn't hire any expert witnesses. I've heard them state that the bones found on Steven Averys property were Teresa's yet that has not been determined because the county medical examiner was not allowed on the property. That is illegal. That's why on her death certificate the cause of death is unknown. It really makes me sick that every person who was involved in this doc made $$$ except for the 2 innocent men who sit behind bars. Ken Kratzs sick press conference should have been enough for a change of venue and mis-trial.
I don't understand how they dropped the charges of kidnapping , and sexual assault for Steve Avery because there was no evidence of her being in the trailer that's why they didn't use Brandon's testimony but yet they convict the kid on a rape charge in his case with no DNA evidence of him or the victim being there
Nature Boy good point . There is no way that what the prosecution say happen in that trailer could have happened without leaving any dna evidence at all .NO WAY ON EARTH COULD SOMEONE CLEANE THAT SPACE WITHOUT LEAVING ANYTHING !!
I live in Australia and I stumbled across this series on Netflix and have to say I cannot believe what I was watching. This series was not just a fun television show with intrigue, I was memorised by real life interactions of lawyers, clients and understanding the great work that good lawyers do to the best of their knowledge in the pursuit of truth and justice. I could not believe the injustices being committed by the Prosecution, not only at a local level but all the way to the top in the Wisconsin judicial system. I was so intrigued by the level of intelligence Steven's lawyer Kathleen was able to attack the evidence produced by the Prosecution. By the way these 2 lawyers Dean and Jerry did the best they could with the resources they must have had at the time and I for one could not believe the verdict was guilty when the doubt that was planted by these 2 lawyers was enough to say beyond reasonable doubt, the verdict should have been "not guilty". I really did believe I was going to see the ending of this whole awful story at the end of Part 2 but could not believe it ended where it did. At least Kathleen was able to look into other people of interests that needed to be looked at. The tragedy is that the real killer would have had a better chance of being caught, much earlier in this story, had the focus been on more than just ONE person. That's the real tragedy. I will have to keep searching for the up to date information regarding this case because I want to see justice served with truth and those in the Police department who have made an absolute mess and miscarriage of justice, get what they truly deserve. To Dean and Jerry we say thank you for the great work you both continue to do in pursuit of justice in this truly very extraordinary case.
Yes you are so right ! ALL OF HIS LAWYERS - THESE 2 ,AND KATHLEEN-- ARE ABSOLUTLY AMAZING !!! THEY ALL WORKED SO HARD, SO HONESTLY ,AND STILL A STUPID(!!!!) " JUDGE"-- AND JURY MADE HORRIBLE VERDICT , UNBELIVABLE !! AND KEN K- THE CREEPY SNAKE OF A " PROSECUTER"- MADE ME SO ANGRY ,AND DO YOU KNOW - THAT HE SEXUALY HARRESED WOMEN FOR YEARS !! HE CALLED STEVEN A RAPIST ?? HE IS THE RAPIST ! AND WHY ISNT HE IN JAIL ???? SO MUCH INJUSTICE YOU CANT BELIVE THAT EVEN NOW IN 2022 IT IS HAPPANING ,WE ALL SHOULD UNITE AGAINST IT
Although they have been criticized for doing a tour; I think this is a great opportunity to bring about change to our justice system. I think these two men did the best that the could at the time the trial. I still find them very admirable and honest. Hopefully the discussion will continue and change will come about due to the documentary and subsequent discussions. I really hope that we will soon see Steven and Brendan free.
hopefully that change will come. this documentary came out at just about the same time prof. james duane launched his book, you have the right to remain innocent. our book, stack the legal odds in your favor, was the first of its kind and launched 6 months earlier. www.stloiyf.com/blog
Beverley Lumb I think the difference is ...is that most people think he’s innocent, so the victims family aren’t given as much thought as if everyone thought he was guilty....
I trust these people as human beings a lot more than the prosecutor, sheriff and the two detectives and officers. They are so much more normal as human beings, overall.
So he scrubbed down the garage where she was supposedly killed so well that none of her DNA was found in the garage, but then he turns around and leaves his blood in her car..?
This is the most serious hole in their story. I wonder all the time why the prosecutors weren’t forced to explain this. They didn’t even try to change their story to say he killed her outside. Instead they insist he raped and killed her in the house and garage which lack any traces of human blood and Teresa’s DNA. But the car has large brushstrokes of Stevens blood.
Exactly. Steven is smart enough to wipe down all the dna from the garage, and on top of that he wiped down all brendans dna in his trailer also. In which the cop said "they had a lot of time to do so". Hes smart enough to do all that, but leaves her bones and her car in his front yard? Lmao.
I never realized that a judge legislated from the appellate court bench and changed the case law to accommodate the prosecution of Steven Avery. The judge made it so 1 motive,2 opportunity,3 access are necessary elements to raise the defense that someone else did it instead of just one of the three elements. This is outrageous!
Don Emigholz Jr. 36 million reasons why they’d frame him again, and 36 million reasons why SA wouldn’t risk doing anything to put his liberty in jeopardy. Just doesn’t make sense. The insurance wasn’t going to cover the 36 million to be paid, so Colburn and Lenk, the officers on the scene in the Halbach search, would have been personally liable along with the county!
Forget denny. I just wonder why no one on the defense team thought to let the jury know that SA was first brought in on felony possession charges (of a firearm) Having been exonerated for the 1985 rape and attempted murder he sat in prison for 18 of the 32 year sentence... What felony was he responsible for that would have made arresting him directly before the vehicle (supposedly matching the description of the missing woman ((TH)) was "found" on the outside perimeter of the Avery property? He wasn't guilty of that charge, and the . 22 LE claimed later, (after BD's entirely coerced confession,) to have been used to shoot TH in the head 10 times wasn't even SA's gun. It belonged to the owner of the trailer that Jodi and SA were renting from him. He's the one who said on the witness stand that he'd fired that gun on the Avery property 10s of thousands of times, shooting gophers and rabbits. But even if the trailers owner hadn't owned the gun LE claimed belonged to SA, they still could not have arrested SA on charges of possession of a firearm by a felon. Steven Avery wasn't a felon for what happened in 1985. He was a victim. And the state of Wisconsin knew that.
He was a felon from a previous charge before they framed him for rape he didn't do. I don't think he should be in prison but he was a felon when charged with the gun. But it's an absolute disgrace this man is in prison. It clearly states he must be found guilty beyond reasonable doubt, for me, there are way too many doubts, to be able to put a man in prison until he dies. Steven Avery has never stood a chance in this life, and it's just a shame that they dragged his poor nephew into it too. He cant get out till hes 59 at the earliest but to do that he has to admit his guilt, which means he probably will never get out. Why do the courts, all over the world not just the US, never admit they might be wrong unless they really have to. Sure there was evidence in 1995 that could've exonerated Avery but they let him rot for another 8 years before they finally admitted it,because they had to. This whole case makes me sick,thinking about it, his parents will be gone soon and he should have been with them... just shocking, and that kratz guy looks and talks like a snake and he was found out for the type of man he is.
I don't know, man... all seems so weird. I don't think it was the ex bf because why he would do it years after break up in the middle of day and such. Either it was Bobby, Scott or somebody strange. I think it was Scott though honestly. He hated Steven. He was probably jealous a lot about money and fame he had. They had no relation ship. Somebody who knew that there will be a girl on his property and the magazine will know the trace where Teresa is. It's very weird. He went hunting right after he got home. Nobody saw him all day. Only Bobby which was clearly forced to testified what police told him to because of that porn he had. Scott is definitely the biggest suspect. He had all afternoon. He had access to the property. Police just framed Steven
This case shouldn't have ever went before a judge or jury of Manitowoc county. Manitowoc county OFFICIALS were not to be involved in any way shape or form .....Therefore I ask ; WHY HAS THIS NOT BEEN ADDRESSED BY THE SUPREME OR APPELET COURTS ???????????????????? Furthermore , the issue pertaining to the official coroner being threatened of her life and being arrested if she even tried to enter in any way into this
Motive. If Barbara was trying to sell her van then Bobby and/ or Scott probably knew that Theresa was coming over that day. Maybe? Edit: What made the whole thing even more difficult for lawyers is that they have to contend with practically ALL the Averys kids and grandkids LYING to some degree at some point. Its extraordinary!
I think the best evidence that he was set up was the trucker who saw her car. We now know that the trucker told the cop that he saw her car on the side of the road. The cop then proceeded to check it out. He called in the license plate number (because he was behind the vehicle) but never said it as being found. Why would you not let everyone know you found the car? And how did the car end up on stevens property when it was on the side of the road? There is nothing that explains that. I think the cop found her body, already burned, and her car, and tried to pin it on steven. Because we already know he has something against steven because of the fact that he never looked into weather steven was innocent or not the first time around, after he received a phone call from a detective telling him that they had the wrong guy, he did nothing. Which shows you that he really didnt want steven to be freed. He wanted him in prison. There are so many things that dont add up. Not to mention that the fact that his bonfire sight was not the main burning site. It couldn't have been because they couldn't have kept the fire hot enough to burn a body to the extent it was burnt. Impossible. And then bobbys computer history, searching up dead bodies of women, and tons of other crazy shit. Makes him my number one suspect. He leaves 20 seconds after she leaves. Hes the most logical person who would have done this. What a travesty of justice. Im not sure if steven did it or not, because the blood in the car really makes me question it, but the blood couldn't have been directly from steven because the car was on the side of the road not his property. Which makes me think that it was planted. How is stevens blood going to end up on a vehicle that was on the side of the road? And if his blood was already in the vehicle when the cop found it, then the planting of the vehicle would make no sense to do seeing as the cops would already have the blood placing steven in her car, implicating him, without having to plant the car on his property. Which means the blood and the car were definitely planted back on his property. Thats the only thing that makes sense when you consider the fact that the police officer had found the car on the side of the road. Which we know happened because he was told it was there and called it in.
Bobby does fit, and it explains why he testified against his own uncle as well. The blood in the Rav, I'm pretty sure was planted. Not from the test tube but from the blood on his sink when his cut reopened. He said he never cleaned the blood up but it was gone when he woke up the next morning. Also, the DNA on the hood latch is ridiculous. No fingerprints left on the latch or anywhere else around the hood prop, only "sweat", which is not even scientifically possible to retrieve DNA from. This entire case blows my mind, these "intelligent" people are accepting this bullshit. Then again, I believe the Manitowoc police are corrupt enough to kill Teresa themselves to have the lawsuit against them dropped, which would ultimately ruin their reputations, lose their careers and possibly expose them as a sex trafficking ring, that the entire state is riddled with.. so they set this up, blackmail Bobby, with his morbid curiosity, to testify against his uncle and plant evidence because of his access. Just my thoughts..
Didn't matter what jury you had, anyone on the jury was scared to death to say innocent, They were thinking if the police did this to him imagine what they will do to me. End of story!!!
What great sincere guys. One thing I would like to ask them is why they didn’t amalgamate with Brendan’s lawyers…to get them tried jointly…that way, a lot of the stuff that wasn’t allowed to be presented in court could have been…? My guess is, Kratz played the two sides against each other. In hindsight, surely they should have shared information and joined forces.
re Brendan , in the UK a youth or a vulnerable person being interviewed by the police would have to have an independent 'appropriate adult' sit in during the interview to ensure that the person was not oppressed during the interview. otherwise the interview would likely be excluded from evidence. there are also protocols on how the police are allowed to question defendants to prevent false admissions by the defendant. there are also rules in things that lawyers are allowed to say in court, for example a prosecutor would not be allowed to suggest to a jury that if they acquit then they are saying the police murdered the victim. the investigation in their case was poor. there was a clear conflict of interest that should have prevented a number of the local officers having anything to do with the case. Justice must be seen to be done, otherwise it is undermined. even if the police officers acted correctly throughout, the evidence is nethertheless tainted by the suspicion due to their conflict of interest.
If his lawyer (court appointed) hadn't been working for the prosecution, he would of had that confession thrown out. On the grounds that a parent or council wasn't present. This is an example of the absolute worse of our justice system.
These guys may not be as successful as KZ,but are incredibly smarter and intellectual..they clearly indirectly show that evidence does point to SA guilt as much as his innocence but the real question is the unjust trial he got..love the way Dean strang answered that first question and the way buting whopped KK ass on Dr phil
They tried their best.Steve Avery is not their family, they have their own kids and family and career to think about as well. It is NOT at all easy to believe SA is innocent.Their is insane amount of circumstantial evidence backing up his guilt, you dont even have to go deep into foresnic. So my point is, just like these 2 lawyers, and even myself, a lot of people believe SA was probably guilty( you can see everytime Dean and Jerry are asked question if they are convined SA is innocent, every single time they give an indirect answer), but should not have been convicted becaus eof so much conflicting evidence. That is why they moved on, they cannot spend their whole lives trying to free a man who is 50% chance easily guilty. For them, its not about SA's innocence or guilt.It was about that unfair conviction.
I'm not saying he's innocent, however there is a MASSSSSSSSIVE conflict of interest getting the Manitowoc PD involved in the case and jury that should've made it null and void off the jump. He deserves a FAIR trial without the meddling of that shady ass police department.
The main problem in justice system is the jury idea imho; you educate people for years to become lawyers, judges etc then you try to pick the cherries on the road so that they can interpret such sophisticated mind processing. Why dont we create another profession called jurorship and make sure these people understand what they are looking into? If you watch the documentary they mention they started with 7 vote as not guilty and then somehow manipulated to a guilty decision. You can never be sure with ordinary people what outcome will be there...
The only relevant questions for me are? 1 Did the police plant evidence and fabricate evidence? 2 Was the judge in Avery and Dassey trial acting criminally or violating the judicial cannons of conduct? 3 Was the prosecutor withholding exculpatory evidence? 4 Was the Dassey confession coerced? 5 Did the crime lab technician commit misconduct when it made a special exception to admit dna that was tainted when it never had ever done that before? I have reason to believe and do believe that the answer is yes to all five points. This is no longer about Steven Avery for me its about government corruption because this means no one is safe from prosecution even if only one of my abridged points were true.Federal prosecutors have prevailed on government corruption complaints on a lot less evidence then has been accrued thus far in the Avery and Dassey trials. The Federal government has enough evidence against most of the public officials involved to put them behind bars but so far the political will for righting this wrong is not there which may point or alert the public that the Fed is also likely corrupted.
no one is safe from prosecution *_if_* s/he hasn't been properly protected beforehand. amzn.to/2UtWIbD and amzn.to/3dIQUCM are like kryptonite to the real criminals-that is, those running the world’s largest crime syndicate we call the US legal system. www.stloiyf.com/blog
Mark Str8 to me it seemed like the judge was working more for the prosecution....there was some evidence and circumstance that he just would not let the jury hear...that might have changed their minds.....
Remember when police come to talk to you for any reason exercise your right to be silent, and say you will be in touch with your lawyer. They will say it's a copout but its your right just like it's not against the law for cops to lie to you. Take back our judicial system by reading the constitution and hold every government employee accountable. Call your mayor, congressman, senator Carsey copy all emails and voice messages text messages to them. Yup surprised how much respect you get in a courtroom
Wow this is the best interview by state media I have seen excluding the incest comment which I believe to be a vocabulary mistake but overall out standing interview.
You're naivety makes me laugh ... these lawyers are defending SA for publicity and basking in the popularity of the documentary, they don't really think SA is innocent, you can tell by the way they answer the first question ...
@@88feji Thats normal. No lawyer ever knows the exact truth of what happened, only what their client and the evidence tells them. A defense lawyers job is to hold the prosecution accountable to prove guilt, because in the United States the default starting point is the presumption of innocence until adequate proof of guilt is presented.
Yes, I believe their hearts where in the right place but Katherine has found lots thar they missed. Granted the Judge was completely against them from the get go
They should have requested the change of venue.... the only argument the state could made in rebuttal would be to say that that whole state has been so utterly polluted that Avery wouldn't get a fair trial no matter where they moved it to. The reasons they just gave for not having made the request are things they should have forced the state into saying.
This interview is 7 years old. Dean Strang should be asked that same question again, today. It's the right question indeed, and Dean saying ' he probably is innocent ' tends to suggest Dean had doubts, so ask that same question again, now based òn newly discovered evidence, the State's record for Bradey violations and breaches of Wisconsin statutes.
The blood smears looked like it was put on with a swab and the fact that there was not a trace of dna found in trailer you can not tell me you can clean such a place totally there is always something somewhere and you could tell if cleaning solution was used I can’t get blood out of everything
I think they forgot most of Northwest Wisconsin. I don't recall hearing anything about this case. Why do you think Ken Kratz tried to operate a law office up here? If it wasn't for the Netflix show we would have not known who he was. They would have got a fair trial here.
Whoever killed Theresa knew the passcode to her voicemail... they were able to go into her phone and erase voicemails that most likely came from that person..This was terrible, Steve was about to get a huge settlement and manitwoc county should definitely be ashamed for this scandal... This shows you how society don’t give a shit about nobody, they had An agenda for Avery and it’s to make sure they don’t ever pay him a single dime that he earned from 18years of wrongful imprisonment...
"it's very rare for the police to say 'i know this guy is innocent, or i believe he is innocent, but i'm going to frame him anyway'." i'm not so sure we can say these days here in amerika that it's very rare. nonetheless, these guys are good lawyers. the only place where mr. buting was incorrect is when he said that most people experience the courts as a result of criminal charges. the most frequent cases are traffic (54%) with criminal second (20%), and the system thus generating its own work nearly 3/4 of the time! www.stloiyf.com/blog
But in this case they didn’t care that Steven was innocent,they wanted to get Steven because of the law suite and the only way was to plant evidence and lie ,and then drag his poor innocent nephew into it ,so they could convict Steven .they should all be in jail especially coulburn n lenk and vile kratz .
Andres F Martinez, Robert M Fabian Jnr, James J Kennedy , Scott Tadych, Charles Avery, Earl Avery, Bryan Dassey, Bobby Dassey, Brendan Dassey and Blaine Dassey
4:30 If the criminal justice system operates under "BEYOND A REASONABLE DOUBT" then there is no logical explanation as to why a defense team can't put forward any crackhead theory they want, much like the prosecution did.
15:50 Amen to that!! Go on down to your local "Bust up your family" court. See how productive men are rewarded for choosing marriage and or fathering children. Don't get married or have kids in Wisconsin. Move to a 3rd world country if you want to have kids. F that country before it F's you is what I tell my sons. 5 kids from 3 baby daddies and a check from each thanks to those family courts.
Dean Strang looks like that guy from How I Met Your Mother who was at Marshall and Lilys wedding and was obviously wearing a toupee that Ted was stealing so he could give it to Marshall after he shaved his head.
Why didn't they use luminol to see if it matches what happened or not in the bed room and shop if they were so sure all that stabbing, cutting and shooting took place there?
That was why they did not want the tail light of Teresa's car to be given for scientific analysis to Kathleen Zelner ( not sure about her surname). That would lead them to the Police.
If you read further down the page, the blanked out area could be because this statement was said by Mark Str8 "Wow this is the best interview by state media I have seen excluding the incest comment which I believe to be a vocabulary mistake but overall out standing interview".
Dean and Jerry conduct themselves exquisitely, i applaud their dedication and sincere loyalty to Steven Avery, even after the bullshit and grossly apparent, fabricated case MANITOWOC COUNTY AND ITS ENTIRE INFECTED, INCESTUOUS, LEGAL GANG projected into the court. I go back to the parents of both Teresa & Steven, their lives and those of their lost loved ones will never be remembered the same. This case is continuing to hunt lives , and its ramifications out there, for all the world to witness. MANITOWOC POLICE AND LEGAL TEAMS would have to be in a chilling state of denial about what will eventually happen, when their lies laid out with undeniable evidence that disputes everything, i hope their anxiety eats them alive to be completely frank about it.
I really think that it was Stevens Brother and /or the ex boyfriend and the cops were so pissed that they screwed up 18years earlier that they had to convict him for this. Not saying the guy is an angel but I think that he was done a serious injustice.
Any lawyer that "seems" to be telling the genuine truth is as close to the truth as it gets... therefore most likely this is the extremely rare case of lawyers speaking facts.
These are two fantastic lawyers but they didn’t know what they were up against. They knew each piece of evidence the key, the blood, and dna on the hood latch, the bones, the bullet, the way it was all found was suspicious. They questioned Colborn on finding the car on the 4th. Kathleen has been able to actually prove why the evidence doesn’t make any sense. The only problem is Brendan’s detailed story. Yes everyone says his confession is false. But it’s so detailed it’s hard to not believe if you watch the whole thing. So there is something off. I believe they got it extremely wrong cause they weren’t seeking the truth. The we’re seeking to lock Avery up. Which is unfair to the victim and her family. Cause now so many people are living with this 14 years later still. If the cops investigated it the right way even if they are guilty the victim and her family could have gotten peace a long time ago. But Colborn should be held accountable for lying about the car regardless. There is audio of him finding the car and a witness to prove it. Idk why that hasn’t happened yet. That already proves the car was moved on to the Avery property. The fact that alone is ignored is beyond crazy.
Can somebody please help Steven Avery he is innocent .He was set up by the police .The police are corrupt there . Surely somebody can take on his case and help him .
They are genuine and extremely intelligent. I think they gave a fair defense. I feel bad for all involved. Question: do you think if Avery got a new trial with a new jury he would be found not guilty?
The way to interpret these shady lawyers is as follows? Dean Strang is asked a very good question, one that all viewers are interested in and anyone that is interested in justice should be interested in. The moderator asks, "Are you convinced Dean, that Steven Avery is innocent?" Dean Strang answers like this? "I'm convinced that's the wrong question." Hold it right there! It's the wrong question for Dean Strang, but not the wrong question for the public who want to know whether or not Steven Avery is guilty of the crime. But hold on at 0:17 Dean Strang continues with his answer... " I have my own personal view which really doesn't matter in the end." Hold on again! WAIT! You, Dean Strang, the leading defense lawyer on this exact case are saying that your personal opinion doesn't matter? Of course it matters. You've sat through all the evidence and more that was shown at trial and argued for reasonable doubt for Steven Avery. Of course your opinion matters! But wait, Dean Strang is not finished... " that he probably is innocent." The way Dean Strang answers this is very telling... Here you have the #1 defense supporter of Steven Avery using a qualifier on Steven Avery's innocence. The qualifier comes in the form of the adverb, "probably". Saying "probably is innocent" is a problem when you are the #1 supporter of Steven Avery's innocence. Probably is like saying, most likely, but definitely not equating his innocence with 100% certainty. The way to look at this is from the prosecution's point of view. What if the prosecutor said Steven Avery is "probably" guilty, but we don't know for sure. That wouldn't wash, would it? The only way for these lawyers to keep the con game going of innocence, is to flat out say they are convinced of Steven Avery's innocence, which Buting actually does. But Strang??? Not so much. So, in Dean Strang's world of words, "probably" means "definitely not" . And anyone that looks at his response can see through his facade of words and realize Dean Strang thinks Steven Avery is GUILTY OF MURDER.
The law needs to change so that prosecutors will go to jail for falsifying or misleading a jury. Such as kratz sending CDs and labeling them to the WRONG owner. Also law MUST change to stop these bloody press conferences BEFORE the trial, naming the suspect and giving details of the alleged crime. I'm amazed this is even permitted. How the hell can anyone get a fair trial with this pantomime going on? It makes a mockery of innocent until proven guilty. The state already declared him guilty before the trial. Trial by jury ONLY works if they hear the FULL story and see the FULL evidence. That's where the funding comes in. I also dont think expert witnesses should be permitted to get paid for testimony. That may level the field a bit for defense. I'm still not sure if avery is guilty of anything. But, I have doubts. That's enough to acquit. There are MOST DEFINITELY a TRUCK LOAD of questions for the police to answer. I'd make them answer. There is EVIDENCE that she DID leave the property. That in itself doesnt mean one of the family isnt responsible but it DOES mean the prosecutions story is completely TITS UP. He should have had a trial with a jury shipped in from another state. And the whole investigation should be considered unsafe due to a very very clear conflict of interests by the county police who should have stayed 20 miles away. This has done the state no favoyrs at all. He needs a new trial. Only other thing I'll add. He has never acted like he has anything to hide. Hes welcomed every test going. So if he is guilty, it's an oscar winning performance. I'm not sure anyone's that good for that long. Ince you eliminate the impossible, whatever is left, no matter how improbable, MUST be the truth. I think Zellner will get there. But his parents may not live to see it. 😥
There are still some things that I don't fully understand... why did Steven say to his relatives that Teresa never showed up? Then later said he "saw her out the window taking photos", and he "never talked with her", then a while later he said there was a brief exchange during the payment, then he said she also went inside Also, it was Steven's suggestion to sell Barb's van, and Barb didn't really wanna, but Steven went on with it anyway, while it was *her* car. Later he called AutoTrader to ask for the same girl as last time and didn't mention his own name, instead he used the name Barb Janda.
Joost B. The MCSD framed a guilty man. That’s why. I do not believe for a second that Avery is innocent. But I do believe the MCSD planted evidence and coerced Brenden.
Focus RR, if he did it, what's the point in planting evidence? A good investigation would prove he did, wouldn't it? Not to mention, planting evidence is illegal. If the Manitowoc county police are willing to commit that crime, what makes you think they couldn't do worse? And let's not forget the fact that they sent him to prison for 18 years, for a rape and attempted murder he DID NOT commit, based on a sketch that was purposely made to look like him and a coerced identification from the woman. No actual evidence. They have been out to get him for a long time and when they failed the first time, he took action that would have ruined them, they had to stop him somehow.
I think avery’s innocence is questionable but I personally don’t think dassey was guilty or involved if someone did frame Avery that wasn’t law enforcement for example they’d have to be very smart however I have been harassed personally by law enforcement one or two cops becoming obsessed with me and trying to get me by any means for something I was innocent of so I know what it’s like and the theory Avery was framed anything is possible
So sorry for the state to try and build a case against Steven Avery and they're failing because the facts r fabricated against them.. let the averyes go and end their suffering
these guys are probably the most honest lawyers that I've ever seen in the media. way to represent!
Nope they're not that honest or heroic ... just look at the way they answer the first question of whether they think SA is guilty, he started by saying it does not matter whether he thinks if SA is guilty. That is the first indication that they're only in this out of trying to exploit the loopholes in how the investigation works in order to get SA off the hook regardless of whether they truely believe he's guilty. Sure, he said "probably innocent" but thats only after realising that it looks bad on him to say what he said earlier on ...
Crooked lawyers in my opinions ...
Why did these 2 jokers not act on the pre-trial evidence that Pam sturm, the infamous RAV4 finder, stated the RAV4 she says she located in the avery salvage yard was a 2 DOOR ! And BLUE! Even Avery’s lawyer dude by name of LOY, asked pammy “ 2 door?” And she says yes.......for those late to the party....TH’s RAV4 was green and a 4 door! From that find by pammy, LE got a warrant against SA to check out his residence.. cute part, was that LE would say that the RAV4 matched vin number. Again, n pre-trial, the cop remicker stated under oath “ the vin looked tampered with”......
88feji completely agree, although it’s maybe harsh calling them “crooked lawyers”. They just do their job. However, I do agree they answer questions like politicians. If they were 100% honest, I think they’d admit there’s barely a cat in hell’s chance that Avery’s innocent! Actually, they’d even have to admit that “guilty” was the correct verdict!
@@88feji It's an irrelevant question whether the lawyer believes his or her client. The lawyer is not a witness.
@@RowanB86they arent cooked defense lawyers are paid to defend guilty people
Excellent interview with excellent lawyers. You do not find lawyers like Dean Strang in this world any longer. His morals and ethics are above reproach.
B.s.
They lost... Avery sits for life.. they tour the world as heroes... not more to say.
@@MrBleedk People and attorneys do not come any better than Dean Strang!!!
Susan Sehorn, I could not agree more.
@@herblewis3788 thats a sad comment. Hoping i never need a lawyer!!
Fantastic lawyers.
They neglected to do their job as well as they should/could, they lost and Avery gone for life... Fantastic... wonder if YOU would think the same if it was you who should sit and wait for a real pitbull with balls (Zellner) who can safe his ass.... They didnt present the case and evidence as they should... simple as that
they are the best!!!
MrBleedk , the biased judge didn't help the matter for fair trail though.
Disagree. They had several opportunities to call for a mistrial. They were paid nearly 1/4 of a million dollars yet didn't hire any expert witnesses. I've heard them state that the bones found on Steven Averys property were Teresa's yet that has not been determined because the county medical examiner was not allowed on the property. That is illegal. That's why on her death certificate the cause of death is unknown.
It really makes me sick that every person who was involved in this doc made $$$ except for the 2 innocent men who sit behind bars.
Ken Kratzs sick press conference should have been enough for a change of venue and mis-trial.
MrBleedk these two did a much better job at convincing me of Avery’s innocence. Zellner didn’t do him any favors IMO
I don't understand how they dropped the charges of kidnapping , and sexual assault for Steve Avery because there was no evidence of her being in the trailer that's why they didn't use Brandon's testimony but yet they convict the kid on a rape charge in his case with no DNA evidence of him or the victim being there
Nature Boy good point .
There is no way that what the prosecution say happen in that trailer could have happened without leaving any dna evidence at all .NO WAY ON EARTH COULD SOMEONE CLEANE THAT SPACE WITHOUT LEAVING ANYTHING !!
Because SA got better lawyers, that's how it works. Those two guys would destroy BD confession so easly
I heard it was to do with the jury.
Brendan Dassey was convicted solely on his own confession; there was no other evidence.
This is what is so stupid ! This whole case is just bs !!!
I live in Australia and I stumbled across this series on Netflix and have to say I cannot believe what I was watching. This series was not just a fun television show with intrigue, I was memorised by real life interactions of lawyers, clients and understanding the great work that good lawyers do to the best of their knowledge in the pursuit of truth and justice. I could not believe the injustices being committed by the Prosecution, not only at a local level but all the way to the top in the Wisconsin judicial system. I was so intrigued by the level of intelligence Steven's lawyer Kathleen was able to attack the evidence produced by the Prosecution. By the way these 2 lawyers Dean and Jerry did the best they could with the resources they must have had at the time and I for one could not believe the verdict was guilty when the doubt that was planted by these 2 lawyers was enough to say beyond reasonable doubt, the verdict should have been "not guilty". I really did believe I was going to see the ending of this whole awful story at the end of Part 2 but could not believe it ended where it did. At least Kathleen was able to look into other people of interests that needed to be looked at. The tragedy is that the real killer would have had a better chance of being caught, much earlier in this story, had the focus been on more than just ONE person. That's the real tragedy. I will have to keep searching for the up to date information regarding this case because I want to see justice served with truth and those in the Police department who have made an absolute mess and miscarriage of justice, get what they truly deserve. To Dean and Jerry we say thank you for the great work you both continue to do in pursuit of justice in this truly very extraordinary case.
Yes you are so right ! ALL OF HIS LAWYERS - THESE 2 ,AND KATHLEEN-- ARE ABSOLUTLY AMAZING !!! THEY ALL WORKED SO HARD, SO HONESTLY ,AND STILL A STUPID(!!!!) " JUDGE"-- AND JURY MADE HORRIBLE VERDICT , UNBELIVABLE !! AND KEN K- THE CREEPY SNAKE OF A " PROSECUTER"- MADE ME SO ANGRY ,AND DO YOU KNOW - THAT HE SEXUALY HARRESED WOMEN FOR YEARS !! HE CALLED STEVEN A RAPIST ?? HE IS THE RAPIST ! AND WHY ISNT HE IN JAIL ???? SO MUCH INJUSTICE YOU CANT BELIVE THAT EVEN NOW IN 2022 IT IS HAPPANING ,WE ALL SHOULD UNITE AGAINST IT
Although they have been criticized for doing a tour; I think this is a great opportunity to bring about change to our justice system. I think these two men did the best that the could at the time the trial. I still find them very admirable and honest. Hopefully the discussion will continue and change will come about due to the documentary and subsequent discussions. I really hope that we will soon see Steven and Brendan free.
Me too Angie.
@@herblewis3788 Everyone one way or another is in on the crime of making a murder. Why in the world wouldn't Dean Strang and Jerry Buting be in on it?
hopefully that change will come. this documentary came out at just about the same time prof. james duane launched his book, you have the right to remain innocent. our book, stack the legal odds in your favor, was the first of its kind and launched 6 months earlier. www.stloiyf.com/blog
@Beverley Lumb you must be legally blind
Beverley Lumb I think the difference is ...is that most people think he’s innocent, so the victims family aren’t given as much thought as if everyone thought he was guilty....
Steven Avery deserves a new trial... New evidence and Brady violations!!!!!🌎🌎🌎🌎
Great lawyers, they worked really hard on the case. Netflix please help Steven Avery.
I trust these people as human beings a lot more than the prosecutor, sheriff and the two detectives and officers. They are so much more normal as human beings, overall.
So he scrubbed down the garage where she was supposedly killed so well that none of her DNA was found in the garage, but then he turns around and leaves his blood in her car..?
KingOfTheG’s GG he didn’t even scrub the garage. His own dna was found.
This is the most serious hole in their story. I wonder all the time why the prosecutors weren’t forced to explain this. They didn’t even try to change their story to say he killed her outside. Instead they insist he raped and killed her in the house and garage which lack any traces of human blood and Teresa’s DNA.
But the car has large brushstrokes of Stevens blood.
But not so scrubbed that he removed all the animal blood and DNA from the garage from the hints they’d been on!
😂 he scrubs all the blood from the garage and put the oil and dust along with all the bits n bobs and tools back where they were lol
Exactly. Steven is smart enough to wipe down all the dna from the garage, and on top of that he wiped down all brendans dna in his trailer also. In which the cop said "they had a lot of time to do so". Hes smart enough to do all that, but leaves her bones and her car in his front yard? Lmao.
Love these guys.
I dont understand why these 2 never went into business together and set up their own law firm. Buting & Strang has a nice ring to it.
Butting and dr Strange 😂😂
Very interesting to hear Dean Strang speaking about the case.
I never realized that a judge legislated from the appellate court bench and changed the case law to accommodate the prosecution of Steven Avery. The judge made it so
1 motive,2 opportunity,3 access are necessary elements to raise the defense that someone else did it instead of just one of the three elements. This is outrageous!
Remember Steven Avery was framed 18 years earlier.
Don Emigholz Jr. 36 million reasons why they’d frame him again, and 36 million reasons why SA wouldn’t risk doing anything to put his liberty in jeopardy. Just doesn’t make sense. The insurance wasn’t going to cover the 36 million to be paid, so Colburn and Lenk, the officers on the scene in the Halbach search, would have been personally liable along with the county!
Forget denny.
I just wonder why no one on the defense team thought to let the jury know that SA was first brought in on felony possession charges (of a firearm) Having been exonerated for the 1985 rape and attempted murder he sat in prison for 18 of the 32 year sentence...
What felony was he responsible for that would have made arresting him directly before the vehicle (supposedly matching the description of the missing woman ((TH)) was "found" on the outside perimeter of the Avery property? He wasn't guilty of that charge, and the . 22 LE claimed later, (after BD's entirely coerced confession,) to have been used to shoot TH in the head 10 times wasn't even SA's gun. It belonged to the owner of the trailer that Jodi and SA were renting from him. He's the one who said on the witness stand that he'd fired that gun on the Avery property 10s of thousands of times, shooting gophers and rabbits.
But even if the trailers owner hadn't owned the gun LE claimed belonged to SA, they still could not have arrested SA on charges of possession of a firearm by a felon. Steven Avery wasn't a felon for what happened in 1985. He was a victim. And the state of Wisconsin knew that.
He was a felon from a previous charge before they framed him for rape he didn't do. I don't think he should be in prison but he was a felon when charged with the gun. But it's an absolute disgrace this man is in prison. It clearly states he must be found guilty beyond reasonable doubt, for me, there are way too many doubts, to be able to put a man in prison until he dies. Steven Avery has never stood a chance in this life, and it's just a shame that they dragged his poor nephew into it too. He cant get out till hes 59 at the earliest but to do that he has to admit his guilt, which means he probably will never get out. Why do the courts, all over the world not just the US, never admit they might be wrong unless they really have to. Sure there was evidence in 1995 that could've exonerated Avery but they let him rot for another 8 years before they finally admitted it,because they had to. This whole case makes me sick,thinking about it, his parents will be gone soon and he should have been with them... just shocking, and that kratz guy looks and talks like a snake and he was found out for the type of man he is.
@@pommiebears 36 million *_very strong_* reasons. satan has a very special place reserved for kratz. www.stloiyf.com/blog
@@jodyjones4928 i couldn't agree more. www.stloiyf.com/blog
These are good men.
The interviewer has an attitude of apathy and pessimism! Thanks Dean and Jerry for your efforts! Change is coming, I am with you!
So proffesional and humbled these laywers are.. cred to the interviewer as well
Can you imagine how hard the real killers are sitting back laughing right now at all this .... ??
Russel Devries Right?! Still to this day...
The ex boyfriend did the majority of it in my humble opinion and these lads have been very impressive lawyer's from the start
franz nowak Don’t watch Making the Murderer 2 it will change your opinion. These guys made a lot of mistakes I the trial.
I don't know, man... all seems so weird. I don't think it was the ex bf because why he would do it years after break up in the middle of day and such. Either it was Bobby, Scott or somebody strange. I think it was Scott though honestly. He hated Steven. He was probably jealous a lot about money and fame he had. They had no relation ship. Somebody who knew that there will be a girl on his property and the magazine will know the trace where Teresa is. It's very weird. He went hunting right after he got home. Nobody saw him all day. Only Bobby which was clearly forced to testified what police told him to because of that porn he had. Scott is definitely the biggest suspect. He had all afternoon. He had access to the property. Police just framed Steven
This case shouldn't have ever went before a judge or jury of Manitowoc county. Manitowoc county OFFICIALS were not to be involved in any way shape or form .....Therefore I ask ; WHY HAS THIS NOT BEEN ADDRESSED BY THE SUPREME OR APPELET COURTS ???????????????????? Furthermore , the issue pertaining to the official coroner being threatened of her life and being arrested if she even tried to enter in any way into this
I like these 2 lawyers. They are good. But the dark power is too strong. And they were hiding lots important evidence from them.
it's not too strong if you have the right weapons to fight it like amzn.to/2UtWIbD and amzn.to/3dIQUCM
Motive. If Barbara was trying to sell her van then Bobby and/ or Scott probably knew that Theresa was coming over that day. Maybe?
Edit: What made the whole thing even more difficult for lawyers is that they have to contend with practically ALL the Averys kids and grandkids LYING to some degree at some point. Its extraordinary!
I think the best evidence that he was set up was the trucker who saw her car. We now know that the trucker told the cop that he saw her car on the side of the road. The cop then proceeded to check it out. He called in the license plate number (because he was behind the vehicle) but never said it as being found. Why would you not let everyone know you found the car? And how did the car end up on stevens property when it was on the side of the road? There is nothing that explains that. I think the cop found her body, already burned, and her car, and tried to pin it on steven. Because we already know he has something against steven because of the fact that he never looked into weather steven was innocent or not the first time around, after he received a phone call from a detective telling him that they had the wrong guy, he did nothing. Which shows you that he really didnt want steven to be freed. He wanted him in prison. There are so many things that dont add up. Not to mention that the fact that his bonfire sight was not the main burning site. It couldn't have been because they couldn't have kept the fire hot enough to burn a body to the extent it was burnt. Impossible. And then bobbys computer history, searching up dead bodies of women, and tons of other crazy shit. Makes him my number one suspect. He leaves 20 seconds after she leaves. Hes the most logical person who would have done this. What a travesty of justice. Im not sure if steven did it or not, because the blood in the car really makes me question it, but the blood couldn't have been directly from steven because the car was on the side of the road not his property. Which makes me think that it was planted. How is stevens blood going to end up on a vehicle that was on the side of the road? And if his blood was already in the vehicle when the cop found it, then the planting of the vehicle would make no sense to do seeing as the cops would already have the blood placing steven in her car, implicating him, without having to plant the car on his property. Which means the blood and the car were definitely planted back on his property. Thats the only thing that makes sense when you consider the fact that the police officer had found the car on the side of the road. Which we know happened because he was told it was there and called it in.
Bobby does fit, and it explains why he testified against his own uncle as well. The blood in the Rav, I'm pretty sure was planted. Not from the test tube but from the blood on his sink when his cut reopened. He said he never cleaned the blood up but it was gone when he woke up the next morning. Also, the DNA on the hood latch is ridiculous. No fingerprints left on the latch or anywhere else around the hood prop, only "sweat", which is not even scientifically possible to retrieve DNA from. This entire case blows my mind, these "intelligent" people are accepting this bullshit. Then again, I believe the Manitowoc police are corrupt enough to kill Teresa themselves to have the lawsuit against them dropped, which would ultimately ruin their reputations, lose their careers and possibly expose them as a sex trafficking ring, that the entire state is riddled with.. so they set this up, blackmail Bobby, with his morbid curiosity, to testify against his uncle and plant evidence because of his access. Just my thoughts..
Have you got any ideas why pammy stated under oath at the preliminary trial she believed she came upon a blue 2-door Rav in the ASY?
These two lawyers were sent to this planet by God, what great men they are.
God has nothing to do with wrongful convictions……which is the case here. These 2 r clowns who didn’t do their job!!
Awesom lawyers and very nice people ❤️🙏🏻👏🏻
Didn't matter what jury you had, anyone on the jury was scared to death to say innocent, They were thinking if the police did this to him imagine what they will do to me. End of story!!!
Moral of the story and truth... ENOUGH money CAN buy you freedom in America.
What great sincere guys. One thing I would like to ask them is why they didn’t amalgamate with Brendan’s lawyers…to get them tried jointly…that way, a lot of the stuff that wasn’t allowed to be presented in court could have been…? My guess is, Kratz played the two sides against each other. In hindsight, surely they should have shared information and joined forces.
re Brendan , in the UK a youth or a vulnerable person being interviewed by the police would have to have an independent 'appropriate adult' sit in during the interview to ensure that the person was not oppressed during the interview. otherwise the interview would likely be excluded from evidence.
there are also protocols on how the police are allowed to question defendants to prevent false admissions by the defendant.
there are also rules in things that lawyers are allowed to say in court, for example a prosecutor would not be allowed to suggest to a jury that if they acquit then they are saying the police murdered the victim.
the investigation in their case was poor. there was a clear conflict of interest that should have prevented a number of the local officers having anything to do with the case.
Justice must be seen to be done, otherwise it is undermined.
even if the police officers acted correctly throughout, the evidence is nethertheless tainted by the suspicion due to their conflict of interest.
If his lawyer (court appointed) hadn't been working for the prosecution, he would of had that confession thrown out. On the grounds that a parent or council wasn't present. This is an example of the absolute worse of our justice system.
The UK wouldn’t have touched Brendan’s confession
These guys may not be as successful as KZ,but are incredibly smarter and intellectual..they clearly indirectly show that evidence does point to SA guilt as much as his innocence but the real question is the unjust trial he got..love the way Dean strang answered that first question and the way buting whopped KK ass on Dr phil
Anyone who can say I bet my life on SA innocence is an idiot #KZ
They tried their best.Steve Avery is not their family, they have their own kids and family and career to think about as well.
It is NOT at all easy to believe SA is innocent.Their is insane amount of circumstantial evidence backing up his guilt, you dont even have to go deep into foresnic.
So my point is, just like these 2 lawyers, and even myself, a lot of people believe SA was probably guilty( you can see everytime Dean and Jerry are asked question if they are convined SA is innocent, every single time they give an indirect answer), but should not have been convicted becaus eof so much conflicting evidence.
That is why they moved on, they cannot spend their whole lives trying to free a man who is 50% chance easily guilty.
For them, its not about SA's innocence or guilt.It was about that unfair conviction.
Very honest and very handsome imo xxxx
exelent lawers...whom...are probably right ! the state /sheriff deparpment is currupt....its too easy :/ too bad
who*
I'm not saying he's innocent, however there is a MASSSSSSSSIVE conflict of interest getting the Manitowoc PD involved in the case and jury that should've made it null and void off the jump. He deserves a FAIR trial without the meddling of that shady ass police department.
Very classy of them...they aren't trying to drag other peoples names through the mud like KRATZ....
The main problem in justice system is the jury idea imho; you educate people for years to become lawyers, judges etc then you try to pick the cherries on the road so that they can interpret such sophisticated mind processing.
Why dont we create another profession called jurorship and make sure these people understand what they are looking into? If you watch the documentary they mention they started with 7 vote as not guilty and then somehow manipulated to a guilty decision.
You can never be sure with ordinary people what outcome will be there...
Love the lawyers..i thought they in for the money..but the case to reform the justice system was excellent..
The only relevant questions for me are?
1 Did the police plant evidence and fabricate evidence?
2 Was the judge in Avery and Dassey trial acting criminally or violating the judicial cannons of conduct?
3 Was the prosecutor withholding exculpatory evidence?
4 Was the Dassey confession coerced?
5 Did the crime lab technician commit misconduct when it made a special exception to admit dna that was tainted when it never had ever done that before?
I have reason to believe and do believe that the answer is yes to all five points.
This is no longer about Steven Avery for me its about government corruption because this means no one is safe from prosecution even if only one of my abridged points were true.Federal prosecutors have prevailed on government corruption complaints on a lot less evidence then has been accrued thus far in the Avery and Dassey trials. The Federal government has enough evidence against most of the public officials involved to put them behind bars but so far the political will for righting this wrong is not there which may point or alert the public that the Fed is also likely corrupted.
no one is safe from prosecution *_if_* s/he hasn't been properly protected beforehand. amzn.to/2UtWIbD and amzn.to/3dIQUCM are like kryptonite to the real criminals-that is, those running the world’s largest crime syndicate we call the US legal system. www.stloiyf.com/blog
Mark Str8 to me it seemed like the judge was working more for the prosecution....there was some evidence and circumstance that he just would not let the jury hear...that might have changed their minds.....
Good interview....these two guys really seem like good people.....not like most of the Just Us system lawyers
+Dave Begotka Right on Dave!!!
Class acts.
Brilliant lawyers!!
Yes these attorney’s, like Kathleen Zellner won’t take a case unless they believe their client is innocent. Just like in the old day’s.🙂
Remember when police come to talk to you for any reason exercise your right to be silent, and say you will be in touch with your lawyer. They will say it's a copout but its your right just like it's not against the law for cops to lie to you. Take back our judicial system by reading the constitution and hold every government employee accountable. Call your mayor, congressman, senator Carsey copy all emails and voice messages text messages to them. Yup surprised how much respect you get in a courtroom
John Bonacci you are right, however don’t blindly rely on your lawyer as we have seen with Brendon
Wow this is the best interview by state media I have seen excluding the incest comment which I believe to be a vocabulary mistake but overall out standing interview.
I ship them.
Jokes aside, RETAIN THESE LAWYERS FOLKS. These are finally some ethical lawyers!
can't these guys run for president "2020" vice and potus in office.! than America can really change i think
You're naivety makes me laugh ... these lawyers are defending SA for publicity and basking in the popularity of the documentary, they don't really think SA is innocent, you can tell by the way they answer the first question ...
@@88feji your*
*then
@@88feji Thats normal. No lawyer ever knows the exact truth of what happened, only what their client and the evidence tells them. A defense lawyers job is to hold the prosecution accountable to prove guilt, because in the United States the default starting point is the presumption of innocence until adequate proof of guilt is presented.
I honestly think they dropped the ball in this case as nice as they are.
Yes, I believe their hearts where in the right place but Katherine has found lots thar they missed. Granted the Judge was completely against them from the get go
They should have requested the change of venue.... the only argument the state could made in rebuttal would be to say that that whole state has been so utterly polluted that Avery wouldn't get a fair trial no matter where they moved it to. The reasons they just gave for not having made the request are things they should have forced the state into saying.
This interview is 7 years old. Dean Strang should be asked that same question again, today. It's the right question indeed, and Dean saying ' he probably is innocent ' tends to suggest Dean had doubts, so ask that same question again, now based òn newly discovered evidence, the State's record for Bradey violations and breaches of Wisconsin statutes.
The ex bf fits that scenario
I love all three of those guys. Buting Strang nd Jim B.
The blood smears looked like it was put on with a swab and the fact that there was not a trace of dna found in trailer you can not tell me you can clean such a place totally there is always something somewhere and you could tell if cleaning solution was used I can’t get blood out of everything
I've maintained the same, the smear looks very precise and like it was put on with a swab or a dropper.
I think they forgot most of Northwest Wisconsin. I don't recall hearing anything about this case. Why do you think Ken Kratz tried to operate a law office up here? If it wasn't for the Netflix show we would have not known who he was. They would have got a fair trial here.
Whoever killed Theresa knew the passcode to her voicemail... they were able to go into her phone and erase voicemails that most likely came from that person..This was terrible, Steve was about to get a huge settlement and manitwoc county should definitely be ashamed for this scandal... This shows you how society don’t give a shit about nobody, they had An agenda for Avery and it’s to make sure they don’t ever pay him a single dime that he earned from 18years of wrongful imprisonment...
"it's very rare for the police to say 'i know this guy is innocent, or i believe he is innocent, but i'm going to frame him anyway'." i'm not so sure we can say these days here in amerika that it's very rare. nonetheless, these guys are good lawyers. the only place where mr. buting was incorrect is when he said that most people experience the courts as a result of criminal charges. the most frequent cases are traffic (54%) with criminal second (20%), and the system thus generating its own work nearly 3/4 of the time! www.stloiyf.com/blog
@Leonard Holt not always
Dean Strang is an awesome man.
But in this case they didn’t care that Steven was innocent,they wanted to get Steven because of the law suite and the only way was to plant evidence and lie ,and then drag his poor innocent nephew into it ,so they could convict Steven .they should all be in jail especially coulburn n lenk and vile kratz .
Not one drop of her blood anywhere on his property!🙄
I would really love to know who their 8 suspects are . I do believe that Barb's husband done something myself .
Andres F Martinez, Robert M Fabian Jnr, James J Kennedy , Scott Tadych, Charles Avery, Earl Avery, Bryan Dassey, Bobby Dassey, Brendan Dassey and Blaine Dassey
4:30 If the criminal justice system operates under "BEYOND A REASONABLE DOUBT" then there is no logical explanation as to why a defense team can't put forward any crackhead theory they want, much like the prosecution did.
It's beyond a REASONABLE doubt, not beyond ANY doubt.
Steven Is innocent.
You can tell if someone is guilty cos eventually they slip up. He has been solid all the way through.
15:50 Amen to that!! Go on down to your local "Bust up your family" court. See how productive men are rewarded for choosing marriage and or fathering children. Don't get married or have kids in Wisconsin. Move to a 3rd world country if you want to have kids. F that country before it F's you is what I tell my sons. 5 kids from 3 baby daddies and a check from each thanks to those family courts.
Dean Strang looks like that guy from How I Met Your Mother who was at Marshall and Lilys wedding and was obviously wearing a toupee that Ted was stealing so he could give it to Marshall after he shaved his head.
Sam Hulsey "it's for the bride" hahaha
Why didn't they use luminol to see if it matches what happened or not in the bed room and shop if they were so sure all that stabbing, cutting and shooting took place there?
After watching season 2, holy shit did these 2 guys fuck up a lot of shit.
That was why they did not want the tail light of Teresa's car to be given for scientific analysis to Kathleen Zelner ( not sure about her surname). That would lead them to the Police.
4:55 the video has been silenced, can anyone say why this is and what has been blanked out?
Perhaps there was some cussing involved, LOL? I have no idea otherwise.
If you read further down the page, the blanked out area could be because this statement was said by Mark Str8 "Wow this is the best interview by state media I have seen excluding the incest comment which I believe to be a vocabulary mistake but overall out standing interview".
It's a mixed bag of rules for different states . As if the federal government just Can't be bothered to regulate these loose cannons
Dean and Jerry conduct themselves exquisitely, i applaud their dedication and sincere loyalty to Steven Avery, even after the bullshit and grossly apparent, fabricated case MANITOWOC COUNTY AND ITS ENTIRE INFECTED, INCESTUOUS, LEGAL GANG projected into the court.
I go back to the parents of both Teresa & Steven, their lives and those of their lost loved ones will never be remembered the same.
This case is continuing to hunt lives , and its ramifications out there, for all the world to witness.
MANITOWOC POLICE AND LEGAL TEAMS would have to be in a chilling state of denial about what will eventually happen, when their lies laid out with undeniable evidence that disputes everything, i hope their anxiety eats them alive to be completely frank about it.
Seems like the goose laid many golden eggs. Except for the two who have been wrongly accused and convicted.
I really think that it was Stevens Brother and /or the ex boyfriend and the cops were so pissed that they screwed up 18years earlier that they had to convict him for this. Not saying the guy is an angel but I think that he was done a serious injustice.
Any lawyer that "seems" to be telling the genuine truth is as close to the truth as it gets... therefore most likely this is the extremely rare case of lawyers speaking facts.
These are two fantastic lawyers but they didn’t know what they were up against. They knew each piece of evidence the key, the blood, and dna on the hood latch, the bones, the bullet, the way it was all found was suspicious. They questioned Colborn on finding the car on the 4th. Kathleen has been able to actually prove why the evidence doesn’t make any sense. The only problem is Brendan’s detailed story. Yes everyone says his confession is false. But it’s so detailed it’s hard to not believe if you watch the whole thing. So there is something off. I believe they got it extremely wrong cause they weren’t seeking the truth. The we’re seeking to lock Avery up. Which is unfair to the victim and her family. Cause now so many people are living with this 14 years later still. If the cops investigated it the right way even if they are guilty the victim and her family could have gotten peace a long time ago. But Colborn should be held accountable for lying about the car regardless. There is audio of him finding the car and a witness to prove it. Idk why that hasn’t happened yet. That already proves the car was moved on to the Avery property. The fact that alone is ignored is beyond crazy.
Can somebody please help Steven Avery he is innocent .He was set up by the police .The police are corrupt there . Surely somebody can take on his case and help him .
They are genuine and extremely intelligent. I think they gave a fair defense. I feel bad for all involved. Question: do you think if Avery got a new trial with a new jury he would be found not guilty?
Yes
They didn’t want to pay that law suit
It's all about the justice.
THESE 2 LAWYERS ARE AMAZING !! THEY WORKED SO HARD, AND SO HONESTLY ,I EVEN FELT, THAT THEY DIDNT ONLY DO IT FOR MONEY/ FAME, THEY ACTUALLY CARED
I think these guy are a little above average lawyers maybe. And honest guys but they dropped the ball on many vital accounts.
i always liked these guys just the new lawyer is just better
if you believe he needs a new trial then he is not guilty plain and simple
The way to interpret these shady lawyers is as follows? Dean Strang is asked a very good question, one that all viewers are interested in and anyone that is interested in justice should be interested in. The moderator asks, "Are you convinced Dean, that Steven Avery is innocent?" Dean Strang answers like this? "I'm convinced that's the wrong question." Hold it right there! It's the wrong question for Dean Strang, but not the wrong question for the public who want to know whether or not Steven Avery is guilty of the crime. But hold on at 0:17 Dean Strang continues with his answer... " I have my own personal view which really doesn't matter in the end." Hold on again! WAIT! You, Dean Strang, the leading defense lawyer on this exact case are saying that your personal opinion doesn't matter? Of course it matters. You've sat through all the evidence and more that was shown at trial and argued for reasonable doubt for Steven Avery. Of course your opinion matters! But wait, Dean Strang is not finished... " that he probably is innocent." The way Dean Strang answers this is very telling... Here you have the #1 defense supporter of Steven Avery using a qualifier on Steven Avery's innocence. The qualifier comes in the form of the adverb, "probably". Saying "probably is innocent" is a problem when you are the #1 supporter of Steven Avery's innocence. Probably is like saying, most likely, but definitely not equating his innocence with 100% certainty. The way to look at this is from the prosecution's point of view. What if the prosecutor said Steven Avery is "probably" guilty, but we don't know for sure. That wouldn't wash, would it? The only way for these lawyers to keep the con game going of innocence, is to flat out say they are convinced of Steven Avery's innocence, which Buting actually does. But Strang??? Not so much. So, in Dean Strang's world of words, "probably" means "definitely not" . And anyone that looks at his response can see through his facade of words and realize Dean Strang thinks Steven Avery is GUILTY OF MURDER.
I’ve never read such a load of rubbish in my life.
He is merely upholding the basic premise - innocent until PROVEN guilty.
The law needs to change so that prosecutors will go to jail for falsifying or misleading a jury.
Such as kratz sending CDs and labeling them to the WRONG owner.
Also law MUST change to stop these bloody press conferences BEFORE the trial, naming the suspect and giving details of the alleged crime. I'm amazed this is even permitted. How the hell can anyone get a fair trial with this pantomime going on?
It makes a mockery of innocent until proven guilty. The state already declared him guilty before the trial.
Trial by jury ONLY works if they hear the FULL story and see the FULL evidence. That's where the funding comes in.
I also dont think expert witnesses should be permitted to get paid for testimony. That may level the field a bit for defense.
I'm still not sure if avery is guilty of anything. But, I have doubts. That's enough to acquit.
There are MOST DEFINITELY a TRUCK LOAD of questions for the police to answer. I'd make them answer.
There is EVIDENCE that she DID leave the property. That in itself doesnt mean one of the family isnt responsible but it DOES mean the prosecutions story is completely TITS UP.
He should have had a trial with a jury shipped in from another state.
And the whole investigation should be considered unsafe due to a very very clear conflict of interests by the county police who should have stayed 20 miles away.
This has done the state no favoyrs at all. He needs a new trial.
Only other thing I'll add. He has never acted like he has anything to hide. Hes welcomed every test going. So if he is guilty, it's an oscar winning performance. I'm not sure anyone's that good for that long.
Ince you eliminate the impossible, whatever is left, no matter how improbable, MUST be the truth.
I think Zellner will get there. But his parents may not live to see it. 😥
There are still some things that I don't fully understand... why did Steven say to his relatives that Teresa never showed up? Then later said he "saw her out the window taking photos", and he "never talked with her", then a while later he said there was a brief exchange during the payment, then he said she also went inside
Also, it was Steven's suggestion to sell Barb's van, and Barb didn't really wanna, but Steven went on with it anyway, while it was *her* car. Later he called AutoTrader to ask for the same girl as last time and didn't mention his own name, instead he used the name Barb Janda.
Joost B. The MCSD framed a guilty man. That’s why. I do not believe for a second that Avery is innocent. But I do believe the MCSD planted evidence and coerced Brenden.
There's countless cars on their lot he could pretend to sell, almost literally. Why would he choose his sisters van she doesn't wanna sell?
Focus RR, if he did it, what's the point in planting evidence? A good investigation would prove he did, wouldn't it? Not to mention, planting evidence is illegal. If the Manitowoc county police are willing to commit that crime, what makes you think they couldn't do worse? And let's not forget the fact that they sent him to prison for 18 years, for a rape and attempted murder he DID NOT commit, based on a sketch that was purposely made to look like him and a coerced identification from the woman. No actual evidence. They have been out to get him for a long time and when they failed the first time, he took action that would have ruined them, they had to stop him somehow.
Does anyone know the 8 people they looked into?
Watch MAKING A MURDERER on Netflix and you will understand this whole case.
best lawyers ever. anyone would want them.
You don't plant evidence without first knowing with absolute certainty that the victim is dead. So when was the blood planted in the Rav 4?
Myoptic law enforcement is an ear mark of many a small town.
I think avery’s innocence is questionable but I personally don’t think dassey was guilty or involved if someone did frame Avery that wasn’t law enforcement for example they’d have to be very smart however I have been harassed personally by law enforcement one or two cops becoming obsessed with me and trying to get me by any means for something I was innocent of so I know what it’s like and the theory Avery was framed anything is possible
So sorry for the state to try and build a case against Steven Avery and they're failing because the facts r fabricated against them.. let the averyes go and end their suffering
Every evidence against Steven is questionable.
Love these 2
where's the fire extinguisher?!?!
there is no chance to beat state,i believe that Steven is innocent
These lawyers are top g
They tried to get a guilty man free but they failed... Kz is trying to get a guilty man free she has no hope.😁
@@darksideofthemoon2348 brenda avery he wanted a hamburger with fries when his momma ask what he want for dinner tonight 😂
@@CiroDiMarzio909 😁
I'm with jerry
Lol...typical lawyer answers to the 1st question
FREE STEVEN AVERY and BRENDEN DASSY!