That's interesting to know, one of the guys my son rally's against won the Asia and Australia round of young rally driver and got an R5 for a year. That damper is about a years running budget for us.
I reckon the fellow you mention has a much bigger budget than my shoestring approach. I am demonstrating the bare minimum required to run one of these cars, if I were not in this position, I would certainly have it with a company who looked after all the time, and I just turned up to events and drove.
@@Richard_Weaver The car's being financed by WRC as part of the Rally Academy. He's already done 3 European rounds. I hear what you're saying about the turn up and drive aspect. However I started building the car with my son when he was 14, got him to do some hill climbs and small events, to get to know the car.. Then waited 2 years while covid got sorted out. He's learnt a lot from the experience, and when I'm navigating for him, it's easy to see he has mechanical sympathy.
@@aussietruckphotosandmodels8510 A very good observation; if you are involved in the maintaining/building of a vehicle and the cost to repair it, it does tend to make you drive with more mechanical sympathy - plus smooth is fast! Great to hear your story, good luck to you and your son.
@@aussietruckphotosandmodels8510 while myself in malaysia have to settle down using DMS australia used rally damper for my national rally season.. and thats about the best for a privateer could buy... Some richer team were running ohlins... But i never saw any reiger dampers used by anyone locals to me... Too bad DMS closed forever now.. their stuff were the best for us privateer...
Really interesting, thanks Richard! Would be interesting to know what kind of money some of those major service costs are, especially engine and gearbox, but even dampers, clutches etc. It sounds like a lot of the costs are similar to other cars. As you said in the video, a lot of the difference just comes from the up-front investment in buying the car. Given the cost of an Evo or Escort with a proper engine and clicky box, it's not such a big gap in reality I suspect.
Clutch is cheaper than the evo. The evo was clutch and flywheel quite frequently, I could get 800 miles or so out of one no problem, but the cost of those components was £1.5k each time for the kit. With the R5 I am told its just plates normally, and that's only £500 or so as far as I can tell and the actual kit is £1.2k if you need it all. Gearbox is back to Sadev or a good preparation firm and I don't see there being any difference in costs there. I am lead to believe that the Reiger dampers are more robust than others and don't need a complete rebuild as often, but again nothing in it. Engine: there are a few people rebuilding now for race engine money, so same as any other car really - I know M-Sport want best part of £20k to rebuild...so having other firms doing this is reassuring. The big deal is accident damage!
Great video! I’ve been looking at getting into a mk1/2 escort to do a few tarmac rallies per year but there are a lot of Evos appearing on the market that are fantastic value. Interesting channel, subscribed!
I think an escort is a slightly cheaper and easier car to run versus and evo. Depending on the spec an escort is likely to range from £25k to £125k However, the evo is a more competitive car in the right hands and a good on is in the £30k-£40k range.
Enjoyed this one... a very interesting comparison cost wise the the 6R4 running cost video I did a year or so ago. R5's are in a different league now speed wise to the old stuff! Also seems we have both had some of Iain Duncan's very wise advice!! He taught me to rotate the car on weight transfer as you can't use the handbrake, breaking through and getting it to work and an amazing feeling.
It completely depends on your approach. Most quote figures will be based on the car living with a firm that prep the car, take it too and from events and all the driver does is turn up and use it. I tried that with the evo and my pockets aren’t deep enough. So I’ve run my evo and now the R5 in a similar way to my 2.5 escort; that said, with the escort, we did everything at home. With the evo I ended up doing a bit of each. If you’re happy to do all the fluids, brakes linings and ad-hoc bolt on bits yourself, but get someone professional to do stuff like a clutch change and/or get the box out to send off for rebuild, then all the time consuming preparation between events can give you a massive saving. The big danger is an accident that means you have to buy a mother load of expensive bits from the sole supplier, which of course, is M-Sport.
Very interesting video. I take it this replaced the Evo? Always enjoyed seeing it out at Brands and South Downs last year but another R5 is always great to see!
Sweet! A good idea for next video would be how you get in and start up the car, showing all the dash pages, what all the buttons are switches on the keypads etc are for... How to change from road mode to stage mode, launch control activation etc.... P.S I will still keep an ear out for that sponsorship to get you over for Rally Barbados haha
R5’s are so cost effective compared to WRC or even group N back in the day even including the Msport tax. I remember putting together a set of tarmac discs for a Evo 9 group N, those little lugs in the floating discs were just over £20 a piece, 8 per disc. More than £650 for a full set to just put the rotor and the bell together.
That's not amortising an engine, gearbox and turbo rebuild over say two seasons. A 20k engine rebuild (if that's what it costs) is going to be £1000/event etc. etc. That's where I see these type of cars getting expensive. I can put a new turbo on an Impreza for £1k, I can rebuild the engine myself for a couple grand.
If you send the engine to m-sport they’re £18k rebuild. There are plenty of others that do it cheaper now. No reason a top and tail can’t be around £5k. I hear what you’re saying, but if I bought the parts myself and rebuilt it, its not much different to your Impreza. As for the box, they’re not expensive to rebuild. If it grenades itself, then yes, you have a problem. But generally these are good reliable boxes. Turbos are also cheap to rebuild. Around £700-800. You’d be surprised. People are frightened of the costs, but it’s what you hear more often than the reality. If everything goes back to M-sport it’s crippling. If you’re doing it like you and I do, less so (in a motorsport context lol).
I was # 313 to like this video..... The area code for Detroit Michigan....😉...and my daily is a very basic 17' SE, auto....in beautiful blue, with 5 spoke wheels! ..considering doing the wheels in Steel-It in plain stainless.
Thanks Richard very interesting and surprising that the costs are not too bad as long as you behave, Don't forget that the likes of KG Motorsport and C&M in Northern Ireland have shed loads of spares for the R5 Fiesta that would be a lot cheaper than M-Sport, always worth a call to those guys first to see if they can look after you,
Thanks. Yes, I have a spares outlet with TG Motorsport also, who I bought the car from. I am in favour of new parts generally if needed. Its a known quantity that way.
Very informative and helpful. Good comparison with the Evo, cost wise, but the difference in performance is five seconds a mile imho. I still cannot get my head round why people buy an R5 then take them to a single venue! They should be used on proper closed road or forest events.
Hi Robert, thank you for your comment. The R5 is certainly deceptively quick compared to the evo. I think SV has its place in rallying for all disciplines. My intention is to budget for 3 x big closed road events next year and then do some ad-hoc SV to keep my hand in if budget allows and everything is going well. I am glad you like the content.
@@Richard_Weaver Don't get me wrong Richard, im not slagging people off for doing single venues in them, if they want to, it just seems a waste, when everything is lifed ! By the way, i co-drive in an R5 and an Evo 9, amongst other things. That's a great plan for a clubman season, three big rallys and a couple of single venues.
Have to agree with you mate. I basically was. Now I’ve got my fiesta I’m just looking to do a handful of decent events in a year. I don’t want to just go pounding round single venues, although I see the value in making the work for a driver to stay sharp.
Jesus Christ engine rebuilt every 2000km. I have a Subaru EJ, I thought I knew about high maintenance engines.. but wow good luck I thought my STI was expensive lol
Something like that. Depends what it needs, but a full rebuild can run into quite a bit of money. If it doesn’t need a shed load of bits, can be done a lot cheaper.
@@Britcherbrianjr I’ve not had to rebuild yet. My understanding is that if it goes back to M-Sport, they make an assessment presumably ok condition of components and probably crack testing. But there are a few engine builders who are now geared up to rebuild them, so they don’t need to go back to the factory. My experience of race engines is that normally for a good engine that’s not done lots of work and been rebuilt many times, then a top and tail with rings, gaskets, bearings, oil pump etc is enough. If you’re into replacing pistons, that implies wear, which I don’t think is very likely. I’ll find out, but I see no reason why this race engine should differ to the others I’ve had.
@@Richard_Weaver thanks for the quick responses. And agreed, just how it’s written spooked me. I as others have mentioned are heavy into Subarus and don’t feel I’ve put a ton of money and am heavily looking into an r2. How many km have you went?
I am about half distance. I replaced the engine in my Evo 6 when it broke. All steel and new block. That cost £12,000. So I think the costs are broadly comparable.
Thankyou for showing this! Cheers from the US
My pleasure.
wow, cool to see the customer portal always love to nosey at how much individual pieces cost especially the bodywork.
It’s quite a good platform.
Outstanding!!!!! Thank you for all involved
That’s me and the pup!
Very cool, I have been seeing more and more R5s here in America so it’s cool to see the running costs
Good to hear there are more these cars out in the USA. ❤
That's interesting to know, one of the guys my son rally's against won the Asia and Australia round of young rally driver and got an R5 for a year. That damper is about a years running budget for us.
I reckon the fellow you mention has a much bigger budget than my shoestring approach. I am demonstrating the bare minimum required to run one of these cars, if I were not in this position, I would certainly have it with a company who looked after all the time, and I just turned up to events and drove.
@@Richard_Weaver The car's being financed by WRC as part of the Rally Academy. He's already done 3 European rounds. I hear what you're saying about the turn up and drive aspect. However I started building the car with my son when he was 14, got him to do some hill climbs and small events, to get to know the car.. Then waited 2 years while covid got sorted out.
He's learnt a lot from the experience, and when I'm navigating for him, it's easy to see he has mechanical sympathy.
@@aussietruckphotosandmodels8510 A very good observation; if you are involved in the maintaining/building of a vehicle and the cost to repair it, it does tend to make you drive with more mechanical sympathy - plus smooth is fast! Great to hear your story, good luck to you and your son.
@@aussietruckphotosandmodels8510 while myself in malaysia have to settle down using DMS australia used rally damper for my national rally season.. and thats about the best for a privateer could buy...
Some richer team were running ohlins...
But i never saw any reiger dampers used by anyone locals to me...
Too bad DMS closed forever now.. their stuff were the best for us privateer...
Really interesting, thanks Richard! Would be interesting to know what kind of money some of those major service costs are, especially engine and gearbox, but even dampers, clutches etc. It sounds like a lot of the costs are similar to other cars. As you said in the video, a lot of the difference just comes from the up-front investment in buying the car. Given the cost of an Evo or Escort with a proper engine and clicky box, it's not such a big gap in reality I suspect.
Clutch is cheaper than the evo. The evo was clutch and flywheel quite frequently, I could get 800 miles or so out of one no problem, but the cost of those components was £1.5k each time for the kit. With the R5 I am told its just plates normally, and that's only £500 or so as far as I can tell and the actual kit is £1.2k if you need it all. Gearbox is back to Sadev or a good preparation firm and I don't see there being any difference in costs there. I am lead to believe that the Reiger dampers are more robust than others and don't need a complete rebuild as often, but again nothing in it. Engine: there are a few people rebuilding now for race engine money, so same as any other car really - I know M-Sport want best part of £20k to rebuild...so having other firms doing this is reassuring. The big deal is accident damage!
Great video! I’ve been looking at getting into a mk1/2 escort to do a few tarmac rallies per year but there are a lot of Evos appearing on the market that are fantastic value.
Interesting channel, subscribed!
I think an escort is a slightly cheaper and easier car to run versus and evo. Depending on the spec an escort is likely to range from £25k to £125k However, the evo is a more competitive car in the right hands and a good on is in the £30k-£40k range.
Enjoyed this one... a very interesting comparison cost wise the the 6R4 running cost video I did a year or so ago. R5's are in a different league now speed wise to the old stuff!
Also seems we have both had some of Iain Duncan's very wise advice!! He taught me to rotate the car on weight transfer as you can't use the handbrake, breaking through and getting it to work and an amazing feeling.
All about weight transfer 🙌🏻
Very useful video. Had heard before that an R5 was no more expensive to run than a 2.5 escort.
It completely depends on your approach. Most quote figures will be based on the car living with a firm that prep the car, take it too and from events and all the driver does is turn up and use it. I tried that with the evo and my pockets aren’t deep enough. So I’ve run my evo and now the R5 in a similar way to my 2.5 escort; that said, with the escort, we did everything at home. With the evo I ended up doing a bit of each. If you’re happy to do all the fluids, brakes linings and ad-hoc bolt on bits yourself, but get someone professional to do stuff like a clutch change and/or get the box out to send off for rebuild, then all the time consuming preparation between events can give you a massive saving. The big danger is an accident that means you have to buy a mother load of expensive bits from the sole supplier, which of course, is M-Sport.
Very interesting video. I take it this replaced the Evo? Always enjoyed seeing it out at Brands and South Downs last year but another R5 is always great to see!
Yes mate. Sold the evo and bought this instead!
Sweet! A good idea for next video would be how you get in and start up the car, showing all the dash pages, what all the buttons are switches on the keypads etc are for... How to change from road mode to stage mode, launch control activation etc.... P.S I will still keep an ear out for that sponsorship to get you over for Rally Barbados haha
That's a good shout. I will note that down. Barbados sounds great..!
great video Richard - I think I am going to start a spreadsheet to keep an eye on service items on our classic mini - thank you
Makes it easier than keeping it all in notes on my iPhone like I used to.
R5’s are so cost effective compared to WRC or even group N back in the day even including the Msport tax. I remember putting together a set of tarmac discs for a Evo 9 group N, those little lugs in the floating discs were just over £20 a piece, 8 per disc. More than £650 for a full set to just put the rotor and the bell together.
Yes. Certain things are so much cheaper. They’ve been really well thought out. The Mk1 R5 was really nailed by Msport in my opinion.
Fantastically interesting thank you!
Thank you!!!
Very helpful THANK YOUUU!!!
That’s great. Pleased it was of use.
Cheers for this vid, so useful.
Really pleased you enjoyed it and found it useful. Thanks
Wow. Beautiful car. Love your videos! Thank you for posting.
Thanks for watching! Glad you like them.
Brilliant stuff Richard- thankyou for posting 👍
Pleasure.
Another great video lik always. Keep it up!
Thanks Stan. I’m glad you like them. I’m always worried they will be boring!
Excellent video.
Thank you very much!
That's not amortising an engine, gearbox and turbo rebuild over say two seasons.
A 20k engine rebuild (if that's what it costs) is going to be £1000/event etc. etc.
That's where I see these type of cars getting expensive.
I can put a new turbo on an Impreza for £1k, I can rebuild the engine myself for a couple grand.
If you send the engine to m-sport they’re £18k rebuild. There are plenty of others that do it cheaper now. No reason a top and tail can’t be around £5k. I hear what you’re saying, but if I bought the parts myself and rebuilt it, its not much different to your Impreza. As for the box, they’re not expensive to rebuild. If it grenades itself, then yes, you have a problem. But generally these are good reliable boxes.
Turbos are also cheap to rebuild. Around £700-800. You’d be surprised.
People are frightened of the costs, but it’s what you hear more often than the reality. If everything goes back to M-sport it’s crippling. If you’re doing it like you and I do, less so (in a motorsport context lol).
I was # 313 to like this video..... The area code for Detroit Michigan....😉...and my daily is a very basic 17' SE, auto....in beautiful blue, with 5 spoke wheels! ..considering doing the wheels in Steel-It in plain stainless.
Thanks Richard very interesting and surprising that the costs are not too bad as long as you behave, Don't forget that the likes of KG Motorsport and C&M in Northern Ireland have shed loads of spares for the R5 Fiesta that would be a lot cheaper than M-Sport, always worth a call to those guys first to see if they can look after you,
Thanks. Yes, I have a spares outlet with TG Motorsport also, who I bought the car from. I am in favour of new parts generally if needed. Its a known quantity that way.
Very informative and helpful. Good comparison with the Evo, cost wise, but the difference in performance is five seconds a mile imho. I still cannot get my head round why people buy an R5 then take them to a single venue! They should be used on proper closed road or forest events.
Hi Robert, thank you for your comment. The R5 is certainly deceptively quick compared to the evo. I think SV has its place in rallying for all disciplines. My intention is to budget for 3 x big closed road events next year and then do some ad-hoc SV to keep my hand in if budget allows and everything is going well. I am glad you like the content.
@@Richard_Weaver Don't get me wrong Richard, im not slagging people off for doing single venues in them, if they want to, it just seems a waste, when everything is lifed ! By the way, i co-drive in an R5 and an Evo 9, amongst other things. That's a great plan for a clubman season, three big rallys and a couple of single venues.
Have to agree with you mate. I basically was. Now I’ve got my fiesta I’m just looking to do a handful of decent events in a year. I don’t want to just go pounding round single venues, although I see the value in making the work for a driver to stay sharp.
Very interesting
Hi Richard really enjoying the content! Would love some advice on a few things could you get in contact with me?
Thanks, Harry.
@@Richard_Weaver Thank you Richard.
Would it be ok to email? I’m on holiday currently or I could do WhatsApp if that’s ok.
Many thanks, Harry. 👍🏻
Jesus Christ engine rebuilt every 2000km. I have a Subaru EJ, I thought I knew about high maintenance engines.. but wow good luck I thought my STI was expensive lol
Are you using it in competition though?
Thats stage km though. 2000km is a lot of rallying.
@@jacksonclendon2987 Correct sir.
So every 2k km you are rebuilding motor? And costs upwards of 10-15k?
Something like that. Depends what it needs, but a full rebuild can run into quite a bit of money. If it doesn’t need a shed load of bits, can be done a lot cheaper.
@@Richard_Weaver are you rebuilding yourself? Usually what does it need? I imagine cams are fine and rods?
@@Britcherbrianjr I’ve not had to rebuild yet. My understanding is that if it goes back to M-Sport, they make an assessment presumably ok condition of components and probably crack testing. But there are a few engine builders who are now geared up to rebuild them, so they don’t need to go back to the factory. My experience of race engines is that normally for a good engine that’s not done lots of work and been rebuilt many times, then a top and tail with rings, gaskets, bearings, oil pump etc is enough. If you’re into replacing pistons, that implies wear, which I don’t think is very likely. I’ll find out, but I see no reason why this race engine should differ to the others I’ve had.
@@Richard_Weaver thanks for the quick responses. And agreed, just how it’s written spooked me. I as others have mentioned are heavy into Subarus and don’t feel I’ve put a ton of money and am heavily looking into an r2. How many km have you went?
I am about half distance. I replaced the engine in my Evo 6 when it broke. All steel and new block. That cost £12,000.
So I think the costs are broadly comparable.
Is it possible you can shar that maintenance log? 🤞
Sure. I’ll need an email mate.
Any chance of getting a copy of your mileage log?
No problem. Let me have your email.
Only rich kid's need apply.
Well I am 44… but point taken 😂
Avin Crack is illegal but In motorsport it is forbidden by WADA. Please stop this promotion
Crack is an essential part of rallying.
@@Richard_Weaver I’m sorry I just can’t condone crack in rallying. Drugs performance enhancing or recreational have no place in sport.
What engine in this car?? Is it 4x4??
Hello, yes it is 4x4 and it has a 1.6 ecoboost engine - 320bhp on a 34mm turbo restrictor.
Is your running a 34mm restrictor?
Yes mate. It’s on 34mm and paddle shift.