Guilliman love and respected all his brothers. He always envisioned(naively) that they would be united somehow someday which is why he was emotionally crushed seeing half his brothers turn on the imperium
As much as I find Guiliman to be a hypocrite, I do find how he views his brother primarchs to be wholesome. He did believe they would all be on the same page, more or less, which makes it all the more devastating when that expectation isn't met. Especially when they are, a family.
@@minhducnguyen9276 not even then. This realization wouldn't come to Lorgar until his duel with Guilliman on Nuceria, when he saw actual and unbridled hatred in his brother's eyes
Like what? Loyal to the core, dude who would drink with your after a hard day and do the dirty work for you because he considers it his duty? It's not like Wolves are known for friendly fire, opressing Imperium's population or collateral damage. And for bombing Ultramar's planet to kill one guy
Gulliman s last words are haunting or perhaps haunted me , in the moments of despair on the brink of death his thoughts are universal with what anyone would think , " they mourn me already , so much still to do , to much , what will they do without me , father save me . " Then darkness and then being reborn in the middle of a different battle . Its why his story is so compelling . His words on his brother shows Conners influence , he is a loving brother who respected his kin , and loved his father . As if in him we are placed in his position in trying times . Truly amazing writing .
@@heathhannah454 Some member of the Death Company suddenly calms the fuck down. "Yeah, I'm Sanguinius". "Yes, you all are, yes." "No, you don't understand."
That first quote about Perturabo does a good job showing the limits of perspective. Perty would say he hates being a weapon and just wants to build things but the universe it conspiring against him.
I have zero pity for Perty. Like the Lion he really is his own worst enemy. Other Primarchs, like G, managed to rotate home to check in and make sure things were going ok and were stable. Perty could have returned home once in a while and taken a break from only being a weapon. But he kept stepping up so they through more at him. Apparently not once did he make plans to step away from being a weapon of war. So he can say all he wants about wanting to be more but than a weapon but actions speak louder than words.
@brockwilkie6022 In addition to the fact all of his complaints were self-inflicted. He could have said “no” to his brothers at any time and used a different strategy for sieges. It was his own choice. And then he has the gall to bitch about it as if he had no control over the situation. Dude could have changed it all with one command at _any time._
I think we'll find that Gulliman's and The Lion's relationship will have changed after 10,000 years. Both thought each other dead. Both alone facing countless enemies. The only Loyalist sons (we know of) still remaining. The Lion was clearly pleased to know that Robute lived when he found out he was not alone. I think the two will have some meeting when they finally see each other. 10,000 years is a long time
Also remember that The Lion has been through his own share of tragedy. He lost Caliban etc. He regretted not being able to be at the Siege of Terra. Just like Gulliman. Both have more in common now than they did 10,000 years ago
The Dark Angels is the chapter I chose as my favorites, a bit biased because I was introduced to WH40K by playing Space Hulk Deathwing, but the more I read into the lore the more I liked what I read. "The Lion" is known to be a bit of an "asshole", not so in the way of just being rude for the sake of being rude but by being curt with his words and generally just doing things his own way while refusing to rely on the help of others. It makes him a bit of a "dark horse" albeit one that has absolutely proven beyond any shadow of a doubt that he is a loyalist to the core.
I imagine their reunion would be in an awkward seconds, waiting each other to talk first and as Lion is about to talk Roboute step forward and hug him, and as Lion is shocked to why is Roboute doing this, why is he hugging him, he'll just brush it off and proceed to hug him back, that's what I want to happen.
Guilleman: I wish anyone of my loyal brothers were with me now to take the royal of regent! *The lion arrives* Guilleman: Not that one 10,000 years later... The Lion: I am alone. If only of my brothers were here with me. Watcher: Guilleman is here. The Lion: why did it have to be him!?
Guilliman also was not be able to recognize the secret superpowers of Jaghatai Khan. - Selfcontrol - Selfreflection some people whisper, he maybe even had compassion and empathy. So overpowered!
Nope. There's bits of fluff in the imperial armour Horus Heresy books that say he and a few other Primarch's called for Perty to be sanctioned because of it. That said, the same source has him happy to nick Perty's idea for squads of cyclone missile launcher termies.
@@Unfitforpurpose Guilliman is ever the pragmatist when it comes to the tools in his arsenal, his personal feelings wouldn't blind him to something that seems to be working well which is why I think it's pretty hilarious that he was the first loyalist primarch to return
Guillaman was a Primarch who could admit when he was Wrong. He rewrote has almost finished Codex Astartes after receiving his beloved Sons Armour after the betrayal and his meeting with him after his Sons return. That armour and his Sergeants Knowledge is what became the basis of Splitting the legions into chapters and the reorganisation of the Marine combat teams into the more Flexible Assault tactical and Decastator squads.
Although it appears that he removed the by any means rule from the codex possibly due to being torn over how it could be used to justify anything being committed under that very rule. And knowing that it was needed because if it was not in the codex then anyone gaining the codex would know all the tactics used and be able to counter them. He covered this in the Short story where he was training his legion in the new Codex tactics and they won every battle. Except for the last one where he roleplayed Horus himself and the Codex tactics where useless against him.
No, it’s because the High Lords refused to accept his original idea of combining the legions and having them function the way the Dark Angels did. He chickened out. The only people who would have sided with the High Lords are idiots who didn’t try to find the truth and traitors who put the High Lords above the Emperor. At the absolute worst, it would have been the fleets and armies designed for merely occupying and garrisoning taken territory versus the highly advanced and veteran proper Imperial Army, Solar Auxilia, the entire remaining Legionnes Astartes and all surviving Primarchs and very possibly the Legio Custodes, as well as most likely the Mechanicum considering the agreements with the Emperor and being curious and smart enough to look for and find the truth. The High Lords and their supporters would have been _fucked._ Guilliman didn’t want another civil war, but what he didn’t understand is that the enemy in that war would be rot and corruption in the Imperium. He essentially doomed it to the nightmare it became and it was obvious. After all, if they weren’t incredibly corrupt already, the High Lords would not have been against combining the legions. It would have made oversight of every authority figure in it easy, as well as monitoring each deployment and all recruitment. Their offense was that they saw the Astartes as a threat to their power due to the public’s reverence for them, the military’s loyalty to them, their independent industry and logistics, and their own military strength. At least Guilliman realized he made a terrible mistake ten thousand years too late.
Bring back Sanguinius as a Saint Primarch. Basically super Celestine or legion of the damned style. Since he has no body but still a strong presence in the warp. The blood angels would need to fuse his two halves back together though. The Sanguinor and Mephiston each have a half.
NO. Sanguinius can never return or it destroys the whole point. The Same with Horus. Now...Ferrus has been seen. A 'headless giant' was seen leading the Legion of the Damned.
Love it! Hey quick suggestion! You have SO MUCH content. Could the playlists get a real crunchy organization? Like separating the primarchs, books, and other categories like the weekly events ?
Man spent his entire formative years fighting monsters in the forest. He doesn't give af that you don't trust him. I really relate to him because I came up the same way but the urban version.
@@Dadecorban GW fixes lore problems the same way they create them. By letting several authors write the same characters completely different and telling the audience "I missed the part where that's my problem." 😂
I would really like to see their reunion soon. I think that, despite the past, when they finally meet in the current setting, each having thought they were the last, they will finally embrace in an honest brotherly hug and reunion. It’s even shown in the Lion’s new book. He rants and raves over Guilliman in the beginning, but is as close to as choked up as he can get when he realizes he isn’t alone and Guilliman is still around.
Guilliman thinking of what Russ and Jhagatai would do without him comes across as him understanding what they are capable of when there's no restraint or order to them. I think it's fear. Fear that without Guilliman to temper them, they would go wild with anger at Chaos, putting themselves in harm, possibly costing them their lives.
Yeah, he was worrying about his brothers...it is what a good brother does. Russ truly cared about his brothers. It tore him up when he was sent to kill the two 'lost' primarchs. He does not remember their names, or their faces, but in his dreams he feels the presence, and he KNOWS he killed someone who was like a brother to him. He is painfully clearly aware of this fact. He even begs Magnus "Do not make me do this brother! Not again! I don't want to do this again!" Russ burried the pain he felt in the heresy. Guiliman...another one who actually cared about the brotherhood aspect...would recognize this fact. Yes Guiliman and Russ may not get along great because of how different they are. Yet they respected each other and cared.
@Nempo13 Russ: “Don’t do this Magnus! Don’t make me kill you!” Magnus: “Dude, I haven’t been resisting. You dropped in and massacred my people and my sons and you’re telling me to stop resisting while I’ve done nothing but sit on my ass!?” Russ: “…Stop resisting!”
The lion and Guilliman are like water and oil. One needs all the data points to know every variable and contingency that should be planned for, while the Lion doesn’t want to give up the slightest bit of info bc it would take away his perceived advantage. It’s not surprising they didn’t get along well lol
Dorn had a good sense of humor and wit. It was reserved for those who were close to him tho. I’m not sure where the rumor started… we see that he isn’t as stern as people make him out to be in the very first book of the heresy.
Ultra straight faced super serious man tends to be kinda funny just based on how they don't react to anything or how they reacts to a funny situation in a very wrong way. Like Drax on GoTG1. Umm acskshually or prim proper guys tends to be annoying. You don't necessarily had them and even prefer them at works. But on casual basis? Probably most will avoided those type.
You almost have to be a veteran to understand Guilliman and Russ relationship. Do you like the guy? He is an absolute a$$hole, I can't be in the same room for ten minutes without wanting to put him through a wall. On the other hand, when the shells start falling, you relax when you see he's on your flank because you know on a soul deep level where he is going to be, and what he is going to be doing. You can have a hundred friends, but you would rather have that guy you trust absolutely but don't like on your side when it gets real.
@@nomindsyndicate5167 He doesn't LIKE Russ. He trusts him in battle, he trusts him with the Imperium's defense, if never its administration. (Russ doesn't trust Russ with administering it either).
Please russ only good point is that his a primarch He's a lesser lions with an iq barely above angron without the nails as an excuse. They want to pretend He's as friendly as the khan but is far less nice to humans He's a cheap version of other primarch but nowhere near most of them
@@dumbidea1007 Tell me you know nothing about Russ without actually saying the words mate. The HH books are a hack job against all of the loyalists more or less. Most of the authors simp for chaos and admitted as much at conventions. Go to the OG lore before the HH books and read up about Russ. Most of the big losses chaos had? Russ caused. Russ is who killed the 'lost primarchs' under orders of Big E directly. Russ also still had that little fight with Lion'El. The Lion lost that fight rather obviously then sucker punched him after Russ ended it. Why did he sucker punch him? Lion'El knew that if Russ wanted to...he could have killed him at any time he wanted. He could feel it. In 1v1 combat where life and death was on the line...only Sanguinius had a chance of beating Russ (and if you look at the primarch stats for the table top, guess what? it is still true! Russ is the most dangerous primarch, and this includes the daemonized Horus btw). In the original version of the Russ V Horus fight, Horus was injured so severely he was out of action for nearly a month...and that is WITH the chaos gods helping to speed up his already fast primarch healing. Lion'El is the joke of most of the primarchs. He was an exterminator that was way too paranoid to the point it crippled his own legion. He was propped up by newer lore that was written to make Russ and Vulkan weaker (yeah wins originally attributed to Wolves or Salamanders were given to the Dark Angels to give Lion'El more wins) because they wanted Lion'El to have more of a prominence in the Heresy books. They in this case meanign the authors that hated writing for the Wolves because in OG lore the Wolves hurt chaos the most. It is why Russ is the most inconsistently written primarch and his Legion was so knee jerk in reactions throughout the whole damn Heresey series. Only bad writing leads to such a character assassination.
Guilliman was wrong about Perturabo in that comment because the guy was very passionate about Architecture and making trinkets. Think of the tiny warhound titan he made and how The phoenician gave him the chance to finally engage in his passion by having him design and build the colliseum.
That isthe biggest reason Perturabo finally went to Horuses side he was never allowed to use his creative side in the conflict only the destructive side of his side. This slowly destroyed him spiritually. The death by a thousand papercuts.
@@lupaswolfshead9971 Not quite "wasn't allowed to", he just didn't voice his woes. He took on all the assignments the Emperor gave him, not once saying no, and then quietly seethed in a corner about it with mounting frustration. And then when he could have had a chance to do something monumental that would be admired by the entire galaxy for the rest of time, when he had the chance to build The Imperial Palace, that honor went to Dorn instead and Perturabo was sent to fight the Hrud, a grinding slog that finally broke him and his legion And then, at his lowest, when he lashed out and burnt Olympia to ash, Horus came and buttered him up, even giving him a token of appreciation with the Forge Breaker.
As far as being a Primarch... Roubute shows the most conceptual flaws at a higher order than all the other Primarchs. He's obviously at a higher level of thinking than say Russ or angron but of course, not by much; but when you're at the league of demigod.. that little extra could make the world. And on the most interesting note, it shows his flaws in thinking. He assumed Perturabo was sharp, flat and a tool.. I get that Perturabo absolutely failed in expressing his internal wishes outwardly but if you're wrong about someone cause they refused to share them at the end of the day you're just wrong. The same with Russ, he fell for the facade that Russ put front and center to his brothers. Sometimes the conclusion you arrive when intaking all the data is correct...but only for the information presented. That's intelligence warfare 101 baby. I'm 30 now and used to fall for this stuff not frequently, but the few times I did it was pretty jarring just how wrong I was when I thought I was completely correct about something. Roubute shows the flaws a well adjusted and healthy person can still make in terms of judgement. Well written character.
Guilliman referred to Leman Russ, Ferus Manus, Rogal Dorn, and Sanguinius as the “Dauntless Few,” and believed any one of their legions paired with his could win any war outright.
Interesting tidbit. If you go back through all the books and look for times any of those 4 legions were beside Ultramarines...THEY NEVER LOST. It wasn't the Ultras carrying the win either in any of the instances...it was the Ultras supporting the other one while THEY made the push to the win. Guiliman knew them well enough and it turned out to be true. All those legions truly need is the Ultramarine logistics behind them to become unstoppable engines of war.
DAUNTLESS FEW isn;t about the PRIMARCH It's ABOUT the LEGIONs TACTICS Guilliman actually LOVE Magnus that he sent Psykers but the THOUSAND sons tactics doesn't sit well with Ultramarines PERTURABO is a tactical genius but his TACTICS is too brutal for the Ultramarines methods SO NO the DAUNTLESS FEW is never about the PRIMARCHS
When the Lion and Roboute reunite, first order of business for the Lion would be like Gulliman, to see their father. Afterwards the Lion would take up more of the fighting and leaving the various crusades to save humanity while Roboute deals with the administrative/bureaucratic side of things.
Guilliman definitely didn’t understand Perturabo. He did have many aspirations Guilliman also was highly appreciative of a clock Perturabo made him and had even mounted it above his throne
At the end in God Blight when Guillimen and Mortarion where discussing things, he directly said *"all my my brothers, many who I loved but ALL of whom I respected"*. Bobby G grew up with manors ans knows when to keep his opinion to himself and with that comes seeing the best in those around him.
Kondrad had issues. He saw the future and it drove him insane as the other end of it would be not have physical contact with anyone which also would have driven him insane
Dam luke im glad u got the green ring ring fuck look out if u got the red oh fuck im a white human with a blk dad and damit there would be none of of that
Tbh yea your right, I think would be awesome to have him being doing the reverse role for chaos that big G is performing as a Lord commander. Would make more interesting story of both of them playing chest on a galactic scale against each others while balancing inner strive between their factions and outside their faction.
I'm hoping Peter Turbo comes back as a much more mature and cunning primarch, as we saw a glimpse of in that one short story. A man who really reflected on his flaws during the 30K era and has grown to become a far more well rounded leader. (I'd also like him to not be all that on the chaos train, but that could be copium.)
@@PowerfulSkeleton I think he'd make a way more interesting war master than Abedon. Him actually wagging the true war while the others want to play with chaos.
@@Dadecorban I think that is false dichotomy, that they are similar but they are not the only ones to have in common or reflective traits to match them. Curz was clearly very similar to Corx but had major similarities to sanguineous. Even tho at first glance you wouldn't see it based off looks and style.
This was what Kor Phaeron meant when he said Guilliman was the emperor's copy. He saw things for what they could be. He cries too much for what's been lost
I think the book Unremembered Empire, we get to cover several! Lorgar is already a known where Guilliman is concerned! Throwing his dumby out the pram! The Lion and Guilliman, too many secrets! Guilliman's opinion of Sanguinius, well, Guilliman knew well of Sanguinius' worth! Moving slightly on inthat series of books we have Konrad Kurze, a mad dog! Fulgrim, mixed opinions, given the outcome (slit throat!)
It's not the Lion has secrets, but rather that he was secretive. Guilliman found him to be inscrutable, impulsive, and unpredictable, and never understood his way of thinking. Strangely, both of them are loners, but the Lion's sulky nature and need for autonomy tended to clash with Guilliman's calm resolve and inertia. Plus, there's the issue of Cypher, the Fallen, and the Dark Angel's own complex internal politics and tendency towards independent action that doesn't make them or their primarch seem particularly trustworthy.
@@petergray2712 Its funny, pretty sure the Lion was not actually impulsive. He just apeared that way because he NEVER shared intel or his train of thought. To you he appears to randomly go off and do something, like take a small elite force across the galaxy to block Horus from getting some siege engines. But in reality he was just a few steps ahead of you and it was anticipated and planned out, he just forgot to mention you what was going on so you were unable to coordinate forces and then gets mad when things didn't work out because he just assumed you were a mind reader or something and could act in concert lol. One of the reasons he could NOT be warmaster lol.
@@brockwilkie6022 I didn't say he was impulsive. I said he kept his cards so close to his vest that nobody could predict his actions. Roboute was a pattern reader who could normally reduce his brothers to a simple, explanatory paragraph, but the Lion was so paranoid about being pigeonholed that he left no pattern of behavior that Guilliman could discern.
We may not know what Guilliman thought of Perturabo, but we can definitely assume with a degree of certainty that Perty must have *loathed* Rowboat almost as much as he did Rogal Dorn, even fans think Girlyman is overrated, let alone mr Iron Saltmine over here.
Guilliman was generally not broadly liked. He was seen as boring and too high-achieving. Dorn and Sanguinius liked him but that was about it. The rest were either indifferent towards him or not very carrying.
Corax liked him. He didn't have a lot of time to get to know any of them, but he and G-man got along really well. Even bonded in true brotherly fashion, kicking each other's asses in video games- er, combat simulations. Honestly, it seems like a lot of Guilliman's brothers just didn't bother to actually know him. They had their impressions and they stuck with them. The fandom did that too until recently.
Yeah, Corax did not like the ostentatious decorations of G man's quarters, but he was willing to accept that he had a different background and was more friendly with him than most.
Roboute Guilliman is the nerd of the twenty, studious and diligent. He was also the sole representative of middle-class upbringing and experience in the group. He really didn't fit in with the others due to their being self conscious of their importance or had larger than life personalities and ambitions.
@@petergray2712 Middle-class upbringing? He was born into the highest elite nobility of any of the brothers. By middle-class do you mean.....didn't have shitty parents? Not sure those are the same thing man.
There was a passige in one of the later seige books(i remeber not which one) where dorn mentions that he wished he had guiliman with him Something about btween his fortress craft and guillimans logistic skills they probably could've won
Purturabo is such an underappreciated and depressing character. He's often poorly written, so he gets dismissed by many, but there's so much potential there for a solid character. He has ambitions. He doesn't want to be a weapon. But he so easily consigns himself to that role, usually feeling used and disregarded in so doing. His ability to destroy and reinforce other individuals' power often overshadows his ability to build and engineer. He was meant to be the architect, and yet he's repeatedly sidetracked by warfare, which bothers him to no end. So much so, in fact, that it's made him bitter and resentful. Any pride he could take in compliments on the few things he gets the chance to build or engineer gets swallowed up by the fact that almost everyone who offers him praise with one hand demands he destroy with the other. So he withdraws. He becomes the weapon he believes he's meant to be. The seigemaster. The ultimate sapper. A force of ruin. He doesn't even get the chance to properly appreciate other people's works because they're usually only in his line of sight because he's been sent to break them. In the same breath, he's damn good at it. The best, even. He doesn't fall into the pageantry of the Emperor's Children, or the pretentiousness of the Alpha Legion, the naiveté of the Dark Angels' obsession with chivalry, the inefficiency of the Luna Wolves/Sons of Horus, the stubbornness of the Space Wolves, the undisciplined anarchy of the World Eaters, et cetera. He's lethal. He's surgical. He's horrifyingly effective. And that's why he's given the worst campaigns the Emperor can throw at him; because he's the one that can always be trusted to get the job done. But he doesn't see it that way. He sees it as being tossed aside and disregarded. Unworthy, even. While his brothers are progagandized, their praises sung by the whole of the Imperium for their bombastic, mural-worthy victories, Perturabo breaks the enemy down in the mud, the suet, the dust, the murk, and the blood. His victories don't look cinematic or glorious because he's the reality of war made manifest, and he knows it. For this reason, he doesn't have time for niceties, or charisma, or even for proper kinship. He's an artist reduced to a military taskmaster because he's damn near on par with Guilliman where war is concerned. However, he lacks Guilliman's moral limitations and hesitant nature. He's unwilling to entertain the theoretical when the lethal, no matter how brutal, will get the job done in utter finality. This perceived disregard and the feeling of being used as solely a weapon for the entirety of his life makes Perturabo untrusting of compliments and kind gestures. It makes him cold. It makes him distant. He always expects to be gaslit. He always expects there to be a catch. And he's usually right. So he plays the role of the weapon and consigns his true passions to dusty sketches and one-off models, inwardly praising himself since no one else will, and dismissing everyone around him in his bitterness. And the one time someone was genuine and caring towards him, he didn't believe her. And the one time he finally relented and believed, Fulgrim stabbed him in the back, leaving him to fight for a side that he no longer trusted or respected against a side that he respected but never trusted to begin with. Always without anyone in his corner except for his pen and paper, his idle creations, and, ironically, a father that misunderstood him and inadvertently played a role in transforming him into the monster he is today. He's also autistic af.
yeah, E thought he could give him the hard stuff and just depend on him, like E did with the Lion. Apparently, they are not the same though. Props for being brutally effective. But seriously, just so "NO" once in a while. He had literally decades to step back and take a break for him, and just as importantly, his men. But NO he just had to keep telling everyone that he was better because he would never say "NO" and could take it nonstop. He could have found a chance for hobbies. Others did. He was a Primarch, at any point he had athority to say, "No, we have been on more campaigns than anyone else, we are due for a rotation".I blame the Lion for the same thing, his fault things got so out of hand back home. But at least the Lion didn't constantly blame everyone else for his own decision coming back to bite him.
Is Guilleman describing what the primarchs skills will be when they return? Like his discription of Lion'El is like spot on to what his powers become. Walks alone has first in him.... Guilleman can see actually see their traits?
Just a semi related/retarded head canon I like to push: I believe that Corvus Corax made his iconic winged jump pack out of pure respect for Sanguinius, as if to say 'Nah doing Horus's dirty work, I'm going to cover glorious hawkboy's 6 up in the air. Be his shadow.' Damn shame the only lore of Corvus's gear we get is his least interesting one: His whip. GW needs to write up some lore on those wings he got.
Negative unless you are talking about a few specific qualities. Sanguinias was likely the best at getting past natural disinclinations to know the real person, especially given limited interactions.
@@Dadecorbandefinitely, Hawk Boy is number 1 brother in terms of genuinely trying to care for all of his brothers, as unbiased as he could be. Guiliman is naive and he's biased, not in the worst of way, but he is very utilitarian with his relationships. He gives fair assessments to those whom meshes well with his methodologies, and if they didn't, he didn't like them. It's not exactly the worst thing a person can do, and considering the faults of many of his brothers, he definitely has some of the least faults, but he is still as biased and contrarian as his father, the Emperor is.
Yaaa no..the comments saying Sanguinius are right..guilliman thinks guilliman is right though that's for sure, guys borderline aware that he's GWs baby boy
Lion El Johnson is the first. As are the Dark Angels. All other primarchs, and chapters do not need to know things they just need to do as the First say, not as they do.
Fascinated by the comments by everyone. I personally used to find it hard to relate to a 10ft tall demi god. But, I worked through it. The Emperor protects, after all.
I still can't fathom how some Primarchs thought the Crusade would bring about everlasting peace. Although they weren't aware of the Necrons/Nids/Tau eventually emerging, there was always going to be a large portion of the universe that Humanity wouldn't make it to, meaning more adversaries would always be a strong possibility. One of the rare times where Roboute put hope/desire over objective reasoning. That's what the Rout, WS, WE, RG, AL and probably NL would have been about. Seek and destroy around the edges of Imperial space.
Besides the emperor I don't think anyone is more well liked than the angel. And I'm a darkangel man 😅 I can see how the lion can rub people the wrong way
How did you miss Guilliman going balistic when he learned about the Decimation of the Iron Warriors? The Empror told G-man to chill and to Perty the Ok to decimate his legion, best dad in the Milky way.
Great stuff! Roboute IMHO is the BEST Primarch, even better than the frankly stupid Emperor, the actual hope for humanity in the grim dark 40k universe. His true super power is his INTELLIGENCE like Malcador. Even Horus understood that.
Dislikes absolutely, but Robute of all would respect his ability to strategically place troops for maximum effects Alpha legion messed up wolves, iron hands, Lunar wolves, and most of all Ravenguad, Not a single one of them are anything less then incredibly dangerous hunts. He must respect the hydra as an adversary maybe but respects none the less
Guilliman calls out Alpharius's tactics, but Guilliman's also the one that set up traitorous members of the High Lords to incriminate themselves and get eliminated by multiple concealed snipers and disguised assassins signaled by a double-agent. He probably appreciates Alpharius's tactics in 41k far more than he did in 30k.
@@huntergallatin6758 I think he could appreciate a lot of the basic concepts but the Alpha Legion were just so over the top with it all, I say that as a fan. Misdirection and efficient use of small elite forces would make sense to G, but when plans are too complex that they almost fall appart on their own, before enemy intervention, yeah you have to wonder if it is the smartest use of resources. I figure G was more mad at the waste. G would not like Angron but hey he was a blunt tool that you could only do so mych with. Alpha OBVIOUSLY had the ability to plan and coordinate on a much higher level but intentionally chose to waste resources in an inefficient method. They could have been so much more.
@@brockwilkie6022 they are also my third favorite legion, but yeah I agree Robute hates his lack of honor. I think had Alpharios been more Loyalist and used all that nonsense to do some hard hits to the traitor his opinion of his tactics would vastly change
You skipped over the unknown primarchs. Even though we know very little, we know that Guilliman wished that they would be there with him and that he would have forgiven them for their deeds.
The way he gushes over family dynamics between magical space warriors gives me the feeling Wolf Lord Rho was an orphan and escapes his abandonment with a dysfunctional sci fi fantasy household in space.
If Russ doesn't like people not laughing at his jokes, perhaps he should be telling better jokes. 🤔 This post has been sponsored by the Gang of Prospero which, unlike Cadia, actually stands.
Guilliman said that when talking to a custodian who thought him charging into battle was not the best idea. He says that like all his brothers he too doesn't really change his mind, and if he thinks he is bad, he should be glad Russ didn't returned in his place because he would punch him to the ground and then scold him for not laughing with him
I have a suggestion for a series on the Primarchs: What if the other Primarchs were sent to another Primarch's planet instead? For example a video could be what would the Primarchs be like if they were sent to Colchis instead of Lorgar. You could make a video about each home planet and how it would shape the temperament of each Primarch.
![True Size of a Space Marine Thunderhawk [999.M41] LORE DOCUMENTARY](/img/1.gif)
Guilliman love and respected all his brothers. He always envisioned(naively) that they would be united somehow someday which is why he was emotionally crushed seeing half his brothers turn on the imperium
Yea that little nugget of info always makes me sad. Guilliman truly believe in the dream
Only after the first shot at Calth did Lorgar realize that Gulliman has never hated him until that point
As much as I find Guiliman to be a hypocrite, I do find how he views his brother primarchs to be wholesome. He did believe they would all be on the same page, more or less, which makes it all the more devastating when that expectation isn't met. Especially when they are, a family.
@@minhducnguyen9276 not even then. This realization wouldn't come to Lorgar until his duel with Guilliman on Nuceria, when he saw actual and unbridled hatred in his brother's eyes
@@InVinoVeratas he was the only one who had a real wholesome family and wished his brothers to experience the same
Russ is the kind of guy you THINK you miss when he's been gone awhile. Then you see him again and go, 'Oh. Right. Forgot you were like this.'
Rus is a real, "God damn it Steve now is not the time for kegstands! We're 55 years old!" Energy
Well, he is a Furry, he can't help it.
As a Space Wolves player…yes
Like what? Loyal to the core, dude who would drink with your after a hard day and do the dirty work for you because he considers it his duty? It's not like Wolves are known for friendly fire, opressing Imperium's population or collateral damage. And for bombing Ultramar's planet to kill one guy
And then you remember that yes Russ is an asshole, but you're low key glad he's YOUR asshole.
Gulliman s last words are haunting or perhaps haunted me , in the moments of despair on the brink of death his thoughts are universal with what anyone would think , " they mourn me already , so much still to do , to much , what will they do without me , father save me . " Then darkness and then being reborn in the middle of a different battle . Its why his story is so compelling . His words on his brother shows Conners influence , he is a loving brother who respected his kin , and loved his father . As if in him we are placed in his position in trying times . Truly amazing writing .
Very grim dark esque
When you think about it, isn't it interesting that the 3 primarchs involved in imperium secundus are the only ones that have appeared in recent lore
Almost as big a coincidence as that Lou Gehrig guy getting Lou Gehrig's disease...
Yeah man i can't wait to see what Sanguinius is gonna do when he wakes up too 😔
@@heathhannah454 Some member of the Death Company suddenly calms the fuck down. "Yeah, I'm Sanguinius". "Yes, you all are, yes." "No, you don't understand."
@@heathhannah454 you're gonna gonna get the screaming head of ferrus manus before you get sanguinius coming back lmao
Well in Lore Primarchs can be cloned. Plus Bile and Belisaruis already met. So…..
That first quote about Perturabo does a good job showing the limits of perspective. Perty would say he hates being a weapon and just wants to build things but the universe it conspiring against him.
I have zero pity for Perty. Like the Lion he really is his own worst enemy. Other Primarchs, like G, managed to rotate home to check in and make sure things were going ok and were stable. Perty could have returned home once in a while and taken a break from only being a weapon. But he kept stepping up so they through more at him. Apparently not once did he make plans to step away from being a weapon of war. So he can say all he wants about wanting to be more but than a weapon but actions speak louder than words.
@@brockwilkie6022He had some reason to being so, considering his meeting with the Emperor
@brockwilkie6022
In addition to the fact all of his complaints were self-inflicted. He could have said “no” to his brothers at any time and used a different strategy for sieges. It was his own choice. And then he has the gall to bitch about it as if he had no control over the situation. Dude could have changed it all with one command at _any time._
I think we'll find that Gulliman's and The Lion's relationship will have changed after 10,000 years. Both thought each other dead. Both alone facing countless enemies. The only Loyalist sons (we know of) still remaining. The Lion was clearly pleased to know that Robute lived when he found out he was not alone. I think the two will have some meeting when they finally see each other. 10,000 years is a long time
Also remember that The Lion has been through his own share of tragedy. He lost Caliban etc. He regretted not being able to be at the Siege of Terra. Just like Gulliman. Both have more in common now than they did 10,000 years ago
To them it hasn't been 10k years though. It's been but a moment
First of all, this is a different Lion. Not sure where the old one went.
The Dark Angels is the chapter I chose as my favorites, a bit biased because I was introduced to WH40K by playing Space Hulk Deathwing, but the more I read into the lore the more I liked what I read. "The Lion" is known to be a bit of an "asshole", not so in the way of just being rude for the sake of being rude but by being curt with his words and generally just doing things his own way while refusing to rely on the help of others. It makes him a bit of a "dark horse" albeit one that has absolutely proven beyond any shadow of a doubt that he is a loyalist to the core.
I imagine their reunion would be in an awkward seconds, waiting each other to talk first and as Lion is about to talk Roboute step forward and hug him, and as Lion is shocked to why is Roboute doing this, why is he hugging him, he'll just brush it off and proceed to hug him back, that's what I want to happen.
Perturabo: "If I'm just a weapon you're just an excel spreadsheet."
Guilliman 😮
Thing is Guilliman would be ok with that.
Hey! I am a well organized and well-made Excel spreadsheet for your information.
Guilleman: I wish anyone of my loyal brothers were with me now to take the royal of regent! *The lion arrives*
Guilleman: Not that one
10,000 years later...
The Lion: I am alone. If only of my brothers were here with me.
Watcher: Guilleman is here.
The Lion: why did it have to be him!?
“It’s like poetry. It rhymes.”
-George Lucas
"I miss them."
"Even Russ, my lord?"
"Yes, even Russ."
😏🍆🔪👂
@@BiggestIron45-70 He did what with a what ?
I wonder what Guilliman really thinks about Dante, does he have him elevated to as close to a primarch as you can be without being one?
Guilliman also was not be able to recognize the secret superpowers of Jaghatai Khan.
- Selfcontrol
- Selfreflection
some people whisper, he maybe even had compassion and empathy.
So overpowered!
To summarize. Common sense
@@jmgonzales7701 he is such a dangerous primarch. :)
Thing is Jaghatai is someone who 'hides' himself and does not let others know him.
@@sarethuskami5082 seems logical
RE Perterabo: There is no way Guilliman would have thought well of him after hearing of the decimations of his own troops.
Nope. There's bits of fluff in the imperial armour Horus Heresy books that say he and a few other Primarch's called for Perty to be sanctioned because of it. That said, the same source has him happy to nick Perty's idea for squads of cyclone missile launcher termies.
@@Unfitforpurpose Guilliman is ever the pragmatist when it comes to the tools in his arsenal, his personal feelings wouldn't blind him to something that seems to be working well which is why I think it's pretty hilarious that he was the first loyalist primarch to return
I like to imagine Guilliman and Dorn share a friendship founded exclusively on Perty hate.
@@95keat "Ah yes, daddy's favourites conspiring against me. Only doing war crimes will relieve the pain of this betrayal."
Guillaman was a Primarch who could admit when he was Wrong.
He rewrote has almost finished Codex Astartes after receiving his beloved Sons Armour after the betrayal and his meeting with him after his Sons return.
That armour and his Sergeants Knowledge is what became the basis of Splitting the legions into chapters and the reorganisation of the Marine combat teams into the more Flexible Assault tactical and Decastator squads.
Although it appears that he removed the by any means rule from the codex possibly due to being torn over how it could be used to justify anything being committed under that very rule. And knowing that it was needed because if it was not in the codex then anyone gaining the codex would know all the tactics used and be able to counter them.
He covered this in the Short story where he was training his legion in the new Codex tactics and they won every battle.
Except for the last one where he roleplayed Horus himself and the Codex tactics where useless against him.
He's also currently writing a revised 2nd edition Codex.
No, it’s because the High Lords refused to accept his original idea of combining the legions and having them function the way the Dark Angels did. He chickened out. The only people who would have sided with the High Lords are idiots who didn’t try to find the truth and traitors who put the High Lords above the Emperor.
At the absolute worst, it would have been the fleets and armies designed for merely occupying and garrisoning taken territory versus the highly advanced and veteran proper Imperial Army, Solar Auxilia, the entire remaining Legionnes Astartes and all surviving Primarchs and very possibly the Legio Custodes, as well as most likely the Mechanicum considering the agreements with the Emperor and being curious and smart enough to look for and find the truth.
The High Lords and their supporters would have been _fucked._ Guilliman didn’t want another civil war, but what he didn’t understand is that the enemy in that war would be rot and corruption in the Imperium. He essentially doomed it to the nightmare it became and it was obvious. After all, if they weren’t incredibly corrupt already, the High Lords would not have been against combining the legions. It would have made oversight of every authority figure in it easy, as well as monitoring each deployment and all recruitment. Their offense was that they saw the Astartes as a threat to their power due to the public’s reverence for them, the military’s loyalty to them, their independent industry and logistics, and their own military strength.
At least Guilliman realized he made a terrible mistake ten thousand years too late.
Im also doing book siginings.
Bring back Sanguinius as a Saint Primarch. Basically super Celestine or legion of the damned style. Since he has no body but still a strong presence in the warp. The blood angels would need to fuse his two halves back together though. The Sanguinor and Mephiston each have a half.
NO.
Sanguinius can never return or it destroys the whole point. The Same with Horus.
Now...Ferrus has been seen. A 'headless giant' was seen leading the Legion of the Damned.
just put the fries in the bag bro
@@Nempo13someone should tell the Christians that Jesus' return destroyed the whole point of his sacrifice
Love it! Hey quick suggestion! You have SO MUCH content. Could the playlists get a real crunchy organization? Like separating the primarchs, books, and other categories like the weekly events ?
Can we blame *_anyone_* for not fully trusting Lion El'Jonson? Or the Dark Angels for that matter?
Is the Lion even the same character anymore? He’s changed much since his return it seems to me.
Man spent his entire formative years fighting monsters in the forest. He doesn't give af that you don't trust him. I really relate to him because I came up the same way but the urban version.
The Dark Angels don’t even trust themselves lol
@@j.k.prufrock5605 No, and I have no fucking idea how they are going to fix that.
@@Dadecorban GW fixes lore problems the same way they create them. By letting several authors write the same characters completely different and telling the audience "I missed the part where that's my problem." 😂
I would really like to see their reunion soon. I think that, despite the past, when they finally meet in the current setting, each having thought they were the last, they will finally embrace in an honest brotherly hug and reunion. It’s even shown in the Lion’s new book. He rants and raves over Guilliman in the beginning, but is as close to as choked up as he can get when he realizes he isn’t alone and Guilliman is still around.
Guilliman thinking of what Russ and Jhagatai would do without him comes across as him understanding what they are capable of when there's no restraint or order to them. I think it's fear. Fear that without Guilliman to temper them, they would go wild with anger at Chaos, putting themselves in harm, possibly costing them their lives.
Yeah, he was worrying about his brothers...it is what a good brother does. Russ truly cared about his brothers. It tore him up when he was sent to kill the two 'lost' primarchs. He does not remember their names, or their faces, but in his dreams he feels the presence, and he KNOWS he killed someone who was like a brother to him. He is painfully clearly aware of this fact. He even begs Magnus "Do not make me do this brother! Not again! I don't want to do this again!"
Russ burried the pain he felt in the heresy. Guiliman...another one who actually cared about the brotherhood aspect...would recognize this fact. Yes Guiliman and Russ may not get along great because of how different they are. Yet they respected each other and cared.
He was right.
@Nempo13
Russ: “Don’t do this Magnus! Don’t make me kill you!”
Magnus: “Dude, I haven’t been resisting. You dropped in and massacred my people and my sons and you’re telling me to stop resisting while I’ve done nothing but sit on my ass!?”
Russ: “…Stop resisting!”
The lion and Guilliman are like water and oil. One needs all the data points to know every variable and contingency that should be planned for, while the Lion doesn’t want to give up the slightest bit of info bc it would take away his perceived advantage. It’s not surprising they didn’t get along well lol
So Russ thought Guilliman was more boring than Dorn? Dorn has zero sense of humor and Guilliman was worse? Damn
Frat boy Russ versus honor student Guilliman and stone-faced Dorn.
Dorn had a good sense of humor and wit. It was reserved for those who were close to him tho. I’m not sure where the rumor started… we see that he isn’t as stern as people make him out to be in the very first book of the heresy.
Ultra straight faced super serious man tends to be kinda funny just based on how they don't react to anything or how they reacts to a funny situation in a very wrong way. Like Drax on GoTG1.
Umm acskshually or prim proper guys tends to be annoying. You don't necessarily had them and even prefer them at works. But on casual basis? Probably most will avoided those type.
Yes, guilliman does truly suck lol
Russ knew dorn for much longer
Corax has a lot of inner thinking, even brooding, about several of the other primarchs in his books that reveal his perceptions of them as well.
You almost have to be a veteran to understand Guilliman and Russ relationship. Do you like the guy? He is an absolute a$$hole, I can't be in the same room for ten minutes without wanting to put him through a wall. On the other hand, when the shells start falling, you relax when you see he's on your flank because you know on a soul deep level where he is going to be, and what he is going to be doing. You can have a hundred friends, but you would rather have that guy you trust absolutely but don't like on your side when it gets real.
He doesn’t like Russ on his side?
@@nomindsyndicate5167 He doesn't LIKE Russ. He trusts him in battle, he trusts him with the Imperium's defense, if never its administration. (Russ doesn't trust Russ with administering it either).
Please russ only good point is that his a primarch
He's a lesser lions with an iq barely above angron without the nails as an excuse.
They want to pretend He's as friendly as the khan but is far less nice to humans
He's a cheap version of other primarch but nowhere near most of them
@@dumbidea1007 Tell me you know nothing about Russ without actually saying the words mate.
The HH books are a hack job against all of the loyalists more or less. Most of the authors simp for chaos and admitted as much at conventions. Go to the OG lore before the HH books and read up about Russ. Most of the big losses chaos had? Russ caused. Russ is who killed the 'lost primarchs' under orders of Big E directly.
Russ also still had that little fight with Lion'El. The Lion lost that fight rather obviously then sucker punched him after Russ ended it. Why did he sucker punch him? Lion'El knew that if Russ wanted to...he could have killed him at any time he wanted. He could feel it. In 1v1 combat where life and death was on the line...only Sanguinius had a chance of beating Russ (and if you look at the primarch stats for the table top, guess what? it is still true! Russ is the most dangerous primarch, and this includes the daemonized Horus btw).
In the original version of the Russ V Horus fight, Horus was injured so severely he was out of action for nearly a month...and that is WITH the chaos gods helping to speed up his already fast primarch healing.
Lion'El is the joke of most of the primarchs. He was an exterminator that was way too paranoid to the point it crippled his own legion. He was propped up by newer lore that was written to make Russ and Vulkan weaker (yeah wins originally attributed to Wolves or Salamanders were given to the Dark Angels to give Lion'El more wins) because they wanted Lion'El to have more of a prominence in the Heresy books. They in this case meanign the authors that hated writing for the Wolves because in OG lore the Wolves hurt chaos the most. It is why Russ is the most inconsistently written primarch and his Legion was so knee jerk in reactions throughout the whole damn Heresey series. Only bad writing leads to such a character assassination.
For Russ, for the All Father
For the AllFather!
For the Wolf the Hunts the Stars!
Guilliman was wrong about Perturabo in that comment because the guy was very passionate about Architecture and making trinkets. Think of the tiny warhound titan he made and how The phoenician gave him the chance to finally engage in his passion by having him design and build the colliseum.
That isthe biggest reason Perturabo finally went to Horuses side he was never allowed to use his creative side in the conflict only the destructive side of his side. This slowly destroyed him spiritually. The death by a thousand papercuts.
@@lupaswolfshead9971 Not quite "wasn't allowed to", he just didn't voice his woes. He took on all the assignments the Emperor gave him, not once saying no, and then quietly seethed in a corner about it with mounting frustration. And then when he could have had a chance to do something monumental that would be admired by the entire galaxy for the rest of time, when he had the chance to build The Imperial Palace, that honor went to Dorn instead and Perturabo was sent to fight the Hrud, a grinding slog that finally broke him and his legion
And then, at his lowest, when he lashed out and burnt Olympia to ash, Horus came and buttered him up, even giving him a token of appreciation with the Forge Breaker.
As far as being a Primarch... Roubute shows the most conceptual flaws at a higher order than all the other Primarchs.
He's obviously at a higher level of thinking than say Russ or angron but of course, not by much; but when you're at the league of demigod.. that little extra could make the world.
And on the most interesting note, it shows his flaws in thinking.
He assumed Perturabo was sharp, flat and a tool.. I get that Perturabo absolutely failed in expressing his internal wishes outwardly but if you're wrong about someone cause they refused to share them at the end of the day you're just wrong.
The same with Russ, he fell for the facade that Russ put front and center to his brothers. Sometimes the conclusion you arrive when intaking all the data is correct...but only for the information presented. That's intelligence warfare 101 baby.
I'm 30 now and used to fall for this stuff not frequently, but the few times I did it was pretty jarring just how wrong I was when I thought I was completely correct about something.
Roubute shows the flaws a well adjusted and healthy person can still make in terms of judgement. Well written character.
I thought Vulcan made the titan or was it just the engine inside Vulcan made?
@@johnevans5706 Vulcan made the components for perturabo from perturabos design if i recall and perturabo constructed it (like a model kit)
The Great Angel beloved by all
Guilliman referred to Leman Russ, Ferus Manus, Rogal Dorn, and Sanguinius as the “Dauntless Few,” and believed any one of their legions paired with his could win any war outright.
Interesting tidbit. If you go back through all the books and look for times any of those 4 legions were beside Ultramarines...THEY NEVER LOST. It wasn't the Ultras carrying the win either in any of the instances...it was the Ultras supporting the other one while THEY made the push to the win.
Guiliman knew them well enough and it turned out to be true. All those legions truly need is the Ultramarine logistics behind them to become unstoppable engines of war.
DAUNTLESS FEW isn;t about the PRIMARCH
It's ABOUT the LEGIONs TACTICS
Guilliman actually LOVE Magnus that he sent Psykers but the THOUSAND sons tactics doesn't sit well with Ultramarines
PERTURABO is a tactical genius but his TACTICS is too brutal for the Ultramarines methods
SO NO the DAUNTLESS FEW is never about the PRIMARCHS
Think he and Russ got on quite well and had high respect for their skills
For the Khan!
When the Lion and Roboute reunite, first order of business for the Lion would be like Gulliman, to see their father. Afterwards the Lion would take up more of the fighting and leaving the various crusades to save humanity while Roboute deals with the administrative/bureaucratic side of things.
Guilliman definitely didn’t understand Perturabo. He did have many aspirations
Guilliman also was highly appreciative of a clock Perturabo made him and had even mounted it above his throne
Great video! Might I recommend adding parts/chapters to your video(s) to make it easier to navigate to specific Primarchs? :)
Lion El-Jonson: HE DID WHAT WITH THE WHAT?
GUILLIMAN!!!!
I feel like 40K Lion will surprise Gorillaman a bit and their relationship might grow a little closer especially since they're the only ones.
rowboat gorrilaman would give the lion control of the miltary i think
At the end in God Blight when Guillimen and Mortarion where discussing things, he directly said *"all my my brothers, many who I loved but ALL of whom I respected"*.
Bobby G grew up with manors ans knows when to keep his opinion to himself and with that comes seeing the best in those around him.
Kondrad had issues. He saw the future and it drove him insane as the other end of it would be not have physical contact with anyone which also would have driven him insane
thanks for narrating the wiki for us
I think Russ knew there would always only be war, heresy or not.
My Emperor a combined taskforce of ultramarines and iron warrior would be terrifying and almost impossible to deal with
It wouldn't work out. Ultramarines don't waste lives.
Iron within iron without
FORTIFY!!!🧱
Perty shouldve been head of the 2nd legion. As for the terrible 2's phase kids have... ;)
iron within iron get out
Oh the irony
Dam luke im glad u got the green ring ring fuck look out if u got the red oh fuck im a white human with a blk dad and damit there would be none of of that
More Guilliman content? Awwwww yisssss!
I think Perturabo would be the perfect rival to Guilliman. In many ways, Perty is a dark reflection of Guilliman.
Tbh yea your right, I think would be awesome to have him being doing the reverse role for chaos that big G is performing as a Lord commander. Would make more interesting story of both of them playing chest on a galactic scale against each others while balancing inner strive between their factions and outside their faction.
I'm hoping Peter Turbo comes back as a much more mature and cunning primarch, as we saw a glimpse of in that one short story. A man who really reflected on his flaws during the 30K era and has grown to become a far more well rounded leader. (I'd also like him to not be all that on the chaos train, but that could be copium.)
@@PowerfulSkeleton I think he'd make a way more interesting war master than Abedon. Him actually wagging the true war while the others want to play with chaos.
A funny thing to say when him and Rogal were setup as the clear light/dark reflections.
@@Dadecorban I think that is false dichotomy, that they are similar but they are not the only ones to have in common or reflective traits to match them. Curz was clearly very similar to Corx but had major similarities to sanguineous. Even tho at first glance you wouldn't see it based off looks and style.
... The Commissar is pleased! 😎
23:50 Video starts here.
This was what Kor Phaeron meant when he said Guilliman was the emperor's copy. He saw things for what they could be. He cries too much for what's been lost
If all the primarches embody part of the Emperor, Guilliman is his heart(in the abstract of course)
i have absolutely devoured your khan content this last week, really greatful about your content.
yo man posted a few times but was wondering if you'd do some similar videos but for chaos?? or maybe some videos about assassins etc.
Vulcan liiiivvvveeeesssss
I do.
I think the book Unremembered Empire, we get to cover several! Lorgar is already a known where Guilliman is concerned! Throwing his dumby out the pram! The Lion and Guilliman, too many secrets! Guilliman's opinion of Sanguinius, well, Guilliman knew well of Sanguinius' worth! Moving slightly on inthat series of books we have Konrad Kurze, a mad dog! Fulgrim, mixed opinions, given the outcome (slit throat!)
It's not the Lion has secrets, but rather that he was secretive. Guilliman found him to be inscrutable, impulsive, and unpredictable, and never understood his way of thinking. Strangely, both of them are loners, but the Lion's sulky nature and need for autonomy tended to clash with Guilliman's calm resolve and inertia. Plus, there's the issue of Cypher, the Fallen, and the Dark Angel's own complex internal politics and tendency towards independent action that doesn't make them or their primarch seem particularly trustworthy.
@@petergray2712 Its funny, pretty sure the Lion was not actually impulsive. He just apeared that way because he NEVER shared intel or his train of thought. To you he appears to randomly go off and do something, like take a small elite force across the galaxy to block Horus from getting some siege engines. But in reality he was just a few steps ahead of you and it was anticipated and planned out, he just forgot to mention you what was going on so you were unable to coordinate forces and then gets mad when things didn't work out because he just assumed you were a mind reader or something and could act in concert lol. One of the reasons he could NOT be warmaster lol.
@@brockwilkie6022 I didn't say he was impulsive. I said he kept his cards so close to his vest that nobody could predict his actions. Roboute was a pattern reader who could normally reduce his brothers to a simple, explanatory paragraph, but the Lion was so paranoid about being pigeonholed that he left no pattern of behavior that Guilliman could discern.
I can't wait to hear about how him and Curze were best friends
Courage and Honour!!!!!
'Something something, butchers nails' - Angron to G-man
@@horusluprecal1144 *Angrionic screams
We may not know what Guilliman thought of Perturabo, but we can definitely assume with a degree of certainty that Perty must have *loathed* Rowboat almost as much as he did Rogal Dorn, even fans think Girlyman is overrated, let alone mr Iron Saltmine over here.
The part about Robute thinking perturabo only viewing himself as a weapon shows he doesn't actually know perturabo.
Do this with all the primarchs.
Courage and Honour!
Guilliman was generally not broadly liked. He was seen as boring and too high-achieving. Dorn and Sanguinius liked him but that was about it. The rest were either indifferent towards him or not very carrying.
Corax liked him. He didn't have a lot of time to get to know any of them, but he and G-man got along really well. Even bonded in true brotherly fashion, kicking each other's asses in video games- er, combat simulations.
Honestly, it seems like a lot of Guilliman's brothers just didn't bother to actually know him. They had their impressions and they stuck with them. The fandom did that too until recently.
Yeah, Corax did not like the ostentatious decorations of G man's quarters, but he was willing to accept that he had a different background and was more friendly with him than most.
Roboute Guilliman is the nerd of the twenty, studious and diligent. He was also the sole representative of middle-class upbringing and experience in the group. He really didn't fit in with the others due to their being self conscious of their importance or had larger than life personalities and ambitions.
Common sense tends to be disliked.
@@petergray2712 Middle-class upbringing? He was born into the highest elite nobility of any of the brothers. By middle-class do you mean.....didn't have shitty parents? Not sure those are the same thing man.
There was a passige in one of the later seige books(i remeber not which one) where dorn mentions that he wished he had guiliman with him
Something about btween his fortress craft and guillimans logistic skills they probably could've won
Ave Dominus Nox!
Do you guys think the Lion's return will ease Guilliman's headache or make it worse?
Purturabo is such an underappreciated and depressing character. He's often poorly written, so he gets dismissed by many, but there's so much potential there for a solid character.
He has ambitions. He doesn't want to be a weapon. But he so easily consigns himself to that role, usually feeling used and disregarded in so doing. His ability to destroy and reinforce other individuals' power often overshadows his ability to build and engineer. He was meant to be the architect, and yet he's repeatedly sidetracked by warfare, which bothers him to no end. So much so, in fact, that it's made him bitter and resentful. Any pride he could take in compliments on the few things he gets the chance to build or engineer gets swallowed up by the fact that almost everyone who offers him praise with one hand demands he destroy with the other. So he withdraws. He becomes the weapon he believes he's meant to be. The seigemaster. The ultimate sapper. A force of ruin. He doesn't even get the chance to properly appreciate other people's works because they're usually only in his line of sight because he's been sent to break them.
In the same breath, he's damn good at it. The best, even. He doesn't fall into the pageantry of the Emperor's Children, or the pretentiousness of the Alpha Legion, the naiveté of the Dark Angels' obsession with chivalry, the inefficiency of the Luna Wolves/Sons of Horus, the stubbornness of the Space Wolves, the undisciplined anarchy of the World Eaters, et cetera. He's lethal. He's surgical. He's horrifyingly effective. And that's why he's given the worst campaigns the Emperor can throw at him; because he's the one that can always be trusted to get the job done. But he doesn't see it that way. He sees it as being tossed aside and disregarded. Unworthy, even. While his brothers are progagandized, their praises sung by the whole of the Imperium for their bombastic, mural-worthy victories, Perturabo breaks the enemy down in the mud, the suet, the dust, the murk, and the blood. His victories don't look cinematic or glorious because he's the reality of war made manifest, and he knows it. For this reason, he doesn't have time for niceties, or charisma, or even for proper kinship. He's an artist reduced to a military taskmaster because he's damn near on par with Guilliman where war is concerned. However, he lacks Guilliman's moral limitations and hesitant nature. He's unwilling to entertain the theoretical when the lethal, no matter how brutal, will get the job done in utter finality.
This perceived disregard and the feeling of being used as solely a weapon for the entirety of his life makes Perturabo untrusting of compliments and kind gestures. It makes him cold. It makes him distant. He always expects to be gaslit. He always expects there to be a catch. And he's usually right. So he plays the role of the weapon and consigns his true passions to dusty sketches and one-off models, inwardly praising himself since no one else will, and dismissing everyone around him in his bitterness.
And the one time someone was genuine and caring towards him, he didn't believe her. And the one time he finally relented and believed, Fulgrim stabbed him in the back, leaving him to fight for a side that he no longer trusted or respected against a side that he respected but never trusted to begin with. Always without anyone in his corner except for his pen and paper, his idle creations, and, ironically, a father that misunderstood him and inadvertently played a role in transforming him into the monster he is today.
He's also autistic af.
yeah, E thought he could give him the hard stuff and just depend on him, like E did with the Lion. Apparently, they are not the same though. Props for being brutally effective. But seriously, just so "NO" once in a while. He had literally decades to step back and take a break for him, and just as importantly, his men. But NO he just had to keep telling everyone that he was better because he would never say "NO" and could take it nonstop. He could have found a chance for hobbies. Others did. He was a Primarch, at any point he had athority to say, "No, we have been on more campaigns than anyone else, we are due for a rotation".I blame the Lion for the same thing, his fault things got so out of hand back home. But at least the Lion didn't constantly blame everyone else for his own decision coming back to bite him.
Should be good :)
Thanks for the vid
I think it's a shame we won't see Sanguinius return.
The Emperor could bring him back. He spoke to Malcador about bringing back Ferrous Manis.
For the Emperor!!!
By his will alone!
I like the content but this is the first time iv had to speed up a video to enjoy it better
would be interested to see what tarasha euten was thinking of the emperor and the other primarchs
Is Guilleman describing what the primarchs skills will be when they return? Like his discription of Lion'El is like spot on to what his powers become. Walks alone has first in him.... Guilleman can see actually see their traits?
Just a semi related/retarded head canon I like to push: I believe that Corvus Corax made his iconic winged jump pack out of pure respect for Sanguinius, as if to say 'Nah doing Horus's dirty work, I'm going to cover glorious hawkboy's 6 up in the air. Be his shadow.' Damn shame the only lore of Corvus's gear we get is his least interesting one: His whip. GW needs to write up some lore on those wings he got.
I hope when part two gets to number thirteen, you talk about Guilliman's opinion of himself. 😉
Guilliman is the Primarch you'd trust the most to give a fair & accurate assessment of other Primarchs!
Negative unless you are talking about a few specific qualities. Sanguinias was likely the best at getting past natural disinclinations to know the real person, especially given limited interactions.
@@Dadecorbandefinitely, Hawk Boy is number 1 brother in terms of genuinely trying to care for all of his brothers, as unbiased as he could be. Guiliman is naive and he's biased, not in the worst of way, but he is very utilitarian with his relationships. He gives fair assessments to those whom meshes well with his methodologies, and if they didn't, he didn't like them. It's not exactly the worst thing a person can do, and considering the faults of many of his brothers, he definitely has some of the least faults, but he is still as biased and contrarian as his father, the Emperor is.
Yaaa no..the comments saying Sanguinius are right..guilliman thinks guilliman is right though that's for sure, guys borderline aware that he's GWs baby boy
@@bowserbrowser6559 hes also the best their is only primarch i would consider other than him the dear angel
Lion El Johnson is the first. As are the Dark Angels. All other primarchs, and chapters do not need to know things they just need to do as the First say, not as they do.
Primarch-Progenitor, to your glory and the glory of Him on Earth!
Fascinated by the comments by everyone. I personally used to find it hard to relate to a 10ft tall demi god. But, I worked through it. The Emperor protects, after all.
I still can't fathom how some Primarchs thought the Crusade would bring about everlasting peace. Although they weren't aware of the Necrons/Nids/Tau eventually emerging, there was always going to be a large portion of the universe that Humanity wouldn't make it to, meaning more adversaries would always be a strong possibility. One of the rare times where Roboute put hope/desire over objective reasoning. That's what the Rout, WS, WE, RG, AL and probably NL would have been about. Seek and destroy around the edges of Imperial space.
Besides the emperor I don't think anyone is more well liked than the angel. And I'm a darkangel man 😅 I can see how the lion can rub people the wrong way
How did you miss Guilliman going balistic when he learned about the Decimation of the Iron Warriors?
The Empror told G-man to chill and to Perty the Ok to decimate his legion, best dad in the Milky way.
Great stuff! Roboute IMHO is the BEST Primarch, even better than the frankly stupid Emperor, the actual hope for humanity in the grim dark 40k universe. His true super power is his INTELLIGENCE like Malcador. Even Horus understood that.
I expect a more cold Vulkan when we see him next time.
Regardless, Roboute almost certainly though highly of Vulcan, but probably not in the sense of being the best legion to fight with.
I already know he dislikes my favorite primarch(s). Hydra Dominatus
Dislikes absolutely, but Robute of all would respect his ability to strategically place troops for maximum effects Alpha legion messed up wolves, iron hands, Lunar wolves, and most of all Ravenguad, Not a single one of them are anything less then incredibly dangerous hunts. He must respect the hydra as an adversary maybe but respects none the less
Guilliman calls out Alpharius's tactics, but Guilliman's also the one that set up traitorous members of the High Lords to incriminate themselves and get eliminated by multiple concealed snipers and disguised assassins signaled by a double-agent. He probably appreciates Alpharius's tactics in 41k far more than he did in 30k.
@@pll3827 Maybe learned a few things from his brother...? If anyone was willing to learn from brothers it would be G.
@@huntergallatin6758 I think he could appreciate a lot of the basic concepts but the Alpha Legion were just so over the top with it all, I say that as a fan. Misdirection and efficient use of small elite forces would make sense to G, but when plans are too complex that they almost fall appart on their own, before enemy intervention, yeah you have to wonder if it is the smartest use of resources.
I figure G was more mad at the waste. G would not like Angron but hey he was a blunt tool that you could only do so mych with. Alpha OBVIOUSLY had the ability to plan and coordinate on a much higher level but intentionally chose to waste resources in an inefficient method. They could have been so much more.
@@brockwilkie6022 they are also my third favorite legion, but yeah I agree Robute hates his lack of honor. I think had Alpharios been more Loyalist and used all that nonsense to do some hard hits to the traitor his opinion of his tactics would vastly change
This for Russ would be cool
You must be proud of numieon
The Dauntless Four.
The emperor never questioned leman russ he was designed to never falter he was meant to be by the his fathers side for all time
Vulkan - Big Hugs 🫂 ..Next
Did Bobby G and The Lion already meet?
You skipped over the unknown primarchs. Even though we know very little, we know that Guilliman wished that they would be there with him and that he would have forgiven them for their deeds.
Mistrust of brothers? Gee. I wonder why. Horus Heresy anyone? The Lions methods are justified if you ask me.
Rho, it’s time for a channel poll. Who wants Clonegrim to return?
Roflap gimelskunk has some good opinions
Next time break it into chapters please. Especially since they weren't in the order laid out in your description.
The way he gushes over family dynamics between magical space warriors gives me the feeling Wolf Lord Rho was an orphan and escapes his abandonment with a dysfunctional sci fi fantasy household in space.
Are you a bot? Or just a massive nob head??
If Russ doesn't like people not laughing at his jokes, perhaps he should be telling better jokes. 🤔
This post has been sponsored by the Gang of Prospero which, unlike Cadia, actually stands.
Is there any lore aboute Magnus and Ferrus interaction ?
Pertu's most hated brother is dorn, who is very much like him. If hes luke that to him, he probably doesnt want to talk with gilimman.
Dorn was everything he wasn't. Selfless, confiant, humble and respected.
Who would win Rho or a word starting with th
They should bring back Konrad
How do you know what my thoughts and memories are?
Into the fire's of battle.........
Didnt Leman Russ punch Roboute Guilliman for not laughing at a joke?
Should listen to the video before going to the comments 😂😂
@@nickhout827 I did but I was doing something while listening to it. Might have accidentally skipped the mention
Guilliman said that when talking to a custodian who thought him charging into battle was not the best idea. He says that like all his brothers he too doesn't really change his mind, and if he thinks he is bad, he should be glad Russ didn't returned in his place because he would punch him to the ground and then scold him for not laughing with him
I have a suggestion for a series on the Primarchs: What if the other Primarchs were sent to another Primarch's planet instead?
For example a video could be what would the Primarchs be like if they were sent to Colchis instead of Lorgar.
You could make a video about each home planet and how it would shape the temperament of each Primarch.
1.25x speed is the way
Playing this video at 1.25 speed to get him to speak at a normal talking voice.
rowboat girlyman
Rawbutt Girlyman ?
Any Primarch can beat up girlyman 😂😂😂
Nice video mate ❤🩹