GM HIKARU CHEATING SCANDAL UPDATE!!!

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  • Опубликовано: 8 фев 2025
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Комментарии • 2 тыс.

  • @GothamChess
    @GothamChess  Год назад +178

    Click the discount link: displate.com/gothamchess?art=6539df7c0b79a
    or use my code GOTHAM at the checkout to get up to 44% off your order!

  • @guayabamecanica
    @guayabamecanica Год назад +2842

    Hikaru plays 3 minute games while talking to the chat, being recorded and saying out loud why he is making the moves. It is incredible to witness and I will keep on watching him while it lasts.

    • @PlaygroundMafia
      @PlaygroundMafia Год назад +99

      This is truly insane. He makes the game seem so easy.

    • @ellnor1744
      @ellnor1744 Год назад +74

      Ive tried calculating the way he does, yeah I'm still 800 😂

    • @carterdahl9654
      @carterdahl9654 Год назад +70

      ​@@ellnor1744you try calculating like that then immediately hang a fork, yeah been there 😂

    • @guayabamecanica
      @guayabamecanica Год назад +17

      The guy sometimes keeps playing while talking about how to pass the level of a different video game he is playing at the same time (head explodes here…).

    • @GMHikaru
      @GMHikaru Год назад +312

      Those are some very kind words, and I appreciate it.

  • @TimTom
    @TimTom Год назад +3199

    I guess it’s true what they say about chess players going crazy in their old age lol

    • @miorioff
      @miorioff Год назад +144

      To be fair we all do.
      It's just more funny when it happens with very smart people 😂

    • @Bismarck-S
      @Bismarck-S Год назад +73

      Bobby Fischer flashbacks

    • @fbch32
      @fbch32 Год назад +19

      and that could possibly cost him cause Kramnik better deliver because I think this sentence 16:21 can be used to show malicious intent in a defamation case

    • @themusicalplatypus2812
      @themusicalplatypus2812 Год назад +5

      Holy crap, Lois. A TimTom cameo!

    • @ismegam1621
      @ismegam1621 Год назад +5

      From drama to drama, TimTom hops like a llama. Just a joke love ur videos

  • @matthis8888
    @matthis8888 Год назад +1254

    Getting cheating accusations from a world champion because you are too good is the definition of suffering from succes

  • @josh8584
    @josh8584 Год назад +214

    The fact that Hikaru got another 45 game winstreak out of spite is just legendary.

  • @0x2d2
    @0x2d2 Год назад +801

    Anyone who has watched Hikaru play on stream knows he isn’t cheating. His premoves and the way he talks through his strategy is insane

    •  Год назад +30

      I echo your thoughts; my agreement aligns with yours.

    • @EnigmaChess
      @EnigmaChess Год назад +7

      to be fair, around the times hans cheated online, he streamed and explained his moves

    • @0x2d2
      @0x2d2 Год назад +30

      @@EnigmaChess honestly I never watched Hans, but I went through a few of his blitz streaming videos to see and from what I saw you really can't compare his speed and discussions with his chat to what Hikaru does.

    • @ChrisJohnson777
      @ChrisJohnson777 Год назад +17

      For real. It's the dumbest accusation and kramnik is ruining his legacy

    • @hermdog715
      @hermdog715 Год назад +11

      How the f can you cheat on 3 minute games anyway?

  • @hariodinio
    @hariodinio Год назад +938

    Hikaru: gets forced to play against players leagues below their rating
    Hikaru: Stomps those players
    Kramnik: *Surprised pikachu face*

  • @Therenaissancemanchild
    @Therenaissancemanchild Год назад +281

    Hikaru cheating against 2800 hundreds would be like me taking steroids and then dunking on a 3 year old. Or getting in a fight with a rabbit and running inside to grab my bazooka. The man is definitely capable of beating 2800's, and if I beat up 40 chickens, no one will accuse me of unlicensed firearm ownership.

    • @hermdog715
      @hermdog715 Год назад +20

      40 chickens in an octagon against you might not be so easy. That's a lot of chickens

    • @admiralensin.
      @admiralensin. Год назад +36

      @@hermdog715you fight them one at a time, its just a win streak.

    • @NeunEinser
      @NeunEinser Год назад +12

      Haven't you played Ocarina of Time? Those birds are brutal when you hurt them!

    • @Fritzgar
      @Fritzgar Год назад +6

      46 Chickens and one gets a tie against you :D

    • @YesSir-mz6ds
      @YesSir-mz6ds Год назад

      😄😄

  • @xiaozhang7103
    @xiaozhang7103 Год назад +2149

    Kramnik never fails to make Hans look like the good guy

    • @gilly_the_fish
      @gilly_the_fish Год назад +131

      That's a hell of an accomplishment. But then again, Kramnik speaks for itself.

    • @Difas0
      @Difas0 Год назад +84

      Hans is pretty based though

    • @leventunver
      @leventunver Год назад +85

      Hans is indeed the better guy.

    • @zhilaxfow7888
      @zhilaxfow7888 Год назад +2

      Ha haaaaaa

    • @neoclassicvii154
      @neoclassicvii154 Год назад +2

      Wow, Inferi fan

  • @angelzashez
    @angelzashez Год назад +252

    I’m not a mathematician but I think it makes logical sense that if you pick up a coin and flip it 5 times the odds of getting 5 heads is low... But if you flip it a few hundred times it's bound to happen... And Hikaru has better odds than 50/50 in these games.

    • @lissythearchitect
      @lissythearchitect Год назад +20

      Exactly. I used to work in the gambling industry. Progressive jackpots are rarely won by an individual. Our top progressive jackpot was won most weeks, and every month Occasionally it was won more than once a week. Streaks are a second layer of hidden likelihood - the chance I may win, say, a specific set of 46 games in a row may be around 1%, but if I play hundreds or thousands, the chance of there being one or more such streaks in that larger set is rather high.

    • @justvani9366
      @justvani9366 Год назад +15

      @@lissythearchitect , I would like to include my statement as well. One of the biggest Kramink's mistake is that he takes the online ELO (which is ridiculously inflated) but not the real FIDE ELO of the players. Hikaru is 2800+ and the IMs are 2300+ real ratings which means that these 500 points correlate to 95% winning chance for Hikaru! If they play 100 games, 95 will be won by Hikaru and there could be 4 draws and 1 loss.
      But Hikaru played only 10+ games with one IM and then with another IM. Not enough data to conclude anything 'interesting'.

    • @HowTo-kj7gx
      @HowTo-kj7gx Год назад +1

      neither am i but i absolustly agree

    • @Aetheraev
      @Aetheraev Год назад +5

      I am a mathematician and you are absolutely correct

    • @steveselanne9773
      @steveselanne9773 Год назад

      The guy had this kind of strikes 5 times over the last month. He had them previous months too etc. Calculate the probability now.

  • @l3igl2eaper
    @l3igl2eaper Год назад +417

    Kramnik: It is mathematically impossible to flip heads 10 times in a row!
    Mathematicians: Uhh, not if you flip the coin 4100 times. It's very likely to see it somewhere in that chain.
    Kramnik: I delete your comment!

    • @joesmith1946
      @joesmith1946 Год назад +8

      Absolutely, you made the point perfectly.

    • @MrGatlingGuy
      @MrGatlingGuy Год назад

      @@joesmith1946 Yes exactly...

    • @rorschach775
      @rorschach775 Год назад +17

      He is a pro at Russian debate. If he could drop math out of a window he probably would.

    • @gutenbird
      @gutenbird Год назад +7

      and not if the coin has 10 heads and 1 tail. It's not like Hikaru is playing with even odds. That's like saying MJ was playing with even odds against inferior players.

    • @sagniksingha
      @sagniksingha Год назад

      Doesn't matter even if you flip a coin 1 billion times, flipping 10 heads consecutively has same probability. Each flip is independent of the other. What is your calculation here?

  • @mrdobivka9091
    @mrdobivka9091 Год назад +2784

    We all know that Hikaru hides a stockfish bot on his ceiling. That's why he looks at it while calculating moves.
    (edit: AYO 2,6k likes that's my new record!)

    • @LilBigHuge
      @LilBigHuge Год назад +100

      Maybe he's just tranquilized out of his mind pulling a Queen's Gambit.

    • @AndrewH1994
      @AndrewH1994 Год назад +97

      alternatively, stockfish is hiding in his headphones, which is why he always wears them, and plays so well so often!
      I am joking. I don’t think Hikaru cheated

    • @jstyles322-y3p
      @jstyles322-y3p Год назад +31

      Imagine if this is what Kramnik says

    • @pen_g_win1027
      @pen_g_win1027 Год назад +28

      Nah Stockfish lives in his ceiling, but Stockfish is the me studying hikaru

    • @alexrobinet7576
      @alexrobinet7576 Год назад +3

      Lol

  • @ReklawLah
    @ReklawLah Год назад +792

    Calling it the "Hikaru Cheating Scandal" gives it credibility when it deserves none.

    • @objective_psychology
      @objective_psychology Год назад +59

      Exactly, the real scandal here is Kramnik being a POS

    • @ShooterEx
      @ShooterEx Год назад +62

      "Kramnik went insane and doesn't now statistcs scandal"

    • @KevinSnyder22
      @KevinSnyder22 Год назад +11

      "the accusation drama by an irrational former world champ" non-scandal

    • @masoodjalal1152
      @masoodjalal1152 Год назад +3

      @@KevinSnyder22 So Magnus is an irrational world champ?

    • @arnavrawat9864
      @arnavrawat9864 Год назад +1

      That's the nature of clickbait.

  • @ArjanKop
    @ArjanKop Год назад +491

    Kramnik is basically saying his own genetic makeup is nonexistent because the likelihood of obtaining it while randomly picking four nucleotides a few billion times to get to this exact sequence is pretty much 0. I’ll give him a statistics course for dummies at a rate of 500 euros an hour.

    • @colin7917
      @colin7917 Год назад +82

      It’s actually mind blowing to me how so many smart people, even a chess legend like Kramnik, don’t understand the basics of stochastic theory and still choose to talk about this topic as if they do understand

    • @Noah_M5
      @Noah_M5 Год назад +17

      He clearly cheated, there's no other explanation
      Edit: This was sarcasm, as in Kramnick must be cheating in this circumstance by his own logic, which is just so stupid it mustn't be true, I don't think Hikaru is cheating

    • @uchicha_itachi
      @uchicha_itachi Год назад +44

      As a PhD Machine Learning student, it's sooooo sad that people's skill in comprehending statistics is so kow

    • @ArjanKop
      @ArjanKop Год назад +4

      @@colin7917 but please, just let me make a bit of money? He obviously won’t even notice 😂

    • @ryannorris6128
      @ryannorris6128 Год назад +19

      He’s stuck on the first rise of the Dunning-Kruger curve.

  • @rayriley1334
    @rayriley1334 Год назад +114

    Hikaru has proven himself In person, over the board many times over. There are literally maybe 10 people in the world who could consistently give him a run for his money. Why is this even a question?

    • @khangle6872
      @khangle6872 Год назад +2

      There's like 4-5 if you only count Bullet

  • @apothecary4371
    @apothecary4371 Год назад +99

    I think they also forgot to include the factor of resignations. a lot of higher level player will just forfeit a losing position, especially against Hikaru. So its less about winning the game and more about getting to a point where you probably win the game. Resignations in general are going to significantly increase the chances of Hikaru getting a win streak. However, I'm not a mathematician nor am I good at chess, so maybe I'm overvaluing one factor.

    • @ThatGuy-nv7cx
      @ThatGuy-nv7cx Год назад +20

      Don’t forget the flagging factor as well. There were at least 6 games where he was clearly losing during that streak but was able to flag his opponent. If it was 3+1 even, he most likely would’ve lost those matches

    • @jorgewilliam7103
      @jorgewilliam7103 Год назад +3

      ​@@ThatGuy-nv7cxflashback to kramnik throwing a similar hissy fit at flagging in online tournaments last year.

    • @luigivercotti6410
      @luigivercotti6410 Год назад

      Resignations are accounted for by the ELO system. A win is a win, and the chances are updated whether you get mated, forfeit, lose on time, lose connection, or anything else

    • @Astroqualia
      @Astroqualia 7 месяцев назад

      This drives me nuts in my low elo. People resign when I want to practice winning endgames to avoid draws ):

  • @mikebould5651
    @mikebould5651 Год назад +87

    If Martin wins 40+ in a row, then we got a problem

    • @martinonmountains
      @martinonmountains Год назад +1

      Until I started playing chess I didn’t think my name was a burden really 😅

  • @iluxa-4000
    @iluxa-4000 Год назад +522

    It's so stupid that I don't even know where to start. People jumped on Hikaru, accusing him of cheating because he won 45 out of 46 games. And not a single thought crossed their minds. First - what does he gain from this? Cool, he set a new elo record. And it gives him literally nothing lol. And to risk his whole career for it? Seems absolutely insane to me. Second - as Levy said, he was playing the same people over and over again. Would it be crazy if Kramnik beat me in chess 50 times in a row? No, not at all. Chess is not a random game, so when you're significantly better than someone - you will beat them *very* consistently. Third one - the "with the average rating of 2950" line. Yes, 2950, which is quite a lot less than his current rating :D

    • @itamarowak
      @itamarowak Год назад +58

      ong ong frfrfr
      Kramnik is such a skibidi for going after hikaru
      Edit: wait someone actually liked this comment WTF i dont even understand half of what i was saying

    • @Marveryn
      @Marveryn Год назад +42

      right if someone like levy who at his best is at 2600 and he plays someone at `1900. 9 times out of 10 he will win. if he plays a thousand games against 1900's at some point he going to get 50 game win streak. which is pretty much what Hikaru was doing. if you look at the elo players he was playing vesus himself it was such a huge drop off. Unless hikura is playing someone in the caliber of fabio and so on he should win at least 75% of his games.
      With that win streak yeah he going to get some pretty high win streaks.

    • @RMF49
      @RMF49 Год назад +15

      Also Hikaru got the record before going 45.5 / 46.

    • @KNNY61
      @KNNY61 Год назад +12

      Surely Kramnik is not so stupid as to think his comment did not insinuate Hikaru was cheating. He's turning into a giant troll, and needs to change his diet; those sour grapes are affecting his thinking. 🙄

    • @milos8024
      @milos8024 Год назад +2

      I thought Dream wasn't cheating because he had nothing to gain from it and that he wouldn't risk his career for nothing. But well..

  • @user-yz1gd2ut3s
    @user-yz1gd2ut3s Год назад +255

    Hikaru is so good he tought Hikaru was cheating

    • @thatonefrenchguy937
      @thatonefrenchguy937 Год назад +18

      He's the same as me but it's real for me
      (J o k e)

    • @Rudy137
      @Rudy137 Год назад +1

      @@thatonefrenchguy937 rel
      (Not a joke I cheat at chess 😈)

    • @mecazor
      @mecazor Год назад

      Thought

  • @Glenn-tj3fk
    @Glenn-tj3fk Год назад +55

    I"d find it extremely painful being accused by a person you've had a great time with in the past

    • @supersayan6318
      @supersayan6318 Год назад +13

      Jealousy is a hellavu drug.

    • @gideoncheung8731
      @gideoncheung8731 Год назад +3

      makes me remember scottie pippen somehow:/

    • @UndisputedONE2
      @UndisputedONE2 Год назад

      @@gideoncheung8731 tbf Scottie Pippen is a wreck of a personality of his past due to personal life struggles and other stuff. His opinion on the sports matter also changed over time. it happenz

    • @zes3813
      @zes3813 Год назад

      wrgg

    • @neruneri
      @neruneri 9 месяцев назад +1

      Yeah that's the thing I feel like people are overlooking. When a random accuses you, sure it's a compliment. But Kramnik is supposed to be his peer. His colleague.

  • @johnhightshoe996
    @johnhightshoe996 Год назад +164

    Being a data analyst myself this is the first thing I thought, even though we see less than 1% as holy crap that’s very unlikely but when you realize the size of the data set and then you see that it’s really not outside the realm of possibility. We can see this in other areas like when the bulls won 72 games in a season and the probability of it ever happening again is super low but we saw it again with the Warriors a few years back again. If there is a possibility that something can happen it’s going to happen. We as humans can only really comprehend data sets with small amounts of numbers so when you start to look into anything that is getting bigger our brain start to intuitively forces things to fit what we expect, ie less than 1% is impossible.
    What I really see is an old man who had his hay day in Chess and now is fighting to stay relevant, and after seeing what happened with the Neiman/Carlson speculation he knows he’s going to be on all the RUclips channels and be relevant again for at least a day. It’s really sad honestly, but it’s going to destroy his chance at ever being relevant again.

    • @grovsyanka
      @grovsyanka Год назад

      There is a possibility that you will die tomorrow during breakfast. It’s going to happen. Be careful.

    • @borandiUK
      @borandiUK Год назад +3

      Funny thing is, Golden State had a 73 win season. Unlikely events happen more often than people think

    • @biray4710
      @biray4710 Год назад +7

      Very well put. Let me say it from a gamer's perspective. If 1% was extremely improbable, nobody would be able to get a 1% mount drop. Yet you see people running around with rare mounts all the time.

    • @melvinkipkemboi9427
      @melvinkipkemboi9427 Год назад

      Murphy's law?

    • @guiladshmaya1
      @guiladshmaya1 Год назад

      ​@@borandiUKit happened 30 years later though..

  • @dustinrhodes2546
    @dustinrhodes2546 Год назад +91

    Kramnik's misunderstanding of statistics is very common in the public as well with regard to flood probabilities. People are stunned that a 1 in 100 year or 1 in 500 year event happens often. But when you consider the probability over 50 states, or 5000 cities, it is almost certain to see these events on the news frequently.

  • @KappaMan123
    @KappaMan123 Год назад +181

    I’m really glad you included the mathematicians comment. I’m no mathematics major, but I’ve taken some statistics classes to know kramniks “statistics” are biased and flawed, as most of statistics is, but when you account for the bias, Hikarus results are not statistically significant. Good stuff Gotham 😎👍

    • @okolenmi7511
      @okolenmi7511 Год назад +2

      -_- it's not biased for such a case. Admit that you are too lazy to calculate everything yourself and will simply float with the crowd to get likes, but at the same time blame an innocent person.

    • @iguoyrxayananikihs9505
      @iguoyrxayananikihs9505 Год назад +5

      ​@@okolenmi7511Innocent person, prey tell who being??

    • @DomiaAbrWyrda
      @DomiaAbrWyrda Год назад +6

      @@okolenmi7511 this is a trivial and well known exercise in the realm of probability, you don't even need to calculate numbers in order to tell that it is very likely that every once in a while a 1 % probability event will occur
      The most famous exercise being the probability of having people with the same birthday in one class.
      Do kindly refrain from advertising your incompetence in certain levels of subjects.

    • @KappaMan123
      @KappaMan123 Год назад

      @@DomiaAbrWyrda well the birthday statistic is misleading because I’m pretty sure in a classroom of ~23 there is a 1/2 chance of two people having the same birthday but okolenmi is just stupid lol

    • @2894031
      @2894031 4 месяца назад

      I would conclude from your comment that you either failed your statistics class or it was a really really elementary one 😹

  • @mrdobivka9091
    @mrdobivka9091 Год назад +183

    As a 600 elo player I can confirm that Hikaru makes every top engine move

    • @dob4592
      @dob4592 Год назад +21

      I'm 601 and I agree.

    • @SkinWynne
      @SkinWynne Год назад

      as a 602, i think i could take him@@dob4592

    • @valiantwarrior1988
      @valiantwarrior1988 Год назад +37

      ​@@dob4592the dominance you've showed by saying 601, makes me wanna agree with you

    • @noahmaas1670
      @noahmaas1670 Год назад +8

      No idea what my elo is, but I beat a lego chess game way back on Windows 98 so basically I am pro. Hikaru OP

    • @dob4592
      @dob4592 Год назад

      @@valiantwarrior1988 the extra elo point speaks for itself

  • @huelias64
    @huelias64 Год назад +165

    Kramnik is the perfect example that being good at chess is not related to being intelligent in general

    • @Casa-de-hongos
      @Casa-de-hongos Год назад +7

      Also, slightly above average intelligence people are much more prone to some biases that lead to fall for conspiracies and simmilar stupid outcomes.

    • @asdfghyter
      @asdfghyter Год назад +6

      @@Casa-de-hongos yeah, overconfidence from being good at one thing is a huge problem. that's why there are so many crackpots with PHDs

    • @ssgoko88
      @ssgoko88 Год назад

      ​@@Casa-de-hongoswrong, people who believe in conspiracies are narcissists who parrot intelligent things they hear and falsely appear more intelligent.

    • @oponamikwe5011
      @oponamikwe5011 Год назад +1

      yep. you are smart in chess but it does not make you a genius in social skills🤣🤣

    • @2894031
      @2894031 4 месяца назад

      Sorry but that’s factually incorrect , they are highly correlated 💁🏿‍♀️

  • @rock21611
    @rock21611 Год назад +233

    Okay, I don’t know anything about Kramnik, but after hearing about his own accusations of cheating, and not knowing if his innocence was ever proven, I’m reminded of a saying. “A thief is someone who thinks that everyone steals.”
    *Edit* In the interest of fairness, after seeing this comment get more traffic than I'm used to, I went and did some research, and it _does_ seem that most reasonable conclusions point to Kramnik's accusers being either liars or deluded. While his accusation of Hikaru is no less ridiculous, I will retract my own implied accusation of cheating in light of this, until such time as I am given compelling evidence otherwise.

    • @jejxkxk
      @jejxkxk Год назад +16

      True. When he was accused of cheating, did he show up and prove them wrong? No, he forfeited the game. A little suspicious. Kramnik can’t play without cheats

    • @doomse150
      @doomse150 Год назад +6

      Not trying to defend the guy, but on a purely factual basis, you can NEVER prove innocence. That's why rules like "innocent until proven guilty" are so damn important.

    • @masoodjalal1152
      @masoodjalal1152 Год назад +1

      @@jejxkxk When he accused Hans of cheating, did he show up and prove it? No, he forfeited the game. A little suspicious. Magnus can’t accept/digest defeat.

    • @FormerPessitheRobberfan
      @FormerPessitheRobberfan Год назад +5

      ​@@masoodjalal1152That doesn't make sense? Magnus wasn't the one accused of cheating?

    • @quill444
      @quill444 Год назад +1

      This is the truly sad thing, because if you are over age fifty, you will remember that on a good day, Vladimir Kramnik was every bit as good as Garry Kasparov. - j q t -

  • @DustinHasVideos
    @DustinHasVideos Год назад +57

    Kramnik is protecting his legacy. It’s common to make a huge controversy to hide your previous controversy. He is trying to make sure when you google Kramnik cheating you find this story and not the story about him cheating previously

    • @joshl4111
      @joshl4111 Год назад +19

      Absolutely this. This is classic reputation management.

    • @SpeedoKeisy6
      @SpeedoKeisy6 Год назад +3

      Genuinely such a decent point. Thx for the comment

    • @eagle-eye29
      @eagle-eye29 Год назад +15

      Kramnik just destroyed his legacy. He now looks like a jealous fool 🤡

    • @savanthuman8809
      @savanthuman8809 Год назад

      Politics suck

    • @mandobrook
      @mandobrook Год назад +6

      That makes no sense. This debacle has all but completely destroyed his reputation and the earlier incident is almost universally seen as totally laughable.

  • @ysf-d9i
    @ysf-d9i Год назад +76

    it would be like the greatest comeback in the history of chess if kramnik actually produced irrefutable stats to prove it (obviously because of how impossible it is)

    • @dessertstorm7476
      @dessertstorm7476 Год назад +17

      he cant really prove anything with stats, he can only say how probable something is (according to his interpretation).

  • @Peterkringle
    @Peterkringle Год назад +101

    Kramnik saw what the Hans scandal did for chess and felt it was his obligation to the chess community to expand its popularity further. Thanks VK!

    • @chriszhang1660
      @chriszhang1660 Год назад +7

      Putin saw what Putin did for Ukraine and felt it was his obligation to the world to lose a war to Ukraine. Thanks VP!

    • @Jeremo-FD
      @Jeremo-FD Год назад +6

      There's no beads in this story so it's not as popular in mainstream culture.

    • @Peterkringle
      @Peterkringle Год назад

      @@Jeremo-FD what do you mean "heads?"

    • @Jeremo-FD
      @Jeremo-FD Год назад +2

      @@Peterkringle sry autocorrect. I meant "beads"

  • @विनयजोशी1
    @विनयजोशी1 Год назад +34

    Hikaru deserves an apology from that man

  • @s1lentsymphony607
    @s1lentsymphony607 Год назад +50

    That 10% is probably way higher when you take into account the ELO difference, and the fact he tends to play one person multiple times. The more you play someone, the more you're going to understand the *way* they play.

    • @drqstic1059
      @drqstic1059 Год назад +16

      Not to mention being beaten 3+ times in a row will easily disrupt your mental. There's so many (external) factors that make a win streak like this very likely.

    • @justvani9366
      @justvani9366 Год назад +2

      @@drqstic1059 One of the biggest Kramink's mistake is that he takes the online ELO (which is ridiculously inflated) but not the real FIDE Elo of the players. Hikaru is 2800+ and the IMs are 2300+ real ratings which means that these 500 points correlate to 95% winning chance for Hikaru! If they play 100 games, 95 will be won by Hikaru and there could be 4 draws and 1 loss.
      Hikaru only played 10+ games with IMs and then switch to another player. Not enough data for Kramnik. Just toilet fireworks. :)

    • @drqstic1059
      @drqstic1059 Год назад +1

      @@justvani9366 Absolutely true.

    • @2894031
      @2894031 4 месяца назад

      It never occurred to you that the more you play a person the more that person will understand the way you play? 😹😹😹

  • @zllay
    @zllay Год назад +86

    Levy never fails to change his video title every 30 minutes.

    • @rindal3042
      @rindal3042 Год назад +9

      It’s likely one of those companies that change titles and thumbnails and stuff to figure out what works best for the algorithm

  • @chrisb8698
    @chrisb8698 Год назад +366

    Levy always trying to put Hikaru inside us

  • @DrkTheNewGuy
    @DrkTheNewGuy Год назад +21

    Hikaru isn't cheating, he's just looking at the ceiling and asking god what to do

  • @kylezo
    @kylezo Год назад +4

    i guess his fence sitting stance is that he's "just saying" everyone should be "looked into" more often and equally and uses that to hide behind "i'm not actually accusing"

  • @gregasrde5814
    @gregasrde5814 Год назад +12

    Interesting point is that a lot of stats given by Kramnik assume each game to be an independent event which leads to seemingly impossible stats of (.77)^45, but this fails to account for several factors such as the effect of playing the games back to back and against the same opponent in multiple games.

    • @justvani9366
      @justvani9366 Год назад +1

      One of the biggest Kramink's mistake is that he takes the online ELO (which is ridiculously inflated) but not the real FIDE Elo of the players. Hikaru is 2800+ and the IMs are 2300+ real ratings which means that these 500 points correlate to 95% winning chance for Hikaru! If they play 100 games, 95 will be won by Hikaru and there could be 4 draws and 1 loss.
      Hikaru only played 10+ games with IMs and then switch to another players. Not enough data for Kramnik. Just toilet fireworks. :) Not to mention the fact that he excludes the 'farming lower rated opponents' and flagging components. Because a flagging where Hikaru would loose is counted as win.

  • @L1MERS
    @L1MERS Год назад +81

    i wish Kramnik a speedy recovery!

    • @NoComplience
      @NoComplience Год назад +2

      😂😂😂

    • @billj4525
      @billj4525 Год назад +3

      He's extremely paranoid. If he can start looking at things more realistically and accurately then it's possible.

    • @crypti1c
      @crypti1c Год назад

      @@billj4525 except its extremely hard to convince anyone out of their paranoia, especially someone whos been at or near the top of their field for so long that they can't understand when they might be reading way too far into something

  • @hyperthreaded
    @hyperthreaded Год назад +7

    Kramnik ist prime evidence for the theory that chess abilities and general intelligence aren't correlated

  • @zencookiegod7740
    @zencookiegod7740 Год назад +5

    would you think that if an 1100 beat a bunch of 800s in 3min blitz that would be suspicious?

    • @billmorrigan386
      @billmorrigan386 Год назад

      Imagine beating them 45.5 - 0.5 in 3 min blitz games.
      Ain't that interesting? Of course, it can be dismissed as a lucky streak. Heck, people even win lotteries!

  • @beastyff1792
    @beastyff1792 11 месяцев назад +2

    Levy made this entire video to show us how magnus insulted hikaru in the first tweet

  • @monkeydguts4181
    @monkeydguts4181 Год назад +26

    imagine being so good that you get accused for cheating

  • @ciosnek5
    @ciosnek5 Год назад +21

    Hikaru said it. He's a 500 ELO mathematician 😂

  • @RomanNumural9
    @RomanNumural9 Год назад +8

    PhD student here in math finance (which is mostly stats). The post you showed about the mathematician is exactly what I was thinking the whole video. I really want the accuser to post his stats so I can read what he thinks went wrong. I will be absolutely floored if his analysis isn't completely unhinged.

  • @Rawrkorn
    @Rawrkorn Год назад +1

    Nice recap you did really well providing all of the relevant facts. Especially keeping the video to the low 20 minutes

  • @cheetah219
    @cheetah219 Год назад +7

    Gotham point at the 6 minute mark is absolutely spot on.
    Before 2020, I didn't know any modern famous chess players except for Gary Kasparov or Bobby Fischer. But magnus, Haikaru...no I didn't know them to put it simply.
    But the skill for these players was always there, the public, like me, just didn't know them.
    And then, other twitch and youtubers started playing chess, quarantine, and then Hikaru and Gotham really blew up after 2020.
    Even Magnus got a resurgence and other GMs like Naroditsky, Rosen, Fabi...all of these players had a career resurgence

  • @toasteroven6761
    @toasteroven6761 Год назад +6

    If Hikaru was a cheater, he'd be called The Beads of '87

  • @TheWildSlayer
    @TheWildSlayer Год назад +3

    Kramnik calculating his way into the grave

  • @mastersanada
    @mastersanada Год назад +2

    Soon enough Hikaru is gonna install a computer display cam and roof cam just for Kramnik

  • @Klatubarada1979
    @Klatubarada1979 Год назад +2

    If I played opponents 600 points below my rating id get 45 win streaks on the regular

  • @alex86fire
    @alex86fire Год назад +5

    I don't understand why Kramnik wants this to be his legacy... It's insane to me.

  • @jonasschmift4126
    @jonasschmift4126 Год назад +25

    The most absurd about the allegation is that Hikaru has nothing to gain from cheating. His streaming and youtube brings a lot more money in than any of the chess events and definitely more than being 3336 Elo for a short time in Blitz. Now if he cheats and gets caught he would endanger his money-bringing job. If sb else cheats it is a risk/gain calculation. How much can I gain being better in chess? How probable is it that I am caught? But for Hikaru there is no gain. Only risk. And risk with extremely high loss. It would be completely braindead to cheat in his position (which he obv didn’t) and it is similarly braindead to think that he did.

    • @tvrskkngdm2333
      @tvrskkngdm2333 Год назад

      As long he is "great"... I m convinced he was cheating in yrs. That explains his movements. Not in last tourneys but he DID. And he plays narrowed repertoire. Now he doesn't need it most of the times

    • @AfonsoCL
      @AfonsoCL Год назад +2

      @@tvrskkngdm2333 What are you even trying to say? Try harder, Ivan.

  • @PlutoMonkey-rr5hd
    @PlutoMonkey-rr5hd Год назад +5

    “The roooooooook” screamed in the first 30 seconds , new record

  • @Hidinginyourcupboard
    @Hidinginyourcupboard Год назад +2

    This is also known as the 'backfire effect', where people double-down when shown to be wrong

  • @AsterJ
    @AsterJ Год назад +15

    Being one of the greatest chess players of all time apparently doesn't prevent you from being a complete clown

    • @khangle6872
      @khangle6872 Год назад

      Actually, it kinda does if you are on Bobby Fischer level.

  • @Jordan-qb3ed
    @Jordan-qb3ed Год назад +10

    Rip my respect for Kramnik

  • @Scorey__23
    @Scorey__23 Год назад +12

    “Your honor They’re glazing” killed me 😂😂😂

  • @ScottWaltonDev
    @ScottWaltonDev Год назад +8

    12:37 Hikaru also talked about the effect of tilt so, I’m guessing, a statistician could possibly build a Markov chain to nudge up the probability that the winner keeps winning against the same opponent.

  • @BiosTheo
    @BiosTheo Год назад +1

    Given a large enough sample size all probabilities, no matter how improbable, become certainties.

  •  Год назад +6

    Hikaru is the absolute last person on Earth who would even contemplate cheating in any chess game.

  • @xabu2850
    @xabu2850 Год назад +26

    I was thinking of posting this on the last video: you said something like 2% probability of this happening. So if Hikaru plays 50 games a day, we would expect this to happen about every two months.
    So these chess cheating scandals seem to basically be "look at this really not that low probability event with thousands of observations and it happened once"

    • @davcrav
      @davcrav Год назад +14

      Indeed. I was expecting when he started his "statistics" saying something like "this outcome is a 1 in 10 billion" or something like that. At least seven sigma. But 1%? Oh, you mean like it happens three times a year if you do something every day?

    • @zura17
      @zura17 Год назад +2

      Hikaru did a 40 game win streak again yesterday on stream

    • @justvani9366
      @justvani9366 Год назад

      One of the biggest Kramink's mistake is that he takes the online ELO (which is ridiculously inflated) but not the real FIDE Elo of the players. Hikaru is 2800+ and the IMs are 2300+ real ratings which means that these 500 points correlate to 95% winning chance for Hikaru! If they play 100 games, 95 will be won by Hikaru and there could be 4 draws and 1 loss.
      Hikaru only played 10+ games with IMs and then switch to another players. Not enough data for Kramnik. Just toilet fireworks. :) Not to mention the fact that he excludes the 'farming lower rated opponents' and flagging components. Because a flagging where Hikaru would loose is counted as win.
      These 2% that Kramnik is talking about are not correct...

  • @mrdobivka9091
    @mrdobivka9091 Год назад +73

    Levy never fails to feature himself in a GothamChess videos

    • @guayabamecanica
      @guayabamecanica Год назад +2

      Hikaru will probably complain tomorrow about this.

    • @octobsession3061
      @octobsession3061 Год назад +1

      Levy never fails to be Levy in every GothamChess video

  • @bradlupien2770
    @bradlupien2770 Год назад +4

    “Chess doesn’t drive people mad; it keeps mad people sane” - some guy

  • @jonathanlivingston7358
    @jonathanlivingston7358 Год назад +17

    Man you’re so good at what you do

  •  Год назад +4

    If Hikaru were to resort to cheating in a chess game, the repercussions could metaphorically create a gravitational pull of consequences, akin to the powerful force of a black hole.

  • @mhl2674
    @mhl2674 Год назад +6

    Rule #1 in life: when you realize you are in a hole, stop digging. Kramnik sadly doesn't see how hopeless this is for him.

  • @susbedo9258
    @susbedo9258 Год назад +23

    Chessbrah Eric Hansen even came out and says he is 99.99% sure that Hikaru is not cheating and even says that Kramnik's allegations are wildy misleading. Hikaru x Eric Hansen's bad blood runs really really deep in the past and i think this speak volumes how ridiculous this accusation is.

    • @elmerruddock6546
      @elmerruddock6546 Год назад +2

      What happened between Hansen and Hikaru?

    • @ragnablade5397
      @ragnablade5397 10 месяцев назад

      @@elmerruddock6546 a well known fist fight

  • @nolanmccune8982
    @nolanmccune8982 Год назад +5

    The fact Hikaru did the streak again shows how he doesn’t care about this accusation lol

  • @jamesflames6987
    @jamesflames6987 Год назад +2

    1% is an EXTREMELY low chance. Unless Hikaru has somehow played more than 100 chess games in his career. Does anyone know if it's possible he has done that?

  • @muhammadaminkozimov1528
    @muhammadaminkozimov1528 Год назад +1

    Another demonstration of the fact that being good at chess doesn't mean you are actually smart

  • @billyocean9236
    @billyocean9236 Год назад +15

    This is truly a shame. I actually admired that Kramnik was publicly taking a stand against cheaters online. Unfortunately, that train derailed before it gained traction and has entered a disgusting territory. I do not think Hikaru is not cheating. He is just one of the greats.

    • @masoodjalal1152
      @masoodjalal1152 Год назад

      You liked Kramnik before, but the moment he turned his guns towards someone you like (you are biased towards). You are now turning your back on your stance. Why not investigate it and prove Hikaru's innocence. They did the whole investigation for Hans, why cant they do for Hikaru? If he didnt cheat, it would be revealed in the investigation. What Kramnik said is perfectly reasonable, Hikaru shouldnt get special treatment just because he is fan favorite.
      Funny thing is when Hans was accused everyone attacked him and went out of their way to make the most absurd arguments like "beads", but right now everyone is defending Hikaru like he is their daddy. Double standards.

    • @afonsosolano5274
      @afonsosolano5274 Год назад

      ​@@masoodjalal1152Because they already very his games.

    • @prfwrx2497
      @prfwrx2497 Год назад

      ​@@masoodjalal1152probably because we've seen Hikaru cook. If your definition of cheating includes memorizing sets of openers, then sure, he's definitely "cheating". There's a reason he's best known for blitz and not regular chess.

    • @vercot7000
      @vercot7000 8 месяцев назад

      @@masoodjalal1152 They...already have investigated hikaru. What? did you forget 2016 BCC?

  • @unstoppable0120
    @unstoppable0120 Год назад +9

    Updates never fail to Levy us.

  • @loganpaulwastakenwastaken
    @loganpaulwastakenwastaken Год назад +13

    You’re more famous than kramnik will ever be. Never heard of 99% of chess people until I found your channel. Whether those nerds like it or not they need to respect and acknowledge how important you’ve been to the game of chess.

    • @Minerva6699
      @Minerva6699 Год назад +6

      Nah
      Kramnik is basically in world history forever

    • @griffinq8003
      @griffinq8003 Год назад +2

      Calm down buddy, Levy's ego is already big enough

  • @MagnusAnand
    @MagnusAnand Год назад +2

    Kramnik is going the Fischer route

  • @madmalkav6540
    @madmalkav6540 Год назад +1

    Clearly Kramnik didn’t play his good share of Rolemaster

  • @Frog-2001
    @Frog-2001 Год назад +18

    Wow. That last image. That made me kind of emotional. They look so happy, Kramnik was a cool guy too from the podcast I watched but this. Theres no reason for this, and doubling tripling and even quaddruppleing it just wow. Kramnik just turned himself into the biggest clown of chess overtaking my favorite clown of all time GohamChess who will the 2nd biggest clown on chess

    • @agarrikr2996
      @agarrikr2996 Год назад

      Wow, I’m waiting for the pin of glory/shame.
      Edit : don’t know which it will be. And yes, this is not an edit.

    • @masoodjalal1152
      @masoodjalal1152 Год назад

      Kramnik was cool guy until he turned his guns towards your beloved player. I dont see any problem with Kramnik's proposal, Hikaru should be investigated and if he is innocent, that will be proved as such. Turns out people would rather attack Kramnik for accusing Hikaru, but they were quick to jump in line with Magnus and Hikaru when they accused Nieman. If you keep the Hans Nieman Saga in mind and read the comments, you will see the double standards here.

    • @Frog-2001
      @Frog-2001 Год назад

      @@masoodjalal1152 Hans Niemann is litterally a confirmed cheater. He admitted to cheating in online game with money on the line. the game vs Magnus is still suspicious to this very day. His inability to analyse his own game,n inability to analyse without the board and the computer line showing(both of which he can do perfectly now for some reason),unable to explain the thought process behind moves, just out right saying wrong stuff is suspecious and was litterally never explained by him. Hikarus accusation on the other hand, is easily explainable and has been explained by many people but Kramnik still doubling down.

  • @jamesflames6987
    @jamesflames6987 Год назад +14

    Streaks are so common in series of random events that LACK of streaks is actually considered a red flag for fraud.

    • @neruneri
      @neruneri 9 месяцев назад

      Yes, because when someone is actually fiddling with it and trying to hide it, their intuition tells them to break up the streaks in non-random ways.

    • @vercot7000
      @vercot7000 8 месяцев назад

      @@neruneri "their intuition" can mean they take 500 different actions. Your comment doesn't really mean anything. it's like me saying "Tomorrow the sky could blow up". Yeah? Maybe that's what's happening?

    • @Mark_Cook
      @Mark_Cook 7 месяцев назад

      @@vercot7000
      He’s referring to when people fake data sets with a finite number of outcomes they intuitively prevent “streaks” because they think that would look to suspicious. Yet the absences of streaks is actually a huge red flag for fraud.
      If I told you to fake the results of 100 coin flips, you likely wouldn’t put a streak of 8 in a row of heads/tails, yet that is actually expected at least once if you actually flip it 100 times.

  • @sivelasquez
    @sivelasquez Год назад +3

    Imagine if Hikaru beats kramnik 45 times over the board in the most watched chess event of the year

  • @danielcrase
    @danielcrase 11 месяцев назад +1

    Hikaru may be “older” in chess, but the SHEER amount he plays is insane, without immense pressure, he calculates and explains on stream CONSTANTLY, he plays SO MUCH CHESS, he does SO MUCH CALCULATION, he sees SO MANY POSITIONS, HE PLAYS AND SEES AND DOES MORE THAN 99.95% of all chess players…. So he remains sharp, he is world number 3 I believe and he doesn’t even play anymore… all those factors, including the fact he plays on stream and explains everything and analyses and calculates and reads chat and get so zoned in and it’s obvious…. He doesn’t cheat, he’s simply is just THAT guy.

  • @Nephthys52
    @Nephthys52 Год назад +71

    Imagine unironicly thinking Hikaru is actually cheating. It's just such a wild situation. Like if someone told me this with no context, I'd honestly think it was a joke. Still do.

    • @ysf-d9i
      @ysf-d9i Год назад +2

      how do you know hikaru isn't cheating? ... on his wife

    • @4T0O
      @4T0O Год назад +2

      why can't someone think so? Anti-cheat measures should apply to everyone, even Hikaru, even Magnus, that's the main point.
      However, Kramnik interprets Hikaru's statistic wrong

    • @josephcorbin8073
      @josephcorbin8073 Год назад +24

      ​​​@@4T0Obecause if you watch his stream for more than 60 seconds, you quickly realize it's impossible. The guy literally verbalizes his stream of thought non-stop, telling us exactly why he's making a move, what effect it has on the game-state, how he expects his opponent to react, exactly which opening theory they are in with any variations, he premoves constantly, and all this while reading chat and answering random non-chess questions. Now you tell me why he can be cheating.

    • @4T0O
      @4T0O Год назад +1

      @@josephcorbin8073 I also do not think Hikaru is cheating. But my idea is that we can never be 100% sure talking about online chess that someone is not cheating

    • @josephcorbin8073
      @josephcorbin8073 Год назад +1

      @@4T0O fair enough, but I think the probability Hikaru would cheat is so negligible it is considered 0. Only if the many worlds interpretation of quantum mechanics is proven true would I concede it is possible 😉

  • @nico2319
    @nico2319 Год назад +3

    In 11:25 , to put it simply, lets say if levy and magnus play 1 game the probability of levy winning would be slim, but if they play a thousand games the chance of levy winning 1 game out of those 1000 games is very likely. The only one cheating here is kramnik on his math exams.

  • @mattdyne
    @mattdyne Год назад +3

    Levy is low-key my coolest friend.
    I don't know the guy but he feels like my friend

  • @Random_Geography
    @Random_Geography Год назад +1

    *look at the ceiling
    "Rook take d5, knight f6, take, take, take, trade, check, king g2, sacrifices da ruk, check, check, rook b2, take, here, sacrifices da queen, here, take, check, check, checkmated"
    "Easy mate in 21"

  • @lm7_gio
    @lm7_gio Год назад +1

    You know when some cool old guy that you like from your neighborhood starts saying things that make no sense, mistakens people's names etc, and you realise he has started loosing it due to dementia/alzheimer's/etc? That kind of sadness is what i feel for Kramnik right now.

  • @nemuonakpoya8592
    @nemuonakpoya8592 Год назад +4

    I dont think kramnik has seen hikaru's speed in puzzles... it's crazy to assume Hikaru of cheating lol. He is literally the best or 2nd best blitz player of all time... maybe kramnik will accuse magnus next😂.

  • @TopHatDroplet
    @TopHatDroplet Год назад +45

    Levy never fails to put this hikamura guy in his videos

  • @raidensama1511
    @raidensama1511 Год назад +5

    Once you understand Price’s Law then you’ll know why Hikaru is not cheating.

  • @zahawolfe
    @zahawolfe Год назад +1

    We need a world chess championship “craziness” tier list. Bobby Fisher #1 and Kramnik #2

  • @SomethingStupid_YT
    @SomethingStupid_YT Год назад +2

    Its sad to watch Levy lose admiration for one of his heroes.

  • @noahblack914
    @noahblack914 Год назад +18

    Now, I'm pretty confident Hikaru is legit. But, I'll never say he's too good to cheat. People say this all the time in speedrunning cheating scandals, and then it turns out the person was provably cheating. They feel entitled to the record _because_ they're so good.
    Still, the public numbers are with Hikaru. I'll be waiting for Kramnik's numbers.

    • @canadianguy8661
      @canadianguy8661 Год назад +7

      True, I think there’s an additional component to this case though because Hikaru would be jeopardizing 30 years of hard work, literally his entire life’s work. Which is a bigger risk than a speed runner

    • @noahblack914
      @noahblack914 Год назад +1

      @@canadianguy8661 Totally true. Like I said, I think Kramnik has it all wrong. But I just wanted to let it be said that "He's too good to cheat" is not a good argument.

    • @slicedtoad
      @slicedtoad Год назад +4

      @RaniaIsAwesome if his odds of winning are 14/15, the likelihood of winning 45 games in a row is NOT very low. It's (14/15)^45 = 0.045. So 4.5% chance that a set of 45 games will be all wins. If you play thousands of games, this will happen often.

  • @jloiterer
    @jloiterer Год назад +10

    "I believe it is clear You don't fully understand how probability works...." what a quote. I am team Hikaru on this one, it's ridiculous to accuse him of cheating. This dude accusing Hikaru is Salieri to Hikaru's Mozart....

  • @G0rdonFr33man
    @G0rdonFr33man Год назад +1

    "Strength in truth" - the favorite putler-ism quote from Bodrov move Brat 2.

  • @DIAMONDBOIII
    @DIAMONDBOIII Год назад +31

    Levy never fails to keep us posted on chess drama! Gothamchess is like the news channel but only for chess.

  • @nikitadeleon8647
    @nikitadeleon8647 Год назад +1

    This is just a small sample of how many polotics and media

  • @PushyPawn
    @PushyPawn Год назад +1

    China just released Beads v2.0 with which the user can communicate opponent's moves by "squeezing".

  • @Lemill1on
    @Lemill1on Год назад +12

    you know youre good when people call you a cheater

    • @masoodjalal1152
      @masoodjalal1152 Год назад

      So Hans is good?

    • @badcornflakes6374
      @badcornflakes6374 Год назад

      ​@@masoodjalal1152 A very strong chess player Hans is.

    • @JimmyKim-fb1ji
      @JimmyKim-fb1ji Год назад

      @@masoodjalal1152he is, 2675 fide rating and top 44 in the world pretty dang good if you ask me

  • @Dr.AbdoFlaha
    @Dr.AbdoFlaha Год назад +5

    The thing about super GMs is that it's nearly impossible to know if they cheated since they know all the theory and most endgame outcomes and all they need to know is 1 move unlike a regular person who needs multiple moves to build and convert an advantage, so how are you supposed to detect that??????
    IMO Hikaru doesn't seem like the type to cheat he already has everything a Chess player dreams of (alien like ELO/great fanbase/good sponsors...etc), so why would he jeopardize that?

    • @masoodjalal1152
      @masoodjalal1152 Год назад +1

      " so how are you supposed to detect that?????? "
      Aparently it is easy to do, since Hikaru and Magnus quickly detected that Han's cheated.

    • @Dr.AbdoFlaha
      @Dr.AbdoFlaha Год назад

      @@masoodjalal1152 they couldn't confirm it.

  • @陈祥智-y3v
    @陈祥智-y3v Год назад +10

    I totally agree with what the mathematician said. Even though I'm not of math degree or anything, just a little bit logical thinking is going to put me in the same conclusion as what the mathematician says. Funny how narrow minded Kremnik is, the guy really didn't realize how Online exposure is bigger than what he'd ever thought. People can judge freely online.
    Respect you Levy for covering this drama, never back down. Keep farming this out of us HAHA

    • @supersayan6318
      @supersayan6318 Год назад

      What is Levy covering up?
      Covering it up = hiding it
      Covering it = talking about it on his channel

    • @陈祥智-y3v
      @陈祥智-y3v Год назад +1

      @@supersayan6318 ohh my bad hahahaha i just realize it after reading your comment. Edited!

  • @afdalazman8257
    @afdalazman8257 Год назад

    The was one video in the past, Kramnik hallucinated a bit during a game of chess otb. and he is hallucinating again right now

  • @m00py1
    @m00py1 Год назад +1

    Mandate cavity searches before every play!

  • @Brazz27
    @Brazz27 Год назад +4

    I know some people who had a huge psychosis (I had to kick them away from my life), and Kremnik is having a similar attack right now by the way he's handling this on Twitter and overall.
    I hope he ends up being ok. That's kinda sad to see.
    And Im sorry for saying that if he ends up being right (which Im giving a 0.1% chance of happening as of now).