Definitely get you test levels checked in your late 20s, or at least by 30. I'm 32 and mine is well below normal. My NP said it probably started dropping in my 20s.
Thanks Clarence. I didnt know about the 10% rule, its an easy rule of thumb that can show me what is realistic. Btw thanks I became vegan after seeing your content. Cheers
@@IDiggPattyMayonnaise lifestyle changes can boost testosterone naturally, I understand some people need it for medical reasons. TRT is a lifelong commitment, put some deep thought into it before you jump on
The most refreshing answer by any fitness channel ever. Most dance around the question even if they don’t outright claim natural. Many give drawn out explanations for why they are/aren’t natural. The simple “no” gives no nuanced explanation or justification. Just the truth.
@@anotherhairlessapewithanop7455 nobody knows ur natty except you. Im saying that a natty claims their taking steroids to boost their rep...are you slow?
I'm sorry to dissapoint but I'm afraid you're a victim of Sophistry here, rather than critical reasoning. Clarence unfortunately committed the Classic Logical FALLACY of "slippery slope" -----that drug test cannot be 100% accurate, that there are drug cheats doesnt mean drug test is NOTHING. It also doesn't mean degree of rampancy of PED use is uniform across sports. Moreoever, it doesn't mean the degree of PED use in sports governed by WADA is at all comparable to the degree of PED use in unregulated sports. In fact, I would argue athletes in 100m and Olympic lifting use FAR LESS than those in more unregulated sports such as strongman, powerlifting, crossfit, and bodybuilding. To lump them all together and claim Olympic lifting is no different from your next door 24 hour gym or internet fitness guru is just a Gross oversimplification... I don't think anybody or WADA has ever claimed an athlete is completely NATURAL SIMPLY BECAUSE they pass its drug test. Their definition of "natural" is always qualified. Between an athlete who passes a drug test and an athelte who abuses PED as much as he wants there is a WORLD of difference. Clarence is knocking on an open door here
@@runhenry WADA don’t claim it. But the vast majority of the population think these guys are natural. They are portrayed as these superhero’s and given a bigger spotlight then “untested sports”. Meanwhile, they have a dirty little secret that they hide from the young, up and coming athletes by taking peds. That’s the problem.
No comparison to the King Clarence which is a honest atlethe. Mike O Tren isnt impressive, all this drugs injected, thats a sport for genderless who cant choose their hormone levels
USA Weightlifting has a largely successful propaganda campaign that purports all USA weightlifters as tested and natural. Coaches, when questioned about the natural status of their athletes, react with anger and whataboutism, pointing to USADA as the final decider of the issue. In my opinion, it's just American exceptionalism in PED form. Some of these up-and-coming unaffiliated athletes are adding 50kg to their total in a year, or squatting 210kg (with long levers) before they turn 20. And to address the classic American rebuttal, no, I do not believe we can simply look to totals for the answer, because we do not have a weightlifting farm system in this country akin to Eastern Europe or Asia. USAW and USADA have created an entire culture around fake natties.
This is such a weird video, just blanket statements based on nothing but conjecture and your own experience on gear. Seems an odd thing to say to outright generally the Chinese dope and Western Europeans are clean, what is that based on? Because they're outspoken on doping? The cycling world might have something to say about that.
I love that you actually allowed your video to be sponsored!!! I hate that it’s largely necessary to be profitable but I’m glad there’s a legitimate way to promote you. You’re a great guy and deserve to profit from your fans. Cheers brother!
One thing that i think that gets overlooked is the fact that you can still show benefits of PEDs even several years after taking them. I have a friend that would test natural bc he hasn't taken PEDs in 15 years but he can still bench 405 despite almost never working out...
Yeah testosterone in particular is basically putting your body through a second male puberty when used in above-natural doses, which obviously you can never really undo. You can allow the muscle mass to atrophy back down to your pre PED size and that will wipe out _most_ of the "unnatural" performance gains, but you're never going to reverse everything.
Also you can recover better so use UFC as an example; a fighter training in thailand can buy test and peptides over the counter... That same fighter might be able to do an hour muay thai training, an hour of bjj, an hour of sparring & fully recover and be good to go the next day... Whereas a natural fighter might only be able to recover from one session. Getting away with ped use doesnt just make you stronger but allows you to do a LOT more training... And then you can just clean up and get your bloodwork back to baseline
GVS has refined his opinion on someone like Russell and thinks he's natural now. Considering Russell is Nigerian, and there is a mind-blowing concentration of strength genes there, and every story about "that Nigerian that works out in my gym" is about insane genetics and muscle belly definition, I'd guess Russell is just top-tier natty and we can actually see how far Nigerian genes can go with abundance of resources like food and training regimes. Who ACTUALLY knows, I guess nobody but Russell. But I'm willing to bet more people are natty than we think.
Do you mean just anyone? Or specifically people who are into strength training themselves? Because it's pretty easy to get uninitiated non-lifters to think you're on steroids, just do a ton of fluff and pump upper body training for two or three years then wear a tight t-shirt everywhere you go lol.
10-15% is okay, but in powerlifting, it's extremely visible that it's closer to up to 20%+ Especially the last couple years, lifters have increased their squat from for example 290 (6+ years of training) all the way up to 350 after only 10 months... That's almost 20% in only 10 months of lifting enhanced...
I think claiming to be natty after using gear is a disgrace to oneself. How can someone live with themselves knowing that they had to use gear to reach where they are & naturally wouldn't even be anywhere near? (Excluding those bound by business contract to claim so)
Peds make you WAY more money. Point blank. This is the answer. It is easily worth the scrutiny and hate you get. It isnt cheating when everyone is cheating
Clarence I’m fairly new to your channel, but I’m blown away by your dedication and drive over all these years. I’m really interested in your own reasons for changing to non-natty and what your experience was like in making that switch, numbers, feelings ect. If this type of video exists, could someone point me to it, thank you.
10% is laughable. As someone who trains and has tried TRT, I can tell you it's way more than 10%, and that's only TRT! If you blasted 500mg/week and added Anavar and HGH I'm sure you would see insane strength results. I would guess the difference is up to 100% in a lot of cases, especially in a short time frame like 6 months.
did you remain the same bodyweight and/or body composition after supplementing testosterone? the study the video references claims that it's a 10 percent increase only if you remain around the same bodyweight, clarence just forgot to mention that. the thing is people start taking gear and gain 20 lbs of lean mass, and of course the strength increase is going to be more than 10% if you're gaining a significant amount of muscle as well
There is no way you're getting over 10% on a true TRT dose. There is also no way you're getting 100% increase with just 500mg of test. That means you're claiming before I went on TRT and my max bench was 315, my max is now 345. Or in your theory, if I did 500mg blast for 20 weeks you think my max would move to 630lbs. Sorry dude, you legit have no idea what you're talking about.
@@JK-pp2xl I think a lot of pro powerlifters would disagree. There was this powerlifter who appeared on a Bradley Martyn video that was talking about how he started training less than 2 years ago and he's squatting 800+. You think he could squat 720 naturally in 2 years of training? 😂 If you can bench 350 natural, blasting a cycle for a decent amount of time would get you a high 500's bench, assuming you're heavy enough to begin with.
the 10% increase is made up bs obviously. We have seen a million times that the extra musclemass you can gain from steroids could be more than even double ur natural potential, heck didnt rick piana already at 300 pounds gain like 20lbs of lean muscle tissue in a month or some for lols? Doses isnt accounted for, if you up ur dose to absurd numbers then just muscle mass alone can be ridicilous, how would that not improve ur strength more than 10%? if i go from 180 to 300 then chances is i will increase my bench way more than from 300-320 or whatever lol.
Yeah the 10% excuse is a cope,I agree with you. They just need anything they can to hold onto the lie of working hard for their results whne they know they’re just not as good without them
@@thechosenone93 Yea for sure. Its a reason naturals are lucky and gifted to be 200lbs 6 feet 12% bodyfat, and with steroids people like that can get up to 300 lbs at same bodyfat. Also if female powerlifters «at reasonable bodyweight» is considered strong with a 160 bench then how are juiced women lifting up to 300+ pounds.. no woman can do that natural Even as extremely obese. Many people have more than doubled their strength and mass from PEDs, so 5-10% is the biggest Lie ive ever heard lol
@@neohubris If applied to his snatch and c&j then I'd say yes. For his squats, not so much. On the other hand he's a genetic freak with perfect leverages for squatting, so you never know.
Pretty much ALL professional sports people are using PEDs. There is no particular 'look' that can instantly give away those on roids, HGH, EPO etc. Steroid and HGH users aren't all massive bodybuilder looking people, the worst sport for PED use is pro cyclists. Do they look even remotely huge muscle wise? Not at all, in fact bulky muscles would put cyclists at a disadvantage. Steroids (as well as building muscle) help users recover their training sessions way, way quicker. Pro tennis players and football player also use steroids and HGH to recover and make the user more powerful. Again, footballers and tennis players are far from 'jacked'! Even those on TRT at doctor controlled levels are still at an advantage compared to completely natural athletes. TRT gives users a Testosterone level at the high end of the scale but most importantly without real fluctuations, if you were natural your Test level could get that high but usually only at certain peaks throughout the day. TRT users have these high levels CONSTANTLY, leading to better recovery, lower bodyfat levels, more muscle mass, better strength and making older users feel like they're 20 again (I know this from personal experience!)
Lol what? People in Western countries are less likely to use steroids while Chinese are users nost likelly? That's journalism of a 11 year old who doesn't read the news.
I doubt +10%, I wonder if whatever study compared natties to themselves after a couple of years of b&c anadrol 100mg dbol 100mg tren 1g test 1g or some crazy shit
10 % hahaha women in drugs (average) are stronger than average men or at least with similar strenght how is that possible? My cousin was lifting for 3 or 5 years and hisr m in bench presss was no more than 85 kg he started to take drugs and in 3 months he was benching 110kg for reps, no one will take drugs to lift 10% heavier. No sense video. 🙄🙄
The 10% rule seems logical if comparing the natty vs enhanced numbers of a genetically elite individual that has actually reached their natty ceiling. My issue with the 10% statement as a general guideline is that I think it ignores the fact that enhanced lifters can get away with a lot of lapses in programming and nutrition. Being enhanced raises the floor, or the minimum amount of effort required to achieve an amazing result.
Increased regeneration, bigger strength, faster growth. Without PEDs you get to your natty max after 15-20 years of hard work. With PEDs maybe 5 years, then you start going beyond.
@@lukassky8997 15-20 is a long time but if you're talking absolute 100% of your natural potential then yeah it is probably up there. It's even more nuts when you look at the difference in "short term" gains though imo. Like I'd say you can hit about 80-90% of your "natty max" within 3-5 years if you do everything right, then after that you're just grinding for incremental improvement. But if you hop on gear from day 1, you can hit that 80-90% level in about 1 year. Obviously drug/dose dependent. It's crazy to see. There was a gym I used to go to with a lot of PEDs going about where I saw that happen nearly every year. Because I'd see the skinny kids coming in fresh out of high school at like 140lbs, then some of them would start talking to the older regulars who were openly on gear. Then I'd see them again next summer and they'd be pushing 190lbs with veins popping out and acne everywhere. Then next summer they're 220lbs and glowing red lol. When people see top level strength athletes and bodybuilders they'll often say things like "yeah but they still had to work hard to get there." And to be fair, that is usually true. But when we're just talking about the people who are on gear yet still merely hovering around the upper limits of what they could have achieved naturally, those guys are just pissing about, they're not working hard at all.
@@yewtewbstew547 You will reach, but most do not reach that potential due to personal life or frequent injuries. I trained naturally until a month ago, anabolic steroids make a big difference, the fact is that they also damage our body. It is best to take testosterone with another preparation that protects against gynecomastia. Even with only testosterone (testosterone is the base without it, don't take anything else) small doses give good results, otherwise you harm your body.
Tbh, not all people in the gym with gyno are on gear. I'm one of those people. The reason I went to the gym was to try and get rid of my gyno and to no one's surprise it didn't work. I have a pretty average build and maybe slightly above average numbers for my weight and age, so no thinks I'm on gear.
Regarding your point on psychology: there have been (and are) many people who were very publicly against something that they themselves were guilty of. So I don't think it's a great marker of honesty. People don't always act rationally and can often do things that go against their apparent interests, e.g. due to feelings of shame and guilt.
I don't want to say that Pyrros has always been natural, but your claims against him are really weak on this video. First of all, he did not go out of his way to claim natural. There was a big scandal in Greece at that time, where they caught many weightlifters for ped usage. Also, your logic with the +10% in performance is really weird... I mean, what do you expect? This is what a top-class athlete means. With your "logic" all world record holders and top athletes are unnatural. I sincerely don't know if Pyrros has ever used peds. He probably has. But your arguments are, with all respect, ridiculous...
Culture, character, financial incentives, the 10% rule. Would be interesting to assign a point scale to each of these and come up with a mathematical formula for fake-natty likelihood.
I would definitely be interested in finding a lab that can find the genes in DNA that determine what your strength and weaknesses are to workout around it.
google strength gene testing and a few places will come up. It's around 150 dollars and if you have done 23&me you can send them that data. It really doesn't help though. I found out that i'm genetically pre-disposed to cardio but I still like to lift heavy.
The second Sarah Davies extract is a little misleading due to the context it's used in. That is from BWL's communication on what the believe Davies should do after it surfaced she racially abused a teammate. Not because she has a anti doping stance in the sport.
Of course Athletes can benefit from claiming natural. More media exposure and potential interest from sponsors. The cultural thing seems so much BS to me, if we look at the history of Western Athletes, say USA or Canada for example, in sports such as Track and Field or pretty much all endurance athletes across all nations during the EPO era that house of cards just falls apart. The whole "out guys are clean, the others cheat" narrative is just such a backwards cold war mentality to me. Fake natty IMO has more to do with the fitness industry and people trying to make money off that claim and selling false expectations. No need to drag actual athletes into that.
10% my ass, anyone who took PEDs competitively knows it's more like 20%. PEDs don't only boost strenght, most importantly they boost recovery, which for weightlifting is immense advantage, since it will tremendously improve not just your strenght, and speed, and power, but also your technique. Imagine training 2x as frequent, and 2x more intense, with 2x more volume, than some natty, over 10 years of time. For example: would Ilya CJ 220 as natty? No fukin way. He would be 3 weight classes lighter and lift less than 200. Also, PEDs allow the athlete to reach heavier weight categories gaining "unnatural" amounts of muscle mass they couldn't get otherwise, which is also huge in weightlifting, since the shorter athlete with more muscle mass/lower bodyfat% has advantage, inside the same weight class.
Me: hates "fake natty/natty or not videos". Refuses to watch them. Clarence: makes video on the subject Me: *presses play quicker than Coach Greg contradicts himself on video*
> You have been given THE GOSPEL😇 > God gave the 10 Commandments🙏🏼 Adultery, Hatred, and Pride😬 > God is just and must punish us, but Jesus paid the price. Repent today and be saved from hell. > Welcome to the family 👪
It’s absolutely more then 10% since your example assumes that the lifter you used had already gained 10% and the end result is not far from the best ever recorded, which means those with the best ever recorded were probably 15-20% stronger then naturals.
the effect PEDs have on strength depend ofcourse on the genetics of the person taking it, the amount in which it is taken en de type of PEDs taken. Naturally we also see lots of flifters taking PEDs, but not actually training hard at all... in those cases you cant really expect much of an improvement. On the other end of the spectrum: guys like Clarence that really push the limit, would also do this when taking PEDs and thus are more likely to have a larger increase in strength. the 10% is a general guideline and should not be used for a single lifter.
here's some history for all you nerds: glenn pendlay did post graduate, clinical research with hormonal therapy. His idea was to use hormones as medicine; almost micro-dosing. the hypothesis was that, not only would it save training time lost from small injuries, it would help to prevent catastrophic injuries, AND help to preserve long term health in old age LIKE THE RUSSIANS, Klokov is in GREAT shape. source: person to person phone chat. last thing he did was for Masters, "Stick the Jerk". i didnt even know he was sick and he set Rowing PR's until he was too sick. rip coach
Hey Clarence, im curious if you do anything for a living instead of youtube and patreon( i dont know about othet src of income of urs), its just that u succeed so much on the strength and athletics, that i dont see a window for a normal person to start and succeed that way u did, even tho such person a very good time management skills. Ur awesome, thx ;)
By 10% ??! My trainer always said, when you start doping, in 3 months you are Snatching what you used to CJ. (That's why I'm waiting until I can CJ 160kg😈😂)
Remember, everyone, that the 10% rule is a generous one. Meaning that in most cases it's probably considerably higher. For instance, it's laughable to think that Eddie Hall could have deadlifted more than 450 kg as a natty.
I know the 10% rule is you being generous, but its VERY generous, so much so that I have to comment. The strongman deadlift record is 501kg. There is no way someone can lift even 400kg naturally. I might be pessimistic, but I genuinely believe that. So, thats already over 25% right from the get go.
It makes me a little sad to see the way weightlifting has suffered as a sport as a result of drug-related scandals. Say what you will about bodybuilding, but at least there everyone knows they are not tested and are using. I'm talking about bodybuilding in the IFBB here. It's clear that because it is not tested, bodybuilding is more of a niche sport than weightlifting. It does not have olympic status and no government in the world has probably ever financed bodybuilding. But from a drug perspective, the lack of testing I think helps keep the scandals away.
The 10% rule is nice, it's basically saying top level athletes are almost certainly juicing, which we already know. The first test fails imo because it's predicated on the assumption that people lie for reasons that can be obviously detected, when in fact people can lie for all kinds of reasons, to anyone, at any time, and you aren't aware of the majority of what's going on in their mind. This type of speculative psychoanalysis is something I consider to be rarely fruitful -- instead, judge people by their actions
Also, not often, those claiming natty athletes say they don't use because they don't know they are given certain things. I know it's hard to believe but i think it can happen. I talked to Oleg Chen, and he was adamant in our private conversation that if there was anything detected in him, it was likely a set up because he doesn't use... 🤷🏼♀️. I don't know really...
But wouldn't the benefit from PED's be smaller the higher level the athlete would be at? Like, a 10 % increase of course means the actual increase in kg's becomes higher the bigger numbers the athlete has, but also we know that it's much harder to increase your numbers the higher your level is. So, wouldn't something like a 4-5 % increase seem much more likely?
I have a question: If we assume PEDs give approximately a 10% increase to weightlifting numbers, how is it that the vehemently anti-doping Olympic weightlifters are still able to place top 10 in the world? Surely 10% is an enormous difference at the elite level.
A few honest questions from me, someone who does not know that much about weightlifting but is interested in it: Are there natural elite weightlifters (beside the ones mentioned) ? Is the drug use necessary? What is the maximum total that a natural weightlifter got?
Clarence can you do a video of the apparent epidemic of juice in the western powerlifting world. People like Larry wheels, Stan efferfing sean Noriega, julius Maddox, Jamal browner I could go on. Even Russel orhi who claims natural
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Definitely get you test levels checked in your late 20s, or at least by 30. I'm 32 and mine is well below normal. My NP said it probably started dropping in my 20s.
I think its usefull if one is doping
Thanks Clarence. I didnt know about the 10% rule, its an easy rule of thumb that can show me what is realistic. Btw thanks I became vegan after seeing your content. Cheers
Post more often
@@IDiggPattyMayonnaise lifestyle changes can boost testosterone naturally, I understand some people need it for medical reasons. TRT is a lifelong commitment, put some deep thought into it before you jump on
As a fake natty I approve this message! 💪💉
Found the Fake Natty
@@kk0119yt he's not fake you're just jealous
Keep up the fake natiness
Eat clen, tren hard, anavar give up
This is actualy a paradox.. you cannot be openly fake natty, that just makes you .. not fake natty :D
"are you natty?"
"no"
to this day the most based answer to ever be uttered in YT Fitness
The most refreshing answer by any fitness channel ever. Most dance around the question even if they don’t outright claim natural. Many give drawn out explanations for why they are/aren’t natural. The simple “no” gives no nuanced explanation or justification. Just the truth.
what if ur natty and u lie about being fake natty what happens then will ppl respect u more
@@coachingconfidant2785 whatre u talking bout, you can't be a fake natty if you're natural.
@@anotherhairlessapewithanop7455 nobody knows ur natty except you. Im saying that a natty claims their taking steroids to boost their rep...are you slow?
@@coachingconfidant2785 why tf would a natty tell ppl they're on roids
I still need a video collab of Clarence going to Juji's new fancy gym with a gazillion machines, ending up only doing atg squats in a squat rack
I would love that
He mentioned in a patreon he plans on visiting juji again but nothing final yet
I like when Bugez went there and they ended up doing pullovers with a big natural stone lmao
yes please, this would be great
he's ridiculously strong on other lifts including bench press
Everything goes on hold when Clarence drops a video
Yeah because he uploads like once every six months lol 😂😢😂
Haha, true, I’m cooking dinner now but it’s gonna have to wait 😂
The people’s champ
Quite frankly
*PRIORITIES*
Imagine if Kai had gone full gigachad and instead said only with grapefruits.
Underrated comment.
LMFAO
Clarence out here low-key teaching critical thinking. Great video.
I wish I had videos like this when I was in high school
I'm sorry to dissapoint but I'm afraid you're a victim of Sophistry here, rather than critical reasoning. Clarence unfortunately committed the Classic Logical FALLACY of "slippery slope" -----that drug test cannot be 100% accurate, that there are drug cheats doesnt mean drug test is NOTHING. It also doesn't mean degree of rampancy of PED use is uniform across sports. Moreoever, it doesn't mean the degree of PED use in sports governed by WADA is at all comparable to the degree of PED use in unregulated sports. In fact, I would argue athletes in 100m and Olympic lifting use FAR LESS than those in more unregulated sports such as strongman, powerlifting, crossfit, and bodybuilding. To lump them all together and claim Olympic lifting is no different from your next door 24 hour gym or internet fitness guru is just a Gross oversimplification...
I don't think anybody or WADA has ever claimed an athlete is completely NATURAL SIMPLY BECAUSE they pass its drug test. Their definition of "natural" is always qualified. Between an athlete who passes a drug test and an athelte who abuses PED as much as he wants there is a WORLD of difference. Clarence is knocking on an open door here
@@runhenry WADA don’t claim it. But the vast majority of the population think these guys are natural. They are portrayed as these superhero’s and given a bigger spotlight then “untested sports”. Meanwhile, they have a dirty little secret that they hide from the young, up and coming athletes by taking peds.
That’s the problem.
@@runhenry slippery slope is not a fallacy. it is proven in reality
Clarence with a sponsor? The time has come my brothers
Clarence living in Nottingham… 😮
@@scottessery100 oh shit i wonder what gym he goes to
Clarence even called him “Mike O’Tren” lmao
No comparison to the King Clarence which is a honest atlethe. Mike O Tren isnt impressive, all this drugs injected, thats a sport for genderless who cant choose their hormone levels
Clarence the kind of guy who'd use a hook grip on a grocery store shopping cart.
Why wouldnt you do that? i hook grip anything i can hold
You not a true weightlifter if you dont hookgrip everything lol
Or to carry his shopping bag home.😁
Are you natty though?
Clarence: 'No'
Fake natty videos have been done to death . . . but if Clarence has a video on this topic, I'm in!
USA Weightlifting has a largely successful propaganda campaign that purports all USA weightlifters as tested and natural. Coaches, when questioned about the natural status of their athletes, react with anger and whataboutism, pointing to USADA as the final decider of the issue. In my opinion, it's just American exceptionalism in PED form. Some of these up-and-coming unaffiliated athletes are adding 50kg to their total in a year, or squatting 210kg (with long levers) before they turn 20. And to address the classic American rebuttal, no, I do not believe we can simply look to totals for the answer, because we do not have a weightlifting farm system in this country akin to Eastern Europe or Asia. USAW and USADA have created an entire culture around fake natties.
This is such a weird video, just blanket statements based on nothing but conjecture and your own experience on gear. Seems an odd thing to say to outright generally the Chinese dope and Western Europeans are clean, what is that based on? Because they're outspoken on doping? The cycling world might have something to say about that.
The issue is 99.99% of fake nattys will never lift anywhere near WR level. So these methods only work for pro athletes, and only at the highest level
I love that you actually allowed your video to be sponsored!!! I hate that it’s largely necessary to be profitable but I’m glad there’s a legitimate way to promote you. You’re a great guy and deserve to profit from your fans. Cheers brother!
As a general rule of thumb: Bigger/stronger than you equals not natty, smaller/weaker than equals they natty and aren't training hard enough
where's the lie?
works well if you are Ronnie
@Mal Theri how do you know he was natural ?
LMFAOOOOOOOO
Juicer cope
One thing that i think that gets overlooked is the fact that you can still show benefits of PEDs even several years after taking them. I have a friend that would test natural bc he hasn't taken PEDs in 15 years but he can still bench 405 despite almost never working out...
Excellent point. The ability to synthesise protein and greater bone density will likely stay with most moderate users for the rest of their lives.
He could also be a little gifted lol.
Yeah testosterone in particular is basically putting your body through a second male puberty when used in above-natural doses, which obviously you can never really undo. You can allow the muscle mass to atrophy back down to your pre PED size and that will wipe out _most_ of the "unnatural" performance gains, but you're never going to reverse everything.
Also you can recover better so use UFC as an example; a fighter training in thailand can buy test and peptides over the counter... That same fighter might be able to do an hour muay thai training, an hour of bjj, an hour of sparring & fully recover and be good to go the next day... Whereas a natural fighter might only be able to recover from one session. Getting away with ped use doesnt just make you stronger but allows you to do a LOT more training... And then you can just clean up and get your bloodwork back to baseline
do you think russel orhii is natural? he claims natty like everyday on his insta lmao
GVS has refined his opinion on someone like Russell and thinks he's natural now. Considering Russell is Nigerian, and there is a mind-blowing concentration of strength genes there, and every story about "that Nigerian that works out in my gym" is about insane genetics and muscle belly definition, I'd guess Russell is just top-tier natty and we can actually see how far Nigerian genes can go with abundance of resources like food and training regimes. Who ACTUALLY knows, I guess nobody but Russell. But I'm willing to bet more people are natty than we think.
Simeon Panda and Mike O hearn must be sweating after this video came out 🤣
I want to get to the point one day someone questions my nattyness.
peak
Do you mean just anyone? Or specifically people who are into strength training themselves? Because it's pretty easy to get uninitiated non-lifters to think you're on steroids, just do a ton of fluff and pump upper body training for two or three years then wear a tight t-shirt everywhere you go lol.
@@yewtewbstew547it’s when you still look big in a baggy t shirt, that’s when you know you’re not natty
Senpai Clarence make more videos. Greeting from Germany
Surely a fake natural is simply someone who claims natty and isnt?
10-15% is okay, but in powerlifting, it's extremely visible that it's closer to up to 20%+
Especially the last couple years, lifters have increased their squat from for example 290 (6+ years of training) all the way up to 350 after only 10 months... That's almost 20% in only 10 months of lifting enhanced...
I think claiming to be natty after using gear is a disgrace to oneself. How can someone live with themselves knowing that they had to use gear to reach where they are & naturally wouldn't even be anywhere near? (Excluding those bound by business contract to claim so)
"Anywhere near is debatable", but I get what you're saying
People lie to themselves all the time it's no surprise anywhere
Narcissism is much more powerful than honor
Peds make you WAY more money. Point blank. This is the answer. It is easily worth the scrutiny and hate you get. It isnt cheating when everyone is cheating
Clarence I’m fairly new to your channel, but I’m blown away by your dedication and drive over all these years. I’m really interested in your own reasons for changing to non-natty and what your experience was like in making that switch, numbers, feelings ect. If this type of video exists, could someone point me to it, thank you.
Did he just call out Mike o tren? He just eats duck eggs and trens hard
Love that you used Ender Lillies as the background for the video!
I thought the exact same thing, wanted to comment on it and found your comment. It's just so pretty and beautiful
That's it, the name of the game, I've that one on my wishlist for so long.
Cant believe its only 10mins I want an hour or more on this
Everyone is always talking about fake nattys, but no one ever talks about fake users! I am on gear guys! You gotta believe me!
10% is laughable. As someone who trains and has tried TRT, I can tell you it's way more than 10%, and that's only TRT! If you blasted 500mg/week and added Anavar and HGH I'm sure you would see insane strength results. I would guess the difference is up to 100% in a lot of cases, especially in a short time frame like 6 months.
did you remain the same bodyweight and/or body composition after supplementing testosterone? the study the video references claims that it's a 10 percent increase only if you remain around the same bodyweight, clarence just forgot to mention that.
the thing is people start taking gear and gain 20 lbs of lean mass, and of course the strength increase is going to be more than 10% if you're gaining a significant amount of muscle as well
do believe russwole is natty?
There is no way you're getting over 10% on a true TRT dose. There is also no way you're getting 100% increase with just 500mg of test.
That means you're claiming before I went on TRT and my max bench was 315, my max is now 345. Or in your theory, if I did 500mg blast for 20 weeks you think my max would move to 630lbs. Sorry dude, you legit have no idea what you're talking about.
The 10% rule applies to your strength numbers when at your natural peak I think.
@@JK-pp2xl I think a lot of pro powerlifters would disagree. There was this powerlifter who appeared on a Bradley Martyn video that was talking about how he started training less than 2 years ago and he's squatting 800+. You think he could squat 720 naturally in 2 years of training? 😂
If you can bench 350 natural, blasting a cycle for a decent amount of time would get you a high 500's bench, assuming you're heavy enough to begin with.
the 10% increase is made up bs obviously. We have seen a million times that the extra musclemass you can gain from steroids could be more than even double ur natural potential, heck didnt rick piana already at 300 pounds gain like 20lbs of lean muscle tissue in a month or some for lols? Doses isnt accounted for, if you up ur dose to absurd numbers then just muscle mass alone can be ridicilous, how would that not improve ur strength more than 10%? if i go from 180 to 300 then chances is i will increase my bench way more than from 300-320 or whatever lol.
Yeah the 10% excuse is a cope,I agree with you. They just need anything they can to hold onto the lie of working hard for their results whne they know they’re just not as good without them
@@thechosenone93 Yea for sure. Its a reason naturals are lucky and gifted to be 200lbs 6 feet 12% bodyfat, and with steroids people like that can get up to 300 lbs at same bodyfat. Also if female powerlifters «at reasonable bodyweight» is considered strong with a 160 bench then how are juiced women lifting up to 300+ pounds.. no woman can do that natural Even as extremely obese. Many people have more than doubled their strength and mass from PEDs, so 5-10% is the biggest Lie ive ever heard lol
Toshiki is natural
I think he's natural but his squat is on steroids
@@clarence0 based
in seriousness though, is Toshiki natural?
does the 10% rule work with him?
@@neohubris If applied to his snatch and c&j then I'd say yes. For his squats, not so much. On the other hand he's a genetic freak with perfect leverages for squatting, so you never know.
When Clarence speaks, I listen.
for the blind he is the light for the deaf he is sound for the mute he is voice
Pretty much ALL professional sports people are using PEDs. There is no particular 'look' that can instantly give away those on roids, HGH, EPO etc. Steroid and HGH users aren't all massive bodybuilder looking people, the worst sport for PED use is pro cyclists. Do they look even remotely huge muscle wise? Not at all, in fact bulky muscles would put cyclists at a disadvantage. Steroids (as well as building muscle) help users recover their training sessions way, way quicker. Pro tennis players and football player also use steroids and HGH to recover and make the user more powerful. Again, footballers and tennis players are far from 'jacked'! Even those on TRT at doctor controlled levels are still at an advantage compared to completely natural athletes. TRT gives users a Testosterone level at the high end of the scale but most importantly without real fluctuations, if you were natural your Test level could get that high but usually only at certain peaks throughout the day. TRT users have these high levels CONSTANTLY, leading to better recovery, lower bodyfat levels, more muscle mass, better strength and making older users feel like they're 20 again (I know this from personal experience!)
Lol what? People in Western countries are less likely to use steroids while Chinese are users nost likelly? That's journalism of a 11 year old who doesn't read the news.
Steroids only give 10-15% strength boosts?! I thought it would've been WAY more than that...
Tbf everyone responds differently to steroids and not sure if the study was conducted long enough or with a effective pool of lifters
It definitely is, tons of anecdotal reports with wayyyy more. Maybe it was for specifically weightlifting though, which is super form based
@@dkis8730this means weight adjusted
Do you think steriods would only improve someone who benches 300 to only 315?
Unrelated to video, but recently bought your squat program and seeing amazing results. Thanks Clarence!
How did it go? What did your squat go from and to?
@@Robdutton91 started at a tough 160kg atg and ended with a comfortable 180kg atg
I doubt +10%, I wonder if whatever study compared natties to themselves after a couple of years of b&c anadrol 100mg dbol 100mg tren 1g test 1g or some crazy shit
I would disagree with the 10% for powerlifting.
It's closer to 20% at the same bw and maybe 30% at lets say 10% higher bw.
10% hah, I've seen guys go from pressing light dumbells under 100 to pressing 150s with ease under complete control. Tren heads!
There’s a simple equation. You take the outline of their trap muscles, and if they look like the circumference of a basketball, PEDS. lol
So Base on the 10% rule, whoever holds the #1 record is certainly enhanced ?
If the remaining competitors aren't close then yes. Lasha is a good example. He's so much better than the others there's no way he's natural.
Good choice in music putting that celeste tune in there
I recognize it was from One shot, I might be wrong though
Video titled “How to spot a fake natty” but there is minimal discussion on the topic.
I can't believe how smooth was this promotion introduced into the video
10 % hahaha women in drugs (average) are stronger than average men or at least with similar strenght how is that possible? My cousin was lifting for 3 or 5 years and hisr m in bench presss was no more than 85 kg he started to take drugs and in 3 months he was benching 110kg for reps, no one will take drugs to lift 10% heavier. No sense video.
🙄🙄
The point sailed over your head so fast that I heard the sonic boom it made
"Everybody's on steroid" - Nate Diaz
The 10% rule seems logical if comparing the natty vs enhanced numbers of a genetically elite individual that has actually reached their natty ceiling.
My issue with the 10% statement as a general guideline is that I think it ignores the fact that enhanced lifters can get away with a lot of lapses in programming and nutrition. Being enhanced raises the floor, or the minimum amount of effort required to achieve an amazing result.
Increased regeneration, bigger strength, faster growth. Without PEDs you get to your natty max after 15-20 years of hard work. With PEDs maybe 5 years, then you start going beyond.
@@lukassky8997 15-20 is a long time but if you're talking absolute 100% of your natural potential then yeah it is probably up there. It's even more nuts when you look at the difference in "short term" gains though imo. Like I'd say you can hit about 80-90% of your "natty max" within 3-5 years if you do everything right, then after that you're just grinding for incremental improvement. But if you hop on gear from day 1, you can hit that 80-90% level in about 1 year. Obviously drug/dose dependent. It's crazy to see.
There was a gym I used to go to with a lot of PEDs going about where I saw that happen nearly every year. Because I'd see the skinny kids coming in fresh out of high school at like 140lbs, then some of them would start talking to the older regulars who were openly on gear. Then I'd see them again next summer and they'd be pushing 190lbs with veins popping out and acne everywhere. Then next summer they're 220lbs and glowing red lol.
When people see top level strength athletes and bodybuilders they'll often say things like "yeah but they still had to work hard to get there." And to be fair, that is usually true. But when we're just talking about the people who are on gear yet still merely hovering around the upper limits of what they could have achieved naturally, those guys are just pissing about, they're not working hard at all.
@@yewtewbstew547 You will reach, but most do not reach that potential due to personal life or frequent injuries. I trained naturally until a month ago, anabolic steroids make a big difference, the fact is that they also damage our body. It is best to take testosterone with another preparation that protects against gynecomastia. Even with only testosterone (testosterone is the base without it, don't take anything else) small doses give good results, otherwise you harm your body.
Tbh, not all people in the gym with gyno are on gear. I'm one of those people. The reason I went to the gym was to try and get rid of my gyno and to no one's surprise it didn't work. I have a pretty average build and maybe slightly above average numbers for my weight and age, so no thinks I'm on gear.
I feel you, bro.
Regarding your point on psychology: there have been (and are) many people who were very publicly against something that they themselves were guilty of. So I don't think it's a great marker of honesty. People don't always act rationally and can often do things that go against their apparent interests, e.g. due to feelings of shame and guilt.
I don't want to say that Pyrros has always been natural, but your claims against him are really weak on this video. First of all, he did not go out of his way to claim natural. There was a big scandal in Greece at that time, where they caught many weightlifters for ped usage. Also, your logic with the +10% in performance is really weird... I mean, what do you expect? This is what a top-class athlete means. With your "logic" all world record holders and top athletes are unnatural. I sincerely don't know if Pyrros has ever used peds. He probably has. But your arguments are, with all respect, ridiculous...
More vids like this from you would be dope. You do them very well
Culture, character, financial incentives, the 10% rule.
Would be interesting to assign a point scale to each of these and come up with a mathematical formula for fake-natty likelihood.
The dislike is from Pyrros
Great video dad
I would definitely be interested in finding a lab that can find the genes in DNA that determine what your strength and weaknesses are to workout around it.
The main difficulty with that would be environmental factors, which can heavily influence genes.
google strength gene testing and a few places will come up. It's around 150 dollars and if you have done 23&me you can send them that data. It really doesn't help though. I found out that i'm genetically pre-disposed to cardio but I still like to lift heavy.
I’m just a simple man. I see a Clarence video I press like before watching :)
Really?! Trt sponsorship?
Only 10% increase with PEDs as opposed to without may hold true at the elite level. At the amateur level however this discrepancy must be MUCH higher.
That female weightlifter is full on roids she looks like that light strongwoman who is obviously abusing roids cant remember her name
The one in the thumbnail?
The second Sarah Davies extract is a little misleading due to the context it's used in. That is from BWL's communication on what the believe Davies should do after it surfaced she racially abused a teammate. Not because she has a anti doping stance in the sport.
Of course Athletes can benefit from claiming natural. More media exposure and potential interest from sponsors.
The cultural thing seems so much BS to me, if we look at the history of Western Athletes, say USA or Canada for example, in sports such as Track and Field or pretty much all endurance athletes across all nations during the EPO era that house of cards just falls apart. The whole "out guys are clean, the others cheat" narrative is just such a backwards cold war mentality to me.
Fake natty IMO has more to do with the fitness industry and people trying to make money off that claim and selling false expectations. No need to drag actual athletes into that.
10% my ass, anyone who took PEDs competitively knows it's more like 20%. PEDs don't only boost strenght, most importantly they boost recovery, which for weightlifting is immense advantage, since it will tremendously improve not just your strenght, and speed, and power, but also your technique. Imagine training 2x as frequent, and 2x more intense, with 2x more volume, than some natty, over 10 years of time.
For example: would Ilya CJ 220 as natty? No fukin way. He would be 3 weight classes lighter and lift less than 200.
Also, PEDs allow the athlete to reach heavier weight categories gaining "unnatural" amounts of muscle mass they couldn't get otherwise, which is also huge in weightlifting, since the shorter athlete with more muscle mass/lower bodyfat% has advantage, inside the same weight class.
Idk I think the 10% thing does work
Because you should be considering weight adjusted
Me: hates "fake natty/natty or not videos". Refuses to watch them.
Clarence: makes video on the subject
Me: *presses play quicker than Coach Greg contradicts himself on video*
Highly informative and quality production. Felt like a short minute watching. Thanks
so russwole fake natty
10% of strength gain is a joke
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> Welcome to the family 👪
hi clarence
The 10% thing is just for anabolic steroids, though. Add in growth hormone, IGF-1, insulin, etc., and the threshold goes up, obviously.
It’s absolutely more then 10% since your example assumes that the lifter you used had already gained 10% and the end result is not far from the best ever recorded, which means those with the best ever recorded were probably 15-20% stronger then naturals.
I'm gonna use letsgetchecked to figure out what my favorite anime is
the effect PEDs have on strength depend ofcourse on the genetics of the person taking it, the amount in which it is taken en de type of PEDs taken. Naturally we also see lots of flifters taking PEDs, but not actually training hard at all... in those cases you cant really expect much of an improvement. On the other end of the spectrum: guys like Clarence that really push the limit, would also do this when taking PEDs and thus are more likely to have a larger increase in strength.
the 10% is a general guideline and should not be used for a single lifter.
here's some history for all you nerds: glenn pendlay did post graduate, clinical research with hormonal therapy. His idea was to use hormones as medicine; almost micro-dosing. the hypothesis was that, not only would it save training time lost from small injuries, it would help to prevent catastrophic injuries, AND help to preserve long term health in old age LIKE THE RUSSIANS, Klokov is in GREAT shape.
source: person to person phone chat. last thing he did was for Masters, "Stick the Jerk". i didnt even know he was sick and he set Rowing PR's until he was too sick. rip coach
Got a 10kg PR on my Squat just because Clarence started posting again
As a fake non-natty, I approve this content. That's right, I'm a fake non-natty - I lift and look like shit but claim gear use.
Damn man,was it worth it?
Hey Clarence, im curious if you do anything for a living instead of youtube and patreon( i dont know about othet src of income of urs), its just that u succeed so much on the strength and athletics, that i dont see a window for a normal person to start and succeed that way u did, even tho such person a very good time management skills.
Ur awesome, thx ;)
By 10% ??!
My trainer always said, when you start doping, in 3 months you are Snatching what you used to CJ. (That's why I'm waiting until I can CJ 160kg😈😂)
Remember, everyone, that the 10% rule is a generous one. Meaning that in most cases it's probably considerably higher. For instance, it's laughable to think that Eddie Hall could have deadlifted more than 450 kg as a natty.
I know the 10% rule is you being generous, but its VERY generous, so much so that I have to comment. The strongman deadlift record is 501kg. There is no way someone can lift even 400kg naturally. I might be pessimistic, but I genuinely believe that. So, thats already over 25% right from the get go.
It makes me a little sad to see the way weightlifting has suffered as a sport as a result of drug-related scandals.
Say what you will about bodybuilding, but at least there everyone knows they are not tested and are using. I'm talking about bodybuilding in the IFBB here. It's clear that because it is not tested, bodybuilding is more of a niche sport than weightlifting. It does not have olympic status and no government in the world has probably ever financed bodybuilding. But from a drug perspective, the lack of testing I think helps keep the scandals away.
clarence is back at it again making videos, finally
I'm glad my fellow Belgian Tom Goegebuer is mentioned here. He's been fighting for a clean image for weightlifting for years.
ender lilies, anyone? :) (game with the girl in the background, while he's talking)
Thumbs up if you think Clarence needs to upload more often
Okay
The 10% rule is nice, it's basically saying top level athletes are almost certainly juicing, which we already know. The first test fails imo because it's predicated on the assumption that people lie for reasons that can be obviously detected, when in fact people can lie for all kinds of reasons, to anyone, at any time, and you aren't aware of the majority of what's going on in their mind. This type of speculative psychoanalysis is something I consider to be rarely fruitful -- instead, judge people by their actions
Also, not often, those claiming natty athletes say they don't use because they don't know they are given certain things. I know it's hard to believe but i think it can happen. I talked to Oleg Chen, and he was adamant in our private conversation that if there was anything detected in him, it was likely a set up because he doesn't use... 🤷🏼♀️. I don't know really...
But wouldn't the benefit from PED's be smaller the higher level the athlete would be at? Like, a 10 % increase of course means the actual increase in kg's becomes higher the bigger numbers the athlete has, but also we know that it's much harder to increase your numbers the higher your level is. So, wouldn't something like a 4-5 % increase seem much more likely?
Good ole Mike O’Tren.
So if Julius Maddox was natty at the same bodyweight he would only be benching 10-15% less? so he could still bench 700 or very close too? jeez
I have a question:
If we assume PEDs give approximately a 10% increase to weightlifting numbers, how is it that the vehemently anti-doping Olympic weightlifters are still able to place top 10 in the world? Surely 10% is an enormous difference at the elite level.
I have long dm messages of Wes Kitts claiming natty and shaming everyone in WL for using drugs.
What is that gamplay in the background from?
after the era of the clean and the clear... dimas results when down .. since the greek program was related to that guy the supplier..
The Greek would add weight and lift 198 In the 94 kilo class wich is possible
"Everybody is on steroids" - Nate Diaz
A few honest questions from me, someone who does not know that much about weightlifting but is interested in it: Are there natural elite weightlifters (beside the ones mentioned) ? Is the drug use necessary? What is the maximum total that a natural weightlifter got?
Clarence can you do a video of the apparent epidemic of juice in the western powerlifting world. People like Larry wheels, Stan efferfing sean Noriega, julius Maddox, Jamal browner I could go on. Even Russel orhi who claims natural
love the ender lilies in the background