Waves Cosmos VS ADSR Sample Manager . Shootout Review, does AI mean More Better... Best Workflow?
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- Опубликовано: 29 авг 2024
- The new Waves Cosmos is an AI powered sample manager, but.. does that mean it's better? Lets compare the analyzing, browsing, and workflow and see how we can use both these programs to get the best results!
I migrated to Cosmos because of one MAJOR advantage. It actually analyzes the sound and tags it accordingly. If you have a file called Big Whack, ADSR will not know what to do with it, since the name is not easily tagged. Same for unnamed files as you mentioned. If you have a file called Silky Smooth, Cosmos will discover that it is a Saxophone and tag accordingly. If you search for Saxophone in ADSR, it will only find files named Saxophone. The sample manager that can best identify and tag samples (regardless of name, misspellings, etc), is what I prefer. This is particularly true if you do not want to maintain a meticulous and well-organized folder structure. Personally, I hope ADSR gains some AI and makes this more apples to apples. YMMV. Cheers
Thanks for the insight!
It took me a while but I loaded each of my sample folders as a library. This made the updates a lot faster. I then loaded Waves CR8 sampler plugin and that opens Cosmos in my DAW as with ADSR. ADSR crashed a few times and that made me too nervous to continue using it. Thanks for the video.
When did they update cosmos? I deleted because it was taking to long, should I have another look?
@@CREATEEDUCATEINSPIRE Its worth trying it with the Waves CR8 Creative Sampler plugin, you can audition in real time the samples found through COSMOS, in the full context of your track. It is still slow but once the folders are loaded its ok. I am ver. 14.08. May 11 2022. I'm hoping that Waves are working hard on the development and particully on the read/write speeds of the database. The AI is excellent but time the database speed is slower than my creative speed. Maybe Cosmos is using a lookup table instead of a database. It would help if I could select multiple folders instead of one at a time or even better convert subfolders to libraries automatically. 🤓
I have examined the processes in the Activity Monitor and it looks to me like Cosmos is storing the data in flat files and not a database. This would account for the speed issue. If the source loops are not on a fast thunderbolt 4 SSD like the Samsung X5, then I would not bother trying it again until there is an update. Even scrolling a page reloads the content instead of having a look ahead cache. I read that there were some Mac issues with the Electron Framework. Maybe I am missing something. The answer is for Waves to buy ADSR!
@@CREATEEDUCATEINSPIRE The answer is No! All the development has been focussed on finding the sound you require using AI but the database access and lack of folders means I am uninstalling it and will try again with a later release that includes a plugin. Im using Studio One and its faster to build a Studio One Soundset of the loops folder, its then easy to find the right sound within the DAW. Studio One also reads many audio formats including Apple Loops.
I've had ADSR sample manager on 3 separate machines over approx 4 years and ALWAYS end up bailing on it because it's glitchy and laggy and loses my tags or crashes my DAW, to the point where I can't even carry out the DAW's recovery process successfully... Just got an M1 machine and have had no issues for a couple days, got really excited that I could finally use the bloody software, but nope, just crashed my now unrecoverable project. Have barely given cosmos a go after downloading it but it cannot be any buggier than ADSR
Rant aside, great video man! 😅
I've had corrupt databases and other strange problems as well. Thanks for your feedback.
Are you still using ADSR?
@@CREATEEDUCATEINSPIRE No I've stopped using ADSR and Sound Particles Explorer's having an issue when my sound interface stopped connecting. I've had to use another USB port and it's fine in iZotope RX8, but still trying to get it to work in Explorer with tech support.
@@Xylume I’m enjoying Sononym at the moment! You do have to pay for the premium but you get a month of full functionality to test it out 🤟
@ How long does it take to scan 150GB or so?
Hi, I guess the wait time for how Waves Cosmos analyzes depends on the PC. My 65GB/40,000 audio files were analyzed for about 30-40 minutes. All analysis took place through the processor and the RAM. I have an AMD 7900. And you're talking about days). If I had 1 terabyte, it would probably take up to 7-8 hours.
The plugin is not bad, but there are some minor errors in the distribution of files.
oh man.. this helps a little.. but there is stil a looong way to go to give us access to our samples with fewer clicks and tedious waiting for a search to finish😊
Agreed
THanks for finally breaking it down simply and completely ... took me an hour of not-so-helpful videos titled exactl the same
Glad it helped!
After using both, I can say that ASDR is really obscure about what samples it displays. You might as well not even use it as a sample manager for what good it does you. If you want to do a lot of housekeeping with your samples, then I'd say it's perfect for you.
Cosmos on the other hand, tagged everything at a correct 85% success rate, (some bass samples were showing as a pad, and visa versa) but overall, even thought it took longer, (a sign it was actually analyzing each sound, and not just saying f*ck it) Cosmos has found a permanent place where I can actually use my 150 GB of samples in Production.
I'll stick with ADSR's sample manager. I'm extremely tired of all of this connecting to the cloud crap just to find and organize my samples.
Ya, Cosmos never really worked for me. Just analyzed for EVER
@@CREATEEDUCATEINSPIRE Oh ok.
@@itsrelativ3967 I use ASDR too. its the best one hands down besides the popping sounds on the 808's
so far I'm loving adsr and also pair it with XO love the midi export funcution in xo but adsr works pretty well i mean It takes quite long to analyze the samples but once it's done it worked well ...
I've found ADSR Sample manager my solution for workflow issues in Maschine. Been loving trying out the Maschine
Good info as always here. Keep it up!
I left ADSR for Cosmos because ADSR kept saving rendering files for samples I auditioned in my DAW. It was annoying, but I wonder if Cosmos will ever have the auditioning feature like ADSR.
Let me know which you choose long term
it doesnt render it if you check the "raw" option instead of "processed", when dragging a sample into your daw
@@youl0se0508 thank Mann I’m gonna try that out because I’m starting to hate cosmos now lol
@@AmbiguousAnthony if your using the vst version, there is this arrowed cross on the left side of the sample waveform. Rightclick on that and choose 'raw'.
Cosmos also doesn't register samples that are larger than 45 seconds.
I've just checked and COSMOS did register a sample that was 48 seconds and even 58 seconds long. The only problem is it doesn't register MP3 files, just WAV, AIF, OGG, and FLAC files. Also, its Maximum sample length: 60 sec.
One-shots are relatively easy to analyze. How does Cosmos do with more complex samples and loops?
It does great with all material, but it just takes a very very long time to analyze. The searching process is good but it takes a while for the tags to refresh while you are narrowing down your search.
Its in its infancy still. Only use it for one shots honestly. But if you're using xo, don't even waste your time loading drums into cosmos. the universe view in cosmos is not even that useful compared to xo
also, the keys that cosmos gives for samples are more often than not all the way wrong. Terrible if all your samples don't have keys in the file name or if you don't have relative pitched hearing to find a key.
I've Had cosmos for some time now, I honestly don't think its super useful. xo is way better for drums. Cosmos is incredibly inaccurate and slow. As a producer, its good to separate drums from tonal one shots and samples and loops, textures, etc. The point of having a 3rd party file manager outside of your computers filing system is for speed, being able to explore your options with ease and finding inspiration more quickly. Being able to save things you like into collections without having your files all over the place and not having to duplicate and rename things just so you can keep track of the source of your files. Ai will probably never be that useful when it comes to Loops, samples, and drum loops. xo and any other programs like it are best used for one shots (Drums and possibly tonal one shots). What seems to be the best thing I've done is to have a folder for:
1. Drum stash (literally just drums, rip your kits apart so there's only drums, especially if you're using xo so it doesn't have to scan irrelevant items)
2. Samples/melodic loops, texture loops
3. Drum Loops (texture loops can go here too or you can even have a dedicated textures folder if you really use a lot of them)
4. Midi packs
5. Tonal One shots and Fx
The only folders that my xo scans are the ones in my drum stash (It's nice to be able to filter the exact drum kits and not just rely totally on the Ai and search bar)
Also, browsing and organizing in cosmos is just not a pleasure. It's a great idea but poorly executed. It kinda reminded me why I stopped using splice. The tags are not really that useful and its a pain to use when you know what you want but the system doesn't have the ability to narrow down to your exact needs. I'm interested in alternatives for cosmos which is why I'm here learning abut adsr. I don't need Ai for melody samples and drum loops. what I need is deep organizational capabilities and speed and pleasant browsing. And most importantly, I need something that integrates well with the way that I already have my files organized.
One last thing, Good luck using cosmos when you're not connected to the internet. Get ready to pull your hair out. That connecting to the cloud crap makes the program so much more wonky than it already is
Thanks for the amazing feedback!!!! I’m going to uninstall Cosmos as its just become another icon in the app folder
@@CREATEEDUCATEINSPIRE yeah its just bloatware at this point lol
Thanks for this review. I was about to buy Cosmos (it's on sale for $15) but as an actual drummer, drum samples are very important to me and I have a huge collection. Seems like XO is worth the extra money.
Thanks. I have the same setup and may as well just continue to use XO. I can easily drag the samples to my DAW from XO. It's a great manager with bonuses of sequencing quick beats and midi files. On another topic, I wish XO had 16 slots for 1 shots and more patterns to trigger than just A and B. I know others have requested this. I hope they add more.
Does anyone know if there is something that works well for foley samples to help tag those?
..yes cosmos is amazing, BUT adsr have ableton link and it works perfect with new logic x version its amazing to find acapellas or loops instantly in the project...regards
NICE!! ive also been using ADSR in Maschine.
I got a 8TB terrabyte harddrive and i just started analyzing with Waves COSMOS 😭
Are you still using COSMOS?
@@CREATEEDUCATEINSPIRE They couldn‘t answer your question in the last 9 months sadly. If we wait another 9 they might be done with scanning those 8TB by then lmao
I love your channel. I found a way to have ADSR scan for keys if you click the gear icon on the left side under database right under where it says what sound are you looking for at the bottom it says Rescan Keys after I clicked that I was able to see the key of each sample. The only problem I have had is after purchasing a new sample pack the application does not recognize the new folder added to my sample folder. If I click on it under my the my account icon it crashes. If anyone has a tip on how to solve that please reply. Needless to say ADSR is improving and its almost there. A few more bugs to fix and it will be #1 for sure.
Thanks for your feedback. I've also used ADSR with similar results. I've stopped using it and only use COSMOS for my important files. COSMOS only allows WAV files as far as I know, so I've been just using my DAW's explorer or windows to find what I'm looking for.
what program are you still using??
@@CREATEEDUCATEINSPIRE ADSR sample manager but forgive me the rescan for keys only works if that data is in the tags. I had a very very bad time with ADSR sample manager until I read a post that you need to add each individual sample folder not just your main sample folder once I did it that way all of my problems went away.
Using both here.
Nice, how are you using each one?
Thanks for this video.. Is it just me or does COSMOS not have subfolders? I can only important one folder at a time, or all at once, which is not what i want!
Completely agree, that was one of my biggest irritations with cosmos is that I lose my entire folder structure
Thanks! Very usefull!
Glad it was helpful!
nice vid!
Thanks for supporting! Please let me know if any vids you would like to see in the future.
ADSR is great but it crashes too much for my liking
is it still crashing on you?
great video
I've just installed Cosmos and once I try and launch it I get a message ''COSMOS is connecting to sample database.This may take a few seconds.'' This is before I am asking it to look at any folders. The UI hasn't even opened. I just get a Cosmos search symbol on a black screen. So is it automaticaly searching my hard drive? This has been going for a couple of hours so far. Very frustrating.Not sure whether to leave it or not as I dn't know if it is supposed to be doing this for hours?
That’s very interesting, especially if you haven’t added any folders yet. What it might be doing is first scanning the four gigs of included samples, that can take a while. If he continues to do this I would say use waves central to delete and reinstall
Since Cosmos isn’t a sample player, I can’t even really compare the two.
ADSR is far more useful to me…
I agree!!! Deleted cosmos shortly after
It is if you install the Waves CR8 Sampler plugin.
how adsr scan keys?
i have 1k of mp3 song to chop and it scan only 50-60 songs key
ADSR only gets the key from the name (as far as I know) so if the sample is not tagged, you do not get the key. Thats an advantage of COSMOS, but its pretty slow with big folders. Mixed in Key software is great for key detection on songs.
2:54 ///> Cosmos takes 3 days to do tHE ANALIZATIOn ... Hm... Must be painful.
I deleted Cosmos a few days after trying to use it
iTunes is the best sample manager to me lol
Ha! most of my DJ friends will swear by Itunes.
I'd imagine this is waves way to cut down on their hacking.. A legit vs of waves central will render your ALTERNATE waves useless and cancel it
wares out your hard drive. new hard drive died with in 6 months of use of this stuff.
Which program wears out the hard drive?