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If you will be using cyrta/foetracers then you would need to switch grapple for duskfield grenade to get that damage bonus

also does arbalest inherit any of this bonus damage to tormentors subjugators and witness given its shield breaking bonus damage?

Yeah that would work for sure. I still like ergo because of the option of either single target damage with light attacks, or with occasional heavy attacks and swapping to something else in between or using the movement parts of the build. You don't want to be standing there firing ADS with bloodline for too long (although I love bloodline, it's amazing)

@@glacierrays I was just thinking so you could also take advantage of the volatile rounds that you also get quite often

That's a well reasoned argument for slice and underover. It will perform well against the left subjugator for sure!

@@glacierrays thanks! At the end of the day, the most important thing in high level endgame pve is really to play your life. Most of the time, people augment that by either increasing their damage to kill faster, or increasing their resistance to be harder to put down. But there have also been multiple ways to reduce the damage output of enemies via weapons and abilities. So for me, I feel like having the ability to lower the damage output of specific enemies, even by a little, is just too much to pass up on. Yeah, I know there's fragments that can force sever, but since I'm getting sever from my heavy, I can pick a different fragment for more stats or longer durations and whatnot.

@@glacierrays just got my first master witness clear! Pulled my marcato mg on my hunter, and I was absolutely COOKING that left subjugator. Under over enhanced matching elements is hilarious good

Nvm I think this is Loki better 😭 but it depends

The build focus of this entire expansion is Prismatic, and by extension the double perk class items that can only be used with Prismatic, and which have way more synergy than regular exotics due to being able to mix and match abilities to suit them (plus more versatility e.g. Spirit Of Cyrtarachne working from any grenade, whereas the main exotic only works with grapple). And ignoring that, I even say in the video that the most important spirit is Cyrtarachne and you have options for the other one, but then I make an argument specifically for Foetracer. But if you want you can use a different spirit and instead use regular surge mods, and a more monochromatic weapon loadout

No not a must have at all, it just helps with ammo economy but as it's special ammo anyway it's not too bad

Yes it absolutely could. And you should still be able to proc foetracer for it as well from Ascension

It's an omen that you've found your new favourite build 😉

Yes in theory the most recent version of Avalanche can be good against these subjugators as it can roll under-over in 3rd column and target lock in 4th. But I highly doubt anyone kept that specific roll and it's not currently available which is why I didn't bother mentioning that. If you have any other perk combo then you're better off using the enhanced adaptive munitions and firing line commemoration I highlight in the video which will do significantly more damage

I didn't forget it, I just wanted to highlight the other options which are much better. Remember adaptive munitions needs a non-matching shield to work, so against the strand one chain of command will be similar to commemoration with adaptive munitions (although worse because you can't enhance chain of command), and against the stasis one it will only remove the 20% DR and have no damage perk at all. Yes you could use your grenade with osmosis to make it not stasis but why use a gun that needs an ability cooldown to activate one single damage perk, when you could just use commemoration for enhanced double damage perks which works equally well against both subjugators by default

True that's a good point, but in these tests I was just looking at each LMGs functionality 'out of the box' rather than getting too far into specific buildcrafting restrictions. That would definitely work for me though as my hunter build for master witness already has marksmans dodge on

@glacierrays that's fair. I main rain of fire so it's my popular option for getting rid of the downsides to KT. Unwavering Duty with KT x3 + radiant + solar surge just melts.

@@OthersideSparrow interesting you mention Unwavering Duty because that's another 450rpm that can also roll adaptive munitions, I didn't include it in the video because it's even more annoying to farm than marcato, but the 70% buff would cook even harder than killing tally here

What's the point here, that you don't want to use the best machinegun for subjugators against the subjugators? Of course you're free to not run hunters with celestial and still hunt but then you're almost definitely 3 phasing, which leads back to the same problem I highlight in the video: running out of rez tokens because of deaths at mechanics and dps which are easily done

Just remembered there's also a stasis linear this season that comes with chill clip. Freezing the tormentor/shatter could be interesting..

I doubt Cataclysmic would be a good option imo, it used to be the best linear but it's been power crept hard by 3-bursts. But feel free to test it. Remember adaptive munitions is a different damage bonus on different archetypes so might be much lower on cataclysmic than the 70% you get on commemoration. Also cheeses are a different thing, i'm always going to give advice on the best way to do something legit, rather than just pushing something off a ledge

That's what i'm here for haha. I feel like I have to preface some of my build suggestions with "look you're not gonna believe this but trust me..."

Interesting you'd say that when the main LMG roll i'm recommending above all the others I show only me damaging and getting the subjugator to 25%. Are you saying you think an LMG with a 70% buff in third column multiplied by a 20% buff in fourth column isn't the best option here? What would you recommend instead because everything else except maybe the marcato under-over for the strand sub is just objectively worse

@@glacierrays I was simply finding humor in the timing of the voiceover and the chosen clip to demonstrate the damage potential of said weapon, as you chose an instance when multiple people were cooking the subjugator to highlight how fast they go down, which is akin to doing a damage test on greg with 3 people and saying "look how fast his health bar goes down!" and then not showing damage numbers at the end. I don't think anyone would say that really any machine gun isn't useful for killing yellow bar +'s.

​@@TheRealDigitalDecafoh right, i think that was the clip I chose to show that firing line does sometimes come and go. The format of this video was more conversational and I was playing clips and giving commentary in the moment so sometimes the footage doesn't line up perfectly

I didn't include that because with adaptive you don't want it to match the shield, so it would be redundant against the stasis subjugator. It does also have osmosis so you could match surge with that and get it off stasis but by then you might as well use the commemoration with double damage perks

The damage buff is lower and it will only kick in on the bottom half, so the screech DR will have activated by then

In normal mode surges are already gone, but in Master they're still there and rotate each week. They've been a part of master raids since they started

@@glacierrays Ah ok cool

Yeah you could try the caliban one and change the smoke bomb but you'll lose the weaken and surge synergy from foetracer for a void heavy, especially as the weaken is stronger with expanding abyss. The most important part is the cyrtarachne, and without foetracer and weaken you have more flexibility on weapon elements, but make sure you still have a lot of elemental debuff effects for the GPG procs

@glacierrays sounds good. I got the catalyst and a caster perfect 5th ergo sum, so I've been dying to make a build around it because the power fantasy with that sword is insane. Haha thank you. Also your page is awesome. That other video about killing the strand and stasis meanies was definitely life changing haha.

@@Elizan723 thank you! I love my ergo too, it's very hard for me to equip anything else right now

@glacierrays ergo sum army. I even use that arc conductor one for brain dead onslaught runs with gifted conviction.

I feel that. I normally keep weird combos of things but those perks were instant shards for me lol, who could have predicted this! Seriously considering going back into onslaught to get an under-over surrounded roll on hammerhead too...

Unfortunately pro memoria doesn't have under-over, so it would only really benefit from avoiding the DR of the left side subjugator, and then a lower damage perk like target lock or bait and switch. By using one of the under-over or adaptive munitions LMGs I highlight in the video it will be significantly more damage

@@glacierrays that's very unfortunate. Besides commo. There are no other craftable ones with those perks. Am I right?

@@LRDZw13bL not crafted, no. the only other LMGs that can roll under-over are Avalanche, which is a Dawning weapon so not currently available, or Hammerhead, which can roll it alongside other damage perks. But that would require farming onslaught. Adaptive munitions can roll on the trials LMG, and it's also on the old ritual weapon Chain Of Command, a stasis LMG, but that will only work on the strand subjugator because you want to not match elements for adaptive to work

@@glacierrays actually I kept some hammerheads in my vault. Have to check them later. It's very possible I have one

And farming onslaught is not that bad

Oh that's a great combo as well!

I'm afraid that's not true, I have clips from individual testing of both GPG and the solar from hailfire spike proccing Solar Weapon Boost x4 - however I will admit I did have a few times where the hailfire was a little inconsistent, sometimes giving me the solar boost a few seconds delayed after the solar damage started. Try testing again and making sure you're holding the ergo out the entire time. Also the solar boost text for some reason isn't prioritised so it gets pushed off the screen if there are 4 other buffs/debuffs, it's incredible Bungie thinks I need to see my elemental pickup cooldowns more than that lol

@glacierrays I read that the gunpowder gamble is coded as the element of the grenade you have equipped. So with verity you need to match the grenade element with the weapon element. Might be the same for foe tracer.

@@glacierrays Okay i tested it again and i got the 4x solar surge to appear with ergo sum from gunpowder gamble. Fun thing to note is that you can trigger the 4x solar surge just from sticking the gunpowder gamble onto a yellowbar. But for some reason the 4x surge doesn't appear for any other weapon but ergo sum. Tried it with sunshot and nullify and no 4x surge appeared after hitting the same yellow bar I did the prior ergo sum test on with gunpowder. Also unfortunately haven't been able to trigger the 4x surge from hailfire Did some more testing. And it turns out its swords in general. First thing was I tested if it was based on ammo type. Equipped still hunt, threw gunpowder, no surge. Then I tested weapon type. Gunpowder gave the 4x surge to Lament. The solar surge persisted when i swapped from lament to nullify, and nullify's damage was increased by the 4x solar surges. I then tested throwing gunpowder gamble with a non solar sword equipped, in my case it was half truths. And after throwing the GPG and having it explode with said sword equipped, i swapped back to nullify to find the 4x solar surge appear on the buff list. So it looks like u just need to have any kind of sword out when gunpowder hits or explodes on the yellowbar to proc the solar surge from said gunpowder

@@Elizan723 huh that's weird. i just checked my clip of GPG working during my tests and it was when I had magnetic grenade equipped (void). There's definitely something funky going on though because it and hailfire can be inconsistent. maybe bungie will eventually fix whatever it is

@@judgement3814 that's really odd but good to know, thanks. if i encounter any more weirdness with it i'll bear it in mind and see if sword stuff fixes it

Just keep getting them and you'll see they can be different, that's just unlucky you got the same

@@glacierrays wow 4 times in a row the exact same lame sword....then this was my most unlucky farm in life 😆 thx

@@KingPravum 4 is really unlucky that's wild!

@@glacierrays ok now the fifth time i even get no sword at all 😆 😆 😆 😆 is that even possible that no sword Drops???

THANK YOU. That thumbnail tagline came to me when I was very sleep deprived just before I uploaded, and I knew I had to go with it haha

Glad to hear it! I knew I had my work cut out convincing people on the Foetracer part, which is why I went so in depth. Last night I even ran this exact build for the 1st boss of Master Salvation's Edge and honestly it worked so well even there

Thanks for confirming, I was going to test it myself once i got it but suspected it wouldn't as it doesn't count as an ability for proccing anything else...

Honestly i've never liked the dodge+melee liars spam, even when it was a new thing. It just feels weird that the safest and easiest build which uses next to no ammo, and also heals you, also does the most damage??? And they just made it even stronger with prismatic lmao

In this build I have 100 Mobility, 100 Resilience and 80 Discipline, and yes I use stat mods where I have space for them along with well rolled artifice armour. But it's redundant to mention that in a build video as stat mods needed will vary depending on each individual player's available armour, and they will make the best of it as they can regardless

@@glacierrays yeah but from an average player standpoint they wont have artifice armor and they will need stat mods on every piece of armor meaning if they want to run your build they have to sacrifice the stats they have. I'm just telling you from an average player, not coming at you. Other youtubers do it too. I think it would be good to mention that no matter what they need to shoot for 100 resilience.

The Banner Of War aspect

@@glacierrays lol! Indeed.

@@Homedoceu7 seriously though, i still haven't really played on my alts yet, but i intend to make builds for both titan and warlock once i'm fully familiar with it