I do know for 100%! TGI has made 3 versions, 1 with a N/S rec. build on a AMD 65 kit, 1 build on a N/S rec with a AMD 65 kit using a Rom 16 in barrel, since AMD 65 barrels are hard to get which is what Century does and the latest ones Made in Hung. on a FEG rec. and then opened up to high-cap here. Even though FEG went under in 04 they still had a Mom/Pop operation for many yrs. that did assemble guns from NOS parts which then were imported by TGI and TGI did all 922r compliance and sine these AMD 65 models only had 3 922r parts U still needed to use USA made mags to make up for the other 3 parts, Not many of these were made and on later models due to scarcity of NOS parts they had to use used parts and thus many stocks & grips looked a little rough and some folding stocks were repainted These are the best AK for the Money you can get, but on the last type for 922 reasons, you have to use a US mag to make up for 3 parts! Also about this time Centerfire bought a bunch of FEG rec. which were 2nd's due to fact the X & Y holes were not lined up for the pins and many bought this rec. for all types of builds! I just find it strange nobody here seems to know this in 09 I was in contact per e-mails several times with TGI and talked to them about these guns and they told me what I listed here, In 09 TGI also was on several gun Forums and said what I just did and the reason these AMD 65's did not have a rear swivel on receiver was that the rec when used on the model 2000 these had the swivels on the stocks. If U want me to I can look and find some answers from TGI from 10 yrs. ago!
I'm glad I picked one up last year at a local shop brand new in the box for $450 out the door, I knew that FEG went out of business and that this amd-65 would go up in value, I call it the Darth Vader AK
Charles M. Jones III was convicted as a Felon on Thursday, Mar. 27, 2014 for smuggling guns. I think that answers your unknown question. They were bought from FEG at some point in Hungry and smuggled into the US at a later point by TGI.
My AMD65 is a TGI built kit. No parts matching, SA2000m Nodak Spud receiver, tapco one piece brake, wood pistol grips, 12.5" FEG barrel, and has the sling swivel installed from the factory. Weird Franken-AMD but shoots great and is probably my favorite AK of all the ones I have owned. I am loving all the Hungarian AK vids and totally geek out on this stuff.
adamrojas87 Nodak Spud SA2000m receiver? I think it would be one or the other. Nodak never made a receiver model SA2000m and a USA receiver would have to have a serial number. Only certain imports have a trunnion that is married to the receiver as the serialized part. If your gun says SA2000m it isn't a Nodak. If it is a Nodak, then it isn't a SA2000m.
adamrojas87 That's interesting. SA2000m is usually a Hungarian made receiver model number. I guess Nodak decided to use that too. I didn't know 2 different manufacturers could use the same exact model number. So obviously your gun was one of the kits that were imported.
My favorite ak variant, took me 5 years to find mine. Mine has been flawless. Ive had over 10 ak variants, ive kept this and my mak 90, and my slr 106, zastava m85np. The amd is by far my favorite to go shoot. Ive found the cheap korean 20 rounders fit and work well in them. Thanks for info and keep doing reviews.
I've had my tgi feg for a very long time, and haven't had a problem from day one. The only change I've made is installing a slide rail for a red dot, and a houge back grip... Shoots like a mofo, and takes any ammo/mag combo that i've ever thrown at it . And as far as looks are concerned.... it's one of the main reasons i love this gun..Besides the fact that everyone that I've let shoot this gun has had absolutely nothing bad to say about it, but they want it .
The Clearview Investments AMD65 also has an FEG Hungarian Reciever with the Serial# on the trunion with a post production stamp CII Kentucky & serial# on the bottom of the reciever in front of the magwell
gas tube has a serial number too. awesome vid. You made me regret getting rid of mine. Especially the part about where the might only be 2500 ish imported! That's OK, I'll build a parts kits amd65 one day. Awesome video. Thank's.
Every one of these tgi's I've seen had fresh, in the white cut outs in the receiver for the stock to fold. I bet your right, these were built and came in like the Draco c and converted to a rifle here. Good vid as always
Same here, had about 100 or so of these through my hands back when CFS was selling them off in 2010-2011. Like you say, all i can recall had finish everywhere, except the magwell edges and stock henge edges. If TGI built these from kits + receivers here in the USA, why would they have first painted them and then cut on them? Would have made more sense to mod the receivers, assemble, and then paint. At least, that's how it seems to me. Thanks for watching. I am not saying i know the truth, just that i've studied these and this is my best guess to date.
Now this is the good stuff! Very interesting theories. I really love my AMD, they always seemed ugly bastard confused looking AKs, I never thought it would be one of my favorites until I shot mine.
Great video I was wondering what FEG I have this helped me a bunch I have the TGI SA2000M gun my gun is matching everything but the rear trunnion and top cover. I have an ACE folder and Texas Weapons systems top cover on my modern tanker build.
Another awesome informative video... I have two of the older, original imports with the military 12.5” barrel with that God awful tac welded on muzzle extension to make the barrel 16”... never took them out of the box. Bought another one just like them, used that I’ve shot... always been my favorite AK. Doesn’t look like any other. Loud and obnoxious but shoots decent with anything. The ones with the 12.5” barrel are getting quite expensive
Have you seen the draganov style square black stock variant ? What exactly is that and how hard is it to change stock out for something different and use standard Ak mags ?
So if it came in as a pistol and they just added a barrel extension and buttstock to make it rifle length so they could have a butt stock on it because in those days there was no pistol braces so they figured the best way to sell them would be to make them into a rifle so technically it's still a pistol right once you remove the buttstock?
I purchased my AMD-65 back circa 2012 for $400. I found it curious that these models showed up in US stores sometime not too long after they were provisioned to the Afghan army. Not a theory, per say, but a curious observation.
I have a TGI Knox TN Saiga AK-74 on the stamped receiver there is a noticable spot they took out some writing (maybe a serial number it's behind the safety) says it's made in Russia by izhmash and the full auto trip has not been machined off the bolt carrier. Sorry I can't send it to you but if your ever in Oregon your more than welcome to check it out
The imported pistol makes the most sense. i always thought they demilled SA2000m once imported and reinstalled AMD parts. You are right, the rear trunnion would need to have the the old rivet holes welded up and redrilled for the folder. Too much work to demill and rebuild especially given how affordable these sold for. The pistol theory is spot on Misha, I don't see how it would be cost effective any other way. Either way it was pretty clever on their part.
Good point on the cost. Back then Century's AMD65 kit builds were $500-$550, while these TGI FEGs were $400-$450. At that time, imports were nearly always cheaper than domestic builds.
I've always wondered about mystery of these rifles. Mine is basically the same but they had put a railed dust cover on it. So my dust cover is a different serial number because I put a hungarian factory cover on it.
I like the AMD 65. Mine seems to be a pre ban version. The foregrip on mine is a blonde wood. Mine came with six 20 round magazines, a really neat canvas carry case, a cleaning kit and a sling. The instruction book is on cheap paper.
Love mine. Got lucky, as just picked off a shelf locally when I was 19, good number of years ago. I think they were brought in as single stack import rifles, and sold with an American mag inserted to reduce how many American parts needed to be used. Trigger is Tapco, gas piston might be, maybe brake. All I do know is they're the most shootable AK I've ever fired, and has the smoothest AK action as well.
I don't think the stocks were added after. I don't recall the rivets having any lack of uniformity, and no one could/would recreate identical rivets. Just haven't seen anything that would lead me to believe the stock was added after. Wish I had mine here at the apartment to say for sure and look it over.
Gas piston is Hungarian, and some have a US Tapco brake while others have the orig brake + US 2" extension. Funny thing is that since the device is attached permiantly, US/Foreign doesn't matter under the law.
Yep, not much not to like with these. All Hungarian, well put together, reliable, and accurate for their size/class. About the only negatives are a so-so paint finish and sometimes a chewed up grip.
Mine is like yours, TGI with matte finish all numbers matching which has made in Hungary and the FEG logo engraved on it, mine has the white box that says made in Hungary and has the FEG logo as well. Bought it back in 2008 and have never fired it, its in the safe still in the box, bought it mainly for investment as I figured these may become valuable in the future...
Hey Misha, I have a Romanian TGI imported AK 47 "75 Sporter" Made in Romania/Armex, TGI Knox TN on the left side of receiver below trunnion. Matching numbers on the bolt, bolt carrier, trunnion and gas tube. Has a "79" after the trunnion serial number (all peened). Has a "G" on the left side of the rear sight base. Originally received with tapco furniture and a tapco trigger. Not sure about the slant muzzle device. Still has the bayo lug. Has a lot of lightly struck welding dimples on the receiver right side, a couple on the left side. Bolt carrier has had the auto sear milled off as well. Magazine well was originally single stack that got enlarged. It's basically just like your FEG AMD 65 described in your video but it's a AK 47 "75 Sporter" made in Romania/Armex. I've added a Romy folding wire stock and a Romy wooden dong fore grip.
Yes, it shipped with a 20rd tapco mag, red and yellow plastic oil bottles and steel cleaning capsule with the usual AK tools, also came with a blank firing adapter which is with plastic oil bottles...
Aren't they actually Promag 20rders? In some sort of funny waffle pattern? Using a US made magazine, that's... 3 more US parts? So using a foreign mag might not technically OK, but we're talking for masse sale.
No its a tapco mag, it may not give the required number for 922r but I don't give a crap. I bought it back in 2008 and have yet to fire it anyway, its still in the box in the safe, I bought mainly for investment as I thought these may be worth something someday. I have plenty of other AK's that I do fire...
They could just stamp bolt carriers and dust covers to match the used trunnion. Ive heard of people doing this before. Do any of the other usually numbered parts have numbers or just the most noticeable and seeable ones? Not saying this is what they did, but it wouldnt be hard and a worth it to most ak guys who often ask if the numbers match.
Not likely for a few reasons. First TGI did not do this with their other guns. Second, they made thousands of these. It might be worth it on an individual gunsmith level to restamp numbers, but that stuff gets expensive and time consuming at a factory. Keep in mind too these weren't being sold as premium rifles to collectors. No, these things were cheap back then, cheaper than most any other AK on the market except maybe the WASR10 at the time.
+Ozark Bear Arms I got mine in 04 from Joken Firearms. Mine doesn't have a FEG receiver. I believe it a Horns Flag AZ USAMD. That what it says on bottom of receiver.
TDI had at least two version's of AMD-65 that they sold. The more well known & desirable ones are the guns with both a Hungarian barrel & receiver like what you show in this video, but TDI also sold OG barrel parts kit builds on NDS receivers, one of which I own. It all sn matching on the Hungarian parts (but not all the ones I have seen on the internet were) even the muzzle break which is the two piece spot-welded assembly like on your current gun. It also came from the factory with the rear sling loop installed on the receiver. Same beat up polymer grips, same rough black paint. 99% sure the Bcg still has the FA trip intact, but I would have to strip it down to be sure.
Just bought a CII (clearview) akm 63 style AK with a feg receiver and all matching numbers. Do you have any info on these because i noticed that it has a short stroke gas piston as opposed to the long stroke which is correct for an “akm-63”
Hey, did you ever read the .pdf file with the lawsuit against TGI by waffenworks this year for loss of investment money when TGI got pinched by ATF in 2014? It says that a company called ARMACO in Hungary demilled the AMD65 rifles for TGI, then rebuilt in sporter form on semi auto receivers, then were converted to regular form here in the US. TGI got pinched when feds found out the guns used former "machine gun barrels". I'm including link to pdf, it's a good read. This might make a good pt 2 recap to the the video. www.tneb.uscourts.gov/sites/default/files/01-26-2018_lansden_et_al._v._jones_in_re_jones_14-3048.pdf
I know I'm very late to the game here, but I've been interested in the progeny of these rifles too. I'm so impressed with your level of knowledge and insight. Turning to your hypothesis that they were brought over as pistols, I think you conclude that the rear trunion from an AMD 65 was used, included the button/folding mechanism, but just not the wire stock itself? That is based in part on the rear trunion rivet pattern, which makes sense. But that means that still had to buy AMD kits anyway to separately source the wire stock and foregrip and then throw everything else away. Unless, FEG was sending the "pistol" with its foregrip and wire stock just not assembled. Finally, would it have been TGI who engraved/stamped the underside of the receiver with SA2000M? It looks like they did, which begs the question why? If, instead, this was engraved in Hungary, is it common to engrave the receiver while still in the flat, rather than after being drilled/stamped and folded. I know nothing about that process, so forgive me if that's a silly question. Thanks so much for these spectacular videos and information!
Mine has the 12.5 inch barrel, 1 piece pinned & welded brake, nodak spud receiver w sling loop, says sa2000m TGI. So mine is just a sa2000m parts kit put together bY TGI using a nodak spud US receiver I think. What’s the difference between SA2000M kit build vs AMD65 kit build?
Mine has the shiny finish,with a one piece brake,and came with a Tapco trigger. All numbers match,including the gas tube and recoil spring,tho the recoil spring base has only the last three numbers. The serial number is “EF,four numbers,H”. with the “H” missing on all other parts,and is only present on the trunnion. The left side of the receiver has the FEG logo,and FEG 762.39,and “Made in Hungary”below it The cheesy tack weld on the brake fell off after about 30-40 rounds,and the brake started walking out,causing the bullets to impact and go flying off to parts unknown. The retaining pin for the brake was functional,and popped out after the brake was removed. The barrel is chrome lined and 12.75 in length I bought this,I think,around 2011 from a local chain store for $349.99. I think Mishaco is spot on with his theory,this is no kit build,or imported receiver,this is a complete firearm built in Hungary. Could be as a pistol,never noticed it before,but the cutouts for the folding stock in the receiver are in the white. Whatever,I love this rifle,it looks badass,100% reliable,and as accurate as any AK.
i have recently bought TGI receiver with rear trunnion installed, and rear and front tunnion installed. I have also bought kits dated import 2000 2001. the TGI receiver has sn# in front of mag mod: SA 2000, nodac spud edna Mn. SN: x001459TGI Knoxville, Tn. Do you prefer the 16 in or the 12.75 as a shooter?
fmart3315 it doesn’t matter where you were born. What matters is where you chose to live. I was born and raise in NYC but bought my first rifle at 18 on base in Germany. Since I turned 21 in 1977 I have refused to live where my rights were overly restricted. Florida, Texas, Tennessee, Kentucky, Georgia and Virginia have been my home. I worked at CBP HQ in DC for five years but refused to live in DC or Maryland because of their restrictions on firearms. I voted with my feet and left the leftist strongholds behind.
What about the cii "amd63" I know the amd 63 wasn't ever actually a thing but lots of people have had great experiences with them, just wondering if you have any experience with them. Always in my best interest to ask the ak guru.
i dont know about the assembled guns but ive bought kits and the parts are in pretty nice shape. Frankly close enough to make me think unissued untill i saw a tad bit of rounding at the bolt tail showing it had been fired atleast a bit. The barrels are a bit over gassed though but the break is so effective its not a huge deal
Andre Krumins I've heard about the overgassing, there's a site called amd65tech that sells buffers for them because of it. Lots of purist dont like the idea if rubber buffers in aks but if it works it works. Thanks for the input. I appreciate it.
I have a CII AMD-63 that I got so cheap I couldn't say no. The mag well was really sloppy front to back. So much so that it was causing all sorts of feeding and ejection problems. I put a M+M mag catch on it and it fixed the problem and now it's a great shooter. Aside from my WASR 10-63, it's the cheapest (in terms of cost) AK that I own. I'm happy with it, even though it needed a little help to be reliable.
There were some kits that came without the stock attached and required milling of receiver for the stock, and they only took single stack mags. gun.deals/product/hungarian-amd-65-barreled-receiver-90-complete-build-kit-feg-heavy-wall-receiver-headspaced-
Mine had the 1pc extension, no sn on rcvr, shiny shitty black paint, wood grips, matching numbers 12"bbl, auto trip is gone, sling mounted to stock wire. It says SA2000M TGI in front of magwell.
Yes they could have. The only issues would have been, how did the Tapco device get over to Hungary? Always possible that TGI shipped them to whoever built the firearms of course. Second would be the stock & both pistol grips. These wouldn't have been allowed by import rules, so would have had to have been replaced with a thumbhole stock & std handguard for import. TGI could have done the conversion here, also adding the G2 FCG. These events are possible for sure, but then why did these ship in a FEG marked box only big enough for a pistol or barreled action? Top this off with the simple fact that it is easier to import a pistol than a carbine, it logically, TGI should have picked pistol as the version rather than carbine, but yes it is possible the reverse happened.
I had one but lost it in an unfortunate boating accident. Everyone who tried it loved the butter soft Tapco trigger and mild recoil. The gas block however was canted to the side and it looked like a truck had ran over it because of that. However it shot as good as any other despite of the funny appearance looking down the barrel from the top. I wish I had bought three of them.
Have have the gloss finish that that is terrible but the 12.5 barrel all matching and I love it I put a dong up front maybe I put a video up on it... Good info sir... I have never had a problem outta my feg sa 2000
That was quite a dramatic disassembly! I definitely want one of these at some point. Im somewhat curious as to why they milled the trip on the bolts as as far as i know its not legally mandated. I Have to say the pistol concept makes the most sense to me, ESPECIALLY because the parts that would be added later such as the foregrip/handgaurd assembly and the stock are not serialized on the military guns. That way they could build the pistols from kits in Hungary, keeping the serialized parts together, then just send the stocks, breaks and handgaurds over in a giant bundle to be slapped on later since there would be no way to tell if it was the original to the gun anyways. heck if we really want to reach mabey loose packageing is why the stocks and grips are a bit beat, though id be skeptical on that since ive never seen a parts kit that had clean grips. The search for clean plastic AMD grips has been driveing my nuts by the way, i think i just give up at this point. HA!
Typically, you see the trip machined off on imports. Its something they've been doing since the '80s. You can find this done on later Valmets, most FEG SA85s, most Maadis, and til today with the WASR10 and NPAP.
thanks for watching. We have a video on the SA85 and SA2000 coming soon. We also want to do some other stories on interesting/unique semi autos later, cheers.
Ozark Bear Arms thanks man you guys really sparked my interest in AKs. I've known plenty of AK guys but have never been terribly interested in AKs until now. You show such a great variety and history I definitely appreciate it. And of course I cherish all your AR vids, really the best around. Ian is amazing, but you really go in depth
How did TGI get 922 compliance? US made trigger parts, I presume, but what else? As far as I know there are no domestic sources of amd 65 furniture and mishaco didn't mention a US piston, so...?
I really enjoyed the video... 😬 it's just that, well... it's "carbine," not "carbine." I don't mean to criticize, but when you say "carbine" instead of "carbine," people might think you meant to say "carbine" and not "carbine," which confuses people who say, "carbine." So it's like, important... especially in a nerdy video.
haha your post made me smile. I like the joke, but just because, my TTS says 'carb-i-n, which is the European variant (its British). 'car-been' tends to be the American style. Technically, both are correct. You can ask my wife, she's a linguist lol.
I didn't want to shoot mine because it'd burn up the Hungarian barrel. Sad, I know. Aren't they chrome lined?? Issue before was either getting stuck between shooting bore burning steelish jacketed ammo; or copper jacketed, corrosive, more expensive ammo (Yugo) ammo. Now SG Ammo is selling new production copper jacketed 7.62x39. Even has lacquer coating and sealed bullets and primers!
The barrel was both made with the CHF process known for producing strong/durable steel, and was chromelined which is known for increasing service life and making cleaning easier. No way could you burn up the barrel, not without firing 10,000+ rounds at least. My SAR-1 has over 8k through it now, and the rifling/bore is still fine, cheers.
I can't remember what shooting the "bi-metal" jacketed Russian ammo does, but back when that jacket was first created for the 5.45x39, the life of the barrels on the AK74 dropped down to single digit thousands. Then they had to make the barrels better (not sure how) and only extended the life to 12,000 rounds. The pressure for 5.45x39 is probably higher pressure than 7.62x39, which doesn't help barrel life either, but just don't want to ever sell it or rebarrel it. I don't actuall see a benefit to CHF barrels if they're chrome lined... as the chrome is what goes first and then the barrel is done. Wish I knew roughly how many rounds the Hungarian barrels die on.
Mish should do a vid on the development of the 5.45x39 and AK74. Also who jumped on that ship, and who didn't, and how for both. Or just how they made the barrels better?
hi let me clear up some of the confusion surrounding the receiver. those AMD-65,s were made here from matching kits. the receivers were SINGLE STACK receivers imported from Hungary then had the mag wells milled out to accept standard capacity magazines. Originally they would ONLY FIT TAPCO mags. I have had one for a long time and was able to find this out through research. they are EXCELLENT rifles! enjoy.
Please listen to the video. I discuss the 80% possibility, as well as the 100% receiver possibility too. I have tried to figure out how these came to be, based on the facts we know and can see on the rifles today.
Second time I've watched it enjoyed it just as much the second time help me identify the car being that I have which looks like it's one of the pistols switch I'm happier with. China Joe's got to go resistance is real.
I do know for 100%! TGI has made 3 versions, 1 with a N/S rec. build on a AMD 65 kit, 1 build on a N/S rec with a AMD 65 kit using a Rom 16 in barrel, since AMD 65 barrels are hard to get which is what Century does and the latest ones Made in Hung. on a FEG rec. and then opened up to high-cap here.
Even though FEG went under in 04 they still had a Mom/Pop operation for many yrs. that did assemble guns from NOS parts which then were imported by TGI and TGI did all 922r compliance and sine these AMD 65 models only had 3 922r parts U still needed to use USA made mags to make up for the other 3 parts,
Not many of these were made and on later models due to scarcity of NOS parts they had to use used parts and thus many stocks & grips looked a little rough and some folding stocks were repainted
These are the best AK for the Money you can get, but on the last type for 922 reasons, you have to use a US mag to make up for 3 parts!
Also about this time Centerfire bought a bunch of FEG rec. which were 2nd's due to fact the X & Y holes were not lined up for the pins and many bought this rec. for all types of builds!
I just find it strange nobody here seems to know this in 09 I was in contact per e-mails several times with TGI and talked to them about these guns and they told me what I listed here,
In 09 TGI also was on several gun Forums and said what I just did and the reason these AMD 65's did not have a rear swivel on receiver was that the rec when used on the model 2000 these had the swivels on the stocks.
If U want me to I can look and find some answers from TGI from 10 yrs. ago!
good overview!
Thanks much, feel free to checkout our other AKcentric playlists when you're bored or just need to fall asleep hehee, cheers.
Much AK
Much Knowledge
Much Whisperer
Much Mishaco
I'm glad I picked one up last year at a local shop brand new in the box for $450 out the door, I knew that FEG went out of business and that this amd-65 would go up in value, I call it the Darth Vader AK
El Pistola that’s a steal
Charles M. Jones III was convicted as a Felon on Thursday, Mar. 27, 2014 for smuggling guns. I think that answers your unknown question. They were bought from FEG at some point in Hungry and smuggled into the US at a later point by TGI.
All I know is that I like both of mine. Good shooters, reliable and respectable groupings. They feed any ammo and never burp.
Yes, exactly cheers.
Not boring at all, Misha! Very interesting.
Thank you, this video was actually the leftovers from the one we put out awhile back on the TGI FEG.
My AMD65 is a TGI built kit. No parts matching, SA2000m Nodak Spud receiver, tapco one piece brake, wood pistol grips, 12.5" FEG barrel, and has the sling swivel installed from the factory. Weird Franken-AMD but shoots great and is probably my favorite AK of all the ones I have owned. I am loving all the Hungarian AK vids and totally geek out on this stuff.
adamrojas87 Nodak Spud SA2000m receiver? I think it would be one or the other. Nodak never made a receiver model SA2000m and a USA receiver would have to have a serial number. Only certain imports have a trunnion that is married to the receiver as the serialized part. If your gun says SA2000m it isn't a Nodak. If it is a Nodak, then it isn't a SA2000m.
If it says nodak yours might be a century build or someones homebuild
the bottom of the receiver by the magwell is marked with
Mod:SA200M
CAL:7.62x39
Nodak Spud LLC
Edna, MN. USA
SN:XXXXXXX
TGI
forgot to add a 0 it's marked MOD:SA2000M not 200M
adamrojas87 That's interesting. SA2000m is usually a Hungarian made receiver model number. I guess Nodak decided to use that too. I didn't know 2 different manufacturers could use the same exact model number. So obviously your gun was one of the kits that were imported.
My favorite ak variant, took me 5 years to find mine. Mine has been flawless. Ive had over 10 ak variants, ive kept this and my mak 90, and my slr 106, zastava m85np. The amd is by far my favorite to go shoot. Ive found the cheap korean 20 rounders fit and work well in them. Thanks for info and keep doing reviews.
I've had my tgi feg for a very long time, and haven't had a problem from day one.
The only change I've made is installing a slide rail for a red dot, and a houge back grip...
Shoots like a mofo, and takes any ammo/mag combo that i've ever thrown at it .
And as far as looks are concerned....
it's one of the main reasons i love this gun..Besides the fact that everyone that I've let shoot this gun has had absolutely nothing bad to say about it,
but they want it .
The Clearview Investments AMD65 also has an FEG Hungarian Reciever with the Serial# on the trunion with a post production stamp CII Kentucky & serial# on the bottom of the reciever in front of the magwell
gas tube has a serial number too. awesome vid. You made me regret getting rid of mine. Especially the part about where the might only be 2500 ish imported! That's OK, I'll build a parts kits amd65 one day. Awesome video. Thank's.
AK nerd checking in. Thanks again for all your great info.
Great job Misha, these will go up in value over the years Im glad I snatched one up while they were available.
Very interesting and insightful. Always enjoy your videos, Misha. Thanks for sharing
Every one of these tgi's I've seen had fresh, in the white cut outs in the receiver for the stock to fold. I bet your right, these were built and came in like the Draco c and converted to a rifle here. Good vid as always
Same here, had about 100 or so of these through my hands back when CFS was selling them off in 2010-2011. Like you say, all i can recall had finish everywhere, except the magwell edges and stock henge edges. If TGI built these from kits + receivers here in the USA, why would they have first painted them and then cut on them? Would have made more sense to mod the receivers, assemble, and then paint. At least, that's how it seems to me. Thanks for watching. I am not saying i know the truth, just that i've studied these and this is my best guess to date.
Incredibly knowledgeable and detailed video. This is the best channel to go to for ak info. Well done!
I love your videos because it's nerdy. I totally dork out on anything mechanical especially firearms. Thank you for your videos
Thank you for watching, cheers.
Now this is the good stuff! Very interesting theories. I really love my AMD, they always seemed ugly bastard confused looking AKs, I never thought it would be one of my favorites until I shot mine.
Truth is its an lovely rifle that needs more love.
for sure
Great video I was wondering what FEG I have this helped me a bunch I have the TGI SA2000M gun my gun is matching everything but the rear trunnion and top cover. I have an ACE folder and Texas Weapons systems top cover on my modern tanker build.
I've always liked the 65. Never had one yet though. I do have a single tanker mag though so i guess i should try to find one. Lol.
Another awesome informative video... I have two of the older, original imports with the military 12.5” barrel with that God awful tac welded on muzzle extension to make the barrel 16”... never took them out of the box. Bought another one just like them, used that I’ve shot... always been my favorite AK. Doesn’t look like any other. Loud and obnoxious but shoots decent with anything. The ones with the 12.5” barrel are getting quite expensive
Thank you for watching, cheers.
Have you seen the draganov style square black stock variant ?
What exactly is that and how hard is it to change stock out for something different and use standard Ak mags ?
So if it came in as a pistol and they just added a barrel extension and buttstock to make it rifle length so they could have a butt stock on it because in those days there was no pistol braces so they figured the best way to sell them would be to make them into a rifle so technically it's still a pistol right once you remove the buttstock?
I have seen similar story's about TGI Bulgarian 74. The spot weld patter is slightly different than the other 74s imo.
Great video
I purchased my AMD-65 back circa 2012 for $400. I found it curious that these models showed up in US stores sometime not too long after they were provisioned to the Afghan army. Not a theory, per say, but a curious observation.
I have a TGI Knox TN Saiga AK-74 on the stamped receiver there is a noticable spot they took out some writing (maybe a serial number it's behind the safety) says it's made in Russia by izhmash and the full auto trip has not been machined off the bolt carrier. Sorry I can't send it to you but if your ever in Oregon your more than welcome to check it out
The imported pistol makes the most sense. i always thought they demilled SA2000m once imported and reinstalled AMD parts. You are right, the rear trunnion would need to have the the old rivet holes welded up and redrilled for the folder. Too much work to demill and rebuild especially given how affordable these sold for. The pistol theory is spot on Misha, I don't see how it would be cost effective any other way. Either way it was pretty clever on their part.
Good point on the cost. Back then Century's AMD65 kit builds were $500-$550, while these TGI FEGs were $400-$450. At that time, imports were nearly always cheaper than domestic builds.
I've always wondered about mystery of these rifles. Mine is basically the same but they had put a railed dust cover on it. So my dust cover is a different serial number because I put a hungarian factory cover on it.
railed dust covers are an affront to god
I like the AMD 65. Mine seems to be a pre ban version. The foregrip on mine is a blonde wood. Mine came with six 20 round magazines, a really neat canvas carry case, a cleaning kit and a sling. The instruction book is on cheap paper.
Love mine. Got lucky, as just picked off a shelf locally when I was 19, good number of years ago. I think they were brought in as single stack import rifles, and sold with an American mag inserted to reduce how many American parts needed to be used. Trigger is Tapco, gas piston might be, maybe brake. All I do know is they're the most shootable AK I've ever fired, and has the smoothest AK action as well.
I don't think the stocks were added after. I don't recall the rivets having any lack of uniformity, and no one could/would recreate identical rivets. Just haven't seen anything that would lead me to believe the stock was added after. Wish I had mine here at the apartment to say for sure and look it over.
Gas piston is Hungarian, and some have a US Tapco brake while others have the orig brake + US 2" extension. Funny thing is that since the device is attached permiantly, US/Foreign doesn't matter under the law.
Glad I got one.
Yep, not much not to like with these. All Hungarian, well put together, reliable, and accurate for their size/class. About the only negatives are a so-so paint finish and sometimes a chewed up grip.
good video. based on your evidence, i have to agree. my only question is where did all the sa2000s go? i never see those ugly things.
Mine is like yours, TGI with matte finish all numbers matching which has made in Hungary and the FEG logo engraved on it, mine has the white box that says made in Hungary and has the FEG logo as well. Bought it back in 2008 and have never fired it, its in the safe still in the box, bought it mainly for investment as I figured these may become valuable in the future...
Thanks much for watching & might as well fire that thing. They are a lot of fun.
That’s the beautiful thing about the AK variant you can shoot the shit out them and still watch them appreciate!
Hey Misha, I have a Romanian TGI imported AK 47 "75 Sporter" Made in Romania/Armex, TGI Knox TN on the left side of receiver below trunnion. Matching numbers on the bolt, bolt carrier, trunnion and gas tube. Has a "79" after the trunnion serial number (all peened). Has a "G" on the left side of the rear sight base. Originally received with tapco furniture and a tapco trigger. Not sure about the slant muzzle device. Still has the bayo lug. Has a lot of lightly struck welding dimples on the receiver right side, a couple on the left side. Bolt carrier has had the auto sear milled off as well. Magazine well was originally single stack that got enlarged. It's basically just like your FEG AMD 65 described in your video but it's a AK 47 "75 Sporter" made in Romania/Armex. I've added a Romy folding wire stock and a Romy wooden dong fore grip.
Appreciate your videos sir
What's going on with that 7mm side of the hammer pin. Either the stamping is incorrect or it was drilled incorrectly.
Great video. Do these have a US trigger group? Now I'm really looking forward to getting mine.
Mine has a tapco g-2 trigger.
Oscar Delta That's what I figured. I'm guessing it shipped with a Tapco mag too?
Yes, it shipped with a 20rd tapco mag, red and yellow plastic oil bottles and steel cleaning capsule with the usual AK tools, also came with a blank firing adapter which is with plastic oil bottles...
Aren't they actually Promag 20rders? In some sort of funny waffle pattern? Using a US made magazine, that's... 3 more US parts? So using a foreign mag might not technically OK, but we're talking for masse sale.
No its a tapco mag, it may not give the required number for 922r but I don't give a crap. I bought it back in 2008 and have yet to fire it anyway, its still in the box in the safe, I bought mainly for investment as I thought these may be worth something someday. I have plenty of other AK's that I do fire...
They could just stamp bolt carriers and dust covers to match the used trunnion. Ive heard of people doing this before. Do any of the other usually numbered parts have numbers or just the most noticeable and seeable ones? Not saying this is what they did, but it wouldnt be hard and a worth it to most ak guys who often ask if the numbers match.
Not likely for a few reasons. First TGI did not do this with their other guns. Second, they made thousands of these. It might be worth it on an individual gunsmith level to restamp numbers, but that stuff gets expensive and time consuming at a factory. Keep in mind too these weren't being sold as premium rifles to collectors. No, these things were cheap back then, cheaper than most any other AK on the market except maybe the WASR10 at the time.
Too nerdy? When it comes to guns, there's no such thing :)
haha thanks
+Ozark Bear Arms I got mine in 04 from Joken Firearms. Mine doesn't have a FEG receiver. I believe it a Horns Flag AZ USAMD. That what it says on bottom of receiver.
Sorry, but yours is a different model and has little to do with the TGI FEG AMD65 Sporter that is being debated in this video.
TDI had at least two version's of AMD-65 that they sold. The more well known & desirable ones are the guns with both a Hungarian barrel & receiver like what you show in this video, but TDI also sold OG barrel parts kit builds on NDS receivers, one of which I own. It all sn matching on the Hungarian parts (but not all the ones I have seen on the internet were) even the muzzle break which is the two piece spot-welded assembly like on your current gun. It also came from the factory with the rear sling loop installed on the receiver. Same beat up polymer grips, same rough black paint. 99% sure the Bcg still has the FA trip intact, but I would have to strip it down to be sure.
For sure, TGI did many different kit builds over the years. Thanks for watching, cheers.
Yes, my kits from 2000 2001 have matching numbers. The TGI builds have the trip sears removed and not pretty.
What is the A for on the rear sight? What should I set my rear site at at ,50 to 75 yards
Just bought a CII (clearview) akm 63 style AK with a feg receiver and all matching numbers. Do you have any info on these because i noticed that it has a short stroke gas piston as opposed to the long stroke which is correct for an “akm-63”
Hey, did you ever read the .pdf file with the lawsuit against TGI by waffenworks this year for loss of investment money when TGI got pinched by ATF in 2014? It says that a company called ARMACO in Hungary demilled the AMD65 rifles for TGI, then rebuilt in sporter form on semi auto receivers, then were converted to regular form here in the US. TGI got pinched when feds found out the guns used former "machine gun barrels". I'm including link to pdf, it's a good read. This might make a good pt 2 recap to the the video.
www.tneb.uscourts.gov/sites/default/files/01-26-2018_lansden_et_al._v._jones_in_re_jones_14-3048.pdf
@Mishaco I have one that is built on an arsenal receiver. Any idea about its history or any info? I can't find anything.
I know I'm very late to the game here, but I've been interested in the progeny of these rifles too. I'm so impressed with your level of knowledge and insight.
Turning to your hypothesis that they were brought over as pistols, I think you conclude that the rear trunion from an AMD 65 was used, included the button/folding mechanism, but just not the wire stock itself? That is based in part on the rear trunion rivet pattern, which makes sense. But that means that still had to buy AMD kits anyway to separately source the wire stock and foregrip and then throw everything else away. Unless, FEG was sending the "pistol" with its foregrip and wire stock just not assembled.
Finally, would it have been TGI who engraved/stamped the underside of the receiver with SA2000M? It looks like they did, which begs the question why? If, instead, this was engraved in Hungary, is it common to engrave the receiver while still in the flat, rather than after being drilled/stamped and folded. I know nothing about that process, so forgive me if that's a silly question.
Thanks so much for these spectacular videos and information!
Mine has the 12.5 inch barrel, 1 piece pinned & welded brake, nodak spud receiver w sling loop, says sa2000m TGI.
So mine is just a sa2000m parts kit put together bY TGI using a nodak spud US receiver I think. What’s the difference between SA2000M kit build vs AMD65 kit build?
Mine has the shiny finish,with a one piece brake,and came with a Tapco trigger. All numbers match,including the gas tube and recoil spring,tho the recoil spring base has only the last three numbers. The serial number is “EF,four numbers,H”. with the “H” missing on all other parts,and is only present on the trunnion. The left side of the receiver has the FEG logo,and FEG 762.39,and “Made in Hungary”below it The cheesy tack weld on the brake fell off after about 30-40 rounds,and the brake started walking out,causing the bullets to impact and go flying off to parts unknown. The retaining pin for the brake was functional,and popped out after the brake was removed. The barrel is chrome lined and 12.75 in length I bought this,I think,around 2011 from a local chain store for $349.99. I think Mishaco is spot on with his theory,this is no kit build,or imported receiver,this is a complete firearm built in Hungary. Could be as a pistol,never noticed it before,but the cutouts for the folding stock in the receiver are in the white. Whatever,I love this rifle,it looks badass,100% reliable,and as accurate as any AK.
Thank you much for watching & sharing, cheers.
i have recently bought TGI receiver with rear trunnion installed, and rear and front tunnion installed. I have also bought kits dated import 2000 2001. the TGI receiver has sn# in front of mag mod: SA 2000, nodac spud edna Mn. SN: x001459TGI Knoxville, Tn. Do you prefer the 16 in or the 12.75 as a shooter?
I always wanted an amd 65, oh why was I born in the unconstitutional state of connecticut...,Why Lord, Why
fmart3315 it doesn’t matter where you were born. What matters is where you chose to live.
I was born and raise in NYC but bought my first rifle at 18 on base in Germany.
Since I turned 21 in 1977 I have refused to live where my rights were overly restricted.
Florida, Texas, Tennessee, Kentucky, Georgia and Virginia have been my home.
I worked at CBP HQ in DC for five years but refused to live in DC or Maryland because of their restrictions on firearms.
I voted with my feet and left the leftist strongholds behind.
Why is my rifle a more greyish color and the handgrip and forward grip are almost a green color?
One more thing, my TGI receivers has the sling slit.
Wow what kinda dinguses gave this awesome video a thumbs down 10+ times?!??!! 10000 thumbs up!!! 👍
What about the cii "amd63" I know the amd 63 wasn't ever actually a thing but lots of people have had great experiences with them, just wondering if you have any experience with them. Always in my best interest to ask the ak guru.
i dont know about the assembled guns but ive bought kits and the parts are in pretty nice shape. Frankly close enough to make me think unissued untill i saw a tad bit of rounding at the bolt tail showing it had been fired atleast a bit.
The barrels are a bit over gassed though but the break is so effective its not a huge deal
Andre Krumins I've heard about the overgassing, there's a site called amd65tech that sells buffers for them because of it. Lots of purist dont like the idea if rubber buffers in aks but if it works it works. Thanks for the input. I appreciate it.
I have a CII AMD-63 that I got so cheap I couldn't say no. The mag well was really sloppy front to back. So much so that it was causing all sorts of feeding and ejection problems. I put a M+M mag catch on it and it fixed the problem and now it's a great shooter. Aside from my WASR 10-63, it's the cheapest (in terms of cost) AK that I own. I'm happy with it, even though it needed a little help to be reliable.
Checkout our previous Hungarian AKs video, cheers.
Matthew Olmstead I saw other people mention the mag catch swap as well. May have even been you if you left a review on their classics site.
There were some kits that came without the stock attached and required milling of receiver for the stock, and they only took
single stack mags. gun.deals/product/hungarian-amd-65-barreled-receiver-90-complete-build-kit-feg-heavy-wall-receiver-headspaced-
thank you , Misha
Mine had the 1pc extension, no sn on rcvr, shiny shitty black paint, wood grips, matching numbers 12"bbl, auto trip is gone, sling mounted to stock wire. It says SA2000M TGI in front of magwell.
Did you buy yours new in box or used?
Need more mags, where can I find some for a decent price and actually work ?
I have a question about GSAD Ak’s. Is it normal for them to not be stamped “made in China”? Thanks. Love your channel
Awesome video 👍👍
Kinda off topic but do you know if the CII AMD 65 rifles are any good? The price is tempting.
We have a video that's an initial look at one. Checkout the Hungarian playlist. We'll do a more indepth range review soon too.
I don’t see where it says made in Hungary on the side.
Couldn't they have imported them as single stack rifles with the muzzle device welded on?
Yes they could have. The only issues would have been, how did the Tapco device get over to Hungary? Always possible that TGI shipped them to whoever built the firearms of course. Second would be the stock & both pistol grips. These wouldn't have been allowed by import rules, so would have had to have been replaced with a thumbhole stock & std handguard for import. TGI could have done the conversion here, also adding the G2 FCG. These events are possible for sure, but then why did these ship in a FEG marked box only big enough for a pistol or barreled action? Top this off with the simple fact that it is easier to import a pistol than a carbine, it logically, TGI should have picked pistol as the version rather than carbine, but yes it is possible the reverse happened.
These FEG TGI AMD's now seem to go for $1.200 + on Gunbroker!
Wow mine was about $389. before tax in 2009.
I had one but lost it in an unfortunate boating accident. Everyone who tried it loved the butter soft Tapco trigger and mild recoil. The gas block however was canted to the side and it looked like a truck had ran over it because of that. However it shot as good as any other despite of the funny appearance looking down the barrel from the top. I wish I had bought three of them.
Have have the gloss finish that that is terrible but the 12.5 barrel all matching and I love it I put a dong up front maybe I put a video up on it... Good info sir... I have never had a problem outta my feg sa 2000
My bet is on them having been imported as pistols, then converted to rifles state side.
I did my best to figure it out within the known facts. Could be wrong but....
Nerdy my ass you've got great reviews and there's lots of knowledge in them
That was quite a dramatic disassembly!
I definitely want one of these at some point. Im somewhat curious as to why they milled the trip on the bolts as as far as i know its not legally mandated.
I Have to say the pistol concept makes the most sense to me, ESPECIALLY because the parts that would be added later such as the foregrip/handgaurd assembly and the stock are not serialized on the military guns.
That way they could build the pistols from kits in Hungary, keeping the serialized parts together, then just send the stocks, breaks and handgaurds over in a giant bundle to be slapped on later since there would be no way to tell if it was the original to the gun anyways.
heck if we really want to reach mabey loose packageing is why the stocks and grips are a bit beat, though id be skeptical on that since ive never seen a parts kit that had clean grips.
The search for clean plastic AMD grips has been driveing my nuts by the way, i think i just give up at this point. HA!
Typically, you see the trip machined off on imports. Its something they've been doing since the '80s. You can find this done on later Valmets, most FEG SA85s, most Maadis, and til today with the WASR10 and NPAP.
huh, i have to say its not something ive noticed, but considering pretty much all mine are kit rebuilds i could see how i would miss it
What is the max range of fire... AMD 65
Good overview
I run a Strela 4pc on my TGI AMD65 , easily the most accurate import I own out to 400yd.
That's interesting thanks for sharing
thanks for watching. We have a video on the SA85 and SA2000 coming soon. We also want to do some other stories on interesting/unique semi autos later, cheers.
Ozark Bear Arms thanks man you guys really sparked my interest in AKs. I've known plenty of AK guys but have never been terribly interested in AKs until now. You show such a great variety and history I definitely appreciate it. And of course I cherish all your AR vids, really the best around. Ian is amazing, but you really go in depth
How did TGI get 922 compliance? US made trigger parts, I presume, but what else? As far as I know there are no domestic sources of amd 65 furniture and mishaco didn't mention a US piston, so...?
Best theory I've heard 👍👍
DDI made their rifles off of Hungarian kits. Have you done a vid on that?
got one of these today for $800 walked into the LGS and it was sitting there.
Are these amd65 considered sbrs ?
That backwards grip just weirds me the fk out, man.... 😳
Well, you could always flip it around....though then getting magazines in would be....'interesting' to say the least.
Ancient aliens built these weapons! Thanks for the content!!
I really enjoyed the video... 😬 it's just that, well... it's "carbine," not "carbine." I don't mean to criticize, but when you say "carbine" instead of "carbine," people might think you meant to say "carbine" and not "carbine," which confuses people who say, "carbine." So it's like, important... especially in a nerdy video.
Will definitely make sure to say "carbine" instead of "carbine" in the future. Really appreciate the constructive criticism! - Jay
haha your post made me smile. I like the joke, but just because, my TTS says 'carb-i-n, which is the European variant (its British). 'car-been' tends to be the American style. Technically, both are correct. You can ask my wife, she's a linguist lol.
I didn't want to shoot mine because it'd burn up the Hungarian barrel. Sad, I know. Aren't they chrome lined?? Issue before was either getting stuck between shooting bore burning steelish jacketed ammo; or copper jacketed, corrosive, more expensive ammo (Yugo) ammo. Now SG Ammo is selling new production copper jacketed 7.62x39. Even has lacquer coating and sealed bullets and primers!
The barrel was both made with the CHF process known for producing strong/durable steel, and was chromelined which is known for increasing service life and making cleaning easier. No way could you burn up the barrel, not without firing 10,000+ rounds at least. My SAR-1 has over 8k through it now, and the rifling/bore is still fine, cheers.
I can't remember what shooting the "bi-metal" jacketed Russian ammo does, but back when that jacket was first created for the 5.45x39, the life of the barrels on the AK74 dropped down to single digit thousands. Then they had to make the barrels better (not sure how) and only extended the life to 12,000 rounds. The pressure for 5.45x39 is probably higher pressure than 7.62x39, which doesn't help barrel life either, but just don't want to ever sell it or rebarrel it. I don't actuall see a benefit to CHF barrels if they're chrome lined... as the chrome is what goes first and then the barrel is done. Wish I knew roughly how many rounds the Hungarian barrels die on.
Mish should do a vid on the development of the 5.45x39 and AK74. Also who jumped on that ship, and who didn't, and how for both. Or just how they made the barrels better?
Already did that video last year. Give our playlist a gander.
Could have got back mil issue or police issue back and refirbed ...... Or left over stock . I love myne its a fire breathing lead pissin dragon
LOL good description. - Jay
Thanks much for watching
Great video, very informative. The cat may need to go on a diet though.
I had a neighbor from hungry
Here in 2024…these are going for $1200-$1600 😮
hi let me clear up some of the confusion surrounding the receiver. those AMD-65,s were made here from matching kits. the receivers were SINGLE STACK receivers imported from Hungary then had the mag wells milled out to accept standard capacity magazines. Originally they would ONLY FIT TAPCO mags. I have had one for a long time and was able to find this out through research. they are EXCELLENT rifles! enjoy.
Mine has no problem fitting 20 round Hungarian tanker mags, it came with a 20rd tapco mag. Mine is a TGI build with all matching numbers...
Then how did the receivers come in without a serial number?
Ozark Bear Arms 80 %?
Please listen to the video. I discuss the 80% possibility, as well as the 100% receiver possibility too. I have tried to figure out how these came to be, based on the facts we know and can see on the rifles today.
Second time I've watched it enjoyed it just as much the second time help me identify the car being that I have which looks like it's one of the pistols switch I'm happier with. China Joe's got to go resistance is real.
T.g.i. had them built into pistols then they imported them
I would want one for a truck gun and I’d modify mine.