Once we can all travel again, would you visit Thailand’s elephants? Stay tuned until the end of the video - at 11:01 we talk about the impact COVID-19 has had on the elephants and the people who care for them.
Absolutely not. These animals should be free. There are ways to create reserves where they are fed and have minimal contact with humans (just veterinarians, for example). Exploration will not end until their treatment as "pets" does not stop. Tradition does not mean it is right. What about doing these videos only when you can have the input of a specialist with a different opinion?
@@anaclaudiasaobernardo6449 I agree with you that they should be free but under capitalism I believe that to be impossible, as long as money is required for people to live, elephants will be hunted for their ivory. Sure there are ways to create reserves with minimal contact but capitalism ensures that exploitation will occur and people are more willing to exploit animals than humans most of the time unfortunately.
I have seen lots of elephants in captivity in Thailand. I hated it. They were led on leashes through markets, some still babies without their mums, poked with sticks. Just for the entertainment value... just horribly sad. Some had a somewhat better life in a sanctuary. These elephants often have mental issues and stress bc of the abuses they endured. These creatures are not toys.
I find it very interesting that Westerners have an issue with Elephant riding but in America horses are made to jump and perform in the same way. They even have dressage horses which is basically ballet but you don't see the rest of the world worried about something that isn't their business. And I recently learned that prized horses are basically milked for their sperm and sold for thousands of dollars. Perhaps the West should fix their own shit before worrying about a whole other culture on the other side of the world.
I think the difference is in the structure of the elephants skeleton. It curves a lot at the top and causes them a lot of pain to be ridden. Horses back structure is different and can be ridden without causing that kind of pain. Also elephants have to be broken in a horrible manner and abused to be put in a state where they will follow the commands of people. I think a lot of it also comes down to domestication (of most horses around the world) but yeah there are sure issues in the treatment of horses around the world!
@@Reevayad The "Breaking" is actually becoming obsolete and has been for quite awhile with the introduction of people who use behavior modification ("horse whisperer", Roberts, Parelli, etc.) instead of violence. Of course, places vary and so do methods. Greed is a real motivator for some people. I owned horses at one point, and you can get a horse to do a lot for you if you exercise and train. Btw, the training isn't so far off of what we do with dogs, we just tailor it for the species. My guys were gentle, would pick up their feet themselves for cleaning, stand without being tied, and little kids could safely ride/groom/interact with them. I had a loving and respectful relationship with my horses (just like my dogs, too), so respectful training really does work. Now, I did Western riding and wasn't competitive. But then, I have known quite a bit of people who do both Western and English who are competitive and were training and using ethical practices just like I did. I do think things are getting better for horses overall. Unfortunately you will still meet those terrible, unenlightened, and cruel people who stick to the old ways that should be done away with. But, I think they are becoming the minority are no longer the majority.
@@Reevayad I'm interested to see evidence of this as I've never ever seen an elephant with spinal damage due to riding. And there is a long long history of riding going back millennia.
Mi Ki I judge other cultures based on my values and I judge my own culture based on my values too or i’m a hypocrite! People who horse riding in the west and people who eat pigs and cows here have no rights to criticize any culture who ride elephants or eat dogs and cats BUT vegans and people who reject both definitely can and have to!!
@@saytax i see you keep talking about this "elephant crushing" thing. You can see from this video that we dont do that anymore. You keep watching videos of elephant being torture from 1999 and assuming that we still doing it proundly. Must admitt that there's still some place doing elephant crushing, but we are against them too. And hey sometimes you cowboys kills your horses when they refuse to be running but Thai people cant say a thing about it.
@@5244bbb What I do see is elephants being guided around with bullhooks in the ear and painting with someone next to them. What are they doing? We can't see. But I have seen elephants coerced into painting being manipulated by pain. Slaughter houses for horses is illegal in the US and it's not economical to simply put then down. Horses are sold and repurposed as companion horses, studs, broods, ect. You can't get any money back if you kill the animal.
@@Enjoytheshow435 u cant compare horses with elephants. Its a big difference. Horses are domestic animals and their back is designed in a way to be ridden. They dont have to beaten into submission like ppl do to the elephants.
Riding isn't the problem. People are concerned about the health, living condition, and the well being of the animals. Also elephants are very intelligent and emotional beings. Imo we are doing good re-evaluating ower use of animals.
@@samirahsamir6930 How many horses have been injured and put down? Too often people just throw them away. We do need to do something to save elephants though, and if the elephants are taken care of and not abused, then these sanctuaries are overall good. We shouldn't assume that each person working with intelligent creatures must be abusive.
No we haven't. Modern horses are bred into domestication and lots of horse variaties are quite different from their wild ancestors. It is not the same with the Asian elephants in captivity.
Search elephants spirit being broken it literally heartbreaking you can never get an elephant to obey without it going through a brutal method of abuse, torture, isolation and starvation i have never seen a horse being tamed like that so remember everytime you go to visit places like Asia you're contributing in the abuse of elephants as well as other animals.
Stupid ignorant. Elephants are not domestic animals like horses. What u call taming elephant is torturing them. Horses are not tortured. They are farm animals and domestic animals.
@@lastoutlaw3882 hmm horse 'breaking' isn't fun for the horse either. They are not born wanting us to ride them. Bits actually hurt their mouth too. I worked with horses for years if you are planning to tell me I know nothing about horses. I was just kinda programmed from a young age, like all of us, that using animals for entertainment etc was OK.
There are some elephant owners that mistreat them but there are also some horse owners that mistreat their horses yet we don't call for all the stables to be closed. Western factory farming of livestock is far more abusive than elephant tourism is.
Horses are domesticated animals that have a dependent relationship with humans. Elephants are not, you cannot domestic and elephant you can only tame them. It’s not the same at all. Now do both animals suffer from abuse? Yes. Also you do here all the time for stables to be closed. And are you saying because the west does something bad they can’t criticise the practices of others because that’s a logical fallacy. Instead you can admit both sides are exploiting animals for their own personal game and it needs to be addressed in the west and in other parts of the world.
falloutjustcause falloutjustcause Damn it man! Don’t you see. It’s clearly seen in the video how much the elephants have become dependent on man after thousands of years. And btw, the west have always thought they’re immune to criticism, and have found white man’s culture to be superior. Thus, they have always tried to destroy other cultures saying they’re uncivilised. Look what they did to African, Indian and the American Indian cultures. They are so stubborn that the get clouded in their own opinions and understanding while not having a glimpse of thought from the POV of a thai. They feel that only their bonding with horses is special, while the Thai’s bond with elephants is exploitation. The first thing they need is a cure for this stubborn mindset, to get out if their well, and see the world as it is and have always been
@@falloutjustcause Thai people domesticated elephants for thousands of years. You can research the fox domestication experiment for reference. It basically the same thing.
Elephants are STILL wild animals. They are not build for riding or any form of human interaction. In fact their back is totally different from horses for example, which makes it painful for them to carry things. Also elephants are normally quite aggressive and impulsive animals. Those that you see in the video have been trained through torture to be able to interact with humans
All those scientists and doctors that are saying this is "OK".... are basically paid by those handlers. Their paycheck depends on this industry being kept alive.
@Abe E Hold up. Youre compairing idiots like TK to things like Western Zoo's. TK isn't a proffesional and America like an other country has uniformed and uneducated people who are fooled by words like "sancturary" as any other person. DOn't paint with a broad brush.
While there is some truth to this, it is also untrue in a large degree. I had the wonderful opprotunity to intreact with elephant caregivers in Thailand. They really did care very much for their elephants and adopted and rescued others. Your comment is an oversimplification and an over generalization.
@Abe E Damn dude you and 7 others are very simple minded. I also watched a ted bundy documentary on netflix. What do you make of that? One guy's behavior doesnt not reflect the mentality of a whole country. How do you not know this? Jesus! Plus the west criticizes the west too you know. And the east criticizes the west all the time. Shit going down everywhere man. Criticism is necessary to improve whatever. What is freedom if we cannot express what we feel is wrong? Do you work for CCP?
You are part of the problem, white guy claims he knows more about training elephants than the Thai experts that have been working with elephants for 1000s of years. Why the heck do you think they would abuse something that is their livelihood? A happy healthy animal wouldn't perform or partake. DUH!!
Elephants are pretty friend and timid. I use to live near the forest. And there are a herd of them roaming around. They understand our language. We don't have to abuse them for them to be tame with us. They are quite intelligent and understand our intentions. They trust us enough for us to ride them without us training them. I understand the abuse that some inflicted to them such as extreme logging and those heavy seats they carry for hours. Those should be ban. However, banning riding in general is another story. If you want to ban elephants riding in general than we have to ban horse riding too.
Elephants are NOT created by God for humans to use. The best way to protect them is to HAVE LAWS TO PROTECT THEM AND PROHIBIT USING THEM FOR ILLEGAL LOGGING. That vet who claims that elephants do not cry is a sham.
Sm Guess Great points and any of us who “know horses,” know that they actually DO enjoy being ridden, and only even adapted as runners because our ancestors actually hunted and regularly ate them.
@@ungrateful-66 So this means you've spoken with a domesticated elephant who told you they don't like to be ridden?. Go out to the western U.S. and see if one of the 50,000+ wild horses running free out there "enjoy being ridden". I say let's free them all!
@@scunion66 U R right; what about the bulls in the rodeo festivals , corridas ( bullfight) and captives animals in zoos and circuses, not to mention guentanamo and the lies such Iraq's chemical weapons, just for crud oil ... and so on...
Although I'm interested in this other point of view, this was some pretty imbalanced journalism... Only interviewing people who work for the "sanctuaries" and are making a profit out of this and contrasting it with western internet folks assumptions rather than experts on the other side of things makes it feel very biased. There are Asian groups who are against animal exploitation too you know...
Alexandra Ogden I think it’s pretty balanced. They’ve interviewed everyone from a researcher to a mahout. Maybe elephants are domesticated in Thailand as dogs are, and they are conditioned like how we train dogs
Biased as in it doesn't claim they abuse elephants? Sounds like you only want to hear what you want to hear, not the truth, which is that Thai people love their elephants and would not abuse their livelihood and family members. The elephants are their family members.
Alexandra Ogden Those Asian groups are similar in spirit and ideology as their Western counterparts. The only thing Asian about them are merely their faces, but not their spirit or practice.
The professor doesn't work for a sanctuary. Now as for that cold-hearted Karen mahout only thinking about his fat profits! Listen, I've met many a traditional Karen mahout and unscrupulous businessmen they are not. They are amazing elephant carers who should get 50x what they earn and should be revered for the love and care they have for their elephants. Take care of the good mahouts = take care of the health and well-being of elephants.
One thing that was missed here was when talking about the history of captive elephant care, the fact the demand for teak was driven the West (notably British demand - Burma was, of course, a British colony) and much money was made from it by, for example, the British teak wallahs who made fortunes out of the teak industry. It's somewhat ironic then to have Westerners demand what they see as ethical elephant care in foreign lands based on their feelings and emotions - when the fact you have this legacy of captive elephants needing employment (and elephant tourism is therefore essential) is due to the ending of logging and all the deforestation largely driven by Western demand for teak.
Elephants were stolen from the wild and their mothers illegibly they were two. Domesticating baby elephants is legal Therefor, there would be no need to train them. Please copy and past these key words into your search how to crush an elephants spirit for tourism They predict that Asian elephants will become extinct by the year 2050 and it's not because of lack of tourism! It's because of activities like this. In order to tame a wild animal, and the only way to train an elephant is through abusive training. Elephants can't keep their numbers up when they are taken from the wild where they can thrive and breed. These elephants are bought from training camps and are used for profit.
I just want to say that your videos are very professional and the topics really interesting; to know about global issues and culture. Greetinsgs from Costa Rica!
Elephants have been part of the south asian culture for centuries with us living together in a harmonious way. We don't need peole behind pc and instagram giving their half assed opinion without knowung the culture of a place
You just don’t see the cruelty that takes place before the elephants are placed before you to perform. Elephant calves are torn from their mothers, starved and beaten to bend to their mahouts’ orders otherwise they get beaten with the bull hook till they bleed.
i just wanna point out that when you see elephants in chained it's because they're either sick or being in musth. Musth period makes the elephant very dangerous. Even the caretaker cannot control that elephant. Sick elephant need to keep in chained since they can wander off as well. In some cases, they chain the new elephant before introducing to the herd.
it was not allow by the law but the tourist don't knew about and thought that's in bad way. they don't knew how serious of us to protect and living with them.
Thank you so much for educating us. It's hard to know what info is accurate and what isn't. I love Elephants, and I want to make sure that if I interact with them, I am doing so ethically. I hope the elephant tourism trade is saved. Thank you so much for this video. It would be lovely to have info about which places are ethical, and which ones are more exploitative. It's nice to hear from experts on the ground.
@erinaltstadt Lovely comment from evidently an open-minded person who doesn't simply watch a rehashed Peta video and make blanket judgements about those who care for captive elephants. Nice to read on social media - a world where discussion is rarely allowed and people allow their emotions to get in the way of reason, actual facts, and rational thought.
Those were not experts, they are just people who profit off exploting elephants. Do not ride elephants, do not take selfies with elephants, do not support places that exploit elephants for profit. The best thing you can do for elephants is not give money to people who enslave them and just leave them alone.
@@mrtullyteacher9634 What if you had a child and that child was taken away from you, beaten for weeks, held in a small enclosure, and made to perform stupid tricks for the rest of their life to entertain other people? Would that bother you at all or is crying for your stolen, tortured child too "emotional" and not "logical" enough for you?
@@Tracydot3sorry but you haven't a clue. You are suggesting leaving captive elephants alone? So let them starve to death? Get poisoned? Hit by cars? Shot? And that is from a position of care for elephants?? Go and speak to people who care for elephants - there are some amazing people out there who don't have time to pass judgement and point score behind keyboards in the West. Learn about how they risk their lives to ensure the best care and well-being for these magnificent animals, before judging all because you have read some Peta material or watched a staged video showing abuse with sad piano music and let your emotions overtake rational thought and your ability to think critically about a complex issue. Be open-minded, meet people on the ground, think critically about all issues. Also question why fake narratives are pushed...follow. the. Money. 💰
@@Tracydot3 so pointing out that this is a complex issue and there are many, many wonderful people caring for captive elephants is the same as supporting barbaric training methods (which are NOT normal) and supporting circusses (which are also far from the norm, I've never seen one in Northern Thailand). Wouldn't it be nice if this complex issue was that simple. Then we could all decide who was on the side of good v evil. It isn't. As with any complex issue, the ability to be open-minded and think critically is needed or it's best avoided altogether.
Obviously not many know how they 'break' an elephant into its' tourist friendly' form. Weather you finally get offered the pet them or ride them option ,the process of getting to that stage of submission doesn't change.
Great video! As someone who works at an elephant camp here in Thailand I appreciate you using your platform to help educate tourists and ultimately help the elephants here in Thailand.
How do Europeans and Americans come to terms with their/our human history of horse-riding for >6000 years? Do they go after themselves as hard as going after the (South) Asian elephant culture?
They should, as with dogs and cats an parrots and name it..., lots of mistreated animals everywhere. If we take animals in captivity, we should care well for them. Ive seen how badly elephants (animals in general) are treated in some places in Thailand firsthand. Not all are well cared for in sanctuaries.... So I see this vid as incomplete/naive.
Elephants are beautiful animals. They are wonderful but due to the coronavirus pandemic the tourism has slowed down. I will need to visit this place one day.
I went just to Thailand twice, the ones I seen looked fine, I don’t care to ride them, I just hope they get a chance to move around, the bulls were chained to the ground, both front feet and could only rock back and forth. There was no sadness in their eyes, if I could really tell and one bull was really interested in me it seemed from the eye contact. All in all none of the ones I seen looked beaten
I think this involves political reasons. The US wants to frame Thai elephant ridding to make they have influenced on Thailand as same as they have done to other countries
I went to Samui Elephant sanctuary where yes the elephants are fenced in but it’s a huge space for them to walk around one thing I was confused about was how they keep the elephants that they claimed didn’t get along away from each other. I was told this section is their territory which I interpreted as the elephants establish their territory and stick to that part of the park. We were only allowed to touch their trunks and only if we were feeding them. They said it’s be in elephants remember and these elephants had been riding and had scars from their hoops and the workers said they would remember getting hit on their bodies. These were older elephants with medical issues I believe. They also didn’t let us bath them which I was disappointed about.
I think what I got the most from this, is that there are good & bad people in every part of life. There are people who DO abuse & harm elephants & do not treat them right. But there are so many good people as well who have the right intentions & are doing the right things as well. Just like there are people who abuse dogs & cats in America, it is frowned upon by the majority people here. It is the same in Thailand regarding elephants I believe.
i was actually on the first ever elephant sanctuary on the island of koh samui (opened very recently) and the elephants there looked like they were exttremely happy and lively. we made them food and fed them, along with a nice shower. the sanctuary is called "i love elephant samui"
I went to Samui Elephant sanctuary and we were only allowed to touch their trunks when feeding them and not allowed to bath them which I was looking forward to
@@pri.sci.lla. Do you consider owning a pet exploitative? Since by doing so you'd be subjecting it to a non natural lifestyle for your own pleasure. Thus any pet regardless of its intended purpose(i.e. seeing dog, goldfish, hunting falcon, horse) serves as a tool for human use, meaning you'd be exploiting them for your own purposes. As compared to the disassociated intentions of nature, regardless of it's outcomes.
Mikerphone having a pet isn’t exploitation. I’m not forcing my pet to breed so I can sell their children or other animal products. I’m not exploiting her so no. Companionship isn’t exploitation. Plus she’s a rescue. I believe that it’s our job to care for the animals that are already on this planet. We should try to prevent suffering wherever possible. I’m a pre veterinary animal science student and I work on a farm with large animals.
@@pri.sci.lla. Well then, you're experiencing cognitive dissonance. There is a hole in you're logic. Statistically you're likely to ignore everything i say at this point because I'm going against your world view. But non the less ill explain what's wrong in your logic in happen chance that you are an open minded person. Forcing a pet to breed is not the only form of exploitation, we just went over this before. Things like having an animal carry weight, act as a work force, complete a task, or controlling them via riding or how they live is exploitative. When you have a pet you're forcing them to live with you, to abide by your rules, to have a human integrated experience. All things that wild animals aren't known to want to do. They require training to get to this point. Which is basically the equivalent of brainwashing. Using their natural resources like food, clean water, shelter, ect. you create a demand that they must answer with what you deem is positive behavior. Therfore you're acting against your animals natural instincts. Against nature, *regardless of the outcomes.* that's a key point. Nature is not alway about positive outcomes. Remeber that just because an animal is rescued, doesn't mean it should've been. Not speaking in terms of human caused scenarios here, but that an animal in the wild would've been met with the disassociated consequences of nature. The natural law. Some organisms must die so that others can live and evolve to survive better. This is nature; if you care about some organisms you should care about all of them. Otherwise you don't really care about animals; you just have a bias for the cute and or fluffy ones. Animal companionship is inherently exploitative as i just explained. But furthermore it also leads to damage to pet animals over all. Just because you take good care of your pet doesn't mean others will. Some animals will be abused, others over bred to feed demand, many slaughtered to fight infestation and over population. Giving anyone the ability to own animals will have a guaranteed result in more and more people wishing to do so. Even with a legal requirement, a black market will always exist for people who want to do what others have the ability to do. The only way to curb this is to use social pressure against owning pets. Seeing as we dont require legal consent. If we give you the right to own pets without obtaining any, then we must equally afford that right to everyone. As we do. Notice the word consent, that is not only applicable in your life, its applicable in the animal's. If you believe there is no consent unless explicit, then the obvious question would be how do you get consent from an animal who is bred and trained to be subordinate to humans? We cant. If you were to ask a slave born in America in the early 1800's why they do what they do, they would've told you is because they were born a slave. In a similaf sense your animal is born a slave to humanity. It doesn't know freedom, and so it can't consent to not having it. This all assumes you can read your pets mind in order to recieve explicit consent btw. Which i think we can agree on is impossible. Anyways, this has been a short lecture on the broken logic that befalls many people who claim to care about animal exploitation and animal rights. Take care and be safe. Treat your animals well and with respect... Which I'm sure was something all the propper well to do white Christian plantation family's said about what they did with their slaves. Have a good one!
The claim that brutality is not needed to train an elephant to give rides is laughable! Not a single video of an elephant being trained to give rides without cruelty has ever emerged, yet you'd imagine they would be keen to offer evidence to back up their claims? In fact time and time again video of young calves being brutally trained to give rides continues to emerge, if you know where to look dreadful video footage of the cruelty can sometimes be found being proudly shared on social media by some mahouts unaware that it's a contentious issue! Even the Thai national elephant centre (govt owned) in Lampang shows us calves being separated from their mothers and kept on the shortest of chains ( the desperation and distress of the calf is all too apparent for all to see) as part of the training process! Sorry Dena but you've been had , a little more research and the use of critical thought might have produced a more balanced program! Oh and that 'scientific study' mentioned has more holes in it than a sieve! Sure no hook and no chains does NOT automatically mean good elephant welfare but elephant riding means an elephant has been subjected to a brutal and cruel process even if well treated now and i for one want no part of that!
Thank you!!! Finally someone that knows what they are talking about. Problem is. Westerners are only going to listen to the lies they tell them so they can have the experience without guilt.
It's not so much the tourism and riding itself that hurts the elephant, bet the fact that the baby is taken away from its mother and tied up for days in the same spot. This is a method called "the crush," which not every elephant survives. There is a documentary "Elephant; Return to the Wild" which features Lek Chailert of Elephant Nature Park in Chang Mai and multiple resources on that amongst other things that contradict the and fill in the in-between answers and information in this video, so please make sure to check that out. It's never black and white, I just want people to have as much information as they can to make an informed decision.
I still think we should not ride elephants or make then do shows for people...of course Thailand 🇹🇭 people are not gonna say anything negative because this is how they make money so pleople don’t contribute to this don’t be brainwashed
Your video was really interesting. Nice job, and it really is informative. I just put one up today that shows my experience this week at a Thai elephant place. I feel very similar to you.
Although ideally elephants should live in the wild freely to fully express their complex social and hierarchical structure I can see how in Thailand they are more treated like working animals. I don't think elephants can be compared to horses as horses have been domesticated for over 6000 years through a process of selective breeding and elephants are bred poorly if at all in captivity so I don't think selective breeding and thus "domestication" like in horses is even a possibility. But as an outsider I do understand that there might be a huge difference to how people in Thailand view these animals compared to someone who sees them as "exotic". I do hope their treatment and outlook for them improves because some of these animals are kept quite in piss poor conditions as can be seen again and again in various "rescue" channels and that coexisting will become better and better for elephants as we start to treat all animals with more kindness and love.
Elephants need water, and lots of it. Elephants need to bathe, to clean their bodies, as well getting rid of insects, mites. Elephants can't be in direct sunlight constantly, they need water.
"like carrying a handbag"... disgusting abuse of these beautiful animals. Riding elephants, bathing elephants, making elephants paint for human satisfaction, makes my stomach turn.
snooopert I know what the science shows. I am a pre veterinary animal science student about to graduate. I personally support rescues and sanctuaries. I think that’s the only ethical way to sustain animals who have a “purpose”, whatever that may be, until the end of their natural lives. Since we brought them here, it’s our job to care for them. However the issues arise when you have animals for the purpose of making money, or exploitation. I think conservation is important but it shouldn’t be at the price of that animals sanity and or happiness. Most animals will go extinct at one point or another, most animals on this planet at one point or another have gone extinct however humans are greatly contributing to their increased extinction which is awful.
Priscilla Humans going extinct is the only solution I see. They are probably gonna be, as to how we are currently responding to climate change. When nature provided us with everything we need, we instead turned to greed. We took much more than we ever needed, we became colonialists, imperialists, industrialists, capitalists, etc. I think it’s a long way from going back, and probably our doom is pretty much nearing
Elephants have been used as pack animals and for war for many years. The US army special forces manual lists them as a pack animal that can be used for transport. The U.S Army discourages their use however as they are endangered.
I also think riding an elephant is immoral, but I thought the problem is not with the elephant carrying the weight of a person, but with the constant bending so they can climb on them. How are people exactly getting on the elephant?
So this scientist argues she cares for the health of elephants but at the same time argues that the bullhook should be used only when necessary. In other words, she supports elephant riding. I also doubt you can trust anything these elephant guardians said. In some other videos, these guys said their relationship with elephant is based on trust and love, but they use bullhook regularly, and the training for the very young elephant is just as cruel as what trainers do with elephants in the circus. Of course, the training of young elephants for tourism is not disclosed in this video. That's misinformation.
As someone whose been to Thailand and ridden an elephant before knowing it was not okay to do, I have mixed feelings about riding. My time there I saw the elephant trainer who took us for a ride using a sharp spear-like tool to jab the elephant behind the ear as correction. He ensured us that it doesn’t actually hurt the elephant but idk enough to make a call on whether or not that was true. Oh also, psychedelic mushrooms grow from elephants poop so if you go to the right place, the trainers may offer you elephant poop shrooms 😂 they clean it of course. Edit: I posted this comment before they mentioned the bull-hooks in the video. Looks like they addressed it
The one owner/trainer said the reason he rides his elephant because he can control the elephant and the elephant would run away. If the elephant is treated so well why would he run away ? Saying he would run away seems to say the elephant does not want to be there. Of course they are making money off the elephants so they will support what they are doing, I don't buy it myself.
At the end of the day if you interview three people on camera who all work for or with the same association you will get the same message. Might be worth looking beyond this puff piece before booking your next elephant ride.
they even interviewed a scientist and doctor which is their job to ensure the elephants health is in good condition so why would they lie about that ? don't be stupid
@@nocturnalwolf7559 Education does not always lead to knowledge, ignorance does not always mean you are necessarily lying. Take the research the vet quotes for example, it is based of tests done at one observation venue. how does one observation venue reflect the stress levels of all venues?
@@slowvisuals8957 It is a study so unless more studies are done that take account of more observational venues it is the science for now. As we have seen throughout the pandemic, following the science is forever changing. However, as an indication it is valid and certainly would run counter to what most people (especially in the West) would imagine. It therefore reveals the complexity of the issue if nothing else. And that alone is valid.
The problem is not the riding or human contact. It's the cruelty, that they are trained with pain, treated badly and worked hard under stress. You need a deeper investigation. Of course they are not going to tell you everything. Some handlers are of course better than others. Feet should never be tied. They should not be beaten or suffer when they need a vet. They don't cry? Yes, they do. But not with tears.
Well I am not into selfies so would never take a selfie with an animal. I love photographing and so if given a chance I would totally go on a safari to observe and photograph them from a far. I see no issue with going on to a conservation that makes money to help aid animals and the maintain the actual reserve itself that protects them. You just got to do research. Don't travel and get lured by a sign that says you can pet elephants. Basically if you are questioning the ethics it behind it, maybe it is not right for you.
sundawg911 Not all are like that. There are zoos that is based on the spirit of conservation that allows you to pet or ride elephants. I remember going to one in Taman Safari, a safari-like zoo in Indonesia. Now, Indonesia has some history of bad zoos, but this one is legit. The animals are well-taken care of and it has been trusted to house many different and difficult to maintain animals. The only deaths and accidents in that zoo that I’ve heard of is animals dying of old age or dumb people who thought it’s a good idea to open their car doors in the carnivore of the park. I remember riding the elephants and even camels as a young kid.
Yup, sounds nice, but I don't buy it for full 100 percent though. Seen some awful stuff in Thailand with animals, made my stomach turn. And some positive stuff too with e.g. good elephant sanctuaries. But in general those experiences left me with a deep sense of unease. Humanity has a really f-d relationship with animals.
Look at his elephants they don’t have marks on their body. Those are not the ones people are complaining about it. Riding is and always be bad. No one should ride any animals. It’s unfair to the animals. Humans can walk besides the elephants and they would get the same “exercise “ as they wood if the human was on top. Even “humanly” riding will be an excuse to bad owners that will say but they do it in the “sanctuary” I can do it too. I won’t be going to this “sanctuary”. There are veteneriants at Sea World too. Still they animals were abused. If ou have to force an animal do what you want for profit you don’t really love it. Do your research. There plenty of tour that will not allow riding or performance. Support those.
I understand the complexity of issues this presents to the Thai people, their livelihoods, and their culture. But the fact remains that elephants are trained using negative reinforcement with bullhooks, which are weapons, and through torture ceremonies called "elephant crushings." That's what it takes to make these wild animals submit. And it's proven that rides hurt their backs over time. Their backs are not like horseback. With all due respect to the Thai people, I for one won't support that, and as a longtime supporter of elephant protection and conservation, I urge others not to either. The West absolutely has enormous problems concerning its own treatment of animals. But two wrongs don't make a right. It doesn't mean other animal practices around the world are no longer subject to scrutiny. Everyone is, without exception. And culture is not idle. Some things change, the rest changes eventually. There is nothing that can't be changed for the better. It's just a question of wisdom and courage. Edit: The logic here is faulty btw 4:46, that a sanctuary can't have boundaries to be a sanctuary. No boundaries is called "the wild", and a sanctuary is not the same as the wild. Sanctuaries are real and they are important.
Animal cruelty should never be a part of anyone's culture. And if it is, it should be called out as being wrong and not condoned under any circumstances. If a "sanctuary" is allowing stupid selfies with the elephant then it is not a sanctuary, it's exploitation.
Can we do something about the billions of livestock crammed into tiny, unsanitary cages and tortured for their entire lives? At the minimum, that seems like a much higher priority.
Which is the issue here? Callout culture or animal welfare? Because they are entirely different conversations. What you're really doing is conflating the two to justify what is proven makes elephants suffer. Period.
Yes the elephants may be dependent on humans for their care but that still doesn’t mean they have to be ridden. That’s just an excuse so they can keep exploiting them.
I don't like how this video glosses over the true impact riding has on an elephant. The problem isn't the weight, it's that their back isn't developed to sustain excess weight. Think of horses vs zebras, despite the fact they're almost identical in shape, a zebra is not a suitable animal to ride due to having a weaker back (among other things like being irascible creatures), but the point is that size alone isn't the determining factor of whether an animal can carry on it's back without suffering pain.
Jonathan Avila I agree about the horses vs zebras thing. But the Thai have been riding elephants all along, they too might have known just as the west knew about horses
Zebra's are not suitable to ride because of temperament. Absolutely nothing to do with the strength of its back. Zebra's are stronger than horses both mentally and physically
Doing something for thousands of years is no excuse for animal abuse in no part if the world. I watched a lot of videos of so called elephant sanctuaries and most of them are mainly made for tourists and not for elephants. A sanctuary is supposed to be a save place for animals which are not longer forced to work for humans in any way. . The only really elephant sanctuary I've seen so far is elephant nature park. Everyone who loves elephants should watch their videos. They show the natural behaviour of elephants. I'm not interested in videos of tourists feeding elephants.
well, since its ok to leave a comment AND evryone has an opinion, I for one NEVER EVER EVERRRRRRRRRRRRR was ok with riding hirses, I believe since I was mmmmmhhh about 4 or 5 years old, since i was able to THINK for myself that ts CRUEL ABUSE to ride ANY animal, to show any animal in circus to pay to see any animal do STUPID DISGUSTING tricks that has NITHING to do with their own KIND i repeat: its disgusting to see humans have animals do human tricks for laughs and for "how cute" the children love animals, or ooohhh " we want to show our children animals" so zoos are made oh wait, NOT ZOOS, PRIOSONS are made to have these magnificent animals that BELONG in their home in their HOME wherever they are from, and have to put up being caged for the rest of their lifes take medication for a lifetime so its a soothed animal doesnt make problems, they even give alchool to elephants to tame them, its beyond disgusting I wnet for the first and LAST time to a circus at the age of 6 I went for the first time and LAST time to a zoo at the age of * I absolutely BEGGED my parents to NEVER do this again, EVER, I explained and they agreed and so we never paid to see a animal suffer on the contrary of many I am ABSOLUTELY against riding horses , especially now that finally we invented so many vehicles to go around we can FINALLY leave our beautiful neigbhoring friends creatures any other in peace to live their lives Iam 100% for and hopefully one day to try and bring down human growth as it is, as right now its absolutely out of control animals have no space to live their lives because WE are evrywhere we took away theyre peace and most of all theyre FREEDOM . (excuse my not so good english just trying to explain my view and opinions on this matter its beyond disrespectful what we do to them, im ashamed of looking at them sometimes, so ashamed of what people do to them so emarrassing, absolutely evil and disgusting
The entire point of keeping plant & animal species from going extinct is to attempt resetting the overall natural environment back to something resembling balance. Earth is holistic so I'm not really sure anything besides tradition & entertaining humans explain "animal sanctuaries"...but also the great grandchildren of people that owned other humans in the west should probably take it easy when judging people in other lands that are genuinely attempting to preserve life. #dopestory👏🏾
Of course westerners' audacity is wrong, but also Thai people's treatment to elephants is wrong too. The problem is, the issue was pointed out AFTER aaaalllll those many western tourists have swept Thailand or messed it up. They love Thailand so much and they try to own it? Eh. That's why these people on interview are on the defensive side. AJ is not reporting on the domestic volunteer groups or people for elephants which are against this massive tourism. C'mon, There are also other views, apart from only two of these Western tourists VS Thai elephant owners.
why are you riding a horse There is also a competition in the Olympics. Why do you have a bullfight? Why do you have a hunting season? A 70 kg man rides a 1 ton elephant. with a person weighing 70 kg, face 100 kg why???
Funny the westerners try to tell Thai people what to do with elephants, the elephants bigger than a horse please stop riding a horse first. Sometimes just annoy some of them.
Elephants are not built for riding period! Their vertebrae stands vertical so it creates arthritis and chronic foot problems which lead to euthanasian. Horses have flat spines.
These elephants are the same as horses. Keep the same energy. OF COURSE they are fine to ride, you aren't going to weight too much for them. NOW you should treat the animal with respect, almost like a pet. As long as they are getting regular vet care and not being abused its okay. Just make your standards high with who you go to and it will be okay
Once we can all travel again, would you visit Thailand’s elephants?
Stay tuned until the end of the video - at 11:01 we talk about the impact COVID-19 has had on the elephants and the people who care for them.
so just go visit a zoo then...
Yes but only a sanctuary. I’m not gonna support their exploitation.
Absolutely not. These animals should be free. There are ways to create reserves where they are fed and have minimal contact with humans (just veterinarians, for example). Exploration will not end until their treatment as "pets" does not stop. Tradition does not mean it is right. What about doing these videos only when you can have the input of a specialist with a different opinion?
@@anaclaudiasaobernardo6449 I agree with you that they should be free but under capitalism I believe that to be impossible, as long as money is required for people to live, elephants will be hunted for their ivory. Sure there are ways to create reserves with minimal contact but capitalism ensures that exploitation will occur and people are more willing to exploit animals than humans most of the time unfortunately.
I have seen lots of elephants in captivity in Thailand. I hated it. They were led on leashes through markets, some still babies without their mums, poked with sticks. Just for the entertainment value... just horribly sad. Some had a somewhat better life in a sanctuary. These elephants often have mental issues and stress bc of the abuses they endured. These creatures are not toys.
I find it very interesting that Westerners have an issue with Elephant riding but in America horses are made to jump and perform in the same way. They even have dressage horses which is basically ballet but you don't see the rest of the world worried about something that isn't their business. And I recently learned that prized horses are basically milked for their sperm and sold for thousands of dollars. Perhaps the West should fix their own shit before worrying about a whole other culture on the other side of the world.
Christopher T. I agree they shouldn’t be hypocritical. IMO all animal exploitation is wrong.
I think the difference is in the structure of the elephants skeleton. It curves a lot at the top and causes them a lot of pain to be ridden. Horses back structure is different and can be ridden without causing that kind of pain. Also elephants have to be broken in a horrible manner and abused to be put in a state where they will follow the commands of people. I think a lot of it also comes down to domestication (of most horses around the world) but yeah there are sure issues in the treatment of horses around the world!
Good point, man it's sad how many people dont realize when they are being hypocritical.
@@Reevayad The "Breaking" is actually becoming obsolete and has been for quite awhile with the introduction of people who use behavior modification ("horse whisperer", Roberts, Parelli, etc.) instead of violence. Of course, places vary and so do methods. Greed is a real motivator for some people. I owned horses at one point, and you can get a horse to do a lot for you if you exercise and train. Btw, the training isn't so far off of what we do with dogs, we just tailor it for the species. My guys were gentle, would pick up their feet themselves for cleaning, stand without being tied, and little kids could safely ride/groom/interact with them. I had a loving and respectful relationship with my horses (just like my dogs, too), so respectful training really does work. Now, I did Western riding and wasn't competitive. But then, I have known quite a bit of people who do both Western and English who are competitive and were training and using ethical practices just like I did. I do think things are getting better for horses overall. Unfortunately you will still meet those terrible, unenlightened, and cruel people who stick to the old ways that should be done away with. But, I think they are becoming the minority are no longer the majority.
@@Reevayad I'm interested to see evidence of this as I've never ever seen an elephant with spinal damage due to riding. And there is a long long history of riding going back millennia.
Yeah. Don't judge other's culture based on your own value..
Mi Ki I judge other cultures based on my values and I judge my own culture based on my values too or i’m a hypocrite! People who horse riding in the west and people who eat pigs and cows here have no rights to criticize any culture who ride elephants or eat dogs and cats BUT vegans and people who reject both definitely can and have to!!
@@Enjoytheshow435 look up phanjaan and tell me how we train horses is similar.
@@saytax i see you keep talking about this "elephant crushing" thing. You can see from this video that we dont do that anymore. You keep watching videos of elephant being torture from 1999 and assuming that we still doing it proundly. Must admitt that there's still some place doing elephant crushing, but we are against them too. And hey sometimes you cowboys kills your horses when they refuse to be running but Thai people cant say a thing about it.
@@5244bbb What I do see is elephants being guided around with bullhooks in the ear and painting with someone next to them. What are they doing? We can't see. But I have seen elephants coerced into painting being manipulated by pain.
Slaughter houses for horses is illegal in the US and it's not economical to simply put then down. Horses are sold and repurposed as companion horses, studs, broods, ect. You can't get any money back if you kill the animal.
@@Enjoytheshow435 u cant compare horses with elephants. Its a big difference. Horses are domestic animals and their back is designed in a way to be ridden. They dont have to beaten into submission like ppl do to the elephants.
This is certainly a complicated issue. I still don't feel I'm entitled to a selfie with an elephant though.
Especially those broken by phanjaan.
Is it fine to ride horses then? Why just elephants 🙄
Hate- Chan I don’t think so. I think people need to have the same energy.
Riding isn't the problem. People are concerned about the health, living condition, and the well being of the animals. Also elephants are very intelligent and emotional beings. Imo we are doing good re-evaluating ower use of animals.
Exactly, how many horses dead for show and competition in western why they can’t stop isn’t that is also animal cruelty ? 🤷🏽♀️
@@samirahsamir6930 How many horses have been injured and put down? Too often people just throw them away.
We do need to do something to save elephants though, and if the elephants are taken care of and not abused, then these sanctuaries are overall good. We shouldn't assume that each person working with intelligent creatures must be abusive.
@@FireRupee Were you listening? The Elephants in "Sanctuaries" exhibit more symptoms of stress than elephants who work or doing shows.
we've been taming Elephants as long as westerners have been taming Horses.
Good point.
Look up phanjaan and realize it is not a good point.
No we haven't. Modern horses are bred into domestication and lots of horse variaties are quite different from their wild ancestors. It is not the same with the Asian elephants in captivity.
Search elephants spirit being broken it literally heartbreaking you can never get an elephant to obey without it going through a brutal method of abuse, torture, isolation and starvation i have never seen a horse being tamed like that so remember everytime you go to visit places like Asia you're contributing in the abuse of elephants as well as other animals.
Stupid ignorant. Elephants are not domestic animals like horses. What u call taming elephant is torturing them. Horses are not tortured. They are farm animals and domestic animals.
@@lastoutlaw3882 hmm horse 'breaking' isn't fun for the horse either. They are not born wanting us to ride them. Bits actually hurt their mouth too. I worked with horses for years if you are planning to tell me I know nothing about horses. I was just kinda programmed from a young age, like all of us, that using animals for entertainment etc was OK.
There are some elephant owners that mistreat them but there are also some horse owners that mistreat their horses yet we don't call for all the stables to be closed. Western factory farming of livestock is far more abusive than elephant tourism is.
daddyorama factory farming isn’t just western. Including Asia.
@@pri.sci.lla. but it did get it's start in west .
Horses are domesticated animals that have a dependent relationship with humans. Elephants are not, you cannot domestic and elephant you can only tame them. It’s not the same at all. Now do both animals suffer from abuse? Yes. Also you do here all the time for stables to be closed. And are you saying because the west does something bad they can’t criticise the practices of others because that’s a logical fallacy. Instead you can admit both sides are exploiting animals for their own personal game and it needs to be addressed in the west and in other parts of the world.
falloutjustcause falloutjustcause Damn it man! Don’t you see. It’s clearly seen in the video how much the elephants have become dependent on man after thousands of years.
And btw, the west have always thought they’re immune to criticism, and have found white man’s culture to be superior. Thus, they have always tried to destroy other cultures saying they’re uncivilised. Look what they did to African, Indian and the American Indian cultures. They are so stubborn that the get clouded in their own opinions and understanding while not having a glimpse of thought from the POV of a thai. They feel that only their bonding with horses is special, while the Thai’s bond with elephants is exploitation. The first thing they need is a cure for this stubborn mindset, to get out if their well, and see the world as it is and have always been
@@falloutjustcause Thai people domesticated elephants for thousands of years. You can research the fox domestication experiment for reference. It basically the same thing.
Next, AJ+ East Asia will report on abuse of Horses and Cows in North America :)
and you will continue your whataboutism on that video? of course not :)
Mister X last time I took a comment from an anonymous account seriously was, let me take a look at my calendar .... oh, never!!
Elephants are STILL wild animals. They are not build for riding or any form of human interaction. In fact their back is totally different from horses for example, which makes it painful for them to carry things. Also elephants are normally quite aggressive and impulsive animals. Those that you see in the video have been trained through torture to be able to interact with humans
All those scientists and doctors that are saying this is "OK".... are basically paid by those handlers. Their paycheck depends on this industry being kept alive.
Have you been there?
In the Eastern world, you can safely say that if an animal is performing for you, it did not enjoy its training, nor is enjoying the performance.
@Abe E Hold up. Youre compairing idiots like TK to things like Western Zoo's. TK isn't a proffesional and America like an other country has uniformed and uneducated people who are fooled by words like "sancturary" as any other person. DOn't paint with a broad brush.
While there is some truth to this, it is also untrue in a large degree. I had the wonderful opprotunity to intreact with elephant caregivers in Thailand. They really did care very much for their elephants and adopted and rescued others. Your comment is an oversimplification and an over generalization.
@Abe E Damn dude you and 7 others are very simple minded. I also watched a ted bundy documentary on netflix. What do you make of that? One guy's behavior doesnt not reflect the mentality of a whole country. How do you not know this? Jesus!
Plus the west criticizes the west too you know. And the east criticizes the west all the time. Shit going down everywhere man. Criticism is necessary to improve whatever. What is freedom if we cannot express what we feel is wrong?
Do you work for CCP?
David Thattenbanos Righteous American here😡
You are part of the problem, white guy claims he knows more about training elephants than the Thai experts that have been working with elephants for 1000s of years. Why the heck do you think they would abuse something that is their livelihood? A happy healthy animal wouldn't perform or partake. DUH!!
Elephants are pretty friend and timid. I use to live near the forest. And there are a herd of them roaming around. They understand our language. We don't have to abuse them for them to be tame with us. They are quite intelligent and understand our intentions. They trust us enough for us to ride them without us training them. I understand the abuse that some inflicted to them such as extreme logging and those heavy seats they carry for hours. Those should be ban. However, banning riding in general is another story. If you want to ban elephants riding in general than we have to ban horse riding too.
I think this is a great point. It shows how we should work together with are animal brothers and sisters. :)
Elephants are NOT created by God for humans to use. The best way to protect them is to HAVE LAWS TO PROTECT THEM AND PROHIBIT USING THEM FOR ILLEGAL LOGGING. That vet who claims that elephants do not cry is a sham.
Crasy western people! Driving a horses is not controversy but elephants yes, who is more strong horses or elephants...
Sm Guess Great points and any of us who “know horses,” know that they actually DO enjoy being ridden, and only even adapted as runners because our ancestors actually hunted and regularly ate them.
@@ungrateful-66 that's right
And the majority of the horses runners finish soon at the slaughterhouse
@@ungrateful-66 So this means you've spoken with a domesticated elephant who told you they don't like to be ridden?. Go out to the western U.S. and see if one of the 50,000+ wild horses running free out there "enjoy being ridden". I say let's free them all!
@@scunion66 U R right; what about the bulls in the rodeo festivals , corridas ( bullfight) and captives animals in zoos and circuses, not to mention guentanamo and the lies such Iraq's chemical weapons, just for crud oil ... and so on...
Elephant sanctuaries that look after animals should only be visited. Not dodgy abusive institutions.
Although I'm interested in this other point of view, this was some pretty imbalanced journalism... Only interviewing people who work for the "sanctuaries" and are making a profit out of this and contrasting it with western internet folks assumptions rather than experts on the other side of things makes it feel very biased. There are Asian groups who are against animal exploitation too you know...
Alexandra Ogden I think it’s pretty balanced. They’ve interviewed everyone from a researcher to a mahout. Maybe elephants are domesticated in Thailand as dogs are, and they are conditioned like how we train dogs
Biased as in it doesn't claim they abuse elephants? Sounds like you only want to hear what you want to hear, not the truth, which is that Thai people love their elephants and would not abuse their livelihood and family members. The elephants are their family members.
Alexandra Ogden Those Asian groups are similar in spirit and ideology as their Western counterparts. The only thing Asian about them are merely their faces, but not their spirit or practice.
The professor doesn't work for a sanctuary. Now as for that cold-hearted Karen mahout only thinking about his fat profits! Listen, I've met many a traditional Karen mahout and unscrupulous businessmen they are not. They are amazing elephant carers who should get 50x what they earn and should be revered for the love and care they have for their elephants. Take care of the good mahouts = take care of the health and well-being of elephants.
Have you heard of elephant nature Park Thailand no abuse no chains no bull hooks only love
One thing that was missed here was when talking about the history of captive elephant care, the fact the demand for teak was driven the West (notably British demand - Burma was, of course, a British colony) and much money was made from it by, for example, the British teak wallahs who made fortunes out of the teak industry. It's somewhat ironic then to have Westerners demand what they see as ethical elephant care in foreign lands based on their feelings and emotions - when the fact you have this legacy of captive elephants needing employment (and elephant tourism is therefore essential) is due to the ending of logging and all the deforestation largely driven by Western demand for teak.
Elephants were stolen from the wild and their mothers illegibly they were two. Domesticating baby elephants is legal Therefor, there would be no need to train them. Please copy and past these key words into your search how to crush an elephants spirit for tourism They predict that Asian elephants will become extinct by the year 2050 and it's not because of lack of tourism! It's because of activities like this. In order to tame a wild animal, and the only way to train an elephant is through abusive training. Elephants can't keep their numbers up when they are taken from the wild where they can thrive and breed. These elephants are bought from training camps and are used for profit.
I just want to say that your videos are very professional and the topics really interesting; to know about global issues and culture. Greetinsgs from Costa Rica!
Elephants have been part of the south asian culture for centuries with us living together in a harmonious way. We don't need peole behind pc and instagram giving their half assed opinion without knowung the culture of a place
Yes, people should learn about culture. That doesn't mean they have to agree with you.
You just don’t see the cruelty that takes place before the elephants are placed before you to perform. Elephant calves are torn from their mothers, starved and beaten to bend to their mahouts’ orders otherwise they get beaten with the bull hook till they bleed.
You're right! Nice to have someone who knows what they are talking about! Have you
watched any videos about the crush?
@@wildafrica626 - I have. It’s absolutely gut-wrenching and cruel.
i just wanna point out that when you see elephants in chained it's because they're either sick or being in musth. Musth period makes the elephant very dangerous. Even the caretaker cannot control that elephant. Sick elephant need to keep in chained since they can wander off as well. In some cases, they chain the new elephant before introducing to the herd.
it was not allow by the law but the tourist don't knew about and thought that's in bad way. they don't knew how serious of us to protect and living with them.
Thank you so much for educating us. It's hard to know what info is accurate and what isn't. I love Elephants, and I want to make sure that if I interact with them, I am doing so ethically. I hope the elephant tourism trade is saved. Thank you so much for this video. It would be lovely to have info about which places are ethical, and which ones are more exploitative. It's nice to hear from experts on the ground.
@erinaltstadt Lovely comment from evidently an open-minded person who doesn't simply watch a rehashed Peta video and make blanket judgements about those who care for captive elephants. Nice to read on social media - a world where discussion is rarely allowed and people allow their emotions to get in the way of reason, actual facts, and rational thought.
Those were not experts, they are just people who profit off exploting elephants. Do not ride elephants, do not take selfies with elephants, do not support places that exploit elephants for profit. The best thing you can do for elephants is not give money to people who enslave them and just leave them alone.
@@mrtullyteacher9634 What if you had a child and that child was taken away from you, beaten for weeks, held in a small enclosure, and made to perform stupid tricks for the rest of their life to entertain other people? Would that bother you at all or is crying for your stolen, tortured child too "emotional" and not "logical" enough for you?
@@Tracydot3sorry but you haven't a clue. You are suggesting leaving captive elephants alone? So let them starve to death? Get poisoned? Hit by cars? Shot? And that is from a position of care for elephants?? Go and speak to people who care for elephants - there are some amazing people out there who don't have time to pass judgement and point score behind keyboards in the West. Learn about how they risk their lives to ensure the best care and well-being for these magnificent animals, before judging all because you have read some Peta material or watched a staged video showing abuse with sad piano music and let your emotions overtake rational thought and your ability to think critically about a complex issue. Be open-minded, meet people on the ground, think critically about all issues. Also question why fake narratives are pushed...follow. the. Money. 💰
@@Tracydot3 so pointing out that this is a complex issue and there are many, many wonderful people caring for captive elephants is the same as supporting barbaric training methods (which are NOT normal) and supporting circusses (which are also far from the norm, I've never seen one in Northern Thailand). Wouldn't it be nice if this complex issue was that simple. Then we could all decide who was on the side of good v evil. It isn't. As with any complex issue, the ability to be open-minded and think critically is needed or it's best avoided altogether.
Obviously not many know how they 'break' an elephant into its' tourist friendly' form. Weather you finally get offered the pet them or ride them option ,the process of getting to that stage of submission doesn't change.
Great video! As someone who works at an elephant camp here in Thailand I appreciate you using your platform to help educate tourists and ultimately help the elephants here in Thailand.
Are there elephant sanctuaries in thailand or all elephants are domesticated in thailand?
Thank you dina to share with us this new show, it so amazing!! Keep going.
How do Europeans and Americans come to terms with their/our human history of horse-riding for >6000 years? Do they go after themselves as hard as going after the (South) Asian elephant culture?
Jaan C it’s not.
They should, as with dogs and cats an parrots and name it..., lots of mistreated animals everywhere. If we take animals in captivity, we should care well for them. Ive seen how badly elephants (animals in general) are treated in some places in Thailand firsthand. Not all are well cared for in sanctuaries.... So I see this vid as incomplete/naive.
can’t explain how much this turned my perspective of elephant tourism on its head
Elephants are beautiful animals. They are wonderful but due to the coronavirus pandemic the tourism has slowed down. I will need to visit this place one day.
I went just to Thailand twice, the ones I seen looked fine, I don’t care to ride them, I just hope they get a chance to move around, the bulls were chained to the ground, both front feet and could only rock back and forth. There was no sadness in their eyes, if I could really tell and one bull was really interested in me it seemed from the eye contact. All in all none of the ones I seen looked beaten
😂😂
I was wary of elephant riding, thanks for sharing the researcher’s opinions :)
I think this involves political reasons. The US wants to frame Thai elephant ridding to make they have influenced on Thailand as same as they have done to other countries
I went to Samui Elephant sanctuary where yes the elephants are fenced in but it’s a huge space for them to walk around one thing I was confused about was how they keep the elephants that they claimed didn’t get along away from each other. I was told this section is their territory which I interpreted as the elephants establish their territory and stick to that part of the park. We were only allowed to touch their trunks and only if we were feeding them. They said it’s be in elephants remember and these elephants had been riding and had scars from their hoops and the workers said they would remember getting hit on their bodies. These were older elephants with medical issues I believe. They also didn’t let us bath them which I was disappointed about.
I think what I got the most from this, is that there are good & bad people in every part of life. There are people who DO abuse & harm elephants & do not treat them right. But there are so many good people as well who have the right intentions & are doing the right things as well.
Just like there are people who abuse dogs & cats in America, it is frowned upon by the majority people here. It is the same in Thailand regarding elephants I believe.
i was actually on the first ever elephant sanctuary on the island of koh samui (opened very recently) and the elephants there looked like they were exttremely happy and lively. we made them food and fed them, along with a nice shower. the sanctuary is called "i love elephant samui"
I went to Samui Elephant sanctuary and we were only allowed to touch their trunks when feeding them and not allowed to bath them which I was looking forward to
If ridding an elephant should be considered animal abuse then so should riding a horse.
Mikerphone I agree. Any animal exploitation is wrong and should be given the same energy.
@@pri.sci.lla. Do you consider owning a pet exploitative? Since by doing so you'd be subjecting it to a non natural lifestyle for your own pleasure. Thus any pet regardless of its intended purpose(i.e. seeing dog, goldfish, hunting falcon, horse) serves as a tool for human use, meaning you'd be exploiting them for your own purposes. As compared to the disassociated intentions of nature, regardless of it's outcomes.
Mikerphone having a pet isn’t exploitation. I’m not forcing my pet to breed so I can sell their children or other animal products. I’m not exploiting her so no. Companionship isn’t exploitation. Plus she’s a rescue. I believe that it’s our job to care for the animals that are already on this planet. We should try to prevent suffering wherever possible. I’m a pre veterinary animal science student and I work on a farm with large animals.
@@pri.sci.lla. Well then, you're experiencing cognitive dissonance. There is a hole in you're logic. Statistically you're likely to ignore everything i say at this point because I'm going against your world view. But non the less ill explain what's wrong in your logic in happen chance that you are an open minded person.
Forcing a pet to breed is not the only form of exploitation, we just went over this before. Things like having an animal carry weight, act as a work force, complete a task, or controlling them via riding or how they live is exploitative.
When you have a pet you're forcing them to live with you, to abide by your rules, to have a human integrated experience. All things that wild animals aren't known to want to do. They require training to get to this point. Which is basically the equivalent of brainwashing. Using their natural resources like food, clean water, shelter, ect. you create a demand that they must answer with what you deem is positive behavior. Therfore you're acting against your animals natural instincts. Against nature, *regardless of the outcomes.* that's a key point. Nature is not alway about positive outcomes.
Remeber that just because an animal is rescued, doesn't mean it should've been. Not speaking in terms of human caused scenarios here, but that an animal in the wild would've been met with the disassociated consequences of nature. The natural law. Some organisms must die so that others can live and evolve to survive better. This is nature; if you care about some organisms you should care about all of them. Otherwise you don't really care about animals; you just have a bias for the cute and or fluffy ones.
Animal companionship is inherently exploitative as i just explained. But furthermore it also leads to damage to pet animals over all. Just because you take good care of your pet doesn't mean others will. Some animals will be abused, others over bred to feed demand, many slaughtered to fight infestation and over population. Giving anyone the ability to own animals will have a guaranteed result in more and more people wishing to do so. Even with a legal requirement, a black market will always exist for people who want to do what others have the ability to do. The only way to curb this is to use social pressure against owning pets.
Seeing as we dont require legal consent. If we give you the right to own pets without obtaining any, then we must equally afford that right to everyone. As we do.
Notice the word consent, that is not only applicable in your life, its applicable in the animal's. If you believe there is no consent unless explicit, then the obvious question would be how do you get consent from an animal who is bred and trained to be subordinate to humans? We cant. If you were to ask a slave born in America in the early 1800's why they do what they do, they would've told you is because they were born a slave. In a similaf sense your animal is born a slave to humanity. It doesn't know freedom, and so it can't consent to not having it. This all assumes you can read your pets mind in order to recieve explicit consent btw. Which i think we can agree on is impossible.
Anyways, this has been a short lecture on the broken logic that befalls many people who claim to care about animal exploitation and animal rights.
Take care and be safe. Treat your animals well and with respect... Which I'm sure was something all the propper well to do white Christian plantation family's said about what they did with their slaves.
Have a good one!
Priscilla How about a pet elephant, a companion. I mean the one like that of the mahout in the video.
The claim that brutality is not needed to train an elephant to give rides is laughable! Not a single video of an elephant being trained to give rides without cruelty has ever emerged, yet you'd imagine they would be keen to offer evidence to back up their claims? In fact time and time again video of young calves being brutally trained to give rides continues to emerge, if you know where to look dreadful video footage of the cruelty can sometimes be found being proudly shared on social media by some mahouts unaware that it's a contentious issue! Even the Thai national elephant centre (govt owned) in Lampang shows us calves being separated from their mothers and kept on the shortest of chains ( the desperation and distress of the calf is all too apparent for all to see) as part of the training process! Sorry Dena but you've been had , a little more research and the use of critical thought might have produced a more balanced program! Oh and that 'scientific study' mentioned has more holes in it than a sieve! Sure no hook and no chains does NOT automatically mean good elephant welfare but elephant riding means an elephant has been subjected to a brutal and cruel process even if well treated now and i for one want no part of that!
Thank you!!! Finally someone that knows what they are talking about. Problem is. Westerners are only going to listen to the lies they tell them so they can have the experience without guilt.
Why would anyone seriously care what people that are from DIFFERENT nations think about ones culture when it’s not hurting anyone?
It's not so much the tourism and riding itself that hurts the elephant, bet the fact that the baby is taken away from its mother and tied up for days in the same spot. This is a method called "the crush," which not every elephant survives. There is a documentary "Elephant; Return to the Wild" which features Lek Chailert of Elephant Nature Park in Chang Mai and multiple resources on that amongst other things that contradict the and fill in the in-between answers and information in this video, so please make sure to check that out. It's never black and white, I just want people to have as much information as they can to make an informed decision.
I still think we should not ride elephants or make then do shows for people...of course Thailand 🇹🇭 people are not gonna say anything negative because this is how they make money so pleople don’t contribute to this don’t be brainwashed
Your video was really interesting. Nice job, and it really is informative. I just put one up today that shows my experience this week at a Thai elephant place. I feel very similar to you.
What a great piece. So funny, informative and moving.
Not as informative as it should be.
@Pichada Saeheng I'm talking about phajaan.
@Pichada Saeheng Yeah, it was deliberately vague. Trying to spark up conversation.
Although ideally elephants should live in the wild freely to fully express their complex social and hierarchical structure I can see how in Thailand they are more treated like working animals. I don't think elephants can be compared to horses as horses have been domesticated for over 6000 years through a process of selective breeding and elephants are bred poorly if at all in captivity so I don't think selective breeding and thus "domestication" like in horses is even a possibility. But as an outsider I do understand that there might be a huge difference to how people in Thailand view these animals compared to someone who sees them as "exotic". I do hope their treatment and outlook for them improves because some of these animals are kept quite in piss poor conditions as can be seen again and again in various "rescue" channels and that coexisting will become better and better for elephants as we start to treat all animals with more kindness and love.
Sounds like all Thailand needs is some kind of official label with vet visits. Because treatments of the animals probably vary.
Elephants have been in lao and thai culture forever. I came here because dena is ♥️
Elephants need water, and lots of it. Elephants need to bathe, to clean their bodies, as well getting rid of insects, mites. Elephants can't be in direct sunlight constantly, they need water.
"like carrying a handbag"... disgusting abuse of these beautiful animals. Riding elephants, bathing elephants, making elephants paint for human satisfaction, makes my stomach turn.
Yes. They shouldn’t be ridden. It’s exploitative.
I'm curious about your opinion on horses
snooopert the same. Exploitation is bad.
@@pri.sci.lla. The science shows that domesticated elephants are physically and mentally dependant on humans. Where do you go from there?
snooopert I know what the science shows. I am a pre veterinary animal science student about to graduate. I personally support rescues and sanctuaries. I think that’s the only ethical way to sustain animals who have a “purpose”, whatever that may be, until the end of their natural lives. Since we brought them here, it’s our job to care for them. However the issues arise when you have animals for the purpose of making money, or exploitation. I think conservation is important but it shouldn’t be at the price of that animals sanity and or happiness. Most animals will go extinct at one point or another, most animals on this planet at one point or another have gone extinct however humans are greatly contributing to their increased extinction which is awful.
Priscilla Humans going extinct is the only solution I see. They are probably gonna be, as to how we are currently responding to climate change. When nature provided us with everything we need, we instead turned to greed. We took much more than we ever needed, we became colonialists, imperialists, industrialists, capitalists, etc. I think it’s a long way from going back, and probably our doom is pretty much nearing
Good Lord an elephant weighs 4000 pounds riding on one is like putting a hat on it.
Yes, but do you want to wear a hat all the time without your permission?
That’s not the point. It’s exploitation.
@@pri.sci.lla. Then We Westerners should stop riding horses.
James Sandoval I agree. I don’t cherry pick. Animal exploitation is wrong.
stilllovingsims but we are okay riding horses which don’t weigh a fraction of it. Oh yes, by the way, we ask consent before ridin a horse don’t we?! 😝
Elephants have been used as pack animals and for war for many years. The US army special forces manual lists them as a pack animal that can be used for transport. The U.S Army discourages their use however as they are endangered.
Peta is full of crazy people but look up phajaan and see how they utterly break their souls as calfs.
So you admit Peta are full of shit but still keep on going on about captive elephants all being 'crushed'. #justnottrue
I also think riding an elephant is immoral, but I thought the problem is not with the elephant carrying the weight of a person, but with the constant bending so they can climb on them. How are people exactly getting on the elephant?
So this scientist argues she cares for the health of elephants but at the same time argues that the bullhook should be used only when necessary. In other words, she supports elephant riding.
I also doubt you can trust anything these elephant guardians said. In some other videos, these guys said their relationship with elephant is based on trust and love, but they use bullhook regularly, and the training for the very young elephant is just as cruel as what trainers do with elephants in the circus. Of course, the training of young elephants for tourism is not disclosed in this video. That's misinformation.
As someone whose been to Thailand and ridden an elephant before knowing it was not okay to do, I have mixed feelings about riding. My time there I saw the elephant trainer who took us for a ride using a sharp spear-like tool to jab the elephant behind the ear as correction. He ensured us that it doesn’t actually hurt the elephant but idk enough to make a call on whether or not that was true.
Oh also, psychedelic mushrooms grow from elephants poop so if you go to the right place, the trainers may offer you elephant poop shrooms 😂 they clean it of course.
Edit: I posted this comment before they mentioned the bull-hooks in the video. Looks like they addressed it
Oh interesting about the mushrooms, how strange
The one owner/trainer said the reason he rides his elephant because he can control the elephant and the elephant would run away. If the elephant is treated so well why would he run away ? Saying he would run away seems to say the elephant does not want to be there. Of course they are making money off the elephants so they will support what they are doing, I don't buy it myself.
At the end of the day if you interview three people on camera who all work for or with the same association you will get the same message. Might be worth looking beyond this puff piece before booking your next elephant ride.
they even interviewed a scientist and doctor which is their job to ensure the elephants health is in good condition so why would they lie about that ? don't be stupid
@@nocturnalwolf7559 Education does not always lead to knowledge, ignorance does not always mean you are necessarily lying. Take the research the vet quotes for example, it is based of tests done at one observation venue. how does one observation venue reflect the stress levels of all venues?
@@slowvisuals8957 It is a study so unless more studies are done that take account of more observational venues it is the science for now. As we have seen throughout the pandemic, following the science is forever changing. However, as an indication it is valid and certainly would run counter to what most people (especially in the West) would imagine. It therefore reveals the complexity of the issue if nothing else. And that alone is valid.
The problem is not the riding or human contact. It's the cruelty, that they are trained with pain, treated badly and worked hard under stress. You need a deeper investigation. Of course they are not going to tell you everything. Some handlers are of course better than others. Feet should never be tied. They should not be beaten or suffer when they need a vet. They don't cry? Yes, they do. But not with tears.
Well I am not into selfies so would never take a selfie with an animal. I love photographing and so if given a chance I would totally go on a safari to observe and photograph them from a far. I see no issue with going on to a conservation that makes money to help aid animals and the maintain the actual reserve itself that protects them. You just got to do research. Don't travel and get lured by a sign that says you can pet elephants. Basically if you are questioning the ethics it behind it, maybe it is not right for you.
sundawg911 Not all are like that. There are zoos that is based on the spirit of conservation that allows you to pet or ride elephants.
I remember going to one in Taman Safari, a safari-like zoo in Indonesia. Now, Indonesia has some history of bad zoos, but this one is legit. The animals are well-taken care of and it has been trusted to house many different and difficult to maintain animals. The only deaths and accidents in that zoo that I’ve heard of is animals dying of old age or dumb people who thought it’s a good idea to open their car doors in the carnivore of the park. I remember riding the elephants and even camels as a young kid.
This video is biased. it didn't report the whole picture of elephant tourism.
Who cares about an elephant selphie? Its cruel!!! You should be ashamed of yourself they are nobles living beings
There ARE ele sanctuaries in Thailand, but you won't see them if you don't want to. They might contradict your narrative.
Um, the Elephant Nature Park is in Thailand.
I liked what he said and how we compared horses in the US to elephants in Thailand. Same type of thing.
Yup, sounds nice, but I don't buy it for full 100 percent though. Seen some awful stuff in Thailand with animals, made my stomach turn. And some positive stuff too with e.g. good elephant sanctuaries. But in general those experiences left me with a deep sense of unease. Humanity has a really f-d relationship with animals.
I think I would because the elephants are treated good in some places.
Kerala loves elephants also
Is anyone going to address the elephant in the room?
To support elephants..take part in elephant activities..
STOP CHAINS, STOP BRUTAL TRESUR. Asia is a paradis for turists and hell for elephants
Look at his elephants they don’t have marks on their body. Those are not the ones people are complaining about it. Riding is and always be bad. No one should ride any animals. It’s unfair to the animals. Humans can walk besides the elephants and they would get the same “exercise “ as they wood if the human was on top. Even “humanly” riding will be an excuse to bad owners that will say but they do it in the “sanctuary” I can do it too. I won’t be going to this “sanctuary”. There are veteneriants at Sea World too. Still they animals were abused. If ou have to force an animal do what you want for profit you don’t really love it. Do your research. There plenty of tour that will not allow riding or performance. Support those.
I understand the complexity of issues this presents to the Thai people, their livelihoods, and their culture. But the fact remains that elephants are trained using negative reinforcement with bullhooks, which are weapons, and through torture ceremonies called "elephant crushings." That's what it takes to make these wild animals submit. And it's proven that rides hurt their backs over time. Their backs are not like horseback. With all due respect to the Thai people, I for one won't support that, and as a longtime supporter of elephant protection and conservation, I urge others not to either.
The West absolutely has enormous problems concerning its own treatment of animals. But two wrongs don't make a right. It doesn't mean other animal practices around the world are no longer subject to scrutiny. Everyone is, without exception. And culture is not idle. Some things change, the rest changes eventually. There is nothing that can't be changed for the better. It's just a question of wisdom and courage.
Edit: The logic here is faulty btw 4:46, that a sanctuary can't have boundaries to be a sanctuary. No boundaries is called "the wild", and a sanctuary is not the same as the wild. Sanctuaries are real and they are important.
Animal cruelty should never be a part of anyone's culture. And if it is, it should be called out as being wrong and not condoned under any circumstances. If a "sanctuary" is allowing stupid selfies with the elephant then it is not a sanctuary, it's exploitation.
I think they might be smarter than we are.
Don't support horse riding
Can we do something about the billions of livestock crammed into tiny, unsanitary cages and tortured for their entire lives? At the minimum, that seems like a much higher priority.
Hey can any tell whats the condition right now..?
So off topic, How many people would use a Single Wish to Wish to spend the rest of their Lives Hopelessly devotedly married to Dena Takruri?
I think u should go to elephant nature park in thailand and take another opinion from the pounders..
In the us we treat horses very well
At least we should
I dont care what people say Im gonna take a cruise with an elephant.
Wrong. Elephant Nature Park in Chang Mai
The elephants might be better at painting and kicking a football than I am.
Which is the issue here? Callout culture or animal welfare? Because they are entirely different conversations. What you're really doing is conflating the two to justify what is proven makes elephants suffer. Period.
Yes the elephants may be dependent on humans for their care but that still doesn’t mean they have to be ridden. That’s just an excuse so they can keep exploiting them.
Did you not watch the video?
James Sandoval do you know the definition of exploitation?
Priscilla - I'm sure you know zero about elephants or the conditions they're kept
Nylphinx I’ve actually been to Thailand on a vet assistant trip as I’m an animal science student but I’m sure you think you know more.
No sanctuary just elephant camps and parks.
I don't like how this video glosses over the true impact riding has on an elephant. The problem isn't the weight, it's that their back isn't developed to sustain excess weight. Think of horses vs zebras, despite the fact they're almost identical in shape, a zebra is not a suitable animal to ride due to having a weaker back (among other things like being irascible creatures), but the point is that size alone isn't the determining factor of whether an animal can carry on it's back without suffering pain.
Jonathan Avila thank you!
Jonathan Avila I agree about the horses vs zebras thing. But the Thai have been riding elephants all along, they too might have known just as the west knew about horses
Zebra's are not suitable to ride because of temperament. Absolutely nothing to do with the strength of its back. Zebra's are stronger than horses both mentally and physically
Doing something for thousands of years is no excuse for animal abuse in no part if the world. I watched a lot of videos of so called elephant sanctuaries and most of them are mainly made for tourists and not for elephants.
A sanctuary is supposed to be a save place for animals which are not longer forced to work for humans in any way. . The only really elephant sanctuary I've seen so far is elephant nature park. Everyone who loves elephants should watch their videos. They show the natural behaviour of elephants. I'm not interested in videos of tourists feeding elephants.
well, since its ok to leave a comment AND evryone has an opinion, I for one NEVER EVER EVERRRRRRRRRRRRR
was ok with riding hirses, I believe since I was mmmmmhhh about 4 or 5 years old, since i was able to THINK for myself that ts CRUEL ABUSE to ride ANY animal, to show any animal in circus to pay to see any animal do STUPID DISGUSTING tricks that has NITHING to do with their own KIND
i repeat: its disgusting to see humans have animals do human tricks for laughs and for "how cute" the children love animals, or ooohhh " we want to show our children animals" so zoos are made
oh wait, NOT ZOOS, PRIOSONS are made to have these magnificent animals that BELONG in their home in their HOME wherever they are from, and have to put up being caged for the rest of their lifes take medication for a lifetime so its a soothed animal doesnt make problems, they even give alchool to elephants to tame them, its beyond disgusting
I wnet for the first and LAST time to a circus at the age of 6
I went for the first time and LAST time to a zoo at the age of *
I absolutely BEGGED my parents to NEVER do this again, EVER, I explained and they agreed and so we never paid to see a animal suffer
on the contrary of many I am ABSOLUTELY against riding horses , especially now that finally we invented so many vehicles to go around we can FINALLY leave our beautiful neigbhoring friends creatures any other in peace to live their lives
Iam 100% for and hopefully one day to try and bring down human growth as it is, as right now its absolutely out of control
animals have no space to live their lives because WE are evrywhere we took away theyre peace and most of all theyre FREEDOM .
(excuse my not so good english just trying to explain my view and opinions on this matter
its beyond disrespectful what we do to them, im ashamed of looking at them sometimes, so ashamed of what people do to them so emarrassing, absolutely evil and disgusting
Thank you foryour report ! I love elephants !
2:49 aka "we think you're doing it the exact same way we did"
white people needs to stop bashing other people's custom, culture, and value just because those things don't fit into your perspective...
This was intresting for sure ! This is thier culture and it has been for centuries and it shows that Elephant riding isn't bad if done right !!
The entire point of keeping plant & animal species from going extinct is to attempt resetting the overall natural environment back to something resembling balance. Earth is holistic so I'm not really sure anything besides tradition & entertaining humans explain "animal sanctuaries"...but also the great grandchildren of people that owned other humans in the west should probably take it easy when judging people in other lands that are genuinely attempting to preserve life. #dopestory👏🏾
Comparing animals and slavery is pretty vegan bullshit. Some real exslave should appear and explain to you the diference, you dump.
Of course westerners' audacity is wrong, but also Thai people's treatment to elephants is wrong too. The problem is, the issue was pointed out AFTER aaaalllll those many western tourists have swept Thailand or messed it up. They love Thailand so much and they try to own it? Eh. That's why these people on interview are on the defensive side. AJ is not reporting on the domestic volunteer groups or people for elephants which are against this massive tourism. C'mon, There are also other views, apart from only two of these Western tourists VS Thai elephant owners.
After spending time in sri Lanka I've been making these arguments for years. Great journalism.
ช้างฉลาดมาก😊
In the west we ride horse and bull and put them through training
why are you riding a horse There is also a competition in the Olympics.
Why do you have a bullfight?
Why do you have a hunting season?
A 70 kg man rides a 1 ton elephant. with a person weighing 70 kg, face 100 kg
why???
Funny the westerners try to tell Thai people what to do with elephants, the elephants bigger than a horse please stop riding a horse first. Sometimes just annoy some of them.
This is how you train an elephant btw ruclips.net/video/SVckvi_gWVo/видео.html
Seriously ? Then how about "Let's free the horses, no more riding horses" jeez, ffs
Just realize the "hypocrite" is the word, right ?
Elephants are not built for riding period! Their vertebrae stands vertical so it creates arthritis and chronic foot problems which lead to euthanasian. Horses have flat spines.
I love elephants
These elephants are the same as horses. Keep the same energy. OF COURSE they are fine to ride, you aren't going to weight too much for them. NOW you should treat the animal with respect, almost like a pet. As long as they are getting regular vet care and not being abused its okay. Just make your standards high with who you go to and it will be okay