@@SB-mr2nk the political/philosophical discussions I have with my father are some of the most important discussions of my life. Without patting myself on the back too much, I feel like I give him a nuance perspective into my generation, and he gives me an extremely grounded perspective into how we got to this point in the world. Best person I know to talk about anything
This is also how adult friends interacted when I was a child. I have wonderful memories of my parents and other couples they were friends with sitting around our kitchen table "debating" issues for hours. Drinking coffee and having some intense conversations with no malice, aggression, or hurt feelings. Even when they disagreed on the topics. And remaining friends despite their differences. Taught me a lot about how to be a real adult, stand for what you believe in while respecting other people's right to do the same. To also respectfully listen to other people's differing opinions with an open mind because we're never too old to learn from each other. I miss that so much these days.
Peterson does try to get many more left leaning people on but they almost always refuse. It is very disappointing as I would love to see a divergent range of thought/opinions. Kudos to Destiny for stepping up.
@@vakuzarthe point is not to get anywhere, as a whole neither side is trying to build something better, each side wants to win for themselves, no matter what, that’s all
As a liberal, I am happy conservatives are now seeing the issue with big business. About 10 years back there was a fairly significant libertarian movement on the right, especially regarding Ron Paul and the tea party where they wanted big business to have 0 limitations and ultimately complete control. Scary when those same corporations without limitations would also without limitation take their money in towards lobbyists behind closed doors to basically be the government themselves without anyone seeing it. Liberals, including myself, nowadays also see the problem with big government in hindsight, especially when war is concerned. If you ask any liberal which president killed the most people in history, it wasn't a conservative, but Barack Obama. Its a fact, and hard for other libs to swallow.
@@stendaalcartography3436 - Indeed - I like that since JP is a Psychologist that it makes for a more interesting interview/debate unlike one Mr. Cuchinelli has done before.
I would suggest you watch more of this channel, it has quite the variety of subjects and ideology to which I'm sure you would find at least some interesting and, I've gotta say, Mr. Peterson is one of best to listen to right now. Might be biased, but I find the guy very enlightening. I personally despise Destiny, yet here I am watching this video because I know I will get to see his point of view challenged in a respectful way. And I'm curious to see the arguments he will come up with against someone I deeply respect in Mr. Peterson. The man chooses his words meticulously and precisely.
I do see what you're talking about, but I would (somewhat parasocially) guess that destiny does not really see getting "worked up" as a negative thing he'd have to apologize for. He's said before that he enjoys conversations like that much more than never truly getting into the details. My guess is that JBP is probably the same way.
Destiny doesn't view it as a problem, but he absolutely recognizes it normally conveys high tension friction and overly combativeness, which he's specifically tried to not be swept up in. Finkelstein Debate is another such example, he kept his cool, even if just for appearances, so while he personally doesn't dislike the high tension verbal "fights", when it comes to getting your point across to a different audience, he's made a point of making sure not to get swept up in raising the temperature, or mudslinging (although mudslinging didn't occur here, despite the tone almost seeming to indocate it could happen).
@@kyle8688 it doesn't need to be a verbalised apology to recognize there was an acknowledgement of tempers flaring or the temperature increasing, for both parties to feel the need and want to cooperate to decrease the tension in the room. If you want to argue semantics, we'll probably be here all day.
The clips are not doing this conversation justice. The clips make it seem like the conversation was very contentious but they are very civil to each other. This was wonderful thank you for the video!
The clippers strongly rely on the assumption that no one has the attention span to watch the original, that's why they upload strategically clipped shorts to paint the discussion in whatever light they want. Unfortunately it's working, as you can clearly see the difference between the comments section here, vs the comments sections on shorts.
He wore that during the visit to sioux-falls. I asked him if he would be willing to trade, straight up, for mine. Got a solid laugh. No blazers were exchanged that evening. But memories were made.
It would be nice to have more of them but the only people I've seen from the left that are willing to do it are Destiny and Ana Kasparian. Well, Cenk went on a couple during his 'presidential run' but IMO it was only to grandstand and try for 'gotchas'. He didn't seem interested in having a real discussion.
@@timothystinson9292how exactly is destiny a Marxist? He’s a proclaimed liberal and capitalist. That’s the complete opposite side of the political scale brother
Please consider a second long-form discussion! The chemistry was through the roof, and there is no better combination of people so politically opposed while remaining a) intellectually respectable, b) clear in expression, and c) civil in conduct. The unique productivity here would be a gift to the world if you started a podcast together.
Respectable? Destiny is a smug half brain who argues in bad faith. When Jordan calls him out on his worldview and asks him to defend it, Destiny can only scoff and say, “Well what’s your big brain plan?” Destiny doesn’t have the intellectual rigor to even be in the same room, and certainly not debating.
These guys had such natural chemistry they could easily do this regularly and have enormous success. Don’t sleep on this rare dynamic that’s been uncovered. It’s special.
That makes everything consistent and they are both in the same terms in what they're talking about. There's something relaxing and satisfying when the conversation is this clear
Both are also activily engaging ain listening and trying to understand what other person is saying, instead of the usual where there is one person who is doing very little listening but a huge lot of assuming
If only more people cared about definitions. Instead we assume the worst and end up arguing about 2 different things, while thinking we are arguing about the same thing. Which is just a waste of time.
I've developed a new respect for Jordan Peterson. Not that I agree with him on most things but I can see how his mind works. Destiny's discussion with him is what the world needs today. Bravo gentlemen!!
@@91GT347 Exactly! JBP is a rarity, an intellectual forthcoming intellectual, whereas others (like Dawkins) rarely concede where their knowledge falls short in their domain of expertise, Jordan totally forthrightly says I DONT KNOW and I feel that irks people but it’s the truth and a truth many don’t have the courage to admit
@@JackFate76 What are you talking about? Dawkins was trying to back Peterson into a corner by asking him if he believes a literal interpretation of religious stories, which shows he doesn't understand Peterson's viewpoint in the slightest. Richard discussed the evolutionary arms race between predator and prey, but was so short sighted and dense that he couldn't link the idea that humans co-evolved with stories which they embodied, that gave them an evolutionary advantage. Jordan was getting frustrated because it's so obvious. If in 10,000 years humans turned wolves into dogs through artificial selection, imagine what cultural selection can do to humans through the span of hundreds of thousands of years. We culturally set a highest ideal (a god) and our stories push us to embody that ideal, and culturally we select and admire people who live up to that ideal. Imagine that process through thousands of years. Getting caught up in the historical validity of the stories is completely beside the point - and Jordan had a right to be utterly frustrated. Richard is dense and lacks any ability to imagine and abstract.
The debate on vaccines and climate change was actually fun to listen to. I like when debate opponents actually acknowledge what the other one is saying and address it instead of running down their own dialogue tree.
Destiny was too hasty to conclude that there were predictions by the conservatives about the side effects of the vaccines of which none of the predictions came through. There were actually side effects, although it might not have been pronounced as expected.
Got heated because JP yelled at someone half his age that he doesn't TRUST PEOPLE THAT USE FORCE when that wasn't even the argument in the first place 😂
@@jizim8947do more listening than talking. Also take notes. But Destiny is running laps around JP here. Destiny said we live in different worlds with different facts and that more people should be present in the same space. JP ignored that because he was too busy to yell.
These guys should argue more often. I'm a destiny fan but it's so good to see someone intelligently push back and make him go a level or 2 deeper or make him use precise language particularly because Peterson is intently listening and engaging. Give us a once a month argument about anything 🤣
Yes, I particularly liked their back and forth on vaccines. It really challenged my beliefs on both sides and I think they both made excellent points. It’s very rare to see those sorts of conversations where you can see people with opposing perspectives and agree with both in different aspects.
@@arenegadeboss Right? Feel like Destiny's the only person I've personally seen that had Dr. P stopping and thinking a bit more than usual about his reasoning.
@@drearmouse9510Yes I agree, and coming from the side of a Destiny fan, this is one of the first times I’ve truly seen someone make him stop and think about his reasoning. This is why it’s so important to have smart people from both sides debate complex topics, it’s the only way we can move forward as a country and as a people. Very impressed by both and I hope they do this again.
I'm from Germany. My mum told me that my grandma was completely shocked when, after the war, they were shown documentaries about the concentration camps. She was not aware at all. My other grandma noticed that a Jewish family suddenly wasn't in the street any more. That was the extend if her knowing.
wow im german and i didnt even know it was swept under the rug like that. But we did have a lot of jewish hate going on with people marking jewish stores and stuff like that
This was actually one of the most interesting and dynamic debates either of the participants have engaged in quite some time. Kudos to both Dr. Peterson and Destiny for both giving as good as they got.
@@Kirito_2016 absolutely. And his attempt to be full-on anti-vaxxxxer was cringe. Starts with some vaccines might be safe. Then they are safe, but just too many at once. Then it’s just the mRNA that scientifically bad. Then it’s just distrust because of coercion, but the vaccines themselves weren’t the problem.
BUT I DON'T TRUST PEOPLE THAT USE FORCE, NOW LEMME HALF MY URANIUM ENRICHED KOOL AID. Grandpa, you called the cops on the "shady" people that moved next door. SO?! oh irony. Destiny says there's hypocrisy and abuses of power on both sides. JP: BUT THE LEFT... Just cause you use multi syllable words and have a degree in sociology don't make you an expert in big data modeling, idiot.
Thank God it wasn't. Peterson really just talks a lot and could benefit from becoming more concise. Maybe you are a Peterson fan, and it wasn't as noticeable, but coming from Destiny's audience, it made many parts tough to listen to
@joesecord3066 i am a regular destiny viewer and i generally disagree with you. The only times i feel like jordan needs to speed it up is when it is religious, due to my lack of interest.
@@joesecord3066I really enjoyed Peterson. Although he got a little heated, it was coool to see him actually argue against destiny on shit that conservatives run away from when on destiny’s stream. Really really enjoyable.
@@adamcox6960fauci said it 1 time. If you look at the bulk of the messages from the go and people like fauci, then its clear they ran a campaign that said it would reduce.
@@Mack-i2uhe’s probably not use to talking to midwits that just rattle off talking points that the person saying them doesn’t even understand. Zero original thoughts, all partisan hackery
This interview is giving me nostalgia from Old School JP debates. I'm very encouraged at the intellectual honesty both men had, no personal attacks, no assuming other person's perspective, just speaking about the issues
Steven did not expect to see the monster in Jordan to come out, and i think there was so much emotion and passion coming from Jordan. I absolutely loved watching this play out!
All this conversation proved is you two should have 1,000 more. You both welcome disagreement and can overcome the generational gap. When’s the next episode…
Most debates would benefit from multiple rounds of long form discussion. Unless your intent is to "win." Often times a chunk of the debate is just understanding what the other person is saying.
It's pretty rare to have two people in a room who understand this concept. Hopefully we get more. Took like multiple years to make this convo happen though@@thorinhannahs4614
@@tedmonster66 So if you're making the claim all his info was incorrect, the onus is on you to provide the evidence, maybe show us something to tell us what was incorrect. Though also something being a talking point doesn't mean the info isn't inaccurate, I especially for talking points from the left, who prefer to actually reference scientists rather than whatever slop comes out of trumps mouth/twitter that morning.
You had me until you said especially talking points from the left. That is absurd. Both sides routinely speak out their back end with no sources or research to back them up. Watch any politician on the left talk about firearms for an easy example. They have absolutely no idea what they are talking about. It's a massive err to think your side is more intellectual than the other side. Both sides have roughly the same proportion of smart intellectuals to dumb follow the narrative types because that distribution exists in the human species. One side doesn't draw more than the other. @@redeyesb.dragonite8562
@@nothingspecial1241it's likely alopecia barbae. Funny how his recent interviews always have that spot of his beard facing the camera though lol. It can grow back but he should just shave the sides until it does.
I am a libertarian and align with JP on much more than I do with Destiny, but the error in climate change projections is not based on uncertainty of how much we are impacting the climate, it is uncertainty in how much we will be able to change our carbon emissions. I studied atmospheric science for a couple years before changing my major in college and the science is very clear on climate change. This idea that the right has been pushing for years about how uncertain the science is and how the left is lying about climate change is hurting the party potentially more than any other issue other than abortion. Don't get me wrong, both sides are guilty of this, the right likes to take the projections on the lowest end and the left likes to take the projections on the highest end, but both sides need to stop IGNORING the science for their own personal gain. The conversation might actually go somewhere if politicians weren't so corrupt.
I don't disagree with everything you're saying, but saying you studied atmospheric science (implying you're more knowledgeable on the subject than most) does more harm to your credibility than good...considering the schools and studies being conducted on "the science" that is being taught is overwhelmingly biased in one direction. Then also saying "the science is very clear" is just not factual. Most studies completely discard many important facts as though they worked backwards from the conclusion they were attempting to make. I don't think those that oppose or speak out against those type of studies are necessary lying as much as they are just pointing out relevant details that are intentionally ommited, for example; how the earth has always gone through heating or cooling cycles. The studies always conveniently point at us being the culprit and completely discount any other "inconvenient" factors...and then of course the solution always points to something controversial and/or ludicrous and those that speak out against any of the "studies" or "solutions" are silenced and pushed into the category of being a problem, anti-science, or conspiracy theorist.
@@DreadfulSymptoms If I told you I was a scientist, would you take what I say seriously? Or would you only form your opinion of me based on where I fell in line within the mainstream consensus group? The way you framed that question was based on contempt for someone who would dare question "the science" or question "how the science works". There's a great video from years ago where Carl Sagan warns of this exact scientific superiority complex where skepticism and questioning is not permitted. I'm not even claiming to know the answers or be an expert. But I feel as though we are moving toward a scientific dictatorship where anyone who questions or criticises the mainstream consensus is labeled as being inferior, a conspiracy theorist, a shill, a denier, etc, and is shunned and censored...regardless of their credentials. So yeah, your immediate response to ask if I'm an "actual scientist" just proves the point I was making. If I tell you I'm an accredited scientist with published peer-reviewed scientific journals with a doctorate, then you'd discredit me the exact same way you'd discredit me if I was the average skeptical layman. The only difference would be the angle from which you would target your slander.
@@B-DINO People who have gone against the contemporary understanding of the world have always been viewed with suspicion. The thing is that science rests on the scientific method. You're allowed to question and be skeptic but if you're going to go against the established scientific consensus (it doesn't matter what field) and make opposite or different claims then you better have a scientific argument. In a way the field of science is the most democratic systems of them all. If you make a finding then you're able to contribute. Also your point about Carl Sagans warning. His warning is more about warning against people not understanding science, not getting educated and not being critical thinkers when it comes to those who make claims with little or no scientific backing. He would very likely warn against science done by those who are funded by privately owned companies. What we need in the west is more people with greater understanding of how the scientific method works, that scientists are not a monolith. There are differing opinions within the scientific community when it comes to climate change just like opinions vary in other fields. It's a self-correcting system that is so varied that any major conspiracy would be impossible to keep close to hidden because at ANY point a scientist who wants to become world famous, win Nobel Prizes and get recognition by publishing their revolutionary findings that prove conclusively that humans have 0 impact on the climate. Yet that doesn't seem to happen.
These two guys could argue forever. The second half of this was gold. I'd love to see another one with these two. This was great. Round 2 please. Somebody make it happen.
@yupimawesome hm really? Are you sure about that bud? Hm? Are you confident? Yea? Feeling confident about what you just commented? Well I'll have you know, I lost my dad in a boating accident on 2/7/04 and after he died we went through his belongings and found out he had a child bride in Thailand. What a world!
Dear Dr Jordan Peterson - I hope you invite Steve again! I found this to be one of the best conversations because he was challenging you a lot, but respectfully! It was amazing to see a more left person enganging with you in a respectful and disagreable manner, without resorting to insults or just attacking you with dishonest and bad faith arguments. Your talks are very interesting, no doubt, but seeing someone pushing you more on your ideas was super entertaining. Sometimes it feels certain guests or interviewers don't challenge you as much as Steve did - and because they dont challenge that much, your talking points become slightly repetitive and are not explored more deeply. This was awesome!
@@pabloincell35it would be great for you to provide the information instead the like “just Google it bro” approach, if you have any interest in actually swaying anyone as opposed to just shouting into the void here. But ey that’s probably exactly what I’m doing now lol
Until recently my opinion on Jordan Peterson was broadly negative. But seeing him bring guests like Destiny on and treating them with respect, makes me respect Peterson much more than I did previously.
Got to hand it to Destiny. Almost everything I'd seen about him amounted to clips. I didn't have a good impression of him. I must admit that in a long form interview he acquitted himself far better than I assumed he would. I disagree with him on a lot of things but that doesn't matter much as long as people are communicating in good faith. I never sensed hidden agendas or duplicitousness. He's earned a measure of respect from me.
It highlights the fundamental manipulation of information that exists by decontextualizing individuals for ideological gain. Seeing the world through the lens of shortened clips can be extremely misleading and even Destiny expressed skepticism regarding any "clip less than 10 seconds." Everyone who is associated with a certain ideology usually falls victim to this in one way or another (ex. Jordan Peterson, Destiny, Trump, Biden, etc..)
He’s one of the few influencers on the left side of the spectrum that I actually respect and watch frequently . Some of the points he digs his heels into really piss me off . But overall I appreciate his willingness to discuss, and change his opinions
@@bidensson4643Exactly. Whenever clips of someone get my blood boiling I always try to remember that a short clip is not the best representation of their actual point of view.
I do wish we had more people that were authentic and well thought out in their positions, on both sides of the aisle. I think these people are pretty rare. There's a lot of people that I agree with on a lot of subjects, that are still hot garbage when it comes to rationalizing those beliefs and/or engaging with the opposition. It's funny (in a scary way) how many people I think agree with me, not because of carefully thought out policy approaches, but rather by pure dumb partisan luck.
yeah because it was one of his more easy discussions. ran rings around JP. I find JP to keep letting emotions interfere with his thought. he speaks on things he knows nothing about. Wish he would make his bed and make a proper comeback on topics he is well versed in. constantly out of his depth.
Most entertaining debate I have seen. These guys did great. They were civil and listened to each other even though they disagreed. Why can’t the media do more of this?
Impressed that JP’s community is receiving this well in the comments. Nowadays it seems a roll of the dice whether a community will receive such a contentious conversation. Impressed by these two gentleman as always.
Funnily enough, its the opposite audience that comes in rude, doing nothing reaponding to his points but just disparaginf his relationship. Destiny's audience is pruned over time to be the open ones. He has had debatea from communists to nick fuentes. They aren't going to be offended by peterson.
I’ve never heard Destiny speak without wanting him to shut up until now. I enjoyed him being leveled headed in this, however, I do wish it was either longer or that you’d of allowed him to speak more. Maybe a part 2
I think it's because in the beginning peterson has seen destiny has this disagreeable person and will have this energy. I believe peterson is trying to match the energy because it is anticipation of destiny to fight you and have this element of fast and drama- as well as extremely distrustful of others. So I think petersons enhanced front of aggressiveness might be appreciated by everyone.
Honestly I think he was actually loving the fact that he found a guest that was just as comfortable with arguing as he is. Probably a breath of fresh air for him that he didn’t have to worry about the conversation detailing and he could actually go hard without egos or feelings being hurt.
There was such a thing, but JBP was having none of that. Destiny attacked Peterson for his ways of bringing up the impoverished victims of the left (after he started the topic that way himself).
This was actually fascinating to watch. I have to say I love both of these guys! Destiny did sound a lot more grounded and realistic than Peterson in most of these discussions. Loved this interview. Shifted how I see both of them!
Outstanding conversation. I applaud both Dr Peterson and Destiny for participating in this and being willing to listen to one another. This is what the world needs.
Well I mean Destiny is just a Liberal, not these disgusting leftists, I think center left and right have a lot in common, the leftists are just loud and bully their way to the limelight
@@beneficent2557 Yup. I'm so lost. This seems to be such a common trend, atleast from my own anecdotal experience. Like 3 out of every 4-5 peers or friends I ever knew that were progressive, were also quite sociopathic. I was a progressive too, I hated Trump for 7 years, it wasn't until 2022 when I finally changed and found myself alot more neo-conservative and now I identify alot more as paleo-conservative, only about 25% neocon/semi-isolationist in foreign policy. So the majority of the peers and friends I hung around were all progressive, we all did drugs, messed around, were involved in crime, etc. All my peers like if not 60% of the entire highschool was all doing some form of crime, from shoplifting, burglary, fraud, cracking credit cards, selling weed, drugs, counterfeits, etc. Everyone had a "hustle". And it was so weird too, but after middle school, there was a huge trend where everyone white suddenly started acting more "black" and thuggish, and even some of the blacks were getting annoyed by it because they viewed it as them trying to "copy culture for clout", they were listening to all the drill rap, talking in ebonics, etc. Like literal white upper middle class suburban boys doing this, lol. I had a friend who introduced me to another friend who was 10 years older than me, and a hardcore heroin addict, and introduced me to opiates, I didn't get clean until 2022, but I remember he was this hardcore liberal guy, he wanted drugs to be legalized, he hated Trump, called all conservatives/republicans "rednecks" and he was extremely atheist, he hated Christians, in fact, to feed his habit, he would literally steal from churches, he'd straight up break in and burglarize their donation boxes, music equipment, speakers, mics, guitars, laptops, desktops, everything you could think of, and he'd go in during daytime and drop a few coins in the donation box to make a sound as if he was donating and then scrunch up as many bills in his hand and crumble them up and quickly leave. He robbed over 100 churches in every suburb of northwestern Chicago. He eventually got caught and caught a Class X felony and I believe he got 20 years in prison. He would always say things like "God doesn't want your money, he doesn't even exist! I'm doing everyone a favor by taking money out of church! Money is the root of all evil, so therefore I'm doing the right thing" "Christians are all a bunch of bigots, their all a bunch of rich white guys, they don't need the money" (yet he was a white guy himself from the balkans lol) Literally what I noticed time and time again, was that if you were in private with these progressive liberals and a rather close friend to them or they were intoxicated, they would show their true colors, and be very racist. But show a completely different image in public. This guy, and a bunch of other friends I knew, were all into selling drugs and research chemicals on the darknet and on the streets. Also into credit card fraud and stealing people's identity. This was also trendy in highschool. The excuse would always be "they're just gonna call their bank and get refunded, so therefore we're attacking from the banks and insurance companies, screw the big corporations". This was the same convenient excuse used for shoplifting and organized retail theft schemes like stealing power tools from home depot and laptops from Walmart. This church robber guy would always be posting memes on Facebook about BLM and anti-racism, but yet there was this one time he bought dope from a black guy and got back in my car and then said "thank god for my good ole n--ger nogger friend" and I was like "....what...?" he replied "Oh. That was my nig nog friend" I say wtf? And he says "Yeah, that's what I call em, and all my other blackies, I call em nig nogs" I was like "do you say that to his face?" And he said "Course not, he'd shoot me" I was like "shoot you? Arent you being prejudice? You just posted a meme on your Facebook last week talking about 'prejudice'..." and he was like "whatever, who cares" I'm an early Gen Z from "99 and I don't hang out with anyone my age anymore. Alot of my peers were very progressive, and I noticed a trend of sociopathy among them. With perhaps the exception being white liberal females who were mainly into virtue signaling because they'd get super emotional and want validation and were also prone to emotional manipulation, I never hung out with any girls, mostly just guys. So I may be wrong. This is just my own anecdotal personal experience. I dropped out of highschool in my junior year to pursue entrepreneurship, glad I never went to college, and glad i dropped out of highschool. So yeah I noticed a trend of sociopathy among progressives atleast from my own anecdotal experience. There were rarely any conservatives, only a couple I remember, who I remember posting MAGA hat selfies around 2016, and getting disowned by alot of our peers, they were straight A students and had 3.90-4.00 GPAs, one of them was a great athlete and the 2nd fastest runner in our entire school, was very involved in politics young, was doing school debates and was nominated class president. The reason there was rarely any conservatives was because we were constantly indoctrinated, our teachers were making us watch CNN student news everyday and after 2016 during Trump's rise to president they were playing CNN like 3 times a day. And our teachers were constantly telling us about how bad and evil Trump was and how he was a threat to freedom and human rights. We were constantly watching movies about slavery that fabricated history, movies like roots, movies that would depict white Americans sailing to shores of Africa and storming tiki huts in the jungles of Africa at night to steal blacks and take them back to America to work in the cotton fields of the "deep evil red south". I was shocked when I learned just a couple years ago that slavery existed worldwide and was basically a norm, and still exists to this day, and that all races were enslaved. We were never told this in school, they essentially never told us but never denied it either and thereby crafted a belief in us that made us think it only existed in America, by only showing us movies and curriculum about slavery in America and nothing else. I went off topic, but I'd like to add one last thing. I've noticed a constant pattern too, that liberals are alot more soft on the superficial level, but nasty on the inside once you get to know their true colors, lifestyle and personality. And with conservatives I've noticed they're very hard, tough, and sometimes even harsh (that may not be the right word) like a "i dont take crap from anyone" attitude on the superficial level, but once you get to know them, open up, and become closer, they're actually very down to earth, trustworthy, and nice. A key pillar belief in conservativism is the acknowledgment that all humans are inherently flawed no matter what, and you can only adapt to this, and no amount of changes to their environment and external factors can change that. I believe this is a key reason in why some conservatives portray a hard shell towards people, and are generally skeptical of strangers and seem to have a high guard on, whereas once they let you into their home and you become close they're very down to earth and kind. Progressives on the other hand don't really believe in this key tenet, and they believe all humans are perfect and it's their environments and external factors that make them flawed and commit acts of evil and wrong, and whatnot. And they appear alot more quirky and soft on the outside but are very very prejudiced, judgemental, rude, gossipy, and traitorous once you become closer to them. From my personal experience from dealing with dozens of them in my close life and dealing with hundreds of them in public in short term relationships or small interactions.
Unfortunately, most of us wouldn’t have the “skills” to keep this conversation going, let alone the knowledge to make relevant points. Another observation is that the energy and focus needed to sustain the conversation requires an athleticism that, again, most of us lack! It’s exhausting to watch! Thank goodness for the ads, that were like the bell between rounds!
This has to be one of my absolute favourites of Dr. Peterson's debates. I thoroughly enjoyed the breadth of topics covered, the short amount of time it took for the conversations to get deep and heated, and the fact that both gentlemen showed passion for the topics and their positions but did not, at any point, turn it into an argument with personal attacks. Bravo to both, I would love to see another interview with Destiny where you cover even more contentious problems!
agreed 100% - this is how it's suppose to be when solving problems or resolving conflict via examining and discussing opposing ideas to reach the truth - it's this kind of dialectical engagement, this exchange of wisdom, that could really lead to major breakthroughs in the most challenging or stubborn of impasses or conundrums. i didn't know who this destiny guy was - but i must admit, he impressed me more than most of the liberal leftists. (possibly because he has that conservative background?) great interview. 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
I used to be just like him. Then years into young adulthood I was around people like Peterson, and life got clearer. What I learned most was just how much understanding of a complex world and most of all, human nature.
The way Jordan Peterson can review the conversation on command and recall a point from the beginning of the convo to then apply it with surgical precision is quite incredible
Great observation. I just started watching the video but I totally get your point and have seen it many times. I wish I could do that or could even retain just a tiny bit of the things I read like JP can.
I think Peterson really enjoyed having a fiery conversation with someone on the left who could hold their own without having to resort to personal jabs. Allowing him to let his emotions fly and then come back and fourth between emotions on important topics. At the end I think he was impressed with Destiny and tipped his hat to a worthy opponent. I REALLY enjoyed this one.
Worthy opponent, perhaps, but maybe Dr. Peterson saw a bit of the student in Destiny. I just hope Destiny bears enough humility to remember what he learned.
Jordan usually gets exhausted when it comes to arguments because they usually lead to conflict and Jordan doesn't like conflict (though he hates delayed conflict even more) but watching him while he's in it is so mesmerizing
1:12:00 Peterson just makes up Bible exegesis. I know of no early Church Father who says God punishes Moses because he hit an inanimate object (a rock) with a stick! Haha. What? It wasn't because of Moses "force". It was because He did not follow God's given command, but decided to wing it and do it his own way. Like JBP is doing w this interpretation.
1:18:00 yes. They were crazies saying "the jab will kill everyone" but come on Destiny. Obviously the VAST amount of people opposed to the mandate were opposed because it was a MANDATE and interfered with personal choice. It wasn't about micro chips. Haha. So dishonest. If someone disagrees, just strawman then into conspiracy land. Lame tactic.
He means Jordan was pushed against in the strongest of ways, you cannot distill the truth unless it is placed in the crucible of reality. They both outlined real problems with each other's ideas and I seriously benefited from it.
People not familiar with the recent Finklestein incident (in which he constantly made up new names for Mr. Benulli) must be really confused by this comment section.
Didnt really get to hear a lot of Destiny's responses because they played the ads right over them, youd think theyd at least pause the conversation for the ads instead of playing them right over the top of them
If you listen closely you'll realize they don't cut Destiny's responses at all they just have video playing behind the ad but it starts back where it cuts off. Have a nice day.
@@zlkanglwrth2776nah it really seems like they both are just searching for the truth. So much respect for both of these people for doing their homework and always talking from a place of logic
I could've listened to another 4 hours of this. Debates like this don't happen enough anymore. Both Jordan Peterson and Destiny were able to get deep into the details of their stances without it becoming bad faith.
Destiny did that too. That isn't an indication of bad faith, that is an indication that both of them were operating at the edge of their ability and that their initial formulations of the idea they were attempting to grapple with failed to live up to their own standards of validity, so they attempted to reformulate them.
This is the first time I can say Destiny impressed me. He carries himself very well here and having an actual debate as opposed to moving towards insults and raising his voice as he normally does. Jordan Peterson is crazy smart...Destiny showed he can carry an intellectual conversation. Great video!!!!
I would love it if a conversation like this between these two became a regular segment. This kind of conversation between people who are quite articulate, but who have opposing view points and are willing to follow the proverbial rabbit holes where they might go is genuinely and desperately needed as an antidote to the informational positive feedback loops that social media platforms have become. Jordan and Destiny also seem to be uniquely able to keep things rational and cordial even while vehemently disagreeing on topics, which is refreshing and inspiring. Furthermore, I truly appreciate that they both approach this conversation in good faith with a desire to develop a rapprochement between the divergent viewpoints.
@@mariusciobotaru3 so you watched 1 segment and have an opinion on the whole debate? pathetic. Anyways its hard to remain cordial with somone whos entire argument is trope after trope after trope without any ability to actually support and back up his claims and arguments. destiny is worthless.
Both made good arguments, presented good information, didn't resort to personal attacks. All in all, a good discussion. Tempers got a bit heated tho. Peterson could do with a little less shouting and interrupting. Which surprised me, that's very unlike him. Normally he's very calm and collected in a discussion.
Anybody who thinks "destiny" represented himself well here needs to stop drinking soy lattes. It's hard to watch, or listen to such a sad, indoctrinated, demoralized and effeminate man for this long. If you think he made good points, you need to change yourself fundamentally to become a man. Peterson is also not the way. He merely points in the faint direction of the way.
I love this discussion!!! I just discovered Mr. Bonneccelli. And I might say I respect his perspective a lot. I like his thought process. And I hope for a part two of this discussion.
Be destiny being completely wrong and later studying the video and his information sources to make arguments he couldn't make in person? That's what happened and destiny just looked like a punk the whole time.
@@habitat2990 Dude, I feel like we were watching two different debates lmao. Destiny was doing his usual thing of rapid-firing facts and opinions, Peterson was hyper emotional, esp when they got to the climate change and vaccine stuff.
It is very hard to listen, as I feel Jordan is regularly dominating the conversation with his venting not allowing his guest to respond to many points. Then when his guest talks, he often has to intersect over them quickly.
@@wasteddudewhy is that insane? Lmfao🤣 should we just always assume that people don’t have other intentions? The comparison was made because of many similarities between the groups. And notice he compared rather than outright call them Nazis. Remember the actual Nazis truly thought they were on the right side too.
Because saying “I’m a climate change activist” doesn’t mean you are a good person or that you don’t have any ulterior, malicious motives. You also don’t know what “climate change activists” are willing to do, what they’re willing to destroy, take, kill etc. all in the name of their “activism” (if you think this would never happen, the you should know that’s exactly how it happens anyway) This should be obvious dude. Stop letting your fixation on hating nazis and loving activism blind you from the fact that there are spectrums to these things, and that your naïveté can and IS easily being used against you. Step away from hating Peterson for a second and look at the broader picture.
As someone who sees most of what JP puts out, another 7 hours of this would be welcome! I can only image how hard it is to get someone on the left to come sit with him, but conversations like this are of the utmost importance! Well done both.
Each side has people of different levels of intellect, discussion and argument skillsets, and varying motivations. I enjoy when these people get matched up and talk are the best things to listen to.
Jordan, while not arguing in good faith, is at the bare minimum being respectful to destiny. Every argument I've ever been in with a conservative has devolved into ad hominem attacks, mistaking feelings for facts, or putting up a literal wall between them and simply opening a dictionary or googling a concept they don't understand. I too would love for more discussions like this but Trumps own personal unscrupulous and disrespectful behavior is inspiring the right to act likewise
@@personface108…..that’s exactly what Liberals do. Call names(Nazis is the go to) Big thing is that you can’t critique any other race, because that’s….. .
Peterson's ability to bring in such an argumentative person, start the dialogue in a calm way to set the tone for a more productive debate was masterful. Hes very good at what he does.
Jordan told Destiny, "You have the right to your own Destiny" without a hint of irony. What a fantastic conversation.
1:13:11
He didn’t even give our girl Destiny a paper to roll up and fidget with. Hitler level evil
Baller!
Oh no I arrived late to comment that! Lol
Yea, great convo.
This feels like a father and son debating over the dinner table after the rest of the family had enough and went to bed... and its great lol
32:07
Is that what fathers are supposed to do?
@@SB-mr2nk the political/philosophical discussions I have with my father are some of the most important discussions of my life. Without patting myself on the back too much, I feel like I give him a nuance perspective into my generation, and he gives me an extremely grounded perspective into how we got to this point in the world. Best person I know to talk about anything
This is also how adult friends interacted when I was a child. I have wonderful memories of my parents and other couples they were friends with sitting around our kitchen table "debating" issues for hours. Drinking coffee and having some intense conversations with no malice, aggression, or hurt feelings. Even when they disagreed on the topics. And remaining friends despite their differences. Taught me a lot about how to be a real adult, stand for what you believe in while respecting other people's right to do the same. To also respectfully listen to other people's differing opinions with an open mind because we're never too old to learn from each other. I miss that so much these days.
@@redbird1336you are my opponent but not my enemy.
Never in my life did I think I would see this pairing, I admire the diversity of guests on this podcast.
His daughter is friends with Lauren Southern. Who apparently had his bastard child. After his experiment with cuckoldry and marital failure.
"So maybe it wasn't a good idea to let your wife get ran through by random dudes for money. Okay, okay.."
Always so important to have diverse viewpoints. Good thing there is a strong black italian woman being included in the discourse finally.
Peterson does try to get many more left leaning people on but they almost always refuse. It is very disappointing as I would love to see a divergent range of thought/opinions. Kudos to Destiny for stepping up.
Destiny does always talk more to conservatives than other leftists do. @@zarbins
This is the most respectful ive ever seen destiny being.
I think he knew deep down he had to tread carefully
Because Jordan is not a republican. He's a conservative but looks at both parties for solution.
Cause he knows he's out of his league and could be made looking like a fool.
Destiny mirrors whoever he’s speaking with. He’ll only give respect where it is deserved
@@matthewcox3510 The only person who got hot and bothered in this debate was Peterson.
I love a debate with zero personal attacks.
Edit : Desiny has been getting worse and worse recently. Dude's gone insane, I retract my statements
@@vakuzarthe point is not to get anywhere, as a whole neither side is trying to build something better, each side wants to win for themselves, no matter what, that’s all
@@34fdfgbr I too use insults when I have nothing of substance to say XD
@@34fdfgbr nice personal attack.
@@34fdfgbrWelp. Tick that "personal attacks" counter to 1 because of you.
As a conservative, I am now skeptical aboul both gigantic business and government. It's especially dangerous because they are working together.
Government enables big businesses to exist.
Think back to Teddy Roosevelt you’ll see why he was a Trust Busting conservative
Great comment. Centralized power in general is always concerning to me
Hence why you shouldn't keep voting I'm the same asswipe parties...stop voting republican abd democrat
As a liberal, I am happy conservatives are now seeing the issue with big business. About 10 years back there was a fairly significant libertarian movement on the right, especially regarding Ron Paul and the tea party where they wanted big business to have 0 limitations and ultimately complete control. Scary when those same corporations without limitations would also without limitation take their money in towards lobbyists behind closed doors to basically be the government themselves without anyone seeing it.
Liberals, including myself, nowadays also see the problem with big government in hindsight, especially when war is concerned. If you ask any liberal which president killed the most people in history, it wasn't a conservative, but Barack Obama. Its a fact, and hard for other libs to swallow.
Thank you for having Mr. Bonerelli on. I always enjoy when people from different sides of the political spectrum talk to each other.
It was great to see Mr. Borelli on here!
Destiny has some reasonable views
Good to know, *HostileTakeover555.*
@@stendaalcartography3436 - Indeed - I like that since JP is a Psychologist that it makes for a more interesting interview/debate unlike one Mr. Cuchinelli has done before.
@@NickTheShark_he doesn't have any views. He is a nihilist internet debate bro. He believes in nothing.
I've watched probably 20 different debates on RUclips in the past 2 days. This one is by far the best, respectful and explained debate I've seen yet
It's more of a sit down with your psychiatrist than a debate
I would suggest you watch more of this channel, it has quite the variety of subjects and ideology to which I'm sure you would find at least some interesting and, I've gotta say, Mr. Peterson is one of best to listen to right now. Might be biased, but I find the guy very enlightening.
I personally despise Destiny, yet here I am watching this video because I know I will get to see his point of view challenged in a respectful way. And I'm curious to see the arguments he will come up with against someone I deeply respect in Mr. Peterson. The man chooses his words meticulously and precisely.
Kind of like a perfectly played game of chess, they tend to end with a draw
The subtle, unspoken, mutual apologies for getting too worked up were things of absolute beauty. I'd love to see much more between these two.
I do see what you're talking about, but I would (somewhat parasocially) guess that destiny does not really see getting "worked up" as a negative thing he'd have to apologize for. He's said before that he enjoys conversations like that much more than never truly getting into the details. My guess is that JBP is probably the same way.
Destiny doesn't view it as a problem, but he absolutely recognizes it normally conveys high tension friction and overly combativeness, which he's specifically tried to not be swept up in. Finkelstein Debate is another such example, he kept his cool, even if just for appearances, so while he personally doesn't dislike the high tension verbal "fights", when it comes to getting your point across to a different audience, he's made a point of making sure not to get swept up in raising the temperature, or mudslinging (although mudslinging didn't occur here, despite the tone almost seeming to indocate it could happen).
If an apology is both subtle and unspoken then that’s not an apology
@@kyle8688if it's heard then it's an apology
@@kyle8688 it doesn't need to be a verbalised apology to recognize there was an acknowledgement of tempers flaring or the temperature increasing, for both parties to feel the need and want to cooperate to decrease the tension in the room. If you want to argue semantics, we'll probably be here all day.
Mr Vermicelli was surprisingly respectful and well tempered. Great talk.
Yeah he walked the line gracefully
Except during the vaccine bit
Yup Mr barmelli was nice today lol
Mr. Burelli used his wiki knowledge to make the conversation interesting.
Basssseeeddddd
The clips are not doing this conversation justice. The clips make it seem like the conversation was very contentious but they are very civil to each other. This was wonderful thank you for the video!
Same thing I thought too. Clips really paint the wrong energy of the conversation
100%
That's exactly what I thought.
The clippers strongly rely on the assumption that no one has the attention span to watch the original, that's why they upload strategically clipped shorts to paint the discussion in whatever light they want. Unfortunately it's working, as you can clearly see the difference between the comments section here, vs the comments sections on shorts.
You took the words out of my mouth!
Our era NEEDS discussions like this right now.
The interview is actually real
I still cant believe it, lmao
Thanks Lex
How old is this
@@dashockpixle4140I believe it was filmed on February 2nd or 3rd
lets see how much destiny wanted to cut out
Jordans suit game is outta this world
Yeah that is a bold choice
@@okayydudecringe
It’s awful
He wore that during the visit to sioux-falls. I asked him if he would be willing to trade, straight up, for mine. Got a solid laugh. No blazers were exchanged that evening. But memories were made.
His suit game as of late has actually been pretty cringy/bad, tbh
Bro I’m so here for this. I love how more podcasts are doing the left/right crossover. I respect both these gentlemen.
It would be nice to have more of them but the only people I've seen from the left that are willing to do it are Destiny and Ana Kasparian.
Well, Cenk went on a couple during his 'presidential run' but IMO it was only to grandstand and try for 'gotchas'. He didn't seem interested in having a real discussion.
This used to be the norm.
It's weird you think this is so novel 🙄
@@TheNancypooWhen was it the norm? I’m only 26 and this is pretty unique to me (since I’ve been old enough to remember and appreciate it)
I would n🎉describe Destiny as a gentleman
@@timothystinson9292how exactly is destiny a Marxist? He’s a proclaimed liberal and capitalist. That’s the complete opposite side of the political scale brother
This is how debates should be. Passionate, truthful, educated and without personal attacks. Refreshing to see.
Please consider a second long-form discussion! The chemistry was through the roof, and there is no better combination of people so politically opposed while remaining a) intellectually respectable, b) clear in expression, and c) civil in conduct.
The unique productivity here would be a gift to the world if you started a podcast together.
"Destiny" is intellectually dishonest. He either plays the contrarian fukhed or is an actual dumass
Definately agree, 2 hours was too short!
Respectable? Destiny is a smug half brain who argues in bad faith. When Jordan calls him out on his worldview and asks him to defend it, Destiny can only scoff and say, “Well what’s your big brain plan?” Destiny doesn’t have the intellectual rigor to even be in the same room, and certainly not debating.
hahaha agreed
absolutely agreed
These guys had such natural chemistry they could easily do this regularly and have enormous success. Don’t sleep on this rare dynamic that’s been uncovered. It’s special.
Yeah there is something happening here that feels entirely productive.
Good point
I doubt they collaborate again for a while. It’s a shame though, this convo was really good.
Initially I didn't feel it that much, but by the end of the conversation I think it was good.
I agree their chemistry/dynamic completely captured my attention
I noticed something very important in this debate. Both were willing to clarify definitions on multiple occasions.
That makes everything consistent and they are both in the same terms in what they're talking about. There's something relaxing and satisfying when the conversation is this clear
Which makes it all very entertaining and engaging right to the end.
Both are also activily engaging ain listening and trying to understand what other person is saying, instead of the usual where there is one person who is doing very little listening but a huge lot of assuming
So much better than name calling
If only more people cared about definitions. Instead we assume the worst and end up arguing about 2 different things, while thinking we are arguing about the same thing. Which is just a waste of time.
I've developed a new respect for Jordan Peterson. Not that I agree with him on most things but I can see how his mind works. Destiny's discussion with him is what the world needs today. Bravo gentlemen!!
Wanna loose it again? Watch him talk to Dawkins.
@@JackFate76Only for those who don't understand JP.
@@91GT347 Exactly! JBP is a rarity, an intellectual forthcoming intellectual, whereas others (like Dawkins) rarely concede where their knowledge falls short in their domain of expertise, Jordan totally forthrightly says I DONT KNOW and I feel that irks people but it’s the truth and a truth many don’t have the courage to admit
Don’t worry destiny goes right back to attacking oppositional beliefs with personal attacks and fast talking sperging out right after this
@@JackFate76 What are you talking about? Dawkins was trying to back Peterson into a corner by asking him if he believes a literal interpretation of religious stories, which shows he doesn't understand Peterson's viewpoint in the slightest. Richard discussed the evolutionary arms race between predator and prey, but was so short sighted and dense that he couldn't link the idea that humans co-evolved with stories which they embodied, that gave them an evolutionary advantage. Jordan was getting frustrated because it's so obvious. If in 10,000 years humans turned wolves into dogs through artificial selection, imagine what cultural selection can do to humans through the span of hundreds of thousands of years. We culturally set a highest ideal (a god) and our stories push us to embody that ideal, and culturally we select and admire people who live up to that ideal. Imagine that process through thousands of years. Getting caught up in the historical validity of the stories is completely beside the point - and Jordan had a right to be utterly frustrated. Richard is dense and lacks any ability to imagine and abstract.
The debate on vaccines and climate change was actually fun to listen to. I like when debate opponents actually acknowledge what the other one is saying and address it instead of running down their own dialogue tree.
You literally have to have 30 iq to not get the "vaccines" was a money grab
@nft3 NPC
@@zakeaton5632you'd think that would make you more apprehensive about the vaccine not less .
I'd love to see JP talk to a virologist and climatologist, but I also understand why professionals wouldn't want to associate with people like him.
@@zakeaton5632 what are you trying to say? The way you wrote this I can’t even tell if you are saying the vaxs were or weren’t tested.
I applaud both for this conversation. It got heated and yet remained cordial with no personal attacks. Very well done. We need more of this
Destiny was too hasty to conclude that there were predictions by the conservatives about the side effects of the vaccines of which none of the predictions came through. There were actually side effects, although it might not have been pronounced as expected.
I agree. Things have gotten so bad I can't even talk to my best friend about politics it's sad
Which is odd , since Destiny usually leans on personal attacks in debate
Got heated because JP yelled at someone half his age that he doesn't TRUST PEOPLE THAT USE FORCE when that wasn't even the argument in the first place 😂
@@jizim8947do more listening than talking. Also take notes. But Destiny is running laps around JP here. Destiny said we live in different worlds with different facts and that more people should be present in the same space. JP ignored that because he was too busy to yell.
Probably one of JP’s most interesting talks I’ve heard in a while. Very good pairing here.
Impressed by destiny
These guys should argue more often. I'm a destiny fan but it's so good to see someone intelligently push back and make him go a level or 2 deeper or make him use precise language particularly because Peterson is intently listening and engaging.
Give us a once a month argument about anything 🤣
Yes, I particularly liked their back and forth on vaccines. It really challenged my beliefs on both sides and I think they both made excellent points. It’s very rare to see those sorts of conversations where you can see people with opposing perspectives and agree with both in different aspects.
@@arenegadeboss Right? Feel like Destiny's the only person I've personally seen that had Dr. P stopping and thinking a bit more than usual about his reasoning.
@@drearmouse9510Yes I agree, and coming from the side of a Destiny fan, this is one of the first times I’ve truly seen someone make him stop and think about his reasoning.
This is why it’s so important to have smart people from both sides debate complex topics, it’s the only way we can move forward as a country and as a people. Very impressed by both and I hope they do this again.
I'm from Germany. My mum told me that my grandma was completely shocked when, after the war, they were shown documentaries about the concentration camps. She was not aware at all. My other grandma noticed that a Jewish family suddenly wasn't in the street any more. That was the extend if her knowing.
They showed videos on national TV at that time of "how well people were in the concentration camps".
wow im german and i didnt even know it was swept under the rug like that. But we did have a lot of jewish hate going on with people marking jewish stores and stuff like that
This was actually one of the most interesting and dynamic debates either of the participants have engaged in quite some time. Kudos to both Dr. Peterson and Destiny for both giving as good as they got.
Right? I did not expect this level of conversation between a blue haired gamer and an exiled Psychology Professor.
Exiled? You mean thrown out of the Canadian Cult? Because that's exactly what happened.@@SubvertTheState
this was amazing
It's a gem amongst the debates, I hope it will go viral.
I think "thrown out" and exiled can mean the same thing lol@@mikesmith9501
I started to think this interview never happened because it took a long time to be released
Were you edging or were you gooning?
Not everyone uses spotify
@@nyChannel09I don't use Spotify for podcast and I wasn't really complaining
To be fair we had reason to doubt given Destiny used a JP interview as a bait & switch before
@@RedactedUsernameWe certainly had a reason
Incredible discussion. When can we get a round 2?
Get this to the top
Why? To get more:
Peterson: here is hard data
Destiny: yeah but I feel like....
?
@@zlkanglwrth2776 Peterson did this just as much as Destiny
@@Kirito_2016 absolutely.
And his attempt to be full-on anti-vaxxxxer was cringe. Starts with some vaccines might be safe. Then they are safe, but just too many at once. Then it’s just the mRNA that scientifically bad. Then it’s just distrust because of coercion, but the vaccines themselves weren’t the problem.
It wasn't that MRNA is/was bad, just that it wasn't tested enough
Very good debate,Destiny stood his ground.Would love a second interview in the near future.
Thank you for having Ms. Boncinelli on the show. I always appreciate when two people on opposite sides of the autism spectrum can have a civil debate
I’m forever now describing the variation in autism as the Peterson end and the Destiny end. Golden observation
Lmaoo well done
I don’t understand. Is this your attempt at being funny?
In the brilliant words of Mrs Candace Owens to destiny “aren’t you too old to be acting and thinking the way you do?”
Opposite sides of the spectrum, and opposite sexes
“ guys please you’re ruining Easter for the whole family”
😂😂😂😂😂
BUT I DON'T TRUST PEOPLE THAT USE FORCE, NOW LEMME HALF MY URANIUM ENRICHED KOOL AID. Grandpa, you called the cops on the "shady" people that moved next door. SO?! oh irony. Destiny says there's hypocrisy and abuses of power on both sides. JP: BUT THE LEFT... Just cause you use multi syllable words and have a degree in sociology don't make you an expert in big data modeling, idiot.
Too late, Biden already ruined it.
You mean trans visibility day😂😂😂
@@Caramelized_Sausage waaahhh
This needed to be 3x longer! IMO. It was extremely satisfying to see this conversation happen. Thank you to both Dr Peterson and Destiny. ❤
Thank God it wasn't. Peterson really just talks a lot and could benefit from becoming more concise. Maybe you are a Peterson fan, and it wasn't as noticeable, but coming from Destiny's audience, it made many parts tough to listen to
@joesecord3066 i am a regular destiny viewer and i generally disagree with you. The only times i feel like jordan needs to speed it up is when it is religious, due to my lack of interest.
IKR! Now I want Daily Wire+
@@joesecord3066I really enjoyed Peterson. Although he got a little heated, it was coool to see him actually argue against destiny on shit that conservatives run away from when on destiny’s stream.
Really really enjoyable.
@@joesecord3066
Destiny viewer here. I enjoyed. Acting like destiny fans are used to higher discussion is a joke.
This is core destiny.
This is the longest period of time I have ever been able to listen to Steve. Good show.
Destiny it was NOT Biden alone that said the vaccine would get rid of transmission. NIH officials and CDC officials said the same thing.
Did they say it got rid? Or reduced?
Fauci himself said it
@@kylemcmahon9868 They absolutely said reduce lol
@SquishJessica in the beginning they said " got rid of"
@@adamcox6960fauci said it 1 time. If you look at the bulk of the messages from the go and people like fauci, then its clear they ran a campaign that said it would reduce.
You rarely ever see Peterson like this. It's fantastic to watch.
He's used to people agreeing with him on everything
@@Mack-i2uhe’s probably not use to talking to midwits that just rattle off talking points that the person saying them doesn’t even understand. Zero original thoughts, all partisan hackery
That's actually the opposite. His rise to fame was because of talking with people that disagreed with him.@@Mack-i2u
@@Mack-i2uUhhhhh… what?😂😂
@@alexrennison8070for what is a non combative interview yes
Joe Rogan would never disagree with him
This interview is giving me nostalgia from Old School JP debates. I'm very encouraged at the intellectual honesty both men had, no personal attacks, no assuming other person's perspective, just speaking about the issues
Just, you know, climate change science is equivalent to nazis...that part is pretty dishonest
Destiny is not an intellectual. Sorry about that. He made his name off of TDS
@FastAndEasy2010 not climate science, the movement behind climate science, you didn't pay enough attention apparently
Yes but the interview is a good example of why the left avoids debate and relies on censorship and paid influencers
@@FastAndEasy2010your right the Nazis raised their people's standard of living
Steven did not expect to see the monster in Jordan to come out, and i think there was so much emotion and passion coming from Jordan. I absolutely loved watching this play out!
All this conversation proved is you two should have 1,000 more. You both welcome disagreement and can overcome the generational gap. When’s the next episode…
Most debates would benefit from multiple rounds of long form discussion. Unless your intent is to "win." Often times a chunk of the debate is just understanding what the other person is saying.
It's pretty rare to have two people in a room who understand this concept. Hopefully we get more. Took like multiple years to make this convo happen though@@thorinhannahs4614
What info from "Destiny" was accurate and not liberal talking points?
@@tedmonster66 So if you're making the claim all his info was incorrect, the onus is on you to provide the evidence, maybe show us something to tell us what was incorrect. Though also something being a talking point doesn't mean the info isn't inaccurate, I especially for talking points from the left, who prefer to actually reference scientists rather than whatever slop comes out of trumps mouth/twitter that morning.
You had me until you said especially talking points from the left. That is absurd. Both sides routinely speak out their back end with no sources or research to back them up. Watch any politician on the left talk about firearms for an easy example. They have absolutely no idea what they are talking about. It's a massive err to think your side is more intellectual than the other side. Both sides have roughly the same proportion of smart intellectuals to dumb follow the narrative types because that distribution exists in the human species. One side doesn't draw more than the other. @@redeyesb.dragonite8562
51 minutes in, things are tense, the fadeaway to the advertisement had me DYING of laughter
Such is the daily wire
@@nothingspecial1241it's likely alopecia barbae. Funny how his recent interviews always have that spot of his beard facing the camera though lol. It can grow back but he should just shave the sides until it does.
@@stillnotchill2560 It is alopecia, Destiny brought it up several times on stream.
Edit: Also he did shave the sides xD
Yo this shit makes me so sick. Why do they cover up the actual content with the ad. Why don't they just pause the content and show the ad?
@@MiddleWayLiving because they want you to subscribe to DW to get that sweet sweet currency up out of your bank account.
One of Jordan's best interviews by a large margin.
@@andrewstarr8062you all over the comments crying jp had an interesting conversation, your brain is rotted
@@andrewstarr8062who hurt you lol
yeah i would not declare that so quickly. But i enjoyed it a lot. @@andrewstarr8062
Yep, it was an immaculate debate by two excellent intellectuals on opposite political spectrum.
@@Lol-ww8xd🤣
I am a libertarian and align with JP on much more than I do with Destiny, but the error in climate change projections is not based on uncertainty of how much we are impacting the climate, it is uncertainty in how much we will be able to change our carbon emissions. I studied atmospheric science for a couple years before changing my major in college and the science is very clear on climate change. This idea that the right has been pushing for years about how uncertain the science is and how the left is lying about climate change is hurting the party potentially more than any other issue other than abortion. Don't get me wrong, both sides are guilty of this, the right likes to take the projections on the lowest end and the left likes to take the projections on the highest end, but both sides need to stop IGNORING the science for their own personal gain. The conversation might actually go somewhere if politicians weren't so corrupt.
I don't disagree with everything you're saying, but saying you studied atmospheric science (implying you're more knowledgeable on the subject than most) does more harm to your credibility than good...considering the schools and studies being conducted on "the science" that is being taught is overwhelmingly biased in one direction. Then also saying "the science is very clear" is just not factual. Most studies completely discard many important facts as though they worked backwards from the conclusion they were attempting to make. I don't think those that oppose or speak out against those type of studies are necessary lying as much as they are just pointing out relevant details that are intentionally ommited, for example; how the earth has always gone through heating or cooling cycles. The studies always conveniently point at us being the culprit and completely discount any other "inconvenient" factors...and then of course the solution always points to something controversial and/or ludicrous and those that speak out against any of the "studies" or "solutions" are silenced and pushed into the category of being a problem, anti-science, or conspiracy theorist.
@@B-DINO are you an actual scientist as well, or are you implying you just know "how science works"?
@@DreadfulSymptoms If I told you I was a scientist, would you take what I say seriously? Or would you only form your opinion of me based on where I fell in line within the mainstream consensus group? The way you framed that question was based on contempt for someone who would dare question "the science" or question "how the science works". There's a great video from years ago where Carl Sagan warns of this exact scientific superiority complex where skepticism and questioning is not permitted. I'm not even claiming to know the answers or be an expert. But I feel as though we are moving toward a scientific dictatorship where anyone who questions or criticises the mainstream consensus is labeled as being inferior, a conspiracy theorist, a shill, a denier, etc, and is shunned and censored...regardless of their credentials. So yeah, your immediate response to ask if I'm an "actual scientist" just proves the point I was making. If I tell you I'm an accredited scientist with published peer-reviewed scientific journals with a doctorate, then you'd discredit me the exact same way you'd discredit me if I was the average skeptical layman. The only difference would be the angle from which you would target your slander.
@@B-DINO People who have gone against the contemporary understanding of the world have always been viewed with suspicion. The thing is that science rests on the scientific method. You're allowed to question and be skeptic but if you're going to go against the established scientific consensus (it doesn't matter what field) and make opposite or different claims then you better have a scientific argument. In a way the field of science is the most democratic systems of them all. If you make a finding then you're able to contribute. Also your point about Carl Sagans warning. His warning is more about warning against people not understanding science, not getting educated and not being critical thinkers when it comes to those who make claims with little or no scientific backing. He would very likely warn against science done by those who are funded by privately owned companies.
What we need in the west is more people with greater understanding of how the scientific method works, that scientists are not a monolith. There are differing opinions within the scientific community when it comes to climate change just like opinions vary in other fields. It's a self-correcting system that is so varied that any major conspiracy would be impossible to keep close to hidden because at ANY point a scientist who wants to become world famous, win Nobel Prizes and get recognition by publishing their revolutionary findings that prove conclusively that humans have 0 impact on the climate. Yet that doesn't seem to happen.
These two guys could argue forever. The second half of this was gold. I'd love to see another one with these two. This was great. Round 2 please. Somebody make it happen.
Peterson said at the end of the conversation/debate that they will talk more.
@yupimawesome hm really? Are you sure about that bud? Hm? Are you confident? Yea? Feeling confident about what you just commented? Well I'll have you know, I lost my dad in a boating accident on 2/7/04 and after he died we went through his belongings and found out he had a child bride in Thailand.
What a world!
@krappa1234 yes I truly showed him and put him in his place, like the giga Chad I am, ofc😎😈
I do hope he brings mr. Borrelli back for a second round
a sentence longer than 10 words and words with more than 2 syllables might break this commenter
Dear Dr Jordan Peterson - I hope you invite Steve again! I found this to be one of the best conversations because he was challenging you a lot, but respectfully! It was amazing to see a more left person enganging with you in a respectful and disagreable manner, without resorting to insults or just attacking you with dishonest and bad faith arguments. Your talks are very interesting, no doubt, but seeing someone pushing you more on your ideas was super entertaining. Sometimes it feels certain guests or interviewers don't challenge you as much as Steve did - and because they dont challenge that much, your talking points become slightly repetitive and are not explored more deeply. This was awesome!
I 100% agree
Bring actual covid data because 90% of what he said about covid was incorrect
@@pabloincell35You're generous ❤
90% of my comments... just... disappear.
Even HERE ❤
@@pabloincell35it would be great for you to provide the information instead the like “just Google it bro” approach, if you have any interest in actually swaying anyone as opposed to just shouting into the void here. But ey that’s probably exactly what I’m doing now lol
Please can we get a part 2? These conversations are great, and we need more of this in the media
Really? The psychologist and the uninformed dumbass?
Until recently my opinion on Jordan Peterson was broadly negative. But seeing him bring guests like Destiny on and treating them with respect, makes me respect Peterson much more than I did previously.
Got to hand it to Destiny. Almost everything I'd seen about him amounted to clips. I didn't have a good impression of him. I must admit that in a long form interview he acquitted himself far better than I assumed he would. I disagree with him on a lot of things but that doesn't matter much as long as people are communicating in good faith. I never sensed hidden agendas or duplicitousness. He's earned a measure of respect from me.
It highlights the fundamental manipulation of information that exists by decontextualizing individuals for ideological gain. Seeing the world through the lens of shortened clips can be extremely misleading and even Destiny expressed skepticism regarding any "clip less than 10 seconds." Everyone who is associated with a certain ideology usually falls victim to this in one way or another (ex. Jordan Peterson, Destiny, Trump, Biden, etc..)
He’s one of the few influencers on the left side of the spectrum that I actually respect and watch frequently .
Some of the points he digs his heels into really piss me off . But overall I appreciate his willingness to discuss, and change his opinions
Oh yeah i disagree with Destiny heavy on like 10 topics but i still watch him.
@@bidensson4643Exactly. Whenever clips of someone get my blood boiling I always try to remember that a short clip is not the best representation of their actual point of view.
I do wish we had more people that were authentic and well thought out in their positions, on both sides of the aisle. I think these people are pretty rare.
There's a lot of people that I agree with on a lot of subjects, that are still hot garbage when it comes to rationalizing those beliefs and/or engaging with the opposition.
It's funny (in a scary way) how many people I think agree with me, not because of carefully thought out policy approaches, but rather by pure dumb partisan luck.
Destiny really looked happy to be there and discuss with JP. I think it shows a lot of respect. And vice versa.
I've been following Destiny for quite a long time at this point, this had to have been his best conversation in years. JBP's a fantastic speaker.
yeah because it was one of his more easy discussions. ran rings around JP. I find JP to keep letting emotions interfere with his thought. he speaks on things he knows nothing about. Wish he would make his bed and make a proper comeback on topics he is well versed in. constantly out of his depth.
@squadedits-ht3tr that's missing the point entirely. They weren't there to "win". If you think that this talk is wasted on you.
@@stysner4580 i dont think you understand how quotes work haha. i never said win, snowflake.
@@stysner4580 learn how quotes work lol. just another over emotional JP stan
So good to see JP looking healthy again.
Amen KetoVore
no
Pink shirt does wonders for his pallor 😅
Most entertaining debate I have seen. These guys did great. They were civil and listened to each other even though they disagreed. Why can’t the media do more of this?
I haven’t listened to such a substantive conversation propelled through good faith dialogue in so long. Bravo to both men.
Unless it really was someone's idea of a hook up it wasn't anyone's fault ... love is very strong. I'm a sucker for the fucking dorky depressed dork
So damn good
What is this promotion of good faith argument in the comments ...JP has become unhinged
@@unspoken7704 you're just reading him wrong. He's not an easy man to decipher but that's definitely not him becoming unhinged.
Is Destiny’s vaccine argument good faith?
I think it’s delusional!
This is exactly why free speech is so damn important.
Without it we can never talk to each other
be honest do you even want to talk to them
Peterson didn't let Destiny speak at all though lol
@@victorespino5650no, it’s Destiny that doesn’t have anything to contribute.
He’s an idiot.
Free speech protects you from the government and it has been like that since the dawn of this nation
@@victorespino5650 right? He was shouting the entire time and interrupted him left right and centre. Super disappointed...
Impressed that JP’s community is receiving this well in the comments. Nowadays it seems a roll of the dice whether a community will receive such a contentious conversation. Impressed by these two gentleman as always.
Sort by newest and you’ll see the anger behold you lol
Funnily enough, its the opposite audience that comes in rude, doing nothing reaponding to his points but just disparaginf his relationship.
Destiny's audience is pruned over time to be the open ones. He has had debatea from communists to nick fuentes. They aren't going to be offended by peterson.
@@JackSack-w5hcertainly not offended by jp. He was refreshingly good faith.
You can’t say the same for Destiny’s audience.
Destiny wanted so badly to be right about vaccine harm denialism and was just out of his league.
I’ve never heard Destiny speak without wanting him to shut up until now. I enjoyed him being leveled headed in this, however, I do wish it was either longer or that you’d of allowed him to speak more. Maybe a part 2
The pure joy Jordan got from an actual debate must be so rewarding 😂
Intellectual honesty. Nice!
This wasn't a debate, really. JP debated Dillahunty, Sam Harris, and Zizek. They were all L's for him.
@@chekz3520facts
lol, what ever you say buddy@@chekz3520
@chekz3520 you are ignorant, wrong and clearly never watched those conversations 😂😂😂😂😂
I have rarely seen JP as much agitated as in this discussion. Very interesting discussion, I also liked Mr. Bonell.
borelli
Mr. Spaghetti
I think it's because in the beginning peterson has seen destiny has this disagreeable person and will have this energy. I believe peterson is trying to match the energy because it is anticipation of destiny to fight you and have this element of fast and drama- as well as extremely distrustful of others. So I think petersons enhanced front of aggressiveness might be appreciated by everyone.
Honestly I think he was actually loving the fact that he found a guest that was just as comfortable with arguing as he is. Probably a breath of fresh air for him that he didn’t have to worry about the conversation detailing and he could actually go hard without egos or feelings being hurt.
Wow, what a rarity! A non-moderated, true debate with plenty of yelling and passion, but not a single personal attack! And for 2 hours!
I hope this is a sign that the medium and participants are maturing. Doubtful but I can hope.
@@Toxicottonthey both have independent platforms. This was organized by themselves and not a network
Probably because it wasn't a debate at all. It was an interview where some disagreements came up. Not sure an actual debate would go the same way.
I love to see passion from both sides!!
There was such a thing, but JBP was having none of that. Destiny attacked Peterson for his ways of bringing up the impoverished victims of the left (after he started the topic that way himself).
This was actually fascinating to watch. I have to say I love both of these guys! Destiny did sound a lot more grounded and realistic than Peterson in most of these discussions. Loved this interview. Shifted how I see both of them!
Outstanding conversation. I applaud both Dr Peterson and Destiny for participating in this and being willing to listen to one another. This is what the world needs.
Well I mean Destiny is just a Liberal, not these disgusting leftists, I think center left and right have a lot in common, the leftists are just loud and bully their way to the limelight
Destiny doesnt listen to points other than looking for something to argue against.
He may have sociopathic tendencies.
@@beneficent2557 Yup. I'm so lost. This seems to be such a common trend, atleast from my own anecdotal experience. Like 3 out of every 4-5 peers or friends I ever knew that were progressive, were also quite sociopathic. I was a progressive too, I hated Trump for 7 years, it wasn't until 2022 when I finally changed and found myself alot more neo-conservative and now I identify alot more as paleo-conservative, only about 25% neocon/semi-isolationist in foreign policy. So the majority of the peers and friends I hung around were all progressive, we all did drugs, messed around, were involved in crime, etc. All my peers like if not 60% of the entire highschool was all doing some form of crime, from shoplifting, burglary, fraud, cracking credit cards, selling weed, drugs, counterfeits, etc. Everyone had a "hustle". And it was so weird too, but after middle school, there was a huge trend where everyone white suddenly started acting more "black" and thuggish, and even some of the blacks were getting annoyed by it because they viewed it as them trying to "copy culture for clout", they were listening to all the drill rap, talking in ebonics, etc. Like literal white upper middle class suburban boys doing this, lol.
I had a friend who introduced me to another friend who was 10 years older than me, and a hardcore heroin addict, and introduced me to opiates, I didn't get clean until 2022, but I remember he was this hardcore liberal guy, he wanted drugs to be legalized, he hated Trump, called all conservatives/republicans "rednecks" and he was extremely atheist, he hated Christians, in fact, to feed his habit, he would literally steal from churches, he'd straight up break in and burglarize their donation boxes, music equipment, speakers, mics, guitars, laptops, desktops, everything you could think of, and he'd go in during daytime and drop a few coins in the donation box to make a sound as if he was donating and then scrunch up as many bills in his hand and crumble them up and quickly leave. He robbed over 100 churches in every suburb of northwestern Chicago. He eventually got caught and caught a Class X felony and I believe he got 20 years in prison. He would always say things like "God doesn't want your money, he doesn't even exist! I'm doing everyone a favor by taking money out of church! Money is the root of all evil, so therefore I'm doing the right thing" "Christians are all a bunch of bigots, their all a bunch of rich white guys, they don't need the money" (yet he was a white guy himself from the balkans lol)
Literally what I noticed time and time again, was that if you were in private with these progressive liberals and a rather close friend to them or they were intoxicated, they would show their true colors, and be very racist. But show a completely different image in public.
This guy, and a bunch of other friends I knew, were all into selling drugs and research chemicals on the darknet and on the streets. Also into credit card fraud and stealing people's identity. This was also trendy in highschool. The excuse would always be "they're just gonna call their bank and get refunded, so therefore we're attacking from the banks and insurance companies, screw the big corporations". This was the same convenient excuse used for shoplifting and organized retail theft schemes like stealing power tools from home depot and laptops from Walmart.
This church robber guy would always be posting memes on Facebook about BLM and anti-racism, but yet there was this one time he bought dope from a black guy and got back in my car and then said "thank god for my good ole n--ger nogger friend" and I was like "....what...?" he replied "Oh. That was my nig nog friend" I say wtf? And he says "Yeah, that's what I call em, and all my other blackies, I call em nig nogs" I was like "do you say that to his face?" And he said "Course not, he'd shoot me" I was like "shoot you? Arent you being prejudice? You just posted a meme on your Facebook last week talking about 'prejudice'..." and he was like "whatever, who cares"
I'm an early Gen Z from "99 and I don't hang out with anyone my age anymore. Alot of my peers were very progressive, and I noticed a trend of sociopathy among them. With perhaps the exception being white liberal females who were mainly into virtue signaling because they'd get super emotional and want validation and were also prone to emotional manipulation, I never hung out with any girls, mostly just guys. So I may be wrong. This is just my own anecdotal personal experience. I dropped out of highschool in my junior year to pursue entrepreneurship, glad I never went to college, and glad i dropped out of highschool.
So yeah I noticed a trend of sociopathy among progressives atleast from my own anecdotal experience. There were rarely any conservatives, only a couple I remember, who I remember posting MAGA hat selfies around 2016, and getting disowned by alot of our peers, they were straight A students and had 3.90-4.00 GPAs, one of them was a great athlete and the 2nd fastest runner in our entire school, was very involved in politics young, was doing school debates and was nominated class president.
The reason there was rarely any conservatives was because we were constantly indoctrinated, our teachers were making us watch CNN student news everyday and after 2016 during Trump's rise to president they were playing CNN like 3 times a day. And our teachers were constantly telling us about how bad and evil Trump was and how he was a threat to freedom and human rights. We were constantly watching movies about slavery that fabricated history, movies like roots, movies that would depict white Americans sailing to shores of Africa and storming tiki huts in the jungles of Africa at night to steal blacks and take them back to America to work in the cotton fields of the "deep evil red south". I was shocked when I learned just a couple years ago that slavery existed worldwide and was basically a norm, and still exists to this day, and that all races were enslaved. We were never told this in school, they essentially never told us but never denied it either and thereby crafted a belief in us that made us think it only existed in America, by only showing us movies and curriculum about slavery in America and nothing else.
I went off topic, but I'd like to add one last thing. I've noticed a constant pattern too, that liberals are alot more soft on the superficial level, but nasty on the inside once you get to know their true colors, lifestyle and personality. And with conservatives I've noticed they're very hard, tough, and sometimes even harsh (that may not be the right word) like a "i dont take crap from anyone" attitude on the superficial level, but once you get to know them, open up, and become closer, they're actually very down to earth, trustworthy, and nice. A key pillar belief in conservativism is the acknowledgment that all humans are inherently flawed no matter what, and you can only adapt to this, and no amount of changes to their environment and external factors can change that. I believe this is a key reason in why some conservatives portray a hard shell towards people, and are generally skeptical of strangers and seem to have a high guard on, whereas once they let you into their home and you become close they're very down to earth and kind. Progressives on the other hand don't really believe in this key tenet, and they believe all humans are perfect and it's their environments and external factors that make them flawed and commit acts of evil and wrong, and whatnot. And they appear alot more quirky and soft on the outside but are very very prejudiced, judgemental, rude, gossipy, and traitorous once you become closer to them. From my personal experience from dealing with dozens of them in my close life and dealing with hundreds of them in public in short term relationships or small interactions.
@@beneficent2557 if this was true you would provide some examples, not some vague fanfic
Unfortunately, most of us wouldn’t have the “skills” to keep this conversation going, let alone the knowledge to make relevant points. Another observation is that the energy and focus needed to sustain the conversation requires an athleticism that, again, most of us lack! It’s exhausting to watch! Thank goodness for the ads, that were like the bell between rounds!
Has to be one of Jordans Petersons best videos in a long time ! These 2 held up a great conversation hope to see Destiny on here again !!!
This has to be one of my absolute favourites of Dr. Peterson's debates. I thoroughly enjoyed the breadth of topics covered, the short amount of time it took for the conversations to get deep and heated, and the fact that both gentlemen showed passion for the topics and their positions but did not, at any point, turn it into an argument with personal attacks. Bravo to both, I would love to see another interview with Destiny where you cover even more contentious problems!
well said and agreed, would love to see destiny back on
agreed 100% - this is how it's suppose to be when solving problems or resolving conflict via examining and discussing opposing ideas to reach the truth - it's this kind of dialectical engagement, this exchange of wisdom, that could really lead to major breakthroughs in the most challenging or stubborn of impasses or conundrums.
i didn't know who this destiny guy was - but i must admit, he impressed me more than most of the liberal leftists.
(possibly because he has that conservative background?)
great interview.
👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
Destiny looks like he smells
@@LodyC30Destiny is a filthy Marxist
@@matthewpeers1705
lol. mouldy cheese and cabbages 🤣
I used to be just like him. Then years into young adulthood I was around people like Peterson, and life got clearer. What I learned most was just how much understanding of a complex world and most of all, human nature.
The way Jordan Peterson can review the conversation on command and recall a point from the beginning of the convo to then apply it with surgical precision is quite incredible
Great observation. I just started watching the video but I totally get your point and have seen it many times. I wish I could do that or could even retain just a tiny bit of the things I read like JP can.
He's a clinical psychologist
My wife can do this and I find it OP and unfair lol
@@mandrewski2742 all i can say in regards to such a skill is with great power comes great responsibility 🤣
I thought he lost this argument and I didn't want him to
I think Peterson really enjoyed having a fiery conversation with someone on the left who could hold their own without having to resort to personal jabs. Allowing him to let his emotions fly and then come back and fourth between emotions on important topics. At the end I think he was impressed with Destiny and tipped his hat to a worthy opponent. I REALLY enjoyed this one.
Exact words I'd say. Yes. I enjoy both men respectively for their points even before this debate. Awaiting for round 2
Destiny isn't on the left lol he's a lukewarm liberal at best
Worthy opponent, perhaps, but maybe Dr. Peterson saw a bit of the student in Destiny. I just hope Destiny bears enough humility to remember what he learned.
Jordan usually gets exhausted when it comes to arguments because they usually lead to conflict and Jordan doesn't like conflict (though he hates delayed conflict even more) but watching him while he's in it is so mesmerizing
I think Destiny won this. More convincing in his arguments. Great debate.
None stop, the most attentive I’ve been to an episode from either of these two. It was the best from the both of them.
1:12:00 Peterson just makes up Bible exegesis. I know of no early Church Father who says God punishes Moses because he hit an inanimate object (a rock) with a stick! Haha. What? It wasn't because of Moses "force". It was because He did not follow God's given command, but decided to wing it and do it his own way.
Like JBP is doing w this interpretation.
1:18:00 yes. They were crazies saying "the jab will kill everyone" but come on Destiny. Obviously the VAST amount of people opposed to the mandate were opposed because it was a MANDATE and interfered with personal choice. It wasn't about micro chips. Haha. So dishonest. If someone disagrees, just strawman then into conspiracy land. Lame tactic.
Only time I've ever been able to handle Destiny for more than 4 seconds....
Nice work Jordan, Sir.
Mr Cincinatti was super respectful in this conversation, great talk.
Mr Martelli
I spit out my coffee at this comment; I regret that I only have one like to give
Mr Spaghetti
Imagine being a jp viewer and seeing all these dgg comments lol
@@aries8910the psyop is in full effect dggL
Honestly, this is actually a great back and forth
In the sense Jordan is right on. ❤
He means Jordan was pushed against in the strongest of ways, you cannot distill the truth unless it is placed in the crucible of reality. They both outlined real problems with each other's ideas and I seriously benefited from it.
@SubvertTheState no you didnt. You only think you did, nothing changes for you.
@@myhatelect im gonna touch you tonight
Only if you know nothing
Great talk between Mr. Peterson and Mr. Morelli
No.
😂
@@nft3 Heh I am so cool by writing short edgy responses that are open to diverse interpretation
that's Mr. Motormouth Morelly for you.
@@comicsans6487 no it's Mr. Moronelli
"I ferret down a lot of rabbit holes". This much is ABUNDANTLY clear.
Scathing criticism from DJ Syko
I wish I had professors like Jordan when I was in school
Earlier version of Jordan, yes.
I KNOW. It'd be a DREAM😊
A professor who get's mad when you disagree with him? No thanks
Hes just another stock standard right wing talking head...he just seems smarter.
@@simonfredheim9581 lol great point
Great interview with Mr.Bodelli, one of my favourites.
Agree. They should do a lot more of these
People not familiar with the recent Finklestein incident (in which he constantly made up new names for Mr. Benulli) must be really confused by this comment section.
Motormouth Borealis.
Please Talk to Destiny Again this was one of the best conversations of all time
Notice how destiny is a complete moron?
Didnt really get to hear a lot of Destiny's responses because they played the ads right over them, youd think theyd at least pause the conversation for the ads instead of playing them right over the top of them
If you listen closely you'll realize they don't cut Destiny's responses at all they just have video playing behind the ad but it starts back where it cuts off. Have a nice day.
@d-ray1084 I'll have to rewatch, but if that's true then that's good
I could listen to these two talk for days. Concessions were made, respect was displayed, corrections were allowed and welcomed. Good stuff.
Not really destiny is illogical, full of himself and insufferable
@@zlkanglwrth2776 y so mad?
@@zlkanglwrth2776nah it really seems like they both are just searching for the truth. So much respect for both of these people for doing their homework and always talking from a place of logic
@@zlkanglwrth2776you’ve clearly got a personal gripe. You mad he called Tate a sex trafficker?
Jordan is guilty of the same, at times. Few people who engage in political discourse are tolerable humans.
This is the most respectful heated debate I have ever seen. Absolutely amazing ❤
Except for destiny is just such a stupid person, he's basically Cuban with the added title of us citizen...
I would gladly eavesdrop on the 4hr expansion of this conversation. I vote for a Part II. Or even a series of debates on refined topics.
Definitely a fantastic conversation
I agree. It was a great debate!
The 48 minute mark was brutal to hear. Peterson is so illustrative with his words
This is probably one of the best conversations/debate I have seen in a long time and more of these need to happen.
Petition to have multiple conversation between the two forming a playlist
I’d play it at night to fall asleep to.
I was literally about to comment, "Where do I sign the petition to have this be a weekly podcast?"
Glad I wasn't the only one lol
This!! 100%
Yes❤
yepyepyep
I could've listened to another 4 hours of this. Debates like this don't happen enough anymore. Both Jordan Peterson and Destiny were able to get deep into the details of their stances without it becoming bad faith.
Not sure if JP changing definitions and contradicting himself constitutes bad faith or not. Asking for a friend
@@czechrebel It doesn't. there were no changing of definitions and contradictions. you suck at listening
Destiny did that too. That isn't an indication of bad faith, that is an indication that both of them were operating at the edge of their ability and that their initial formulations of the idea they were attempting to grapple with failed to live up to their own standards of validity, so they attempted to reformulate them.
@@czechrebel destiny is the worst. He's a good debater with horrible mindless NPC ideas. So are his defenders (you, probably)
@@brandongillett2616 *Super like*
This is the first time I can say Destiny impressed me. He carries himself very well here and having an actual debate as opposed to moving towards insults and raising his voice as he normally does. Jordan Peterson is crazy smart...Destiny showed he can carry an intellectual conversation. Great video!!!!
that was genuinely a fast 2 hour convo
well done to both
I would love it if a conversation like this between these two became a regular segment. This kind of conversation between people who are quite articulate, but who have opposing view points and are willing to follow the proverbial rabbit holes where they might go is genuinely and desperately needed as an antidote to the informational positive feedback loops that social media platforms have become. Jordan and Destiny also seem to be uniquely able to keep things rational and cordial even while vehemently disagreeing on topics, which is refreshing and inspiring. Furthermore, I truly appreciate that they both approach this conversation in good faith with a desire to develop a rapprochement between the divergent viewpoints.
It’s a shame how little likes this comment received compared to “wow this conversation got heated”.
Peterson was screaming and throwing a tantrum the whole episode. He's neither cordial, nor rational.
I think you overestimate Destiny.
@@mariusciobotaru3you must have watched another video
@@mariusciobotaru3 so you watched 1 segment and have an opinion on the whole debate? pathetic. Anyways its hard to remain cordial with somone whos entire argument is trope after trope after trope without any ability to actually support and back up his claims and arguments. destiny is worthless.
The comment section on this alone shows that this was a huge W for both parties involved.
Exactly
Cause they showed humility to agree with each other's good point
Both made good arguments, presented good information, didn't resort to personal attacks. All in all, a good discussion. Tempers got a bit heated tho. Peterson could do with a little less shouting and interrupting. Which surprised me, that's very unlike him. Normally he's very calm and collected in a discussion.
Anybody who thinks "destiny" represented himself well here needs to stop drinking soy lattes. It's hard to watch, or listen to such a sad, indoctrinated, demoralized and effeminate man for this long. If you think he made good points, you need to change yourself fundamentally to become a man. Peterson is also not the way. He merely points in the faint direction of the way.
@@xander9460yes that surprised me, but having a bit of emotion can be interesting for those of us watching.
To see Destiny not cussing and see Jordan swearing up a storm is funny
I love this discussion!!! I just discovered Mr. Bonneccelli. And I might say I respect his perspective a lot. I like his thought process. And I hope for a part two of this discussion.
Mr. Botticelli was top tier as well.
Andrea Bocelli is The BEST
I love my Pirelli tyres
The only way humanity will endure is by coming together. This is how it starts. Bravo gentlemen.
I like that
Be destiny being completely wrong and later studying the video and his information sources to make arguments he couldn't make in person? That's what happened and destiny just looked like a punk the whole time.
If people today arnt believing in Jesus Christ then it never going to happen
This was probably the best "debate" conversation between these kind of people in a while
I agree it was one of the best debates and the emotional hubris that represents the left Lost again!
@@habitat2990 Dude, I feel like we were watching two different debates lmao. Destiny was doing his usual thing of rapid-firing facts and opinions, Peterson was hyper emotional, esp when they got to the climate change and vaccine stuff.
@@OhWellWhatTheHell1There was crazy emotion flowing from them both of them- they just show it so differently. It was very interesting to watch!
@@OhWellWhatTheHell1 I don't know how many Russian bots are on this thread. Didn't Jordan Peterson go to Moscow for "detox"?
Yeah! I miss debates. RUclips was full of them 6-7 years back!
46:20 I'm 100% in favor of nuclear energy. Not sure why JP is straw manning that "the left" is against nuclear energy.
It's a trend of the left to believe one thing, and vote another.
The majority of democratic constituents fear nuclear energy, fission in particular.
Thank you for having Destiny on.
It's true you had presence
Facts. Big fan of him and JP.
This Tyrion vs Tywin Lannister debate was too good
LOL
Holy shit lol
😭😭😭
I felt like I had seen this dynamic before and you just blew my mind
Exactly 👍
lol 😂
Love this!!
Maybe it's just me, but I really like how animated both of them are in this conversation
@@Noname-lw6hpbrother what lol
@@Noname-lw6hp that sounds like projecting your anxiety
@@Noname-lw6hpIt feels more like destiny is being careful not to be too confrontational, to not shut down the conversation
Yes, (except for at certain micro-points), the animation felt passionate and sincere rather than an explosion of hostility.
how many top comments can you have in one thread
It is very hard to listen, as I feel Jordan is regularly dominating the conversation with his venting not allowing his guest to respond to many points. Then when his guest talks, he often has to intersect over them quickly.
Very pleased to see Mr. Berrelli speaking with Jordan Peterson!
I thought it was Mr Morelli? Hahaha
You’re both wrong… it’s Mr. Brundell
@@rohitk2497 hahaha!!! I’m still laughing about that!!
Vanilli
Mr Fettucini please
1:33:55 Destiny seriously just claimed that we *”have to trust institutions, especially when they use force!”* that is the most insane comment ever!
Never trust a Marxist!
Put Republicans in control and that statement will be flipped real fast.
I think Peterson saying "why not?" when told you can't compare Nazis to climate change advocates is just as insane.
@@wasteddudewhy is that insane? Lmfao🤣 should we just always assume that people don’t have other intentions? The comparison was made because of many similarities between the groups. And notice he compared rather than outright call them Nazis. Remember the actual Nazis truly thought they were on the right side too.
Because saying “I’m a climate change activist” doesn’t mean you are a good person or that you don’t have any ulterior, malicious motives. You also don’t know what “climate change activists” are willing to do, what they’re willing to destroy, take, kill etc. all in the name of their “activism” (if you think this would never happen, the you should know that’s exactly how it happens anyway) This should be obvious dude. Stop letting your fixation on hating nazis and loving activism blind you from the fact that there are spectrums to these things, and that your naïveté can and IS easily being used against you. Step away from hating Peterson for a second and look at the broader picture.
Hamas Piker would only dream of having a conversation like this. He's busy screaming at clouds and asking terrorists if they watch One Piece.
😂😂😂
Idk it's kinda similar. Jordan said give em hell netanyahu and then Gaza started getting glassed
One piece is incredible . It’s a fucking disgrace that piker likes it .
@@Crybaby-Media Yea! … Wait, what?
So true.
57:16 Florida here. Solar and such makes sense. 😮 57:16 !!
As someone who sees most of what JP puts out, another 7 hours of this would be welcome! I can only image how hard it is to get someone on the left to come sit with him, but conversations like this are of the utmost importance! Well done both.
This is what a Presedential debate should look like.
ABSOLUTELY.
if dems refuse to go on joe rogan, fine. but can they please agree to go on SOME podcast so we can actually hear candidates talking to eachother?
This is a great great comment!!
@gutless1108 I assume you think you're smarter than both of them 🤣
No
I wish the left and right could have more respectful yet passionate debates like this.
The problem is there’s money to be made and a cult of personality to be built by polarizing.
Each side has people of different levels of intellect, discussion and argument skillsets, and varying motivations. I enjoy when these people get matched up and talk are the best things to listen to.
Jordan, while not arguing in good faith, is at the bare minimum being respectful to destiny. Every argument I've ever been in with a conservative has devolved into ad hominem attacks, mistaking feelings for facts, or putting up a literal wall between them and simply opening a dictionary or googling a concept they don't understand. I too would love for more discussions like this but Trumps own personal unscrupulous and disrespectful behavior is inspiring the right to act likewise
@@personface108…..that’s exactly what Liberals do.
Call names(Nazis is the go to)
Big thing is that you can’t critique any other race, because that’s….. .
@@personface108 ….. I was reading your obviously false words & wondering when the TDS would come into play..
You nailed it🫡
Peterson's ability to bring in such an argumentative person, start the dialogue in a calm way to set the tone for a more productive debate was masterful. Hes very good at what he does.