Former George W. Bush staffer on merits of AUKUS for NZ | Q+A 2024
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- Опубликовано: 27 май 2024
- Professor Michael Green says New Zealand could get access to advanced technologies if it were to join AUKUS Pillar Two, and add an additional tool to its kit when it comes to dealing with China's influence. Meanwhile, the Government says any decision on AUKUS is a long way away.
Join Jack Tame and the Q+A team and find the answers to the questions that matter. Made with the support of NZ on Air.
One thing I’ve learned, America makes up the rules as they go and breaks them when it suits. Eg: Rules-Based international order
So true.
Apologies, but I'm going to veto this comment...
@@jamescooper-hope6930
...😁 ...sorry - permanent members only.😐😆
@@jamescooper-hope6930
At least you apologized
Would you rather live under a communist state run government or at least have a choice of freedom and that is under the US because NZ cannot protect itself
If Kiwis want to know the outcome of US deterrent policies we need look no further than Ukraine and Gaza. We are already on the hook in Ukraine and indirectly with target practice on the Houthis in the Red Sea. The intention is not to “deter” but to dominate. (The not so quiet bit out loud) Does NZ want to sign up for another round of this ? Getting privileged access to advanced technology intended to defeat China? Smells like ?
Why not question the role of tribal military alliances in the modern context, questioned because modern arms are too costly to build and too destructive to use? The discussion assumes the US has the right to global hegemony, to contain China - as SEATO did before. Further, this is not the US of Eisenhower; it's the US whose economy and the opulent wealth of its richest depends as much on arms production as anything else. An outbreak of global peace would mortally wound the US economy. The World has changed; other nations possess advanced technologies, they want a seat at the table of trade and international influence unbound by US constraints. China is vastly problematic but so too is the US whose responsibility for provoking and promoting wars in the name of the democracy and human rights about which its leaders - and their donors - care as little for as the 500,000 Ukrainian lives lost for their prosperity. NZ must steer clear of AUKUS, a throwback alliance that will do nothing but sell arms and bring war. Voices of peace are desperately needed; NZ could be that voice. It's a risky path to take but it's a far better option than biological or nuclear annihilation.
Nuclear submarine footnote: it's one thing to build these ludicrously expensive vehicles. It's quite another to dismantle them; at the time of writing, the Royal Navy still hasn't figured out how to dispose of radioactive carcasses that have been rotting for years [www.navylookout.com/project-to-dismantle-ex-royal-navy-nuclear-submarines-inches-forward/]
how many wars has China provoked so that you consider it's vastly problematic, except for buying your diary, kiwis and beef as a good client? Has China failed to pay for your goods?
Thats a great and well informed comment with deep insight, you restored a little faith in kiwi intellectualism. If your not a kiwi- dont say it - I need this ...for the love of God don't burst my bubble 😁
@@dancerinmaya6813 During seven years recently spent working in China I had ample opportunity to witness the corruption, gross materialism, appalling levels of surveillance and massive divergence of wealth and opportunity expected of an oligarchy; ironically similar in many ways to the US. China's approach to claiming global influence and control is a little more subtle than that of the US but that doesn't make it any less dangerous than its Western counterparts. This is a vast subject and this is not the place to do it justice; I also don't want to tar everyone with the same brush - I had the privilege of working with wonderful colleagues and the young people with whom I had the privilege of meeting would have graced any society.
@@myresponsesarelimited7895 Thank you for the appreciation; pushing back against the colossal headwinds of destruction fueled by unreasoning hatred and bigotry feels an impossible task but my words are heartfelt - and written in Dunedin - NZ, not Florida! 😊
It is debatable whether Russia or China were more involved in supporting or promoting the communist faction in the Korean War and Vietnam war. If the USSR was the prime supporter and planner of the North Korean attack, the Chinese also sent their Amy in and both significantly armed and supplied North Vietnam. It is true that with the decline and collapse of the Soviet Union and its successor state Russia in 1989-1994 their agricultural purchases and fishing liabilities were not easily settled in NZ but that shows one of the risks of extensive trading involvement with communist states which practice a somewhat fraudulent form of replicate capitalism. Argentina which in 1981-82 conducted 70 percent of its trade with the Soviet Union mainly in Agriculture experienced even worse difficulties as a result and after the Church committees ban on military cooperation with Argentina, Buenos Aires was forced to conduct Its anti communist dirty wars with the support of the French and Tel Viv and rely on Germany and possibly Russia for serious military support and equipment. The right side the old UK with the US and USN on its side won it for Thatcher against Buenos Aires in 1982.@@dancerinmaya6813
I'd seriously watch a debate between Green and Clark on foreign policy.
No thanks.
No thanks indeed. This guy helped decieve the world to mass murder millions of innocent Iraqis and Afghans. Now they are murdering Palestinians and want us to hate China for their nasty profit plans. No thanks.
9:53 no it's definitely an American tension, and don't lie- BRI is not a military expansion, and everyone involved benefits from a silk trade road.
Maybe you should speak to some of China's neighbour's for an alternative point of view. I
@@3800gracie
I used to be you - believing all America said, until the WMD lie, so don't give me that bs, try your own advice, find out India annexed parts of China and still occupies them today, how Tibet was a monastic theocracy complete with serfdom. We westerners are arrogant and hypocritical beyond belief.
The attempt to conflate Ukraine-Russia with China-Taiwan is either deliberately misleading or entirely ignorant.
The litmus test is to turn back and ask your own government's official view on whether they would call Taiwan an independent nation to compare with their willingness to do the same to Ukraine.
people don't conflate the two because of independence or anything, they do so because of hypocrisy given both Ukrainians and Palestinians are fighting for their homeland yet America aids Ukraine but supplies weapons to destroy Palestine.
both conflicts contain American proxies.
As for Taiwan - also well known to be a proxy of America
Great interview Jack. Not taking a position, no click bait gotchya 'journalism'. Just exploring the why. It might be boring albeit, not even polarising interview but it gives perspective for the public to make their own minds up or ask further questions. please keep it up.
flyingroman247 . 3h ago
Telling us what to do is a
generalisation, on a broad
spectrum, I know nz business
whom first hand dealings with
china , lost them millions,
and now china sells there
products as there own ,like I
said in my comment above
don't be so nieve, borderline
stupid!, attacking the
mssgnr??? You say the
messenger as you call nz
media. They are currupt!
can't tell a current event
without shock and / ore, with
misguided angled political
editing. That's my comment
free to do so on a posted
media like this, unless you
are an umbersil, you might
have naticed thev onlv allow
Ukraine's Donba.
The New Atlas
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@@myresponsesarelimited7895 Chinese bot. Reported.
@@huiaramalol I'm not a bot, flying roman was lying his arse of and deleting the evidence, even tried to make out I wrote that comment😆
But after deleting his own comment several times- I told him if he persisted I would randomly post it all over this video, go look at his comment- you'll see all the conversation he didn't delete or ban, people are fkn crazy these day's, besides wouldn't a bot spell shit right? Maybe not i don't know just figured they'd have a spell check or something.
@@huiaramaalso the post is (again not mine) ...but obviously anti China so that would make me an American bot? 🤔😁
“Killing India troops in the Himalayas?” In 2020 Indian and Chinese troops in the Himalayas , armedwith “clubs and stones” had prolonged hand to hand combat in which there fatalities on both sides. No shots were fired. How many combatants and non combatants have died in US initiated conflicts since 9 / 11 ?
What has that got to do with India and China?
@@3800gracie
Its a simple enough comparison, one has killed millions (your big daddy) and the other has killed almost nobody, but lifted hundreds of millions out of poverty.
@@myresponsesarelimited7895 Maybe talk to the people of Tibet and Xinjiang they are likely to have a different perspective.
@@3800gracie do you not realise what a monastic theocracy is?
@@3800gracie do you know what serfdom is?
No to Aukus, not negotiable.
The real question is how much to invest in this? Can we afford it given so many children in poverty. Should have asked this guy as well in the US? So many homeless people in the US city streets. Should ask him why the US gave free trade agreement to the NZ so NZ can access the US market not relying on China? It is so called Allies? The US can have 700 military bases around the world, why China can not expand its military capabilities. Look at the wars currently? Who is the one really behind all these?
A real question for you- why should we simp for the most murderous regime ever? ...they are everyone's biggest threat.
the question before how much is why.
flyingroman247 . 3h ago
Telling us what to do is a
generalisation, on a broad
spectrum, I know nz business
whom first hand dealings with
china , lost them millions,
and now china sells there
products as there own ,like I
said in my comment above
don't be so nieve, borderline
stupid!, attacking the
mssgnr??? You say the
messenger as you call nz
media. They are currupt!
can't tell a current event
without shock and / ore, with
misguided angled political
editing. That's my comment
free to do so on a posted
media like this, unless you
are an umbersil, you might
have naticed thev onlv allow
Ukraine's Donba.
The New Atlas
Home
Shorts
Subscriptions
So the Allies who joined the US in IRAQ came out the stronger for it? But what about the people of of Iraq?
Great interview good job jack
5:36 all those places mentioned also have substantial groups that want America out of their country.
flyingroman247 . 3h ago
Telling us what to do is a
generalisation, on a broad
spectrum, I know nz business
whom first hand dealings with
china , lost them millions,
and now china sells there
products as there own ,like I
said in my comment above
don't be so nieve, borderline
stupid!, attacking the
mssgnr??? You say the
messenger as you call nz
media. They are currupt!
can't tell a current event
without shock and / ore, with
misguided angled political
editing. That's my comment
free to do so on a posted
media like this, unless you
are an umbersil, you might
have naticed thev onlv allow
Ukraine's Donba.
The New Atlas
Home
Shorts
Subscriptions
Auatralia has transferred advanced tech to the USA, some examples: 1. A uranium enrichment program that enriches it to weapons grade in half the time. 2. A new style of atonomous drone -th Ghost Bat, which was developed IN Australia and the US has now acquired some. 3. First scram jet engine to work was done IN Australia, and then USA was given this . First underwater unmanned subs were put into the water 3 weeks ago - by Australia. So it is not to leser extent at all, there are only SOME examples.
I really do dislike bullshit , this guy says N Z exports to China are significantly higher than Australia, when the truth is the other way around..Australian exports 2023 ins US$ to China were 120 BILLION ( and this was during Chinese economic war with Australia) and New Zealand exports were in US$30 billion and THAT is with China increasing New Zealand access to spite Australia. SO this guy does not tell the truth.
The funny think is America egged Australia on to prod the dragon by indirectly accusing them of being responsible for creating covid (guess who did fund it?) ...anyway Australia got salty at us because we refused to fling that American muck, saying we stole their wine exports, truth be told it did work in our favor, we did receive a 50 million or something boost for our wine industry
...but guess who took the lion's share of Australian wine exports to China? ....yes- again it was America, if you know who ASPI is and what they do- you already have a grip on the situation.
We don't need Aukus take a hike My friend no need for it 😂😂😂😂
flyingroman247 . 3h ago
Telling us what to do is a
generalisation, on a broad
spectrum, I know nz business
whom first hand dealings with
china , lost them millions,
and now china sells there
products as there own ,like I
said in my comment above
don't be so nieve, borderline
stupid!, attacking the
mssgnr??? You say the
messenger as you call nz
media. They are currupt!
can't tell a current event
without shock and / ore, with
misguided angled political
editing. That's my comment
free to do so on a posted
media like this, unless you
are an umbersil, you might
have naticed thev onlv allow
Ukraine's Donba.
The New Atlas
Home
Shorts
Subscriptions
Australian exports to China 2023 were about 20% ( approx) and imports similar , approx 20% listening to this seems different from what the truth is. He really does a good job.AUKUS is not just about a technology transferance, some is, but that's NOT it. Listen to how he says HE disagrees, you can only disagree if you have different facts, the truth never tells a lie, but this guy seems adroit at it.
❤. Japanese is good Great Family, We will welcome then. Government do it. Japanese USA. USA .
All this guy is saying falls on deaf ears with Tame and all his media entourage. They're far left, consequently pro Beijing.
Or, you are xenophobic and anti China.
You mean all the bs.
NO thanks !
flyingroman247 . 3h ago
Telling us what to do is a
generalisation, on a broad
spectrum, I know nz business
whom first hand dealings with
china , lost them millions,
and now china sells there
products as there own ,like I
said in my comment above
don't be so nieve, borderline
stupid!, attacking the
mssgnr??? You say the
messenger as you call nz
media. They are currupt!
can't tell a current event
without shock and / ore, with
misguided angled political
editing. That's my comment
free to do so on a posted
media like this, unless you
are an umbersil, you might
have naticed thev onlv allow
Ukraine's Donba.
The New Atlas
Home
Shorts
Subscriptions
I don't want NZ to join AUKUS. I want NZ to be independent and able to trade freely with whoever we choose. I don't want more weapons in NZ. I don't want more spy installations in NZ. I don't want us to become part of the US's aggressive policy with China. I don't want us to become the lackey of US hegemony and war-mongering. We are a tiny nation with a privileged lifestyle in a peaceful area of the world and I want us to remain that way. I certainly wouldn't give any respect at all to a Former George W. Bush staffer.
Well said, I agree entirely. Why would NZ want to be another US military base? Sad to see how things have changed during my 50 years in NZ. I came here in 1973, age 17 - it had many faults but was largely ignored by the big powers and rich elites. Now we're just a bolt hole for them, when they ruin their own country. Difficult times ahead.
Preach! Aussies already have a spy and satellite headquarters called Pine Gap, their own soil given to the Americans. War commands travel right through it, meaning the Aussies have blood on their hands. We do not want the same. Aussies and American are big enough to withstand sanctions and face their repercussions, we would be absolutely destroyed as a nation, economically, if we ever had to face sanctions from china.
If we fall behind in technology, in a technology based modern world, we will not remain independent😊
Agree and well said
@@MikeForster-fl6om it’s not about the weapons, it’s about who we point out weapons at. Joining aukus means we point then at china. Discounted weapons means we give up out liberty to make our own decisions.
Don't join them no need we are fine and can have all that focus on technology without joining them we already are ahead in the 🚀 rocket front... I'm kind of on the fence with defence weapons being pushed not sure why humans keep fighting 😭..I don't know enough to comment. I'm really pretty dumb...
You sound pretty wise to me...
Provided we join on the technology side ONLY, we can keep up with the technology and be a voice for "peace". It's not an alliance, we can withdraw if we fail in our aim.
@@grantchin1526
Me too.
@@MikeForster-fl6omthese guy's don't work like that, they're zero sum, "your either with us or against us" there is no grey area where we can take the good and leave the bad.
flyingroman247 . 3h ago
Telling us what to do is a
generalisation, on a broad
spectrum, I know nz business
whom first hand dealings with
china , lost them millions,
and now china sells there
products as there own ,like I
said in my comment above
don't be so nieve, borderline
stupid!, attacking the
mssgnr??? You say the
messenger as you call nz
media. They are currupt!
can't tell a current event
without shock and / ore, with
misguided angled political
editing. That's my comment
free to do so on a posted
media like this, unless you
are an umbersil, you might
have naticed thev onlv allow
Ukraine's Donba.
The New Atlas
Home
Shorts
Subscriptions
Yes!,Well!, We all know how America works on relationships. 😮
flyingroman247 . 3h ago
Telling us what to do is a
generalisation, on a broad
spectrum, I know nz business
whom first hand dealings with
china , lost them millions,
and now china sells there
products as there own ,like I
said in my comment above
don't be so nieve, borderline
stupid!, attacking the
mssgnr??? You say the
messenger as you call nz
media. They are currupt!
can't tell a current event
without shock and / ore, with
misguided angled political
editing. That's my comment
free to do so on a posted
media like this, unless you
are an umbersil, you might
have naticed thev onlv allow
Ukraine's Donba.
The New Atlas
Home
Shorts
Subscriptions
Zero sum
❤ Democracy Party is just doomed. ❤ Republic Patriot you want a see.... Democratic fault
It was a good interview until Trump was mentioned.
I like the guy… great to hear from him…
Go home stay home
@@user-ew3jw8xh7m
?
1 on 1 kim and abdi
Does he seriously think China doesnt know where every single submarine in the world is? He's nuts. All subs are tracked by the opposing party. They're only 100m or so below the ocean. How do you think they knew the Titan imploded 3km below the ocean and absolutely tiny. Navy tracking tech.
No because they have ships and helicopters that can hunt submarines, stealth is their advantage, as for that sub that imploded, sound travels well through water, they would have heard something like a can getting stomped I guess, I remember media saying they heard it and knew long before, some say they pretended they didn't know to distract from banking legislation that went through at the time and that refugee boat that sank killing hundreds which was turned back.
As a leftist 🥝.., I say that Clark is wrong .. about appeasement of China
We need to stand up for ourselves and others..
What demands have China made of us - or what advantage over us do they seek? ... that Helen Clark thinks we should appease?...
The bias and petty woke thinking of JT has no ends
This is the WMD lie the US told about Iraq all over again. This isn't about military dominance but economic dominance, just like the Iraq war was about oil. The US is still an unrivalled military power house...they don't need Australia, Japan or NZ in the indo-pacific. 2hat they want to do is destroy trade relationships with China to isolated them economically so they can regain dominance. And don't get me wrong, an economically dominant China is probably good for no one but China, but the same goes for the US corporations as well.
Well... China has brought massive economic gain to all involved, and last I checked they had lifted 350 million people out of poverty. 🤷♂️
What has America done other than destruction and domination... even within the states.
Tame’s a little boy clinging to Aunty Helen’s apron.
Your an ignoramus screaming WMDs.
I vote that we should join. The fact that China has so much economic power over New Zealand is frightning. We took a economic hit with our anti nuclear stance.
Do you know Australia is already in the hole for eye watering 368 billion dollars?... for a few outdated subs now- and new ones decades away. Paul keeting took Australia to school on that.
Do you know we NEED everything China sells us?...
Do you know China puts out over 7 million stem graduates every year? ...or any idea what that means for technological advancement?... do you know these guy's have missiles that can hit America going the long way?
Do you know the us never has given us a trade deal? Guess who we do have a trade deal with?...
China is our biggest trade partner. Pillar 2 doesn't replace that wealth
Fully support NZ joining AUKUS, This is a great opportunity for NZ to get access to and build our economy using the latest technology. In this case which are dual use. AI, Quatum Computing, Cyber and Space etc. THis is not a mutual defence treaty as others seem to think. How can we have a truly independent foreign policy when if China say do not do something we just say yes?
Tf are you talking about, America tell.us what to do not China, what a stupid thing to say, did you see us in north Vietnam or south Vietnam? ...North Korea or South Korea? China don't have any wars but you know we went to Indonesia, Malaysia... Iraq ...Afghanistan... etc - did China make us do that? ...how tf did you get it so backwards?🤷♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️
@@myresponsesarelimited7895 this is not the case. Perhaps you should check longer history of Asia. China has had plenty of wars, India, Tibet, Vietnam, Korea.
@@3800gracie this is not the facts perhaps you should do a little digging and not just accept the propaganda as America and her allies presents it.
Ok so Vietnam and Korea were its allies, far be it from me to hold supporting allies against them, by now we know how Vietnam started which was under the false pretense of the golf of Tonkin incident which in hindsight we know was another murican false flag attack.
@@3800gracie india is an on-going boarder disput, and when you look into it both india and China occupy each other's territory, you probably only know about the incidents in the Himalayas because America and india like to portray them as China trying to take over the world which is quite ridiculous, india is no slouch militarily- were one trying to take over the world? - you wouldn't start with them pinky. The Himalayas is high ground strategically a military threat were india to become emboldened and try something, don't say they wouldn't- reserch the history- they already have annexed part's of China hence why they both occupy troughs of land that belonged to the other. Its all documented, you just need to doubt what you've been told in order to investigate the truth.
@@3800gracie
As for Tibet - what the western propaganda leaves out is that Tibet was a monastic theocracy complete with serfdom, young men were forced into the monastery and children toiled away as slaves, turns out kids want iphones and fun time- who in Tibet would have thought. The Dali Lama was responsible for a huge amount of foreign support but Google dalilama asks boy to suck his tongue- ...turns out they're another bunch of pedo priests.
Jack Lame looks stunned lol.. Everything Winston Peters said it was lolololol
flyingroman247 . 3h ago
Telling us what to do is a
generalisation, on a broad
spectrum, I know nz business
whom first hand dealings with
china , lost them millions,
and now china sells there
products as there own ,like I
said in my comment above
don't be so nieve, borderline
stupid!, attacking the
mssgnr??? You say the
messenger as you call nz
media. They are currupt!
can't tell a current event
without shock and / ore, with
misguided angled political
editing. That's my comment
free to do so on a posted
media like this, unless you
are an umbersil, you might
have naticed thev onlv allow
Ukraine's Donba.
The New Atlas
Home
Shorts
Subscriptions
Question is Do we want to trade with dictators or democratic voted leader ? Its USA an AUS for me
flyingroman247 . 3h ago
Telling us what to do is a
generalisation, on a broad
spectrum, I know nz business
whom first hand dealings with
china , lost them millions,
and now china sells there
products as there own ,like I
said in my comment above
don't be so nieve, borderline
stupid!, attacking the
mssgnr??? You say the
messenger as you call nz
media. They are currupt!
can't tell a current event
without shock and / ore, with
misguided angled political
editing. That's my comment
free to do so on a posted
media like this, unless you
are an umbersil, you might
have naticed thev onlv allow
Ukraine's Donba.
The New Atlas
Home
Shorts
Subscriptions
America dictates our foreign policy - so how's that democracy working out? ...
China has stats the blow western economies (all in recession) ...into the weeds with the kind of economic growth we couldn't even dream of. Funny how we westerners are quick to fling muck at the fastest growing, soon to be the biggest economy - all while we're in the sht, we should stop being so ignorant and judgmental ...at least until we too have no homeless people, or we've lifted hundreds of millions of people out of poverty 🤷♂️
Youre always be jack Lame lol.. following old govt, what about this govt debates Lamey BOY