@@Lavender9911 si ella estaba compitiendo con una seria lesión en la espalda de hecho por eso el vestido esta tapado en la espalda y no transparente para disimular la faja
Hello! 0:36 - it is AD2 but not AD3. And it could be count only if the 180-rotation is valid for judges in this case (but I am not sure) 0:43 not sure that AD2 is valid (is it really work under the leg?). And is the next AD2 during the balance is without visual control? 0:51 There is AD2 during the S 0:53 No AD3, no the second criteria (no 180-rotation, only w/o visual control) 1:02 AD2 not valid, no second criteria (no 180-rotation, only w/o visual control) 1:23 AD2 can be not valid for judges because of no second criteria w/o visual control (see CoP) 1:38 it is AD3 but not AD2 1:50 the last AD4 for sure is not valid because the music is over. So the last AD3 is also questionable
@Alicia Kjær Если вы имеете в виду AD на 0:43, то я написала, что: 1. не факт, что при выполнении равновесия с рисунком ленты "змейка" засчитали критерий "под ногой", т.к. подобная ситуация не описана и не проиллюстрирована в CoP 2017-2020 как критерий "под ногой". Аналогично можно говорить о следующим сразу за этим элементом AD во время второго равновесия: критерий "вне зрительного контроля" могут не засчитать, т.к. работа с лентой происходит сбоку или даже впереди гимнастки. Да, она держит руку за спиной, но спирали делает перед собой, т.е. визуально контролирует рисунок ленты. Опять же, см. CoP, там проиллюстрировано, что критерий "без зрительного контроля" засчитывают, только если действие происходит за спиной, а не сбоку гимнастки. Или Вы имеете в виду какой-то другой момент? Тогда укажите, пожалуйста, точное время на видео
@Alicia Kjær именно поэтому я написала, что критерий под ногой спорный, но, вероятнее всего, его засчитали, а вот критерий "без зрительного контроля" для спирали на втором равновесии не должен быть засчитан, это сейчас в правилах прописано четко. А касательно того, что "прописано" и что "очевидно" - у FIG есть свой журнал, где они периодически публикуют ответы на вопросы тренеров и судей касательно формулировок правил и соответствия различных элементов и ситуаций на ковре тем или иным пунктам правил. Так что нужно опираться не на "очевидно" а на правила и пояснения к ним, которые публикует FIG. На то они и правила, чтобы по ним не спорить, а оценивать.
1:50 АД4 действительно, так как музыка в момент ловли ещё звучит, даже если те, кто не привык слушать громко её не слышат. Fade-out в музыкальных треках ещё никто не отменял. Дина успела в музыку.
I understand that you couldn't use the real videos because of copyright issues, but this way it wasn't a very useful analysis like this... In Tokyo, Dina was very messy, a lot of her ADs included very questionable parts, her BD lines are not clean at all, she didn't use the whole carpet just about 40% of it, she finished without music.. and I'm not even a professional judge, but still can see these mistakes. I feel like this time the judges made a little effort to create a fair play, it was sad for the Averinas that the olympics was the first time it has happened to them. And the olympic medal was based on an AA competition, not on a ribbon final.
I tried to be as objective as possible. If there was a certain AD she did with error, I used the Olympics footage. I know there are no apparatus Final events. I just named this video, "ribbon finals" because I wanted people to know this was not the qualification. Most people would know this was the AA final because most know there arent any AF in the Olympics. thanks for watching! :)
@@crybaby-bd9xg I said it was an AA and not an AF because a ribbon routine doesn't have that much impact on the overall score. Plus, a constructive criticism, it would be a lot of help to show on the video which criterias did you count, not just the elements' final score.
Thats true, why dnt you use the her full video at tokyo? She cut those messy part maybe to convice us dina really won. Mybe one this days shes going to upload arinas exercise on ribbon without the signature"knot" kidding:)
Hi Maya, I've uploaded the video that you have requested. Go check it out! :) Sorry it took a long time. I had to reedit and reupload it a couple of times because of copyright... hope you enjoy :)
where can you find linoy’s full performance? how is Dina’s performance who won silver available but the gold performance which would be the best is unfindable.
Первый риск стоит 0,9-там выброс без зрительного, на шагах не перекат палки, а скольжение на 0,2, потому что там нет целых рук и есть прерывание, на боковом равновесии нет АД, потому что для него не хватает критериев (нога в шпагате-поэтому под ней не может быть, а без зрительного в боковых нет-в правилах все четко нарисовано в этом плане-на каждом семинаре вроде это даже обговаривают). И работа на полу не считается, т к.там нужно сделать круг рукой, а его не было. Перекат палки стоит 0,3, пусть вначале рука согнута, но она в течение переката выпрямляется. Ну и последняя ловля была была без музыки.
@@ivanpetrov1105 посмотрите другие соревнования и убедитесь, что она заканчивала с последним громким аккордом. По правилам (по старым) по-другому нельзя было, иначе сбавка за музыку была
@@pinakAlena я меломан. У меня мониторные наушники, и я отчетливо слышу звук в момент ловли. Он уже достаточно тихий, но ещё есть. Fade-out - это когда аудио сигнал затухает не сразу, а постепенно. И ловля считова и сбавки 0,5 в артистике нет. Если не верите, наложите оригинальную аудиодорожку на видео и убедитесь. Компакт-диск ещё подавал в момент ловли музыку, и судьи не имели права за окончание после музыки снимать. Там именно что точное окончание с музыкой. Если бы в Правилх ФИж было написано, что окончание музыки - это последний громкий аккорд, судьям не надо было бы после музыки в обруче у Дины дополнительно вставлять звуковой сигнал, свидетельствующий о её окончании (там в районе 2 секунд затухание вообще, то всё, опять же отчетливо слышно, если конечно, хотеть услышать). Вот из журнала "Пирует" ФИЖевского пример про окончание после музыки: ruclips.net/video/jMheIUdPN-k/видео.html Динин случай явно не из этих.
You can't convince people that are pro-Dina . They are still convinced that Dina should have won ! But the IFG already gave its decision and confirmed that Linoy won the gold medal as She was better in complexity of the exercises . Thanks for your analysis.
I am "pro Dina ", if you want to call it like that., Why? :Dina always got the first place and there must be a reason why she always won. So, in your eyes the judges that gave her all the points and scores in the last years and months did wrong and overscored her and just the judges at olympics were right?? Why, do YOU think, did she get lower points ONLY at the Olympic games, NEVER before got Linoy more points although both of them did the exactly same routines they did when Dina won couple months ago..
@@Amelie8H Linoy was better , made more complex exercises .If Linoy wouldn't have dropped the ribbon the difference in score would have been much higher . The difference was a slight one due to that . Linoy is very good and you can't deny that. But really, It is over !! You can keep crying and being disappointed but it is over ! The ROC can't appeal anymore , they just need to cope with the situation. IT IS OVER !!!!
@@Amelie8H You may look at this analysis. It may help understanding. Dina was not always better. In Bulgaria, she was the third in all around after Arina and Boryana Kalein. Linoy was better in Bulgaria with clubs. Boryana Kalein also was better than Arina and Dina with hoop or ribbon (I do not remember) in Moscow a few months ago. So they do ot perform very consistently. Besides, she has a serious back injury/ It also explains a lot! ruclips.net/video/_zuLbEGDKXE/видео.html
@@Amelie8H And you thing that judges was no subjective in other competitions - especially in cities like Moscow and Baku?! Or Dina is always playing the same way - without mistakes?
And I saw analysis in which she is 4 points overrated, because mast of DA should not be counted - she is doing things later and catches are not out of view, so DA was about 11! She was not doing things clear.
I think some AD's are overvalued here as there are impressions in the catch of the apparatus. Dina takes two steps to catch the apparatus twice during the final performance- certainly, due to youtube's restrictions they can't be shown here but those imprecisions were made so those 2 AD'S are worth much less or even 0- yet I am not sure which one. Secondly, there are BD made to validate the AD and these do not count because there is only 9 BD allowed (the ones with the highest difficulties ) the rest do not count towards BD but AD. Plus, I would go as far as to say that only one of Dina's balances can fully be counted, the rest are not held for the mandatory 1 second. Plus, I think one AD is double-counted. All in all, I think the score Dina was given in this particular routine was fair, it was a strong routine and she got a strong score (she improved on her qualifications performance by 1.2 points). It is a pretty good review of the analysis but it would be a lot better if all the difficulties were properly justified using the code of points as other channels do, then there would be less room for interpretations. IF THE CODE OF POINTS ALLOWS IT, THEN IT MUST BE RIGHT!
Hi, thanks for ur input. I will answer to ur input about her balances for now. Even if a balance is not held for one sec, the balance is valid but with a 0.3 deduction from execution.
i agree with some of your points!! there was an AD up the back of the mat in particular where I would've thought there should be a trajectory deduction and therefore the AD wouldn't count... but Dina is very good at covering up her trajectory issues with dancing steps! Very clever of her ! However, I also agree with @/crybaby here; as per the Code of Points, you can still validate a BD even without the mandatory 1sec stop position. Here is an excerpt from the Code: "if the shape is well-defined and the apparatus element is executed correctly but the stop position is insufficient, the balance is valid with a technical execution penalty" Hope this helps!
im so glad you did both linoy and dina!! it shows that you are trying to be as fair as possible and for that you have my respect :)) just a couple of things i have notes about: (1) The D1/2 score: why did you include the arabesque, cabriole and illusion in the video when they arent counted as part of her D1/2 score? (P.S. arabesque balance is 0.2!) Regardless; this was the potential D1/2 score that I got: 3 turning split w/ arch (0.6+0.6+0.6) ponche balance (on flat) (0.4) ponche balance w/ ring (on flat) (0.4) front balance (0.4) side scale balance (0.5) side scale pivot (0.5) back scale balance (0.5) As you correctly pointed out (something I didn't even notice so thank you!!) she definitely didn't do the correct handling in her back scale and therefore this wouldn't have counted! Good find! With the logic that we count the best 9 BDs + our 0.3 DS in our D1/2 score... I'm unsure how you got to 4.8 with this? Since we eliminate the back scale balance and replace it with the next highest scoring AD (in this case, arabesque balance of 0.2 is next!), we should get: 0.6 + 0.6 + 0.6 + 0.4 + 0.4 + 0.4 + 0.5 + 0.5 + 0.2 + 0.3 = 4.5?? Since the judges gave 4.8 as their D1/2 score... it is likely that they actually did count the invalid back scale balance (and likely the AD along with it) This is mainly because it's hard to count patterns so quickly in the moment! (2) AD3: there were two example of ADs that you counted as rolls that I would have probably counted as AD2 instead! The first is at 0:37 ; in this case, I wouldn't say that 'two large body segments' were rolled upon, especially considering how much she helps the AD with her hands! In this case, I think it should be an AD2. The second is at 0:54 ; there has been an edition of Pirouette by FIG which clarifies that these sort of ADs must be done HORIZONTALLY to get the AD3 (I think Taseva does them quite well!). If you do it VERTICALLY like Dina does, you can only get 0.2 as the base becomes a slide instead of a roll! (3) the *awful* front attitude balance ADs; absolutely zero hate to either Dina or Arina, but oh my gosh these ADs,,, i hope they get rid of them in coming years lol they're just not my cuppa tea Regardless, I am confused why you counted the first one (at 0:42) but not the second (at 1:00). The shape is not good for either of them in my opinion! (4) this is just a genuine thank you for your work and always being respectful in replying to my comments! this sort of this is very helpful for my judging knowledge, so thank you for always having a discussion!
Hi Amy, thanks for coming back again. :) (1) oh shoot, I thought 2 balances executed consecutively are counted as one BD. That is why I counted the pence and pence w/ ring balances as one BD, and the front balance & side scale as one BD. Arabesque is worth 0.2???! (hashtag not worth it) I'm sure the score you came up with is right then, thanks for clarifying once again. (2) I can see your point there but I've seen many gymnasts do this "roll" AD so I would like to give this particular AD the benefit of the doubt. 0:54 I see. Thank you for that information again. (3) Yeah, I hope those ADs won't count in the future. But this cycle's CoP calls for lots of ADs and maximizing ur difficulty score so you gotta do what you gotta do. 0:42 at the finals in the Olympics, her shape was much clearer. I should have used that footage, a lil regrets right now... (4) Thank you so much! I love how we are able to have a positive discussion. You are also very helpful I must say. It's viewers like you that keeps me going. Thanks for watching and your input once again :)
@@crybaby-bd9xg hiiiii again!!! (1) YOU LITERALLY PREDICTED THE NEXT CODE OF POINTS THEN HAHAHA (they have so many new rules now on combined balances omg!! its doing my head in slowly lol) and COMPLETELY agree about arabesque, it's even been kept at that value for 2022-24! and not a worry! D1/2 scores usually make the most sense lol, at least i can get something right with accuracy!!!! (2) mmm yes i could see the first one i mentioned being a AD3 in some cases, but the second one has definitely been clarified as a AD2! (3) yep agree, you gotta get that difficulty in somehow!! it was a clever idea in theory, but the execution of it is questionable... lol her execution at finals was definitely better, but still wasn't really a correct shape, i would still say it was a 0.5 execution deduction which invalidates the AD and the BD, but you never know what the judges saw in that moment! (4) awww im so glad to hear that!! im more active on my insta if you ever want any help with future videos!! (@rhythmicgymnastics.mp4)
it was fair play. this account acknowledges that they are not a certified judge. how can a very invested rhythmic gymnastics fan be better and fairer than a certified judge? I can also do the same kind of analysis and reach a different conclusion, then who's right? probably neither, the judges only.
@@karolmaria2547 Ok. You may prepare your analysis. Unfortunately, the federation of gymnastics refuses to provide a protocol with the analysis of exercises. If they have nothing to hide, let them publish it. All fans are waiting........
@@mayazaslavskaia3358 they have released the official breakdown of scores with D1/2, D3/4, EA and ET scores on the official Olympics website if that's what you mean! However, they wont ever release the actual scoring notations of the judges, this isn't really protocol...
@@rhythmicgymnastics.mp4782 Yes, I've seen the Official Reports (Results). It would be nice to see the current scores on monitors in the future ( like in Figure Skating).
why dont you use a full tokyo footage? your excuse is always "copy right issue" but there are uploader who use tokyo footage only. dinas performance at varna is good but messy at tokyo same with her twin who got only useless 4th place only. you kidding? whats next? upload arina averinas ribbon exer witbout a knot to convince us she won? be fair. use the clip only at tokyo.
Please see the uploaded dates before you make this kind of comments. Understand the fact this was a video from 4 months ago. This was uploaded way before the full Olympic replay was uploaded on RUclips and videos and clips of it were profusely copyrighted.
I don't understand this sport, but this video and the other one about Linoy's performance are quite interesting! As I said, I do not understand this sport, but Linoy's routine seems complex than Dina's.
@@crybaby-bd9xg" Dina received a score that was relatively accurate", ok, I see, but if it's a matter of o. 15 points of who's the winner, it has to be percent 💯 accurate. I don't understand why Dina was always the winner and suddenly at the Olympics she got lower scores, there must be a reason why. She did all her routine like always. Very weird imo
@@crybaby-bd9xg RG scores analysed both routines. It does not look like Dina should have won. RG scores accounted for all mistakes of both girls. There were lots of catches not out of sight in Dina's performance. Linoy also had these mistakes. The RG scores count shows that Linoy received around 1, 00 higher whereas Dina received around 3,00 higher than she deserves., Overall, judges overevaluated Dina. You can compare these calculations with yours. ruclips.net/video/_zuLbEGDKXE/видео.html ruclips.net/video/hKLjaex-FOY/видео.html
@@Amelie8H She did not. she was doing catches and other things not well as always. She finished after the music. She did not have obvious mistakes, but for the judges is different - they are looking if the catch is aout of view, how many seconds she is keeping balances ect.
@@deniivanova5961 Она всегда первая и никогда не будет второй, а то , что судьи поставили её на второе место 🥈, ещё ничего не значит, она первая в сердцах людей.
Дина не первая в мое серце. Я люблю Боряна. У ее тоже бьила одна ошибка, но Арина била на 4 место. Ето честно? Как думаете? Арина лента изпортила и получила висше оценка.
@@deniivanova5961 Я Боряну не видела, не могу сказать, но Арина первоклассно выступала до ленты, а ей специально баллы занижали, чтобы вывести из строя за первое место 🥇, а ленту могли тоже ей подпортить , не исключено, а Ашрам никак не тянет на золото 🥇, это же очевидно 🙄, вдобавок ленту уронила, а с такой ошибкой никто раньше олимпиаду не выигрывал, ни Алина Кабаева, ни Яна Кудрявцева, хотя Кудрявцева уронила булаву уже в самом конце, когда все было выполнено и это не испортило программу, просто смотрелась как небольшая помарка, и то не дали золотую медаль 🥇, а у Ашрам программа разделилась на две части из-за потери ленты, и плюс эстетически некрасивая программа, прыгает как кенгуру, красоты никакой, и никакой сложности тела не видно, только корявость видно, и с предметами у неё сложности нет 👎, ясно что все подстроено было под Ашрам, чтобы вывести её на первое место.
Why don't you all stop with your imprecised analyzes when you're not a true judge? Trying to earn some likes over the people's pain is pathetic. Dina and Arina are now focused on the future. So stop posting such "conspiracy" videos. It's pointless. If ROC notice irregularity they could send a complaint to OC. They know better what to do. And let Linoy to enjoy her medal!
how's this a conspiracy video. If you are sensing a negative connotation from this video, I think it's because you are approaching this video with a negative attitude. I'm not trying to earn likes from someone's pain. You are taking this way out of context. I think you are the one who can't move on, hence your angry comment here... Plus, this was a requested video. And unlike someone, I definitely respect everyone's opinion, even if their viewpoint is different from me. And if you thought my "analysis" (not analyzes, *cough cough) was imprecise, I'm sure you are the who with the imprecision. Thank you for ur comment! I guess I still earn a view and a comment thanks to you... ;)
I was getting mean Commnents just bc I wrote the truth:Ashrams doesn't fullfill the pysical requirements you have to fullfill for a professional RG gymnast. Oh, now I am a body shamer.. Ok so, why, on God's earth, no tiny man/woman is complaining bout not able to compete as a weight lifter!???. Never ever did a slim human being complain about not being allowed to be, f. I. at hammer throwing or lift weighting , but If I say something about Ashrams physical proportions, which are NOT looking well in RG.. This is a problem??? Sheesh, that's so pathetic!!!!
Linoy Ashram is only a "temporary champion" 🤣🥇because she makes others feel a bit speculative.🤮 First, because the Israeli players are generally not of high quality. Second, she dropped the ribbon but the judges still showed her favor.🤬😱🤔..
![I.N "HALLUCINATION" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/n5B5q1Hwt_U/mqdefault.jpg)
![AVERINA Arina [RUS] (AA) - Strongest Cup 2023 Apparatus FINALS](/img/1.gif)
Keep in mind that Dina competed in Tokyo with an injury in her back and couldn't do some elements in her routines.
really, I didn't know that
Yes she lost BD points
@@Lavender9911 si ella estaba compitiendo con una seria lesión en la espalda de hecho por eso el vestido esta tapado en la espalda y no transparente para disimular la faja
Hello!
0:36 - it is AD2 but not AD3. And it could be count only if the 180-rotation is valid for judges in this case (but I am not sure)
0:43 not sure that AD2 is valid (is it really work under the leg?). And is the next AD2 during the balance is without visual control?
0:51 There is AD2 during the S
0:53 No AD3, no the second criteria (no 180-rotation, only w/o visual control)
1:02 AD2 not valid, no second criteria (no 180-rotation, only w/o visual control)
1:23 AD2 can be not valid for judges because of no second criteria w/o visual control (see CoP)
1:38 it is AD3 but not AD2
1:50 the last AD4 for sure is not valid because the music is over. So the last AD3 is also questionable
@Alicia Kjær я учитывала все возможные критерии, включая BD
@Alicia Kjær Если вы имеете в виду AD на 0:43, то я написала, что: 1. не факт, что при выполнении равновесия с рисунком ленты "змейка" засчитали критерий "под ногой", т.к. подобная ситуация не описана и не проиллюстрирована в CoP 2017-2020 как критерий "под ногой". Аналогично можно говорить о следующим сразу за этим элементом AD во время второго равновесия: критерий "вне зрительного контроля" могут не засчитать, т.к. работа с лентой происходит сбоку или даже впереди гимнастки. Да, она держит руку за спиной, но спирали делает перед собой, т.е. визуально контролирует рисунок ленты. Опять же, см. CoP, там проиллюстрировано, что критерий "без зрительного контроля" засчитывают, только если действие происходит за спиной, а не сбоку гимнастки. Или Вы имеете в виду какой-то другой момент? Тогда укажите, пожалуйста, точное время на видео
@Alicia Kjær именно поэтому я написала, что критерий под ногой спорный, но, вероятнее всего, его засчитали, а вот критерий "без зрительного контроля" для спирали на втором равновесии не должен быть засчитан, это сейчас в правилах прописано четко. А касательно того, что "прописано" и что "очевидно" - у FIG есть свой журнал, где они периодически публикуют ответы на вопросы тренеров и судей касательно формулировок правил и соответствия различных элементов и ситуаций на ковре тем или иным пунктам правил. Так что нужно опираться не на "очевидно" а на правила и пояснения к ним, которые публикует FIG. На то они и правила, чтобы по ним не спорить, а оценивать.
Nice analysis Varvara, thank u for pointing these mistakes.
1:50 АД4 действительно, так как музыка в момент ловли ещё звучит, даже если те, кто не привык слушать громко её не слышат. Fade-out в музыкальных треках ещё никто не отменял. Дина успела в музыку.
I understand that you couldn't use the real videos because of copyright issues, but this way it wasn't a very useful analysis like this...
In Tokyo, Dina was very messy, a lot of her ADs included very questionable parts, her BD lines are not clean at all, she didn't use the whole carpet just about 40% of it, she finished without music.. and I'm not even a professional judge, but still can see these mistakes.
I feel like this time the judges made a little effort to create a fair play, it was sad for the Averinas that the olympics was the first time it has happened to them. And the olympic medal was based on an AA competition, not on a ribbon final.
I tried to be as objective as possible. If there was a certain AD she did with error, I used the Olympics footage.
I know there are no apparatus Final events. I just named this video, "ribbon finals" because I wanted people to know this was not the qualification. Most people would know this was the AA final because most know there arent any AF in the Olympics.
thanks for watching! :)
@@crybaby-bd9xg I said it was an AA and not an AF because a ribbon routine doesn't have that much impact on the overall score.
Plus, a constructive criticism, it would be a lot of help to show on the video which criterias did you count, not just the elements' final score.
@@HHH-uj7oo do u mean the criterias for the ADs? I did show the criteria for the risks. :)
Thats true, why dnt you use the her full video at tokyo? She cut those messy part maybe to convice us dina really won. Mybe one this days shes going to upload arinas exercise on ribbon without the signature"knot" kidding:)
What About her finishing without music?
thats execution... not difficulty
@@florenciamorenocrovetto7384 the element finished after the music should not be counted in the D score as well.
Could you please compare the exercises with clubs ( if possible)? ARINA Averina vs Linoy Ashram ( Tokyo Olympic Games . Finals). Thank you in advance.
Okay, I will. Thanks for requesting. I will try to make one very soon. :)
@@crybaby-bd9xg yes pleaseeeee
Hi Maya, I've uploaded the video that you have requested. Go check it out! :)
Sorry it took a long time. I had to reedit and reupload it a couple of times because of copyright... hope you enjoy :)
@@Esheonearth it is up right now. Go check it out! :)
where can you find linoy’s full performance? how is Dina’s performance who won silver available but the gold performance which would be the best is unfindable.
Try it here. At least the last round is available ruclips.net/video/uzQ9QIKJICI/видео.html
This is a clip from EC varna and tokyo not tokyo alone.
Try this a comparison bet dina and linoy at OG tokyo. Unlike this watching 2 clip from 2 diff event. ruclips.net/video/WrlQfTbudbM/видео.html
Первый риск стоит 0,9-там выброс без зрительного, на шагах не перекат палки, а скольжение на 0,2, потому что там нет целых рук и есть прерывание, на боковом равновесии нет АД, потому что для него не хватает критериев (нога в шпагате-поэтому под ней не может быть, а без зрительного в боковых нет-в правилах все четко нарисовано в этом плане-на каждом семинаре вроде это даже обговаривают). И работа на полу не считается, т к.там нужно сделать круг рукой, а его не было. Перекат палки стоит 0,3, пусть вначале рука согнута, но она в течение переката выпрямляется. Ну и последняя ловля была была без музыки.
if you are going to talk about certain ADs, could you pls timestamp it. I don't know which ADs u r talking about...
There are so many ADs.
Спасибо, очень интересно!
Последняя ловля Дины была ОТЧЕТЛИВО с музыкой, даже если те, кто не привык слушать громко, её не слышат. Fade-out еще никто не отменял.
@@ivanpetrov1105 посмотрите другие соревнования и убедитесь, что она заканчивала с последним громким аккордом.
По правилам (по старым) по-другому нельзя было, иначе сбавка за музыку была
@@pinakAlena я меломан. У меня мониторные наушники, и я отчетливо слышу звук в момент ловли. Он уже достаточно тихий, но ещё есть. Fade-out - это когда аудио сигнал затухает не сразу, а постепенно. И ловля считова и сбавки 0,5 в артистике нет. Если не верите, наложите оригинальную аудиодорожку на видео и убедитесь. Компакт-диск ещё подавал в момент ловли музыку, и судьи не имели права за окончание после музыки снимать. Там именно что точное окончание с музыкой.
Если бы в Правилх ФИж было написано, что окончание музыки - это последний громкий аккорд, судьям не надо было бы после музыки в обруче у Дины дополнительно вставлять звуковой сигнал, свидетельствующий о её окончании (там в районе 2 секунд затухание вообще, то всё, опять же отчетливо слышно, если конечно, хотеть услышать).
Вот из журнала "Пирует" ФИЖевского пример про окончание после музыки: ruclips.net/video/jMheIUdPN-k/видео.html
Динин случай явно не из этих.
Dina is the best !
You can't convince people that are pro-Dina . They are still convinced that Dina should have won !
But the IFG already gave its decision and confirmed that Linoy won the gold medal as She was better in complexity of the exercises . Thanks for your analysis.
I am "pro Dina ", if you want to call it like that., Why? :Dina always got the first place and there must be a reason why she always won. So, in your eyes the judges that gave her all the points and scores in the last years and months did wrong and overscored her and just the judges at olympics were right?? Why, do YOU think, did she get lower points ONLY at the Olympic games, NEVER before got Linoy more points although both of them did the exactly same routines they did when Dina won couple months ago..
@@Amelie8H Linoy was better , made more complex exercises .If Linoy wouldn't have dropped the ribbon the difference in score would have been much higher . The difference was a slight one due to that .
Linoy is very good and you can't deny that. But really, It is over !! You can keep crying and being disappointed but it is over ! The ROC can't appeal anymore , they just need to cope with the situation. IT IS OVER !!!!
@@Amelie8H You may look at this analysis. It may help understanding. Dina was not always better. In Bulgaria, she was the third in all around after Arina and Boryana Kalein. Linoy was better in Bulgaria with clubs. Boryana Kalein also was better than Arina and Dina with hoop or ribbon (I do not remember) in Moscow a few months ago. So they do ot perform very consistently. Besides, she has a serious back injury/ It also explains a lot! ruclips.net/video/_zuLbEGDKXE/видео.html
@@Amelie8H And you thing that judges was no subjective in other competitions - especially in cities like Moscow and Baku?! Or Dina is always playing the same way - without mistakes?
@@silviainaboxbox that person and the uploader is the same. Same thoughts
And I saw analysis in which she is 4 points overrated, because mast of DA should not be counted - she is doing things later and catches are not out of view, so DA was about 11! She was not doing things clear.
I think some AD's are overvalued here as there are impressions in the catch of the apparatus. Dina takes two steps to catch the apparatus twice during the final performance- certainly, due to youtube's restrictions they can't be shown here but those imprecisions were made so those 2 AD'S are worth much less or even 0- yet I am not sure which one. Secondly, there are BD made to validate the AD and these do not count because there is only 9 BD allowed (the ones with the highest difficulties ) the rest do not count towards BD but AD. Plus, I would go as far as to say that only one of Dina's balances can fully be counted, the rest are not held for the mandatory 1 second. Plus, I think one AD is double-counted. All in all, I think the score Dina was given in this particular routine was fair, it was a strong routine and she got a strong score (she improved on her qualifications performance by 1.2 points). It is a pretty good review of the analysis but it would be a lot better if all the difficulties were properly justified using the code of points as other channels do, then there would be less room for interpretations. IF THE CODE OF POINTS ALLOWS IT, THEN IT MUST BE RIGHT!
Hi, thanks for ur input. I will answer to ur input about her balances for now. Even if a balance is not held for one sec, the balance is valid but with a 0.3 deduction from execution.
i agree with some of your points!! there was an AD up the back of the mat in particular where I would've thought there should be a trajectory deduction and therefore the AD wouldn't count... but Dina is very good at covering up her trajectory issues with dancing steps! Very clever of her !
However, I also agree with @/crybaby here; as per the Code of Points, you can still validate a BD even without the mandatory 1sec stop position. Here is an excerpt from the Code:
"if the shape is well-defined and the apparatus element is executed correctly but the
stop position is insufficient, the balance is valid with a technical execution penalty"
Hope this helps!
im so glad you did both linoy and dina!! it shows that you are trying to be as fair as possible and for that you have my respect :))
just a couple of things i have notes about:
(1) The D1/2 score: why did you include the arabesque, cabriole and illusion in the video when they arent counted as part of her D1/2 score? (P.S. arabesque balance is 0.2!) Regardless; this was the potential D1/2 score that I got:
3 turning split w/ arch (0.6+0.6+0.6)
ponche balance (on flat) (0.4)
ponche balance w/ ring (on flat) (0.4)
front balance (0.4)
side scale balance (0.5)
side scale pivot (0.5)
back scale balance (0.5)
As you correctly pointed out (something I didn't even notice so thank you!!) she definitely didn't do the correct handling in her back scale and therefore this wouldn't have counted! Good find! With the logic that we count the best 9 BDs + our 0.3 DS in our D1/2 score... I'm unsure how you got to 4.8 with this?
Since we eliminate the back scale balance and replace it with the next highest scoring AD (in this case, arabesque balance of 0.2 is next!), we should get:
0.6 + 0.6 + 0.6 + 0.4 + 0.4 + 0.4 + 0.5 + 0.5 + 0.2 + 0.3 = 4.5??
Since the judges gave 4.8 as their D1/2 score... it is likely that they actually did count the invalid back scale balance (and likely the AD along with it)
This is mainly because it's hard to count patterns so quickly in the moment!
(2) AD3: there were two example of ADs that you counted as rolls that I would have probably counted as AD2 instead!
The first is at 0:37 ; in this case, I wouldn't say that 'two large body segments' were rolled upon, especially considering how much she helps the AD with her hands! In this case, I think it should be an AD2.
The second is at 0:54 ; there has been an edition of Pirouette by FIG which clarifies that these sort of ADs must be done HORIZONTALLY to get the AD3 (I think Taseva does them quite well!). If you do it VERTICALLY like Dina does, you can only get 0.2 as the base becomes a slide instead of a roll!
(3) the *awful* front attitude balance ADs; absolutely zero hate to either Dina or Arina, but oh my gosh these ADs,,, i hope they get rid of them in coming years lol they're just not my cuppa tea
Regardless, I am confused why you counted the first one (at 0:42) but not the second (at 1:00). The shape is not good for either of them in my opinion!
(4) this is just a genuine thank you for your work and always being respectful in replying to my comments! this sort of this is very helpful for my judging knowledge, so thank you for always having a discussion!
Hi Amy, thanks for coming back again. :)
(1) oh shoot, I thought 2 balances executed consecutively are counted as one BD. That is why I counted the pence and pence w/ ring balances as one BD, and the front balance & side scale as one BD.
Arabesque is worth 0.2???! (hashtag not worth it)
I'm sure the score you came up with is right then, thanks for clarifying once again.
(2) I can see your point there but I've seen many gymnasts do this "roll" AD so I would like to give this particular AD the benefit of the doubt.
0:54 I see. Thank you for that information again.
(3) Yeah, I hope those ADs won't count in the future. But this cycle's CoP calls for lots of ADs and maximizing ur difficulty score so you gotta do what you gotta do.
0:42 at the finals in the Olympics, her shape was much clearer. I should have used that footage, a lil regrets right now...
(4) Thank you so much! I love how we are able to have a positive discussion. You are also very helpful I must say. It's viewers like you that keeps me going. Thanks for watching and your input once again :)
@@crybaby-bd9xg hiiiii again!!!
(1) YOU LITERALLY PREDICTED THE NEXT CODE OF POINTS THEN HAHAHA (they have so many new rules now on combined balances omg!! its doing my head in slowly lol)
and COMPLETELY agree about arabesque, it's even been kept at that value for 2022-24!
and not a worry! D1/2 scores usually make the most sense lol, at least i can get something right with accuracy!!!!
(2) mmm yes i could see the first one i mentioned being a AD3 in some cases, but the second one has definitely been clarified as a AD2!
(3) yep agree, you gotta get that difficulty in somehow!! it was a clever idea in theory, but the execution of it is questionable... lol
her execution at finals was definitely better, but still wasn't really a correct shape, i would still say it was a 0.5 execution deduction which invalidates the AD and the BD, but you never know what the judges saw in that moment!
(4) awww im so glad to hear that!! im more active on my insta if you ever want any help with future videos!! (@rhythmicgymnastics.mp4)
Many thanks! I really want gymnastics to remain fair play. This is very important not only for gymnasts today but also tomorrow.
Definitely! Thanks for watching! :)
it was fair play. this account acknowledges that they are not a certified judge. how can a very invested rhythmic gymnastics fan be better and fairer than a certified judge? I can also do the same kind of analysis and reach a different conclusion, then who's right? probably neither, the judges only.
@@karolmaria2547 Ok. You may prepare your analysis.
Unfortunately, the federation of gymnastics refuses to provide a protocol with the analysis of exercises. If they have nothing to hide, let them publish it. All fans are waiting........
@@mayazaslavskaia3358 they have released the official breakdown of scores with D1/2, D3/4, EA and ET scores on the official Olympics website if that's what you mean! However, they wont ever release the actual scoring notations of the judges, this isn't really protocol...
@@rhythmicgymnastics.mp4782 Yes, I've seen the Official Reports (Results).
It would be nice to see the current scores on monitors in the future ( like in Figure Skating).
I STAND WITH DINA
Anyway I think the matter was not her ribbon score. She was losing all the way from hoop.
37-th European Rhythmic Championship, Varna 9-13 June 2021
why dont you use a full tokyo footage? your excuse is always "copy right issue" but there are uploader who use tokyo footage only. dinas performance at varna is good but messy at tokyo same with her twin who got only useless 4th place only. you kidding? whats next? upload arina averinas ribbon exer witbout a knot to convince us she won? be fair. use the clip only at tokyo.
Please see the uploaded dates before you make this kind of comments. Understand the fact this was a video from 4 months ago. This was uploaded way before the full Olympic replay was uploaded on RUclips and videos and clips of it were profusely copyrighted.
I don't understand this sport, but this video and the other one about Linoy's performance are quite interesting! As I said, I do not understand this sport, but Linoy's routine seems complex than Dina's.
In terms of complexity, I would say Dina and Linoy are roughly on the same level.
thanks for watching! :)
@@crybaby-bd9xg Thank you for the response. I will keeping following the channel to understand more about it.
I don't disagree her score was accurate.
Linoy Ashram's was inaccurate.
can you do dina vs linoy for the other apparatuses
sure. I would try to make a video with ball.
thanks for suggesting! :)
Rip prepare to be judged by pro Dina fans . Good video by the way ❤️
Thank u so much! :)
@@crybaby-bd9xg" Dina received a score that was relatively accurate", ok, I see, but if it's a matter of o. 15 points of who's the winner, it has to be percent 💯 accurate. I don't understand why Dina was always the winner and suddenly at the Olympics she got lower scores, there must be a reason why. She did all her routine like always. Very weird imo
@@Amelie8H dina's score was relatively accurate but linoy's was not. I know Dina should have won. :)
@@crybaby-bd9xg RG scores analysed both routines. It does not look like Dina should have won. RG scores accounted for all mistakes of both girls. There were lots of catches not out of sight in Dina's performance. Linoy also had these mistakes. The RG scores count shows that Linoy received around 1, 00 higher whereas Dina received around 3,00 higher than she deserves., Overall, judges overevaluated Dina. You can compare these calculations with yours. ruclips.net/video/_zuLbEGDKXE/видео.html
ruclips.net/video/hKLjaex-FOY/видео.html
@@Amelie8H She did not. she was doing catches and other things not well as always. She finished after the music. She did not have obvious mistakes, but for the judges is different - they are looking if the catch is aout of view, how many seconds she is keeping balances ect.
It should be titled underscored.
Dina was the best
Естественно 😻
She is second, not the best.
@@deniivanova5961 Она всегда первая и никогда не будет второй, а то , что судьи поставили её на второе место 🥈, ещё ничего не значит, она первая в сердцах людей.
Дина не первая в мое серце. Я люблю Боряна. У ее тоже бьила одна ошибка, но Арина била на 4 место. Ето честно? Как думаете? Арина лента изпортила и получила висше оценка.
@@deniivanova5961 Я Боряну не видела, не могу сказать, но Арина первоклассно выступала до ленты, а ей специально баллы занижали, чтобы вывести из строя за первое место 🥇, а ленту могли тоже ей подпортить , не исключено, а Ашрам никак не тянет на золото 🥇, это же очевидно 🙄, вдобавок ленту уронила, а с такой ошибкой никто раньше олимпиаду не выигрывал, ни Алина Кабаева, ни Яна Кудрявцева, хотя Кудрявцева уронила булаву уже в самом конце, когда все было выполнено и это не испортило программу, просто смотрелась как небольшая помарка, и то не дали золотую медаль 🥇, а у Ашрам программа разделилась на две части из-за потери ленты, и плюс эстетически некрасивая программа, прыгает как кенгуру, красоты никакой, и никакой сложности тела не видно, только корявость видно, и с предметами у неё сложности нет 👎, ясно что все подстроено было под Ашрам, чтобы вывести её на первое место.
She did it 👌 perfect the real winner
This should have a woman robot's voice.
Russia is proud of Dina, she won!
🥈 !!! Silver is something to be very proud of. She’s lucky she even got that!
Yes 2nd and 4th
Last ad is not valid. She did it after the music ended
Why don't you all stop with your imprecised analyzes when you're not a true judge? Trying to earn some likes over the people's pain is pathetic. Dina and Arina are now focused on the future. So stop posting such "conspiracy" videos. It's pointless. If ROC notice irregularity they could send a complaint to OC. They know better what to do. And let Linoy to enjoy her medal!
how's this a conspiracy video. If you are sensing a negative connotation from this video, I think it's because you are approaching this video with a negative attitude. I'm not trying to earn likes from someone's pain. You are taking this way out of context. I think you are the one who can't move on, hence your angry comment here... Plus, this was a requested video. And unlike someone, I definitely respect everyone's opinion, even if their viewpoint is different from me. And if you thought my "analysis" (not analyzes, *cough cough) was imprecise, I'm sure you are the who with the imprecision.
Thank you for ur comment! I guess I still earn a view and a comment thanks to you... ;)
@@crybaby-bd9xg Pathetic behavior. I said what I wanted. You don't deserve a word. Bye.
@@nnakeva Rude... You said u wanted to say what you wanted but I don't deserve a word? What kind of paradox is this? Strange, strange indeed......
I was getting mean Commnents just bc I wrote the truth:Ashrams doesn't fullfill the pysical requirements you have to fullfill for a professional RG gymnast. Oh, now I am a body shamer.. Ok so, why, on God's earth, no tiny man/woman is complaining bout not able to compete as a weight lifter!???. Never ever did a slim human being complain about not being allowed to be, f. I. at hammer throwing or lift weighting , but If I say something about Ashrams physical proportions, which are NOT looking well in RG.. This is a problem??? Sheesh, that's so pathetic!!!!
Very good. She didn't even deserve second place. Lol
ののかちゃんをいじるな😡
Linoy Ashram is only a "temporary champion" 🤣🥇because she makes others feel a bit speculative.🤮
First, because the Israeli players are generally not of high quality.
Second, she dropped the ribbon but the judges still showed her favor.🤬😱🤔..
if the Russians make mistakes e.g. Rio 2016 or Sofia 2018 and getting gold shoved up the ass isn't to say, is it?